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Author Topic: Interesting take on "Original Sin"  (Read 686 times) Average Rating: 0
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Enoch
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« on: August 18, 2012, 09:02:57 AM »

We, in Ethiopia: The Kingdom of God, believe that there is no "original sin" as such for anyone to inherit from his/her parents. It is a phenomenon which every human being acquires later in the process of his/her individual life, i.e., at maturity, by the inherent attainment of one's own will-power of making his/her CHOICE.
The conventional belief that the infamous action of Adam and Eve that culminated in their eating of the fruit of the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil rendered every individual human being liable to the inheritance of the original sin is utterly unacceptable in our Faith of the Holy Covenant. According to such conventional belief, The Holy Virgin Mary, Mother of God, as the offspring of Adam and Eve, could be regarded to have inherited the original sin as any ordinary human being, through Her natural birth from Her Parents, Iyaqem (Joakim) and Hanna (Anne) who are descendents of the seeds and the chain of abnormal and illicit relationships of eminent sinners and gentiles like Judah and Tamar, Salmon and Rahab, Boaz and Ruth, and David who married BethSheba, wife of Uriah, to beget Solomon who, from the Ethiopian Virgin Queen Makk'dda, begot Menelik, the Grandparent of The Virgin Mary.
The Divine Truth is that the above critical option taken by the First Parents, contrary to the conventional belief and to the benefit of the human nature, raised the exalted status of the Divine Image of the latter to the perfect fullness of Divinity by expanding his/her capacity of the Divine Power to the extent of possessing the Divine Knowledge, not only of the Good, but also of the Evil. This attainment of the human nature of the Divine Status signified simply the elevation of the human nature to such stage where he/she is empowered to discern both the Good and the Evil, just like God does, as well as to make the CHOICE of adhering to one of the two alternatives. It did not constitute or imply in any sense as committing a sin, as it had never been in the case of God Himself. The concept of "original sin" is, thus, made null and void, merely on this premise.
Hence, the decisive and significant factor in this and all aspects of creation that rendered The Virgin Mary a unique human being, particularly among the female gender, is simply the CHOICE She had made that no other person of Her kind, from the time of Adam and Eve until Her emergence, ever attempted to attain: The CHOICE of making oneself Divine, rather than Evil. (On the male gender side Abel, Henok and EthioPis, the Primary Melke-Tsedeq, the Archetype of the Final and the Everlasting Melke-Tsedeq, Jesus Christ, and who received the Sacred Heritage from Noah, and the Intermediary Melke-Tsedeq, who blessed Abraham, could be cited.) The praise expressed by the Arch-Angel Saint Gabriel in his Annunciation to The Virgin Mary such as "Blessed are you among women!" attests to this Divine Truth. (Lk. 1/28)
Let me elaborate on this vital issue. To do so, I need to reiterate a section that I composed and sent as response for an earlier email, a copy of which you had received.
You certainly know and believe, as is written in the Scriptures, that God had created every human person, including you and me, in His Image of Divinity. Such Wonder of Creation that emerged in human beings in Divinity began to develop from the original, then proceeded into the intermediate, and finally culminated unto the Perfect Completeness of the Everlasting Present. The enhancement of this phenomenon was Divinely set off and revealed in the first, the second and the third stages, as briefly explained hereunder:


i) The first stage of Human Divinity, of course, was realized when Adam and Eve were created in the Image of God, and confined only in the Divine Realm of Goodness, as attested in Scriptures that says, "So God created man in His own image; in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them." (Gen. 1/27.)
The progeny of this stage continued its survival through the recurrence of the procreation and the life that span from conception to birth and up to the age of adolescence of each one of us, whereby only the Good dominates every aspect of our lives.


ii) The second stage of Human Divinity occurred when our primal ancestors ate the forbidden fruit of the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil. This was the epoch when they were both proclaimed by God to attain Fullness of Divinity, as attested in Scriptures that says, "Then the LORD God said, "Behold, the man has become like one of Us, to know good and evil. And now, lest he put out his hand and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live forever, therefore, the LORD God sent him out of the garden of Eden to till the ground from which he was taken." (Gen. 3/22-23).
The progeny of this stage continued its survival through the recurrence of the attainment of adulthood. It is at this stage whereby the knowledge of Good and Evil transcends, the will and the choice to commit either of the two prevails, and the capability to decisively execute the preference avails itself, in the life that span from adulthood to old age and death of each one of us.


