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Author Topic: Discussion on Saudis releasing Ethiopians arrested for praying in home  (Read 1482 times) Average Rating: 0
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HabteSelassie
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« on: August 07, 2012, 01:25:53 AM »

Greetings in that Divine and Most Precious Name of Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ!

I'm glad they were released.  I recall hearing about it when they were arrested, and I was afraid nothing could be done to help them.


Quote
Almost three dozen imprisoned Christian Ethiopians in Saudi Arabia have been freed after months of being held by the authorities there.

The 35 Ethiopians were imprisoned last December 17 for conducting a prayer meeting in a private home.

“We understand that the Saudi’s assaulted, harassed, and pressured the Christians to convert to Islam during the time of their incarceration,” says International Christian Concern’s Jonathan Racho.  According to Racho, the female prisoners were especially mistreated and humiliated.

Read the rest here:

http://theorthodoxchurch.info/blog/news/2012/08/saudis-release-christians/

A) the Saudis are more pragmatic than vindictive, and they have multi-BILLION investments in Ethiopia to protect

B) there are well over three dozen political prisoners in Ethiopia today are Orthodox Christians, so it goes both ways Sad

Aside from the political griping, this indeed wonderful news, when we were discussing this a few months back I felt confident in the Spirit that these folks would be released, because again, the Saudis have been pandering a bit of favor from Ethiopia. While Ethiopia may not have a lot of money by international standards, regionally, they have a huge amount of clout, which is why to this day the AU is seated in Addis Ababa where HIM Haile Selassie founded it as the OAU just over 50 years ago.  

In regards to (A), the release of these prisoners was as predictable as it was agreeably miraculous (indeed all praises to God!) and to (B), let us pray for ALL Christians experiencing persecution across the world.

stay blessed,
habte selassie
« Last Edit: August 07, 2012, 01:26:16 AM by HabteSelassie » Logged

"Yet stand aloof from stupid questionings and geneologies and strifes and fightings about law, for they are without benefit and vain." Titus 3:10
Hiwot
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« Reply #1 on: August 07, 2012, 06:08:04 AM »

Greetings in that Divine and Most Precious Name of Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ!

I'm glad they were released.  I recall hearing about it when they were arrested, and I was afraid nothing could be done to help them.


Quote
Almost three dozen imprisoned Christian Ethiopians in Saudi Arabia have been freed after months of being held by the authorities there.

The 35 Ethiopians were imprisoned last December 17 for conducting a prayer meeting in a private home.

“We understand that the Saudi’s assaulted, harassed, and pressured the Christians to convert to Islam during the time of their incarceration,” says International Christian Concern’s Jonathan Racho.  According to Racho, the female prisoners were especially mistreated and humiliated.

Read the rest here:

http://theorthodoxchurch.info/blog/news/2012/08/saudis-release-christians/

A) the Saudis are more pragmatic than vindictive, and they have multi-BILLION investments in Ethiopia to protect

B) there are well over three dozen political prisoners in Ethiopia today are Orthodox Christians, so it goes both ways Sad

Aside from the political griping, this indeed wonderful news, when we were discussing this a few months back I felt confident in the Spirit that these folks would be released, because again, the Saudis have been pandering a bit of favor from Ethiopia. While Ethiopia may not have a lot of money by international standards, regionally, they have a huge amount of clout, which is why to this day the AU is seated in Addis Ababa where HIM Haile Selassie founded it as the OAU just over 50 years ago.  

In regards to (A), the release of these prisoners was as predictable as it was agreeably miraculous (indeed all praises to God!) and to (B), let us pray for ALL Christians experiencing persecution across the world.

stay blessed,
habte selassie



I am quite impressed by your educated analysis of events, sociopolitical, and historical awareness, which only leads me to extrapolate that the klan and those with similar ideology were being quite pragmatic and not vindictive, when they brutalized and tortured the blacks, so long as they did not kill them. After all they do need them for economical interest.  If there is an economic connection that must translate into friendship and love of course those occasional torture, brutality and killing are simply unfortunate hiccups that get in the way of the good intentions of those pragmatic and none vindictive folks. Quite brilliant analysis I say!

Is the current government of Ethiopia i.e. EPRDF even a Christian institution let alone an Orthodox Christian one? That you would compare religious persecution with a political persecution, unless of course you do  know  and acknowledge that to the Saudis religion and politics are one and the same ideology therefore in order to create a fictitious similarity between the religious political ideology in Saudi and the atheistic politics of EPRDF you mention the people of different religious confessions who are prisoners of an atheist political party with those who are imprisoned for their peaceful religious practices by a Theocracy. I have to congratulate you for your continual brilliant attempt to create if not an effective apology for Islamic brutality at least one that attempts to take the focus off of it. Quite impressive! Applause! Applause!


what better way to end it than with a prayer for All Christians that are being persecuted by the number one active christian persecutor which shall remain unnamed. this takes the cake! superb!
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Only pray for me, that God would give me both inward and outward strength, that I may not only speak, but truly will; and that I may not merely be called a Christian, but really be found to be one. St.Ignatius of Antioch.Epistle to the Romans.
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« Reply #2 on: August 07, 2012, 08:50:14 AM »


Dear Salpi, the Ethiopian Christians were not released, rather deported for refusing to accept the diabolic cult, Islam. Besides, their inhuman treatment and sufferings in the Saudi prison was known to the international community. There are still thousands of Ethiopians, Filipinos etc languishing in Saudi prisons just for being Christians.

I am pretty confident soon the poor Ethiopians will destroy the sodomite Saudis. May they all go to hell!
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Balthasar
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« Reply #3 on: August 07, 2012, 09:02:30 AM »

Greetings in that Divine and Most Precious Name of Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ!

I'm glad they were released.  I recall hearing about it when they were arrested, and I was afraid nothing could be done to help them.


Quote
Almost three dozen imprisoned Christian Ethiopians in Saudi Arabia have been freed after months of being held by the authorities there.

The 35 Ethiopians were imprisoned last December 17 for conducting a prayer meeting in a private home.

“We understand that the Saudi’s assaulted, harassed, and pressured the Christians to convert to Islam during the time of their incarceration,” says International Christian Concern’s Jonathan Racho.  According to Racho, the female prisoners were especially mistreated and humiliated.

Read the rest here:

http://theorthodoxchurch.info/blog/news/2012/08/saudis-release-christians/

A) the Saudis are more pragmatic than vindictive, and they have multi-BILLION investments in Ethiopia to protect

B) there are well over three dozen political prisoners in Ethiopia today are Orthodox Christians, so it goes both ways Sad

Aside from the political griping, this indeed wonderful news, when we were discussing this a few months back I felt confident in the Spirit that these folks would be released, because again, the Saudis have been pandering a bit of favor from Ethiopia. While Ethiopia may not have a lot of money by international standards, regionally, they have a huge amount of clout, which is why to this day the AU is seated in Addis Ababa where HIM Haile Selassie founded it as the OAU just over 50 years ago.  

In regards to (A), the release of these prisoners was as predictable as it was agreeably miraculous (indeed all praises to God!) and to (B), let us pray for ALL Christians experiencing persecution across the world.

stay blessed,
habte selassie



I am quite impressed by your educated analysis of events, sociopolitical, and historical awareness, which only leads me to extrapolate that the klan and those with similar ideology were being quite pragmatic and not vindictive, when they brutalized and tortured the blacks, so long as they did not kill them. After all they do need them for economical interest.  If there is an economic connection that must translate into friendship and love of course those occasional torture, brutality and killing are simply unfortunate hiccups that get in the way of the good intentions of those pragmatic and none vindictive folks. Quite brilliant analysis I say!

Is the current government of Ethiopia i.e. EPRDF even a Christian institution let alone an Orthodox Christian one? That you would compare religious persecution with a political persecution, unless of course you do  know  and acknowledge that to the Saudis religion and politics are one and the same ideology therefore in order to create a fictitious similarity between the religious political ideology in Saudi and the atheistic politics of EPRDF you mention the people of different religious confessions who are prisoners of an atheist political party with those who are imprisoned for their peaceful religious practices by a Theocracy. I have to congratulate you for your continual brilliant attempt to create if not an effective apology for Islamic brutality at least one that attempts to take the focus off of it. Quite impressive! Applause! Applause!


what better way to end it than with a prayer for All Christians that are being persecuted by the number one active christian persecutor which shall remain unnamed. this takes the cake! superb!

Nice response, Hiwot!

@Habte

I was trying to defend you on the other thread when some of the participants raised up their voices because of the Catholic Icon. Well, you don't seem to get it when things get to the Muslim Zombies, do you? Do you actually know that the Muslims in Ethiopia were the loudest folks to celebrate the Emperor Haile Selassie's deposition on September 12, 1974? There is a video that shows them celebrating at the main Market (Mercato) in Addis. Do you know that Muslim Ethiopians hate Ethiopian Kings and Emperors because they were Christians and defenders of Christian Ethiopia from barbaric Arabs? Believe me ወንድም, you will never be a true Christian, an Orthodox Tewahedo Christian, until you denounce and hate Islam። (four points)



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sheenj
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St. Gregorios of Parumala, pray for us...


« Reply #4 on: August 07, 2012, 10:07:57 AM »

Greetings in that Divine and Most Precious Name of Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ!

I'm glad they were released.  I recall hearing about it when they were arrested, and I was afraid nothing could be done to help them.


Quote
Almost three dozen imprisoned Christian Ethiopians in Saudi Arabia have been freed after months of being held by the authorities there.

The 35 Ethiopians were imprisoned last December 17 for conducting a prayer meeting in a private home.

