Author Topic: Is this a sin in the same way as sex?  (Read 664 times)

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Offline Peace

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Is this a sin in the same way as sex?
« on: October 15, 2017, 06:09:18 PM »
I was wondering, is literature that contains sex scenes sinfull like when 2 people having sex? Or it is not so "heavy" The people who produce this king of things and publish them, do they have the same weight in their souls like those who has sex with others? Or it is more light?

Offline Arachne

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Re: Is this a sin in the same way as sex?
« Reply #1 on: October 15, 2017, 06:19:50 PM »
Are you actually referring to literature that contains sex scenes, or to porn?
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Offline Peace

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Re: Is this a sin in the same way as sex?
« Reply #2 on: October 15, 2017, 06:28:12 PM »
Actually to both

Offline Arachne

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Re: Is this a sin in the same way as sex?
« Reply #3 on: October 15, 2017, 06:32:12 PM »
Pornography is a sin for many reasons, most of which can fall under the 'commodification of a sacred bond' umbrella. Sex, however, remains an integral part of human life (so, by extension, of storytelling) and a lot hinges on how it is treated in the story and how the society around the story treats it. Even The Scarlet Letter was considered pornographic when it first came out.
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Offline xOrthodox4Christx

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Re: Is this a sin in the same way as sex?
« Reply #4 on: October 15, 2017, 06:37:27 PM »
Pornography is a sin for many reasons, most of which can fall under the 'commodification of a sacred bond' umbrella. Sex, however, remains an integral part of human life (so, by extension, of storytelling) and a lot hinges on how it is treated in the story and how the society around the story treats it. Even The Scarlet Letter was considered pornographic when it first came out.

We've come a long way, regrettably.
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Offline Indocern

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Re: Is this a sin in the same way as sex?
« Reply #5 on: October 15, 2017, 06:46:16 PM »
Pornography is a sin for many reasons, most of which can fall under the 'commodification of a sacred bond' umbrella. Sex, however, remains an integral part of human life (so, by extension, of storytelling) and a lot hinges on how it is treated in the story and how the society around the story treats it. Even The Scarlet Letter was considered pornographic when it first came out.

I don't think that pornograhpy is a sin.
« Last Edit: October 15, 2017, 06:46:47 PM by Indocern »

Offline William T

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Re: Is this a sin in the same way as sex?
« Reply #6 on: October 15, 2017, 06:48:08 PM »
Maybe a good comparison might be if you thought of comparing sex with food.  On their own they are created good, and an indispensable part of being human (even if one is highly ascetic with fasting and chaste food and sexuality play a part in everything) but have the tendency to be misused.  So it will be in the general culture and literature.  Discretion, context, use, and things like that matter.  Clearly pornography is wrong, but sex in any writing would mean that the Bible itself was inappropriate if we were to follow that logic to its ultimate conclusion.
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Re: Is this a sin in the same way as sex?
« Reply #7 on: October 15, 2017, 06:55:26 PM »
One approach is to apply in your own life the Pauline verses which say:

"All things are lawful unto me, but all things are not expedient: all things are lawful for me, but I will not be brought under the power of any." (1 Cor. 6:12)

"All things are lawful for me, but all things are not expedient: all things are lawful for me, but all things edify not." (1 Cor. 10:23)

Things are ok (at least neutral) as long as they aren't causing harm. Part of the difficulty is that we humans can easily deceive ourselves or just be unaware of how things are affecting us.

St. Paul also says: "Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things." (Phil. 4:8)
« Last Edit: October 15, 2017, 06:56:43 PM by Asteriktos »

Offline xOrthodox4Christx

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Re: Is this a sin in the same way as sex?
« Reply #8 on: October 15, 2017, 07:02:55 PM »
Pornography is a sin for many reasons, most of which can fall under the 'commodification of a sacred bond' umbrella. Sex, however, remains an integral part of human life (so, by extension, of storytelling) and a lot hinges on how it is treated in the story and how the society around the story treats it. Even The Scarlet Letter was considered pornographic when it first came out.

I don't think that pornograhpy is a sin.

Um, really? Objectifying the human body, another's body, for your own personal consumption and pleasure isn't sinful? Think about what else that logic can apply to before you claim that it isn't sinful.
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Offline Sharbel

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Re: Is this a sin in the same way as sex?
« Reply #9 on: October 15, 2017, 07:16:40 PM »
I don't think that pornograhpy is a sin.

