Author Topic: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently  (Read 6718 times)

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Offline tweety234

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #45 on: January 02, 2013, 09:56:16 PM »
regarding substaining from specific foods. Do not let anyone tell you what you should be eating. But there is nothing wrong with fasting if it makes you feel good, and healthier. But the notion that you have to do it, because everyone else is doing for thousands of years, is ridiculous. You shouldn't do something because it was always done. You should do it or not do it, because it helps you improve as a being, both physically and spiritually, especially spiritually. But the again you shouldn't abuse your body either, it's the only one you get to live with. If you destroy it, you will have to explain to the almighty about this sin of yours as well. Besides all the others. Should you have any.
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Offline PeterTheAleut

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #46 on: January 02, 2013, 10:02:59 PM »
regarding substaining from specific foods. Do not let anyone tell you what you should be eating. But there is nothing wrong with fasting if it makes you feel good, and healthier. But the notion that you have to do it, because everyone else is doing for thousands of years, is ridiculous. You shouldn't do something because it was always done. You should do it or not do it, because it helps you improve as a being, both physically and spiritually, especially spiritually. But the again you shouldn't abuse your body either, it's the only one you get to live with. If you destroy it, you will have to explain to the almighty about this sin of yours as well. Besides all the others. Should you have any.
What does this have to do with the topic of discussion?
« Last Edit: January 02, 2013, 10:03:48 PM by PeterTheAleut »
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Offline SavedByChrist94

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #47 on: January 06, 2013, 02:30:39 AM »
Folks, we're dealing with a textbook narcissist here. Appealing to reason or civility won't work, even if he were 50, not 18. He's too enthralled by his own awesomeness. :P ::)

How did I say I'm better than anyone? I attributed my success to The Holy Spirit and the arguments I use are a culmination of geniuses touched by The Holy Spirit. I say you will not win, not to be proud but because it's Fact, ANYONE who uses these arguments, such as William Lane Craig will not lose.
Is the work of the Holy Spirit to win debates or to win souls?

To win debates that win souls. Look at Stephen, Truth has to be told.
Stephen did not engage the Pharisees in a debate, and you are not a martyr.

Actually it sort of was, Pharisees were wrong so Stephan by The Holy Spirit countered them with Truth, that is sort oof argumentative, his point would never get anywhere had he not refuted them and defended Jesus Christ.

I ask you in a debate between a Christian and an "atheist" will not The Holy Spirit make sure The Christian wins in order to gain others Salvation? of course, when it comes to "atheist" you have to win debates to win their souls, very simple.
No, it's not that simple. You don't have to win debates to win their souls, especially when you make an ass of yourself as you did at both AtheistForums.com and AtheistForums.org.

Go ahead and defend "atheist"s downward spiral to death, I will be winning debates(because of The Holy Spirit) and leaving them no excuse but to come to Jesus Christ, where they will get from Him Eternal Life.
« Last Edit: January 06, 2013, 02:31:40 AM by SavedByChrist94 »

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #48 on: January 06, 2013, 03:06:03 AM »
Quote
Go ahead and defend "atheist"s downward spiral to death, I will be winning debates(because of The Holy Spirit) and leaving them no excuse but to come to Jesus Christ, where they will get from Him Eternal Life.

PetertheAleut and I have crossed swords many a time here, but there's nothing in what he's posted here which is defending atheism. But you, OTOH, are full of your own misguided greatness and misplaced zeal. Do not take the Holy Spirit's name in vain.  :police:
Am I posting? Or is it Schroedinger's Cat?

Offline SavedByChrist94

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #49 on: January 06, 2013, 03:29:23 AM »
Quote
Go ahead and defend "atheist"s downward spiral to death, I will be winning debates(because of The Holy Spirit) and leaving them no excuse but to come to Jesus Christ, where they will get from Him Eternal Life.

PetertheAleut and I have crossed swords many a time here, but there's nothing in what he's posted here which is defending atheism. But you, OTOH, are full of your own misguided greatness and misplaced zeal. Do not take the Holy Spirit's name in vain.  :police:

How did I take His name in vain? Please do not slander.

Offline biro

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #50 on: January 06, 2013, 05:34:19 AM »
Quote
Go ahead and defend "atheist"s downward spiral to death, I will be winning debates(because of The Holy Spirit) and leaving them no excuse but to come to Jesus Christ, where they will get from Him Eternal Life.

