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Author Topic: Greece/Ελληνική Δημοκρατία  (Read 1682 times) Average Rating: 0
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« on: December 16, 2012, 08:24:46 AM »


Hellenic Democracy/Greece/Ελληνική Δημοκρατία - was established in 19th Century.

Why orthodox state called by this unchristian and paganic name?


John of Damascus:

All Heresies come from four heretical mothers :
1) barbarity
2) Scythianism,
3) Hellenism,
4) Judaism.

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« Reply #1 on: December 16, 2012, 08:35:38 AM »

Hellenic used to mean "Greek", then it came to mean "Pagan" and then it came to mean "Greek" again. The meaning of words change. They chose this specific name because by calling themselves "Greeks/Hellens" they could get more sympathy from the philhellenic european powers. Calling themselves Romaioi wouldn't have been helpful in their struggle for independence.

But why is this thread in the Oriental Orthodox subforum?
« Last Edit: December 16, 2012, 08:45:53 AM by Cyrillic » Logged

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« Reply #2 on: December 16, 2012, 08:57:01 AM »

This will be a funny thread.

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« Reply #3 on: December 16, 2012, 09:05:19 AM »

There are "Hellenic church" ( Greek Orthodox Church/Ελληνορθόδοξη Εκκλησί)- taken after "country name" which refuse to call name patriarch due liturgy... so basically it be came kind of "new oriental church" .

So my guess it is technological reason, not christian.... so all issue, combined together, just make me wounder what is going on, and who behind of this. Any names? who allowed Christ name to be mixed with with unchristian value?





 
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« Reply #4 on: December 16, 2012, 09:22:28 AM »

There are "Hellenic church" ( Greek Orthodox Church/Ελληνορθόδοξη Εκκλησί)- taken after "country name" which refuse to call name patriarch due liturgy... so basically it be came kind of "new oriental church" .

 Huh

So my guess it is technological reason, not christian.... so all issue, combined together, just make me wounder what is going on, and who behind of this. Any names? who allowed Christ name to be mixed with with unchristian value?

Οὐ γὰρ ἐπαισχύνομαι τὸ εὐαγγέλιον; δύναμις γὰρ Θεοῦ ἐστὶν εἰς σωτηρίαν παντὶ τῷ πιστεύοντι, Ἰουδαίῳ τε πρῶτον καὶ Ἕλληνι. (Romans 1:16)

For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God to salvation to every one that believes; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

Again, the meaning of words change. Helleniki dimokratia isn't a "bad" name. It doesn't mean Pagan Democracy but Greek Democracy.
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« Reply #5 on: December 16, 2012, 09:11:29 PM »

There are "Hellenic church" ( Greek Orthodox Church/Ελληνορθόδοξη Εκκλησί)- taken after "country name" which refuse to call name patriarch due liturgy

What specific church does not commemorate what patriarch during liturgy?
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« Reply #6 on: December 16, 2012, 09:12:44 PM »

What is "a new oriental Church"?
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« Reply #7 on: December 16, 2012, 09:16:33 PM »

There are "Hellenic church" ( Greek Orthodox Church/Ελληνορθόδοξη Εκκλησί)- taken after "country name" which refuse to call name patriarch due liturgy... so basically it be came kind of "new oriental church" .

So my guess it is technological reason, not christian.... so all issue, combined together, just make me wounder what is going on, and who behind of this. Any names? who allowed Christ name to be mixed with with unchristian value?



 

I'm sorry, I don't understand.
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« Reply #8 on: December 19, 2012, 01:57:07 AM »

There are "Hellenic church" ( Greek Orthodox Church/Ελληνορθόδοξη Εκκλησί)- taken after "country name" which refuse to call name patriarch due liturgy

What specific church does not commemorate what patriarch during liturgy?

It is not my job to report, but i see a lot of what is called "greek orthodox" parishes where Patriarh of Constantinople do not commemorated.  And head bishop know about and welcome it or enforce etc.

As well i did heard about some "Russians" (as they call them-self "abroad") do same.

but it is side kick of this topic.
Main questions:

where "Hellenic Chirch/Ελληνορθόδοξη Εκκλησί" come from and fist time name was used?
What reason for it?
Who is smarty who push for it?

