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Author Topic: Has anyone heard anything about Met.Jonah resigning? / Met Jonah Resigns / Holy Synod Releases Official Statement about Met. Jonah's Resignation  (Read 37519 times) Average Rating: 0
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« on: July 07, 2012, 08:48:20 PM »

It has been reported on the Yahoo Orthodox Forum and on the MOnomahkos blog that Met.Jonah has resigned..any truth to this?
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« Reply #1 on: July 07, 2012, 09:01:46 PM »

Whah?  Huh  Shocked  Cry Cry

I looked on Google and all the news they had was about when he addressed the ACNA conference. Nothing newer than that.
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« Reply #2 on: July 07, 2012, 09:14:44 PM »

There were rumors in 2011 that he'd resigned, they weren't true...

Monomakhos, a private blog from a man who seems kinda anti-episcopacy anyway. Yahoo Orthodox forum, I would trust it about as much as this forum, CF or Monachos. Unless something shows up on OCA.org I wouldn't trust it.
« Last Edit: July 07, 2012, 09:18:17 PM by 88Devin12 » Logged
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« Reply #3 on: July 08, 2012, 03:04:25 PM »

I was just reading through some of the comments on posts at Monomakhos - it's truly incredible the politicized sleeze people hurl at the clergy and one another there. Sounds more like a bunch of Southern Baptists than Orthodox Christians...
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« Reply #4 on: July 08, 2012, 03:33:37 PM »

Do tell.  I was talking with Marcy yesterday, whose friend Fran's husband works with someone who has attended a parish in Poughkeepsie, NY, where Met. Jonah once visited.  He told Fran's husband that he thought that Met. Jonah was supposed to return for another visit, but that it never happened.  Now Fran's husband isn't all that interested, but Fran herself is making some calls and has done some blogging.  She thinks, at least from what Marcy reported, that this cancellation could be due to Met. Jonah resigning.  As for the reasons? Oh my, so much fun speculation. While Marcy figured it was probably due to health or stress, Fran thinks it's probably due to pressure from some of our more aggressive and influential blogists, who've really pushed him on some issues relating to all sorts of things.   This is so exciting!!!! 
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« Reply #5 on: July 08, 2012, 07:52:19 PM »

This from Rod Dreher.  http://www.theamericanconservative.com/dreher/metropolitan-jonah-ousted/

Where there is smoke there is fire, things are going to be interesting.  So disheartened by the lack of effective leadership anywhere in American Bishops of any jurisdiction.
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« Reply #6 on: July 08, 2012, 08:02:07 PM »

There were rumors in 2011 that he'd resigned, they weren't true...

Monomakhos, a private blog from a man who seems kinda anti-episcopacy anyway. Yahoo Orthodox forum, I would trust it about as much as this forum, CF or Monachos. Unless something shows up on OCA.org I wouldn't trust it.
Agreed. Until such time that we receive official word from OCA.org, all we're doing here is engaging in baseless rumor mongering and gossip.
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« Reply #7 on: July 08, 2012, 08:02:31 PM »

...or a couple of people smoking something. Given that Michalopulos and Dreher are fueling this, I'm guessing the latter :-).

This from Rod Dreher.  http://www.theamericanconservative.com/dreher/metropolitan-jonah-ousted/

Where there is smoke there is fire, things are going to be interesting.  So disheartened by the lack of effective leadership anywhere in American Bishops of any jurisdiction.
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« Reply #8 on: July 08, 2012, 10:40:18 PM »

Until such time that we receive official word from OCA.org, all we're doing here is engaging in baseless rumor mongering and gossip.

Precisely!  But people clearly live for this dross.
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« Reply #9 on: July 08, 2012, 11:57:44 PM »

Until such time that we receive official word from OCA.org, all we're doing here is engaging in baseless rumor mongering and gossip.

Precisely!  But people clearly live for this dross soap opera comedy.

Fixed it for you (FIFY).

Ugh. I agree with you. This whole scenario is pathetic.