PetertheAleut and I have crossed swords many a time here, but there's nothing in what he's posted here which is defending atheism. But you, OTOH, are full of your own misguided greatness and misplaced zeal. Do not take the Holy Spirit's name in vain.  :police:

How did I take His name in vain? Please do not slander.

You said the Holy Spirit would guide you to win debates. You aren't winning anything, so please check your ego at the door.

Offline Eastern Mind

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #51 on: January 06, 2013, 10:07:57 AM »
It kind of seems like you are using the Holy Spirit as if He were a pokemon. I know that sounds silly, but that's the first example that came to mind. Using God as if He is supposed to fight all of your battles for you. It's very sad. You can win all the debates in the world, and not a single person can come to Christ. In the end, what is more important?

I use to be the same way. I would get into heated debates with Protestants. In the end, though, there was no convincing done, and I ended up making the other side more set in their beliefs than before. I was stupid, and all I cared about was being right and being a walking encyclopedia. But I think now, God has taught me to just care for others and correct gently, if need be.

God bless you, my friend :)
« Last Edit: January 06, 2013, 10:08:56 AM by Eastern Mind »
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Offline SavedByChrist94

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #52 on: January 06, 2013, 02:22:58 PM »
Quote
Go ahead and defend "atheist"s downward spiral to death, I will be winning debates(because of The Holy Spirit) and leaving them no excuse but to come to Jesus Christ, where they will get from Him Eternal Life.

PetertheAleut and I have crossed swords many a time here, but there's nothing in what he's posted here which is defending atheism. But you, OTOH, are full of your own misguided greatness and misplaced zeal. Do not take the Holy Spirit's name in vain.  :police:

How did I take His name in vain? Please do not slander.

You said the Holy Spirit would guide you to win debates. You aren't winning anything, so please check your ego at the door.

Prove how I lose debates, every time I post Proof, Evidence, and Facts for God(The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit) no one can refute them, The Holy Spirit guides me with truth and wisdom, I believe in Him.

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #53 on: January 06, 2013, 02:27:20 PM »
Prove how I lose debates, every time I post Proof, Evidence, and Facts for God(The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit) no one can refute them, The Holy Spirit guides me with truth and wisdom, I believe in Him.

There is nothing to win here, because there is no debate. Nobody is engaging you. You are soliloquising, and I, for one, am just mildly amused. Like this is our version of Hyde Park Corner.

It would be to everyone's advantage if you kept quiet for a while and read around a bit, to get an idea of the community you are invading entering.
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Offline biro

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #54 on: January 06, 2013, 02:27:46 PM »
 :o

I think I am going to get some ice cream now.
« Last Edit: January 06, 2013, 02:28:10 PM by biro »

Offline Justin Kissel

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #55 on: January 06, 2013, 03:15:26 PM »
Quote
Go ahead and defend "atheist"s downward spiral to death, I will be winning debates(because of The Holy Spirit) and leaving them no excuse but to come to Jesus Christ, where they will get from Him Eternal Life.

PetertheAleut and I have crossed swords many a time here, but there's nothing in what he's posted here which is defending atheism. But you, OTOH, are full of your own misguided greatness and misplaced zeal. Do not take the Holy Spirit's name in vain.  :police:

How did I take His name in vain? Please do not slander.

You said the Holy Spirit would guide you to win debates. You aren't winning anything, so please check your ego at the door.

Prove how I lose debates, every time I post Proof, Evidence, and Facts for God(The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit) no one can refute them, The Holy Spirit guides me with truth and wisdom, I believe in Him.

I can prove your entire world view wrong with one simple question, which you will not be able to answer. However, I am generous so I will give you three different questions, and you can choose which one you like most:

1) What shape is purple?
2) What does a G7 chord on a guitar taste like?
3) How old is the dust on top of the layer of dark matter on top of my computer mouse?
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Offline Cyrillic

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #56 on: January 06, 2013, 03:20:22 PM »
The Holy Spirit guides me with truth and wisdom

 ;D
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Offline Ebor

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #57 on: January 06, 2013, 03:27:03 PM »

Prove how I lose debates, every time I post Proof, Evidence, and Facts for God(The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit) no one can refute them, The Holy Spirit guides me with truth and wisdom, I believe in Him.