 
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« Reply #9 on: December 19, 2012, 01:58:52 AM »

There are "Hellenic church" ( Greek Orthodox Church/Ελληνορθόδοξη Εκκλησί)- taken after "country name" which refuse to call name patriarch due liturgy... so basically it be came kind of "new oriental church" .

So my guess it is technological reason, not christian.... so all issue, combined together, just make me wounder what is going on, and who behind of this. Any names? who allowed Christ name to be mixed with with unchristian value?



 


I'm sorry, I don't understand.

I'm sorry, I don't understand, what do you do not understand?
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« Reply #10 on: December 19, 2012, 02:26:32 AM »

It is not my job to report, but i see a lot of what is called "greek orthodox" parishes where Patriarh of Constantinople do not commemorated.  And head bishop know about and welcome it or enforce etc.

Unlike the Russians, in Greek (or Rum, if you prefer) practice, only the local bishop is commemorated during the Divine Liturgy, not the Patriarch. Only if the ruling bishop is serving will he commemorate his Patriarch/Archbishop. So even in those "greek orthodox" parishes which are under the jurisdiction of the Ecumenical Patriarchate you would not hear the Patriarch of Constantinople commemorated.

The term "Greek Orthodox" is not just used by the Church of Greece, which became autocephalous following the Greek revolution, but also by autocephalous churches which were never under the Patriarchate of Constantinople, the churches of Alexandria, Antioch, Jerusalem and Cyprus.
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« Reply #11 on: December 19, 2012, 09:28:34 AM »


The term "Greek Orthodox" is not just used by the Church of Greece, which became autocephalous following the Greek revolution, but also by autocephalous churches which were never under the Patriarchate of Constantinople, the churches of Alexandria, Antioch, Jerusalem and Cyprus.

Since what???
and forced by whom?

Since pope make himself "cathollic"? and established fake name "Byzantine empire" instead "Roman empire".... good fake.

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« Reply #12 on: December 19, 2012, 09:36:29 AM »

There are "Hellenic church" ( Greek Orthodox Church/Ελληνορθόδοξη Εκκλησί)- taken after "country name" which refuse to call name patriarch due liturgy... so basically it be came kind of "new oriental church" .

So my guess it is technological reason, not christian.... so all issue, combined together, just make me wounder what is going on, and who behind of this. Any names? who allowed Christ name to be mixed with with unchristian value?



 


I'm sorry, I don't understand.

I'm sorry, I don't understand, what do you do not understand?

It's my Xmas marigold!

Thank you.

Thank you!
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« Reply #13 on: December 19, 2012, 09:36:42 AM »


The term "Greek Orthodox" is not just used by the Church of Greece, which became autocephalous following the Greek revolution, but also by autocephalous churches which were never under the Patriarchate of Constantinople, the churches of Alexandria, Antioch, Jerusalem and Cyprus.

Since pope make himself "cathollic"? and established fake name "Byzantine empire" instead "Roman empire".... good fake.



LOL
« Last Edit: December 19, 2012, 09:36:52 AM by Cyrillic » Logged

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« Reply #14 on: December 19, 2012, 09:40:49 AM »

But why is this thread in the Oriental Orthodox subforum?

Because it is brilliant?
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« Reply #15 on: December 19, 2012, 09:52:51 AM »

There are "Hellenic church" ( Greek Orthodox Church/Ελληνορθόδοξη Εκκλησί)- taken after "country name" which refuse to call name patriarch due liturgy

What specific church does not commemorate what patriarch during liturgy?

It is not my job to report, but i see a lot of what is called "greek orthodox" parishes where Patriarh of Constantinople do not commemorated.  And head bishop know about and welcome it or enforce etc.

As well i did heard about some "Russians" (as they call them-self "abroad") do same.

but it is side kick of this topic.
Main questions:

where "Hellenic Chirch/Ελληνορθόδοξη Εκκλησί" come from and fist time name was used?
What reason for it?
Who is smarty who push for it?

