Family Tree of Abrahamic Faiths/Religions according to Orthodox (Need Help)

[Michał Kalina]

don't the Karaites consider themselves to be the descendants of the Sadducees? Or is this just something somebody told me due to certain similarities in their beliefs?

There are some similarities (both groups believe in Torah Only) however Karaites emerged several hundreds of years after Sadducees had disappeared. There is no direct connection.

[Eastern Mind]

I would add Yezidi to the tree, although it's so obscure I doubt anyone has really heard of it.

Might as well add Zoroastrianiam while you're at it.

Well, I just added them because they do, at least, believe in the Abrahamic God, even if most of their worship centers around the peacock "angel" Melek Taus.

[Jetavan]

I would add Yezidi to the tree, although it's so obscure I doubt anyone has really heard of it.

Might as well add Zoroastrianiam while you're at it.

Well, I just added them because they do, at least, believe in the Abrahamic God, even if most of their worship centers around the peacock "angel" Melek Taus.

According to 2nd Chronicles 36:23:

“Thus says Cyrus, king of Persia: ‘All the kingdoms of the earth the LORD, the God of heaven, has given to me, and he has also charged me to build him a house in Jerusalem, which is in Judah. Whoever, therefore, among you belongs to any part of his people, let him go up, and may his God be with him!’”

Cyrus the Great was most likely a Zoroastrian, and yet according to the text above the author of Chronicles also saw him as someone who believed in the God of heaven, the God of Moses. One possibility was that the author thought that Cyrus was Jewish; but there is no evidence that he was Jewish. Another possibility, which I consider to be much more likely, was that the author viewed Cyrus's God (Ahura Mazda) to really be the Jewish God, though perhaps the Zoroastrians were off a little in their theology and so forth.

In Isaiah 45, Cyrus is called God's "anointed', or "moshiach" ("messiah"), partly because of Cyrus aiding the Jewish return to Jerusalem and rebuilding the Temple.

[rakovsky]

I would add Yezidi to the tree, although it's so obscure I doubt anyone has really heard of it.

Might as well add Zoroastrianiam while you're at it.

Well, I just added them because they do, at least, believe in the Abrahamic God, even if most of their worship centers around the peacock "angel" Melek Taus.

According to 2nd Chronicles 36:23:

“Thus says Cyrus, king of Persia: ‘All the kingdoms of the earth the LORD, the God of heaven, has given to me, and he has also charged me to build him a house in Jerusalem, which is in Judah. Whoever, therefore, among you belongs to any part of his people, let him go up, and may his God be with him!’”

Cyrus the Great was most likely a Zoroastrian, and yet according to the text above the author of Chronicles also saw him as someone who believed in the God of heaven, the God of Moses. One possibility was that the author thought that Cyrus was Jewish; but there is no evidence that he was Jewish. Another possibility, which I consider to be much more likely, was that the author viewed Cyrus's God (Ahura Mazda) to really be the Jewish God, though perhaps the Zoroastrians were off a little in their theology and so forth.

Jetavan,

I think this is an interesting issue or problem you bring up. There is also a part in the Old Testament where it describes Pharaoh the Lame talking about Israel's God with reverence before the Pharaoh defeated and killed King Josiah. Normally, one would not expect this, because the Egyptians believed in a multiplicity of gods, none of which were named Jehovah/Yahweh. Not to mention the fact that the pharaoh in Moses' time was against Moses' God.

(The fact that Cyrus was called anointed, though, doesn't mean he believed in God though, because Nebechudnezzar was called that too, and the idea was that God chose (ie anointed) him for a mission, not that the person believed.)

Nonetheless, I am not sure the Zoroastrians followed the Abrahamic God, just because they were monotheists: this could have been the Chronicler's own interpretation. Their monotheism could have come from a source independent of Abraham, I think.

Another point: I think there is a mention that the Israelites' neighbors thought Israel's god was punishing them. I could be wrong about that. But being polytheists, they could have thought Israel's god was real, they just didn't focus on him. After all, among Israelites, there was occasional polytheism that included worship to Jehovah along with Baal and idol worship. That being he case, Cyrus or others could have acknowledged Jehovah, without actually focusing on him in an Abrahamic and monotheist way.

