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Author Topic: Female Eucharistic Ministers in the Roman Catholic Church?  (Read 2921 times) Average Rating: 0
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HabteSelassie
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« on: July 09, 2012, 06:31:55 PM »

Greetings in that Divine and Most Precious Name of Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ!

I don't mean to stir controversy, but I just learned of this by coincidence today.  I'm a bit late in learning about this, but I am also not a Catholic Smiley

What do y'all think about female Eucharistic ministers? I know we disagree, obviously by a lot of the backlash just as the idea of girls wearing the same vestments as altar boys, but seriously, what is y'all opinion?  In particular, what do our resident Catholic boardies think.  Could some of the Catholics here perhaps explain their experience or reasoning with this? I am curious more so than judgemental about this.

stay blessed,
habte selassie
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« Reply #1 on: July 09, 2012, 07:27:51 PM »

Are they ordained as deaconesses?
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« Reply #2 on: July 09, 2012, 07:50:54 PM »

I have seen nuns be given this task sometimes. No, they don't have women deacons.
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« Reply #3 on: July 09, 2012, 08:07:10 PM »

I'm not a big fan of extraordinary ministers of the Eucharist in the first place. The priest is to be an icon of Christ, and in the liturgy, we receive grace from Christ. It points to a particular reality of the spiritual life. We are not active, nor are we the initiators. It is God who gives us grace. It is he who pursues us. Thus, it is most appropriate that we receive Holy Communion from the hands of the priest. We (the Church) are the bride. Christ is the groom. 
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« Reply #4 on: July 09, 2012, 08:14:39 PM »

I have seen nuns be given this task sometimes. No, they don't have women deacons.

That was a joke.

People used to receive Eucharist every Sunday to take It daily and now there are protests against receiving It in hands. I do not see any sense in that.
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« Reply #5 on: July 10, 2012, 10:00:48 AM »

Greetings in that Divine and Most Precious Name of Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ!

I don't mean to stir controversy, but I just learned of this by coincidence today.  I'm a bit late in learning about this, but I am also not a Catholic Smiley

What do y'all think about female Eucharistic ministers? I know we disagree, obviously by a lot of the backlash just as the idea of girls wearing the same vestments as altar boys, but seriously, what is y'all opinion?  In particular, what do our resident Catholic boardies think.  Could some of the Catholics here perhaps explain their experience or reasoning with this? I am curious more so than judgemental about this.

stay blessed,
habte selassie

First of all, the *only* "Eucharistic ministers" in the Catholic Church are priests and deacons.  Those who assist them, when necessary (would that that were always the case!) are called "Extraordinary eucharistic ministers" or "extraordinary ministers of the eucharist".  These people, whether men or women are not ordained, and depending on which parish of which diocese they are in they get training that varies from excellent to almost none (that's a whole other issue!).

Their existence and function is approved and "regulated" (well...) by Rome.  See http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/pontifical_councils/laity/documents/rc_con_interdic_doc_15081997_en.html

I find their use, whether they are men or women, to be, at least in the U.S., excessive and distracting.  There are situations, such as at some of the Masses at the parish I belong to, where their participation is justified (of our 4 priests we have 2 who are old and physically ailing, one of whom is semi-retired who are not physically up to serving Holy Communion to hundreds of parishioners at a time, and we have only one deacon at the moment who is only there occasionally.)

If a vote were held about the use of EMOE's I would vote to limit their use drastically and to restrict it to men and to ensure that they had thorough, comprehensive training with at least annual "re-training" workshops.   
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« Reply #6 on: July 10, 2012, 12:45:48 PM »

Greetings in that Divine and Most Precious Name of Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ!




First of all, the *only* "Eucharistic ministers" in the Catholic Church are priests and deacons.  Those who assist them, when necessary (would that that were always the case!) are called "Extraordinary eucharistic ministers" or "extraordinary ministers of the eucharist".  These people, whether men or women are not ordained, and depending on which parish of which diocese they are in they get training that varies from excellent to almost none (that's a whole other issue!).

Their existence and function is approved and "regulated" (well...) by Rome.  See http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/pontifical_councils/laity/documents/rc_con_interdic_doc_15081997_en.html

I find their use, whether they are men or women, to be, at least in the U.S., excessive and distracting.  There are situations, such as at some of the Masses at the parish I belong to, where their participation is justified (of our 4 priests we have 2 who are old and physically ailing, one of whom is semi-retired who are not physically up to serving Holy Communion to hundreds of parishioners at a time, and we have only one deacon at the moment who is only there occasionally.)

If a vote were held about the use of EMOE's I would vote to limit their use drastically and to restrict it to men and to ensure that they had thorough, comprehensive training with at least annual "re-training" workshops.   

Thank you for the clarification, so be to sure, non-ordained laity, including women, do in fact on certain occasions dispense the Holy Communion? Theologically, how is this explained in the Catholic Church in the context of (a) the hardly feminist writings of Apostle Paul and (b) the theology of the priests representing Christ when they give the Holy Communion.  These are the issues that came up with girls perform altar services in our other related threads, so I am curious how the Catholic Church resolves these theological issues.  In Ethiopian Orthodox only Ordained clergy can touch or handle the Holy Communion and further definitely then not women since they can't be ordained in the first place.  There is plenty else for women and laity to do in the Church, but dispensing the Holy Communion we see as rightfully the responsibility of the clergy.  So I am very curious how the Latins, the adept scholars that they are, have resolved these historic issues.

stay blessed,
habte selassie
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« Reply #7 on: July 10, 2012, 12:55:46 PM »

Greetings in that Divine and Most Precious Name of Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ!




First of all, the *only* "Eucharistic ministers" in the Catholic Church are priests and deacons.  Those who assist them, when necessary (would that that were always the case!) are called "Extraordinary eucharistic ministers" or "extraordinary ministers of the eucharist".  These people, whether men or women are not ordained, and depending on which parish of which diocese they are in they get training that varies from excellent to almost none (that's a whole other issue!).

Their existence and function is approved and "regulated" (well...) by Rome.  See http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/pontifical_councils/laity/documents/rc_con_interdic_doc_15081997_en.html

I find their use, whether they are men or women, to be, at least in the U.S., excessive and distracting.  There are situations, such as at some of the Masses at the parish I belong to, where their participation is justified (of our 4 priests we have 2 who are old and physically ailing, one of whom is semi-retired who are not physically up to serving Holy Communion to hundreds of parishioners at a time, and we have only one deacon at the moment who is only there occasionally.)