 

In my parish, we commemorate 'our Archbishop Alexiou,' as well as all priests, deacons and the 'brotherhood in Christ.' This includes all the clergy. Surely the Patriarch is in the brotherhood in Christ?

God knows everything, and he knows who we include in our intentions before we even say it.
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« Reply #16 on: December 19, 2012, 11:35:51 AM »

There are "Hellenic church" ( Greek Orthodox Church/Ελληνορθόδοξη Εκκλησί)- taken after "country name" which refuse to call name patriarch due liturgy

What specific church does not commemorate what patriarch during liturgy?

It is not my job to report, but i see a lot of what is called "greek orthodox" parishes where Patriarh of Constantinople do not commemorated.  And head bishop know about and welcome it or enforce etc.

As well i did heard about some "Russians" (as they call them-self "abroad") do same.

but it is side kick of this topic.
Main questions:

where "Hellenic Chirch/Ελληνορθόδοξη Εκκλησί" come from and fist time name was used?
What reason for it?
Who is smarty who push for it?

 

In my parish, we commemorate 'our Archbishop Alexiou,' as well as all priests, deacons and the 'brotherhood in Christ.' This includes all the clergy. Surely the Patriarch is in the brotherhood in Christ?

God knows everything, and he knows who we include in our intentions before we even say it.

so we say it for our self then.... and it is one more proof about some geopolical games around orthodoxy which elevated to level of paganism.

i not say you do wrong etc. i just pointing about there are not place in orthodoxy for geopolitical games. Patriarh of Romania - is bishop of cappadocia.... ? kind of joke...
 
every bishop in his town have full apostolic autocracy... i do respect that, as long he keep orthodoxy.... i just sick of all those political foreplay....we Russians, we Greeks, we Macedonian, we Serbs, we Romanian... which other ethnically proud folks more i missed?

 
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« Reply #17 on: December 19, 2012, 01:26:56 PM »

I am somewhat confused here, Alive.
If I understand you, your original point seems that the term Hellene/Hellenic which USED to connote pre-Christian Greco-Roman paganism while the term "Roman" denoted a Greek-speaking citizen of the Empire who was an Orthodox Catholic Christian (which you do not mention), such is labels as were once used should be used again?.
I guess with the resurgence of neo-paganism in Greece today one could object to these cults' use of the term Hellenic, if that is your point.
But now you appear to be complaining about something else.
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« Reply #18 on: December 19, 2012, 03:02:12 PM »

But now you appear to be complaining about something else.

Let's hope so and for much more to come.
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« Reply #19 on: December 19, 2012, 11:35:16 PM »

I am somewhat confused here, Alive.
If I understand you, your original point seems that the term Hellene/Hellenic which USED to connote pre-Christian Greco-Roman paganism while the term "Roman" denoted a Greek-speaking citizen of the Empire who was an Orthodox Catholic Christian (which you do not mention), such is labels as were once used should be used again?.
I guess with the resurgence of neo-paganism in Greece today one could object to these cults' use of the term Hellenic, if that is your point.
But now you appear to be complaining about something else.

I see , you pick up thing very clear... sound like you know more then me about rising paganism.... i just make guess about.

i did shift to "bishop" and other "oriental/domestic jurisdictions"  ,  as related issue. as becose "greec jurestiction" was identide by "govermantal" boarder bit more then hundred years ago, as well as many other we did mentioned above and some we dont. - like orthodoxy in USA i guess (but we do not want to go there i guess Smiley....

So, i would like to know about your experience to taste "raising paganism" in "Greece".  It is raising all around the world i guess, but possibly "Greeks" suffer more then any one? is not?

Because i cant get , if Greece is orthodox state by constitution, so what support paganism may have?
Would be constitution  rewritten?  to suit new age technological and social demands?



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« Reply #20 on: December 19, 2012, 11:39:27 PM »

It's one thing to ask if certain clerical leaders are doing a good job. It's another to keep saying there's paganism to do with it.

Is there really a spike in polytheism? I must have missed that.  Huh
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« Reply #21 on: December 22, 2012, 09:42:18 AM »



But why is this thread in the Oriental Orthodox subforum?