“We understand that the Saudi’s assaulted, harassed, and pressured the Christians to convert to Islam during the time of their incarceration,” says International Christian Concern’s Jonathan Racho.  According to Racho, the female prisoners were especially mistreated and humiliated.

Read the rest here:

http://theorthodoxchurch.info/blog/news/2012/08/saudis-release-christians/

A) the Saudis are more pragmatic than vindictive, and they have multi-BILLION investments in Ethiopia to protect

B) there are well over three dozen political prisoners in Ethiopia today are Orthodox Christians, so it goes both ways Sad

Aside from the political griping, this indeed wonderful news, when we were discussing this a few months back I felt confident in the Spirit that these folks would be released, because again, the Saudis have been pandering a bit of favor from Ethiopia. While Ethiopia may not have a lot of money by international standards, regionally, they have a huge amount of clout, which is why to this day the AU is seated in Addis Ababa where HIM Haile Selassie founded it as the OAU just over 50 years ago.  

In regards to (A), the release of these prisoners was as predictable as it was agreeably miraculous (indeed all praises to God!) and to (B), let us pray for ALL Christians experiencing persecution across the world.

stay blessed,
habte selassie



I am quite impressed by your educated analysis of events, sociopolitical, and historical awareness, which only leads me to extrapolate that the klan and those with similar ideology were being quite pragmatic and not vindictive, when they brutalized and tortured the blacks, so long as they did not kill them. After all they do need them for economical interest.  If there is an economic connection that must translate into friendship and love of course those occasional torture, brutality and killing are simply unfortunate hiccups that get in the way of the good intentions of those pragmatic and none vindictive folks. Quite brilliant analysis I say!

Is the current government of Ethiopia i.e. EPRDF even a Christian institution let alone an Orthodox Christian one? That you would compare religious persecution with a political persecution, unless of course you do  know  and acknowledge that to the Saudis religion and politics are one and the same ideology therefore in order to create a fictitious similarity between the religious political ideology in Saudi and the atheistic politics of EPRDF you mention the people of different religious confessions who are prisoners of an atheist political party with those who are imprisoned for their peaceful religious practices by a Theocracy. I have to congratulate you for your continual brilliant attempt to create if not an effective apology for Islamic brutality at least one that attempts to take the focus off of it. Quite impressive! Applause! Applause!


what better way to end it than with a prayer for All Christians that are being persecuted by the number one active christian persecutor which shall remain unnamed. this takes the cake! superb!

Nice response, Hiwot!

@Habte

I was trying to defend you on the other thread when some of the participants raised up their voices because of the Catholic Icon. Well, you don't seem to get it when things get to the Muslim Zombies, do you? Do you actually know that the Muslims in Ethiopia were the loudest folks to celebrate the Emperor Haile Selassie's deposition on September 12, 1974? There is a video that shows them celebrating at the main Market (Mercato) in Addis. Do you know that Muslim Ethiopians hate Ethiopian Kings and Emperors because they were Christians and defenders of Christian Ethiopia from barbaric Arabs? Believe me ወንድም, you will never be a true Christian, an Orthodox Tewahedo Christian, until you denounce and hate Islam። (four points)




Really? Hatred of others is now Orthodox Dogma? I understand that some of their actions are upsetting but as Orthodox Christians we should always respond with love and not hatred.
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PeterTheAleut
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Lord, have mercy on the Christians in Mosul!


« Reply #5 on: August 07, 2012, 10:15:22 AM »

Greetings in that Divine and Most Precious Name of Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ!

I'm glad they were released.  I recall hearing about it when they were arrested, and I was afraid nothing could be done to help them.


Quote
Almost three dozen imprisoned Christian Ethiopians in Saudi Arabia have been freed after months of being held by the authorities there.

The 35 Ethiopians were imprisoned last December 17 for conducting a prayer meeting in a private home.

“We understand that the Saudi’s assaulted, harassed, and pressured the Christians to convert to Islam during the time of their incarceration,” says International Christian Concern’s Jonathan Racho.  According to Racho, the female prisoners were especially mistreated and humiliated.

Read the rest here:

http://theorthodoxchurch.info/blog/news/2012/08/saudis-release-christians/

A) the Saudis are more pragmatic than vindictive, and they have multi-BILLION investments in Ethiopia to protect

B) there are well over three dozen political prisoners in Ethiopia today are Orthodox Christians, so it goes both ways Sad

Aside from the political griping, this indeed wonderful news, when we were discussing this a few months back I felt confident in the Spirit that these folks would be released, because again, the Saudis have been pandering a bit of favor from Ethiopia. While Ethiopia may not have a lot of money by international standards, regionally, they have a huge amount of clout, which is why to this day the AU is seated in Addis Ababa where HIM Haile Selassie founded it as the OAU just over 50 years ago.  

In regards to (A), the release of these prisoners was as predictable as it was agreeably miraculous (indeed all praises to God!) and to (B), let us pray for ALL Christians experiencing persecution across the world.

stay blessed,
habte selassie



I am quite impressed by your educated analysis of events, sociopolitical, and historical awareness, which only leads me to extrapolate that the klan and those with similar ideology were being quite pragmatic and not vindictive, when they brutalized and tortured the blacks, so long as they did not kill them. After all they do need them for economical interest.  If there is an economic connection that must translate into friendship and love of course those occasional torture, brutality and killing are simply unfortunate hiccups that get in the way of the good intentions of those pragmatic and none vindictive folks. Quite brilliant analysis I say!

Is the current government of Ethiopia i.e. EPRDF even a Christian institution let alone an Orthodox Christian one? That you would compare religious persecution with a political persecution, unless of course you do  know  and acknowledge that to the Saudis religion and politics are one and the same ideology therefore in order to create a fictitious similarity between the religious political ideology in Saudi and the atheistic politics of EPRDF you mention the people of different religious confessions who are prisoners of an atheist political party with those who are imprisoned for their peaceful religious practices by a Theocracy. I have to congratulate you for your continual brilliant attempt to create if not an effective apology for Islamic brutality at least one that attempts to take the focus off of it. Quite impressive! Applause! Applause!


what better way to end it than with a prayer for All Christians that are being persecuted by the number one active christian persecutor which shall remain unnamed. this takes the cake! superb!

Nice response, Hiwot!

@Habte

I was trying to defend you on the other thread when some of the participants raised up their voices because of the Catholic Icon. Well, you don't seem to get it when things get to the Muslim Zombies, do you? Do you actually know that the Muslims in Ethiopia were the loudest folks to celebrate the Emperor Haile Selassie's deposition on September 12, 1974? There is a video that shows them celebrating at the main Market (Mercato) in Addis. Do you know that Muslim Ethiopians hate Ethiopian Kings and Emperors because they were Christians and defenders of Christian Ethiopia from barbaric Arabs? Believe me ወንድም, you will never be a true Christian, an Orthodox Tewahedo Christian, until you denounce and hate Islam። (four points)




Really? Hatred of others is now Orthodox Dogma? I understand that some of their actions are upsetting but as Orthodox Christians we should always respond with love and not hatred.
Did Balthasar say anything about hating Muslims? No, he did not. He said we are to hate Islam. Do you not see the difference?
« Last Edit: August 07, 2012, 10:15:49 AM by PeterTheAleut » Logged
sheenj
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St. Gregorios of Parumala, pray for us...


« Reply #6 on: August 07, 2012, 11:21:28 AM »

Greetings in that Divine and Most Precious Name of Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ!

I'm glad they were released.  I recall hearing about it when they were arrested, and I was afraid nothing could be done to help them.


Quote
Almost three dozen imprisoned Christian Ethiopians in Saudi Arabia have been freed after months of being held by the authorities there.

The 35 Ethiopians were imprisoned last December 17 for conducting a prayer meeting in a private home.

“We understand that the Saudi’s assaulted, harassed, and pressured the Christians to convert to Islam during the time of their incarceration,” says International Christian Concern’s Jonathan Racho.  According to Racho, the female prisoners were especially mistreated and humiliated.

Read the rest here:

http://theorthodoxchurch.info/blog/news/2012/08/saudis-release-christians/

A) the Saudis are more pragmatic than vindictive, and they have multi-BILLION investments in Ethiopia to protect

B) there are well over three dozen political prisoners in Ethiopia today are Orthodox Christians, so it goes both ways Sad

Aside from the political griping, this indeed wonderful news, when we were discussing this a few months back I felt confident in the Spirit that these folks would be released, because again, the Saudis have been pandering a bit of favor from Ethiopia. While Ethiopia may not have a lot of money by international standards, regionally, they have a huge amount of clout, which is why to this day the AU is seated in Addis Ababa where HIM Haile Selassie founded it as the OAU just over 50 years ago.  

In regards to (A), the release of these prisoners was as predictable as it was agreeably miraculous (indeed all praises to God!) and to (B), let us pray for ALL Christians experiencing persecution across the world.

stay blessed,
habte selassie



I am quite impressed by your educated analysis of events, sociopolitical, and historical awareness, which only leads me to extrapolate that the klan and those with similar ideology were being quite pragmatic and not vindictive, when they brutalized and tortured the blacks, so long as they did not kill them. After all they do need them for economical interest.  If there is an economic connection that must translate into friendship and love of course those occasional torture, brutality and killing are simply unfortunate hiccups that get in the way of the good intentions of those pragmatic and none vindictive folks. Quite brilliant analysis I say!

