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Author Topic: Episcopal Church Takes Action Against the Bishop and Diocese of South Carolina  (Read 3835 times) Average Rating: 0
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Father H
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« Reply #45 on: November 13, 2012, 06:53:02 PM »

Lawsuits are part of the Episcopal Church's holy tradition.

Breaking news: "Pot calls kettle black. Pot, meet kettle." We Orthodox have our own historical litany of litigation here in North America so I wouldn't gloat over the ECUSA's problems.

Never said we didn't. Sheesh.

But the crack about lawsuits and "holy" would not be taken without comment if someone made against it an EO jurisdication.

Just for information's sake, there are Anglican traditions and holiness and lawsuits aren't part of the Book of Common Prayer, or Lesser Feast and Fasts or any other custom that I know of.  Undecided

Nevermind.

Just saying it's unfortunate. St. Mark's in Denver, a historic church, became Orthodox (or a significant portion of the congregation did), but they were sued and had to abandon the building, which is now a night club. His Eminence Metropolitan Philip, may he live forever, would probably have no qualms doing the same thing, and Metropolitan Platon fought for his cathedral in the courts.

The Book of Common Prayer is missing a lot of things embraced by the Episcopal Church.

Don't take it too hard.  Ebor doesn't even know how to spell Ybor.  What does he know?  
« Last Edit: November 13, 2012, 06:53:24 PM by Father H » Logged
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« Reply #46 on: November 14, 2012, 09:37:34 AM »

Members of one parish in the Diocese of South Carolina are not simply leaving the national Episcopal Church; they are crossing the Tiber:

"The breakup in the Episcopal diocese has led some members of one local parish, the Anglo-Catholic Church of the Holy Communion, to make a move of their own. Five families will follow the Rev. Patrick Allen, curate at Holy Communion, into the arms of the Roman Catholic Church.

The Rev. Dow Sanderson, rector of Holy Communion, will remain part of the Episcopal Church, along with most of the congregation, and strive to be neutral as the drama plays out, he said.

The fracture comes as no surprise; worshippers at this historic downtown parish at 218 Ashley Ave. [, Charleston, SC,] have long preferred to uphold Catholic traditions.
....
Allen said the process of becoming Catholic will take several months.
....
In January, Allen and the others will join the congregation at St. Mary Catholic Church on Hasell Street to worship. Allen said he hopes to be confirmed as a priest in the Catholic Church by late spring or early summer.
....
More than a year ago, Holy Communion, as a parish, considered opting out of the Episcopal Church and joining the Catholic Diocese of Charleston, but that possibility faded, according to Allen, who addressed the matter in a Nov. 7 letter to the congregation.

With the split in the Episcopal diocese, Allen saw a new opportunity to pursue his goal, though the controversies were not central to his decision, he wrote."
« Last Edit: November 14, 2012, 09:38:17 AM by Jetavan » Logged

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Extra caritatem nulla salus.
In order to become whole, take the "I" out of "holiness".
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« Reply #47 on: November 15, 2012, 01:05:55 AM »

Lawsuits are part of the Episcopal Church's holy tradition.

Breaking news: "Pot calls kettle black. Pot, meet kettle." We Orthodox have our own historical litany of litigation here in North America so I wouldn't gloat over the ECUSA's problems.

Never said we didn't. Sheesh.

But the crack about lawsuits and "holy" would not be taken without comment if someone made against it an EO jurisdication.

Just for information's sake, there are Anglican traditions and holiness and lawsuits aren't part of the Book of Common Prayer, or Lesser Feast and Fasts or any other custom that I know of.  Undecided

Nevermind.

Just saying it's unfortunate. St. Mark's in Denver, a historic church, became Orthodox (or a significant portion of the congregation did), but they were sued and had to abandon the building, which is now a night club. His Eminence Metropolitan Philip, may he live forever, would probably have no qualms doing the same thing, and Metropolitan Platon fought for his cathedral in the courts.

The Book of Common Prayer is missing a lot of things embraced by the Episcopal Church.

Don't take it too hard.  Ebor doesn't even know how to spell Ybor.  What does he know?  

When it comes to things Anglican I know a good deal and some things on other subjects as well.

But perhaps it is due to the lateness of the hour that I do not follow what appears to be an attempted dig at my handle... which has nothing to do with a particular section of Tampa, Florida
http://www.ybor.org/

May I ask what I may have done or said to you or another that would warrant this please?

