Topic: New Age

[GabrieltheCelt]

Any Orthodox priest who does it, I would not commune with.

Validity of Eucharist depending on personal opinion of a priest? Isn't that a heresy?

Nope.  CF1888 has it 100%.  If you know a priest is practicing another religion, or incorporating other religions into his beliefs, that ain't opinion.  So who can be sure that said priest isn't hiding crystals on the altar table somewhere?  Who can be sure he isn't reciting some sort of mantra instead of the prayers?  I agree with you that this is all highly unlikely, but if a priest is practicing two religions, he's got both of them wrong; ergo, I would not commune with him either.  And that ain't heresy, or opinion.

Then you're saying that the vitality of the Sacramental Mysteries is dependent upon the personal sanctity of the priest, which is the heresy of Donatism.

Don't believe I said that.  Certainly didn't mean that.

The Holy Mysteries are the work of the Church, not the personal work of the priest,

I agree 100%, yet if there are crystals and mantras involved, then it isn't the Holy Mysteries.  

so until such time that the priest is excommunicated/deposed by his bishop for heresy, the Sacramental Mysteries he dispenses are still valid and filled with grace.

Not if I see it first.  Again, it's highly unlikely, but if there are other religious practices being mixed in the Mysteries, then they're not the Mysteries.  If we're 100% sure, then we shouldn't need to wait for the bishop's decree.

Now, if you choose to break communion with him, that's your business. There's certainly precedent for that, as well, and you wouldn't necessarily be blameworthy for doing so.

Then then, is it heresy or not?

Heresy is fundamentally a choice, so if you choose to be a heretic, you choose to be a heretic. That's your choice.

Thanks.  I know.

[GabrieltheCelt]

Good points my friend. As expected, the ridicule has already begun. Don't be discouraged. Keep shining the light (the light of Christ that is, not the New Age luciferian "light".)


Selam

He'd probably include reggae in his list of New Age music.

That's an ad hominem.

Not to mention I'm sick of all the idiotic attacks of Gebre by everyone.

Gebre?  He's one of the nicest guys you could talk to.  We part ways on several issues, but even then he's always super nice to me about it.  I can't imagine him attacking anyone.  Because of his views, he's usually the one who's attacked. 

[Peter J]

Good points my friend. As expected, the ridicule has already begun. Don't be discouraged. Keep shining the light (the light of Christ that is, not the New Age luciferian "light".)


Selam

He'd probably include reggae in his list of New Age music.

That's an ad hominem.

Not to mention I'm sick of all the idiotic attacks of Gebre by everyone.

Gebre?  He's one of the nicest guys you could talk to.  We part ways on several issues, but even then he's always super nice to me about it.  I can't imagine him attacking anyone.  Because of his views, he's usually the one who's attacked. 

This seems like an odd response, given that celticfan1888 said "attacks of Gebre by everyone."

[GabrieltheCelt]

Good points my friend. As expected, the ridicule has already begun. Don't be discouraged. Keep shining the light (the light of Christ that is, not the New Age luciferian "light".)


Selam

He'd probably include reggae in his list of New Age music.

That's an ad hominem.

Not to mention I'm sick of all the idiotic attacks of Gebre by everyone.

Gebre?  He's one of the nicest guys you could talk to.  We part ways on several issues, but even then he's always super nice to me about it.  I can't imagine him attacking anyone.  Because of his views, he's usually the one who's attacked. 

This seems like an odd response, given that celticfan1888 said "attacks of Gebre by everyone."

Indeed he did.  Totally misread that one.  Sorry, celticfan1888!

[Gebre Menfes Kidus]

Thanks Gabriel and CelticFan for the kind words. As you say, we don't always agree on everything, but you guys are both class acts and know how to discuss things with sharp reason and sound integrity. It's always a pleasure.


Selam

[celticfan1888]

Donatists were rigorists, holding that the church must be a church of "saints," not "sinners," and that sacraments, such as baptism, administered by sinners were invalid (Which is not what I said).

Your argument that it is heresy doesn't make sense. Please try again. 

You said the Communion will be invalid. What's the difference, then?

Try again. You like putting words in my mouth?

That's not what I said. I said I would not personally commune with him, if the priest is doing very obviously heretical things, and justifying them.

So according to you what'd be wrong with that Communion then that wouldn't allow you to participate?

In Christian ecclesiology, full communion is a relationship between church organizations or groups that mutually recognize their sharing the essential doctrines. So if the priest is dabbling into New Age teachings, such as the Charismatic Movement, he is no longer sharing the essential doctrinal teachings. If this was something that he did and he realized it was wrong, that is different. But if it is something he believes is orthodox, that is crossing that fine line.

Are you a bishop?

What does that have to do with anything? You keep running in circles trying to find something wrong, but there isn't. lol

[celticfan1888]

Thanks Gabriel and CelticFan for the kind words. As you say, we don't always agree on everything, but you guys are both class acts and know how to discuss things with sharp reason and sound integrity. It's always a pleasure.


Selam

You certainly are a class act Gebre, keep your head and humility, don't let people bring you down.