Is the current government of Ethiopia i.e. EPRDF even a Christian institution let alone an Orthodox Christian one? That you would compare religious persecution with a political persecution, unless of course you do  know  and acknowledge that to the Saudis religion and politics are one and the same ideology therefore in order to create a fictitious similarity between the religious political ideology in Saudi and the atheistic politics of EPRDF you mention the people of different religious confessions who are prisoners of an atheist political party with those who are imprisoned for their peaceful religious practices by a Theocracy. I have to congratulate you for your continual brilliant attempt to create if not an effective apology for Islamic brutality at least one that attempts to take the focus off of it. Quite impressive! Applause! Applause!


what better way to end it than with a prayer for All Christians that are being persecuted by the number one active christian persecutor which shall remain unnamed. this takes the cake! superb!

Nice response, Hiwot!

@Habte

I was trying to defend you on the other thread when some of the participants raised up their voices because of the Catholic Icon. Well, you don't seem to get it when things get to the Muslim Zombies, do you? Do you actually know that the Muslims in Ethiopia were the loudest folks to celebrate the Emperor Haile Selassie's deposition on September 12, 1974? There is a video that shows them celebrating at the main Market (Mercato) in Addis. Do you know that Muslim Ethiopians hate Ethiopian Kings and Emperors because they were Christians and defenders of Christian Ethiopia from barbaric Arabs? Believe me ወንድም, you will never be a true Christian, an Orthodox Tewahedo Christian, until you denounce and hate Islam። (four points)




Really? Hatred of others is now Orthodox Dogma? I understand that some of their actions are upsetting but as Orthodox Christians we should always respond with love and not hatred.
Did Balthasar say anything about hating Muslims? No, he did not. He said we are to hate Islam. Do you not see the difference?
Really? These phrases

Quote
Muslim Zombies

Quote
barbaric Arabs

seem more directed at the people than their religion.
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Salpy
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« Reply #7 on: August 07, 2012, 11:57:04 AM »

This was split off from here:

http://www.orthodoxchristianity.net/forum/index.php/topic,46245.0.html
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HabteSelassie
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« Reply #8 on: August 07, 2012, 12:45:34 PM »

Greetings in that Divine and Most Precious Name of Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ!

Quote from: HabteSelassie

In regards to (A), the release of these prisoners was as predictable as it was agreeably miraculous (indeed all praises to God!) and to (B), let us pray for ALL Christians experiencing persecution across the world.


To the Ethiopian sisters, did y'all somehow miss this in your quickness to attack my character and faith? Lord have His mercy on all that meanness, aren't we brothers and sisters here?  Sad

Apologize for Islam? What? I never expressed my opinions about the Saudis in Ethiopia one way or the other, I just kicked the facts of the reality that the Saudis have billions invested in Ethiopia, and so it is predictable that they would inevitably have to back off from any pressure they put on Ethiopia expatriates, because the Ethiopian regime might not take too kindly to this.  It was not an apology for Islam, you sisters have NO idea how I feel about Saudis in Ethiopia because I didn't tell you, and I'd kindly prefer you don't make such broad painted assumptions.

I don't hate anyone, but I do hate it when Orthodox Christians get so caught up in their own hatred and prejudice that they begin to bite and attack at each other as if they the people they are prejudiced against!! Lord have His mercy Sad Sad Sad


what better way to end it than with a prayer for All Christians that are being persecuted by the number one active christian persecutor which shall remain unnamed. this takes the cake! superb!
How very noble of you to scoff at prayer, what a faithful and upstanding Christian!

The only person persecuting Christians is THE DEVIL SATAN, who not only whispers this temptation to those persecutors around the world, but also whispers that same hateful nonsense into your own heart, to cause you bite and nash your teeth so harshly in my direction, and for calling for prayer?


Quote
For the entire Law is fulfilled in one word, in this: You shall love your neighbor as yourself.' Now if you are biting and devouring one another, be aware that you not be consumed by one another.
Galatians 5


stay blessed,
habte selassie
« Last Edit: August 07, 2012, 12:52:08 PM by HabteSelassie » Logged

"Yet stand aloof from stupid questionings and geneologies and strifes and fightings about law, for they are without benefit and vain." Titus 3:10
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« Reply #9 on: August 07, 2012, 01:40:38 PM »


Dear Salpi, the Ethiopian Christians were not released, rather deported for refusing to accept the diabolic cult, Islam. Besides, their inhuman treatment and sufferings in the Saudi prison was known to the international community. There are still thousands of Ethiopians, Filipinos etc languishing in Saudi prisons just for being Christians.

I am pretty confident soon the poor Ethiopians will destroy the sodomite Saudis. May they all go to hell!
How can you, a christian, say such things? Hoping for the destruction of others is to go against the commandments of Christ. The church fathers taught us that God desires the salvation of all mankind.
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PeterTheAleut
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Lord, have mercy on the Christians in Mosul!


« Reply #10 on: August 07, 2012, 02:42:46 PM »

Greetings in that Divine and Most Precious Name of Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ!

I'm glad they were released.  I recall hearing about it when they were arrested, and I was afraid nothing could be done to help them.


Quote
Almost three dozen imprisoned Christian Ethiopians in Saudi Arabia have been freed after months of being held by the authorities there.

The 35 Ethiopians were imprisoned last December 17 for conducting a prayer meeting in a private home.

“We understand that the Saudi’s assaulted, harassed, and pressured the Christians to convert to Islam during the time of their incarceration,” says International Christian Concern’s Jonathan Racho.  According to Racho, the female prisoners were especially mistreated and humiliated.

Read the rest here:

http://theorthodoxchurch.info/blog/news/2012/08/saudis-release-christians/

A) the Saudis are more pragmatic than vindictive, and they have multi-BILLION investments in Ethiopia to protect

B) there are well over three dozen political prisoners in Ethiopia today are Orthodox Christians, so it goes both ways Sad

Aside from the political griping, this indeed wonderful news, when we were discussing this a few months back I felt confident in the Spirit that these folks would be released, because again, the Saudis have been pandering a bit of favor from Ethiopia. While Ethiopia may not have a lot of money by international standards, regionally, they have a huge amount of clout, which is why to this day the AU is seated in Addis Ababa where HIM Haile Selassie founded it as the OAU just over 50 years ago.  

In regards to (A), the release of these prisoners was as predictable as it was agreeably miraculous (indeed all praises to God!) and to (B), let us pray for ALL Christians experiencing persecution across the world.

stay blessed,
habte selassie



I am quite impressed by your educated analysis of events, sociopolitical, and historical awareness, which only leads me to extrapolate that the klan and those with similar ideology were being quite pragmatic and not vindictive, when they brutalized and tortured the blacks, so long as they did not kill them. After all they do need them for economical interest.  If there is an economic connection that must translate into friendship and love of course those occasional torture, brutality and killing are simply unfortunate hiccups that get in the way of the good intentions of those pragmatic and none vindictive folks. Quite brilliant analysis I say!

Is the current government of Ethiopia i.e. EPRDF even a Christian institution let alone an Orthodox Christian one? That you would compare religious persecution with a political persecution, unless of course you do  know  and acknowledge that to the Saudis religion and politics are one and the same ideology therefore in order to create a fictitious similarity between the religious political ideology in Saudi and the atheistic politics of EPRDF you mention the people of different religious confessions who are prisoners of an atheist political party with those who are imprisoned for their peaceful religious practices by a Theocracy. I have to congratulate you for your continual brilliant attempt to create if not an effective apology for Islamic brutality at least one that attempts to take the focus off of it. Quite impressive! Applause! Applause!


what better way to end it than with a prayer for All Christians that are being persecuted by the number one active christian persecutor which shall remain unnamed. this takes the cake! superb!

Nice response, Hiwot!

@Habte

I was trying to defend you on the other thread when some of the participants raised up their voices because of the Catholic Icon. Well, you don't seem to get it when things get to the Muslim Zombies, do you? Do you actually know that the Muslims in Ethiopia were the loudest folks to celebrate the Emperor Haile Selassie's deposition on September 12, 1974? There is a video that shows them celebrating at the main Market (Mercato) in Addis. Do you know that Muslim Ethiopians hate Ethiopian Kings and Emperors because they were Christians and defenders of Christian Ethiopia from barbaric Arabs? Believe me ወንድም, you will never be a true Christian, an Orthodox Tewahedo Christian, until you denounce and hate Islam። (four points)




Really? Hatred of others is now Orthodox Dogma? I understand that some of their actions are upsetting but as Orthodox Christians we should always respond with love and not hatred.
Did Balthasar say anything about hating Muslims? No, he did not. He said we are to hate Islam. Do you not see the difference?
Really? These phrases

Quote
Muslim Zombies

Quote
barbaric Arabs

seem more directed at the people than their religion.
How do those labels communicate hatred?
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« Reply #11 on: August 07, 2012, 03:04:06 PM »

/Snip
Did Balthasar say anything about hating Muslims? No, he did not. He said we are to hate Islam. Do you not see the difference?
Really? These phrases

Quote
Muslim Zombies

Quote
barbaric Arabs

seem more directed at the people than their religion.
How do those labels communicate hatred?
When you take those quotes in context with the one from the previous post:
the sodomite Saudis. May they all go to hell!
Seems to indicate quite well that he hates Saudi's and wishes them ill.
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« Reply #12 on: August 07, 2012, 04:47:05 PM »

Believe me ወንድም, you will never be a true Christian, an Orthodox Tewahedo Christian, until you denounce and hate Islam። (four points)
...

What?

Four points?
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« Reply #13 on: August 07, 2012, 04:49:07 PM »

Islam። (four points)

Can you explain what you mean by the "four points" bit?

Thanks.
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« Reply #14 on: August 07, 2012, 07:21:46 PM »

/Snip
Did Balthasar say anything about hating Muslims? No, he did not. He said we are to hate Islam. Do you not see the difference?
Really? These phrases

Quote
Muslim Zombies

Quote
barbaric Arabs

seem more directed at the people than their religion.
How do those labels communicate hatred?
When you take those quotes in context with the one from the previous post:
the sodomite Saudis. May they all go to hell!
Seems to indicate quite well that he hates Saudi's and wishes them ill.