You are not posting "Proof", Evidence and Facts"  You are posting mere statements that are not backed up. You are making statements of your own ideas without explanation. You are saying that it is the Holy Spirit that is the director of your opinions and that is already a claim without support.  I could just in the same way post that statement for myself or that you are not guided by the Holy Spirit.  Either one would be an assertion and not any sort of "Fact" without some sort of backup.  You have not proved that it is the Spirit that guides you, to be blunt, you just claim that it is so.

In the New Testament it was the case that even when they heard the words of St. Paul and  his companion, who I think it can be agreed was guided by the spirit at least sometimes, the Bereans looked for support.  And they were praised for this. (Acts 17).

In debates there is an exchange of ideas, support and analysis.  It is not one person making claims and then declaring that she/he has "won".

Here is a page from the University of Virginia on the "The 9 Principles of Good Debating"

http://onlinelearn.edschool.virginia.edu/debate/thenine.html




« Last Edit: January 06, 2013, 03:32:13 PM by Ebor »
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Offline Ebor

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #58 on: January 06, 2013, 03:28:17 PM »
It would be to everyone's advantage if you kept quiet for a while and read around a bit, to get an idea of the community you are invading entering.

I agree that SBC94 has not shown that he knows much or anything about EO just for starters.
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Offline J Michael

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #59 on: January 06, 2013, 03:31:04 PM »
It would be to everyone's advantage if you kept quiet for a while and read around a bit, to get an idea of the community you are invading entering.

I agree that SBC94 has not shown that he knows much or anything about EO just for starters.

He's 18, if I remember correctly.  Ergo, he knows everything (but not quite as much as a 16 or 17 year old). ;D
« Last Edit: January 06, 2013, 03:37:51 PM by J Michael »
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Offline stanley123

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #60 on: January 06, 2013, 04:51:22 PM »
How old are you? 19?


I hope you don't mind me asking.

Quote
3, God has ended suffering with The Bible however humanity holds it back(For example Jesus Christ(God Himself) told us to share our possessions, if we all actually listened no one would be straving, guaranteed.)


Do you really believe God ended suffering with the Bible?
Well, maybe not ended suffering, but it has been discussed in the Bible. For example,  what is one of the lessons of the Book of Job? Is it not that God blesses those who endure suffering , and that although we may not know exactly the reason for our suffering, nevertheless  in the end, we hope for eternal salvation and joy where there will be no sorrow.
« Last Edit: January 06, 2013, 04:53:58 PM by stanley123 »

Offline Eastern Mind

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #61 on: January 06, 2013, 06:33:11 PM »
It would be to everyone's advantage if you kept quiet for a while and read around a bit, to get an idea of the community you are invading entering.

I agree that SBC94 has not shown that he knows much or anything about EO just for starters.

He's 18, if I remember correctly.  Ergo, he knows everything (but not quite as much as a 16 or 17 year old). ;D

LOL. We all know everything at 18  :laugh: How time humbles us!
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Offline theistgal

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #62 on: January 06, 2013, 06:57:50 PM »
It would be to everyone's advantage if you kept quiet for a while and read around a bit, to get an idea of the community you are invading entering.

I agree that SBC94 has not shown that he knows much or anything about EO just for starters.

He's 18, if I remember correctly.  Ergo, he knows everything (but not quite as much as a 16 or 17 year old). ;D

I've encountered some pretty smart 18-year-olds here and at other fora who are intelligent, reasonable and quite capable of holding a dialogue. So I'm not cutting SBC94 any slack just because of his age.
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Offline mike

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #63 on: January 06, 2013, 07:08:49 PM »
1) What shape is purple?
Oval

Quote
2) What does a G7 chord on a guitar taste like?

Something with cheese an vegetables... Zapiekanka.

Quote
3) How old is the dust on top of the layer of dark matter on top of my computer mouse?

No older than the time you used it last passed. You destroy the structure of layers of dark matter with your hand every time you use your mouse and the dust moves.