If a vote were held about the use of EMOE's I would vote to limit their use drastically and to restrict it to men and to ensure that they had thorough, comprehensive training with at least annual "re-training" workshops.   

Thank you for the clarification, so be to sure, non-ordained laity, including women, do in fact on certain occasions dispense the Holy Communion? Theologically, how is this explained in the Catholic Church in the context of (a) the hardly feminist writings of Apostle Paul and (b) the theology of the priests representing Christ when they give the Holy Communion.  These are the issues that came up with girls perform altar services in our other related threads, so I am curious how the Catholic Church resolves these theological issues.  In Ethiopian Orthodox only Ordained clergy can touch or handle the Holy Communion and further definitely then not women since they can't be ordained in the first place.  There is plenty else for women and laity to do in the Church, but dispensing the Holy Communion we see as rightfully the responsibility of the clergy.  So I am very curious how the Latins, the adept scholars that they are, have resolved these historic issues.

stay blessed,
habte selassie

In Alexandria (from which Ethiopia received Christianity), Communion was administered in the hand, so every man woman and child held the Body. It was also common practice to take the Body home. This stopped when Christianity became wider spread. In a small community, there is no danger. In a large community, it is easier/more likely for someone to sneak in unawares, and take the Body to commit sacrilege and mock Christianity. This does not seem to be a significant problem in the RC Church today, where the Eucharistic ministers are responsible for observing that each communicant places the body in their mouth before moving on. So it does not seem fair to say that there are unresolved historic issues here with women handling the Body. It is still the priest who represents Christ in the consecration.

That said, I still disagree with this practise. At the feeding of the multitude, Christ blessed, then the Apostles distributed to the groups of 50. While it is not wrong for women to touch the Body (for us it is since there have been rules past against it, which we must obey, but it is not intrinsically wrong), it is certainly not ideal for women to be distributing Communion in a parish. But no more wrong than men doing it. It is the role of bishops, presbyters, and deacons to distribute, to carry Communion to the people. (Note though that if a priest blesses, and then gives to a deacon to distribute, that does not in an way diminish the priests representation of Christ in the Liturgy).
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« Reply #8 on: July 10, 2012, 04:45:45 PM »

From the Code of Canon Law, Title II, Canon 230, para.3:

"When the need of the Church warrants it and ministers are lacking, lay persons, even if they are not lectors or acolytes, can also supply certain of their duties, namely, to exercise the ministry of the word, to preside offer liturgical prayers, to confer baptism, and to distribute Holy Communion, according to the prescripts of the law."  http://www.vatican.va/archive/ENG1104/_PV.HTM#2.1.0.2.0.0.230
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« Reply #9 on: July 10, 2012, 05:08:08 PM »

I'm not a big fan of extraordinary ministers of the Eucharist in the first place. The priest is to be an icon of Christ, and in the liturgy, we receive grace from Christ. It points to a particular reality of the spiritual life. We are not active, nor are we the initiators. It is God who gives us grace. It is he who pursues us. Thus, it is most appropriate that we receive Holy Communion from the hands of the priest. We (the Church) are the bride. Christ is the groom. 

Call me 'old fashion' but I still favor only the Priest and/or Deaconate administering Holy Communion.  End of story...
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« Reply #10 on: July 10, 2012, 05:58:01 PM »

My mom is one of half a dozen Eucharistic ministers at her parish every week.
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« Reply #11 on: July 10, 2012, 09:05:56 PM »

I have seen nuns be given this task sometimes. No, they don't have women deacons.

That was a joke.

People used to receive Eucharist every Sunday to take It daily and now there are protests against receiving It in hands. I do not see any sense in that.

This.
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« Reply #12 on: July 10, 2012, 09:30:48 PM »

I'm not a big fan of extraordinary ministers of the Eucharist in the first place. The priest is to be an icon of Christ, and in the liturgy, we receive grace from Christ. It points to a particular reality of the spiritual life. We are not active, nor are we the initiators. It is God who gives us grace. It is he who pursues us. Thus, it is most appropriate that we receive Holy Communion from the hands of the priest. We (the Church) are the bride. Christ is the groom. 

Call me 'old fashion' but I still favor only the Priest and/or Deaconate administering Holy Communion.  End of story...

I think this is the best way to go. The RCC had a priest shortage up until a few years ago, and they still have a deacon shortage from the looks of it. Maybe if they try to get more deacons, they won't have to resort to lay Eucharistic ministers in so many parishes- and Communion will look orderly again, for once. Lax behavior at Communion was one of the reasons I wanted to leave that church in the first place.
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« Reply #13 on: July 12, 2012, 08:34:10 AM »

This does not seem to be a significant problem in the RC Church today, where the Eucharistic ministers are responsible for observing that each communicant places the body in their mouth before moving on.

At the Catholic secondary school I attended, whenever a Mass was held at the school many of the kids would keep the wafer in their mouth, take it out and stick it under the pew like a piece of bubble gum when they went to sit back down.

I think the problem is more with school masses than with the method of distribution though.
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« Reply #14 on: July 12, 2012, 09:08:27 AM »

This does not seem to be a significant problem in the RC Church today, where the Eucharistic ministers are responsible for observing that each communicant places the body in their mouth before moving on.

At the Catholic secondary school I attended, whenever a Mass was held at the school many of the kids would keep the wafer in their mouth, take it out and stick it under the pew like a piece of bubble gum when they went to sit back down.

I think the problem is more with school masses than with the method of distribution though.

Or, perhaps more specifically, a lack of catechesis and discipline at that particular school.  Interesting how easy it is to extrapolate from the specific to the general, often times incorrectly.  But, kids being kids, hey....anything is possible  laugh.
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« Reply #15 on: July 13, 2012, 01:53:24 PM »

This does not seem to be a significant problem in the RC Church today, where the Eucharistic ministers are responsible for observing that each communicant places the body in their mouth before moving on.

At the Catholic secondary school I attended, whenever a Mass was held at the school many of the kids would keep the wafer in their mouth, take it out and stick it under the pew like a piece of bubble gum when they went to sit back down.

I think the problem is more with school masses than with the method of distribution though.
That's terrible. Did anyone ever notify the Priest that this was going on? They certainly should have.
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« Reply #16 on: July 13, 2012, 03:13:47 PM »

This does not seem to be a significant problem in the RC Church today, where the Eucharistic ministers are responsible for observing that each communicant places the body in their mouth before moving on.

At the Catholic secondary school I attended, whenever a Mass was held at the school many of the kids would keep the wafer in their mouth, take it out and stick it under the pew like a piece of bubble gum when they went to sit back down.