It would be more gross if Bishop Benjamin were to become the new Metropolitan.
I knew him when he was a deacon. He had a beautiful voice, but he has changed.

I respect Metropolitan Jonah, and I hope he has not resigned. Lord have mercy.
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« Reply #10 on: July 09, 2012, 12:10:53 AM »

http://oca.org/

In a letter addressed to the members of the Holy Synod of Bishops dated Friday, July 6, 2012, His Beatitude, Metropolitan Jonah tendered his resignation as Primate of the Orthodox Church in America.

His Beatitude composed and signed the letter at his residence in Washington, DC, in the presence of Archpriest John Jillions, OCA Chancellor. ...

This is sad.  Lord have mercy on our Bishops.
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« Reply #11 on: July 09, 2012, 12:14:48 AM »

Lord have mercy!   Cry
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« Reply #12 on: July 09, 2012, 12:51:21 AM »

"As per your unanimous request, as conveyed to me by Chancellor Fr. John Jillions, I hereby tender my resignation as Primate of the Orthodox Church in America, and humbly request another Episcopal assignment. ...<sic>... and beg forgiveness for however I have offended you,"

 What was/is the Synod's concern about Metropolitan JONAH?  How long has this been going on?  This is so sad and disappointing...  Sad
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« Reply #13 on: July 09, 2012, 01:14:51 AM »

"As per your unanimous request, as conveyed to me by Chancellor Fr. John Jillions, I hereby tender my resignation as Primate of the Orthodox Church in America, and humbly request another Episcopal assignment. ...<sic>... and beg forgiveness for however I have offended you,"

 What was/is the Synod's concern about Metropolitan JONAH?  How long has this been going on?  This is so sad and disappointing...  Sad
I don't think it's exactly news that the Synod has had concerns about His Beatitude's leadership, since we've heard off and on of disputes between His Beatitude and the rest of the Synod through the last few years. OCA.org has not exactly been silent on this. As I read the letter posted in this article, ISTM that everyone on the Synod, His Beatitude included, has come to the realization that he just doesn't have the right personality for the position of Metropolitan of the OCA, a position he never requested.
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« Reply #14 on: July 09, 2012, 01:18:56 AM »

Some real info on the matter, from the OCA:

http://oca.org/news/headline-news/metropolitan-jonah-tenders-resignation
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« Reply #15 on: July 09, 2012, 01:37:10 AM »

"As per your unanimous request, as conveyed to me by Chancellor Fr. John Jillions, I hereby tender my resignation as Primate of the Orthodox Church in America, and humbly request another Episcopal assignment. ...<sic>... and beg forgiveness for however I have offended you,"

 What was/is the Synod's concern about Metropolitan JONAH?  How long has this been going on?  This is so sad and disappointing...  Sad
I don't think it's exactly news that the Synod has had concerns about His Beatitude's leadership, since we've heard off and on of disputes between His Beatitude and the rest of the Synod through the last few years. OCA.org has not exactly been silent on this. As I read the letter posted in this article, ISTM that everyone on the Synod, His Beatitude included, has come to the realization that he just doesn't have the right personality for the position of Metropolitan of the OCA, a position he never requested.

Very true, there are still members of the "old guard" left, but that should be left to the private section of the site, not for news.
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« Reply #16 on: July 09, 2012, 01:46:04 AM »

"As per your unanimous request, as conveyed to me by Chancellor Fr. John Jillions, I hereby tender my resignation as Primate of the Orthodox Church in America, and humbly request another Episcopal assignment. ...<sic>... and beg forgiveness for however I have offended you,"

 What was/is the Synod's concern about Metropolitan JONAH?  How long has this been going on?  This is so sad and disappointing...  Sad
I don't think it's exactly news that the Synod has had concerns about His Beatitude's leadership, since we've heard off and on of disputes between His Beatitude and the rest of the Synod through the last few years. OCA.org has not exactly been silent on this. As I read the letter posted in this article, ISTM that everyone on the Synod, His Beatitude included, has come to the realization that he just doesn't have the right personality for the position of Metropolitan of the OCA, a position he never requested.