iii) The third stage of Human Divinity culminated when the human person is baptized in the Names of the Divine Father, the Divine Son and the Divine Holy Spirit, One God, at which time his/her original sin, if there is any, is absolved, and partakes the Holy Communion, the Tree of Life, acquired through the sacrifice, atonement and Redemption of Jesus Christ. By performing such Acts of Faith, each one of us becomes Eternal and Divine Son and Daughter of God, Priest and Priestess, King and Queen.
Such status is attained over and above the Divinity each one of us already possessed originally in the first stage, but which we rejected and lost of our own will and choice in the second stage, in preference to the evil. The Body of Our Lord crucified on the Cross and the Blood shed thereon purified, restored and affirmed the third and final stage that is ultimately maintained and eternalized for the Life of Divinity in Sanctity.
This is attested in Scriptures that says, in fulfillment of "And now, lest he put out his hand and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live forever," Our Lord Jesus Christ declared that "This is the bread which comes down from Heaven, that one may eat of it and not die. I am the living bread which came down from Heaven. If anyone eats of this bread, he will live forever; and the bread that I shall give is My flesh, which I shall give for the life of the world."
"And Jesus came and spoke to them, saying, "All authority has been given to Me in Heaven and on earth. Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age."…
"But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become Children of God, to those who believe in His name: who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man and woman, but of God."
"Jesus answered, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the Kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit." (Gen. 3/22-23; Mt. 28/18-20; Jn. 1/12-13; Jn.3/5-6.)
The progeny of this stage continued their survival for the last two millenniums of the Era of the Covenant of Mercy. This was acquired by The Incarnate God Our Lord Jesus Christ and His Mother of God The Virgin Mary, through the recurrence of the attainment of Divine Childhood, Citizenship, Priesthood and Royalty in Ethiopia: The Kingdom of God of the Holy Covenant, the Life of God where evil, sin and death non-exist.
The above brief presentation is the revelation of The Divine Truth with regard to the identity of the individual human who is personified as the Ethiopian. The latter, in the inspiration and guidance of the Holy Spirit, remained for millenniums on end and to this day, as the intelligent creature who acquired his/her knowledge, teaching and belief of Ethiopia: The Kingdom of God directly and inherently from his/her Divine Creator, Provider, Protector and Redeemer.
Now, as such, and according to the above stipulations of The Divine Truth that the Word of God expressly provided, every human being, including you and I, is the Image and One of Him, as well as Son/Daughter of God. Yes, God wanted each one of us to be, live and act like Him, no question about that. If you and I choose, of our own will, to know and accept in Faith this Divine Gift and Truth, you and I can think, speak or write, and act and live like God, just as Adam and Eve did in their preference to the Evil.
For someone to attain such spiritual transcendence, it is as simple as doing anything ordinary that worth personal preference. Accordingly, if a human being, like you and me, of his/her free will and choice, resolves, on the one hand, to promote himself/herself into becoming an angel, and then to think and speak, act and live as such, he/she surely can. Or, on the other hand, if the latter resolves, in the same manner, to remain a bare human, or to demote himself/herself into becoming an animal, a beast, Satan, or even worse than the Devil, and then to think and speak, act and live as such, yes, he/she can.
However, regrettably and surprisingly, the intransigent tendency of all human beings, right from the beginning, viz., from Adam and Eve, became manifest in exclusively following suit of the evil path of their predecessors. This is, of course, with the exception of a handful of hopefuls with whom God made Transitory Covenants. Such condition of human misery remained a status quo up until the Advent of The Holy Virgin Mary Who bore God The Son, The Lord Jesus Christ.
At the End of Time, The Virgin Mary uniquely and unequivocally refused to succumb to the will of the flesh, and to let Herself fall victim of the usual evil tendency, that retraced the same track upon which all humans, particularly the female gender, treaded in the direction of the domain where the Devil rules, Sin prevails and Death dominates.
The Virgin Mary, being immaculate, if not in Her physical body and human nature, but in Her Love and Faith of The Divine Truth, vigorously desired and totally resolved, to choose and commit Herself into becoming completely the Divine Image of God, to learn from Him and acquire His Knowledge. She totally rejected the human or the evil one unlike Her kinds from the time of Adam and Eve to Her Day were entirely inclined and determined to make their preferences.
To achieve this end, of course, She exercised Her enhanced triune Divine Powers that were inherent in the human nature bestowed by the Benevolence of God, as explained above. These Sacred Virtues are the Knowledge of Good and Evil, and the Willpower to reject the Evil in favour of the Good, finally the utilization of the capability to execute the preference She decided upon.
By electing and using the nature of Her Divinity, the Holy Virgin Mary was capable of rendering Herself Immaculate of the original sin, if there is any, and of any blemish, thus of becoming Mother of God, through the Cleansing Power of the Holy Spirit.
This phenomenon materialized within the process of God's creation of Her human person and nature at Her Conception in Her Mother's womb that began in the possession of His Image and culminated in Her being of the enhanced Divine Status, which came about by means of those gradual developments of the three stages explained above. Be mindful that the attainment of the last stage in Her unique pre-Redemption case was undertaken by the work of the Holy Spirit Himself.
Yet, the reaction of humans for such extraordinary benevolent gift of God proved to be contrary to the Divine Will, as was evidenced by the choice and act of Adam and Eve who preferred the evil guidelines, teaching and knowledge offered to them by the adversary of God rather than that offered to them by God their Creator Himself earlier. Ever since then, the general tendency of humans remained the same as their predecessors throughout the ages, up until the Conception and Birth of The Virgin Mary, and even to the present. This is, of course, with the exception of the Ethiopians who learn only from God through their inherent creation of Divinity and live accordingly in Ethiopia: The Kingdom of God.
While the rest of humanity elected to take that evil course of action and survival, only Ethiopians of the Holy Covenant, from the time of the repentant Adam and Eve, decisively preferred to lead the Divine Ordinance of the privileged Life. They continued to adhere to that preference through those singular personalities of the Faith of the Holy Covenant until the Advent of The Virgin Mary, the Ethiopian, and the Birth of The Incarnate God Jesus Christ from Her.
Based on the premises of the foregoing Divine Truth, we do not accept the Catholic Dogma of the "Immaculate Conception". For anyone who may tend to consider this Dogma, it is inevitable that certain serious and concomitant questions will ensue in his/her curious mind. These are, such as:
Why did the Gracious and Merciful God waited for 5, 500 years, according to our computation, to effect the Divine Benevolence that God bestowed and revealed upon The Virgin Mary on any one of the female human beings who were born after Eve up until the former?
And why did He simply prefer to see humanity fall into the crushing yoke of the reign of the Devil and allow His Creature in His Image to languish in and endure the unbearable misery under such condition for so long?