Ebor (from "Eboracum" but that has been mentioned before)
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« Reply #48 on: November 16, 2012, 03:12:53 PM »

Bishop Mark Lawrence's letter to the members of his diocese, on the recent unpleasantness. It was also published in the major Charleston newspaper, The Post and Courier, 15 November 2012 issue.

"In just a few days, on November 17th, the Special Convention of the Diocese of South Carolina will meet at St. Philip’s Church in Charleston. By God’s grace and providence we will step more fully into the vocation that awaits us—taking, as we have done in the past, the Good News of Jesus Christ across the oceans and across the street. This is and shall remain our highest purpose.

As I have stated at various deanery and parish forums in the diocese this present crisis was brought about through the convergence of three dimensions of our diocesan life and the national church’s leadership—theology, morality and polity. All three have undergone and continue to undergo revision within The Episcopal Church (TEC).
....
It should give all our members profound encouragement to know that we have heard from Archbishops, Presiding Bishops, and diocesan bishops from Kenya to Singapore, England to Egypt, Ireland to the Indian Ocean, representing the overwhelmingly vast majority of members of the Anglican Communion that they consider me as a faithful Anglican Bishop in good standing and this diocese as part of the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church.
....
Nevertheless, you need to know that the national leadership of TEC is taking steps to undermine this diocese. What we are faced with is an intentional effort by the ill-advised TEC organization to assume our identity, one that we have had since 1785.
....
I assure you, we continue to be The Protestant Episcopal Church in the Diocese of South Carolina, known also to our parishes and the wider community as The Episcopal Diocese of South Carolina, and more simply, the Diocese of South Carolina of which I am the XIV Bishop in succession. We are still here and by God’s grace we shall not only endure we shall prevail.

Faithfully yours in Christ,

The Right Reverend Mark Joseph Lawrence
South Carolina XIV
"

« Last Edit: November 16, 2012, 03:18:03 PM by Jetavan » Logged

If you will, you can become all flame.
Extra caritatem nulla salus.
In order to become whole, take the "I" out of "holiness".
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« Reply #49 on: November 16, 2012, 03:25:08 PM »

Perhaps by coincidence, also on 15 November, the Presiding Bishop of TEC issued a pastoral letter to the Diocese of SC:

"Katharine, a servant of Christ, to the saints in South Carolina.

May the grace, mercy, and peace of Christ Jesus our Savior be with you all.

You and the challenges you are facing in South Carolina remain in my own prayers and in those of many, many Episcopalians.  As the confusion increases, I would like to clarify a number of issues which I understand are being discussed.

1)  While some leaders have expressed a desire to leave The Episcopal Church, the Diocese has not left.  It cannot, by its own action.
....
2)  I want to urge every parishioner and cleric in South Carolina to recognize that, as long as you wish to remain in The Episcopal Church, no leader, current or former, can exile you, remove you, or separate you from it without your consent.  That decision is yours alone.
....
4)  Clergy in the Diocese of South Carolina should be advised that they remain members of this Church until they renounce their orders or are otherwise removed by Title IV processes.
....
5)  The same is true of all – The Episcopal Church will do everything in its power to support loyal Episcopalians who wish to remain members of this Church.
....
At the same time, we recognize that an individual may decide that his or her spiritual growth means the individual needs to find another worshipping community....
"
« Last Edit: November 16, 2012, 03:25:29 PM by Jetavan » Logged

If you will, you can become all flame.
Extra caritatem nulla salus.
In order to become whole, take the "I" out of "holiness".
सर्वभूतहित
Ἄνω σχῶμεν τὰς καρδίας
"Those who say religion has nothing to do with politics do not know what religion is." -- Mohandas Gandhi
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« Reply #50 on: November 17, 2012, 04:45:51 PM »

The following address was given by the Rt. Rev. Mark J. Lawrence, XIV Bishop of South Carolina, at St. Philip's Church, Charleston on Saturday, November 17.

