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Author Topic: Question about Gift of Holy spirit?  (Read 261 times) Average Rating: 0
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walter1234
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« on: November 18, 2012, 03:59:10 AM »

If God do not give me the gift of 'healing' and 'casting out demons', when I see the patients or the men who is possessed by demons, What should I do?

Can I still go to heal the patients or excorise the demons from them in jesus name? OR should I just pray for them behind?
« Last Edit: November 18, 2012, 04:07:15 AM by walter1234 » Logged
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« Reply #1 on: November 18, 2012, 04:32:20 AM »

Just pray for them. Presuming to cast out demons or heal others is not a good thing, and besides can be really annoying or upsetting for the person you are presuming to heal. You may not know their condition or why they are as they are, but God does, so just pray. He will hear your prayer and if it be His will, He will heal the person of His own accord, whether through you or not.
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walter1234
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« Reply #2 on: November 18, 2012, 04:47:14 AM »

If God did not give us the gift of healing or the gift of 'casting out demon', can we still do the healing or the exorism with the others?
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walter1234
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« Reply #3 on: November 18, 2012, 04:50:07 AM »

Quote
Matthew chapter 17:
19.Then came the disciples to Jesus apart, and said, Why could not we cast him out?

20.And Jesus said unto them, Because of your unbelief: for verily I say unto you, If ye have faith as a grain of mustard seed, ye shall say unto this mountain, Remove hence to yonder place; and it shall remove; and nothing shall be impossible unto you.
 
21.Howbeit this kind goeth not out but by prayer and fasting.


Without the gift of exorcism, we can also cast out the demons through the prayer and fasting.

So,what is the difference casting our demons through 'the gift of exorcism' and  through 'the prayer and fasting'?
« Last Edit: November 18, 2012, 05:13:42 AM by walter1234 » Logged
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« Reply #4 on: November 18, 2012, 05:23:23 AM »

I'm not sure what you mean by the 'gift of exorcism'. As far as I know, this is something that a priest may be able to do, and there is some kind of rite for it (I don't know exactly what it is, but you can read a little bit here in a previous thread), but it is not as a layperson might do by praying over a person.

Prayer and fasting...well, those are obvious, aren't they? And it's true: Prayer and fasting does cast out demons, but by the power of God, not any particular ability given to us as individuals. If it were that simple, then all Copts would be expert demon-cast-awayers after fasting for the vast majority of the year. Alas, that is not the case.
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mike
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« Reply #5 on: November 18, 2012, 05:25:59 AM »

Only specially prepared priests are exorcists in a popular sense (I do not mean exorcisms performed during baptism etc.). There are very few of them.
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« Reply #6 on: November 18, 2012, 06:39:44 AM »

I'm not sure what you mean by the 'gift of exorcism'. As far as I know, this is something that a priest may be able to do, and there is some kind of rite for it (I don't know exactly what it is, but you can read a little bit here in a previous thread), but it is not as a layperson might do by praying over a person.

Prayer and fasting...well, those are obvious, aren't they? And it's true: Prayer and fasting does cast out demons, but by the power of God, not any particular ability given to us as individuals. If it were that simple, then all Copts would be expert demon-cast-awayers after fasting for the vast majority of the year. Alas, that is not the case.

Quote
1Cor12:9 To another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit;

I am still a bit confused. Ok, let me take gift of healing as the example.

Without the gift of healing, we can still heal or help the paitients through fasting and praying. Just pray for the patients, God  listens our prayers and He may heal them. Why does God still have to give us the gift of healing?

A Christian who possess the gift of healing can heal  patients either through the  gift of healing or through his prayers. What is the difference between healing the patients through 'the gift of healing' and through 'praying'?

« Last Edit: November 18, 2012, 06:47:31 AM by walter1234 » Logged
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« Reply #7 on: November 18, 2012, 10:59:18 AM »

Good morning, Walter,

May I show you the other side of the coin?  I've had many many people since my childhood tell me I was either a witch or demon possessed because I was 'too' quiet, or my eyes were 'too' brown - or the emotional pain I was in was 'too' deep, I was 'too' poor, or 'too' awed by God. . .or struggling in life 'too' much. 

Their 'exorcisms' were not the only painful and degrading part of the picture, how they treated me before and afterward were much much worse.  This was their ego - not my ailment. 

Their judgment was sorely lacking. 