I think the problem is more with school masses than with the method of distribution though.
That's terrible. Did anyone ever notify the Priest that this was going on? They certainly should have.


So much for Catechism Classes.....
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« Reply #17 on: July 13, 2012, 03:52:18 PM »

This does not seem to be a significant problem in the RC Church today, where the Eucharistic ministers are responsible for observing that each communicant places the body in their mouth before moving on.

At the Catholic secondary school I attended, whenever a Mass was held at the school many of the kids would keep the wafer in their mouth, take it out and stick it under the pew like a piece of bubble gum when they went to sit back down.

I think the problem is more with school masses than with the method of distribution though.
That's terrible. Did anyone ever notify the Priest that this was going on? They certainly should have.


So much for Catechism Classes.....

Yup.  All catechism classes should be denounced, cancelled, and banned because of a single anecdote  at a single Catholic secondary school.  After all, because of that one reported set of incidents, that just proves beyond all doubt whatsoever that all catechism classes everywhere and at any time are totally ineffectual and useless.  Got it.

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« Reply #18 on: July 13, 2012, 03:57:48 PM »

Quote
All catechism classes should be denounced, cancelled, and banned because of a single anecdote  at a single Catholic secondary school
Yep. Abolish the papacy, crumble Rome to the ground and come back to Orthodoxy with sackcloth and ashes and all will be forgiven  laugh

PP
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« Reply #19 on: July 13, 2012, 04:13:09 PM »

Quote
All catechism classes should be denounced, cancelled, and banned because of a single anecdote  at a single Catholic secondary school
Yep. Abolish the papacy, crumble Rome to the ground and come back to Orthodoxy with sackcloth and ashes and all will be forgiven  laugh

PP

I assure you, my Catholicism is quite orthodox.  Thanks for the offer, but no thanks  laugh  Crumbling Rome to the ground would just result in a big mess with lots of dead hedonistic Italians.   And, the waste of all that wonderful pasta and sausage and vino and those shoes...oh, those handmande Italian shoes... laugh  (how I wish I could afford some!!)
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« Reply #20 on: July 13, 2012, 04:15:16 PM »

Quote
All catechism classes should be denounced, cancelled, and banned because of a single anecdote  at a single Catholic secondary school
Yep. Abolish the papacy, crumble Rome to the ground and come back to Orthodoxy with sackcloth and ashes and all will be forgiven  laugh

PP

I assure you, my Catholicism is quite orthodox.  Thanks for the offer, but no thanks  laugh  Crumbling Rome to the ground would just result in a big mess with lots of dead hedonistic Italians.   And, the waste of all that wonderful pasta and sausage and vino and those shoes...oh, those handmande Italian shoes... laugh  (how I wish I could afford some!!)
laugh
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« Reply #21 on: July 13, 2012, 05:27:23 PM »


You never miss a chance to try to poke the Catholic Church in the eye with a sharp stick, do you?  
[/quote]

As a former RC with 12 years of parochial education under my belt, I can certainly speak my mind on how Catholic education has degraded over the years.  This IS a sharp stick in the eye of those who are incapable of teaching the youth how to properly honor and respect the host when it is received.  Heck, we had nuns making sure that this sort of ABOMINATION didnt happen.  Oh, and before I forget, these kids are above the age of reason and this sort of practice is condemning them regardless of "KIDS WILL BE KIDS"....

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« Reply #22 on: July 13, 2012, 11:41:28 PM »

Quote
All catechism classes should be denounced, cancelled, and banned because of a single anecdote  at a single Catholic secondary school
Yep. Abolish the papacy, crumble Rome to the ground and come back to Orthodoxy with sackcloth and ashes and all will be forgiven  laugh

PP

I assure you, my Catholicism is quite orthodox.  Thanks for the offer, but no thanks  laugh  Crumbling Rome to the ground would just result in a big mess with lots of dead hedonistic Italians.   And, the waste of all that wonderful pasta and sausage and vino and those shoes...oh, those handmande Italian shoes... laugh  (how I wish I could afford some!!)

Okay, okay... Forget the sackcloth and ashes. Just bring a good meal and shoes for all. Wink
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« Reply #23 on: July 13, 2012, 11:52:58 PM »

Greetings in that Divine and Most Precious Name of Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ!

I don't mean to stir controversy, but I just learned of this by coincidence today.  I'm a bit late in learning about this, but I am also not a Catholic Smiley

What do y'all think about female Eucharistic ministers? I know we disagree, obviously by a lot of the backlash just as the idea of girls wearing the same vestments as altar boys, but seriously, what is y'all opinion?  In particular, what do our resident Catholic boardies think.  Could some of the Catholics here perhaps explain their experience or reasoning with this? I am curious more so than judgemental about this.

stay blessed,
habte selassie

I was at a funeral at a Roman Catholic Church a few months ago. Yup, there were two older women in pastel dresses who stood on the stage where the alter was located. They distributed the Eucharist.

I was at a memorial service last year for a lapsed Catholic. A priest conducted a service and then spoke. He said that you don't need to attend Church to go to Heaven. He said we should not believe anyone who tells us otherwise. I guess that was supposed to be comforting for the family. 
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« Reply #24 on: July 14, 2012, 01:33:09 PM »

Greetings in that Divine and Most Precious Name of Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ!

I don't mean to stir controversy, but I just learned of this by coincidence today.  I'm a bit late in learning about this, but I am also not a Catholic Smiley

What do y'all think about female Eucharistic ministers? I know we disagree, obviously by a lot of the backlash just as the idea of girls wearing the same vestments as altar boys, but seriously, what is y'all opinion?  In particular, what do our resident Catholic boardies think.  Could some of the Catholics here perhaps explain their experience or reasoning with this? I am curious more so than judgemental about this.

stay blessed,
habte selassie

I was at a funeral at a Roman Catholic Church a few months ago. Yup, there were two older women in pastel dresses who stood on the stage where the alter was located. They distributed the Eucharist.

I was at a memorial service last year for a lapsed Catholic. A priest conducted a service and then spoke. He said that you don't need to attend Church to go to Heaven. He said we should not believe anyone who tells us otherwise. I guess that was supposed to be comforting for the family. 
What was he supposed to say, "so-and-so is in hell right now"?
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« Reply #25 on: July 14, 2012, 01:37:46 PM »

It is possible to not lie, and instead address God's mercy, which both the lapsed and the active depend on. I don't think the message that we don't need to attend church is comforting in the least. At best, it gives false hope and an excuse to be frivolous in this life. That's not right.
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« Reply #26 on: July 15, 2012, 12:10:49 AM »

It is possible to not lie, and instead address God's mercy, which both the lapsed and the active depend on. I don't think the message that we don't need to attend church is comforting in the least. At best, it gives false hope and an excuse to be frivolous in this life. That's not right.

