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Author Topic: Springfield MO preacher comes out in support of gay marriage  (Read 2246 times) Average Rating: 0
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88Devin12
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« on: October 20, 2012, 01:14:38 AM »

Reverend Dr. Phil Snider of Brentwood Christian Church recently came out in support of gay marriage at a public hearing in Springfield Missouri. He started his speech in opposition to gay marriage to illustrate a point that what is said about homosexuality is the same as was said 50 years ago about blacks in the civil rights movement, he then took a complete 180 and came out at the end in support of gay marriage.

His speech was uploaded to YouTube and became the top post on Reddit, earning the support of thousands of Redditors (for whatever the heck that is worth).

I've personally met the guy, and had to attend his "church" once for school. He doesn't strike me as beig a Christian at all, and honestly the "worship" in his church scared the daylight a out of me and couldn't be considered Christian worship, in fact I don't even recall Christ ever being mentioned in the hymns.

Unfortunately he is popular with young people, especially at the local liberal arts university where he occasionally gives talks.

Surprisingly several of the major churches in Springfield MO are actually LGBT churches, including Snider's church called "Brentwood", Another called National Avenue and a few others (sadly many from my former denomination).

It's so sad to see this, I would honestly love to see Springfield clergy come out with something to refute this guy.
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« Reply #1 on: October 20, 2012, 01:22:38 AM »

Reverend Dr. Phil Snider of Brentwood Christian Church recently came out in support of gay marriage at a public hearing in Springfield Missouri. He started his speech in opposition to gay marriage to illustrate a point that what is said about homosexuality is the same as was said 50 years ago about blacks in the civil rights movement, he then took a complete 180 and came out at the end in support of gay marriage.

His speech was uploaded to YouTube and became the top post on Reddit, earning the support of thousands of Redditors (for whatever the heck that is worth).

I've personally met the guy, and had to attend his "church" once for school. He doesn't strike me as beig a Christian at all, and honestly the "worship" in his church scared the daylight a out of me and couldn't be considered Christian worship, in fact I don't even recall Christ ever being mentioned in the hymns.

Unfortunately he is popular with young people, especially at the local liberal arts university where he occasionally gives talks.

Surprisingly several of the major churches in Springfield MO are actually LGBT churches, including Snider's church called "Brentwood", Another called National Avenue and a few others (sadly many from my former denomination).

It's so sad to see this, I would honestly love to see Springfield clergy come out with something to refute this guy.
There is a connection there.
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« Reply #2 on: October 20, 2012, 01:39:20 AM »

There definitely is! Unfortunately he is very charismatic and is very good at speaking and identifying with the younger generations.

I honestly hope the Catholic, Orthodox, Traditional Anglican, Baptist and Assemblies groups of Springfield can come out and denounce him and his so-called "church".


I knew nothing about him or his church until my final year in College and I knew the moment I met him that something was not right with him, something inside me just screamed something was wrong.

Wolves in sheeps clothing, and it's sad to see a wolf being sent Into the midst of vulnerable sheep (young people with open and developing minds) with the encouragement of the people who are supposed to protect and educate them.

I finally realized why the group I had to be in always visited Brentwood and National Avenue... They are both LGBT friendly... Ugh...

Nations Ave also struck me wrong, but they are a rare DOC church that retained some traditional elements (robes, organ, procession, etc...) they also actually used Christian hymns.

Brentwood was just wrong. Songs never mentioned Christ explicitly, instead of hymnbooks the songs were on a projection screen with music over speakers. They had "communion" but I don't even remember the words of institution. That visit, which occurred before my baptism, scared me so much that the only events I attended thereafter were dinners, movie nights and coffee nights (I had to participate for scholarship).

No wonder that same group I was a part of never wanted to visit the Orthodox Church or any local Catholic Church. They were only interested in the LGBT churches as well as the local mosque and synagogue.
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« Reply #3 on: October 20, 2012, 01:59:50 AM »

The younger generations are convinced that "Christianity" is religious mumbo-jumbo code for "I hate gay people, including your friends and family who are gay". I think that's a much bigger problem than one particular preacher in one particular location, who after all is really just a symptom of the way American society as a whole seems to be headed.

