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Author Topic: 'Mommy Porn'- The NEWEST romance novel craze  (Read 7001 times) Average Rating: 0
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GabrieltheCelt
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« on: June 01, 2012, 12:31:40 AM »

Hey y'all,

 So, the so-called 'romance novel' genre has been around for quite awhile.  But it seems there's a new type of romance novel/media that's slowly been seducing it's way to the top called 'Mommy Porn' or 'Erotic Novels'.  It probably started earlier, but I think it sorta took off with the 'Sex In The City' craze.  Now, there's a new novel out there that has almost every woman from their 20's to their 50's clamoring for it.  It's reportedly been banned in several city libraries only to be readmitted.  And if you're one of these women who's dying to read it- there's a waiting list at almost every city library.  The novel is called '50 Shades of Grey' and it's not just steamy, by the authors' own admission it's raunchy. 

 Now, I'm no prude but it seems to me that this newest craze might be just as dangerous as other types of pornography.  For decades, the porn industry has largely targeted men but this stuff is largely written by women and for women, specifically the working/corporate woman. 

 I wonder if this newest craze, like the novel '50 Shades of Grey', is OK for Christians to read, or is it every bit as dangerous as other types of porn?  Some conclude that it's not really pornography and that it gets men and women (specifically husbands and wives) discussing the wants and needs of BOTH partners, while other conclude that, because of the explicit nature and the fact that rarely, if ever, are the main characters married, it's smut and should be avoided by Christians. 

 What would be the Orthodox response to these questions and accusations?  I see Christian women reading this novel and watching these types of shows all the time and am somewhat concerned.  To get an idea of just how popular this particular novel is, go to Amazon books and look at the top sellers.

 So, what say you?
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« Reply #1 on: June 01, 2012, 12:48:16 AM »

Gabe,

9 times out of 10 so-called "romance" novels ARE porn, just porn aimed at women. The other 1/10 of the time it's more like watching a porn movie with all the sex scenes edited out.
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« Reply #2 on: June 01, 2012, 01:06:07 AM »

Subscribing now so I won't forget to check this tomorrow.  Smiley
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« Reply #3 on: June 01, 2012, 03:08:06 AM »

Gabe,

9 times out of 10 so-called "romance" novels ARE porn, just porn aimed at women. The other 1/10 of the time it's more like watching a porn movie with all the sex scenes edited out.

 Did not know this.  Thanks.  The Penthouse magazine letters I'm familiar with, but when you say these novels are porn, are you saying they're as graphic as a pornographic movie or Penthouse letters?  I've never attempted to read these "novels" because I've always thought they were, well, silly.  Plus, the covers, the one's with the male hunk and the beautiful damsel, were my 'scarecrow'.

 I realize fantasies are just that and that they provide a distraction from the demands and responsibilities of our lives.  I also realize that they can be used to 'spice' up the marriage bed if you will.  I just wonder if this type of stuff is to be viewed as harmless entertainment or something to be cautioned against.  Seems that there's some gray area and I was hoping to learn a little more.

 I would really like to hear from the ladies as well; I don't want their voices to get drowned out.   
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« Reply #4 on: June 01, 2012, 03:44:53 AM »

If your OP is correct, they're busy reading.
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« Reply #5 on: June 01, 2012, 01:47:05 PM »

//BUMP//
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« Reply #6 on: June 01, 2012, 01:48:21 PM »

90% of the time Romance Novels are just porn, but it is porn geared towards women and hiding under the 'Romance' label so that women feel classy because they do not want to accept that they are looking at porn. It is fair to mention though that this has been around for ages; erotic literature existed in ancient times, in many Orthodox countries too by the way, and now it exists in modern times. In any case, I find novels like this to be detrimental to women because it gives them an unrealistic standard of what their relationship should be like and their expectations for their man become way too high. I've met women who truly believe that they are princesses and that men should treat them like royalty, and not surprisingly they were huge romance novel fans. Maybe this is why so many marriages and relationships are failing, because of unrealistic standards from certain women. On the other hand, men do the same thing with their porn from a sexual point of view. They make their woman feel insecure or have too high of expectations for what she should look like or be capable of doing in bed because of their porn.
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« Reply #7 on: June 01, 2012, 02:06:32 PM »

I also realize that they can be used to 'spice' up the marriage bed if you will.  I just wonder if this type of stuff is to be viewed as harmless entertainment or something to be cautioned against.  Seems that there's some gray area and I was hoping to learn a little more.