I agree.  The priest could have focused on talking about God's mercy and how it is available for all.  He doesn't have to make things up for the feelings of the family.
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« Reply #27 on: July 15, 2012, 04:03:24 PM »

Greetings in that Divine and Most Precious Name of Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ!

I don't mean to stir controversy, but I just learned of this by coincidence today.  I'm a bit late in learning about this, but I am also not a Catholic Smiley

What do y'all think about female Eucharistic ministers?
I know we disagree, obviously by a lot of the backlash just as the idea of girls wearing the same vestments as altar boys, but seriously, what is y'all opinion?  In particular, what do our resident Catholic boardies think.  Could some of the Catholics here perhaps explain their experience or reasoning with this? I am curious more so than judgemental about this.

stay blessed,
habte selassie
I abhor them and wouldn't step foot in a Church that makes use of them.

More VII liberal garbage.

You can keep them, altar girls and their "clown masses". Roll Eyes
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« Reply #28 on: July 15, 2012, 06:45:44 PM »

clown masses
In your experience, do these exist outside the world of the internet?
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« Reply #29 on: July 16, 2012, 07:48:36 AM »

This reminds me of my friend's wedding recently when the deacon performing the wedding prayed the following:

"Lord may <name> and <name> be blessed with long life, and that they may see their children's children, and aww, what the heck their children's children's children. Amen"

PP
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« Reply #30 on: July 16, 2012, 08:59:18 AM »

This reminds me of my friend's wedding recently when the deacon performing the wedding prayed the following:

"Lord may <name> and <name> be blessed with long life, and that they may see their children's children, and aww, what the heck their children's children's children. Amen"

PP

How Quaint
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« Reply #31 on: July 16, 2012, 07:26:14 PM »


You never miss a chance to try to poke the Catholic Church in the eye with a sharp stick, do you?  

As a former RC with 12 years of parochial education under my belt, I can certainly speak my mind on how Catholic education has degraded over the years.  This IS a sharp stick in the eye of those who are incapable of teaching the youth how to properly honor and respect the host when it is received.  Heck, we had nuns making sure that this sort of ABOMINATION didnt happen.  Oh, and before I forget, these kids are above the age of reason and this sort of practice is condemning them regardless of "KIDS WILL BE KIDS"....


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I agree with you Joe!
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« Reply #32 on: July 18, 2012, 02:55:59 PM »

clown masses
In your experience, do these exist outside the world of the internet?
What does that matter?

There are a lot of abuses within the "New Mass", just because some are reported on the Internet you're saying it's not true?

And no, I haven't personally attended a "clown mass", but I've seen my share of abuses with my own eyes.



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« Reply #33 on: July 18, 2012, 03:13:54 PM »

clown masses
In your experience, do these exist outside the world of the internet?
What does that matter?

There are a lot of abuses within the "New Mass", just because some are reported on the Internet you're saying it's not true?

And no, I haven't personally attended a "clown mass", but I've seen my share of abuses with my own eyes.





Why do you stick around then? 
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« Reply #34 on: July 18, 2012, 04:29:54 PM »

clown masses
In your experience, do these exist outside the world of the internet?
What does that matter?

There are a lot of abuses within the "New Mass", just because some are reported on the Internet you're saying it's not true?

And no, I haven't personally attended a "clown mass", but I've seen my share of abuses with my own eyes.





Why do you stick around then? 
People registered with the SSPX consider themselves Catholics, but do not accept most of the novelties introduced after Vatican II. Priests at the SSPX are not excommunicated, but at the same time, they are not considered to be in full communion with the  post Vatican II Catholic Church.
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« Reply #35 on: July 20, 2012, 08:36:38 PM »

clown masses
In your experience, do these exist outside the world of the internet?
What does that matter?

There are a lot of abuses within the "New Mass", just because some are reported on the Internet you're saying it's not true?

And no, I haven't personally attended a "clown mass", but I've seen my share of abuses with my own eyes.





Why do you stick around then? 
I don't attend Novus Ordo Mass.
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« Reply #36 on: July 20, 2012, 08:37:30 PM »

clown masses
In your experience, do these exist outside the world of the internet?
What does that matter?

There are a lot of abuses within the "New Mass", just because some are reported on the Internet you're saying it's not true?

And no, I haven't personally attended a "clown mass", but I've seen my share of abuses with my own eyes.





Why do you stick around then? 
People registered with the SSPX consider themselves Catholics, but do not accept most of the novelties introduced after Vatican II. Priests at the SSPX are not excommunicated, but at the same time, they are not considered to be in full communion with the  post Vatican II Catholic Church.
I'm not SSPX or Sede.

Just sayin.
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« Reply #37 on: July 25, 2012, 11:15:49 PM »

clown masses
In your experience, do these exist outside the world of the internet?
What does that matter?

There are a lot of abuses within the "New Mass", just because some are reported on the Internet you're saying it's not true?

And no, I haven't personally attended a "clown mass", but I've seen my share of abuses with my own eyes.
That wasn't my point. People who are opponents of the Ordinary Form of the Roman Rite, or just opponents of the Catholic Church in general, often cite "proof" of clown masses online as a basis for their argument as if they are a common occurrence. From everything I've heard/read, if they exist at all it is a very isolated thing. Other abuses are another thing altogether. If abuses are occurring, the more prudent thing to do, rather than completely writing off the Ordinary Form Mass altogether, would be to speak to the Priest, or to the Bishop of the diocese it is happening in, etc.
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« Reply #38 on: July 25, 2012, 11:25:37 PM »

clown masses
In your experience, do these exist outside the world of the internet?
What does that matter?

There are a lot of abuses within the "New Mass", just because some are reported on the Internet you're saying it's not true?

And no, I haven't personally attended a "clown mass", but I've seen my share of abuses with my own eyes.
That wasn't my point. People who are opponents of the Ordinary Form of the Roman Rite, or just opponents of the Catholic Church in general, often cite "proof" of clown masses online as a basis for their argument as if they are a common occurrence. From everything I've heard/read, if they exist at all it is a very isolated thing. Other abuses are another thing altogether. If abuses are occurring, the more prudent thing to do, rather than completely writing off the Ordinary Form Mass altogether, would be to speak to the Priest, or to the Bishop of the diocese it is happening in, etc.
This is just a question: What do you think of the following Catholic Mass?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rh_nqtp3VrU
Everyone seems to be having such a good time?
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« Reply #39 on: July 26, 2012, 01:15:37 AM »

I have seen nuns be given this task sometimes. No, they don't have women deacons.