Lord have mercy on us all.
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« Reply #4 on: October 20, 2012, 02:24:47 AM »

It should also be noted on this "congregations" website, they reference and quote people like Marcus Borg and John D. Caputo, even naming the latter as "theologian".

I'm so glad I got out of that denomination. My original congregation was and still is traditional, but the rest of the DOC seems to be going downhill fast. Definitely a wishy-washy free-for-all group.
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« Reply #5 on: October 20, 2012, 05:32:22 AM »

Reverend Dr. Phil Snider of Brentwood Christian Church recently came out in support of gay marriage at a public hearing in Springfield Missouri. He started his speech in opposition to gay marriage to illustrate a point that what is said about homosexuality is the same as was said 50 years ago about blacks in the civil rights movement, he then took a complete 180 and came out at the end in support of gay marriage.

His speech was uploaded to YouTube and became the top post on Reddit, earning the support of thousands of Redditors (for whatever the heck that is worth).

I've personally met the guy, and had to attend his "church" once for school. He doesn't strike me as beig a Christian at all, and honestly the "worship" in his church scared the daylight a out of me and couldn't be considered Christian worship, in fact I don't even recall Christ ever being mentioned in the hymns.

Unfortunately he is popular with young people, especially at the local liberal arts university where he occasionally gives talks.

Surprisingly several of the major churches in Springfield MO are actually LGBT churches, including Snider's church called "Brentwood", Another called National Avenue and a few others (sadly many from my former denomination).

It's so sad to see this, I would honestly love to see Springfield clergy come out with something to refute this guy.
Bolded portion...not so much.  Being black has never been a sinful action.

"Springfield's Bible Belt Alternative"
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« Reply #6 on: October 20, 2012, 09:22:31 AM »

Bolded portion...not so much.  Being black has never been a sinful action.
Maybe not in itself a sinful action, but being black has certainly been viewed as a result of sin. Baptist minister Carey Daniel gave a 1954 pro-segregation sermon, indicative of attitudes that were also used to justify slavery in antebellum South:

"The Bible clearly implies that the Negroes' black skin is the result of Ham's immorality at the time of his father Noah's drunkenness. For example, in Jeremiah 13:23 we read, 'Can the Ethiopian change his skin, or the leopard his spots? Then may ye also do good, that are accustomed to do evil.' Here the black skin of the Negro is obviously a symbol of evil" (Stephen R. Haynes, Noah's Curse, 2002, 86).
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« Reply #7 on: October 20, 2012, 10:37:07 AM »

Bolded portion...not so much.  Being black has never been a sinful action.
Maybe not in itself a sinful action, but being black has certainly been viewed as a result of sin. Baptist minister Carey Daniel gave a 1954 pro-segregation sermon, indicative of attitudes that were also used to justify slavery in antebellum South:

"The Bible clearly implies that the Negroes' black skin is the result of Ham's immorality at the time of his father Noah's drunkenness. For example, in Jeremiah 13:23 we read, 'Can the Ethiopian change his skin, or the leopard his spots? Then may ye also do good, that are accustomed to do evil.' Here the black skin of the Negro is obviously a symbol of evil" (Stephen R. Haynes, Noah's Curse, 2002, 86).
This is the sort of thing that happens when people interpret the scriptures for them self.
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« Reply #8 on: October 20, 2012, 12:13:01 PM »

Bolded portion...not so much.  Being black has never been a sinful action.
Maybe not in itself a sinful action, but being black has certainly been viewed as a result of sin. Baptist minister Carey Daniel gave a 1954 pro-segregation sermon, indicative of attitudes that were also used to justify slavery in antebellum South:

"The Bible clearly implies that the Negroes' black skin is the result of Ham's immorality at the time of his father Noah's drunkenness. For example, in Jeremiah 13:23 we read, 'Can the Ethiopian change his skin, or the leopard his spots? Then may ye also do good, that are accustomed to do evil.' Here the black skin of the Negro is obviously a symbol of evil" (Stephen R. Haynes, Noah's Curse, 2002, 86).