Not any more.... Smiley


But for you this document could be useful to get familiar with:

1867   The Alaska Purchase treaty :


Quote
ARTICLE II.

In the cession of territory and dominion made by the preceding article are included the right of property in all public lots and squares, vacant lands, and all public buildings, fortifications, barracks, and other edifices which are not private individual property. It is, however, understood and agreed, that the churches which have been built in the ceded territory by the Russian government, shall remain the property of such members of the Greek Oriental Church resident in the territory, as may choose to worship therein.





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« Reply #22 on: December 22, 2012, 09:49:44 AM »

Yes, I'm well aware that the Eastern Orthodox Church was sometimes called the Oriental Orthodox Church before the 20th century. Oriental and Eastern are synonyms. But since at least the second half of the 20th century the name Oriental Orthodox has been almost exclusively given to those who in the past were called either Jacobites or Monophysites.
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« Reply #23 on: December 22, 2012, 10:15:18 AM »

Since pope make himself "cathollic"? and established fake name "Byzantine empire" instead "Roman empire".... good fake.

I can see your point, that the Orthodox populations of the east surrendered their Roman identity to the Latin West.

I don't think the switch from "Roman" to "Greek" is a problem for the Church, but it could be argued that the identity of the people themselves has been compromised by the change. Rum identity was first and foremost an Orthodox Christian identity above all else, while 'Greek' identity since the Revolution seems to have undermined this somewhat. I heard many monks on Mount Athos say 'The Byzantine Empire did not fall in 1453, but in 1821". There is probably some truth in that.

That being said, for the vast majority of Greeks a renunciation of Orthodoxy is also a forfeit of Greek identity. Likewise, a lot of Western converts are offended when a Greek tells them "when you become Orthodox, you become Greek", because Westerners don't understand the religious rather than racial identity of the Roman/Byzantine ethnos. So in many ways it is still alive and well. In Cyprus, for example, the Greeks who converted to Islam and adopted the Turkish language became Turks. Yet others in Asia Minor, whose only language was Turkish, but who remained Orthodox Christians, were still very much considered Greeks. The difference between a Greek and a Turk, then, was not whether one spoke Greek or Turkish, but whether one was an Orthodox Christian or a Muslim.

I suppose what the adoption of the term 'Greek' does is cause potential confusion in a way that the term 'Rum' did not. Those who consider themselves Greek place quite considerable emphasis on their being inheritors of the cultural and philosophical legacy of ancient pagan Greece, in a way that those who considered themselves Rum perhaps would not. In terms of actual appeals to paganism, however, nothing of the sort is true.
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« Reply #24 on: December 22, 2012, 10:30:46 AM »

Yes, I'm well aware that the Eastern Orthodox Church was sometimes called the Oriental Orthodox Church before the 20th century. Oriental and Eastern are synonyms. But since at least the second half of the 20th century the name Oriental Orthodox has been almost exclusively given to those who in the past were called either Jacobites or Monophysites.

they are heretics....

Every town where christian live have same Church. Church in Thessaloniki, Church in Alexandria etc.... but if some one start promoting wrong, so they get identified as heretical group: Monophysites, Judaism etc...  


It is not good to use wrong name.

About Church:
One(Solo) , Holly, Catholic, Apostolic Church.

About Perception (faith/confession/teaching) :
Correct one (Orthodox)



1. So church cant be an "orthodox" but faith .
2. who force substitute meaning ? satana.
3. why ? to promote heresy into level of correctness.

So in reality there never was any "Greek church" , there was only, 1 Catholic church, what pop refuse to respect. so he also distribute myth about "byzantine empire" instead if "roman empire" etc....


Because this , people was forced to take pagan name of "Ελληνική Δημοκρατία". and about 100 ears after, rest Territory was cleaned from any possible memory about "roman empire".... even Constantinople was renamed into Istanbul.... by who ? muslim? no... !!!

Ottoman Sultan was happy with name of Constantinople and title of "Roman Emperor".
Guess who was not happy with such historical evidence?

POP OF ROME.

So game plan was:
- change name Catholic Church into "oriental orthodox"
- make each local "orientals" be ruled by 1 leader who do what local government told him to do
- make more mess about common orthodox value




So i guess before 1830th (or so)  "Ελληνορθόδοξη Εκκλησί" - NEVER existedHuh

Is is correct?