This is where I get confused.

Is the marriage bed to be spiced up?  I don't see how the marriage bed can be spiced up without some kind of porn.  I'm not saying we humans aren't capable of exploration sexually without certain visual aids, such a time had to have been pre-Kama Sutra.  And I'm sorry but some of those Indo-Mughal friezes and reliefs depicting Shiva or whoever it is having an orgy are hot.

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« Reply #8 on: June 01, 2012, 02:10:17 PM »

90% of the time Romance Novels are just porn, but it is porn geared towards women and hiding under the 'Romance' label so that women feel classy because they do not want to accept that they are looking at porn. It is fair to mention though that this has been around for ages; erotic literature existed in ancient times, in many Orthodox countries too by the way, and now it exists in modern times. In any case, I find novels like this to be detrimental to women because it gives them an unrealistic standard of what their relationship should be like and their expectations for their man become way too high. I've met women who truly believe that they are princesses and that men should treat them like royalty, and not surprisingly they were huge romance novel fans. Maybe this is why so many marriages and relationships are failing, because of unrealistic standards from certain women. On the other hand, men do the same thing with their porn from a sexual point of view. They make their woman feel insecure or have too high of expectations for what she should look like or be capable of doing in bed because of their porn.

James--I am in awe at your knowledge of these matters at your tender age of 16. If I had been as knowledgeable and wise as you, I would have surely avoided all sorts of woes.
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« Reply #9 on: June 01, 2012, 02:12:21 PM »

Okay, I have some general thoughts and nothing better to do at the moment.  Grin

First of all, Romance and Erotica are two different genres. To put it simplistically, Romance is about a love story, focused on the characters. Erotica is, as the name suggests, focused on erotica. Erotica is the genre that is essentially literary porn. Which isn't to say that Romance genre has no sex scenes, but it's not ALL sex scenes. You pull the sex scenes out of Romance and you still have a story. You pull the sex scenes out of erotica and you have a pamphlet. So this:

90% of the time Romance Novels are just porn, but it is porn geared towards women and hiding under the 'Romance' label so that women feel classy because they do not want to accept that they are looking at porn.

I disagree with.

1. Women look at porn. I don't mean an erotica novel, either. I mean actual porn. It's not an issue only men face.

2. Women who want to feel classy don't read Romance. I'll admit, I enjoy a romance novel every now and again (flame away, I know my truth!  Wink ), but if I want to feel classy, it's not what I'm reaching for.


But this:

In any case, I find novels like this to be detrimental to women because it gives them an unrealistic standard of what their relationship should be like and their expectations for their man become way too high.

I can get behind. Probably not the case for every reader of romance, but I can definitely see how the potential is there.

As for the OP, and 50 Shades of Grey specifically: After all the hullabaloo, curiosity killed this cat and I downloaded the first chapter for free on my Kindle app. I figured the raunchy-ness would definitely not be in the first chapter where we would be merely meeting the characters. The buzz on these books is so big, so I wanted to know what the fuss was about, and if the story was compelling.

No. Just, no. The writing is atrocious. I mean, seriously. Ten minutes of my life I can never get back. I found out after the fact that it started as Twilight fan fiction, but I literally Googled the author because I seriously thought (based on the quality of writing) it was written by a 14 year old. So, that's all I got on that. I haven't read the book(s), and after reading the first chapter I have no desire to. I would not give this woman a dime for her horrible abuse of literature when there are other authors who can string three words together coherently that are struggling to get published.
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« Reply #10 on: June 01, 2012, 02:29:05 PM »

ZZ, so you're saying I should just go ahead and get that History of the Rhodesian Bush War and eschew the 50 Shades of Twilight?