I just love though, how the pro-LGBT crowd chooses to ignore nearly 1900/1800 years of Christian history when talking about homosexuality & racism. The situation with black slaves arose, not from Christianity, but from the Islamic slave trade, the Western European Catholics & Protestants simply fed into a system that already existed, and expanded it. It wasn't always (or even chiefly) blacks being enslaved by whites, it was actually one tribe enslaving another tribe, and then selling them to the whites. This of course, doesn't make it right, but one has to understand the history before making accusations.

Homosexuality, on the other hand, has always been condemned in the Christian Church. Christ didn't tell the prostitute that she could keep selling her body as a sex tool so she could make money. He didn't tell the tax collectors that they could keep cheating people out of their money. He didn't tell the sinful woman she could keep having multiple marriages & sleeping around with multiple men.
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« Reply #9 on: October 20, 2012, 12:27:11 PM »

The younger generations are convinced that "Christianity" is religious mumbo-jumbo code for "I hate gay people, including your friends and family who are gay". I think that's a much bigger problem than one particular preacher in one particular location, who after all is really just a symptom of the way American society as a whole seems to be headed.

Lord have mercy on us all.
I knew someone who, with her husband, accepted baptism from the Vatican.  What had blocked that before was that her experience with "Christianity" was the clan.

IIRC, Rev. Jeremiah Wright of Obama fame, like most Black Supremacist, preached actual hatred towards gays.  Of course, being a Black Supremacist or a non-Christian like Farrakhan, that's OK.
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« Reply #10 on: October 20, 2012, 01:04:10 PM »

50 years ago pastors couldn't get away with this. Just sayin.
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« Reply #11 on: October 20, 2012, 04:03:31 PM »

50 years ago pastors couldn't get away with this. Just sayin.

And the times, they are a changin'!
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« Reply #12 on: October 20, 2012, 04:18:54 PM »

50 years ago pastors couldn't get away with this. Just sayin.

50 years ago they were also still castrating homosexuals...
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« Reply #13 on: October 20, 2012, 08:00:56 PM »

50 years ago pastors couldn't get away with this. Just sayin.

50 years ago they were also still castrating homosexuals...
Who was?
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« Reply #14 on: October 20, 2012, 08:05:31 PM »

50 years ago pastors couldn't get away with this. Just sayin.

50 years ago they were also still castrating homosexuals...
Who was?

I don't have a list, but I know the British didn't repeal their law that allowed for chemical castration until 1967.
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« Reply #15 on: October 20, 2012, 08:05:38 PM »

50 years ago pastors couldn't get away with this. Just sayin.

50 years ago they were also still castrating homosexuals...
Who was?

Castration, ECT and psychotropics were all mainstream "treatments" for homosexuality in first half of the 20th century.
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« Reply #16 on: October 20, 2012, 08:14:14 PM »

I guess I'm curious why a random injection of what someone did to homosexuals in the past which was unrelated to preaching this sin is ok was ever used.  There was real no purpose I can see unless the pastors were the ones performing the castration, which of course, they were not.
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« Reply #17 on: October 20, 2012, 08:15:48 PM »

Times they are a changin'. Some think for the worse. I think for the better.
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« Reply #18 on: October 20, 2012, 08:25:40 PM »

50 years ago pastors couldn't get away with this. Just sayin.

Nor could they safely condone interracial marriage in much of this country...
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« Reply #19 on: October 20, 2012, 08:27:31 PM »

50 years ago pastors couldn't get away with this. Just sayin.

Yeah, freedom of speech and freedom of religion really suck.
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« Reply #20 on: October 20, 2012, 09:11:49 PM »

50 years ago pastors couldn't get away with this. Just sayin.

Nor could they safely condone interracial marriage in much of this country...

Another random, purposeless injection to the discussion.  I don’t get it. 

50 years ago people didn’t wear their pants around their knees or go to Wal-Mart in pajamas.

Hmmm, I’m not seeing how this works or is beneficial to the discussion.
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« Reply #21 on: October 20, 2012, 09:12:48 PM »

50 years ago pastors couldn't get away with this. Just sayin.

