Levsky
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« on: October 11, 2012, 07:22:02 PM » |
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I've been looking at some videos from Eastern American diocese of ROCOR and have noticed that Metropolitan Hilarion and the other bishops stand on a raised platform in the middle of church during some of the services. Is this platform a Russian replacement for the bishop's throne? I ask this because neither the Bulgarians nor the Greeks themselves have anything like this.
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Michał Kalina
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Hypatos
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OC.net's trickster
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« Reply #1 on: October 12, 2012, 02:43:47 AM » |
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Yes, it is.
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formerly known as mikeDespite being a Polish citizen I am not a Pole.  Long live Belarus! "It's my constitutional right!" |
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Alpo
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« Reply #2 on: October 12, 2012, 03:26:12 AM » |
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There aren't bishops' thrones in Russian practice? Finns use those platforms but I've also seen a throne in one church. Must be a loan from Greeks since the church in question is otherwise fairly Greek.
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« Last Edit: October 12, 2012, 03:26:40 AM by Alpo »
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Just a little reminder: this forum is not called OrthodoxChristianityUSA.net   |
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LBK
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« Reply #3 on: October 12, 2012, 04:02:28 AM » |
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Greek churches generally have a bishop's throne on the right-hand side of the nave, just short of the solea; Russian churches set up a platform covered with red or wine-colored cloth and a suitable chair about a third of the way into the nave.
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HabteSelassie
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« Reply #4 on: October 12, 2012, 02:39:40 PM » |
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Greetings in that Divine and Most Precious Name of Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ! In my parish we don't elevate the Bishops seat when HGs comes to visit with us, but we still have a revered Throne-chair for them and further when they are with us sitting anywhere we lay out silk and embroidered fabrics which we also use for the Altar. Further, the canopy is always brought out like it is for the Gospel and the Holy Communion. The Bishops traditionally are the living Apostles, and we revere them as almost Living Saints who carry that Grace of God in them and share it with us best as they are able. When we revere them, it is not exactly personal (though sometimes if folks are close enough in a paternal relationship it is  )as much as spiritual. We acknowledge that God is working through the Bishops, and so we revere them as we do the Icons, not to worship the people themselves but the Grace of God which flows through their actions and persons.  [ Lord have Mercy on HH soul ] The Throne of the Bishop comes to symbolize the Throne of the Apostles which in reality is like an extension of the Dominions and Powers of the Angels. stay blessed, habte selassie |
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« Last Edit: October 12, 2012, 02:40:10 PM by HabteSelassie »
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"Yet stand aloof from stupid questionings and geneologies and strifes and fightings about law, for they are without benefit and vain." Titus 3:10
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OrthoNoob
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« Reply #5 on: October 12, 2012, 02:48:01 PM » |
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My church (OCA) has a bishop's throne in the altar, behind the Holy Table. Fr. told us at catechism this week that the Greek practice of having the bishop sit outside in the middle of the church is ahistoric, and that throne properly belongs to the emperor.
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HabteSelassie
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« Reply #6 on: October 12, 2012, 02:58:21 PM » |
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Greetings in that Divine and Most Precious Name of Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ! My church (OCA) has a bishop's throne in the altar, behind the Holy Table. Fr. told us at catechism this week that the Greek practice of having the bishop sit outside in the middle of the church is ahistoric, and that throne properly belongs to the emperor.
Yes, we usually keep the Throne in the Altar, and yes, there used to be two Thrones equal in stature and rank, one for the Bishop and the other for the Emperor. Today, the Ethiopian Church indeed has allowed for the Crown Prince HIH Zara Yacob to have the rights and privileges to sit on the Throne during Divine Liturgy as HIH grandfather HIM Haile Selassie I sat before HIH. We usually don't take the Bishop's Throne-chair out, rather just lay the fabrics down on the whichever seat the Bishop is going to sit on, but sometimes for the Metropolitan or the Patriarch the Throne is taken out of the Altar and brought into the Sanctuary stay blessed, habte selassie |
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"Yet stand aloof from stupid questionings and geneologies and strifes and fightings about law, for they are without benefit and vain." Titus 3:10
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Deacon Lance
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« Reply #7 on: October 12, 2012, 04:10:41 PM » |
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It is not a replacement. In Hagia Sophia there was a throne on the Solea where the patriarch sat until the Little Entrance and another throne behind the altar in the apse. The Slav tradition retains this arrangement.
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My cromulent posts embiggen this forum.
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LizaSymonenko
Христос Воскрес!!! Christ is Risen!!!
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« Reply #8 on: October 12, 2012, 04:38:19 PM » |
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The Ukrainian Bishop stands on a covered platform in the middle of the nave.  |
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« Last Edit: October 12, 2012, 04:38:33 PM by LizaSymonenko »
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Conquer evil men by your gentle kindness, and make zealous men wonder at your goodness. Put the lover of legality to shame by your compassion. With the afflicted be afflicted in mind. Love all men, but keep distant from all men.
—St. Isaac of Syria
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Antonis
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« Reply #10 on: October 13, 2012, 09:49:22 PM » |
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Finally submitting to East Rome as is their charge. |
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How shall I not weep when I think of death? For I have seen my brother in his coffin, without glory or comeliness. What, then, do I expect? And what do I hope for? Only grant me, O Lord, repentance before the end.
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ialmisry
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« Reply #11 on: October 13, 2012, 09:56:48 PM » |
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Finally submitting to East Rome as is their charge. LOL. To that upstart? I have a post on the EP and Emperor of New Rome taking their hats off to the Pope of Alexandria (it was Emperor Basil II, but I forget the patriarch). http://www.orthodoxchristianity.net/forum/index.php/topic,19115.0.html |
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« Last Edit: October 13, 2012, 10:12:37 PM by ialmisry »
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Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
and both come out of your mouth
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Antonis
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« Reply #12 on: October 14, 2012, 09:29:12 PM » |
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Heh, neat! |
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How shall I not weep when I think of death? For I have seen my brother in his coffin, without glory or comeliness. What, then, do I expect? And what do I hope for? Only grant me, O Lord, repentance before the end.
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Shanghaiski
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« Reply #13 on: October 14, 2012, 10:02:43 PM » |
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Greek churches generally have a bishop's throne on the right-hand side of the nave, just short of the solea; Russian churches set up a platform covered with red or wine-colored cloth and a suitable chair about a third of the way into the nave.
Greek bishops moved to the emperor's throne. I thought the Russian throne was behind the altar. |
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Not to be flippantly dismissive, but something of such a personal nature as this is best addressed by your priest, not by anonymous yahoos on an Internet discussion forum.
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Shanghaiski
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« Reply #14 on: October 14, 2012, 10:07:24 PM » |
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Another instance of an OO hierarch wearing Constantinopolitan mitre. They seem to have fallen in love with them. Those vestments are so awesome. |
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Not to be flippantly dismissive, but something of such a personal nature as this is best addressed by your priest, not by anonymous yahoos on an Internet discussion forum.
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OrthoNoob
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« Reply #15 on: October 14, 2012, 11:00:46 PM » |
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I thought the Russian throne was behind the altar.
It is. At least it is in my parish. |
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Deacon Lance
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« Reply #16 on: October 14, 2012, 11:33:00 PM » |
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Greek churches generally have a bishop's throne on the right-hand side of the nave, just short of the solea; Russian churches set up a platform covered with red or wine-colored cloth and a suitable chair about a third of the way into the nave.
Greek bishops moved to the emperor's throne. I thought the Russian throne was behind the altar. It is. The second throne in the nave is used in hierarchal liturgies only. The bishop sits here until the little entrance. |
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My cromulent posts embiggen this forum.
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