Author Topic: What Exactly is our Relation to the Old Testament?  (Read 598 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline JamesR

  • Virginal Chicano Blood
  • Taxiarches
  • **********
  • Posts: 6,611
  • 1951-2015 Memory Eternal Uncle Roy--40 Days of Mourning.
  • Faith: Misotheistic Eastern Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: Orthodox Church *of* America
What Exactly is our Relation to the Old Testament?
« on: May 02, 2012, 09:23:39 PM »
This is something I've never really gotten a clear answer to before. I emailed my Priest about it but he has not responded yet. So, I felt like asking you fellows. What exactly is the Church's position in regards to the Old Testament? Are we still under certain ordinances from it or not? I've had some people say that it does not apply to us at all anymore, and others that some parts do, and even others who say that all of it does. What is our relationship with the Old Testament? Likewise, more specifically, could I use Old Testament ordinances and scriptures to support liturgical worship against contemporary modernist worship?
...Or it's just possible he's a mouthy young man on an internet forum.
In the infinite wisdom of God, James can be all three.

Offline witega

  • Is it enough now, to tell you you matter?
  • OC.net guru
  • *******
  • Posts: 1,614
Re: What Exactly is our Relation to the Old Testament?
« Reply #1 on: May 03, 2012, 12:54:46 AM »
exactly

I think you may be misinformed. Orthodox don't do 'exactly'.
« Last Edit: May 03, 2012, 12:56:19 AM by witega »
Ariel Starling - New album

For it were better to suffer everything, rather than divide the Church of God. Even martyrdom for the sake of preventing division would not be less glorious than for refusing to worship idols. - St. Dionysius the Great

Offline SolEX01

  • Toumarches
  • ************
  • Posts: 12,353
    • Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America
  • Faith: Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: Metropolis of New Jersey
Re: What Exactly is our Relation to the Old Testament?
« Reply #2 on: May 03, 2012, 01:05:58 AM »
Likewise, more specifically, could I use Old Testament ordinances and scriptures to support liturgical worship against contemporary modernist worship?

Why do such a thing?  Why not focus on the cathecumenate because to answer your question - the New Testament, in Jesus Christ, fulfills the Old Testament.  What happened in the Old Testament was supposed to prepare the children of Israel for the Messiah.  When the Messiah came, he was crucified (even that was prophecized in the Old Testament).

Offline Justin Kissel

  • *
  • Protospatharios
  • ****************
  • Posts: 32,252
Re: What Exactly is our Relation to the Old Testament?
« Reply #3 on: May 03, 2012, 01:10:31 AM »
In broad strokes... the Old Testament has been superceded by the new. The morality of the NT is superior, the ability to achieve salvation is, well, brand new, and we are to follow grace more than law (not that there wasn't both concepts in both the OT and NT).

Offline ironchapman

  • A bull of truth in a china shop of falsehoods.
  • High Elder
  • ******
  • Posts: 800
  • I see you.
  • Faith: Serious inquirer.
Re: What Exactly is our Relation to the Old Testament?
« Reply #4 on: September 12, 2012, 06:23:19 PM »
Bump.

I was talking with a friend last night who was debating someone about whether OT laws still apply. I told him my understanding of the issue was that the arrival, death, and resurrection of Jesus had abolished the written laws (no pork, punishments for crimes, etc) but kept the moral ones (don't kill or steal, etc.).

He said it was more complicated than that. Admittedly, he is a Catholic, and a pretty learned one at that. What am I missing, or is this just some understanding Catholics have that Orthodox don't.
"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." --Bertrand Russell

Offline yeshuaisiam

  • Protokentarchos
  • *********
  • Posts: 4,697
  • A pulling horse cannot kick.
Re: What Exactly is our Relation to the Old Testament?
« Reply #5 on: September 17, 2012, 01:04:34 PM »
Likewise, more specifically, could I use Old Testament ordinances and scriptures to support liturgical worship against contemporary modernist worship?

Why do such a thing?  Why not focus on the cathecumenate because to answer your question - the New Testament, in Jesus Christ, fulfills the Old Testament.  What happened in the Old Testament was supposed to prepare the children of Israel for the Messiah.  When the Messiah came, he was crucified (even that was prophecized in the Old Testament).

I don't know if JamesR could say that without defining contemporary modernist worship.

For instance, Messianic Jews worship in Aramayic and on the Sabbath.  This practice many early Christians did.

Some may consider the Liturgy of St. John Chrysostom modernist compared to the Liturgy of St. James

Then you could go into the "modernist" new calendar.

Or the old believer Orthodox would call the current mainstream EO church modernist...

Modernist can be defined differently. 
I learned how to be more frugal and save money at http://www.livingpress.com