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Author Topic: Feel free to ask me anything about Islam...  (Read 32913 times) Average Rating: 0
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Syriac.Aramaic
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« Reply #675 on: December 20, 2014, 01:16:46 PM »

You will kill non-muslims to receive 72 virgins:
9:111

I didn't check the other verses you cited, but the Quran (as far as I know) doesn't include anything about 72 virgins.  Even this verse you gave says nothing about virgins.

You probably meant 9:11, which doesn't put a number to these virgins.  Does your criticism still stand?
Yes my criticism stand.
I quote what Sunan al-Tirmidhi Hadith 2562 says: “The smallest reward for the people of Paradise is an abode where there are 80,000 servants and 72 wives, over which stands a dome decorated with pearls, aquamarine, and ruby, as wide as the distance from Al-Jabiyyah [a Damascus suburb] to Sana’a [Yemen]”

Imam, and muslim around the world link the quran verse 9:111 with the hadiths, and in that way explain that there will be 72 virgins in heaven. I know several other hadiths that clearly says that 72 virgins are waiting in heaven, but i have them only in arabic and i don't have the time to translate them.

Dear John, you need to read the hadiths, and other auhtentic material on arabic in order to understand islam correct. Surely a muslim can copy and paste quran versers that includes things like love etc, and the person with no knowledge will fall for their hypocrite.
But when you open the hadiths, and compare them with versers and chapters in the quran you will realise that ISIS, Al qaeda, boko haram etc are those who are the real muslims.
Watch the video by david wood: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LXBgqa-xQwY
« Last Edit: December 20, 2014, 01:17:59 PM by Syriac.Aramaic » Logged

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« Reply #676 on: December 20, 2014, 06:47:32 PM »

You will kill non-muslims to receive 72 virgins:
9:111

I didn't check the other verses you cited, but the Quran (as far as I know) doesn't include anything about 72 virgins.  Even this verse you gave says nothing about virgins.

You probably meant 9:11, which doesn't put a number to these virgins.  Does your criticism still stand?
Yes my criticism stand.
I quote what Sunan al-Tirmidhi Hadith 2562 says: “The smallest reward for the people of Paradise is an abode where there are 80,000 servants and 72 wives, over which stands a dome decorated with pearls, aquamarine, and ruby, as wide as the distance from Al-Jabiyyah [a Damascus suburb] to Sana’a [Yemen]”

Imam, and muslim around the world link the quran verse 9:111 with the hadiths, and in that way explain that there will be 72 virgins in heaven. I know several other hadiths that clearly says that 72 virgins are waiting in heaven, but i have them only in arabic and i don't have the time to translate them.

Dear John, you need to read the hadiths, and other auhtentic material on arabic in order to understand islam correct. Surely a muslim can copy and paste quran versers that includes things like love etc, and the person with no knowledge will fall for their hypocrite.
But when you open the hadiths, and compare them with versers and chapters in the quran you will realise that ISIS, Al qaeda, boko haram etc are those who are the real muslims.
Watch the video by david wood: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LXBgqa-xQwY


I know.  The Hadiths are, IMO a weakness in the Islamic narrative.  They say the Quran is so simple and so obvious, yet you need the Hadiths to interpret it.  The problem is that no one can agree on which Hadiths are accurate.  Furthermore, they are themselves not perfect.  So they are left with a "perfectly inspired" book which relies on an imperfect collection of texts.  Seems counter-intuitive to me, though perhaps not all Muslims believe this way.
« Last Edit: December 20, 2014, 06:48:47 PM by john_mo » Logged

Love is not blind; that is the last thing that it is. Love is bound; and the more it is bound the less it is blind.

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Syriac.Aramaic
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« Reply #677 on: Yesterday at 09:15:28 AM »

Dear John, I'm with you regarding what you are saying. To the public people who is not muslims, other muslims and imams are good at explaining how rich their faith is, and how easy it is to understand islam. But when you study the religion, you will clearly see that it isn't as simple as they say.
No disrespect to muslim people here on the forum, but when you study their religion, and yourself have good knowledge of christianty you will pretty soon realise how bad, poor and empty their religion is.
A former muslim friend to me, who converted to orthodoxy in my parish said once this to me after he got baptised; "You christians should be happier with the religion you have, because its the real way to god, i which every person could see how rich this faith is and how correct it is".

« Last Edit: Yesterday at 09:16:48 AM by Syriac.Aramaic » Logged

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LenInSebastopol
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« Reply #678 on: Yesterday at 11:15:06 AM »

We're living in crazy times, and hopefully with this thread we can have a better understanding.

So feel free to ask me anything you want about Islam, I'll try to answer it to the best of my knowledge.