Very true, there are still members of the "old guard" left, but that should be left to the private section of the site, not for news.
I'm not sure, though, that it's safe to reduce this to just a conflict between His Beatitude and the "Old Guard". The synodal decision to ask His Beatitude to step down was unanimous.
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« Reply #17 on: July 09, 2012, 02:12:29 AM »

The synodal decision to ask His Beatitude to step down was unanimous.

And this surprises me. I thought the Synod and the Metropolitan had worked through their big issues after His Beatitude took a leave of absence about a year and a half ago. The candid speaking at the last AAC seemed to affirm that. Now there's a unanimous request for his resignation?
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« Reply #18 on: July 09, 2012, 06:08:14 AM »

Apparently the issues persisted and they felt things were severe enough that they needed to request his resignation :-(.

The synodal decision to ask His Beatitude to step down was unanimous.

And this surprises me. I thought the Synod and the Metropolitan had worked through their big issues after His Beatitude took a leave of absence about a year and a half ago. The candid speaking at the last AAC seemed to affirm that. Now there's a unanimous request for his resignation?
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« Reply #19 on: July 09, 2012, 06:36:28 AM »

Sad.
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« Reply #20 on: July 09, 2012, 07:16:53 AM »

For those here who are members of OCA parishes: What do the faithful in your parish think about this issue? Is this all just something going on in the Synod, or were the laypeople and parish clergy also discontent with Met. Jonah's leadership? Would they prefer to keep him?
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« Reply #21 on: July 09, 2012, 07:43:31 AM »

Sad. I met the Metropolitan a while back and was thoroughly impressed. I wish more were like him.
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« Reply #22 on: July 09, 2012, 08:21:22 AM »

I support the Holy Synod's decision. It is sad that it took this long. They gave him multiple chances and a great deal of support. I am sure he is a nice guy but he isn't cut out for Metropolitan. He should be reassigned back to the monastery he founded where his ministry can flourish.
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« Reply #23 on: July 09, 2012, 08:28:31 AM »

Did he not mismanage money enough for them?

PP
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« Reply #24 on: July 09, 2012, 08:35:26 AM »

For those here who are members of OCA parishes: What do the faithful in your parish think about this issue? Is this all just something going on in the Synod, or were the laypeople and parish clergy also discontent with Met. Jonah's leadership? Would they prefer to keep him?

I am not sure this is the place for this.

Perhaps not even in the private forums as much would be mere gossip and rumor.

Just be happy you don't know the half of what has gone on.
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« Reply #25 on: July 09, 2012, 08:38:33 AM »

For those here who are members of OCA parishes: What do the faithful in your parish think about this issue? Is this all just something going on in the Synod, or were the laypeople and parish clergy also discontent with Met. Jonah's leadership? Would they prefer to keep him?
From my limited experience: there are those thatmourn him as if it's a presage of the world's ending, and there are those that are glad; he was really naive though thinking that he can just dive head in into the whole "culture-war" the way he did, when his church wasn't on the same page as him by and large. But with friends like Dreher, a metropolitan hardly needs enemies.
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« Reply #26 on: July 09, 2012, 08:39:01 AM »

Who will succeed him?
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« Reply #27 on: July 09, 2012, 08:57:55 AM »

For those here who are members of OCA parishes: What do the faithful in your parish think about this issue? Is this all just something going on in the Synod, or were the laypeople and parish clergy also discontent with Met. Jonah's leadership? Would they prefer to keep him?

As the Orthodox Church is universal, it is just as much local.  At least that is how it is in my parish.  Of course we care about the primate of our Church, but he is a bit removed.  It is our own parish and diocese, our own bishop and priests that have an impact on us.  We are in the Diocese of New York and New Jersey, this was once the diocese of the primate of the OCA, and I guess the Metropolia, but now that is Washington DC. 