Yeah, freedom of speech and freedom of religion really suck.
And a third, but admittedly, this one at least is somewhat on track.
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« Reply #22 on: October 20, 2012, 09:13:54 PM »

50 years ago pastors couldn't get away with this. Just sayin.

50 years ago they were also still castrating homosexuals...
Who was?

Castration, ECT and psychotropics were all mainstream "treatments" for homosexuality in first half of the 20th century.

And American pastors were the ones doing these things?  No, so why even bring it up? 
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« Reply #23 on: October 20, 2012, 09:15:17 PM »

50 years ago pastors couldn't get away with this. Just sayin.

Nor could they safely condone interracial marriage in much of this country...

Another random, purposeless injection to the discussion.  I don’t get it. 

50 years ago people didn’t wear their pants around their knees or go to Wal-Mart in pajamas.

Hmmm, I’m not seeing how this works or is beneficial to the discussion.


That was precisely my point; there's no value in saying that a half-century ago, a pastor couldn't have promoted gay marriage.
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« Reply #24 on: October 20, 2012, 09:15:55 PM »

50 years ago pastors couldn't get away with this. Just sayin.
You are correct.  Just a short 50 years ago, the congregation would have run this “pastor” off and had him stripped of his ordination.  I wonder which church ordained him anyway.  Probably the universal church of all inclusion, or something else on the internet.  People sure have gotten off the path.
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« Reply #25 on: October 20, 2012, 09:16:56 PM »

50 years ago pastors couldn't get away with this. Just sayin.

Nor could they safely condone interracial marriage in much of this country...

Another random, purposeless injection to the discussion.  I don’t get it. 

50 years ago people didn’t wear their pants around their knees or go to Wal-Mart in pajamas.

Hmmm, I’m not seeing how this works or is beneficial to the discussion.


That was precisely my point; there's no value in saying that a half-century ago, a pastor couldn't have promoted gay marriage.

But you are mistaken.  There is a very valid point in saying this.  If not, there is no point in Orthodoxy pointing to the ECF's.
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« Reply #26 on: October 20, 2012, 10:28:50 PM »

50 years ago pastors couldn't get away with this. Just sayin.

Nor could they safely condone interracial marriage in much of this country...

Another random, purposeless injection to the discussion.  I don’t get it. 

50 years ago people didn’t wear their pants around their knees or go to Wal-Mart in pajamas.

Hmmm, I’m not seeing how this works or is beneficial to the discussion.


That was precisely my point; there's no value in saying that a half-century ago, a pastor couldn't have promoted gay marriage.

But you are mistaken.  There is a very valid point in saying this.  If not, there is no point in Orthodoxy pointing to the ECF's.

So is there, then, a valid point in saying that "50 years ago, a pastor in Alabama could never have married a black man and a white woman" as a justification for pastors not marrying them today?  Or slavery, slavery was rampant in certain Orthodox countries, with the full support of the Church.  The fact that this happened even just 200 years ago, is that justification for bringing back slavery?
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« Reply #27 on: October 20, 2012, 10:30:43 PM »

I had a feeling that this was the case when I saw the video.

I miss pro-gay Christians who didn't completely neuter the traditions of other parts of the faith. Where's DVE when you need him?
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« Reply #28 on: October 21, 2012, 12:02:55 AM »

50 years ago pastors couldn't get away with this. Just sayin.

Nor could they safely condone interracial marriage in much of this country...

Another random, purposeless injection to the discussion.  I don’t get it.  

50 years ago people didn’t wear their pants around their knees or go to Wal-Mart in pajamas.

Hmmm, I’m not seeing how this works or is beneficial to the discussion.


That was precisely my point; there's no value in saying that a half-century ago, a pastor couldn't have promoted gay marriage.

But you are mistaken.  There is a very valid point in saying this.  If not, there is no point in Orthodoxy pointing to the ECF's.

So is there, then, a valid point in saying that "50 years ago, a pastor in Alabama could never have married a black man and a white woman" as a justification for pastors not marrying them today?  Or slavery, slavery was rampant in certain Orthodox countries, with the full support of the Church.  The fact that this happened even just 200 years ago, is that justification for bringing back slavery?