Our Lord does:
Quote from: Mt 5:28
But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart.
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Offline William T

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Re: Is this a sin in the same way as sex?
« Reply #10 on: October 15, 2017, 09:10:00 PM »
Pornography is a sin for many reasons, most of which can fall under the 'commodification of a sacred bond' umbrella. Sex, however, remains an integral part of human life (so, by extension, of storytelling) and a lot hinges on how it is treated in the story and how the society around the story treats it. Even The Scarlet Letter was considered pornographic when it first came out.

I don't think that pornograhpy is a sin.

Um, really? Objectifying the human body, another's body, for your own personal consumption and pleasure isn't sinful? Think about what else that logic can apply to before you claim that it isn't sinful.

To use the monty python sketch, he isn't making an argument:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lvcnx6-0GhA

he also isn't being funny or satirical as others who do who may wish to poke fun of  Orthodox piety or cosmology here, so I would just ignore this unless he says something amusing, crazy, or gives some kind of reason
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Offline ialmisry

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Re: Is this a sin in the same way as sex?
« Reply #11 on: October 15, 2017, 10:36:23 PM »
I have a simple rule about sex (and violence) scenes: if you take them out and I can still follow the plot, they are gratuitous.
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Offline LizaSymonenko

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Re: Is this a sin in the same way as sex?
« Reply #12 on: October 16, 2017, 10:36:53 AM »

If the book is interesting....read it...just skip over the inappropriate parts.  ;)   Same thing with movies...if you can...just FWD through them...

There's no need to tempt yourself...or awaken any dormant desires upon which you cannot take action.
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Offline Dominika

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Re: Is this a sin in the same way as sex?
« Reply #13 on: October 17, 2017, 06:21:45 AM »

If the book is interesting....read it...just skip over the inappropriate parts.  ;)   Same thing with movies...if you can...just FWD through them...

There's no need to tempt yourself...or awaken any dormant desires upon which you cannot take action.

I agree, sepecially about movies - it's easy to skip these parts; and if you're in theathre or the movei is on tv, you can just look at another place. Most of the sexual scenes in films are.. Just for a pleasure. If it wasn't only the one target, it could be put only scenes of kissing or allusion or that they went tob ed and that's all.

As for literature, it's mroe difficult, because you have to find where the scene ends, so, anyway, you're reading at least some parts of it. Sometimes these scenes are necessary for the plot or knowing a character. I remember one of the set books at Polish high schools ("Granica" - "Border" by Nałkowska from the XIX century) in which there are 2 scenes of sexual act, but they're really important to know the personality and motivations one of the cahracters. There is also a sexual scene (well, almost rape) in another book that's a set book at Polish high schools, and it's also very imporatnat to know the personality and later motivitations and reasons for some actions and feeeligns of the main character. I had a few similar cases in the texts that we had to read during my Arabic studies.
So, in such case, I would say the point is to read such scenes as normal scenes, without focusing on it, coming back to earleir sentences, not puting into work too much (or even, at all) the imagination.
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Offline Arachne

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Re: Is this a sin in the same way as sex?
« Reply #14 on: October 17, 2017, 06:32:42 AM »
For perspective, here's a list of classic novels that have, at times, been banned as obscene: https://www.thoughtco.com/top-obscene-literary-classics-721234

And a more recent case we discussed around here: http://www.orthodoxchristianity.net/forum/index.php/topic,66899.0

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Offline youssef

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Re: Is this a sin in the same way as sex?
« Reply #15 on: October 17, 2017, 07:19:38 AM »
I don't think that pornograhpy is a sin.

Our Lord does:
Quote from: Mt 5:28
But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart.

He just want to learn new position

Offline xOrthodox4Christx

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Re: Is this a sin in the same way as sex?
« Reply #16 on: October 17, 2017, 08:03:17 AM »
I don't think that pornograhpy is a sin.

Our Lord does:
Quote from: Mt 5:28
But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart.

He just want to learn new position

Muslims would tell you to fear God. I would advise the same.
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Offline youssef

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Re: Is this a sin in the same way as sex?
« Reply #17 on: October 17, 2017, 08:25:28 AM »
I don't think that pornograhpy is a sin.

Our Lord does:
Quote from: Mt 5:28
But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart.