"Lord, Lord, did we not cast out demons in Your name?" . . .

"Go away, I never knew you."  (He answers)

Because the truth is, even the Priest doesn't cast out demons.  We can't turn the hair on our heads black or white.  We can't do a fool thing for ourselves or for another without HIM doing it in us.

Before any gift is given, humility must MUST go before it.  Why?  Because if YOU decide that YOU are going to exorcise a demon, that demon has won.  It has done exactly what it intended to do. . .it tempted and succeeded in you making yourself your own god and exalting yourself over the one TRUE God. 

So are you gifted with exorcism?  Funny, I don't remember any gift of the Holy Spirit in exorcising demons.  I recall a commissioning of the disciples when he sent them out two by two.  . . but this is not listed in the 'gifts of the Holy Spirit'. 

It's not a gift.  And when used improperly it is a huge can of worms that can destroy YOUR soul. 

Demons are nothing to be played with.

And the lives at stake are not to be played with, either.  They are precious precious precious to Him who made every cell. . .every hair, every peptide. . . every enzyme - wrote every single moment of their lives in His holy Book before they were even conceived. 

This action has been downsized and degraded by those who think they know better.

This action is HOLY.

Jesus has nothing in Him for the demons to manipulate.  You and I have a ton of things.  I urgently and seriously caution you to not go there.  It's incredibly dangerous and foolish. And if you are wrong and this person is not 'possessed' . . .you will do a lot of damage . . . it's a most unloving thing and judgmental thing to do.  It is arrogant to presume that you know. . that you can. . and that it's your job. 

I urge you not to be one of those that says "Lord, Lord, didn't **I** do this in Your Name or that in Your Name?"

Don't give OUR ENEMY the chance to use you against the one True God.






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BethAnna
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« Reply #8 on: November 18, 2012, 11:12:12 AM »

I'm not sure what you mean by the 'gift of exorcism'. As far as I know, this is something that a priest may be able to do, and there is some kind of rite for it (I don't know exactly what it is, but you can read a little bit here in a previous thread), but it is not as a layperson might do by praying over a person.

Prayer and fasting...well, those are obvious, aren't they? And it's true: Prayer and fasting does cast out demons, but by the power of God, not any particular ability given to us as individuals. If it were that simple, then all Copts would be expert demon-cast-awayers after fasting for the vast majority of the year. Alas, that is not the case.

Quote
1Cor12:9 To another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit;

I am still a bit confused. Ok, let me take gift of healing as the example.

Without the gift of healing, we can still heal or help the paitients through fasting and praying. Just pray for the patients, God  listens our prayers and He may heal them. Why does God still have to give us the gift of healing?

A Christian who possess the gift of healing can heal  patients either through the  gift of healing or through his prayers. What is the difference between healing the patients through 'the gift of healing' and through 'praying'?



The Gift of Healing comes each and every time through prayer.  Even the slightest prayer. . . again going back to humility.  The gift of healing is not a gift you have at your ready disposal. . .it is granted one time for each time - and each time it follows humility.  Each and every time it follows humility because it's not our will that grants healing, it's HIS. 

If it were our will, we would heal and heal and heal and heal. . . and take the very things that help those souls to repent, taking their very repentance from them.  Who are we to judge what is the best action for that person?  Only God knows.  He sees the heart.  We see the skin, the expression on the face, the sound of the voice, the actions.  He knows, we are blind.  He knows exactly what that person needs. 

The Gift of Healing is not a tool wielded by us.  It is a GIFT to the person receiving the healing.  WE - if that specific gift manifests, are only the vessel in which the Holy Spirit HIMSELF is DOING HIS WORK.  We are nothing more than the pot . . . or pitcher.  If we put a pot or pitcher on a shelf, it has no will or way of making itself DO anything.  Only the owner of the pot or pitcher can will that pot to do anything by holding the pot or pitcher and using it as a tool. 

We are nothing.

He is EVERYTHING.

And He is so humble that even this action is done without fan fair and whooopla.  We can follow that example.  It's not about us.  It's about Him and it's about the person needing to be healed.  We're just the pot.  That's it.

That one instance of healing doesn't mean there will ever be another.  It's up to Him and Him alone.  He can give, He can take away.  Prayer is necessary every single time because this is a relationship. . He's not a candy store.  He's a person.  He's God. 

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