Everything isn't about slavery.  It never has been, but if you want to talk about slavery, lets start a thread and talk about how children and women are still very much part of the underground slave trade today.
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« Reply #29 on: October 21, 2012, 12:03:40 AM »

I honestly don't see how this is news. There are ministers all over the Americas that line up in support of this.
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« Reply #30 on: October 21, 2012, 12:05:03 AM »

50 years ago pastors couldn't get away with this. Just sayin.

Nor could they safely condone interracial marriage in much of this country...

Another random, purposeless injection to the discussion.  I don’t get it. 

50 years ago people didn’t wear their pants around their knees or go to Wal-Mart in pajamas.

Hmmm, I’m not seeing how this works or is beneficial to the discussion.


That was precisely my point; there's no value in saying that a half-century ago, a pastor couldn't have promoted gay marriage.

But you are mistaken.  There is a very valid point in saying this.  If not, there is no point in Orthodoxy pointing to the ECF's.

So is there, then, a valid point in saying that "50 years ago, a pastor in Alabama could never have married a black man and a white woman" as a justification for pastors not marrying them today?  Or slavery, slavery was rampant in certain Orthodox countries, with the full support of the Church.  The fact that this happened even just 200 years ago, is that justification for bringing back slavery?

Everything isn't about slavery.  It never has been, but if you want to talk about slavery, lets start a thread and talke about how children and women are still very much part of the underground slave trade today.

Did you have to take a class to learn how to dodge points so well, or is it a natural ability?
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« Reply #31 on: October 21, 2012, 12:06:19 AM »

50 years ago pastors couldn't get away with this. Just sayin.

Nor could they safely condone interracial marriage in much of this country...

Another random, purposeless injection to the discussion.  I don’t get it. 

50 years ago people didn’t wear their pants around their knees or go to Wal-Mart in pajamas.

Hmmm, I’m not seeing how this works or is beneficial to the discussion.


That was precisely my point; there's no value in saying that a half-century ago, a pastor couldn't have promoted gay marriage.

But you are mistaken.  There is a very valid point in saying this.  If not, there is no point in Orthodoxy pointing to the ECF's.

So is there, then, a valid point in saying that "50 years ago, a pastor in Alabama could never have married a black man and a white woman" as a justification for pastors not marrying them today?  Or slavery, slavery was rampant in certain Orthodox countries, with the full support of the Church.  The fact that this happened even just 200 years ago, is that justification for bringing back slavery?

Everything isn't about slavery.  It never has been, but if you want to talk about slavery, lets start a thread and talke about how children and women are still very much part of the underground slave trade today.

Did you have to take a class to learn how to dodge points so well, or is it a natural ability?

I just have a lot of practice keeping people from taking the topic of a discussion and running in a different direction.
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« Reply #32 on: October 21, 2012, 12:07:20 AM »

I honestly don't see how this is news. There are ministers all over the Americas that line up in support of this.

Sadly, this is true.  I believe it is news only in the sense it reveals just how twisted the world has become and how far from the truth we now find it, including religious entities.
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« Reply #33 on: October 21, 2012, 12:37:50 AM »

I honestly don't see how this is news. There are ministers all over the Americas that line up in support of this.

I don't really think it is news, this guy is in the middle of the Bible Belt and his words don't mean much to most people in Springfield. But it's just "news" because of how popular the story & video has gotten, it's practically gone viral, unfortunately.
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« Reply #34 on: October 21, 2012, 12:01:51 PM »

we have opera tickets tonight, it's "The Domestic Partnership of Figaro".
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« Reply #35 on: October 21, 2012, 12:47:51 PM »

50 years ago pastors couldn't get away with this. Just sayin.
You are correct.  Just a short 50 years ago, the congregation would have run this “pastor” off and had him stripped of his ordination.  I wonder which church ordained him anyway.  Probably the universal church of all inclusion, or something else on the internet.  People sure have gotten off the path.