Thanks very much

Why you guys killing so much?
and
can you come up with a peaceful way to end that soon?
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« Reply #679 on: Yesterday at 11:21:39 AM »

Did Islam mess up the entire Middle East? Be honest about it. I mean, I'll be the first one to admit that the Roman Catholic Church messed up western Europe during the Dark Ages and screwed up Latin America.

The Brits and French did a great job of that after WWI when they created nation-states at keeping at odds with the various tribes of the area, all to get oil.
Had they followed Lawrence of Arabia's map, most likely the conflict now would have been avoided.
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xOrthodox4Christx
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« Reply #680 on: Yesterday at 12:34:36 PM »

Did Islam mess up the entire Middle East? Be honest about it. I mean, I'll be the first one to admit that the Roman Catholic Church messed up western Europe during the Dark Ages and screwed up Latin America.

The Brits and French did a great job of that after WWI when they created nation-states at keeping at odds with the various tribes of the area, all to get oil.
Had they followed Lawrence of Arabia's map, most likely the conflict now would have been avoided.

We're talking about today's conflicts. But before the 19th century, you cannot say it was the Brits and the French.
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"Years ago I recognized my kinship with all living beings, and I made up my mind that I was not one bit better than the meanest on earth.... While there is a lower class, I am in it, and while there is a criminal element, I am of it, and while there is a soul in prison, I am not free." (Eugene Debs)
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« Reply #681 on: Yesterday at 01:40:03 PM »

Did Islam mess up the entire Middle East? Be honest about it. I mean, I'll be the first one to admit that the Roman Catholic Church messed up western Europe during the Dark Ages and screwed up Latin America.

The Brits and French did a great job of that after WWI when they created nation-states at keeping at odds with the various tribes of the area, all to get oil.
Had they followed Lawrence of Arabia's map, most likely the conflict now would have been avoided.

We're talking about today's conflicts. But before the 19th century, you cannot say it was the Brits and the French.

I did not know the issue was limited to the 19th century.
As little as I know about the Ottoman, anyone can say anything and I would believe him.
For example I heard/read that it was a great civilization/empire that ruled about as average as any empire did, but then how would one compare? The notions of personhood were/are much different than the influence of Christian Europe where slavery became anathema or in America where religion was relegated to the people and separated from the state. It would be like comparing apples to zebras, no?
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xOrthodox4Christx
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« Reply #682 on: Yesterday at 01:44:25 PM »

Did Islam mess up the entire Middle East? Be honest about it. I mean, I'll be the first one to admit that the Roman Catholic Church messed up western Europe during the Dark Ages and screwed up Latin America.

The Brits and French did a great job of that after WWI when they created nation-states at keeping at odds with the various tribes of the area, all to get oil.
Had they followed Lawrence of Arabia's map, most likely the conflict now would have been avoided.

We're talking about today's conflicts. But before the 19th century, you cannot say it was the Brits and the French.

I did not know the issue was limited to the 19th century.
As little as I know about the Ottoman, anyone can say anything and I would believe him.
For example I heard/read that it was a great civilization/empire that ruled about as average as any empire did, but then how would one compare? The notions of personhood were/are much different than the influence of Christian Europe where slavery became anathema or in America where religion was relegated to the people and separated from the state. It would be like comparing apples to zebras, no?

Yes, if we were comparing. If we're talking about the historical crimes of the Islamic empires throughout history, then we have to be honest and say it was horrendous.
« Last Edit: Yesterday at 01:44:37 PM by xOrthodox4Christx » Logged

"Years ago I recognized my kinship with all living beings, and I made up my mind that I was not one bit better than the meanest on earth.... While there is a lower class, I am in it, and while there is a criminal element, I am of it, and while there is a soul in prison, I am not free." (Eugene Debs)
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« Reply #683 on: Yesterday at 02:49:49 PM »

Here are a couple of related questions that occurred to me the other day.

Ignoring the concepts of Trinity, Jesus as God-Man and his resurrection, what about Islam as a religion would you say is better than Orthodoxy when it is practised as preached by the New Testament?

What does it offer to an individual over say, the Jewish religion which also does not accept these concepts?

Thanks.

PS: I apologise if they've already been covered. I couldn't make myself (re)read 16 pages of this thread Sad
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« Reply #684 on: Yesterday at 06:25:07 PM »

Is there room for doctrinal development, varying interpretation, and disagreement within Islam? Most Muslims I've met seem to adhere to a worldview of "Divine Command Theory" like fundamental Protestants where morality is determined simply because God said so, and thus, there is no room for hermeneutics, context, or moral development such as abolitionism. I've met Protestant "Divine Command" theorists who've said that if they found modern day Midianites for example, they'd have to genocide them because God's command makes it okay. And they seem to present their religion in such a way where if you don't agree with the basest, most literal interpretation that they provide, then you can't belong to that religion. There's no room for disagreement or doctrinal breathing room. Muslims seem the same way with the no intermarriage thing and no abolitionism and all.
« Last Edit: Yesterday at 06:29:21 PM by JamesR » Logged

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« Reply #685 on: Today at 01:48:28 AM »

....
But when you open the hadiths, and compare them with versers and chapters in the quran you will realise that ISIS, Al qaeda, boko haram etc are those who are the real muslims.
....