Source: Q&A http://www.ethkogserv.org/QandA.htm
« Last Edit: August 18, 2012, 09:11:23 AM by Enoch » Logged

Ethiopia Stretches Out Her Hands Unto God.   Ps. 67(68):31
Hiwot
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« Reply #1 on: August 18, 2012, 09:31:46 AM »

Enoch is neither a christian nor an Ethiopian orthodox Tewahedo Christian, nor an Ethiopian. he is one of those cults that have a fabricated self serving and fetishized view of Ethiopia and  the Orthodox Tewahedo Christians of Ethiopia. none of the above nut case view represents Ethiopian Orthodox Christianity. I hope the forum has a way of dealing with such blatant misrepresentation of one of the Oriental Orthodox Churches. Thank you.
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Only pray for me, that God would give me both inward and outward strength, that I may not only speak, but truly will; and that I may not merely be called a Christian, but really be found to be one. St.Ignatius of Antioch.Epistle to the Romans.
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« Reply #2 on: August 18, 2012, 10:44:58 AM »

This was split off from here:

http://www.orthodoxchristianity.net/forum/index.php/topic,46348.0.html
« Last Edit: August 18, 2012, 10:46:40 AM by Salpy » Logged

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« Reply #3 on: August 18, 2012, 10:47:31 AM »

Enoch is neither a christian nor an Ethiopian orthodox Tewahedo Christian, nor an Ethiopian. he is one of those cults that have a fabricated self serving and fetishized view of Ethiopia and  the Orthodox Tewahedo Christians of Ethiopia. none of the above nut case view represents Ethiopian Orthodox Christianity. I hope the forum has a way of dealing with such blatant misrepresentation of one of the Oriental Orthodox Churches. Thank you.

I second every word Hiwot said!
Enoch, you should differentiate your own interpretations from Orthodox teaching. You can't just write whatever crazy thought that crosses your mind and label with "We in Ethiopia". I am not sure if you're blatantly lying for whatever motive or you are just downright confused. Regardless, save your distorted interpretations to yourself.
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« Reply #4 on: August 18, 2012, 11:13:14 AM »

Enoch is neither a christian nor an Ethiopian orthodox Tewahedo Christian, nor an Ethiopian. he is one of those cults that have a fabricated self serving and fetishized view of Ethiopia and  the Orthodox Tewahedo Christians of Ethiopia. none of the above nut case view represents Ethiopian Orthodox Christianity. I hope the forum has a way of dealing with such blatant misrepresentation of one of the Oriental Orthodox Churches. Thank you.

May God forgive your corrupted thoughts.. This is our faith.
http://www.ethkogserv.org/faith_.htm

 
« Last Edit: August 18, 2012, 11:24:58 AM by Enoch » Logged

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« Reply #5 on: August 18, 2012, 11:25:14 AM »

Enoch is neither a christian nor an Ethiopian orthodox Tewahedo Christian, nor an Ethiopian. he is one of those cults that have a fabricated self serving and fetishized view of Ethiopia and  the Orthodox Tewahedo Christians of Ethiopia. none of the above nut case view represents Ethiopian Orthodox Christianity. I hope the forum has a way of dealing with such blatant misrepresentation of one of the Oriental Orthodox Churches. Thank you.

May God forgive your sickening mind. This is our faith.
http://www.ethkogserv.org/faith_.htm




 LOL!! ROL!

Enoch, you can advocate for your cult somewhere else, you can also have your faith in 'Ethiopia the kingdom of God' but you are not Christian, let alone an Orthodox Christian, so you can not talk for Ethiopian Orthodox Christians. you obviously are not Ethiopian as you have no clue as to what the Ethiopian Orthodox Church teaches, which unlike your assumptions that you can get away with disseminating your heretical views as that of the Church's to an ignorant audience, the Ethiopian Orthodox Church is a Church which has been around for two millennia and never once worshiped Mary as Divinity, nor have taught the other lunatic ideas you advocate in here. if it is a case of the blind leading the blind then may the Lord deliver you from both. but the World knows what  the Ethiopian Orthodox Tewahedo Church along with all her sister churches believes and teaches so take your lies somewhere else, where it will have the gullible ,egotistical,delusional audience it needs.

In Short take your cult and shove it where the sun does not shine! 

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To God be the Glory in all things! Amen!

Only pray for me, that God would give me both inward and outward strength, that I may not only speak, but truly will; and that I may not merely be called a Christian, but really be found to be one. St.Ignatius of Antioch.Epistle to the Romans.
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« Reply #6 on: August 18, 2012, 11:34:13 AM »

Enoch's views may be heretical, and as such they should be clearly and soundly refuted. The scriptures encourage us to defend sound doctrine and theological truth, but nowhere are we commanded to mock, disparage, ridicule, and humiliate our fellow man. Do you think that you will persuade Enoch to embrace our Orthodox Tewahedo Faith with such unloving and unchristian remarks?


"...speaking the truth in love..." [Ephesians 4:15]



Selam
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« Reply #7 on: August 18, 2012, 11:37:09 AM »

Enoch you aint the first nor the last to follow a cult and  attempt to call it Orthodox Christianity, do not be surprised if the Orthodox Christians call your BS for what it is.
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To God be the Glory in all things! Amen!