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« Reply #25 on: December 22, 2012, 10:53:35 AM »


I can see your point, that the Orthodox populations of the east surrendered their Roman identity to the Latin West.

I don't think the switch from "Roman" to "Greek" is a problem for the Church, but it could be argued that the identity of the people themselves has been compromised by the change. Rum identity was first and foremost an Orthodox Christian identity above all else, while 'Greek' identity since the Revolution seems to have undermined this somewhat. I heard many monks on Mount Athos say 'The Byzantine Empire did not fall in 1453, but in 1821". There is probably some truth in that.

1. why 1821 not 1920th? 

For me , it  is look like 1920th, with following "orthodox deportation" and "Constantinople rename".

2. Why  "Byzantine Empire" not  "Roman Empire"  ? there are no single historical document with such name as  "Byzantine Empire". so in reality " Byzantine Empire" - historical fraud. 








That being said, for the vast majority of Greeks a renunciation of Orthodoxy is also a forfeit of Greek identity. Likewise, a lot of Western converts are offended when a Greek tells them "when you become Orthodox, you become Greek", because Westerners don't understand the religious rather than racial identity of the Roman/Byzantine ethnos. So in many ways it is still alive and well. In Cyprus, for example, the Greeks who converted to Islam and adopted the Turkish language became Turks. Yet others in Asia Minor, whose only language was Turkish, but who remained Orthodox Christians, were still very much considered Greeks. The difference between a Greek and a Turk, then, was not whether one spoke Greek or Turkish, but whether one was an Orthodox Christian or a Muslim.


so , as you say - it was not ethnical identity ....  and it is key factor.
Not national , nor ethnical .... but religious. 


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« Reply #26 on: December 22, 2012, 10:58:01 AM »

You should become a comedian

 Cheesy
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« Reply #27 on: December 22, 2012, 12:11:27 PM »

You should become a comedian

 Cheesy

Be nice. He's not working in his first language here.
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« Reply #28 on: December 22, 2012, 12:16:27 PM »

You should become a comedian

 Cheesy

Be nice. He's not working in his first language here.

It's not the spelling I'm ridiculing but notions that names like the "Greek Orthodox Church" and the "Byzantine Empire"  are the results of some nefarious papal conspiracy. Also, the Pope is apparently to blame that the Orthodox Church had to deal with caesaropapism.
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« Reply #29 on: December 22, 2012, 12:23:43 PM »

You should become a comedian

 Cheesy

Be nice. He's not working in his first language here.

Cyrillic is neither.
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« Reply #30 on: December 22, 2012, 12:25:08 PM »

You should become a comedian

 Cheesy

Be nice. He's not working in his first language here.

Cyrillic is neither.

Some are better than others. Yourself included.
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« Reply #31 on: December 22, 2012, 12:26:42 PM »

You should become a comedian

 Cheesy

Be nice. He's not working in his first language here.

Cyrillic is neither.

Do you mean neither as in not nice and not working in my first language? Oh, the ambiguity lol.


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« Reply #32 on: December 22, 2012, 12:27:19 PM »

You should become a comedian

 Cheesy

Be nice. He's not working in his first language here.

Cyrillic is neither.

Some are better than others. Yourself included.

Michal, he means others.
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« Reply #33 on: December 22, 2012, 12:27:47 PM »

You should become a comedian

 Cheesy

Be nice. He's not working in his first language here.

Cyrillic is neither.

Do you mean neither as in not nice and not working in my first language? Oh, the ambiguity.




You're Dutch. English is your first language.
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« Reply #34 on: December 22, 2012, 12:33:11 PM »

You should become a comedian

 Cheesy

Be nice. He's not working in his first language here.

Cyrillic is neither.

Do you mean neither as in not nice and not working in my first language? Oh, the ambiguity.




You're Dutch. English is your first language.

+1
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« Reply #35 on: December 22, 2012, 02:12:37 PM »

Since pope make himself "cathollic"? and established fake name "Byzantine empire" instead "Roman empire".... good fake.