Quote
I can prove your entire world view wrong with one simple question, which you will not be able to answer. However, I am generous so I will give you three different questions, and you can choose which one you like most:

Go on!
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Offline Justin Kissel

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #64 on: January 06, 2013, 07:13:46 PM »
Those answers were incorrect. In fact, not even close. Oval? What? Let the other guy try, he might not be so far off!
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Offline SavedByChrist94

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #65 on: January 06, 2013, 07:17:45 PM »

Prove how I lose debates, every time I post Proof, Evidence, and Facts for God(The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit) no one can refute them, The Holy Spirit guides me with truth and wisdom, I believe in Him.

You are not posting "Proof", Evidence and Facts"  You are posting mere statements that are not backed up. You are making statements of your own ideas without explanation. You are saying that it is the Holy Spirit that is the director of your opinions and that is already a claim without support.  I could just in the same way post that statement for myself or that you are not guided by the Holy Spirit.  Either one would be an assertion and not any sort of "Fact" without some sort of backup.  You have not proved that it is the Spirit that guides you, to be blunt, you just claim that it is so.

In the New Testament it was the case that even when they heard the words of St. Paul and  his companion, who I think it can be agreed was guided by the spirit at least sometimes, the Bereans looked for support.  And they were praised for this. (Acts 17).

In debates there is an exchange of ideas, support and analysis.  It is not one person making claims and then declaring that she/he has "won".

Here is a page from the University of Virginia on the "The 9 Principles of Good Debating"

http://onlinelearn.edschool.virginia.edu/debate/thenine.html






I don't claim to win, I just win, why? because the opponent is incapable of refuting me.

Also the points, proofs, evidence, and Facts all lead to the inescapable conclusion that I posit, if not then please by all means prove that I didn't win, all the person has to do is refute me, otherwise I am well in my right to say I factually won the debate.
« Last Edit: January 06, 2013, 07:18:39 PM by SavedByChrist94 »

Offline Eastern Mind

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #66 on: January 06, 2013, 07:20:37 PM »
You could win every debate and yet have not one person come to Christ.
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Offline biro

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #67 on: January 06, 2013, 07:22:08 PM »
This is not some kind of high school debate practice hall. There are very few atheists here. You can count them on one hand.

So, SBC, why are you here? Just to rant about how great you are? Mom and Dad won't let you use Word?

Offline SavedByChrist94

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #68 on: January 06, 2013, 07:23:56 PM »
It kind of seems like you are using the Holy Spirit as if He were a pokemon.

It seems like you are slandering, which is not of The Holy Spirit.

 I know that sounds silly, but that's the first example that came to mind. Using God as if He is supposed to fight all of your battles for you.

God(The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit) wants to fight all our battles against evil("atheism" being one of them)

 It's very sad.

It's very sad that you claim to be a Christian yet are against someone trying to Preach and Spread The Bible and its Truth.


You can win all the debates in the world, and not a single person can come to Christ. In the end, what is more important.

I use to be the same way. I would get into heated debates with Protestants. In the end, though, there was no convincing done, and I ended up making the other side more set in their beliefs than before. I was stupid, and all I cared about was being right and being a walking encyclopedia.

you lack faith, with faith as Jesus Christ said you could move mountains.

But I think now, God has taught me to just care for others and correct gently, if need be.

God bless you, my friend :)

Nope God is expecting every follower of His to Preach and Spread The Gospel.

Offline SavedByChrist94

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #69 on: January 06, 2013, 07:25:24 PM »
You could win every debate and yet have not one person come to Christ.

I agree, that is therefore a personal rebellion problem in which debates cannot help, what I do as other Theologians do is debate The Fact of God's existence, that it becomes irrefutable, they will have no excuse, there then if they make excuses prove personal reasons.

Offline Eastern Mind

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #70 on: January 06, 2013, 07:26:12 PM »
It kind of seems like you are using the Holy Spirit as if He were a pokemon.

It seems like you are slandering, which is not of The Holy Spirit.

 I know that sounds silly, but that's the first example that came to mind. Using God as if He is supposed to fight all of your battles for you.

God(The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit) wants to fight all our battles against evil("atheism" being one of them)

 It's very sad.

It's very sad that you claim to be a Christian yet are against someone trying to Preach and Spread The Bible and its Truth.


You can win all the debates in the world, and not a single person can come to Christ. In the end, what is more important.