Thanks for the warning.
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« Reply #11 on: June 01, 2012, 02:30:29 PM »

90% of the time Romance Novels are just porn, but it is porn geared towards women and hiding under the 'Romance' label so that women feel classy because they do not want to accept that they are looking at porn. It is fair to mention though that this has been around for ages; erotic literature existed in ancient times, in many Orthodox countries too by the way, and now it exists in modern times. In any case, I find novels like this to be detrimental to women because it gives them an unrealistic standard of what their relationship should be like and their expectations for their man become way too high. I've met women who truly believe that they are princesses and that men should treat them like royalty, and not surprisingly they were huge romance novel fans. Maybe this is why so many marriages and relationships are failing, because of unrealistic standards from certain women. On the other hand, men do the same thing with their porn from a sexual point of view. They make their woman feel insecure or have too high of expectations for what she should look like or be capable of doing in bed because of their porn.

James--I am in awe at your knowledge of these matters at your tender age of 16. If I had been as knowledgeable and wise as you, I would have surely avoided all sorts of woes.

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« Reply #12 on: June 01, 2012, 02:45:55 PM »

ZZ, so you're saying I should just go ahead and get that History of the Rhodesian Bush War and eschew the 50 Shades of Twilight?

Thanks for the warning.

Vamrat, anything for you, mon ami.
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« Reply #13 on: June 01, 2012, 02:50:02 PM »

I have to say, ZZ's post kind of makes me want to read it just to see how badly one can write and still make millions of dollars. But also I'm afraid it would be so bad it would be one of those "cannot un-see" sort of deals, in which case...I dunno, I don't think I need millions of dollars that badly.
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« Reply #14 on: June 01, 2012, 02:59:45 PM »

I haven't read it. I don't plan to, either. Doesn't sound like the kind of thing I'd like at all.  Angry
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« Reply #15 on: June 01, 2012, 03:31:30 PM »

So then I gather that the consensus is that this stuff is mostly immoral and to generally be avoided by Christians?
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« Reply #16 on: June 01, 2012, 03:35:18 PM »

So then I gather that the consensus is that this stuff is mostly immoral and to generally be avoided by Christians?


And a serious waste of time as well.
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« Reply #17 on: June 01, 2012, 03:47:03 PM »

So then I gather that the consensus is that this stuff is mostly immoral and to generally be avoided by Christians?

Yeah right.  I think I am going to write my own trashy romance novels.  That should help me pick up chicks and make me millionz in the process, thereby helping me pick up even more chicks.

I already have a list of horrifying similes chosen.  Unfortunately, I cannot bring myself to post them on a Christian forum. 
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« Reply #18 on: June 01, 2012, 10:38:29 PM »

I have to say, ZZ's post kind of makes me want to read it just to see how badly one can write and still make millions of dollars. But also I'm afraid it would be so bad it would be one of those "cannot un-see" sort of deals, in which case...I dunno, I don't think I need millions of dollars that badly.

Like I said, I haven't read the book but after reading the first chapter I really feel like this reviewer is right on the money:

http://www.amazon.com/review/R1LT38SAC0FA4G/ref=cm_cr_dp_title?ie=UTF8&ASIN=0345803485&nodeID=283155&store=books

Serious LOLs in that one.

So then I gather that the consensus is that this stuff is mostly immoral and to generally be avoided by Christians?


And a serious waste of time as well.

Bingo.
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« Reply #19 on: June 01, 2012, 10:43:50 PM »

I flipped to a random page in 50 Shades of Grey and there was immediate laughter to be had. In terms of values, I would agree that this stuff is completely degenerate. It seems to revolve around a worship of power and wealth. I heard from someone that it was originally Twilight fanfiction, which, if true, really says something.
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« Reply #20 on: June 01, 2012, 10:57:36 PM »

Haha. That review was fantastic.

I'm sorry to say that I did the same as Iconodule and looked up a random page, and...oh my. It's even worse than I could have ever imagined. Maybe it's some kind of elaborate literary in-joke, like Naked Came the Stranger?

I can hope, can't I... Undecided
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« Reply #21 on: June 01, 2012, 11:59:45 PM »

What I especially dislike about this book is how it has led to mainstream sources pushing pornography.  It's sickening to see this.
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« Reply #22 on: June 02, 2012, 01:52:05 AM »

I flipped to a random page in 50 Shades of Grey and there was immediate laughter to be had. In terms of values, I would agree that this stuff is completely degenerate. It seems to revolve around a worship of power and wealth. I heard from someone that it was originally Twilight fanfiction, which, if true, really says something.
You mean like Touchstone? That's what they worship there too.
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« Reply #23 on: June 02, 2012, 06:59:23 AM »

I flipped to a random page in 50 Shades of Grey and there was immediate laughter to be had. In terms of values, I would agree that this stuff is completely degenerate. It seems to revolve around a worship of power and wealth. I heard from someone that it was originally Twilight fanfiction, which, if true, really says something.
You mean like Touchstone? That's what they worship there too.