Seems quite obvious, from his comments, that Balthasar hates Saudis. I have Saudi friends, some of them are even interested in Orthodoxy...Its not right to hate an entire group of people, and its definitely not what we Christians are supposed to do. Pleases remember that there are plenty of proud Arab Christians in Lebanon, Palestine, Syria, Jordan, Iraq and plenty other places...
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« Reply #15 on: August 07, 2012, 09:49:26 PM »

Greetings in that Divine and Most Precious Name of Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ!

Quote from: HabteSelassie

In regards to (A), the release of these prisoners was as predictable as it was agreeably miraculous (indeed all praises to God!) and to (B), let us pray for ALL Christians experiencing persecution across the world.


To the Ethiopian sisters, did y'all somehow miss this in your quickness to attack my character and faith? Lord have His mercy on all that meanness, aren't we brothers and sisters here?  Sad

Apologize for Islam? What? I never expressed my opinions about the Saudis in Ethiopia one way or the other, I just kicked the facts of the reality that the Saudis have billions invested in Ethiopia, and so it is predictable that they would inevitably have to back off from any pressure they put on Ethiopia expatriates, because the Ethiopian regime might not take too kindly to this.  It was not an apology for Islam, you sisters have NO idea how I feel about Saudis in Ethiopia because I didn't tell you, and I'd kindly prefer you don't make such broad painted assumptions.

I don't hate anyone, but I do hate it when Orthodox Christians get so caught up in their own hatred and prejudice that they begin to bite and attack at each other as if they the people they are prejudiced against!! Lord have His mercy Sad Sad Sad


what better way to end it than with a prayer for All Christians that are being persecuted by the number one active christian persecutor which shall remain unnamed. this takes the cake! superb!
How very noble of you to scoff at prayer, what a faithful and upstanding Christian!

The only person persecuting Christians is THE DEVIL SATAN, who not only whispers this temptation to those persecutors around the world, but also whispers that same hateful nonsense into your own heart, to cause you bite and nash your teeth so harshly in my direction, and for calling for prayer?


Quote
For the entire Law is fulfilled in one word, in this: You shall love your neighbor as yourself.' Now if you are biting and devouring one another, be aware that you not be consumed by one another.
Galatians 5


stay blessed,
habte selassie

habte ,

I do not have time to address your comments fully today, God Willing I will get back to them tomorrow.

scoff at prayer you say , and attempt to try to hide the real intent of my comment. you are praying for all the Christian religious persecution, but you conveniently omit who is doing the persecution, as it does not align with the apologetic of '' oh it is all similar what is happening in Ethiopia by EPRDF and what is happening in Saudi to the Christians''  clearly argued by your points. crocodile tears , or a show of air, whatever it is , it does not interest me. stand up for justice and speak up against injustice plainly in truth, and do not try to hide truth at the expense of one or another, if you stand for peace and justice then bring to light what injustice is being done and by exactly whom it is being done. your play of words , is consistent with your stance on this issue in all the other threads of similar content, diversion with alleged identical of the injustice and persecution, if that does not work then cry personal attack. back up your comments with facts or if you find being challenged offensive then do not throw around comments like that. as some of us also see it as a very personal issue. thank you.

one more thing, I have said you were trying to take the heat off of Islamic brutality,and diversion is your methodology of choice. as to the Ethiopian and Saudi Trade relationship I have already addressed it. why do you say that they imprison them in the first place if the Saudis are thinking pragmatically as to not harm the existing trade relationship? as you have pointed out EPRDF is a dictatorship which does not care one way or another about who is imprisoned by whom as long as the trade continues. so are you saying EPRDF will fight for the Christians of Ethiopia in Saudi, when it has thousands of Ethiopians political prisoners, of various religious convictions imprisoned unjustly so it is not an atheistic dictatorship after all. you see the confusion of logic? rhetorical question.



@ Balthazar, I have mentioned to you before, hateful comments such as yours against Arabs, is against everything Christian, and not the common Ethiopian sentiment. know that those that act hateful in the other camp act and say they way you do. what makes you so different than them? correct your ways, or know you are hurting the plight of all Christians by bringing hate rather than facts and reason as well as compassion to this difficult issue. thank you.
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« Reply #16 on: August 07, 2012, 10:01:31 PM »

Greetings in that Divine and Most Precious Name of Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ!

Sister Hiwot, I am just a Christian trying his best.  Politics, history, culture, science, these things are arguable topics.  However when you insistently criticise the sincerity of my prayers it hurts me personally, even if this is just the internet.  You've done this on several occasions, and each time with increasing levels of scathing venom.  Again, that hurts me too..  I can only continue to pray about all this, but we are all just sinners here, and I am just trying my honest best.

stay blessed,
habte selassie
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« Reply #17 on: August 07, 2012, 10:11:41 PM »

All I got from Habte's initial post was "it's no surprise the Saudis released them because they value their business interests more than their persecution of non-Muslims," which I think is a pretty fair assessment. I don't really see any problem with what he said.
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« Reply #18 on: August 07, 2012, 10:17:38 PM »

All I'm saying is, can't we all just get along?
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« Reply #19 on: August 08, 2012, 03:42:29 AM »

All I'm saying is, can't we all just get along?
Sounds like a reasonable suggestion.
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« Reply #20 on: August 08, 2012, 04:21:52 AM »

It is fun to see the same players over and over reenacting their same points. I agree with the same old, and disagree with the same old. And I'll repeat again what I've said before: Nobody would like to get along more than the Christians. The problem is with the Muslims. And I have Saudi friends too (including one crypto-Christian), but that doesn't make KSA any better, just some of its people. And there are plenty of good Christian Arabs, Balthasar. Do not mistake "Arab" for "Muslim"...that only plays into Islamist tendencies like what KSA officially exports. I may not like Arabism (which many Christian Arabs have fallen for and propagated; Lord have mercy), but that has nothing to do with the historical reality of the Ghassanids, Lakhmids, Banu Taghlib and other Arab tribes that were known to be majority Christian. They were no less Arab for it.

If you wish to be upset about something, Balthasar, again direct your displeasure towards Islam which has co-opted Arabness for its own violent expansionist tendencies and theological idiocy (I have had Muslim Arabs try to tell me that concepts such as Trinitarian theology "don't make sense to the Arab mindset"...ridiculous!). It was not always this way. If I remember correctly, St. Paul preached in Arabia, and Arabs were among the people mentioned as being present on the day of Pentecost. We as servants of the true God owe it to Him to not abandon those He loves so much, such as the Arabs...even if the majority have left the true faith to follow a lie, they deserve the same care and consideration as any other people.

Arabic Orthodox Chant...just one of the things Arabs make when not being damned to hell by the internet. Grin
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« Reply #21 on: August 08, 2012, 05:11:30 AM »

Greetings in that Divine and Most Precious Name of Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ!

Quote from: HabteSelassie

In regards to (A), the release of these prisoners was as predictable as it was agreeably miraculous (indeed all praises to God!) and to (B), let us pray for ALL Christians experiencing persecution across the world.


To the Ethiopian sisters, did y'all somehow miss this in your quickness to attack my character and faith? Lord have His mercy on all that meanness, aren't we brothers and sisters here?  Sad

Apologize for Islam? What? I never expressed my opinions about the Saudis in Ethiopia one way or the other, I just kicked the facts of the reality that the Saudis have billions invested in Ethiopia, and so it is predictable that they would inevitably have to back off from any pressure they put on Ethiopia expatriates, because the Ethiopian regime might not take too kindly to this.  It was not an apology for Islam, you sisters have NO idea how I feel about Saudis in Ethiopia because I didn't tell you, and I'd kindly prefer you don't make such broad painted assumptions.

I don't hate anyone, but I do hate it when Orthodox Christians get so caught up in their own hatred and prejudice that they begin to bite and attack at each other as if they the people they are prejudiced against!! Lord have His mercy Sad Sad Sad


what better way to end it than with a prayer for All Christians that are being persecuted by the number one active christian persecutor which shall remain unnamed. this takes the cake! superb!
How very noble of you to scoff at prayer, what a faithful and upstanding Christian!

The only person persecuting Christians is THE DEVIL SATAN, who not only whispers this temptation to those persecutors around the world, but also whispers that same hateful nonsense into your own heart, to cause you bite and nash your teeth so harshly in my direction, and for calling for prayer?


Quote
For the entire Law is fulfilled in one word, in this: You shall love your neighbor as yourself.' Now if you are biting and devouring one another, be aware that you not be consumed by one another.
Galatians 5


stay blessed,
habte selassie

I find it very sad that your reasoned opinions are mocked and dismissed with such hateful and sarcastic rhetoric. But I applaud you for your Christian response.

His Majesty's Orthodox devotion is unquestioned, and yet H.I.M. always exhibited a spirit of tolerance toward other faiths. It is quite contrary to the spirit of our Orthodox religion to seek to violently conquer those who disagree with us. Some Orthodox Christians here are sadly manifesting the same violent spirit of the Islamist enemy which they condemn.

Ethiopia remained an island of Orthodox Christianity amidst a sea of colonialism and Islam, not by seeking to destroy every perceived enemy, but by clinging to the principles of the Christian Faith and remaining firm and vigilant without embracing the demonic and counterproductive spirit of hatred and retaliation.

Stand firm bredren!