Only pray for me, that God would give me both inward and outward strength, that I may not only speak, but truly will; and that I may not merely be called a Christian, but really be found to be one. St.Ignatius of Antioch.Epistle to the Romans.
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« Reply #8 on: August 18, 2012, 11:42:38 AM »

Mr gebre, this is not the first time Enoch was here, he neither listens to a christian council nor to the Church therefore he is now knowingly against all advise advocating this same teaching he has been told not to, so he is anathema! and will be told how hateful his blasphemies are. but i say this for the benefit of the audience that might be confused by your insinuations not for your sake as you know perfectly all this but chose to have an amnesia of choice for the usual reasons.
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To God be the Glory in all things! Amen!

Only pray for me, that God would give me both inward and outward strength, that I may not only speak, but truly will; and that I may not merely be called a Christian, but really be found to be one. St.Ignatius of Antioch.Epistle to the Romans.
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« Reply #9 on: August 18, 2012, 11:45:36 AM »

and gebre, please do not waste your precious time in showing how pious you are in comparison to me, as you will have no opposition to the contrary in here. now I advise you follow your own advise and address each argument in here that he is using to blaspheme and scandalize the Ethiopian Orthodox Tewahedo church, thank you.
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To God be the Glory in all things! Amen!

Only pray for me, that God would give me both inward and outward strength, that I may not only speak, but truly will; and that I may not merely be called a Christian, but really be found to be one. St.Ignatius of Antioch.Epistle to the Romans.
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« Reply #10 on: August 18, 2012, 12:01:55 PM »

Jude 1
Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition (DRA)
1 Jude, the servant of Jesus Christ, and brother of James: to them that are beloved in God the Father, and preserved in Jesus Christ, and called.
2 Mercy unto you, and peace, and charity be fulfilled.
3 Dearly beloved, taking all care to write unto you concerning your common salvation, I was under a necessity to write unto you: to beseech you to contend earnestly for the faith once delivered to the saints.
4 For certain men are secretly entered in, (who were written of long ago unto this judgment,) ungodly men, turning the grace of our Lord God into riotousness, and denying the only sovereign Ruler, and our Lord Jesus Christ.
5 I will therefore admonish you, though ye once knew all things, that Jesus, having saved the people out of the land of Egypt, did afterwards destroy them that believed not:
6 And the angels who kept not their principality, but forsook their own habitation, he hath reserved under darkness in everlasting chains, unto the judgment of the great day.
7 As Sodom and Gomorrha, and the neighbouring cities, in like manner, having given themselves to fornication, and going after other flesh, were made an example, suffering the punishment of eternal fire.
8 In like manner these men also defile the flesh, and despise dominion, and blaspheme majesty.
9 When Michael the archangel, disputing with the devil, contended about the body of Moses, he durst not bring against him the judgment of railing speech, but said: The Lord command thee.
10 But these men blaspheme whatever things they know not: and what things soever they naturally know, like dumb beasts, in these they are corrupted.

11 Woe unto them, for they have gone in the way of Cain: and after the error of Balaam they have for reward poured out themselves, and have perished in the contradiction of Core.
12 These are spots in their banquets, feasting together without fear, feeding themselves, clouds without water, which are carried about by winds, trees of the autumn, unfruitful, twice dead, plucked up by the roots,
13 Raging waves of the sea, foaming out their own confusion; wandering stars, to whom the storm of darkness is reserved for ever.

14 Now of these Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied, saying: Behold, the Lord cometh with thousands of his saints,
15 To execute judgment upon all, and to reprove all the ungodly for all the works of their ungodliness, whereby they have done ungodly, and of all the hard things which ungodly sinners have spoken against God.
16 These are murmurers, full of complaints, walking according to their own desires, and their mouth speaketh proud things, admiring persons for gain's sake.
17 But you, my dearly beloved, be mindful of the words which have been spoken before by the apostles of our Lord Jesus Christ,
18 Who told you, that in the last time there should come mockers, walking according to their own desires in ungodlinesses.

19 These are they, who separate themselves, sensual men, having not the Spirit.
20 But you, my beloved, building yourselves upon you most holy faith, praying in the Holy Ghost,
21 Keep yourselves in the love of God, waiting for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ, unto life everlasting.
22 And some indeed reprove, being judged:
23 But others save, pulling them out of the fire. And on others have mercy, in fear, hating also the spotted garment which is carnal.

24 Now to him who is able to preserve you without sin, and to present you spotless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy, in the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ,
25 To the only God our Saviour through Jesus Christ our Lord, be glory and magnificence, empire and power, before all ages, and now, and for all ages of ages. Amen.




« Last Edit: August 18, 2012, 12:33:57 PM by Hiwot » Logged

To God be the Glory in all things! Amen!

Only pray for me, that God would give me both inward and outward strength, that I may not only speak, but truly will; and that I may not merely be called a Christian, but really be found to be one. St.Ignatius of Antioch.Epistle to the Romans.
Gebre Menfes Kidus
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« Reply #11 on: August 18, 2012, 12:41:33 PM »

Mr gebre, this is not the first time Enoch was here, he neither listens to a christian council nor to the Church therefore he is now knowingly against all advise advocating this same teaching he has been told not to, so he is anathema! and will be told how hateful his blasphemies are. but i say this for the benefit of the audience that might be confused by your insinuations not for your sake as you know perfectly all this but chose to have an amnesia of choice for the usual reasons.


Are you "...speaking the truth in love..." [Ephesians 4:15] ?



