Author Topic: Tom Hanks 'testimonial' in Russia's Orthodox Church ad  (Read 8821 times)

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Offline Shanghaiski

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Re: Tom Hanks 'testimonial' in Russia's Orthodox Church ad
« Reply #90 on: October 15, 2012, 06:59:59 PM »
Look, we can allow divorce and remarriage by ekonomia.  Can we do the same for same sex marriage?  If a gay couple become Orthodox, does the Church by ekonomia accept them as Orthodox Christians and married?

The answer is so obvious here.

Apparently, some same-sex couples, or at least one partner, become Orthodox. I'm not sure if their condition is known before hand. In some cases it is, and I think this is problematic for many reasons.
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Offline choy

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Re: Tom Hanks 'testimonial' in Russia's Orthodox Church ad
« Reply #91 on: October 15, 2012, 07:22:01 PM »
Look, we can allow divorce and remarriage by ekonomia.  Can we do the same for same sex marriage?  If a gay couple become Orthodox, does the Church by ekonomia accept them as Orthodox Christians and married?

The answer is so obvious here.

Apparently, some same-sex couples, or at least one partner, become Orthodox. I'm not sure if their condition is known before hand. In some cases it is, and I think this is problematic for many reasons.

If the instructions from the Russian Orthodox are any indication, obviously that is a no-no.  I googled and found some instructions on how to receive gay and transgendered individuals.  For transgendered, even if they have surgery to change their sex organs, they will still be received as their birth gender and treated as their birth gender without requiring them to go through surgery to revert.  I highly doubt a same-sex couple will be allowed to continue as if they are married.  I guess the question is, will they be required to file for civil divorce?

Anyway, that is beyond this thread.  Our issue is about people endorsing SSM such as Tom Hanks, and whether it is acceptable in the Orthodox Church or not.

Offline Peter J

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Re: Tom Hanks 'testimonial' in Russia's Orthodox Church ad
« Reply #92 on: November 10, 2012, 02:24:03 PM »
Hi all. I don't want to rehash the whole thread but I would like to add a thought.

Catholicism is often criticized for its harsh stances regarding sexuality; but it's worth noting that those harsh stances are "across the board" if you will: we oppose fornication, divorce/remarriage, contraception, sodomy (whether same- or opposite- sex) etc. It would bother me if, e.g. we took a firm stance against homosexuality but a lenient stance on fornication.
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Offline NicholasMyra

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Re: Tom Hanks 'testimonial' in Russia's Orthodox Church ad
« Reply #93 on: November 10, 2012, 02:51:36 PM »
I guess the question is, will they be required to file for civil divorce?

Would a money lender be required to release all contracts of interest in order to join the church?
« Last Edit: November 10, 2012, 02:51:56 PM by NicholasMyra »
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Offline Father H

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Re: Tom Hanks 'testimonial' in Russia's Orthodox Church ad
« Reply #94 on: November 10, 2012, 07:23:45 PM »
Like religious freedom? Serving meat in restaurants at Wednesdays and Fridays? Allowing for your religious organisation to operate?

Exactly. There is nothing inconsistent about considering something sinful and still supporting another person's freedom to engage in it.


That being said, I remember reading an interview with Tom Hanks where he said his family attended church very infrequently, so I'd be surprised if he placed any great weight on what the Church teaches on the issue.

Eating meat on Wednesdays and Fridays is not a sin.  Otherwise we could not have the exceptions of publican and pharisee, bright week, pentecost, etc.  It is a practice of the virtues.  We cannot equate it to abortion or practiced homosexuality. 

Offline Shlomlokh

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Re: Tom Hanks 'testimonial' in Russia's Orthodox Church ad
« Reply #95 on: November 10, 2012, 11:00:09 PM »
Like religious freedom? Serving meat in restaurants at Wednesdays and Fridays? Allowing for your religious organisation to operate?

Exactly. There is nothing inconsistent about considering something sinful and still supporting another person's freedom to engage in it.