I can see your point, that the Orthodox populations of the east surrendered their Roman identity to the Latin West.

I don't think the switch from "Roman" to "Greek" is a problem for the Church, but it could be argued that the identity of the people themselves has been compromised by the change. Rum identity was first and foremost an Orthodox Christian identity above all else, while 'Greek' identity since the Revolution seems to have undermined this somewhat. I heard many monks on Mount Athos say 'The Byzantine Empire did not fall in 1453, but in 1821". There is probably some truth in that.

That being said, for the vast majority of Greeks a renunciation of Orthodoxy is also a forfeit of Greek identity. Likewise, a lot of Western converts are offended when a Greek tells them "when you become Orthodox, you become Greek", because Westerners don't understand the religious rather than racial identity of the Roman/Byzantine ethnos. So in many ways it is still alive and well. In Cyprus, for example, the Greeks who converted to Islam and adopted the Turkish language became Turks. Yet others in Asia Minor, whose only language was Turkish, but who remained Orthodox Christians, were still very much considered Greeks. The difference between a Greek and a Turk, then, was not whether one spoke Greek or Turkish, but whether one was an Orthodox Christian or a Muslim.

I suppose what the adoption of the term 'Greek' does is cause potential confusion in a way that the term 'Rum' did not. Those who consider themselves Greek place quite considerable emphasis on their being inheritors of the cultural and philosophical legacy of ancient pagan Greece, in a way that those who considered themselves Rum perhaps would not. In terms of actual appeals to paganism, however, nothing of the sort is true.

You do make some good and valid points. Unfortunately, our "founding fathers" (Adamantios Korais, Theophilos Kairis among others), or men who influenced the founding fathers (Methodios Anthrakites, Athanasios Psalidas etc) abhorred everything Orthodox and looked down on anything resembling Byzantine (Rum) and not Hellenic. In a way, we named our nation-state Hellas, and we call ourselves Hellenes, urged to do so by the "enlightened west", who fantasized, men in togas indulging in furious philosophical debates conversing in Classical Greek (instead of piss-poor goat-herders crossing themselves in some strange way and speaking a peculiar form of vernacular Greek).
We chose west instead of "καθ' ἡμᾶς ἀνατολή" ("east according to us") -a term used for the first time by the archbishop of Athens Chrysanthos (+1949)- the east οf our Kollyvades fathers, Georgios Typaldos-Iakovatos (not even a page, a single page, in either Greek or English is dedicated to him on the internetz!), or the first President of the free Greek State Ioannis Kapodistrias (who was assassinated shortly before entering the Church of St. Spyridon on a Sunday morning, to recite the six-psalms of the Matins service, following the footsteps of the Byzantine emperors).
The current crisis will do us the favor though, and destroy the "ψευτορωμαίικο" (phony-roman nation). St. Kosmas of Aetolia has said so: "Θά'ρθει πρῶτα ἕνα ψευτορωμαίικο, νὰ μήν τὸ πιστέψετε θὰ φύγει πίσω" ("a phony-roman nation will come first, don't trust in it, it'll go")
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« Reply #36 on: December 26, 2012, 07:07:32 PM »

The so-called Byzantine Empire is a construct of historians. The 'Byzantines' always called themselves 'Romans'; it was the Eastern Roman Empire, after all. But for Western scholarship, as soon as Rome fell, everything Roman was as good as finished, especially after the rise of nation-states.

The state was named Hellenic Republic as a link with the ancient past and an expression of sovereignty. 'Greek' comes from the Latin 'Graeci' (with connotations of subservience to the Roman conquerors) and the even more pejorative 'Graecyli' that the Frankish occupiers of the latter Middle Ages called the locals. Even now there is an adjective, 'graecylism', meaning the willingness to grovel to the will of the West.

'Istanbul' is a corruption of the phrase 'eis tin Polin' (in the City), and it is a relatively recent construct, deriving from 'Stamboul', which was a common 19th-century name for the area. The Ottomans actually called the city 'Kostantiniyye' until the establishment of the Turkish Republic.