Selam
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« Reply #12 on: August 18, 2012, 01:11:17 PM »

Mr gebre, this is not the first time Enoch was here, he neither listens to a christian council nor to the Church therefore he is now knowingly against all advise advocating this same teaching he has been told not to, so he is anathema! and will be told how hateful his blasphemies are. but i say this for the benefit of the audience that might be confused by your insinuations not for your sake as you know perfectly all this but chose to have an amnesia of choice for the usual reasons.


Are you "...speaking the truth in love..." [Ephesians 4:15] ?



Selam


what did the Lord say about those who do not listen to the Church? hm? why does the church have anathema? is it because she is against speaking the truth in love? Enoch has been told before today about the Truth in Love and he remains adamant not only in his heretical and blasphemous ways but also in lying against the Orthodox Faith and the Orthodox Church. so therefore.....

I will let St. Jude speak for me.. as I have run out of words to express what needs to be said  Grin his ilusterous words are enough to say what I Want to say about those who knowingly blapspheme the Name of God and His Saints and refuse to listen to the council of the Orthodox Church.

10 But these men blaspheme whatever things they know not: and what things soever they naturally know, like dumb beasts, in these they are corrupted.
11 Woe unto them, for they have gone in the way of Cain: and after the error of Balaam they have for reward poured out themselves, and have perished in the contradiction of Core.
12 These are spots in their banquets, feasting together without fear, feeding themselves, clouds without water, which are carried about by winds, trees of the autumn, unfruitful, twice dead, plucked up by the roots,
13 Raging waves of the sea, foaming out their own confusion; wandering stars, to whom the storm of darkness is reserved for ever.


I can bring st Paul also to compare them to dogs and pigs  but I am sure St. Jude tells it like it is so its enough. laugh

so is the apostle too harsh for you when he calls cult following heretics twice dead? tough!
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To God be the Glory in all things! Amen!

Only pray for me, that God would give me both inward and outward strength, that I may not only speak, but truly will; and that I may not merely be called a Christian, but really be found to be one. St.Ignatius of Antioch.Epistle to the Romans.
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« Reply #13 on: August 18, 2012, 01:17:13 PM »

and gebre, please do not waste your precious time in showing how pious you are in comparison to me, as you will have no opposition to the contrary in here. now I advise you follow your own advise and address each argument in here that he is using to blaspheme and scandalize the Ethiopian Orthodox Tewahedo church, thank you.

Mr Gebre, how about this hmm? how about addressing his arguments? I hope you do not plan to send him that ' be happy because Jesus Christ is black and his hair is nappy' video as your approved expression of orthodoxy...

it will be twice tragic for him to move from one cult to another equally fatal.
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Only pray for me, that God would give me both inward and outward strength, that I may not only speak, but truly will; and that I may not merely be called a Christian, but really be found to be one. St.Ignatius of Antioch.Epistle to the Romans.
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« Reply #14 on: August 18, 2012, 01:36:34 PM »

and gebre, please do not waste your precious time in showing how pious you are in comparison to me, as you will have no opposition to the contrary in here. now I advise you follow your own advise and address each argument in here that he is using to blaspheme and scandalize the Ethiopian Orthodox Tewahedo church, thank you.

Mr Gebre, how about this hmm? how about addressing his arguments? I hope you do not plan to send him that ' be happy because Jesus Christ is black and his hair is nappy' video as your approved expression of orthodoxy...

it will be twice tragic for him to move from one cult to another equally fatal.

According to our Ethiopian Tradition, Melke-Zedeq and N'guse-Salem are dual TITLES each with two combined Ge'ez words whose meaning is: The True King or The Righteous King, and King of Peace or The King of Jerusalem, bestowed upon the Priest of God whose name was "Ethiopis", our First Atsie, i.e. Elect of God, from whose name the designation of "Ethiopia" and Ethiopian" derived. (Ge'ez, claimed to be the dialect of Adam and Eve, is our original and primordial, classical and liturgical language still effectively in use by Ethiopians.)

The Three distinguished Melke-Zedeqs mentioned in the Ethiopian Tradition and in Scriptures are:
The First One was the contemporary of Noah from whom he, i.e., the First Melke-Zedeq inherited personally the Sacred Heritage of the Holy Covenants that Adam and Eve as well as that which Noah himself had made with God, and who became the first Ethiopian custodian of the same, and the Founder and Sovereign of the City of Jerusalem;
The Intermediate One was the contemporary of Abraham by whom the latter (Abraham) was blessed;
And The Last and The Eternal one was Our Lord Jesus Christ Himself, whose predecessors including the above two were all about whom the Psalmist of Ps. 110 and the Writer of the Epistle to the Hebrews chapters 5-7 related.

It is narrated in the Bible that the three sons of Noah: Shem, Ham and Japheth along with their respective offspring partitioned the Earth, separated themselves from each other and were dispersed throughout its expanses. This process developed to such an extent that it finally culminated in classifying each one of the three sons of Noah, as the ancestor and father of the branch of humanity whose descendants, in their racial identity and skin colour, became to be known: those of Shem, as Semites and "Reds" or "Yellows", those of Ham, as Hamites and "Blacks", and those of Japheth, as Japhetites and "Whites" respectively. (Gen. 10)

While this reality still remains the actual state of affairs of human experiences even today, the Divine Will to preserve the unity of humanity and the assurance of its continuity after Noah was effected by the birth of Ethiopis from the fusion of the selected seeds of the three races through intermarriages of the same. With the nucleus seed of the offspring of Ham united with the seeds of the offspring of Shem and Japheth produced "Ethiopis", the First Melke-Zedeq.