That being said, I remember reading an interview with Tom Hanks where he said his family attended church very infrequently, so I'd be surprised if he placed any great weight on what the Church teaches on the issue.

Eating meat on Wednesdays and Fridays is not a sin.  Otherwise we could not have the exceptions of publican and pharisee, bright week, pentecost, etc.  It is a practice of the virtues.  We cannot equate it to abortion or practiced homosexuality. 
Could we equate usury with practiced homosexuality as Nicholas and Orthonorm love to do?

In Christ,
Andrew
"I will pour out my prayer unto the Lord, and to Him will I proclaim my grief; for with evils my soul is filled, and my life unto hades hath drawn nigh, and like Jonah I will pray: From corruption raise me up, O God." -Ode VI, Irmos of the Supplicatory Canon to the Theotokos

Offline Opus118

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Re: Tom Hanks 'testimonial' in Russia's Orthodox Church ad
« Reply #96 on: November 10, 2012, 11:36:45 PM »
"as Nicholas and Orthonorm love to do?"

I think it is more their "love for us" rather than their "love to do".

Offline orthonorm

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Re: Tom Hanks 'testimonial' in Russia's Orthodox Church ad
« Reply #97 on: November 12, 2012, 12:07:24 AM »
Like religious freedom? Serving meat in restaurants at Wednesdays and Fridays? Allowing for your religious organisation to operate?

Exactly. There is nothing inconsistent about considering something sinful and still supporting another person's freedom to engage in it.


That being said, I remember reading an interview with Tom Hanks where he said his family attended church very infrequently, so I'd be surprised if he placed any great weight on what the Church teaches on the issue.

Eating meat on Wednesdays and Fridays is not a sin.  Otherwise we could not have the exceptions of publican and pharisee, bright week, pentecost, etc.  It is a practice of the virtues.  We cannot equate it to abortion or practiced homosexuality. 
Could we equate usury with practiced homosexuality as Nicholas and Orthonorm love to do?

In Christ,
Andrew

Quote or it didn't happen.

I would never equate the two.

A lot more people get screwed over by one than the other.
Ignorance is not a lack, but a passion.

Offline choy

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Re: Tom Hanks 'testimonial' in Russia's Orthodox Church ad
« Reply #98 on: November 12, 2012, 03:38:51 AM »
I guess the question is, will they be required to file for civil divorce?

Would a money lender be required to release all contracts of interest in order to join the church?

If one does not repent, isn't one excommunicated?

Offline ialmisry

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Re: Tom Hanks 'testimonial' in Russia's Orthodox Church ad
« Reply #99 on: November 12, 2012, 07:40:13 AM »
Like religious freedom? Serving meat in restaurants at Wednesdays and Fridays? Allowing for your religious organisation to operate?

Exactly. There is nothing inconsistent about considering something sinful and still supporting another person's freedom to engage in it.


That being said, I remember reading an interview with Tom Hanks where he said his family attended church very infrequently, so I'd be surprised if he placed any great weight on what the Church teaches on the issue.

Eating meat on Wednesdays and Fridays is not a sin.  Otherwise we could not have the exceptions of publican and pharisee, bright week, pentecost, etc.  It is a practice of the virtues.  We cannot equate it to abortion or practiced homosexuality. 
Could we equate usury with practiced homosexuality as Nicholas and Orthonorm love to do?

In Christ,
Andrew

Quote or it didn't happen.

I would never equate the two.

A lot more people get screwed over by one than the other.
A lot more people get screwed by theft than by murder, but it doesn't make the latter less a crime.
Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
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and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth

Offline ialmisry

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Re: Tom Hanks 'testimonial' in Russia's Orthodox Church ad
« Reply #100 on: November 12, 2012, 07:43:44 AM »
and his calling those that oppose gay marriage as "un-American," or something to that effect.
Once again, this is a statement about civil rights, nothing that could raise qustions about his Orthodoxy.
If no one can produce a specific statement asking for church weddings, I consider the case closed.
So, unless the perpetrator is Orthodox, we are OK with murder?  We have nothing to say on Armin Meiwes?
Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth

Offline ialmisry

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Re: Tom Hanks 'testimonial' in Russia's Orthodox Church ad
« Reply #101 on: November 12, 2012, 07:47:33 AM »
You know I remember a lot of racist types trotting their black "friends" out back in the day.

