OrthodoxChristianity.net
April 24, 2014, 09:25:33 AM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
News: The Rules page has been updated.  Please familiarize yourself with its contents!
 
   Home   Help Calendar Contact Treasury Tags Login Register  
Pages: 1   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Authority sources  (Read 416 times) Average Rating: 0
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
Anastasia1
My warrior name is Beyoncé Pad Thai
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Oriental Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Occasionally traveling, Armenian.
Posts: 1,146



« on: September 09, 2012, 11:44:06 PM »

Is the church higher or equal to the Bible in terms of authority?
Logged

Therefore prepare yourself and arise, and speak to them all that I command you. Do not be dismayed before their faces, Lest I dismay you before them.  For behold, I have made you this day a fortified city and an iron pillar, and bronze walls against the whole land...
Aindriú
Faster! Funnier!
Protokentarchos
*********
Offline Offline

Faith: Cynical
Jurisdiction: Vestibule of Hell
Posts: 3,908



WWW
« Reply #1 on: September 10, 2012, 12:33:22 AM »

Is the church higher or equal to the Bible in terms of authority?

The bible is a 20-sided die and the Church is a 12-sided die. Now, which of the dice is better? We're not playing Dungeons and Dragons here! Stick to the point!
Logged


I'm going to need this.
Anastasia1
My warrior name is Beyoncé Pad Thai
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Oriental Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Occasionally traveling, Armenian.
Posts: 1,146



« Reply #2 on: September 10, 2012, 12:41:02 AM »

Is the church higher or equal to the Bible in terms of authority?

The bible is a 20-sided die and the Church is a 12-sided die. Now, which of the dice is better? We're not playing Dungeons and Dragons here! Stick to the point!
I don't get it at all.
Logged

Therefore prepare yourself and arise, and speak to them all that I command you. Do not be dismayed before their faces, Lest I dismay you before them.  For behold, I have made you this day a fortified city and an iron pillar, and bronze walls against the whole land...
FatherGiryus
You are being watched.
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: Patriarchate of Antioch - NA
Posts: 2,094



« Reply #3 on: September 10, 2012, 12:52:56 AM »

God is the highest authority in the Church.  His will is made known to us through collective judgment of the Church, which is the Body of Christ, that holds forth the Holy Scriptures as witness to His Church.  The Scriptures, therefore, are not separate, but part of the whole revelation of Truth, which is found in the Church.

Those who are outside the Church cannot understand the Scriptures, because the Scriptures are meaningless without the indwelling Holy Spirit.  Therefore, you can't say 'this one has more authority than that' because in order to understand the Scriptures you must have the Holy Spirit, which means you are part of the Body of Christ, the Church, and so such a separation would be an impossibility.

See?


Is the church higher or equal to the Bible in terms of authority?
Logged

http://orthodoxyandrecovery.blogspot.com
The most dangerous thing about riding a tiger is the dismount.  - Indian proverb
Anastasia1
My warrior name is Beyoncé Pad Thai
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Oriental Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Occasionally traveling, Armenian.
Posts: 1,146



« Reply #4 on: September 10, 2012, 01:17:09 AM »

God is the highest authority in the Church.  His will is made known to us through collective judgment of the Church, which is the Body of Christ, that holds forth the Holy Scriptures as witness to His Church.  The Scriptures, therefore, are not separate, but part of the whole revelation of Truth, which is found in the Church.

Those who are outside the Church cannot understand the Scriptures, because the Scriptures are meaningless without the indwelling Holy Spirit.  Therefore, you can't say 'this one has more authority than that' because in order to understand the Scriptures you must have the Holy Spirit, which means you are part of the Body of Christ, the Church, and so such a separation would be an impossibility.

See?


Is the church higher or equal to the Bible in terms of authority?
Ok, this answer makes sense. Now there was another answer I got a while back about the Greek Orthodox view compared to a Protestant view of sola scriptura was that the church helped to determine what was canonized as scripture.  How does this relate?
Logged

Therefore prepare yourself and arise, and speak to them all that I command you. Do not be dismayed before their faces, Lest I dismay you before them.  For behold, I have made you this day a fortified city and an iron pillar, and bronze walls against the whole land...
NicholasMyra
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Antiochian/Greek
Posts: 5,634


Avowed denominationalist


« Reply #5 on: September 10, 2012, 02:22:59 AM »

Is the church higher or equal to the Bible in terms of authority?
The Church is the living body of Christ.