The Greek Orthodox Church is an umbrella term for EO churches that worship in the Koine Greek language. The Church of Greece, on the other hand, is the jurisdiction of most of the country's territory, autocephalus under the aegis of the Ecumenical Patriarchate. It was established in 1833.
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« Reply #37 on: January 05, 2013, 10:26:09 AM »



You do make some good and valid points. Unfortunately, our "founding fathers" (Adamantios Korais, Theophilos Kairis among others), or men who influenced the founding fathers (Methodios Anthrakites, Athanasios Psalidas etc) abhorred everything Orthodox and looked down on anything resembling Byzantine (Rum) and not Hellenic. In a way, we named our nation-state Hellas, and we call ourselves Hellenes, urged to do so by the "enlightened west", who fantasized, men in togas indulging in furious philosophical debates conversing in Classical Greek (instead of piss-poor goat-herders crossing themselves in some strange way and speaking a peculiar form of vernacular Greek).
We chose west instead of "καθ' ἡμᾶς ἀνατολή" ("east according to us") -a term used for the first time by the archbishop of Athens Chrysanthos (+1949)- the east οf our Kollyvades fathers, Georgios Typaldos-Iakovatos (not even a page, a single page, in either Greek or English is dedicated to him on the internetz!), or the first President of the free Greek State Ioannis Kapodistrias (who was assassinated shortly before entering the Church of St. Spyridon on a Sunday morning, to recite the six-psalms of the Matins service, following the footsteps of the Byzantine emperors).
The current crisis will do us the favor though, and destroy the "ψευτορωμαίικο" (phony-roman nation). St. Kosmas of Aetolia has said so: "Θά'ρθει πρῶτα ἕνα ψευτορωμαίικο, νὰ μήν τὸ πιστέψετε θὰ φύγει πίσω" ("a phony-roman nation will come first, don't trust in it, it'll go")

powerful declaration, sound like situation worse than i thought ...

Kirie Elaison imas....
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« Reply #38 on: January 05, 2013, 11:11:47 AM »

The so-called Byzantine Empire is a construct of historians. The 'Byzantines' always called themselves 'Romans'; it was the Eastern Roman Empire, after all. But for Western scholarship, as soon as Rome fell, everything Roman was as good as finished, especially after the rise of nation-states.

The state was named Hellenic Republic as a link with the ancient past and an expression of sovereignty. 'Greek' comes from the Latin 'Graeci' (with connotations of subservience to the Roman conquerors) and the even more pejorative 'Graecyli' that the Frankish occupiers of the latter Middle Ages called the locals. Even now there is an adjective, 'graecylism', meaning the willingness to grovel to the will of the West.


Graeculi is 'little Greeks' in Latin. It's pretty derogative. It's how you would adress children.
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« Reply #39 on: January 05, 2013, 10:28:23 PM »


The state was named Hellenic Republic as a link with the ancient past and an expression of sovereignty. 'Greek' comes from the Latin 'Graeci' (with connotations of subservience to the Roman conquerors) and the even more pejorative 'Graecyli' that the Frankish occupiers of the latter Middle Ages called the locals. Even now there is an adjective, 'graecylism', meaning the willingness to grovel to the will of the West.


Graeculi is 'little Greeks' in Latin. It's pretty derogative. It's how you would adress children.

So i guess , GREEK = NIGER .... some thing like that...
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« Reply #40 on: January 05, 2013, 10:47:57 PM »

The so-called Byzantine Empire is a construct of historians. The 'Byzantines' always called themselves 'Romans'; it was the Eastern Roman Empire, after all. But for Western scholarship, as soon as Rome fell, everything Roman was as good as finished, especially after the rise of nation-states.

The state was named Hellenic Republic as a link with the ancient past and an expression of sovereignty. 'Greek' comes from the Latin 'Graeci' (with connotations of subservience to the Roman conquerors) and the even more pejorative 'Graecyli' that the Frankish occupiers of the latter Middle Ages called the locals. Even now there is an adjective, 'graecylism', meaning the willingness to grovel to the will of the West.


Graeculi is 'little Greeks' in Latin. It's pretty derogative. It's how you would adress children.

Yes indeed, it's the diminutive form. Latin rocks!!!
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