It seemed to be a relief when we became smaller.  We, as a parish, do not even concern ourselves with the Diocese of Washington, it is as if the OCA is there now, and not here.  For the most part, the bishop who is Primate, is more important to the other bishops of the OCA, and to the people in Virginia, Maryland, and Delaware, than to the people of other diocese.

I do not know why the bishops asked His Beatitude to step down, but it is their right and duty to do so if needed. It is not that we are people with our heads in the sand, so to speak, it is that there are more important matters for our parish.
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« Reply #28 on: July 09, 2012, 09:03:05 AM »

Who will succeed him?

There will be a need for a special All American Council, just like we must have a special sobor to elect a new metropolitan.  In the mean time the eldest bishop, usually, will assume the role of Locum Tenens of the OCA till said election. 
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« Reply #29 on: July 09, 2012, 09:07:30 AM »

For those here who are members of OCA parishes: What do the faithful in your parish think about this issue? Is this all just something going on in the Synod, or were the laypeople and parish clergy also discontent with Met. Jonah's leadership? Would they prefer to keep him?

As the Orthodox Church is universal, it is just as much local.  At least that is how it is in my parish.  Of course we care about the primate of our Church, but he is a bit removed.  It is our own parish and diocese, our own bishop and priests that have an impact on us.  We are in the Diocese of New York and New Jersey, this was once the diocese of the primate of the OCA, and I guess the Metropolia, but now that is Washington DC. 

It seemed to be a relief when we became smaller.  We, as a parish, do not even concern ourselves with the Diocese of Washington, it is as if the OCA is there now, and not here.  For the most part, the bishop who is Primate, is more important to the other bishops of the OCA, and to the people in Virginia, Maryland, and Delaware, than to the people of other diocese.

I do not know why the bishops asked His Beatitude to step down, but it is their right and duty to do so if needed. It is not that we are people with our heads in the sand, so to speak, it is that there are more important matters for our parish.


A good calming voice. Bishops are people and issues with them are nothing new in the Church. Rather than proclaim 'sturm und drang' like Dreher and others, we should all pray for the Bishop and for all of the faithful, clergy and OCA that they may find the strength and wisdom to work through this situation. The sun will come out, the night will fall, people will go on and the Church will prevail as promised by Christ Himself.
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« Reply #30 on: July 09, 2012, 09:32:27 AM »

For those here who are members of OCA parishes: What do the faithful in your parish think about this issue? Is this all just something going on in the Synod, or were the laypeople and parish clergy also discontent with Met. Jonah's leadership? Would they prefer to keep him?
I don't know that we've had enough time yet to let this all soak in.
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« Reply #31 on: July 09, 2012, 09:36:17 AM »

Did he not mismanage money enough for them?
That's just plain rude. We don't know yet why the Synod requested His Beatitude's resignation. Until then it's best we refrain from asking such snarky questions.
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« Reply #32 on: July 09, 2012, 09:37:46 AM »

Did he not mismanage money enough for them?
That's just plain rude. We don't know yet why the Synod requested His Beatitude's resignation. Until then it's best we refrain from asking such snarky questions.
You're right. I should not have said that. my apologies.

PP
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« Reply #33 on: July 09, 2012, 09:43:24 AM »

Did he not mismanage money enough for them?
That's just plain rude. We don't know yet why the Synod requested His Beatitude's resignation. Until then it's best we refrain from asking such snarky questions.
You're right. I should not have said that. my apologies.
Thank you. Smiley
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« Reply #34 on: July 09, 2012, 10:00:36 AM »

http://oca.org/news/headline-news/metropolitan-jonah-tenders-resignation

July 8, 2012

Metropolitan Jonah tenders resignation

SYOSSET, NY [OCA]

In a letter addressed to the members of the Holy Synod of Bishops dated
Friday, July 6, 2012, His Beatitude, Metropolitan Jonah tendered his
resignation as Primate of the Orthodox Church in America.