I use to be the same way. I would get into heated debates with Protestants. In the end, though, there was no convincing done, and I ended up making the other side more set in their beliefs than before. I was stupid, and all I cared about was being right and being a walking encyclopedia.

you lack faith, with faith as Jesus Christ said you could move mountains.

But I think now, God has taught me to just care for others and correct gently, if need be.

God bless you, my friend :)

Nope God is expecting every follower of His to Preach and Spread The Gospel.

To spread the Gospel, yes. To start and win every debate thrown as us, no. I speak from experience; you could present every fact and be 100% right, and still do a world of hurt, because you are so focused on being right, that you can't stop and try to show them Christ. True, one could use a debate to witness, but many times, for me at least, I was less concerned about the person and more concerned about being "right." But I feel you will see this over time. God bless you :)
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Offline theistgal

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #71 on: January 06, 2013, 07:29:13 PM »
Nope God is expecting every follower of His to Preach and Spread The Gospel.

And what, specifically, about this particular forum made you think "Hmm! Lots of people here need to know about the Gospel!" ?  ???
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Offline SavedByChrist94

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #72 on: January 06, 2013, 07:46:46 PM »
Nope God is expecting every follower of His to Preach and Spread The Gospel.

And what, specifically, about this particular forum made you think "Hmm! Lots of people here need to know about the Gospel!" ?  ???

I thought and forgive me for my error, that this was like ChristianForums(Which I was banned from, in which there are a multitude of "atheist" to debate).

Offline biro

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #73 on: January 06, 2013, 07:48:00 PM »
Nope God is expecting every follower of His to Preach and Spread The Gospel.

And what, specifically, about this particular forum made you think "Hmm! Lots of people here need to know about the Gospel!" ?  ???

I thought and forgive me for my error, that this was like ChristianForums(Which I was banned from, in which there are a multitude of "atheist" to debate).

Okay. That does explain some things.

Why not relax, put your feet up, have some tea? Would you like to know some things about the Orthodox Church? There are even priests here. We have a lot of members and a lot of interesting threads.

I hope you enjoy it here.  :)

Offline SavedByChrist94

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #74 on: January 06, 2013, 07:50:08 PM »
It kind of seems like you are using the Holy Spirit as if He were a pokemon.

It seems like you are slandering, which is not of The Holy Spirit.

 I know that sounds silly, but that's the first example that came to mind. Using God as if He is supposed to fight all of your battles for you.

God(The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit) wants to fight all our battles against evil("atheism" being one of them)

 It's very sad.

It's very sad that you claim to be a Christian yet are against someone trying to Preach and Spread The Bible and its Truth.


You can win all the debates in the world, and not a single person can come to Christ. In the end, what is more important.

I use to be the same way. I would get into heated debates with Protestants. In the end, though, there was no convincing done, and I ended up making the other side more set in their beliefs than before. I was stupid, and all I cared about was being right and being a walking encyclopedia.

you lack faith, with faith as Jesus Christ said you could move mountains.

But I think now, God has taught me to just care for others and correct gently, if need be.

God bless you, my friend :)

Nope God is expecting every follower of His to Preach and Spread The Gospel.

To spread the Gospel, yes. To start and win every debate thrown as us, no. I speak from experience; you could present every fact and be 100% right, and still do a world of hurt, because you are so focused on being right, that you can't stop and try to show them Christ. True, one could use a debate to witness, but many times, for me at least, I was less concerned about the person and more concerned about being "right." But I feel you will see this over time. God bless you :)

Actually my debates can bring people to Jesus Christ personally, for example, my permanent rebuttal of The Problem of Suffering, if an "atheist" rebels against God(The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit) because of suffering, that refutes it, and brings them to God(The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit) personally. also by taking all the excuses down, the "atheist" is left with the personal  problem, winning debates actually brings them further to Christ as once they realize that God(The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit) exists, they start to slowly put their guard down.

Offline theistgal

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #75 on: January 06, 2013, 07:51:28 PM »
Actually my debates can bring people to Jesus Christ personally, for example, my permanent rebuttal of The Problem of Suffering, if an "atheist" rebels against God(The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit) because of suffering, that refutes it, and brings them to God(The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit) personally. also by taking all the excuses down, the "atheist" is left with the personal  problem, winning debates actually brings them further to Christ as once they realize that God(The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit) exists, they start to slowly put their guard down.