Here is the elaborate line and link of the tripartite racial union brought about through the intermarriage that had begotten the unique person named Ethiopis who was destined to be the precursor of Our Lord Jesus Christ, possessing the Three Graces God bestowed upon human beings He created in His Image: Divine Birth, Priesthood and Kingship: On the first lineage, one of the elder sons of Ham married one of the elder daughters of Shem, and begot sons and daughters. On the second lineage, one of the younger sons of Ham married one of the daughters of Japheth, and begot sons and daughters. On the third lineage, the eldest grand son of Ham and Shem married the eldest grand daughter of Ham and Japheth and begot a son. And that son who was begotten from these grand children of two quarters of the seed of Ham, and one quarter of that of Shem and of that of Japheth each, is Ethiopis, the First Melke-Zedeq.

Let us all pray for the inspiration and guidance of the Holy Spirit in all our individual lives, professions and ventures.

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« Reply #15 on: August 18, 2012, 02:00:21 PM »

Enoch if I have wanted to read that website I would have , without you copy pasting it for me here. you are free to believe what you want, but as you very well know that as it stands what you and that website advocates is Not the Faith of the Ethiopian Orthodox Tewahedo Church.
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Only pray for me, that God would give me both inward and outward strength, that I may not only speak, but truly will; and that I may not merely be called a Christian, but really be found to be one. St.Ignatius of Antioch.Epistle to the Romans.
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« Reply #16 on: August 18, 2012, 03:36:02 PM »

Mr gebre, this is not the first time Enoch was here, he neither listens to a christian council nor to the Church therefore he is now knowingly against all advise advocating this same teaching he has been told not to, so he is anathema! and will be told how hateful his blasphemies are. but i say this for the benefit of the audience that might be confused by your insinuations not for your sake as you know perfectly all this but chose to have an amnesia of choice for the usual reasons.


Are you "...speaking the truth in love..." [Ephesians 4:15] ?



Selam


what did the Lord say about those who do not listen to the Church? hm? why does the church have anathema? is it because she is against speaking the truth in love? Enoch has been told before today about the Truth in Love and he remains adamant not only in his heretical and blasphemous ways but also in lying against the Orthodox Faith and the Orthodox Church. so therefore.....

I will let St. Jude speak for me.. as I have run out of words to express what needs to be said  Grin his ilusterous words are enough to say what I Want to say about those who knowingly blapspheme the Name of God and His Saints and refuse to listen to the council of the Orthodox Church.

10 But these men blaspheme whatever things they know not: and what things soever they naturally know, like dumb beasts, in these they are corrupted.
11 Woe unto them, for they have gone in the way of Cain: and after the error of Balaam they have for reward poured out themselves, and have perished in the contradiction of Core.
12 These are spots in their banquets, feasting together without fear, feeding themselves, clouds without water, which are carried about by winds, trees of the autumn, unfruitful, twice dead, plucked up by the roots,
13 Raging waves of the sea, foaming out their own confusion; wandering stars, to whom the storm of darkness is reserved for ever.


I can bring st Paul also to compare them to dogs and pigs  but I am sure St. Jude tells it like it is so its enough. laugh

so is the apostle too harsh for you when he calls cult following heretics twice dead? tough!


Let the apostles, Bishops, and Priests do the anathematizing sister. We are humble servants of the Church, and our responsibility is to speak the truth in love (as I have reiterated previously.) No need to sugarcoat the truth, but the problem is that the truth you do speak is infused with so much of your own venom that you burn up the wheat with the tares. You can spot a heretic under every rock, but try looking for Christ in your neighbor. Sometimes the problem is not so much the villain as it is our vision. But our perspective is always skewed when we ignore the beam in our own eye while searching for the speck in our brother's.


Selam


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« Reply #17 on: August 18, 2012, 04:04:59 PM »

Mr gebre, this is not the first time Enoch was here, he neither listens to a christian council nor to the Church therefore he is now knowingly against all advise advocating this same teaching he has been told not to, so he is anathema! and will be told how hateful his blasphemies are. but i say this for the benefit of the audience that might be confused by your insinuations not for your sake as you know perfectly all this but chose to have an amnesia of choice for the usual reasons.


Are you "...speaking the truth in love..." [Ephesians 4:15] ?



Selam


what did the Lord say about those who do not listen to the Church? hm? why does the church have anathema? is it because she is against speaking the truth in love? Enoch has been told before today about the Truth in Love and he remains adamant not only in his heretical and blasphemous ways but also in lying against the Orthodox Faith and the Orthodox Church. so therefore.....

I will let St. Jude speak for me.. as I have run out of words to express what needs to be said  Grin his ilusterous words are enough to say what I Want to say about those who knowingly blapspheme the Name of God and His Saints and refuse to listen to the council of the Orthodox Church.

10 But these men blaspheme whatever things they know not: and what things soever they naturally know, like dumb beasts, in these they are corrupted.
11 Woe unto them, for they have gone in the way of Cain: and after the error of Balaam they have for reward poured out themselves, and have perished in the contradiction of Core.
12 These are spots in their banquets, feasting together without fear, feeding themselves, clouds without water, which are carried about by winds, trees of the autumn, unfruitful, twice dead, plucked up by the roots,
13 Raging waves of the sea, foaming out their own confusion; wandering stars, to whom the storm of darkness is reserved for ever.