Selam
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« Reply #22 on: August 08, 2012, 02:09:42 PM »

The Saudis, after they detained those Ethiopians who gathered to pray and celebrate Christmas, privately which ever since 2006 the Saudis have announced to be a legal activity as long as it’s a private event. Yet here they were detaining people on Christmas for worshiping in private the news of which did not got buried as they have anticipated but was brought to light by all men and women of the world who struggle for truth, peace and justice all over the world ,Ethiopian community all over the world  organized under different branches of political, law, religious etc. organizations, ICC( International Christian Concern), the bipartisan U.S. Commission on International Religious Freedom ( USCIRF),Human Rights Watch, etc. these are the men and women of the world that put the lies that were being fabricated by the Saudi Arabian government out to light for the whole world to see.

In order to save face in the international community and their political and diplomatic as well as economic relation between the major powers they engage in who demand a platform of respect and tolerance. They attempted to fabricate a charge of illegal activity against the Ethiopians, if they could say the Ethiopians have broken a law, and then they could effectively be justified in detaining them and prosecuting them according to their law. Which will also mean that no one would interfere with the internal justice system of a sovereign state from the international community as it would have been seen as a justified action. And the Saudis would have managed to pull off Christian persecution and forced islamisation or execution of those who refused it, under the cover of the political and legal right of a sovereign state. However they did not have evidence of their alleged charges and the Ethiopians refused to admit to any of the political and legal charges that were being thrown at them by the Saudis.

There is a BIG difference between being a political prisoner and a religious prisoner, we all knew it. The minute they ceased to be a religious prisoners their fate would have been sealed. All these months the back and forth communication has been in standing their ground as being prisoners of faith. They have done that bravely and under unbearable pressure and brutality. Glory be to God it has culminated in their deportation. They are not the only ones who are prisoners of faith in Saudi there are others but this was a massive arrest on a Christian holiday and it comes at a time where the Saudi Arabians want to keep a certain image in international politics as well as the diplomatic community of the Christian west flexing its diplomatic muscle enough to make the Saudis weigh the cost benefit analysis of their too obvious Christian persecution. They let them go because their arm was twisted by the unceasing uproar this created internationally. The Ethiopian Christians all over the world did not let go, nor did the international Christian community that stands for justice, so by God’s great mercy infinite wisdom they were released.


Now what is offensive is to hear those that have done this brutality being called pragmatic rather than vindictive. I am sorry but that does not sit well with me. If what they have done to those Christians does not make them vindictive I don’t know what does.  The Christians release has nothing to do with any interest the Saudis have in neither Ethiopia nor the involvement of the EPRDF officials in appeal or any bilateral negotiations between those two governments regarding these prisoners. There are over thousands of Ethiopians in Saudi prisons without a single thing being done about it by neither the Ethiopian government nor the Saudi’s brothering to be pragmatic about those prisoners for the sake of trade. The trade goes on whether there are prisoners in Saudi or not as far as the Ethiopian government is concerned.


The most offensive point is the attempted parallel of political prisoners in Ethiopia with faith prisoners in Saudi Arabia, get it now? This is the very argument used by the Saudis and their sympathizers that a government can detain law breakers justifiably, thus those Christians are really just like any other political prisoners. Here Habte, you made a singular point of purposely comparing political prisoners in Ethiopia who might be baptized orthodox Christians as the majority of Ethiopians are, as being similar with those Christians who are being sent to the gallows for their faith in Christ. To stress your point you said it goes both ways. So Ethiopia is imprisoning orthodox Christians for praying and practicing their faith? If even the dictatorial regime for all its faults, it did not venture to close churches, or imprison those who practice their faith, for practicing their faith. It has brutalized and imprisoned and killed thousands for political reasons, but the legal practice of their faith is not one of them. Even at present where the Saudi bred and funded radical Islam has created a lot of chaos the practice of Islam and all other religions remain legally protected and implemented right. That does not mean there are no conflicts between government and religious groups there are, but that has always a political flavor in it.


So how what is goes on in Saudi in religious persecution identical to the political persecution in Ethiopia? How can you in good conscious say such a callous thing? You think this does not hurt and offend me personally? It infuriates me, why? because it is a lie, a blatant lie which makes me ask, why would someone first argue for the non vindictive nature of the action of the Saudis, then goes on to say oh the same thing happens in Ethiopia too so, no the political conclusion that you urge the reader to get is to say oh well in that case, it goes both ways, what goes around comes around, or what’s good for the goose.. In such a way the Saudis are no better or worse than Ethiopians themselves who are doing the same thing in their country. They are all the same, it goes both ways. Yes it disgusts me to hear it! To know a Christian said it, is even more hurtful not out of a sense of entitlement for loyalty but out of expectation of a Christian being about Truth, and justice.


Love cannot be built on falsehood and deceit, exploitation. Love triumphs first and for most in Truth. If you love, you fight all injustice, and false hood. Calling the bringing to light of all truth an act of hate and attempting to distort it by crafty insinuations are just that: lies. Look what the exposure of truth can accomplish; miracles like this can happen when people insist on the truth. Not when they say oh well, it happens and give up on the determination to pursue justice. Yes most of us did not expect them to remain in Saudi and continue their legal work because we cannot expect that much of tolerance from the Saudi government, though their deportation is still unjust , we are happy they are alive .
If I have thought you made a slip of a tongue so to speak, or that you are not aware of any of the situation then I would have let it go. I never like to bring politics or these drawn out arguments to this forum however once a distortion of something that is above me in its worth is done, and then I cannot in good conscious keep quite. If it is necessary to talk about self then I will be the first to say that I am a hot head. Yet even I have certain principles that curb my territorial instincts. I cannot however be silent when I know there is a clear and calculated intent; I can ignore ignorance, not purposeful distortions. I can read as well as any, comprehend well enough, to understand what was consistently argued by you is no different from what is argued in this thread regarding Islamic brutality and persecution of Christians. So besides me being a mean @*%#$ ,which I will not disagree with, could there be point that I am trying to make?
Your prayer after you equated the witness of those Christians as being the same as the politicians, not willing to acknowledge that which is persecuting them, strikes me as a mockery itself. So I hope you understand if I am not all psyched about it. Why did St. Stephen die, for faith or politics? What was the difference between Jesus and Barabbas? What is Caesars and what is God’s?

I hope you know, what you say affects many as well, in a deep and extreme degree, and you will be challenged, in the most unhesitating manner. Keep arguing this way, and expect no difference in the reply. It’s your choice.

for those who wish to know a bit more about the situation and the delicate fight that was fought  and the relevance of each sides argument politics vs religion, breaking the law vs peaceful religious practice under the law, here are some sites..


Information on the Arrest and the subsequent action taken by various groups,
http://www.persecution.org/2011/12/17/42-ethiopian-christians-arrested-in-saudi-arabia/
http://www.asianews.it/news-en/Jeddah:-35-Ethiopian-Christians-still-in-prison-after-praying-in-a-private-home-24983.html
http://www.persecution.org/2012/02/16/icc-ethiopian-community-to-hold-demonstration-demanding-saudis-release-ethiopian-christian-prisoners/
http://www.hrw.org/news/2012/01/30/saudi-arabia-christians-arrested-private-prayer
http://www.bpnews.net/BPnews.asp?ID=37143

Prisoners of various charges in Saudi. http://blogs.voanews.com/breaking-news/2012/06/21/ethiopians-report-dire-conditions-in-saudi-jails/

« Last Edit: August 08, 2012, 02:13:49 PM by Hiwot » Logged

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« Reply #23 on: August 08, 2012, 11:41:02 PM »

Greetings in that Divine and Most Precious Name of Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ!



. Here Habte, you made a singular point of purposely comparing political prisoners in Ethiopia who might be baptized orthodox Christians as the majority of Ethiopians are, as being similar with those Christians who are being sent to the gallows for their faith in Christ. To stress your point you said it goes both ways. So Ethiopia is imprisoning orthodox Christians for praying and practicing their faith?

No, but as you said, Love stands up for justice, and there is insane injustice in Ethiopia and above all else I LOVE Ethiopian peoples.  I can't speak for your life, but some of the Ethiopians I know fled that persecution, some were in those jails.  I feel sympathy and pain for ANYONE wrongly persecuted and imprisoned, be it for political OR religious reasons, injustice anywhere for any reason is injustice everywhere and for every reason.  I was not trying to justify the Saudis, quite the opposite, I was trying to point out that we need to EXTEND our prayers for not just a handful or even a thousand Ethiopians arrested in Saudi Arabia, but for those many thousands of Ethiopians wrongfully imprisoned in ETHIOPIA, as you said, many of whom are Christians.  But again, you scoffed my prayer and treated me like I was the Saudis instead of the Orthodox brother in the Lord Sad

Quote

? It infuriates me, why? because it is a lie, a blatant lie which makes me ask, why would someone first argue for the non vindictive nature of the action of the Saudis, then goes on to say oh the same thing happens in Ethiopia too so, no the political conclusion that you urge the reader to get is to say oh well in that case, it goes both ways, what goes around comes around, or what’s good for the goose.. In such a way the Saudis are no better or worse than Ethiopians themselves who are doing the same thing in their country. They are all the same, it goes both ways. Yes it disgusts me to hear it! To know a Christian said it, is even more hurtful not out of a sense of entitlement for loyalty but out of expectation of a Christian being about Truth, and justice.

My dear, you are arguing with a Straw men, so you are really just getting yourself all worked up and upset at YOUR ASSUMPTIONS.  Again, I never mentioned my stance on the Saudis, I just kicked facts, I'm not trying to debate politics.  Again, I didn't mention the Ethiopian political prisoners in order to some how justify the Saudis, rather to mention that we have A LOT OF WORK still to do, not just in freeing Ethiopians from Saudis, but freeing Ethiopians from Ethiopian prisons too!  A prison is a prison and Jesus Christ specifically asked us in Matthew 25 to be concerned for the prisoners, regardless of the guilt, sometimes especially because of their guilt! However, you carried on in your assumptions instead of reading what I posted.  I am sorry that you got yourself so upset, but to  entirely misunderstood my post.  