Post editted for copyright rules - MK

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« Reply #35 on: July 09, 2012, 10:12:49 AM »

For those here who are members of OCA parishes: What do the faithful in your parish think about this issue? Is this all just something going on in the Synod, or were the laypeople and parish clergy also discontent with Met. Jonah's leadership? Would they prefer to keep him?
From my limited experience: there are those thatmourn him as if it's a presage of the world's ending, and there are those that are glad; he was really naive though thinking that he can just dive head in into the whole "culture-war" the way he did, when his church wasn't on the same page as him by and large. But with friends like Dreher, a metropolitan hardly needs enemies.
you have anything beyond your admitted "limited experience"?

You're right about the mourners and those who rejoice, btw.
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« Reply #36 on: July 09, 2012, 10:16:19 AM »

From Byzantine, TX: "Some people are putting two and two together and believe that a delay in the Diocese of the South's episcopal search can be tied not only to the re-vetting of Fr. Gerasim, but also to Met. Jonah's impending resignation."
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« Reply #37 on: July 09, 2012, 10:36:57 AM »

From Byzantine, TX: "Some people are putting two and two together and believe that a delay in the Diocese of the South's episcopal search can be tied not only to the re-vetting of Fr. Gerasim, but also to Met. Jonah's impending resignation."
Ironic, given the circumstances of his consecration, then election, and then the Sunday of Orthodoxy speech heard round the world.
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« Reply #38 on: July 09, 2012, 11:02:10 AM »

From Byzantine, TX: "Some people are putting two and two together and believe that a delay in the Diocese of the South's episcopal search can be tied not only to the re-vetting of Fr. Gerasim, but also to Met. Jonah's impending resignation."

Quite possible. Met. Jonah was Vladyka Dmitri's picked successor, and we in the south are rather favorable towards him. Perhaps He will be our hierarch after all.
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« Reply #39 on: July 09, 2012, 11:04:54 AM »

Dear Augustin,

If you carefully comb through the controversies surrounding Met. Jonah, you will see the 'culture war' was by far a small bump in His Beatitude's road as First Hierarch.

The main problems he encountered came from speeches in which he offended the Church of Constantinople in an unpolitical way, then later called the Tomos of Autocephaly of the OCA into question by essentially implying it could be given up in favor of an arrangement with the Episcopal Assembly.  In both cases, the Holy Synod was caught off-guard, since these were major issues (inter-Orthodox relations and autocephaly itself) that the HS has a role in.

His Beatitude had a habit of musing in public, which is never something that someone of such consequence should do.  After all, when he speaks, he speaks not for himself but the entire OCA.  It appears that he never entirely grasped the idea that the OCA is a large ship and that you can't jerk the wheel this way or that before you end up breaking the rudder.

This was all the more magnified when he agreed to take a leave of absence, then 'un-agreed' after the meeting with his bishops.  His pattern of quick decisions that led him to even quicker changes of mind really made working with him difficult.  But, it was his ignoring of the other bishops that ultimately did him in.  They tried to explain to him why he could not simply move the whole operation of the OCA to Washington, DC, during a true financial crisis, and he never seemed to accept the advice.  He tried to jerk the wheel, and ended up in conflict with his own administration.

Then, there was his unfortunate involvement with Fr. Joseph Fester that was uncovered by the leaked emails posted on OCANews.  I'm sure you don't want to wade into that controversy here.

In the end, Met. Jonah is a good man, but very clearly not cut out for the job.  This is not an insult, not every monk is material for such an office.  It just did not work out.  The difficulty of the OCA is that it has had a string of bad choices, which is really painful when you are a young church.  Let's hope the next metropolitan is a better fit.



For those here who are members of OCA parishes: What do the faithful in your parish think about this issue? Is this all just something going on in the Synod, or were the laypeople and parish clergy also discontent with Met. Jonah's leadership? Would they prefer to keep him?
From my limited experience: there are those thatmourn him as if it's a presage of the world's ending, and there are those that are glad; he was really naive though thinking that he can just dive head in into the whole "culture-war" the way he did, when his church wasn't on the same page as him by and large. But with friends like Dreher, a metropolitan hardly needs enemies.
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« Reply #40 on: July 09, 2012, 04:58:24 PM »

Holy Synod appoints Archbishop Nathaniel Locum Tenens, Bishop Michael Temporary Administrator. The oca's website does mention Met. Jonah's request, but doesn't say anything else.