Therefore, since we are surrounded by so great a cloud of witnesses, let us also lay aside every weight, and sin which clings so closely, and let us run with perseverance the race that is set before us, looking to Jesus the founder and perfecter of our faith….”  Hebrews 12:1—2a

When this Diocese last met in a convention at St. Philip’s, it was September 16th, 2006.  I was one of three candidates for the XIV Bishop of South Carolina.
....
For since that day on September 16th this Diocese and I have passed through two consent processes for Bishop, and two Disciplinary Board procedures for Abandonment of the Communion of The Episcopal Church—the last without our even knowing it and while we were seeking a peaceable way through this crisis.    I have not done the research but I suppose two consent processes and two disciplinary board procedures  is and may well remain unique in the annuals of TEC.
....
But I must say this again and again. This has never been about who is welcome or not welcome in our church.  Its about what we shall tell them about Jesus Christ, his mercy, his   grace and his truth – it is about , what we shall tell them when they come and what we shall share when we go out.
....
All this might be what lies behind the question often raised at the deanery and parish forums I’ve been addressing—“Bishop, with whom will we affiliate?”  My answer has been quite simply, “For now—no one.”  As any wise pastor will tell you, if you been in a troubling, painful or dysfunctional relationship for a long period of time and then the marriage or relationship ends, you would be wise not to jump right away into the first one that comes along and tie the knot.  You’d be wise take your time.  Nevertheless, I hope we can work with and for a greater unity among the Anglican Churches within our local region and also within North America.  We have many friends and bonds of affection that unite us and along with this—a common mission, Christ’s Mission and unity will deeply assist it.
....
Nevertheless, this I assure you, there shall be lengthy and thorough conversation among the clergy of this diocese—our bishops, priests, and deacons—and our lay leaders before any decision will be presented before this Convention that would ask you to associate with any Province.   I remind you of an historical fact—this diocese existed after the American Revolution for four years before it helped to fully form the Protestant Episcopal Church in these United States and before that organization was completed.  It was a fifth year before this diocese ratified that relationship at our Diocesan Convention in 1790.  So for now and the foreseeable future, having withdrawn from our association with TEC, we remain an extra-provincial Diocese within the larger Anglican Communion; buttressed by the knowledge we are recognized as a legitimate diocese by the vast majority of Anglicans around the world.  Truly, we are surrounded by a great cloud of witnesses. 
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Extra caritatem nulla salus.
In order to become whole, take the "I" out of "holiness".
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"Those who say religion has nothing to do with politics do not know what religion is." -- Mohandas Gandhi
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« Reply #51 on: November 18, 2012, 10:09:34 PM »

On, Saturday, November 17, 2012, the Protestant Episcopal Church in the Diocese of South Carolina met in Special Convention at the “mother church of the Diocese,” historic St. Philip’s Church in Charleston.  There, an overwhelming majority passed three resolutions.

DISASSOCIATION
The first, by voice vote, affirmed the act of disassociation taken by the Bishop and Standing Committee of the Diocese, in response to actions of The Episcopal Church. 
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If you will, you can become all flame.
Extra caritatem nulla salus.
In order to become whole, take the "I" out of "holiness".
सर्वभूतहित
Ἄνω σχῶμεν τὰς καρδίας
"Those who say religion has nothing to do with politics do not know what religion is." -- Mohandas Gandhi
Y dduw bo'r diolch.
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« Reply #52 on: November 19, 2012, 12:13:05 AM »

These are indeed heady days for the EpiscopalDiocese of South Carolina and I pray for the Holy Spirit to comfort and guide them in their self determination.  Just to add a smile or two to their days, I would refer them to the blog "Bad Vestments", to remind them of who it was, Archbishop Schori, who invited them to leave.....
[url]http://badvestments.blogspot.com/2011/05/comeback.htm/url]
This post is the latest to feature this liturgical fashion maven, but there are some real beauties in the older posts.  BTW, I could not seem to get the search function to work properly; there are not too many to page thru, and besides, just flipping the pages will provide one with hours of amusement!
   (edit: oddly, the hyperlink did not work. You may have to copy and paste, but it's worth it!)
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« Reply #53 on: November 19, 2012, 10:37:11 AM »

These are indeed heady days for the EpiscopalDiocese of South Carolina and I pray for the Holy Spirit to comfort and guide them in their self determination.  Just to add a smile or two to their days, I would refer them to the blog "Bad Vestments", to remind them of who it was, Archbishop Schori, who invited them to leave.....
http://badvestments.blogspot.com/2011/05/comeback.html
This post is the latest to feature this liturgical fashion maven, but there are some real beauties in the older posts.  BTW, I could not seem to get the search function to work properly; there are not too many to page thru, and besides, just flipping the pages will provide one with hours of amusement!
   (edit: oddly, the hyperlink did not work. You may have to copy and paste, but it's worth it!)