Quote


Love cannot be built on falsehood and deceit,  Calling the bringing to light of all truth an act of hate and attempting to distort it by crafty insinuations are just that: lies.

 I cannot however be silent when I know there is a clear and calculated intent; I can ignore ignorance, not purposeful distortions. I can read as well as any, comprehend well enough, to understand what was consistently argued by you is no different from what is argued in this thread regarding Islamic brutality and persecution of Christians. So besides me being a mean @*%#$ ,which I will not disagree with, could there be point that I am trying to make?

Please don't call me a liar, you really have no right, and you really don't know me, just chill out! My priest always ends his sermon by saying, "We show our love for Christ in how we treat others."  Is the way you treat me really reflecting any love of Christ?

Quote
Your prayer after you equated the witness of those Christians as being the same as the politicians, not willing to acknowledge that which is persecuting them, strikes me as a mockery itself. So I hope you understand if I am not all psyched about it. Why did St. Stephen die, for faith or politics? What was the difference between Jesus and Barabbas? What is Caesars and what is God’s?

My prayer is sincere.  My prayer was for ALL Ethiopian prisoners, FOR ANY REASON, IN ANY PLACE. Again, please don't scoff my sincere prayers, that is simply not very nice of you.  I am just a humble Christian trying best, what about you?

Quote

I hope you know, what you say affects many as well, in a deep and extreme degree, and you will be challenged, in the most unhesitating manner. Keep arguing this way, and expect no difference in the reply. It’s your choice

Yes, it was my choice to call for prayer for all the prisoners, and I will stand up and call for it again.  I hope you also know that your mean-spirited and venomous words equally have the same impact, perhaps you should reflect on them in the mirror from time to time.



stay blessed,
habte selassie
« Last Edit: August 08, 2012, 11:44:19 PM by HabteSelassie » Logged

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« Reply #24 on: August 09, 2012, 03:18:36 PM »

here it comes again! Grin and this time this same argument almost sounded like something that lady justice herself would say, just before executing her blind justice.

Now let us go back and read what you said and the context of which you said it.
The topic of discussion: Christians released and deported after months of being incarcerated and brutalized by Islamic theocracy for no other reason than practicing their Christian faith in private
Your response:  

Quote
A. The Saudis are more pragmatic than vindictive,
This in the face of what they have done to those Christians and many others like them for no other crime than having a Christian faith and practicing it private.
http://www.hrw.org/news/2012/01/30/saudi-arabia-christians-arrested-private-prayer
Quote
And the have a multi billion investments in Ethiopia to protect
..

This knowing full well that to the Ethiopian government those prisoners mean nothing.that business has and will continue as usual, nor was any attempt ever made by the Ethiopian government to appeal for the case of those prisoners. Still you pitched their release and deportation to the benevolent interference of Ethiopian government which will use its trade negotiations to appeal for the prisoners, in truth does not give a hoot about them…. Interesting  this is not the first time you argued about the Saudi’s trade investments as if it is  tied to their nicety to Ethiopians who work in Saudi or that the dictatorial regime cares enough about those workers to negotiate for the protection of their human rights. You know the facts on the ground are not that way, yet you keep on arguing this same argument over and over again. Even now when we know who was the force behind the release and deportation of the Ethiopians, and it is not even remotely the Ethiopian government’s influence of any sort. Yet you still go on and on about the trade and its none existing human right respecting preconditions.

the point being made :  peaceful Christians are being persecuted by Islamic Theocracy for no other reason than practicing their faith.  Your response…

Quote
B.  there are well over three dozen political prisoners in Ethiopia today are Orthodox Christians, so it goes both ways.
 
Religious persecution of Orthodox Christians goes both ways as in Saudi so in Ethiopia? Or the politicians in prison for their political conviction and fight with the government are imprisoned for their orthodox Christian faith?

This is a lie, why?   because it is not true lol . That at least you have admitted that there is no religious persecution in Ethiopia that one will be imprisoned for purely worshiping the god and religion of one’s choice.

now we have cleared that up, You have said that you mentioned the political prisoners to pray for them. This would have been wonderful! Truly a beautiful thing a Christian thing to do! And I am more than willing to join that prayer if it was that kind of prayer. Yet in your initial point B you only prayed for Christians that are persecuted, had your intent was only to pray for all those political prisoners because injustice to one is injustice to all, and to remind all of us that we need to do more to fight against injustice from every angel , then you would have prayed for the Animists, for the atheists, for the Catholics, For the Protestants for the Muslims who are political prisoners same as the Orthodox Christian politicians. Yet your point was not to shine light over one type of injustice that was being done by a politicaly dictatorial government in Ethiopia, no you want to insinuate that Christians are being persecuted for their orthodox Faith in Ethiopia , so the only political prisoners that were mentioned by you in that statement were orthodox Christians. Why ? because following your ‘’ it goes both ways’’ speech we are invited to say oh Orthodox Christians are being persecuted for their faith in Ethiopia too! If you were thinking of the injustice for all then why exclude the rest from that prayer for political prisoners hmm?

The political prisoners in Ethiopia are Orthodox, Protestant, Catholic, Muslim, Animist, atheists etc.  If you are indeed praying for ALL political prisoners as you later on claimed, then let us pray for all of them as political prisoners, not persecuted Christians for the sake of Christianity since that will make liars out of us. Regardless of your denial the Orthodox Church makes the differentiation between those who are martyred for the faith and those  for politics as what unites them is their politics not their religion. so your insinuation that they are the same kind of persecution is a blatant distortion of truth. still all the same, for credible fight against injustice you need to name what is being done and by whom it is being done, so show the same curtsey that you would show the political prisoners in naming who is doing the persecution of Christians for their Christianity. Are the politicians persecuted, to use your definition regarding Christian persecution; are they all also being persecuted by only one person i.e. Satan. Or are there humans out there operating as governments with ideologies such as militant Islam or is this also in our hateful folk’s imagination?



These  peaceful Christian men and women all over the world who show us what it means to live one’s faith under deprivation, humiliation, and torture even to the point of death, are being told by their brethren that their case is the same as political agitators of various cause. They are told, what makes you different from the politician over there who is in prison for political opposition of his counterpart from the other party, who are both baptized orthodox Christians. So oh well don’t make a big deal about your religious persecution, we got politicians imprisoned unjustly who also happen to be baptized orthodox Christians in here so our politicians here can claim both political and religious persecution. you don’t agree? Well too bad! The sun will rise in the west before we say islamists are persecuting Christians, we rather say the only person persecuting Christians is THE DEVIL SATAN, and he is usually in their heads and hearts.

So now, you claim you initially prayed for all political prisoners, as being Christians facing persecution a very elegant play of words, yet my friend, we cannot forget that  all political prisoners are not Christians, if all political prisoners were Christians then and only then perhaps we might have said , there is a religious persecution of the political prisoners, yet that is neither happening nor are they facing their persecution for being Christians. Which begs the question why the purposeful distortion of meaning here? Point B argues, there are political prisoners who  are orthodox Christians, which makes what the Saudis have done the same thing, and  in that it goes both ways, then addressing point B you pray still insinuating Christian persecution for the Christian faith, which in your later argument have elevated to being for All political prisoners of all religions, but we all can see in the initial statement it was not so. In fighting injustice none here will contradict you that injustice to one is injustice to all, that political prisoners and all those who hunger and thirst for justice matter. Yet each case is unique in its nature, and here we are addressing Islamic persecution of Christians specifically. Your insistence in preaching to the choir in the nature of injustice while you create an unrealistic identicalness of religious persecution of Christians with the political persecution politicians of a country;  All for the sake of diversion that you finally succeeded in claiming , IT ALL HAPPENS EVERYWHERE IN THE SAME MANNER Ethiopians do it, Saudis do it, and you noble sir, are happy to say anything as long as it takes the attention from the main issue this event brought to light i.e. Islamic brutality that is going on all over the world where Islam feels free to be itself. That part will never get discussed the facts never analyised with the precise focus they require, the suffering endured by the victims never fully appreciated, because there are those among us , who do what you do. Bravo! That’s how far your zeal for justice stretches and I am astounded by it.


This Ethiopian who have known firsthand what islamists have done to my countrymen and my Christian brethren all over the world, have followed your argument for a while now concerning your stance on radical Islam and its persecution of Christians, and I do understand you very well. http://www.orthodoxchristianity.net/forum/index.php/topic,41642.0.html   I have not assumed anything; I simply read what you wrote.

...........
the end.


on a side note regarding this issue... real life for those who face the religious persecution is very real than the internet, and it is not an issue that only Ethiopian Christians are dealing with , it is something that can no longer be ignored, it makes sure it is not ignored, that it must be seriously debated, for what it really is, not for the fabricated mask of peace and love some put on it. the sooner everyone takes on a serious look at it , the sooner we figure out a right and enduring way of dealing with the issue and perhaps even one that includes the participation of moderate Muslims who value peaceful coexistence , individual freedom, and most importantly who know first hand what Islamic government is.



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« Reply #25 on: August 09, 2012, 08:39:57 PM »

Greetings in that Divine and Most Precious Name of Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ!