It's exactly like Touchstone, but with more butt plugs and elevator quickies.
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« Reply #24 on: June 02, 2012, 03:25:39 PM »

Romance novels have nothing to do with romance.  I work for a distributor of this crap and it's literary pornography.  When it's sexually graphic, particularly deviant, then it's porn.  Men do pictures, women like to read theirs.  And my employer also distributes christian romance.  I pull up accounts all day long of people ordering both, and that's quite a joke at work--"Christians are the biggest hypocrites."  I used to resent that, but a year and a half later, yeah it's true.  If you're ordering Christian fiction because you want your "God" and it's all a front because you're also ordering books full of bed-hopping, group sex, sex in public, graphic descriptions not just of acts but of body parts (like we all don't know what we look like down to the wrinkle anyway) and these books where the authors have completely run out of ideas and are now just trying to out-sick each other, then yes, a hypocrite you would be. 

Trigger issue for me.  Seriously.  We've turned sex into a public farce, which necessarily drains life of meaning.  We're now just largely monkeys walking our bodies around in the world.  Sad.  Sad as hell. 
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« Reply #25 on: June 02, 2012, 07:41:11 PM »

I actually have a manuscript for such a novel of my own with a publisher for review, and I am saddened by the judgmentalism here.

Here is an excerpt from one of the "spicier" scenes of my novel:

And then he started making whoopie with me.

"Oh yeah, we're making whoopie! Cool!" I said.

"Yea, I like whoopie" he replied.


Don't plagiarize my stuff.
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« Reply #26 on: June 02, 2012, 09:26:56 PM »

Haha. That review was fantastic.

I'm sorry to say that I did the same as Iconodule and looked up a random page, and...oh my. It's even worse than I could have ever imagined. Maybe it's some kind of elaborate literary in-joke, like Naked Came the Stranger?

I can hope, can't I... Undecided
No, it's much worse. The whole thing started out as a piece of Twilight fanfic.

And that is literally all I know about it.
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« Reply #27 on: June 02, 2012, 09:42:59 PM »

Lust is lust, whether thought, viewed, or read.  All sins.
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« Reply #28 on: June 02, 2012, 10:11:08 PM »

I actually have a manuscript for such a novel of my own with a publisher for review, and I am saddened by the judgmentalism here.

Here is an excerpt from one of the "spicier" scenes of my novel:

And then he started making whoopie with me.

"Oh yeah, we're making whoopie! Cool!" I said.

"Yea, I like whoopie" he replied.


Don't plagiarize my stuff.

Coming soon to a Kindle near the soccer mom near you: 50 Shades of Whoopie
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« Reply #29 on: June 02, 2012, 10:47:54 PM »

I actually have a manuscript for such a novel of my own with a publisher for review, and I am saddened by the judgmentalism here.

Here is an excerpt from one of the "spicier" scenes of my novel:

And then he started making whoopie with me.

"Oh yeah, we're making whoopie! Cool!" I said.

"Yea, I like whoopie" he replied.


Don't plagiarize my stuff.
Must you inflame my youthful lust so?
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« Reply #30 on: June 03, 2012, 03:05:15 PM »

I flipped to a random page in 50 Shades of Grey and there was immediate laughter to be had. In terms of values, I would agree that this stuff is completely degenerate. It seems to revolve around a worship of power and wealth. I heard from someone that it was originally Twilight fanfiction, which, if true, really says something.
You mean like Touchstone? That's what they worship there too.

It's exactly like Touchstone, but with more butt plugs and elevator quickies.