Weird that the homohystericals always seem to have that gay "friend" as well.


Unlike the Left, they can tolerate persons of different opinions.
Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth

Offline Shlomlokh

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Re: Tom Hanks 'testimonial' in Russia's Orthodox Church ad
« Reply #102 on: November 12, 2012, 11:07:49 AM »
"as Nicholas and Orthonorm love to do?"

I think it is more their "love for us" rather than their "love to do".
I said what I said. ;)

In Christ,
Andrew
"I will pour out my prayer unto the Lord, and to Him will I proclaim my grief; for with evils my soul is filled, and my life unto hades hath drawn nigh, and like Jonah I will pray: From corruption raise me up, O God." -Ode VI, Irmos of the Supplicatory Canon to the Theotokos

Offline Charles Martel

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Re: Tom Hanks 'testimonial' in Russia's Orthodox Church ad
« Reply #103 on: November 17, 2012, 09:42:15 PM »
Hi all. I don't want to rehash the whole thread but I would like to add a thought.

Catholicism is often criticized for its harsh stances regarding sexuality; but it's worth noting that those harsh stances are "across the board" if you will: we oppose fornication, divorce/remarriage, contraception, sodomy (whether same- or opposite- sex) etc. It would bother me if, e.g. we took a firm stance against homosexuality but a lenient stance on fornication.
That is known as consistency. ;)

Sancte Michael Archangele, defende nos in proelio, contra nequitiam et insidias diaboli esto praesidium.

Offline Charles Martel

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Re: Tom Hanks 'testimonial' in Russia's Orthodox Church ad
« Reply #104 on: November 17, 2012, 09:46:13 PM »
Supporting one's freedom to sin is anti-Christian.

Christ is anti-Christian...
Oh really...........do tell.

and what you're talking about is not "freedom" what you really want is licence.
Sancte Michael Archangele, defende nos in proelio, contra nequitiam et insidias diaboli esto praesidium.

Offline Charles Martel

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Re: Tom Hanks 'testimonial' in Russia's Orthodox Church ad
« Reply #105 on: November 17, 2012, 09:49:40 PM »
You know I remember a lot of racist types trotting their black "friends" out back in the day.

Weird that the homohystericals always seem to have that gay "friend" as well.


You know, if I was black and you made a statement like that equating my people with homosexuals, we'd have a problem.

The scary part is you call your self OrthoNORM.  :o
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Offline Charles Martel

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Re: Tom Hanks 'testimonial' in Russia's Orthodox Church ad
« Reply #106 on: November 17, 2012, 09:53:45 PM »
Even if the secular government wants to sanction sinful behavior, our duty as Christians is to lead people to the Kingdom of God.  How does supporting secular action that promotes anti-Christian behavior help that duty?  How does supporting secular gay marriage help lead these gay couples into the Kingdom?  By supporting gay marriage we are actually leading them away from the Kingdom, and ourselves as well.
I'm really beginning to have a new found respect for you choy after reading this thread. ;)

Unfortunately, it's quite revealing about some "Orthodox" attitudes towards this sexual deviancy known as a "life style".
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Offline orthonorm

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Re: Tom Hanks 'testimonial' in Russia's Orthodox Church ad
« Reply #107 on: November 17, 2012, 11:03:21 PM »
Hi all. I don't want to rehash the whole thread but I would like to add a thought.

Catholicism is often criticized for its harsh stances regarding sexuality; but it's worth noting that those harsh stances are "across the board" if you will: we oppose fornication, divorce/remarriage, contraception, sodomy (whether same- or opposite- sex) etc. It would bother me if, e.g. we took a firm stance against homosexuality but a lenient stance on fornication.
That is known as consistency. ;)



To mangle another's words: Consistency is the hobgoblin of small minds.
Ignorance is not a lack, but a passion.