The Scriptures are used by the living body of Christ.

In that sense, they aren't really in the same category to be judged against each other. Does the farmer contend with the plow for authority?
« Last Edit: September 10, 2012, 02:23:41 AM by NicholasMyra » Logged

"...you are the orphan, not the protagonist."

-St. Seraphim of Vyritsa, 'This was from me'
Anastasia1
My warrior name is Beyoncé Pad Thai
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Oriental Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Occasionally traveling, Armenian.
Posts: 1,146



« Reply #6 on: September 10, 2012, 02:35:24 AM »

Is the church higher or equal to the Bible in terms of authority?
The Church is the living body of Christ.

The Scriptures are used by the living body of Christ.

In that sense, they aren't really in the same category to be judged against each other. Does the farmer contend with the plow for authority?
The farmer controls what the plow does to the crops.

The plow cannot act on its own: the farmer can.
« Last Edit: September 10, 2012, 02:35:51 AM by Anastasia1 » Logged

Therefore prepare yourself and arise, and speak to them all that I command you. Do not be dismayed before their faces, Lest I dismay you before them.  For behold, I have made you this day a fortified city and an iron pillar, and bronze walls against the whole land...
Gorazd
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: The Ecumenical Patriarchate of Istanbul and Chambésy
Posts: 1,855



« Reply #7 on: September 10, 2012, 07:07:32 AM »

Is the church higher or equal to the Bible in terms of authority?

Authority is a Latin term anyway. The Fathers used the Greek exousia, which could be better translated as power or mandate.

Actually, it is not Bible or Church, but Bible in the Church. Who wrote the Bible? The Holy Apostles and Evangelists. Who fixed what is part of the Bible and what not? St. Athanasius of Alexandria and the recognition his canon received in the Church. Who understands the Bible correctly? The Church. The Bible in the Church is like a heart in its body.

And btw, I really recommend you to read Fr. Matta al-Maskeen. Probably the greatest OO Bible commentator during the last centuries.
Logged
Alpo
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Faith: <Insert your favourite patriotic attribute here> Orthodox
Posts: 5,975



« Reply #8 on: September 10, 2012, 08:10:43 AM »

The Fathers used the Greek

And Latin, Arabic, English, Church Slavonic...
Logged

Gorazd
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: The Ecumenical Patriarchate of Istanbul and Chambésy
Posts: 1,855



« Reply #9 on: September 10, 2012, 08:43:13 AM »

The Fathers used the Greek

And Latin, Arabic, English, Church Slavonic...

I mean the Church Fathers in a historical sense, especially those of Alexandria, in the context of an OO discussion. They use Greek and Coptic.
Logged
Iconodule
Uranopolitan
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: OCA (Diocese of Eastern Pennsylvania)
Posts: 6,835


"My god is greater."


« Reply #10 on: September 10, 2012, 10:10:03 AM »

Is the church higher or equal to the Bible in terms of authority?

Authority is a Latin term anyway. The Fathers used the Greek exousia, which could be better translated as power or mandate.

Woah, that's so mystical and eastern and completely different!
Logged

"A riddle or the cricket's cry
Is to doubt a fit reply." - William Blake

Quote from: Byron
Just ignore iconotools delusions. He is the biggest multiculturalist globalist there is due to his unfortunate background.
ialmisry
There's nothing John of Damascus can't answer
Hypatos
*****************
Offline Offline

Faith: جامعي Arab confesssing the Orthodox Faith of the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church
Jurisdiction: Antioch (for now), but my heart belongs to Alexandria
Posts: 35,633



« Reply #11 on: September 10, 2012, 10:41:05 AM »

The Scriptures outside the context of the Orthodox Church is like a fish out of water.  Or the heart trying to pump on its own outside the body, without the circulation system, or the brain trying to think without the nervous system.

Trying to use the Bible outside of the Church is like owning the manual to a car, and not having the car.
Logged

Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth
Tags:
Pages: 1   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.18 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
Page created in 0.062 seconds with 38 queries.