Way, way too much information.  Angry
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« Reply #31 on: June 04, 2012, 06:30:13 AM »

I've heard of making books to support movies, video games, etc., but this is the first time I've heard of making books to support porn videos. Or... are they talking about a different kind of "Mommy porn"  Huh
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« Reply #32 on: June 04, 2012, 09:33:06 AM »

As for the OP, and 50 Shades of Grey specifically: After all the hullabaloo, curiosity killed this cat and I downloaded the first chapter for free on my Kindle app. I figured the raunchy-ness would definitely not be in the first chapter where we would be merely meeting the characters. The buzz on these books is so big, so I wanted to know what the fuss was about, and if the story was compelling.

No. Just, no. The writing is atrocious. I mean, seriously. Ten minutes of my life I can never get back. I found out after the fact that it started as Twilight fan fiction, but I literally Googled the author because I seriously thought (based on the quality of writing) it was written by a 14 year old. So, that's all I got on that. I haven't read the book(s), and after reading the first chapter I have no desire to. I would not give this woman a dime for her horrible abuse of literature when there are other authors who can string three words together coherently that are struggling to get published.

My wife did the same and lasted a bit longer than you..thirty minutes, to be exact.

There's a vid on youtube of comedian Gilbert Godfried doing a dramatic reading of some passages.  It's hilarious not just because of the way Gilbert reads it (he does it rather straight), but because the writing itself.
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« Reply #33 on: June 04, 2012, 09:50:13 AM »

I miss the days when 'romance' in literature meant adventure, like 'Ivanhoe.' Now that's a book.
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« Reply #34 on: June 04, 2012, 09:56:03 AM »

There's a vid on youtube of comedian Gilbert Godfried doing a dramatic  reading of some passages.  It's hilarious not just because of the way Gilbert reads it (he does it rather straight), but because the writing itself.

Darn, I could only find short clips of it. A deeper search brought up vids that have since been removed.  Undecided
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« Reply #35 on: June 04, 2012, 10:15:53 AM »

There's a vid on youtube of comedian Gilbert Godfried doing a dramatic  reading of some passages.  It's hilarious not just because of the way Gilbert reads it (he does it rather straight), but because the writing itself.

Darn, I could only find short clips of it. A deeper search brought up vids that have since been removed.  Undecided

Gilbert Gottfried reads 50 Shades of Grey

NOTE: THIS IS REPLETE WITH GRAPHIC LANGUAGE.
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« Reply #36 on: June 04, 2012, 10:29:09 AM »

Lol, thanks (I think) Smiley
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« Reply #37 on: June 04, 2012, 10:29:52 AM »

I accidently clicked this thread from my work computer, hopefully I don't get fired.
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« Reply #38 on: June 04, 2012, 10:32:28 AM »

I miss the days when 'romance' in literature meant adventure, like 'Ivanhoe.' Now that's a book.

Ivanhoe sounds like an awesome idea for a romantic novel!

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« Reply #39 on: June 04, 2012, 12:16:47 PM »

I accidently clicked this thread from my work computer, hopefully I don't get fired.

I don't think you have to worry.  The word "porn" doesn't appear in teh URL, so it won't get "flagged".

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« Reply #40 on: June 04, 2012, 12:46:50 PM »

There's a vid on youtube of comedian Gilbert Godfried doing a dramatic  reading of some passages.  It's hilarious not just because of the way Gilbert reads it (he does it rather straight), but because the writing itself.

Darn, I could only find short clips of it. A deeper search brought up vids that have since been removed.  Undecided

Gilbert Gottfried reads 50 Shades of Grey

NOTE: THIS IS REPLETE WITH GRAPHIC LANGUAGE.

OMG. I was laughing so hard I couldn't breathe. That was definitely NSFW.
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« Reply #41 on: June 04, 2012, 01:52:12 PM »

That is the funniest thing I have ever seen. Also: I'm going to throw up.

I'm confused.
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« Reply #42 on: July 12, 2012, 07:49:32 AM »

From what I've heard, 50 Shades of Grey is extremely explicit, going into bondage and other..... raunchy sexual acts. I don't rrealy get it. From what I knew, "Mom Porn" was pretty much bad romance novels with lots of sex thrown in. This stuff sounds absolutely perverse and makes the previous stuff sound like an especially tame episode of Sesame Street.
I don't know much about it, but here's a video of Gilbert Gotfried reading some excerpts.