So how many atheists have you personally brought to Jesus Christ through this particular argument? Names, contact info?
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Offline SavedByChrist94

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #76 on: January 06, 2013, 07:55:04 PM »
Actually my debates can bring people to Jesus Christ personally, for example, my permanent rebuttal of The Problem of Suffering, if an "atheist" rebels against God(The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit) because of suffering, that refutes it, and brings them to God(The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit) personally. also by taking all the excuses down, the "atheist" is left with the personal  problem, winning debates actually brings them further to Christ as once they realize that God(The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit) exists, they start to slowly put their guard down.

So how many atheists have you personally brought to Jesus Christ through this particular argument? Names, contact info?

I don't know, had to have been at least 1, I've debated over the net since last June. the thing that would be their problem is rebellion and presupposition, which no one but The Holy Spirit(God) can help.
« Last Edit: January 06, 2013, 07:55:22 PM by SavedByChrist94 »

Offline biro

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #77 on: January 06, 2013, 07:56:34 PM »
SBC, if you don't mind my asking, are you studying to be a minister?  ???

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #78 on: January 06, 2013, 07:58:08 PM »
I don't know, had to have been at least 1, I've debated over the net since last June. the thing that would be their problem is rebellion and presupposition, which no one but The Holy Spirit(God) can help.

Only one since June, and you don't even know for sure?  ::)
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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #79 on: January 06, 2013, 08:01:09 PM »
No offense, but you seem like somewhat of a narcissist. I get where you are coming from--there was a period when I got all obsessed in the pseudo-philosophy and silly debates and articles of Christian apologetics. Then I found Orthodoxy and realized that simple knowledge of theology already solves like 90% of the atheist worlds' objections because most of their objections and problems with Christianity come from a distorted view of Evangelical-Protestant doctrine. Moving on, nearly like 90% of all modern apologetic arguments for God are based off of ignorance, or, at the very best, are only cases for a deistic god at best, but do nothing to prove that the God of Christianity is true. Hurray, you may have refuted atheism, but now you have to explain why your God is the real God and thus effectively refute millions of other religions which have belief in a God/gods. Your famous "First Cause" thing argument could just as effectively be used for Allah, Oden, Shiva or Zeus. Does nothing to prove the God of Christianity that we profess belief in.
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Offline Eastern Mind

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #80 on: January 06, 2013, 08:09:37 PM »
No offense, but you seem like somewhat of a narcissist. I get where you are coming from--there was a period when I got all obsessed in the pseudo-philosophy and silly debates and articles of Christian apologetics. Then I found Orthodoxy and realized that simple knowledge of theology already solves like 90% of the atheist worlds' objections because most of their objections and problems with Christianity come from a distorted view of Evangelical-Protestant doctrine. Moving on, nearly like 90% of all modern apologetic arguments for God are based off of ignorance, or, at the very best, are only cases for a deistic god at best, but do nothing to prove that the God of Christianity is true. Hurray, you may have refuted atheism, but now you have to explain why your God is the real God and thus effectively refute millions of other religions which have belief in a God/gods. Your famous "First Cause" thing argument could just as effectively be used for Allah, Oden, Shiva or Zeus. Does nothing to prove the God of Christianity that we profess belief in.

And in fact, I've heard Hindus give better arguments for why Brahman must be real, than what SBC has given here.
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Offline SavedByChrist94

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #81 on: January 06, 2013, 08:30:40 PM »
No offense, but you seem like somewhat of a narcissist. I get where you are coming from--there was a period when I got all obsessed in the pseudo-philosophy and silly debates and articles of Christian apologetics. Then I found Orthodoxy and realized that simple knowledge of theology already solves like 90% of the atheist worlds' objections because most of their objections and problems with Christianity come from a distorted view of Evangelical-Protestant doctrine. Moving on, nearly like 90% of all modern apologetic arguments for God are based off of ignorance, or, at the very best, are only cases for a deistic god at best, but do nothing to prove that the God of Christianity is true. Hurray, you may have refuted atheism, but now you have to explain why your God is the real God and thus effectively refute millions of other religions which have belief in a God/gods. Your famous "First Cause" thing argument could just as effectively be used for Allah, Oden, Shiva or Zeus. Does nothing to prove the God of Christianity that we profess belief in.