He just want to learn new position

Muslims would tell you to fear God. I would advise the same.

Okey,  At the end you are both the same ;D
« Last Edit: October 17, 2017, 08:25:45 AM by youssef »

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Re: Is this a sin in the same way as sex?
« Reply #18 on: October 17, 2017, 09:19:15 AM »
I don't think that pornograhpy is a sin.

Our Lord does:
Quote from: Mt 5:28
But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart.

He just want to learn new position

Muslims would tell you to fear God. I would advise the same.

Okey,  At the end you are both the same ;D

What a bizarre fellow you are.
Please don't project meta-debates onto me.

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Offline youssef

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Re: Is this a sin in the same way as sex?
« Reply #19 on: October 17, 2017, 02:35:16 PM »
I don't think that pornograhpy is a sin.

Our Lord does:
Quote from: Mt 5:28
But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart.

He just want to learn new position

Muslims would tell you to fear God. I would advise the same.

Okey,  At the end you are both the same ;D

What a bizarre fellow you are.

I had say that you will comment.

Offline Avdima

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Re: Is this a sin in the same way as sex?
« Reply #20 on: October 26, 2017, 08:38:18 AM »
I have a simple rule about sex (and violence) scenes: if you take them out and I can still follow the plot, they are gratuitous.

Just like such scenes in the Bible eh?

Offline Iconodule

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Re: Is this a sin in the same way as sex?
« Reply #21 on: October 26, 2017, 09:59:35 AM »
I have a simple rule about sex (and violence) scenes: if you take them out and I can still follow the plot, they are gratuitous.

Just like such scenes in the Bible eh?

Do you have some in mind?
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Online Mor Ephrem

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Re: Is this a sin in the same way as sex?
« Reply #22 on: October 26, 2017, 10:12:19 AM »
I have a simple rule about sex (and violence) scenes: if you take them out and I can still follow the plot, they are gratuitous.

Just like such scenes in the Bible eh?

Do you have some in mind?

Unnf, this is getting sexy...
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The erection of one’s rod counts as a form of glory (Theophylaktos of Ohrid, A Defense of Eunuchs, p. 329).

Offline Avdima

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Re: Is this a sin in the same way as sex?
« Reply #23 on: October 30, 2017, 09:18:16 AM »
I have a simple rule about sex (and violence) scenes: if you take them out and I can still follow the plot, they are gratuitous.

Just like such scenes in the Bible eh?

Do you have some in mind?

The many parts of the Old Testament that mention such things, Lot sleeping with his daughter,  Donkey genitals and horse goo, rapes, incest, babies being murdered, ethnic cleansing,  spilled semen causing God to kill a man.

Offline Iconodule

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Re: Is this a sin in the same way as sex?
« Reply #24 on: October 30, 2017, 09:51:25 AM »
I have a simple rule about sex (and violence) scenes: if you take them out and I can still follow the plot, they are gratuitous.

Just like such scenes in the Bible eh?

Do you have some in mind?

The many parts of the Old Testament that mention such things, Lot sleeping with his daughter,  Donkey genitals and horse goo, rapes, incest, babies being murdered, ethnic cleansing,  spilled semen causing God to kill a man.

" if you take them out and I can still follow the plot, they are gratuitous."

You don't think the origin of Moabites and Ammonites has anything to do with the plot?
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“A goose to hatch the Crystal Egg after an Eagle had half-hatched it! Aye, aye, to be sure, that’s right,” said the Old Woman of Beare. “And now you must go find out what happened to it. Go now, and when you come back I will give you your name.”
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Offline Volnutt

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Re: Is this a sin in the same way as sex?
« Reply #25 on: October 31, 2017, 09:17:19 PM »
I have a simple rule about sex (and violence) scenes: if you take them out and I can still follow the plot, they are gratuitous.

Just like such scenes in the Bible eh?

Do you have some in mind?

The many parts of the Old Testament that mention such things, Lot sleeping with his daughter,  Donkey genitals and horse goo, rapes, incest, babies being murdered, ethnic cleansing,  spilled semen causing God to kill a man.

Onan was killed for bedding his brother's widow under false pretenses (he never had any intent to have children by her), ie. for rape. That coitus interuptus was his method of doing so is irrelevant.
« Last Edit: October 31, 2017, 09:19:10 PM by Volnutt »
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