I can bring st Paul also to compare them to dogs and pigs  but I am sure St. Jude tells it like it is so its enough. laugh

so is the apostle too harsh for you when he calls cult following heretics twice dead? tough!


Let the apostles, Bishops, and Priests do the anathematizing sister. We are humble servants of the Church, and our responsibility is to speak the truth in love (as I have reiterated previously.) No need to sugarcoat the truth, but the problem is that the truth you do speak is infused with so much of your own venom that you burn up the wheat with the tares. You can spot a heretic under every rock, but try looking for Christ in your neighbor. Sometimes the problem is not so much the villain as it is our vision. But our perspective is always skewed when we ignore the beam in our own eye while searching for the speck in our brother's.


Selam




oh then you have no idea that the Faithful can anathemise as well as they can say'worthy' it is what the apostles have entrusted us all the faithful to watch and be vigilant against those heresies that come from within and with out, be it an angel or a man , whoever teaches a different Gospel and calls it the Truth , let him be anathema!

as to seeing heretics everywhere, read what St.Jude have said again. I do not need to fabricate an imaginary heretic, when the heretic insists on being acknowledged as Orthodox. it is those who deny the heresy in the name of false love that will answer to the One who will hold them accountable for the blood of those they appeased and affirmed in their fatalistic ways.Still, The Truth does not depend on your or mine personal holiness. so again stop with the personal holiness rhetoric ,  The Creed of the Orthodox Faith is what is the issue here not what he or me has done personally or have failed to do.

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To God be the Glory in all things! Amen!

Only pray for me, that God would give me both inward and outward strength, that I may not only speak, but truly will; and that I may not merely be called a Christian, but really be found to be one. St.Ignatius of Antioch.Epistle to the Romans.
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« Reply #18 on: August 18, 2012, 04:18:05 PM »

FYI  what the none clergy faithful do in Ethiopia , both male and female, when they see something that is heretical or henous being done by someone who claimed to be Orthodox  . they say : be maeteb meseqele, bemehayem qale gezechalehu , awegezihalehu/ with the cross of my baptism with my uneducated tongue I bind you/ anathema. those who have seen the power of that anathema know what I am talking about, it has power to immobilize the most enraged person. or gets the unrepentant heretic kicked out of the church.
« Last Edit: August 18, 2012, 04:19:34 PM by Hiwot » Logged

To God be the Glory in all things! Amen!

Only pray for me, that God would give me both inward and outward strength, that I may not only speak, but truly will; and that I may not merely be called a Christian, but really be found to be one. St.Ignatius of Antioch.Epistle to the Romans.
Gebre Menfes Kidus
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« Reply #19 on: August 18, 2012, 04:18:31 PM »

Mr gebre, this is not the first time Enoch was here, he neither listens to a christian council nor to the Church therefore he is now knowingly against all advise advocating this same teaching he has been told not to, so he is anathema! and will be told how hateful his blasphemies are. but i say this for the benefit of the audience that might be confused by your insinuations not for your sake as you know perfectly all this but chose to have an amnesia of choice for the usual reasons.


Are you "...speaking the truth in love..." [Ephesians 4:15] ?



Selam


what did the Lord say about those who do not listen to the Church? hm? why does the church have anathema? is it because she is against speaking the truth in love? Enoch has been told before today about the Truth in Love and he remains adamant not only in his heretical and blasphemous ways but also in lying against the Orthodox Faith and the Orthodox Church. so therefore.....

I will let St. Jude speak for me.. as I have run out of words to express what needs to be said  Grin his ilusterous words are enough to say what I Want to say about those who knowingly blapspheme the Name of God and His Saints and refuse to listen to the council of the Orthodox Church.

10 But these men blaspheme whatever things they know not: and what things soever they naturally know, like dumb beasts, in these they are corrupted.
11 Woe unto them, for they have gone in the way of Cain: and after the error of Balaam they have for reward poured out themselves, and have perished in the contradiction of Core.
12 These are spots in their banquets, feasting together without fear, feeding themselves, clouds without water, which are carried about by winds, trees of the autumn, unfruitful, twice dead, plucked up by the roots,
13 Raging waves of the sea, foaming out their own confusion; wandering stars, to whom the storm of darkness is reserved for ever.


I can bring st Paul also to compare them to dogs and pigs  but I am sure St. Jude tells it like it is so its enough. laugh

so is the apostle too harsh for you when he calls cult following heretics twice dead? tough!


Let the apostles, Bishops, and Priests do the anathematizing sister. We are humble servants of the Church, and our responsibility is to speak the truth in love (as I have reiterated previously.) No need to sugarcoat the truth, but the problem is that the truth you do speak is infused with so much of your own venom that you burn up the wheat with the tares. You can spot a heretic under every rock, but try looking for Christ in your neighbor. Sometimes the problem is not so much the villain as it is our vision. But our perspective is always skewed when we ignore the beam in our own eye while searching for the speck in our brother's.


Selam




oh then you have no idea that the Faithful can anathemise as well as they can say'worthy' it is what the apostles have entrusted us all the faithful to watch and be vigilant against those heresies that come from within and with out, be it an angel or a man , whoever teaches a different Gospel and calls it the Truth , let him be anathema!

as to seeing heretics everywhere, read what St.Jude have said again. I do not need to fabricate an imaginary heretic, when the heretic insists on being acknowledged as Orthodox. it is those who deny the heresy in the name of false love that will answer to the One who will hold them accountable for the blood of those they appeased and affirmed in their fatalistic ways.Still, The Truth does not depend on your or mine personal holiness. so again stop with the personal holiness rhetoric ,  The Creed of the Orthodox Faith is what is the issue here not what he or me has done personally or have failed to do.