That was a joke.

People used to receive Eucharist every Sunday to take It daily and now there are protests against receiving It in hands. I do not see any sense in that.

But still, the giver on Sunday for the rest of the week was the priest.  Christ gave to the Apostles, and the Apostles gave to the people. 
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« Reply #40 on: July 26, 2012, 01:26:22 AM »

clown masses
In your experience, do these exist outside the world of the internet?
What does that matter?

There are a lot of abuses within the "New Mass", just because some are reported on the Internet you're saying it's not true?

And no, I haven't personally attended a "clown mass", but I've seen my share of abuses with my own eyes.
That wasn't my point. People who are opponents of the Ordinary Form of the Roman Rite, or just opponents of the Catholic Church in general, often cite "proof" of clown masses online as a basis for their argument as if they are a common occurrence. From everything I've heard/read, if they exist at all it is a very isolated thing. Other abuses are another thing altogether. If abuses are occurring, the more prudent thing to do, rather than completely writing off the Ordinary Form Mass altogether, would be to speak to the Priest, or to the Bishop of the diocese it is happening in, etc.
This is just a question: What do you think of the following Catholic Mass?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rh_nqtp3VrU
Everyone seems to be having such a good time? 

They seem to be having a blast. 

Note:  thought of the average parishioner-- "please don't let this monstrosity come out of its costume and eat me"

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« Reply #41 on: July 26, 2012, 01:28:17 AM »

Greetings in that Divine and Most Precious Name of Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ!

I don't mean to stir controversy, but I just learned of this by coincidence today.  I'm a bit late in learning about this, but I am also not a Catholic Smiley

What do y'all think about female Eucharistic ministers? I know we disagree, obviously by a lot of the backlash just as the idea of girls wearing the same vestments as altar boys, but seriously, what is y'all opinion?  In particular, what do our resident Catholic boardies think.  Could some of the Catholics here perhaps explain their experience or reasoning with this? I am curious more so than judgemental about this.

stay blessed,
habte selassie

Not really about women Eucharistic ministers.  Is it because is a woman that is abberation? 
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« Reply #42 on: July 26, 2012, 03:29:38 AM »

Quote
If abuses are occurring, the more prudent thing to do, rather than completely writing off the Ordinary Form Mass altogether, would be to speak to the Priest, or to the Bishop of the diocese it is happening in, etc.

Wyatt, I was at a confirmation of a young boy earlier this year. The local RC bishop officiated, as is the custom. After the service (prerecorded singing with karaoke-style bouncing ball lyrics on a projector screen) ended, the newly-confirmed were ushered by the priest to the space behind the altar table. Girls as well as boys. The bishop joined them there. The kiddies were being typical kiddies - a bit of jostling, a bit of giggling, curiosity at the objects on the Table. Little hands touching the Table. The bishop simply stood there, smiling with everyone gathered.

I was shocked and mortified at this complete lack of respect and reverence for the holiest part of the church, and all under the direct supervision of the bishop. I'm yet to be convinced that this is simply an aberration. What would be the point of anyone complaining to the priest or bishop?
« Last Edit: July 26, 2012, 03:30:45 AM by LBK » Logged
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« Reply #43 on: July 26, 2012, 12:19:41 PM »

Quote
If abuses are occurring, the more prudent thing to do, rather than completely writing off the Ordinary Form Mass altogether, would be to speak to the Priest, or to the Bishop of the diocese it is happening in, etc.

Wyatt, I was at a confirmation of a young boy earlier this year. The local RC bishop officiated, as is the custom. After the service (prerecorded singing with karaoke-style bouncing ball lyrics on a projector screen) ended, the newly-confirmed were ushered by the priest to the space behind the altar table. Girls as well as boys. The bishop joined them there. The kiddies were being typical kiddies - a bit of jostling, a bit of giggling, curiosity at the objects on the Table. Little hands touching the Table. The bishop simply stood there, smiling with everyone gathered.

I was shocked and mortified at this complete lack of respect and reverence for the holiest part of the church, and all under the direct supervision of the bishop. I'm yet to be convinced that this is simply an aberration. What would be the point of anyone complaining to the priest or bishop?

In that case you write to Rome.  And you keep writing or you just move to Orthodoxy and take pot shots at the Church you just left.  It is really quite simple.

M.
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« Reply #44 on: July 26, 2012, 01:52:28 PM »

clown masses
In your experience, do these exist outside the world of the internet?
What does that matter?

There are a lot of abuses within the "New Mass", just because some are reported on the Internet you're saying it's not true?

And no, I haven't personally attended a "clown mass", but I've seen my share of abuses with my own eyes.
That wasn't my point. People who are opponents of the Ordinary Form of the Roman Rite, or just opponents of the Catholic Church in general, often cite "proof" of clown masses online as a basis for their argument as if they are a common occurrence. From everything I've heard/read, if they exist at all it is a very isolated thing. Other abuses are another thing altogether. If abuses are occurring, the more prudent thing to do, rather than completely writing off the Ordinary Form Mass altogether, would be to speak to the Priest, or to the Bishop of the diocese it is happening in, etc.
This is just a question: What do you think of the following Catholic Mass?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rh_nqtp3VrU
Everyone seems to be having such a good time?

If I had a nickel for every time I've seen that exact video thrown out in a discussion of liturgical abuses, I could buy my own puppet costume. Literally just about every time. And, that's the only video of a clown mass I've ever seen.
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« Reply #45 on: July 26, 2012, 02:24:20 PM »

clown masses
In your experience, do these exist outside the world of the internet?
What does that matter?

There are a lot of abuses within the "New Mass", just because some are reported on the Internet you're saying it's not true?

And no, I haven't personally attended a "clown mass", but I've seen my share of abuses with my own eyes.
That wasn't my point. People who are opponents of the Ordinary Form of the Roman Rite, or just opponents of the Catholic Church in general, often cite "proof" of clown masses online as a basis for their argument as if they are a common occurrence. From everything I've heard/read, if they exist at all it is a very isolated thing. Other abuses are another thing altogether. If abuses are occurring, the more prudent thing to do, rather than completely writing off the Ordinary Form Mass altogether, would be to speak to the Priest, or to the Bishop of the diocese it is happening in, etc.