First Uncaused Cause Fact proves Genesis Correct, since that is correct God can only be The Trinity of The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit, 3 Persons, 1 God. also God has to be multiple Persons, otherwise He would be incapable of loving others.

Now, The Shroud of Jesus Christ,

No evidence of Forgery

Not a Painting

Faulty Carbon testing thousands of years behind

Caused by an X-ray like UV light, not forged

29 AD Pontius Pilate Coin on eye

Jerusalem Pollen from March/April

Looks like Historical Jesus Christ

crown of thorns

crucified

right side stabbed

flogged

Burial Cloth.

Offline PeterTheAleut

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #82 on: January 06, 2013, 08:39:31 PM »
Quote
Go ahead and defend "atheist"s downward spiral to death, I will be winning debates(because of The Holy Spirit) and leaving them no excuse but to come to Jesus Christ, where they will get from Him Eternal Life.

PetertheAleut and I have crossed swords many a time here, but there's nothing in what he's posted here which is defending atheism. But you, OTOH, are full of your own misguided greatness and misplaced zeal. Do not take the Holy Spirit's name in vain.  :police:

How did I take His name in vain? Please do not slander.

You said the Holy Spirit would guide you to win debates. You aren't winning anything, so please check your ego at the door.

Prove how I lose debates, every time I post Proof, Evidence, and Facts for God(The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit) no one can refute them, The Holy Spirit guides me with truth and wisdom, I believe in Him.
No one wants to refute your "evidence", because you've shown clearly that you merely want to beat others up, not actually debate them.
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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #83 on: January 06, 2013, 08:46:00 PM »
Folks, we're dealing with a textbook narcissist here. Appealing to reason or civility won't work, even if he were 50, not 18. He's too enthralled by his own awesomeness. :P ::)

How did I say I'm better than anyone? I attributed my success to The Holy Spirit and the arguments I use are a culmination of geniuses touched by The Holy Spirit. I say you will not win, not to be proud but because it's Fact, ANYONE who uses these arguments, such as William Lane Craig will not lose.
Is the work of the Holy Spirit to win debates or to win souls?

To win debates that win souls. Look at Stephen, Truth has to be told.
Stephen did not engage the Pharisees in a debate, and you are not a martyr.

Actually it sort of was, Pharisees were wrong so Stephan by The Holy Spirit countered them with Truth, that is sort oof argumentative, his point would never get anywhere had he not refuted them and defended Jesus Christ.

I ask you in a debate between a Christian and an "atheist" will not The Holy Spirit make sure The Christian wins in order to gain others Salvation? of course, when it comes to "atheist" you have to win debates to win their souls, very simple.
No, it's not that simple. You don't have to win debates to win their souls, especially when you make an ass of yourself as you did at both AtheistForums.com and AtheistForums.org.

Go ahead and defend "atheist"s downward spiral to death, I will be winning debates(because of The Holy Spirit) and leaving them no excuse but to come to Jesus Christ, where they will get from Him Eternal Life.
BTW, defending the actions a couple of atheist discussion sites have taken against your trolling is not a defense of atheism.
« Last Edit: January 06, 2013, 08:46:27 PM by PeterTheAleut »
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Offline 88Devin12

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #84 on: January 06, 2013, 09:01:35 PM »
Theological Breakthrough?

If you think you've reached a new revelation or a breakthrough it's either one of three things:

1. Something the Ancient Church has known for 2 millenia
2. Not a new idea, and a heresy
3. A new heresy

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #85 on: January 06, 2013, 09:18:15 PM »
Now, The Shroud of Jesus Christ,

No evidence of Forgery

Not a Painting

Faulty Carbon testing thousands of years behind

Caused by an X-ray like UV light, not forged

29 AD Pontius Pilate Coin on eye

Jerusalem Pollen from March/April

Looks like Historical Jesus Christ

crown of thorns

crucified

right side stabbed

flogged

Burial Cloth.

Just out of curiosity, what did they compare the Shroud to, to get the idea that it "looks like Historical Jesus Christ"?
"Sometimes, you just gotta say, 'OK, I still have nine live, two-headed animals' and move on.'' (owner of Coney Island freak show, upon learning he'd been outbid on a 5-legged puppy)

Offline Eastern Mind

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #86 on: January 06, 2013, 09:23:31 PM »
Theological Breakthrough?