WARNING: Explicit
http://www.jest.com/video/174214/gilbert-gottfried-reads-fifty-shades-of-grey
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« Reply #43 on: July 12, 2012, 07:50:14 AM »

Crap. Someone already posted the link. >_<
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« Reply #44 on: July 12, 2012, 08:41:13 AM »

. It seems to revolve around a worship of power and wealth.

So it is just porn for women?
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« Reply #45 on: July 12, 2012, 09:25:50 AM »

Does Fifty Shades of Gay actually count as "Mom Porn"?  Last time I saw mom porn it was completely different?
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« Reply #46 on: July 12, 2012, 09:40:07 AM »

Most readers of the series I've encountered are in fact moms. Here's a funny article by the way:

http://screencrush.com/50-shades-of-grey-movie/

Quote
Throughout the book, Anastasia is slowly exposed to Christian’s “dark” world and his “Red Room of Pain,” which is just a room with a bunch of sex toys in it, but apparently we have to get all silly about it. I mean, we don’t call the kitchen the “White Room of Yummy” or the living room the “TV Room of Couching.”
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« Reply #47 on: July 12, 2012, 12:18:33 PM »

And since Gilbert Godfried is the voice of 1) Iago the parrot in the Disney "Aladdin" movies and 2) Digit the cyberbird on "CyberChase" on PBS which is a kids show that teaches math concepts the idea of a comic avian reading this is even more bizarre/entertaining
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« Reply #48 on: July 12, 2012, 12:41:50 PM »

I accidently clicked this thread from my work computer, hopefully I don't get fired.

The way things are now you could get fired for clicking on Christian websites.

Years ago I used to write a breastfeeding newsletter and would do some research/surfing online at work.  Anyone looking at my online search history woulda thought I had a breast and nipple fetish but I never got blocked.  Now I can't even access Overstock.com but still can Google breasts.  Go figure.
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« Reply #49 on: July 12, 2012, 02:16:39 PM »

Hey y'all,

 So, the so-called 'romance novel' genre has been around for quite awhile.  But it seems there's a new type of romance novel/media that's slowly been seducing it's way to the top called 'Mommy Porn' or 'Erotic Novels'.  It probably started earlier, but I think it sorta took off with the 'Sex In The City' craze.  Now, there's a new novel out there that has almost every woman from their 20's to their 50's clamoring for it.  It's reportedly been banned in several city libraries only to be readmitted.  And if you're one of these women who's dying to read it- there's a waiting list at almost every city library.  The novel is called '50 Shades of Grey' and it's not just steamy, by the authors' own admission it's raunchy. 

 Now, I'm no prude but it seems to me that this newest craze might be just as dangerous as other types of pornography.  For decades, the porn industry has largely targeted men but this stuff is largely written by women and for women, specifically the working/corporate woman. 

 I wonder if this newest craze, like the novel '50 Shades of Grey', is OK for Christians to read, or is it every bit as dangerous as other types of porn?  Some conclude that it's not really pornography and that it gets men and women (specifically husbands and wives) discussing the wants and needs of BOTH partners, while other conclude that, because of the explicit nature and the fact that rarely, if ever, are the main characters married, it's smut and should be avoided by Christians. 

 What would be the Orthodox response to these questions and accusations?  I see Christian women reading this novel and watching these types of shows all the time and am somewhat concerned.  To get an idea of just how popular this particular novel is, go to Amazon books and look at the top sellers.

 So, what say you?

My wife started to read it.  Its complete trash.  Personally, I think it is on a level lower than actual pornography.  We all know how reading something sticks in your mind longer than seeing the same thing.  It's extremely, EXTREMELY graphic!  She showed me one paragraph, that was enough.
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« Reply #50 on: July 12, 2012, 02:20:45 PM »

90% of the time Romance Novels are just porn, but it is porn geared towards women and hiding under the 'Romance' label so that women feel classy because they do not want to accept that they are looking at porn. It is fair to mention though that this has been around for ages; erotic literature existed in ancient times, in many Orthodox countries too by the way, and now it exists in modern times. In any case, I find novels like this to be detrimental to women because it gives them an unrealistic standard of what their relationship should be like and their expectations for their man become way too high. I've met women who truly believe that they are princesses and that men should treat them like royalty, and not surprisingly they were huge romance novel fans. Maybe this is why so many marriages and relationships are failing, because of unrealistic standards from certain women. On the other hand, men do the same thing with their porn from a sexual point of view. They make their woman feel insecure or have too high of expectations for what she should look like or be capable of doing in bed because of their porn.