Sister, I can only continue to pray for all prisoners, all peoples, and especially you and me both and all this tension.  You've been arguing with yourself for months now,  I never suggested or insinuated any of the things you are talking about.  I suggested that the Saudis have billions in Ethiopia, which is evidence of both a relationship and also some leverage that Ethiopia has.  After all, you and me both know that Saudis can't OWN land outright in Ethiopia, they need middlemen.  I never said it was the ONLY factor, just an obvious one.  I also gave thanks to God, and asked for more prayer.  I brought up the political prisoners in Ethiopia not to apologize or justify the Saudis, but rather to mention that we have a lot more Ethiopians to pray for than just these from the OP discussion.  You do realize that we can easily disagree about things with out you having to also be so mean-spirited and scathing right?

Does all this anger and malice really make you feel any better? You don't even know me, why do you harbor this obvious grudge and what's worse, against your projections and assumptions? Let it go, please, it is seriously an extended two-year old misunderstanding.  Sad

I can only continue to pray each day before the Altar at Qidase these weeks of Filseta that the Holy Spirit cool all those fires in your heart, and that there be some kind of peace between us as Christian brother and sister in the Lord.

stay blessed,
habte selassie
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« Reply #26 on: August 09, 2012, 09:27:20 PM »

Greetings in that Divine and Most Precious Name of Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ!

Sister, I can only continue to pray for all prisoners, all peoples, and especially you and me both and all this tension.  You've been arguing with yourself for months now,  I never suggested or insinuated any of the things you are talking about.  I suggested that the Saudis have billions in Ethiopia, which is evidence of both a relationship and also some leverage that Ethiopia has.  After all, you and me both know that Saudis can't OWN land outright in Ethiopia, they need middlemen.  I never said it was the ONLY factor, just an obvious one.  I also gave thanks to God, and asked for more prayer.  I brought up the political prisoners in Ethiopia not to apologize or justify the Saudis, but rather to mention that we have a lot more Ethiopians to pray for than just these from the OP discussion.  You do realize that we can easily disagree about things with out you having to also be so mean-spirited and scathing right?

Does all this anger and malice really make you feel any better? You don't even know me, why do you harbor this obvious grudge and what's worse, against your projections and assumptions? Let it go, please, it is seriously an extended two-year old misunderstanding.  Sad

I can only continue to pray each day before the Altar at Qidase these weeks of Filseta that the Holy Spirit cool all those fires in your heart, and that there be some kind of peace between us as Christian brother and sister in the Lord.

stay blessed,
habte selassie

I admire your true Christian spirit brother. Pray for me as well if you think about it.


Selam
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« Reply #27 on: August 09, 2012, 10:21:51 PM »

Its good you continue to pray before the Altar, try to remember all the other altars that got burnt down by radical Islam, and all the priests and Christians that got slaughtered before those altars as well. After all some matters are way above just you and me. On this case think of what radical Islam is doing perhaps then you might be able to be the voice of those under Islamic persecution.


Your attempt to make this a personal persecution of sorts you can keep if it makes you feel better. Like you said I do not know you personally, your opinions however are plastered all over the forum and those I know of, and will argue against with no hesitation and with the strongest terms possible so long as they remain the way they are such as your consistent political diversion concerning radical Islam, I will call you up on it EVERY single time it happens. Call it misunderstanding; call it a deluded argument of a hysterical woman whatever, your consistent argument on this issue speaks for itself. Even now there is no addressing radical Islam from you, just vague generalities when it comes who is doing the religious persecution. I have no expectation of this continued denial and continued distortion by you to cease.

So remember all those altars that got burnt down, monasteries closed, men women and children slaughtered just for being Christians, and thousand others still languishing under the persecution of radical Islam who prays each day that Christians continue to bring to light what the real face of Islamic theocracy is like.

Then I will be the first to thank you with all the sincerity I can master.

Until you stop your mean spirited and scathing political diversions on this very serious issue, you need not worry about painting others as mean spirited and scathing when they disagree with your IDEAS and the factualness of your supporting evidence.


You think I am arguing with you here out of personal grudge, oh please! I am not even arguing for you to change your mind, that aint happening I know, what I am here for is to make a point about radical Islam against your diversions and insinuations for the sake of those that are affected by it directly. But you are free to believe what you like.
So long.
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« Reply #28 on: August 10, 2012, 10:36:30 AM »

All I'm saying is, can't we all just get along?

Why? Isn’t the universe big enough… for both of us? Haa Haa, hii hii hoo hoo!

Please tell that to Mullah Ismail. If you have enough love to share with him while your home is burning, he might shade a crocodile' tear to you, he might even cordial ask you which side of your neck he would begin during decapitation. You know what happened to president Jack Nicholson, don't you?

Please, pardon me!

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« Reply #29 on: August 10, 2012, 10:42:08 AM »

@Hiwot

LOL. You have the luxury to take over the difficult task of convincing Habib rasta that Islam is at war with us, and the God of Abraham, Isaak and Jacob. I think he is just preparing himself for the coming dhimmi generation through the anti-Christ ideology of "ChrIslam". Please do pray for him!

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« Reply #30 on: August 10, 2012, 01:49:45 PM »

All I'm saying is, can't we all just get along?

Why? Isn’t the universe big enough… for both of us? Haa Haa, hii hii hoo hoo!

Please tell that to Mullah Ismail. If you have enough love to share with him while your home is burning, he might shade a crocodile' tear to you, he might even cordial ask you which side of your neck he would begin during decapitation. You know what happened to president Jack Nicholson, don't you?

Please, pardon me!


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But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;
Matthew 5:44
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« Reply #31 on: August 11, 2012, 04:25:57 AM »

@Hiwot

LOL. You have the luxury to take over the difficult task of convincing Habib rasta that Islam is at war with us, and the God of Abraham, Isaak and Jacob. I think he is just preparing himself for the coming dhimmi generation through the anti-Christ ideology of "ChrIslam". Please do pray for him!





That's not fair at all to our Tewahedo brother. Please don't malign the faith and motives of your fellow Orthodox Christian in such a way.


Selam
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« Reply #32 on: August 11, 2012, 01:34:58 PM »

@Hiwot

LOL. You have the luxury to take over the difficult task of convincing Habib rasta that Islam is at war with us, and the God of Abraham, Isaak and Jacob. I think he is just preparing himself for the coming dhimmi generation through the anti-Christ ideology of "ChrIslam". Please do pray for him!





That's not fair at all to our Tewahedo brother. Please don't malign the faith and motives of your fellow Orthodox Christian in such a way.
Hiwot also identifies herself as Tewahedo, yet you consistently take Habte's side against her. You even praise Habte for his "Christian spirit" when he stands up to Hiwot, implying somehow that Hiwot's spirit is not Christian. How, then, are you being fair to your Tewahedo sister?
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« Reply #33 on: August 11, 2012, 07:02:35 PM »

@Hiwot

LOL. You have the luxury to take over the difficult task of convincing Habib rasta that Islam is at war with us, and the God of Abraham, Isaak and Jacob. I think he is just preparing himself for the coming dhimmi generation through the anti-Christ ideology of "ChrIslam". Please do pray for him!





That's not fair at all to our Tewahedo brother. Please don't malign the faith and motives of your fellow Orthodox Christian in such a way.
Hiwot also identifies herself as Tewahedo, yet you consistently take Habte's side against her. You even praise Habte for his "Christian spirit" when he stands up to Hiwot, implying somehow that Hiwot's spirit is not Christian. How, then, are you being fair to your Tewahedo sister?

I'm not taking sides at all. I commend Habte's tone and spirit which I find much more Christian than Hiwot's most of the time, especially in this case. Habte has never questioned Hiwot's Orthodox faith, but Hiwot has consistently questioned Habte's. Hiwot is my Tewahedo sister, and Habte is my Tewahedo brother. I love them both.


Selam
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« Reply #34 on: August 11, 2012, 07:20:06 PM »

@Hiwot

LOL. You have the luxury to take over the difficult task of convincing Habib rasta that Islam is at war with us, and the God of Abraham, Isaak and Jacob. I think he is just preparing himself for the coming dhimmi generation through the anti-Christ ideology of "ChrIslam". Please do pray for him!





That's not fair at all to our Tewahedo brother. Please don't malign the faith and motives of your fellow Orthodox Christian in such a way.
Hiwot also identifies herself as Tewahedo, yet you consistently take Habte's side against her. You even praise Habte for his "Christian spirit" when he stands up to Hiwot, implying somehow that Hiwot's spirit is not Christian. How, then, are you being fair to your Tewahedo sister?

I'm not taking sides at all. I commend Habte's tone and spirit which I find much more Christian than Hiwot's most of the time, especially in this case. Habte has never questioned Hiwot's Orthodox faith, but Hiwot has consistently questioned Habte's. Hiwot is my Tewahedo sister, and Habte is my Tewahedo brother. I love them both.
I suppose, then, that I don't really see Hiwot questioning Habte's faith; rather, I see her questioning the sincerity of Habte's motives. Like Hiwot, I am aware of Habte's efforts to minimize Muslim persecution of Christians in his desire to defend his image of Islam as a "religion of peace". Like Hiwot, I also see Habte as engaging in tactics intended to divert our attention away from the real issues Hiwot is trying to address. I can therefore see why she gets so hot under the collar when addressing Habte (and, by extension, you when you take up Habte's defense).
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« Reply #35 on: August 11, 2012, 07:42:53 PM »

@Hiwot

LOL. You have the luxury to take over the difficult task of convincing Habib rasta that Islam is at war with us, and the God of Abraham, Isaak and Jacob. I think he is just preparing himself for the coming dhimmi generation through the anti-Christ ideology of "ChrIslam". Please do pray for him!





That's not fair at all to our Tewahedo brother. Please don't malign the faith and motives of your fellow Orthodox Christian in such a way.
Hiwot also identifies herself as Tewahedo, yet you consistently take Habte's side against her. You even praise Habte for his "Christian spirit" when he stands up to Hiwot, implying somehow that Hiwot's spirit is not Christian. How, then, are you being fair to your Tewahedo sister?