If you think you've reached a new revelation or a breakthrough it's either one of three things:

1. Something the Ancient Church has known for 2 millenia
2. Not a new idea, and a heresy
3. A new heresy

He's just 1-upping himself.
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Offline Ebor

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #87 on: January 06, 2013, 09:32:43 PM »

Prove how I lose debates, every time I post Proof, Evidence, and Facts for God(The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit) no one can refute them, The Holy Spirit guides me with truth and wisdom, I believe in Him.

You are not posting "Proof", Evidence and Facts"  You are posting mere statements that are not backed up. You are making statements of your own ideas without explanation. You are saying that it is the Holy Spirit that is the director of your opinions and that is already a claim without support.  I could just in the same way post that statement for myself or that you are not guided by the Holy Spirit.  Either one would be an assertion and not any sort of "Fact" without some sort of backup.  You have not proved that it is the Spirit that guides you, to be blunt, you just claim that it is so.

In the New Testament it was the case that even when they heard the words of St. Paul and  his companion, who I think it can be agreed was guided by the spirit at least sometimes, the Bereans looked for support.  And they were praised for this. (Acts 17).

In debates there is an exchange of ideas, support and analysis.  It is not one person making claims and then declaring that she/he has "won".

Here is a page from the University of Virginia on the "The 9 Principles of Good Debating"

http://onlinelearn.edschool.virginia.edu/debate/thenine.html






I don't claim to win, I just win, why? because the opponent is incapable of refuting me.

What does the word "refute" mean to *you*?

If you discount another person's ideas that you do not agree with, if you do not engage in an actual conversation with the other then you are not in any sort of discussion, debate or argument on any subject. Telling others what they think or know when they don't or putting words in their mouths/posts that aren't theirs is setting up other Human Beings falsely.  

Ignoring what others write doesn't make you a "winner".  

Quote
Also the points, proofs, evidence, and Facts all lead to the inescapable conclusion that I posit, if not then please by all means prove that I didn't win, all the person has to do is refute me, otherwise I am well in my right to say I factually won the debate.

What is "Proof" to you beyond putting out what seem to be your own opinions without considering what other people really do think or what real science or history say.

What makes you an Authority?  Why should we accept your words or your claim that the Holy Spirit guides you?  Your statement are not "Proof"

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Offline Ebor

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #88 on: January 06, 2013, 09:36:25 PM »
Nope God is expecting every follower of His to Preach and Spread The Gospel.

And what, specifically, about this particular forum made you think "Hmm! Lots of people here need to know about the Gospel!" ?  ???

I thought and forgive me for my error, that this was like ChristianForums(Which I was banned from, in which there are a multitude of "atheist" to debate).

In what way did you think that OC.net was like that other forum?  Did you read much of the posting here before you started?  Learning something about a place or group can be helpful in preventing mis-steps and confusion
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Offline JamesR

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Re: Theological Breakthrough: Problem of Suffering Refuted, Permanently
« Reply #89 on: January 06, 2013, 09:43:35 PM »
First Uncaused Cause Fact proves Genesis Correct..

No it doesn't. At the very best, it proves that a Deistic entity (call it "God" if you want) created the universe--and even that is pushing it. But it does nothing to prove that it has to be the God of Christianity or that Genesis is true. You ignored the point entirely.

Quote
...since that is correct God can only be The Trinity of The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit, 3 Persons, 1 God. also God has to be multiple Persons, otherwise He would be incapable of loving others.

And how is this relevent to your first cause principle at all? Whether or not the God or gods "love us" is irrelevant to the creation of the universe. For all we know, they/it/He could have created us just to suffer because He's full of hate or created us for His own amusement.

Quote
Now, The Shroud of Jesus Christ,

No evidence of Forgery

Not a Painting

Faulty Carbon testing thousands of years behind

Caused by an X-ray like UV light, not forged

29 AD Pontius Pilate Coin on eye

Jerusalem Pollen from March/April

Looks like Historical Jesus Christ

crown of thorns

crucified

right side stabbed

flogged

Burial Cloth.

All of which is irrelevant to the question I asked you.
Until I see the resurrection of the dead and the life of the world to come, I will not believe.