Fixed the link for you.
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« Reply #54 on: December 06, 2012, 02:00:27 PM »

Bishop Lawrence, Diocese of South Carolina:

Quote
Dear Friends in Christ,
 
“For what we preach is not ourselves, but Jesus Christ as Lord, with ourselves as your servants for Jesus’ sake.”  2 Corinthians 4:5
 
The Presiding Bishop called me this afternoon to inform me that she and her council of advice have “accepted my renunciation of ordained ministry.” I listened quietly, asked a question or two and then told her it was good to hear her voice. I did not feel any need to argue or rebut. It is the Presiding Bishop’s crossing of the T’s and dotting of the I’s—for their paper work, not my life. I could point out the canonical problems with what they have done contrary to the canons of The Episcopal Church but to what avail?   TEC will do what they will do regardless of canonical limitations. Those canonical problems are already well documented by others and hardly need further documentation by me. She and her advisers will say I have said what I have not said in ways that I have not said them even while they cite words from my Bishop’s Address of November 17, 2012.  

Quite simply I have not renounced my orders as a deacon, priest or bishop any more than I have abandoned the Church of Jesus Christ. As I am sure you are aware, the Diocese of South Carolina has canonically and legally disassociated from The Episcopal Church. We took this action long before today’s attempt to claim a renunciation of my orders,  thereby making it superfluous.
« Last Edit: December 06, 2012, 02:01:28 PM by Jetavan » Logged

If you will, you can become all flame.
Extra caritatem nulla salus.
In order to become whole, take the "I" out of "holiness".
सर्वभूतहित
Ἄνω σχῶμεν τὰς καρδίας
"Those who say religion has nothing to do with politics do not know what religion is." -- Mohandas Gandhi
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« Reply #55 on: December 07, 2012, 06:46:15 PM »

Kevin Kallsen interviews Bishop Mark Lawrence the day after the Diocese of South Carolina amended its Constitution and Canons to remove any association with General Convention or the Episcopal Church.
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Extra caritatem nulla salus.
In order to become whole, take the "I" out of "holiness".
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"Those who say religion has nothing to do with politics do not know what religion is." -- Mohandas Gandhi
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« Reply #56 on: December 09, 2012, 03:25:15 PM »

Quote
CHARLESTON, S.C. - The Most Reverend Katharine Jefferts Schori, Presiding Bishop of The Episcopal Church will visit the Episcopal Diocese of South Carolina January 25-26, 2013 as Episcopalians in the diocese gather in Charleston for a Special Convention to elect a new “provisional” bishop and other diocesan leadership.

The visit will give Episcopalians in the Diocese of South Carolina an opportunity to welcome Bishop Jefferts Schori and receive encouragement from her as they strive to continue the work of The Episcopal Church, of which their diocese has been a part for more than 200 years.

Bishop Jefferts Schori will be welcomed with a reception and other special events on Friday, January 25. On Saturday, January 26, she will convene a Special Convention at Grace Episcopal Church, 98 Wentworth St. in Charleston, and preside over the convention while delegates elect a provisional bishop and fill other vacant offices in the diocese.

While the Bishop Schori is in Charleston, at Grace Episcopal Church (which decided to stay in The Episcopal Church), Bishop Lawrence and his supporters will be holding 2012's "Mere Anglicanism" conference, at St. Philip's Church (one of many parishes that decided to leave The Episcopal Church). It will be an interesting weekend in Charleston; luckily, Grace and St. Philip's are several blocks away from one another -- otherwise, sparks might fly!
« Last Edit: December 09, 2012, 03:29:06 PM by Jetavan » Logged

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Extra caritatem nulla salus.
In order to become whole, take the "I" out of "holiness".
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« Reply #57 on: December 11, 2012, 01:23:25 AM »

“I would like to make a point of clarification for those who think we became a new entity upon our disassociation. A brief history lesson seems in order. We were founded in 1785 (prior to the founding of the Episcopal Church). We were incorporated in 1973; adopted our current legal name, “The Protestant Episcopal Church in the Diocese of South Carolina,” in 1987; and we disassociated from the Episcopal Church in October of 2012. We did not become a new entity upon our disassociation. A new entity will need to be created by those who choose to leave the Diocese and re-associate with the Episcopal Church.”