Yeah, because the guy couldn't be Episcopalian or Methodist or Lutheran, or something. He'd only have to be an Internet-based fake.  Roll Eyes
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Kerdy
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« Reply #36 on: October 22, 2012, 05:39:01 AM »

50 years ago pastors couldn't get away with this. Just sayin.
You are correct.  Just a short 50 years ago, the congregation would have run this “pastor” off and had him stripped of his ordination.  I wonder which church ordained him anyway.  Probably the universal church of all inclusion, or something else on the internet.  People sure have gotten off the path.

Yeah, because the guy couldn't be Episcopalian or Methodist or Lutheran, or something. He'd only have to be an Internet-based fake.  Roll Eyes
He could be anything.  The rest of my post was in sarcasm.  But the point you are making actually is a great point.  Far too many denominations have simply given into secular, politically correct pressure and warped the minds of millions in the process.  Not just with this, but a lot of things.  My signature line says it clearly.
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JamesRottnek
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« Reply #37 on: October 22, 2012, 07:52:43 PM »

50 years ago pastors couldn't get away with this. Just sayin.
You are correct.  Just a short 50 years ago, the congregation would have run this “pastor” off and had him stripped of his ordination.  I wonder which church ordained him anyway.  Probably the universal church of all inclusion, or something else on the internet.  People sure have gotten off the path.

Yeah, because the guy couldn't be Episcopalian or Methodist or Lutheran, or something. He'd only have to be an Internet-based fake.  Roll Eyes
He could be anything.  The rest of my post was in sarcasm.  But the point you are making actually is a great point.  Far too many denominations have simply given into secular, politically correct pressure and warped the minds of millions in the process.  Not just with this, but a lot of things.  My signature line says it clearly.

Yes, because everyone who disagrees with you is a pansy, secularist, satan-worshipping idiot.
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I know a secret about a former Supreme Court Justice.  Can you guess what it is?

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American Spirits - the eco-friendly cigarette.

Preston Robert Kinney (September 8th, 1997-August 14, 2011
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« Reply #38 on: October 22, 2012, 07:55:52 PM »

Wow. Which one of Kerdy's posts are you referencing to come to that conclusion about what he thinks, James?
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JamesRottnek
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« Reply #39 on: October 22, 2012, 09:07:58 PM »

Wow. Which one of Kerdy's posts are you referencing to come to that conclusion about what he thinks, James?

Well for one thing, his claim that denominations like the Episcapalians only have gay marriage because they gave into "secular, politically correct pressure, and warped the minds of millions." 
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I know a secret about a former Supreme Court Justice.  Can you guess what it is?

The greatest tragedy in the world is when a cigarette ends.

American Spirits - the eco-friendly cigarette.

Preston Robert Kinney (September 8th, 1997-August 14, 2011
Kerdy
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« Reply #40 on: October 23, 2012, 07:13:53 AM »

50 years ago pastors couldn't get away with this. Just sayin.
You are correct.  Just a short 50 years ago, the congregation would have run this “pastor” off and had him stripped of his ordination.  I wonder which church ordained him anyway.  Probably the universal church of all inclusion, or something else on the internet.  People sure have gotten off the path.

Yeah, because the guy couldn't be Episcopalian or Methodist or Lutheran, or something. He'd only have to be an Internet-based fake.  Roll Eyes
He could be anything.  The rest of my post was in sarcasm.  But the point you are making actually is a great point.  Far too many denominations have simply given into secular, politically correct pressure and warped the minds of millions in the process.  Not just with this, but a lot of things.  My signature line says it clearly.

Yes, because everyone who disagrees with you is a pansy, secularist, satan-worshipping idiot.

Um, sure...if you say so.  Undecided
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akimori makoto
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« Reply #41 on: October 23, 2012, 07:15:15 AM »

I miss pro-gay Christians who didn't completely neuter the traditions of other parts of the faith. Where's DVE when you need him?

Seconded.
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The Episcopallian road is easy and wide, for many go through it to find destruction. lol sorry channeling Isa.
Kerdy
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« Reply #42 on: October 23, 2012, 07:15:31 AM »

Wow. Which one of Kerdy's posts are you referencing to come to that conclusion about what he thinks, James?

The ones he doesn't agree with.
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