I find this to be reasonable. I'm getting tired of seeing the same videos of that one clown mass and that one puppet mass over and over. It would be nice to have a critical discussion on the OF as it was actually intended to be (that is, what is in the rubrics) rather than the abuses that certain people commit.
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« Reply #46 on: July 27, 2012, 01:29:43 PM »

I'm getting tired of seeing the same videos of that one clown mass and that one puppet mass over and over.
OK. Here's a photo of a a “Hardrock-Mass” in the Cathedral of Tarragona (Spain) on the 8th of April 2012. (scroll down).
http://wdtprs.com/blog/2012/07/reason-12894-for-summorum-pontificum/
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« Reply #47 on: July 27, 2012, 03:01:20 PM »

I'm getting tired of seeing the same videos of that one clown mass and that one puppet mass over and over.
OK. Here's a photo of a a “Hardrock-Mass” in the Cathedral of Tarragona (Spain) on the 8th of April 2012. (scroll down).
http://wdtprs.com/blog/2012/07/reason-12894-for-summorum-pontificum/

Oy.  Vey.   Roll Eyes Shocked Roll Eyes Shocked
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« Reply #48 on: July 27, 2012, 09:39:12 PM »

clown masses
In your experience, do these exist outside the world of the internet?
What does that matter?

There are a lot of abuses within the "New Mass", just because some are reported on the Internet you're saying it's not true?

And no, I haven't personally attended a "clown mass", but I've seen my share of abuses with my own eyes.
That wasn't my point. People who are opponents of the Ordinary Form of the Roman Rite, or just opponents of the Catholic Church in general, often cite "proof" of clown masses online as a basis for their argument as if they are a common occurrence. From everything I've heard/read, if they exist at all it is a very isolated thing. Other abuses are another thing altogether. If abuses are occurring, the more prudent thing to do, rather than completely writing off the Ordinary Form Mass altogether, would be to speak to the Priest, or to the Bishop of the diocese it is happening in, etc.
And what good would that do, really. The liberal Bishops are the problem to begin with most of the time, this cancer begins at the hierarchy as it is, there are few traditional clerical to begin with and they are more of a target of disdain from many of these same Bishops. I wouldn't waste my time on these modernists. Fortunately, Benedict issued "motu proprio" and the Summorum Pontificum with the TLM and things are beginning to turn around slowly, hopefully as more of the old hippies from VII begin to die off these abuses will begin to fade away as well. Until that time, I will avoid Norvus Ordo with their altar girls and female "Eucharistic ministers" as much as possible.

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« Reply #49 on: July 27, 2012, 09:45:44 PM »

clown masses
In your experience, do these exist outside the world of the internet?
What does that matter?

There are a lot of abuses within the "New Mass", just because some are reported on the Internet you're saying it's not true?

And no, I haven't personally attended a "clown mass", but I've seen my share of abuses with my own eyes.
That wasn't my point. People who are opponents of the Ordinary Form of the Roman Rite, or just opponents of the Catholic Church in general, often cite "proof" of clown masses online as a basis for their argument as if they are a common occurrence. From everything I've heard/read, if they exist at all it is a very isolated thing. Other abuses are another thing altogether. If abuses are occurring, the more prudent thing to do, rather than completely writing off the Ordinary Form Mass altogether, would be to speak to the Priest, or to the Bishop of the diocese it is happening in, etc.
This is just a question: What do you think of the following Catholic Mass?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rh_nqtp3VrU
Everyone seems to be having such a good time?
I think that abomination is neither "catholic" nor a Mass.

I think they must've passed out some pretty good drugs at the door of whatever you want to call that place.

Just don't call it a Church.
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« Reply #50 on: July 27, 2012, 09:52:06 PM »

I'm getting tired of seeing the same videos of that one clown mass and that one puppet mass over and over.
OK. Here's a photo of a a “Hardrock-Mass” in the Cathedral of Tarragona (Spain) on the 8th of April 2012. (scroll down).
http://wdtprs.com/blog/2012/07/reason-12894-for-summorum-pontificum/
More modernist garbage.

What is this now, some kind of "catholic" Christian rock?

Why don't these kooks just leave the Church and convert to evangelical Protestantism already?

Just more fruits ( and I do mean "fruits")of VII.  Roll Eyes
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« Reply #51 on: July 27, 2012, 10:43:46 PM »

clown masses
In your experience, do these exist outside the world of the internet?
What does that matter?

There are a lot of abuses within the "New Mass", just because some are reported on the Internet you're saying it's not true?

And no, I haven't personally attended a "clown mass", but I've seen my share of abuses with my own eyes.
That wasn't my point. People who are opponents of the Ordinary Form of the Roman Rite, or just opponents of the Catholic Church in general, often cite "proof" of clown masses online as a basis for their argument as if they are a common occurrence. From everything I've heard/read, if they exist at all it is a very isolated thing. Other abuses are another thing altogether. If abuses are occurring, the more prudent thing to do, rather than completely writing off the Ordinary Form Mass altogether, would be to speak to the Priest, or to the Bishop of the diocese it is happening in, etc.
This is just a question: What do you think of the following Catholic Mass?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rh_nqtp3VrU
Everyone seems to be having such a good time?
I think that abomination is neither "catholic" nor a Mass.

I think they must've passed out some pretty good drugs at the door of whatever you want to call that place.

Just don't call it a Church.
Bishop Remi J. de Roo, who said the Mass, is a  a “Pilgrim of the Second Vatican Council” and in good standing with the Roman Catholic Church. He is not the only one to make use of female lectors. At least, the female lector at this Mass was modestly dressed.
« Last Edit: July 27, 2012, 10:46:32 PM by stanley123 » Logged
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« Reply #52 on: July 29, 2012, 06:11:34 PM »

clown masses
In your experience, do these exist outside the world of the internet?

I've been to one.
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« Reply #53 on: July 29, 2012, 06:50:32 PM »

clown masses
In your experience, do these exist outside the world of the internet?

I've been to one.
Did you stay around or did you leave?
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« Reply #54 on: July 31, 2012, 01:27:04 PM »

clown masses
In your experience, do these exist outside the world of the internet?

I've been to one.
Did you stay around or did you leave?

Stuck around. I was going with my family to a RC Easter Vigil.
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« Reply #55 on: July 31, 2012, 01:58:39 PM »

clown masses
In your experience, do these exist outside the world of the internet?

I've been to one.
Did you stay around or did you leave?