2 + 2 = ?


Selam
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« Reply #20 on: August 18, 2012, 04:25:03 PM »

yes its that simple, you see an unrepentant heretic misleading others claiming to be preaching the faith of the apostles you follow along and cuddle him or you read him the anathema. that anathema that has already been said by the Apostles, the Bishops and the Priests.

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To God be the Glory in all things! Amen!

Only pray for me, that God would give me both inward and outward strength, that I may not only speak, but truly will; and that I may not merely be called a Christian, but really be found to be one. St.Ignatius of Antioch.Epistle to the Romans.
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« Reply #21 on: August 18, 2012, 04:29:24 PM »

when the Orthodox say Christ is Risen, they really mean it, it means that Christ who have died to save us LIVES and our lives are now Lived in that Truth that Transform us. there is no place for demonic philosophy in the Orthodox Faith.
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To God be the Glory in all things! Amen!

Only pray for me, that God would give me both inward and outward strength, that I may not only speak, but truly will; and that I may not merely be called a Christian, but really be found to be one. St.Ignatius of Antioch.Epistle to the Romans.
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« Reply #22 on: August 18, 2012, 04:38:20 PM »

when the Orthodox say Christ is Risen, they really mean it, it means that Christ who have died to save us LIVES and our lives are now Lived in that Truth that Transform us. there is no place for demonic philosophy in the Orthodox Faith.

You keep preaching to the choir sister. Christ doesn't need you to be His whip.

BTW, I'm waiting on your answer here: 2 + 2 = ?


Selam
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« Reply #23 on: August 18, 2012, 04:49:29 PM »

here is a simple answer for you, if your children were told that their mother is cheating on their father, I sure hope that they will defend her honor and not say let our father come and defend her while we cuddle the liar and slanderer who knowingly fabricated the lie and is assassinating her character. that is your answer to that equation. where is your answer to my request of you following your advise and addressing his heretical views with your Christian ones? hm? instead of the usual circular argument you seem to harp on against all the evidence of scripture and warning of the Apostles you seem to want to take your own philosophy of high regard than them I am not you. If my Church and my Faith is intentionally blasphemed and slandered then I will follow the advise of the apostles and anathemise those who have separated themselves with thier own action.

so I am done with your personal holiness contest ....though art holier than me! I hope you are quite satisfied with that.


Ta ta!
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To God be the Glory in all things! Amen!

Only pray for me, that God would give me both inward and outward strength, that I may not only speak, but truly will; and that I may not merely be called a Christian, but really be found to be one. St.Ignatius of Antioch.Epistle to the Romans.
Gebre Menfes Kidus
"SERVANT of The HOLY SPIRIT"
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« Reply #24 on: August 18, 2012, 05:35:06 PM »

here is a simple answer for you, if your children were told that their mother is cheating on their father, I sure hope that they will defend her honor and not say let our father come and defend her while we cuddle the liar and slanderer who knowingly fabricated the lie and is assassinating her character. that is your answer to that equation. where is your answer to my request of you following your advise and addressing his heretical views with your Christian ones? hm? instead of the usual circular argument you seem to harp on against all the evidence of scripture and warning of the Apostles you seem to want to take your own philosophy of high regard than them I am not you. If my Church and my Faith is intentionally blasphemed and slandered then I will follow the advise of the apostles and anathemise those who have separated themselves with thier own action.

so I am done with your personal holiness contest ....though art holier than me! I hope you are quite satisfied with that.


Ta ta!

 I love you sister.


Selam
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« Reply #25 on: August 18, 2012, 05:37:32 PM »

here is a simple answer for you, if your children were told that their mother is cheating on their father, I sure hope that they will defend her honor and not say let our father come and defend her while we cuddle the liar and slanderer who knowingly fabricated the lie and is assassinating her character. that is your answer to that equation. where is your answer to my request of you following your advise and addressing his heretical views with your Christian ones? hm? instead of the usual circular argument you seem to harp on against all the evidence of scripture and warning of the Apostles you seem to want to take your own philosophy of high regard than them I am not you. If my Church and my Faith is intentionally blasphemed and slandered then I will follow the advise of the apostles and anathemise those who have separated themselves with thier own action.

so I am done with your personal holiness contest ....though art holier than me! I hope you are quite satisfied with that.


Ta ta!

 I love you sister.


Selam

Bless your heart! your are so precious!
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To God be the Glory in all things! Amen!

Only pray for me, that God would give me both inward and outward strength, that I may not only speak, but truly will; and that I may not merely be called a Christian, but really be found to be one. St.Ignatius of Antioch.Epistle to the Romans.
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« Reply #26 on: August 18, 2012, 07:29:56 PM »

when the Orthodox say Christ is Risen, they really mean it, it means that Christ who have died to save us LIVES and our lives are now Lived in that Truth that Transform us. there is no place for demonic philosophy in the Orthodox Faith.

You keep preaching to the choir sister. Christ doesn't need you to be His whip.

BTW, I'm waiting on your answer here: 2 + 2 = ?


Selam

It's simple the answer is 4.  I think Hiwot is not an Ethiopian.  She/He is the one spreading Heresy.
I am not good writher but i can make my point.  May God bless you for your humbleness Gebre Menfes Kidus.
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Ethiopia Stretches Out Her Hands Unto God.   Ps. 67(68):31
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