[JamesR]

Interesting that every group on your chart except for Oriental Orthodox Christianity has groups breaking away from it.

Don't start that crap again.

From an OO perspective, it would be very easy to produce a chart showing how all groups which break away from us end up breaking into pieces themselves.

You mean how there is no uniformity in the OO Churches and how most of them have varying beliefs amongst each other?--even if they are formally considered together.

[Asteriktos]

Interesting that every group on your chart except for Oriental Orthodox Christianity has groups breaking away from it.

Don't start that crap again.

Again? That post was from 2009...

[Nephi]

From an OO perspective, it would be very easy to produce a chart showing how all groups which break away from us end up breaking into pieces themselves.

You mean how there is no uniformity in the OO Churches and how most of them have varying beliefs amongst each other?--even if they are formally considered together.

You mean they're just like the EO?

[Nephi]

Again? That post was from 2009...

You know, this is the only forum I've been on where there are no rules (as far as I'm aware) against resurrecting old threads.

And almost every day on here I'm reminded why they do.

[yeshuaisiam]

Interesting that every group on your chart except for Oriental Orthodox Christianity has groups breaking away from it.

From an OO perspective, it would be very easy to produce a chart showing how all groups which break away from us end up breaking into pieces themselves.

Can understand why that nice, though somewhat strict, Ethiopian in Melbourne said to me, "Only the Oriental Orthodox are Christian."

Was pleased nonetheless to hear less strict views when this one wasn't about though

Exactly.  These charts pretty much give "ah ha's" to those it works for.  Ebionites were not even included.  Roman Catholics would stick themselves on the "main line".

Plus I could make a chart showing where "Orthodoxy" changed, and make marks from that.  Old believers would show how everything came off of them and how modern Orthodoxy "broke tradition" from the way of old belief.

Sorry, charts are just kind of loaded/propaganda.

Basically I look at them like a teacher who walks in on a room of 1st graders all yelling "nanny nanny boo boo, I was here first".   Except, there are 20 kids, all that have history that proves it.

[Nephi]

Exactly.  These charts pretty much give "ah ha's" to those it works for.  Ebionites were not even included.  Roman Catholics would stick themselves on the "main line".

Plus I could make a chart showing where "Orthodoxy" changed, and make marks from that.  Old believers would show how everything came off of them and how modern Orthodoxy "broke tradition" from the way of old belief.

Sorry, charts are just kind of loaded/propaganda.

I think the chart was meant to show a traditional EO perspective - not an 'objective' perspective. Look at the title of the thread - "according to Orthodox."

[Salpy]

Interesting that every group on your chart except for Oriental Orthodox Christianity has groups breaking away from it.

Don't start that crap again.

From an OO perspective, it would be very easy to produce a chart showing how all groups which break away from us end up breaking into pieces themselves.

You mean how there is no uniformity in the OO Churches and how most of them have varying beliefs amongst each other?--even if they are formally considered together.

We are uniform in our basic faith, but diverse in our liturgy and other practices.  This diversity is something the EO's used to have until relatively recently, if I understand correctly.  Lockstep uniformity did not exist in early Christianity, and I am rather glad that the OO's have not given in to that trend, which had its origins in the West.  A lot of EO's here have expressed a desire to one day see local liturgical traditions revived, and I hope that happens.

[Michał Kalina]

You know, this is the only forum I've been on where there are no rules (as far as I'm aware) against resurrecting old threads.

You are not mistaken.

[Cyrillic]

Interesting that every group on your chart except for Oriental Orthodox Christianity has groups breaking away from it.

Don't start that crap again.

From an OO perspective, it would be very easy to produce a chart showing how all groups which break away from us end up breaking into pieces themselves.

You mean how there is no uniformity in the OO Churches and how most of them have varying beliefs amongst each other?--even if they are formally considered together.

Care to substantiate these claims?

[Tags:]

OrthodoxChristianity.net > Moderated Forums > Free-For-All > Religious Topics > Topic: Family Tree of Abrahamic Faiths/Religions according to Orthodox (Need Help)