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Author Topic: Restless Heart: The Confessions of Augustine (movie/this fall)  (Read 4061 times) Average Rating: 0
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GabrieltheCelt
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« Reply #45 on: August 31, 2012, 01:30:42 PM »

In case, I wasn't clear above.

This looks terrible.

Awful.

Horrible.

Etc.

I'm afraid I agree with you. I'll probably still watch it, but it doesn't look very well done to me. Why does every religious movie portray Africans as European? Bizarre.

The Romans inhabiting North Africa were generally of European descent.
I think Gebre meant "Blond hair/blue eyed whites".
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« Reply #46 on: August 31, 2012, 01:32:43 PM »

In case, I wasn't clear above.

This looks terrible.

Awful.

Horrible.

Etc.

I'm afraid I agree with you. I'll probably still watch it, but it doesn't look very well done to me. Why does every religious movie portray Africans as European? Bizarre.

The Romans inhabiting North Africa were generally of European descent.
I think Gebre meant "Blond hair/blue eyed whites".

Most importantly, Gebre AND Gabriel agree with me for once.

Rejoice!

Bio-pics are usually the worst genre of film and this looks worse than most.

An absurd trailer to be sure.
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« Reply #47 on: August 31, 2012, 01:33:44 PM »

How doctrinally sound is "City of God?"

What a weird way to begin to read a text.
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GabrieltheCelt
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« Reply #48 on: August 31, 2012, 01:44:52 PM »

Blessed Augustin isn't accepted as a Saint throughout all of Eastern Orthodoxy.  Some say 'yes', some say 'no.'

 Can you find a "no" from before the 20th century?
No, I haven't tried and probably won't as I wasn't propagating the argument but merely shedding light on the fact that he isn't considered a saint by all Eastern Orthodox.  If you took that to mean me, you should've inquired further.
 
Also, "Blessed" and "Saint" are synonymous.
In all cases?  Fr. Seraphim of Platina, who wrote a very balanced biography on Augustine used "Blessed" instead of "Saint".

The used of the title "Blessed" to mean "not-quite-a-saint" is a Roman Catholic practice (DUN DUN DUN!).
Interesting.  Where can I read more about this?
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Justin Kissel
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« Reply #49 on: August 31, 2012, 01:52:13 PM »

There are a few different descriptors used... saint, venerable, blessed, protomartyr, etc. Just because someone has a title attached to their name other than "saint" that doesn't mean that they aren't a saint. Orthodoxwiki has an article titled "Apostle Stephen the Protomartyr," for example, of course not meaning to deny that he is a saint.
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« Reply #50 on: September 01, 2012, 02:22:23 AM »

In case, I wasn't clear above.

This looks terrible.

Awful.

Horrible.

Etc.

I'm afraid I agree with you. I'll probably still watch it, but it doesn't look very well done to me. Why does every religious movie portray Africans as European? Bizarre.

The Romans inhabiting North Africa were generally of European descent.


But St. Augustine wasn't Roman.



Selam
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« Reply #51 on: September 01, 2012, 03:18:13 AM »

A few things:

1. St. Augustine is commemorated, IIRC, in both the English Holy Transfiguration Monastery Menaion and in the Simonopetra Synaxarion.  Though both editions have tried to include a wide range of Orthodox saints, their editorial integrity is AFAIK as good as anything out there in the Orthodox world.  That IMO should really settle the issue. 

2. As for Northern Africans, the wikipedia page quotes genetic studies stating that the vast majority of the population of modern Tunisia - be they "Arab" or "Berber" have been found to be genetically similar.   This means that most Tunisian "Arabs" are actually culturally Arab Muslim Berbers (if you want to make such a distinction - in fact, I'd imagine similar is true throughout most the Arab world, to include the Egyptians according to wikipedia).  The Berbers have been acknowledged to be the predominant people in the area since the Greeks first wrote on the area.   

This implies to me that North Africans during Roman times were, with exceptions for traders, soldiers and their descendants, and other migrants, mostly Latin-speaking, toga wearing Berbers.  I would not expect them to look much like sub-saharan Africans.  And yes, they would have been considered Romans - in particular, Augustine was a Roman citizen who apparently felt quite at home when he moved to Rome. 

[that being said, I'd guess that availability of actors/extras vice any sort of historical inquiry is the primary factor in how the North Africans of this movie look.  And as another interesting aside, the wikipedia "research" I did for this states that examination of Egyptian Pharaoh Rameses II's mummy reveals he was a red head]
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O Lord before I utterly perish do Thou save me!
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« Reply #52 on: September 01, 2012, 05:51:54 PM »

A few things:

1. St. Augustine is commemorated, IIRC, in both the English Holy Transfiguration Monastery Menaion and in the Simonopetra Synaxarion.  Though both editions have tried to include a wide range of Orthodox saints, their editorial integrity is AFAIK as good as anything out there in the Orthodox world.  That IMO should really settle the issue. 

2. As for Northern Africans, the wikipedia page quotes genetic studies stating that the vast majority of the population of modern Tunisia - be they "Arab" or "Berber" have been found to be genetically similar.   This means that most Tunisian "Arabs" are actually culturally Arab Muslim Berbers (if you want to make such a distinction - in fact, I'd imagine similar is true throughout most the Arab world, to include the Egyptians according to wikipedia).  The Berbers have been acknowledged to be the predominant people in the area since the Greeks first wrote on the area.   

This implies to me that North Africans during Roman times were, with exceptions for traders, soldiers and their descendants, and other migrants, mostly Latin-speaking, toga wearing Berbers.  I would not expect them to look much like sub-saharan Africans.  And yes, they would have been considered Romans - in particular, Augustine was a Roman citizen who apparently felt quite at home when he moved to Rome. 

[that being said, I'd guess that availability of actors/extras vice any sort of historical inquiry is the primary factor in how the North Africans of this movie look.  And as another interesting aside, the wikipedia "research" I did for this states that examination of Egyptian Pharaoh Rameses II's mummy reveals he was a red head]

Rameses II was a ginger?!
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« Reply #53 on: September 02, 2012, 02:20:40 AM »


Rameses II was a ginger?!

Apparently so:

Quote
Microscopic inspection of the roots of Ramesses II's hair proved that the king's hair was originally red, which suggests that he came from a family of redheads.  This has more than just cosmetic significance: in ancient Egypt people with red hair were associated with the god Seth, the slayer of Osiris, and the name of Ramesses II's father, Seti I, means "follower of Seth.

Oddly enough, I know a few redheaded Egyptians.
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O Lord although I desired to blot out
with my tears the handwriting of my many sins
And for the rest of my life to please Thee
through sincere repentance
Yet doth the enemy lead me astray as he wareth
against my sould with his cunning

O Lord before I utterly perish do Thou save me!
JamesR
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« Reply #54 on: June 10, 2013, 03:42:33 AM »

I watched the full thing on youtube today and I have to say, it was pretty bad...It's basically just a badly done bastardization of The Confessions that traded accuracy for entertainment value. For example, the tension between St. Augustine and his father was highly exaggerated in the film. Over all, the whole thing reeks of a classic Evangelical "born again experience" bend. It's a good tear jerker, but really, nothing else. You're better off just reading the book.
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« Reply #55 on: June 10, 2013, 11:34:56 AM »


This has been spoken of again, and thus the circle is completed...
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