I'm not taking sides at all. I commend Habte's tone and spirit which I find much more Christian than Hiwot's most of the time, especially in this case. Habte has never questioned Hiwot's Orthodox faith, but Hiwot has consistently questioned Habte's. Hiwot is my Tewahedo sister, and Habte is my Tewahedo brother. I love them both.
I suppose, then, that I don't really see Hiwot questioning Habte's faith; rather, I see her questioning the sincerity of Habte's motives. Like Hiwot, I am aware of Habte's efforts to minimize Muslim persecution of Christians in his desire to defend his image of Islam as a "religion of peace". Like Hiwot, I also see Habte as engaging in tactics intended to divert our attention away from the real issues Hiwot is trying to address. I can therefore see why she gets so hot under the collar when addressing Habte (and, by extension, you when you take up Habte's defense).

Why don't you try being a peacemaker instead of stirring up division between two Christian brethren?


Selam
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« Reply #36 on: August 11, 2012, 10:17:52 PM »

@Hiwot

LOL. You have the luxury to take over the difficult task of convincing Habib rasta that Islam is at war with us, and the God of Abraham, Isaak and Jacob. I think he is just preparing himself for the coming dhimmi generation through the anti-Christ ideology of "ChrIslam". Please do pray for him!





That's not fair at all to our Tewahedo brother. Please don't malign the faith and motives of your fellow Orthodox Christian in such a way.
Hiwot also identifies herself as Tewahedo, yet you consistently take Habte's side against her. You even praise Habte for his "Christian spirit" when he stands up to Hiwot, implying somehow that Hiwot's spirit is not Christian. How, then, are you being fair to your Tewahedo sister?

I'm not taking sides at all. I commend Habte's tone and spirit which I find much more Christian than Hiwot's most of the time, especially in this case. Habte has never questioned Hiwot's Orthodox faith, but Hiwot has consistently questioned Habte's. Hiwot is my Tewahedo sister, and Habte is my Tewahedo brother. I love them both.
I suppose, then, that I don't really see Hiwot questioning Habte's faith; rather, I see her questioning the sincerity of Habte's motives. Like Hiwot, I am aware of Habte's efforts to minimize Muslim persecution of Christians in his desire to defend his image of Islam as a "religion of peace". Like Hiwot, I also see Habte as engaging in tactics intended to divert our attention away from the real issues Hiwot is trying to address. I can therefore see why she gets so hot under the collar when addressing Habte (and, by extension, you when you take up Habte's defense).

Why don't you try being a peacemaker instead of stirring up division between two Christian brethren?
You do realize that you're misrepresenting my views and projecting your own interpretations into my words (to use a couple of phrases you're so fond of typing)? Please stop doing that. Wink

FWIW, I'm just calling your and Habte's behavior what it is.

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« Reply #37 on: August 12, 2012, 02:52:15 AM »

@Hiwot

LOL. You have the luxury to take over the difficult task of convincing Habib rasta that Islam is at war with us, and the God of Abraham, Isaak and Jacob. I think he is just preparing himself for the coming dhimmi generation through the anti-Christ ideology of "ChrIslam". Please do pray for him!





That's not fair at all to our Tewahedo brother. Please don't malign the faith and motives of your fellow Orthodox Christian in such a way.
Hiwot also identifies herself as Tewahedo, yet you consistently take Habte's side against her. You even praise Habte for his "Christian spirit" when he stands up to Hiwot, implying somehow that Hiwot's spirit is not Christian. How, then, are you being fair to your Tewahedo sister?

I'm not taking sides at all. I commend Habte's tone and spirit which I find much more Christian than Hiwot's most of the time, especially in this case. Habte has never questioned Hiwot's Orthodox faith, but Hiwot has consistently questioned Habte's. Hiwot is my Tewahedo sister, and Habte is my Tewahedo brother. I love them both.
I suppose, then, that I don't really see Hiwot questioning Habte's faith; rather, I see her questioning the sincerity of Habte's motives. Like Hiwot, I am aware of Habte's efforts to minimize Muslim persecution of Christians in his desire to defend his image of Islam as a "religion of peace". Like Hiwot, I also see Habte as engaging in tactics intended to divert our attention away from the real issues Hiwot is trying to address. I can therefore see why she gets so hot under the collar when addressing Habte (and, by extension, you when you take up Habte's defense).

Why don't you try being a peacemaker instead of stirring up division between two Christian brethren?
You do realize that you're misrepresenting my views and projecting your own interpretations into my words (to use a couple of phrases you're so fond of typing)? Please stop doing that. Wink

FWIW, I'm just calling your and Habte's behavior what it is.

A song from the TV sitcom Car 54, Where Are You?


And yet you accuse me of being the one who is taking sides. Always the apex of objectivity.  Roll Eyes


Selam
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« Reply #38 on: August 12, 2012, 10:58:26 AM »

@Hiwot

LOL. You have the luxury to take over the difficult task of convincing Habib rasta that Islam is at war with us, and the God of Abraham, Isaak and Jacob. I think he is just preparing himself for the coming dhimmi generation through the anti-Christ ideology of "ChrIslam". Please do pray for him!





That's not fair at all to our Tewahedo brother. Please don't malign the faith and motives of your fellow Orthodox Christian in such a way.
Hiwot also identifies herself as Tewahedo, yet you consistently take Habte's side against her. You even praise Habte for his "Christian spirit" when he stands up to Hiwot, implying somehow that Hiwot's spirit is not Christian. How, then, are you being fair to your Tewahedo sister?

I'm not taking sides at all. I commend Habte's tone and spirit which I find much more Christian than Hiwot's most of the time, especially in this case. Habte has never questioned Hiwot's Orthodox faith, but Hiwot has consistently questioned Habte's. Hiwot is my Tewahedo sister, and Habte is my Tewahedo brother. I love them both.
I suppose, then, that I don't really see Hiwot questioning Habte's faith; rather, I see her questioning the sincerity of Habte's motives. Like Hiwot, I am aware of Habte's efforts to minimize Muslim persecution of Christians in his desire to defend his image of Islam as a "religion of peace". Like Hiwot, I also see Habte as engaging in tactics intended to divert our attention away from the real issues Hiwot is trying to address. I can therefore see why she gets so hot under the collar when addressing Habte (and, by extension, you when you take up Habte's defense).

Why don't you try being a peacemaker instead of stirring up division between two Christian brethren?
You do realize that you're misrepresenting my views and projecting your own interpretations into my words (to use a couple of phrases you're so fond of typing)? Please stop doing that. Wink

FWIW, I'm just calling your and Habte's behavior what it is.

A song from the TV sitcom Car 54, Where Are You?


And yet you accuse me of being the one who is taking sides. Always the apex of objectivity.  Roll Eyes
Again, just calling your and Habte's conduct what it is. If I'm taking sides, it's only because Hiwot is right. Besides, I see nothing inherently wrong with taking sides if my objectivity leads me to recognize the truth in what one is saying. I just think the way you consistently take Habte's side against Hiwot is grossly unfair to Hiwot.

Your sister is right. Despite her angry tone, you need to listen to her.
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dzheremi
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« Reply #39 on: August 12, 2012, 11:53:09 AM »

This thread should probably be in the private forum. I suspect it will go south very, very soon.
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PeterTheAleut
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« Reply #40 on: August 12, 2012, 04:29:09 PM »

This thread should probably be in the private forum. I suspect it will go south very, very soon.
Why? We don't move threads to the Private Forum just because some people think them too hot for public viewing.
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« Reply #41 on: August 12, 2012, 05:28:10 PM »

Alright, or not. All I know is that when it becomes more about personalities than about the issue at hand (which I am guilty of adding to, regrettably), it's usually not long before we start seeing posts about how so and so is persecuting so and so, and how dare you question ____'s commitment to Orthodoxy(!), and all kinds of other things that aren't about the situation of Ethiopian Christians in KSA. Many a thread have been completely derailed in favor of a poster's indulging in heroic acts of e-martyrdom... Roll Eyes

(It's not the heat, it's the stupid.)
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« Reply #42 on: August 12, 2012, 06:29:16 PM »

Alright, or not. All I know is that when it becomes more about personalities than about the issue at hand (which I am guilty of adding to, regrettably), it's usually not long before we start seeing posts about how so and so is persecuting so and so, and how dare you question ____'s commitment to Orthodoxy(!), and all kinds of other things that aren't about the situation of Ethiopian Christians in KSA. Many a thread have been completely derailed in favor of a poster's indulging in heroic acts of e-martyrdom... Roll Eyes

(It's not the heat, it's the stupid.)
And how do you think you're contributing to that by commenting that the thread should be in the Private Forum, a comment that, BTW, contributes nothing to our discussion of the situation of Ethiopian Orthodox in Saudi Arabia? (In all seriousness, your comment would have been more effective if you had brought it up in a private message to this section's moderator.)
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« Reply #43 on: August 12, 2012, 07:04:32 PM »

I actually agree with you on that account, Peter, as I noted in my reply. Apologies for this brief diversion. I'll try to stay on topic in the future.

With that in mind, according to this article that quotes one of the detained, it seems that the Saudi authorities are both ideologically-driven and pragmatic, telling the world that the Christians broke the sex-mingling law, but telling the detained themselves that they are being arrested for being Christian.

Also, even though the Ethiopians had been working in KSA for 15 years, apparently KSA originally tried to say that there were problems with their work permits. Really? All 35 who just happened to be at this private prayer gathering, which is supposed to be allowed under the new regulations that Hiwot mentioned? I don't buy it.
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