These groups do NOT seem to be followers of Ahlul Bayt.
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« Reply #686 on: Today at 02:07:43 AM »

I know.  The Hadiths are, IMO a weakness in the Islamic narrative.  They say the Quran is so simple and so obvious, yet you need the Hadiths to interpret it.  The problem is that no one can agree on which Hadiths are accurate.  Furthermore, they are themselves not perfect.  So they are left with a "perfectly inspired" book which relies on an imperfect collection of texts.  Seems counter-intuitive to me, though perhaps not all Muslims believe this way.

Prophet Muhammad (sawa) has been recorded many times to say...

"O People! Indeed, I have left among you, that which if you hold fast to it, you shall not go astray: The Book of Allah (Quran) and my Family, the People of my House (Ahlul-Bait)."

The specifics of the Quran is with the members of Ahlul Bayt.
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« Reply #687 on: Today at 02:18:20 AM »

No disrespect to muslim people here on the forum, but when you study their religion, and yourself have good knowledge of christianty you will pretty soon realise how bad, poor and empty their religion is.

Have you studied the story of Imam Hussein(AS)?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lAEkO8R7nhk

« Last Edit: Today at 02:18:33 AM by fibonacci » Logged
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« Reply #688 on: Today at 02:19:07 AM »

I know.  The Hadiths are, IMO a weakness in the Islamic narrative.  They say the Quran is so simple and so obvious, yet you need the Hadiths to interpret it.  The problem is that no one can agree on which Hadiths are accurate.  Furthermore, they are themselves not perfect.  So they are left with a "perfectly inspired" book which relies on an imperfect collection of texts.  Seems counter-intuitive to me, though perhaps not all Muslims believe this way.

Prophet Muhammad (sawa) has been recorded many times to say...

"O People! Indeed, I have left among you, that which if you hold fast to it, you shall not go astray: The Book of Allah (Quran) and my Family, the People of my House (Ahlul-Bait)."

The specifics of the Quran is with the members of Ahlul Bayt.

Who would you say the modern-day "Ahlul Bayt" is/are? The Nizari Ismaili would consider the Aga Khans to be the Ahlul Bayt, for instance. Who do you think they are? The quote you give is interesting because it is similar to what many Christians (including the Orthodox) believe about Apostolic Succession.
« Last Edit: Today at 02:19:33 AM by Minnesotan » Logged
fibonacci
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« Reply #689 on: Today at 03:00:50 AM »

Why you guys killing so much?
and
can you come up with a peaceful way to end that soon?

By your question I assume you meant, why there are so much conflicts ....

A covenant is a contract, and there are clauses to it....

http://biblehub.com/deuteronomy/28.htm

"...The LORD will bring a nation against you from far away, from the ends of the earth, like an eagle swooping down, a nation whose language you will not understand, a fierce-looking nation without respect for the old or pity for the young...." - Deuteronomy 28:49-50
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« Reply #690 on: Today at 03:55:20 AM »

Here are a couple of related questions that occurred to me the other day.

Ignoring the concepts of Trinity, Jesus as God-Man and his resurrection, what about Islam as a religion would you say is better than Orthodoxy when it is practised as preached by the New Testament?

What does it offer to an individual over say, the Jewish religion which also does not accept these concepts?

Thanks.

PS: I apologise if they've already been covered. I couldn't make myself (re)read 16 pages of this thread Sad

True followers of the Jewish religion, have love for Moses and so there connection may lead to Moses to intercede on their behalf for judgement day.

Similarly, true followers of the Christian religion, have love for both Prophet Moses and Prophet Jesus and so there is a chance that their connection may have either of the two prophets to intercede on their behalf for judgement day.

Finally, true followers of the Islamic religion, have love for Prophet Moses, Prophet Jesus and Prophet Muhammad and so there is a chance for any of these three prophets to intercede on their behalf on judgement day.

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« Reply #691 on: Today at 04:04:21 AM »

....
But when you open the hadiths, and compare them with versers and chapters in the quran you will realise that ISIS, Al qaeda, boko haram etc are those who are the real muslims.
....

These groups do NOT seem to be followers of Ahlul Bayt.

are you a follower of ahlul bayt by shia or  sunni?
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