-- The Rev. Canon Jim Lewis
Canon to the Ordinary, Diocese of South Carolina
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If you will, you can become all flame.
Extra caritatem nulla salus.
In order to become whole, take the "I" out of "holiness".
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Ἄνω σχῶμεν τὰς καρδίας
"Those who say religion has nothing to do with politics do not know what religion is." -- Mohandas Gandhi
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« Reply #58 on: December 17, 2012, 12:47:34 PM »

The Primates of the Global South of the Anglican Communion to Bishop Lawrence:

"We want to assure you that we recognize your Episcopal orders and your legitimate Episcopal oversight of the Diocese of South Carolina within the Anglican Communion."
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If you will, you can become all flame.
Extra caritatem nulla salus.
In order to become whole, take the "I" out of "holiness".
सर्वभूतहित
Ἄνω σχῶμεν τὰς καρδίας
"Those who say religion has nothing to do with politics do not know what religion is." -- Mohandas Gandhi
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« Reply #59 on: January 06, 2013, 10:16:09 AM »

Diocese Seeks Declaratory Judgment to Prevent Episcopal Church from Seizing Local Parishes and "Hijacking" their Identities

Quote
St. George, SC, January 4, 2013 –The Diocese of South Carolina, the Trustees of the Diocese and congregations representing the vast majority of its baptized members today filed suit in South Carolina Circuit Court against The Episcopal Church to protect the Diocese’s real and personal property and that of its parishes.

The suit also asks the court to prevent The Episcopal Church from infringing on the protected marks of the Diocese, including its seal and its historical names, and to prevent the church from assuming the Diocese’s identity, which was established long before The Episcopal Church’s creation.

“We seek to protect more than $500 million in real property, including churches, rectories and other buildings that South Carolinians built, paid for, maintained and expanded – and in some cases died to protect – without any support from The Episcopal Church,” said the Rev. Jim Lewis, Canon to the Ordinary. “Many of our parishes are among the oldest operating churches in the nation. They and this Diocese predate the establishment of The Episcopal Church. We want to protect these properties from a blatant land grab.”

The Diocese of South Carolina was established in 1785 as an independent, voluntary association that grew from the missionary work of the Church of England. It was one of nine dioceses that voluntarily joined together to form The Episcopal Church in October 1789, which eventually became an American province in the worldwide Anglican Communion, also a voluntary association.
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If you will, you can become all flame.
Extra caritatem nulla salus.
In order to become whole, take the "I" out of "holiness".
सर्वभूतहित
Ἄνω σχῶμεν τὰς καρδίας
"Those who say religion has nothing to do with politics do not know what religion is." -- Mohandas Gandhi
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« Reply #60 on: January 24, 2013, 01:31:27 AM »

St. George, SC, January 23, 2013 – South Carolina Circuit Court Judge Diane S. Goodstein today issued a temporary restraining order that prevents The Episcopal Church (TEC) and parishes and individuals associated with it from assuming the identity of the Diocese of South Carolina.
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If you will, you can become all flame.
Extra caritatem nulla salus.
In order to become whole, take the "I" out of "holiness".
सर्वभूतहित
Ἄνω σχῶμεν τὰς καρδίας
"Those who say religion has nothing to do with politics do not know what religion is." -- Mohandas Gandhi
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« Reply #61 on: February 06, 2013, 03:10:08 AM »

How orthodox is the SC diocese ( by.Anglican standards)?  Do they allow for women priestesses?  Do they have any scruples about their orthodox stance yet still.choosing to officially affiliate with ECUSA despite the latters heterodox positions?
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« Reply #62 on: February 07, 2013, 02:02:46 AM »

How orthodox is the SC diocese ( by.Anglican standards)?  Do they allow for women priestesses?
A few: http://www.diosc.com/clergy_directory2.htm

Quote
Do they have any scruples about their orthodox stance yet still.choosing to officially affiliate with ECUSA despite the latters heterodox positions?
The Episcopal Diocese of South Carolina is no longer affiliated with ECUSA.
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If you will, you can become all flame.
Extra caritatem nulla salus.
In order to become whole, take the "I" out of "holiness".
सर्वभूतहित
Ἄνω σχῶμεν τὰς καρδίας
"Those who say religion has nothing to do with politics do not know what religion is." -- Mohandas Gandhi
Y dduw bo'r diolch.
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