Stuck around. I was going with my family to a RC Easter Vigil.
Ah I see. You were stuck in a tough situation. If I had been present at such a thing and was able to I would have left such sacrilege behind. Depending on the severity of the abuses (which it sounds like it was severe) it is quite likely it that it was not even a Mass at all.
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« Reply #56 on: July 31, 2012, 02:23:35 PM »

clown masses
In your experience, do these exist outside the world of the internet?

I've been to one.
Did you stay around or did you leave?

Stuck around. I was going with my family to a RC Easter Vigil.
Ah I see. You were stuck in a tough situation. If I had been present at such a thing and was able to I would have left such sacrilege behind. Depending on the severity of the abuses (which it sounds like it was severe) it is quite likely it that it was not even a Mass at all.

+1

If it was indeed a "clown mass" (or any Mass with obvious, severe abuses taking place) I, too, would have left--immediately.  And then I would have contacted the bishop at the earliest opportunity.
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« Reply #57 on: July 31, 2012, 02:59:05 PM »

clown masses
In your experience, do these exist outside the world of the internet?

I've been to one.
Did you stay around or did you leave?

Stuck around. I was going with my family to a RC Easter Vigil.
Ah I see. You were stuck in a tough situation. If I had been present at such a thing and was able to I would have left such sacrilege behind. Depending on the severity of the abuses (which it sounds like it was severe) it is quite likely it that it was not even a Mass at all.

I don't remember exactly what went through my head at the moment - something like I'm here for my family, not myself, and as a former/non-practicing Catholic it isn't really my place to make a statement of some kind. My mother thought about complaining but my father convinced her not to. Wouldn't want her to get too influenced by my overly stringent and reactionary religious beliefs.  angel

I don't know if it would be considered an invalid mass from a RC perspective. Nothing was done with the Eucharistic prayer (besides the usual problems with Eucharistic ministers). It was mostly the liturgy of the Word - dramatizing and acting out the readings in costume (changing the actual text of the Bible in the process), doing this weird liturgical dance led by a woman dressed up in some sort of pseudo-clerical garb, theatrical sound effects, etc.
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« Reply #58 on: July 31, 2012, 08:40:10 PM »

If it was indeed a "clown mass" (or any Mass with obvious, severe abuses taking place) I, too, would have left--immediately.  And then I would have contacted the bishop at the earliest opportunity.
But what if the Mass was said by a Roman Catholic bishop, which of course was the case for the "puppet Mass".  Everybody knows about this Mass, which has been all over the internet for some time,  and AFAIK nothing was done about it. So wouldn't it be reasonable to conclude that this Mass was just fine as far as the Catholic hierarchy and Catholic authorities are concerned? Everyone was having such a good time, and apparently, as far as the Catholic authorities in charge of liturgy are concerned,  there is nothing wrong with that in this case?
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« Reply #59 on: August 01, 2012, 12:09:13 AM »

If it was indeed a "clown mass" (or any Mass with obvious, severe abuses taking place) I, too, would have left--immediately.  And then I would have contacted the bishop at the earliest opportunity.
But what if the Mass was said by a Roman Catholic bishop, which of course was the case for the "puppet Mass".  Everybody knows about this Mass, which has been all over the internet for some time,  and AFAIK nothing was done about it. So wouldn't it be reasonable to conclude that this Mass was just fine as far as the Catholic hierarchy and Catholic authorities are concerned? Everyone was having such a good time, and apparently, as far as the Catholic authorities in charge of liturgy are concerned,  there is nothing wrong with that in this case?

Well at least it wasn't a Seusscharist.
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« Reply #60 on: August 01, 2012, 01:59:58 PM »

If it was indeed a "clown mass" (or any Mass with obvious, severe abuses taking place) I, too, would have left--immediately.  And then I would have contacted the bishop at the earliest opportunity.
But what if the Mass was said by a Roman Catholic bishop, which of course was the case for the "puppet Mass".  Everybody knows about this Mass, which has been all over the internet for some time,  and AFAIK nothing was done about it. So wouldn't it be reasonable to conclude that this Mass was just fine as far as the Catholic hierarchy and Catholic authorities are concerned? Everyone was having such a good time, and apparently, as far as the Catholic authorities in charge of liturgy are concerned,  there is nothing wrong with that in this case?
This would be an instance when contacting Rome would be warranted.
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« Reply #61 on: August 01, 2012, 02:32:25 PM »

If it was indeed a "clown mass" (or any Mass with obvious, severe abuses taking place) I, too, would have left--immediately.  And then I would have contacted the bishop at the earliest opportunity.
But what if the Mass was said by a Roman Catholic bishop, which of course was the case for the "puppet Mass".  Everybody knows about this Mass, which has been all over the internet for some time,  and AFAIK nothing was done about it. So wouldn't it be reasonable to conclude that this Mass was just fine as far as the Catholic hierarchy and Catholic authorities are concerned? Everyone was having such a good time, and apparently, as far as the Catholic authorities in charge of liturgy are concerned,  there is nothing wrong with that in this case?
This would be an instance when contacting Rome would be warranted.
I have seen objections from sedevacantists, but I have not heard about any objections from Rome concerning this Mass.
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« Reply #62 on: August 01, 2012, 03:49:59 PM »

If it was indeed a "clown mass" (or any Mass with obvious, severe abuses taking place) I, too, would have left--immediately.  And then I would have contacted the bishop at the earliest opportunity.
But what if the Mass was said by a Roman Catholic bishop, which of course was the case for the "puppet Mass".  Everybody knows about this Mass, which has been all over the internet for some time,  and AFAIK nothing was done about it. So wouldn't it be reasonable to conclude that this Mass was just fine as far as the Catholic hierarchy and Catholic authorities are concerned? Everyone was having such a good time, and apparently, as far as the Catholic authorities in charge of liturgy are concerned,  there is nothing wrong with that in this case?
This would be an instance when contacting Rome would be warranted.
I have seen objections from sedevacantists, but I have not heard about any objections from Rome concerning this Mass.

Doesn't mean there weren't objections from Rome, though. 
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« Reply #63 on: August 01, 2012, 04:01:35 PM »

If it was indeed a "clown mass" (or any Mass with obvious, severe abuses taking place) I, too, would have left--immediately.  And then I would have contacted the bishop at the earliest opportunity.
But what if the Mass was said by a Roman Catholic bishop, which of course was the case for the "puppet Mass".  Everybody knows about this Mass, which has been all over the internet for some time,  and AFAIK nothing was done about it. So wouldn't it be reasonable to conclude that this Mass was just fine as far as the Catholic hierarchy and Catholic authorities are concerned? Everyone was having such a good time, and apparently, as far as the Catholic authorities in charge of liturgy are concerned,  there is nothing wrong with that in this case?
This would be an instance when contacting Rome would be warranted.
I have seen objections from sedevacantists, but I have not heard about any objections from Rome concerning this Mass.