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« Reply #41 on: July 09, 2012, 07:07:41 PM »

Dear Augustin,

If you carefully comb through the controversies surrounding Met. Jonah, you will see the 'culture war' was by far a small bump in His Beatitude's road as First Hierarch.

The main problems he encountered came from speeches in which he offended the Church of Constantinople in an unpolitical way, then later called the Tomos of Autocephaly of the OCA into question by essentially implying it could be given up in favor of an arrangement with the Episcopal Assembly. In both cases, the Holy Synod was caught off-guard, since these were major issues (inter-Orthodox relations and autocephaly itself) that the HS has a role in.

His Beatitude had a habit of musing in public, which is never something that someone of such consequence should do.  After all, when he speaks, he speaks not for himself but the entire OCA.  It appears that he never entirely grasped the idea that the OCA is a large ship and that you can't jerk the wheel this way or that before you end up breaking the rudder.

This was all the more magnified when he agreed to take a leave of absence, then 'un-agreed' after the meeting with his bishops.  His pattern of quick decisions that led him to even quicker changes of mind really made working with him difficult.  But, it was his ignoring of the other bishops that ultimately did him in.  They tried to explain to him why he could not simply move the whole operation of the OCA to Washington, DC, during a true financial crisis, and he never seemed to accept the advice.  He tried to jerk the wheel, and ended up in conflict with his own administration.

Then, there was his unfortunate involvement with Fr. Joseph Fester that was uncovered by the leaked emails posted on OCANews.  I'm sure you don't want to wade into that controversy here.

In the end, Met. Jonah is a good man, but very clearly not cut out for the job.  This is not an insult, not every monk is material for such an office.  It just did not work out.  The difficulty of the OCA is that it has had a string of bad choices, which is really painful when you are a young church.  Let's hope the next metropolitan is a better fit.



For those here who are members of OCA parishes: What do the faithful in your parish think about this issue? Is this all just something going on in the Synod, or were the laypeople and parish clergy also discontent with Met. Jonah's leadership? Would they prefer to keep him?
From my limited experience: there are those thatmourn him as if it's a presage of the world's ending, and there are those that are glad; he was really naive though thinking that he can just dive head in into the whole "culture-war" the way he did, when his church wasn't on the same page as him by and large. But with friends like Dreher, a metropolitan hardly needs enemies.

And now the Synod has shown why Metropolitan Jonah was right and that the Tomos is worth a roll of used toilet paper in the face of possible American unity. We really don't have a mature enough church in this nation for autocephaly, and won't until after a century or so of actually having a united American Church.
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« Reply #42 on: July 09, 2012, 07:09:24 PM »

If part of the heat he did take was because he was interested in the Chambessey agreement than kudos to Met. Jonah.  If the church is to move forward in the Americas in accordance with the signed by all the leaders of autochephalous churches than one will have to comply with the wishes of the church versus going it alone and being left out.  I wouldn't want his job and I commend him for taking the reigns.  
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« Reply #43 on: July 09, 2012, 07:11:55 PM »

You need to realise that the chambessey agreement (signed by all of the leaders of autochephalous churches, oca being represented by the MP) from what I gather the church in the Americas will be one that is autonomous under the EP.  Don't kill the messenger.  I'm just saying what I've been told.  I wouldn't want to be a bishop let alone be a metropolitan.  Anyone that takes the job has more brass in them than I have.
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« Reply #44 on: July 09, 2012, 10:48:24 PM »

Sad news.  Just out of curiousity, how common is the deposition of a primate in history?  I've read a reasonalbe amount, and the impression I get is that it's extraordinary and often either the result of misconduct or (more often) political factors, e.g. the case of EP Arsenios and Emperor Michael Palaeologos.   

(I'm not accusing Metropolitan Jonah or the Synod of anything, just making a statement)
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