Doesn't mean there weren't objections from Rome, though. 

People who p and m that Rome is a policeman also p and m when Rome does not act like a policeman.

It is par for this course.

M.
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« Reply #64 on: August 01, 2012, 07:38:42 PM »

If it was indeed a "clown mass" (or any Mass with obvious, severe abuses taking place) I, too, would have left--immediately.  And then I would have contacted the bishop at the earliest opportunity.
But what if the Mass was said by a Roman Catholic bishop, which of course was the case for the "puppet Mass".  Everybody knows about this Mass, which has been all over the internet for some time,  and AFAIK nothing was done about it. So wouldn't it be reasonable to conclude that this Mass was just fine as far as the Catholic hierarchy and Catholic authorities are concerned? Everyone was having such a good time, and apparently, as far as the Catholic authorities in charge of liturgy are concerned,  there is nothing wrong with that in this case?
This would be an instance when contacting Rome would be warranted.
I have seen objections from sedevacantists, but I have not heard about any objections from Rome concerning this Mass.

Doesn't mean there weren't objections from Rome, though. 
Doesn't mean that there were objections,  either.
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« Reply #65 on: August 01, 2012, 08:06:24 PM »

Greetings in that Divine and Most Precious Name of Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ!

clown masses
In your experience, do these exist outside the world of the internet?
What does that matter?

There are a lot of abuses within the "New Mass", just because some are reported on the Internet you're saying it's not true?

And no, I haven't personally attended a "clown mass", but I've seen my share of abuses with my own eyes.
That wasn't my point. People who are opponents of the Ordinary Form of the Roman Rite, or just opponents of the Catholic Church in general, often cite "proof" of clown masses online as a basis for their argument as if they are a common occurrence. From everything I've heard/read, if they exist at all it is a very isolated thing. Other abuses are another thing altogether. If abuses are occurring, the more prudent thing to do, rather than completely writing off the Ordinary Form Mass altogether, would be to speak to the Priest, or to the Bishop of the diocese it is happening in, etc.
This is just a question: What do you think of the following Catholic Mass?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rh_nqtp3VrU
Everyone seems to be having such a good time?

Looks like someone took some Mardi Gras parade puppets and brought them into Mass..  I've also never seen so many older midwest white folks digging interpretative dance, its really more of A Different World kind of thing Wink

About any other criticisms of this video, well, its just too easy.  Can we get back to the more readily discussable Female Eucharistic Ministers? So its just a Papal Infallibility thing so that folks can explain away any conflict with Tradition, or with the Scriptures, or with the Fathers? 

I'm glad to see many of the Catholics here are a bit upset about it.  I suggest we pray about it, converting the passions of our anger to the Passion of Christ, and let God sort out His own.  We couldn't change the Church one way or the other if we wanted to, be it a digression or a restoration, and so that being said, we can only pray for the Grace of God to resonate in the hearts of parish by parish, priest by priest, person by person, until the Kingdom is brought into the world stemming from the unified heart of the Body of Christ.

stay blessed,
habte selassie
stay blessed,
habte selassie
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« Reply #66 on: August 02, 2012, 10:10:41 AM »

If it was indeed a "clown mass" (or any Mass with obvious, severe abuses taking place) I, too, would have left--immediately.  And then I would have contacted the bishop at the earliest opportunity.
But what if the Mass was said by a Roman Catholic bishop, which of course was the case for the "puppet Mass".  Everybody knows about this Mass, which has been all over the internet for some time,  and AFAIK nothing was done about it. So wouldn't it be reasonable to conclude that this Mass was just fine as far as the Catholic hierarchy and Catholic authorities are concerned? Everyone was having such a good time, and apparently, as far as the Catholic authorities in charge of liturgy are concerned,  there is nothing wrong with that in this case?
This would be an instance when contacting Rome would be warranted.
I have seen objections from sedevacantists, but I have not heard about any objections from Rome concerning this Mass.

Doesn't mean there weren't objections from Rome, though. 
Doesn't mean that there were objections,  either.

So...I guess it doesn't mean anything, then.
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« Reply #67 on: August 02, 2012, 10:14:49 AM »

Greetings in that Divine and Most Precious Name of Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ!

clown masses
In your experience, do these exist outside the world of the internet?
What does that matter?

There are a lot of abuses within the "New Mass", just because some are reported on the Internet you're saying it's not true?

And no, I haven't personally attended a "clown mass", but I've seen my share of abuses with my own eyes.
That wasn't my point. People who are opponents of the Ordinary Form of the Roman Rite, or just opponents of the Catholic Church in general, often cite "proof" of clown masses online as a basis for their argument as if they are a common occurrence. From everything I've heard/read, if they exist at all it is a very isolated thing. Other abuses are another thing altogether. If abuses are occurring, the more prudent thing to do, rather than completely writing off the Ordinary Form Mass altogether, would be to speak to the Priest, or to the Bishop of the diocese it is happening in, etc.
This is just a question: What do you think of the following Catholic Mass?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rh_nqtp3VrU
Everyone seems to be having such a good time?

Looks like someone took some Mardi Gras parade puppets and brought them into Mass..  I've also never seen so many older midwest white folks digging interpretative dance, its really more of A Different World kind of thing Wink

About any other criticisms of this video, well, its just too easy.  Can we get back to the more readily discussable Female Eucharistic Ministers? So its just a Papal Infallibility thing so that folks can explain away any conflict with Tradition, or with the Scriptures, or with the Fathers? 

I'm glad to see many of the Catholics here are a bit upset about it.  I suggest we pray about it, converting the passions of our anger to the Passion of Christ, and let God sort out His own.  We couldn't change the Church one way or the other if we wanted to, be it a digression or a restoration, and so that being said, we can only pray for the Grace of God to resonate in the hearts of parish by parish, priest by priest, person by person, until the Kingdom is brought into the world stemming from the unified heart of the Body of Christ.

stay blessed,
habte selassie
stay blessed,
habte selassie


From Reply #5 above: Their existence and function is approved and "regulated" (well...) by Rome.  See http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/pontifical_councils/laity/documents/rc_con_interdic_doc_15081997_en.html

This is not a "Papal Infallibility thing".  Not even close. 
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