James--I am in awe at your knowledge of these matters at your tender age of 16. If I had been as knowledgeable and wise as you, I would have surely avoided all sorts of woes.


Normally, I would disregard someone's knowledge at his age, but modern times and my occupation have revealed to me children younger than he know more about this than most adults, which is to be blamed on adults.  Poor parenting and lack of interest or caring about children and this spreads in the school system from one kid to the next.  He may be right in his assessment.  I am continually stunned at what children know these days and not much shocks me.
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« Reply #51 on: July 12, 2012, 02:22:44 PM »

So then I gather that the consensus is that this stuff is mostly immoral and to generally be avoided by Christians?

Absolutely!
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« Reply #52 on: July 12, 2012, 02:25:41 PM »

We've turned sex into a public farce, which necessarily drains life of meaning.  We're now just largely monkeys walking our bodies around in the world.  Sad.   

Interesting way of putting it, but I can’t really disagree with you.  For those of you who believe in evolution, this is surely a sign we are going backwards.
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« Reply #53 on: July 12, 2012, 03:04:11 PM »

Quote
We've turned sex into a public farce, which necessarily drains life of meaning.  We're now just largely monkeys walking our bodies around in the world.  Sad.   
Read the abolition of man. Shocking in its clarity.

PP
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« Reply #54 on: July 12, 2012, 03:40:53 PM »

Literary porn is pretty hard to discern. A book can officially be non-erotica, but in reality it is soft porn. Sex scenes don't make a book porn. I have been reading the Song of Fire and Ice series (aka Game of Thrones) and there are sex scenes aplenty in the series. They are stupid sex scenes. (Ironically the television series takes out certain sex series and adds in others seemingly at random. They took a book with a good number of short sex scenes, eliminated a bunch, only to add in others that are even worse/explicit. So I am not watching that series anymore) But to some extent they give you some insight into a character and have something to do with the plot. To some extent even Twilight was soft porn in the way women read it. And that book didn't even have much (if any, I haven't read the series and never plan to) sex in it. This 50 shades was inspired by Twilight afterall.

I have struggled with this issue since around age 10 when my reading level was high enough that I needed to be wary of content. I think you have to be captured fairly young to find much of the erotica sexy. Phrases like "dewy center" just make me think of incontinence. Many, many Christian women read romance that is essentially soft porn without so much as a blink of the eye.

The problem I have with soft porn romance is that I think it is (in it's own way) much more dangerous than actual porn. Soft porn can not spice up a marriage in any healthy way just like regular porn can't. Soft porn and erotica can cause a woman to wish and desire an idea that is unachievable. A man that actually behaved like Christian Gray (I think that is the character's name in 50 shades) would be an awful partner. He would be an even worse husband and father. A woman can read these books and go to bed "in the mood" and actually have sex with her husband physically but will not be thinking of him when they are having sex. Emotionally/spiritually she just isn't there. That is dangerous for a marriage. The man will think everything is OK because she is having sex with him. But she could loathe him and just be using him as a living/breathing sex toy. That sounds good in theory to many a man. But no one wants to simply be used for sex in a marriage, man or woman. Everyone wants that connection that is deeper than sex when they are having sex. Otherwise you feel like you would after eating an entire cake. You would enjoy the flavor while eating, but afterward you just feel sick and sort of hallow. Not to be crass; but sex (and especially orgasm) is when a person is the most vulnerable. That vulnerability can't be there completely unless people trust each other. So if you think your marriage bed isn't up to par it isn't because you need to "spice it up" it is because you need to be more honest in your communications outside the marriage bed. You don't need to read/watch other people having sex to do it right yourself. That would be like watching NASCAR in order to learn how to drive better. The two are similar, but NOT the same.
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« Reply #55 on: July 12, 2012, 04:03:15 PM »

Say what you will about literary pornography, but I will not hear such terrible slander against cake. That's just insulting to cake. And cake doesn't deserve that.

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« Reply #56 on: July 12, 2012, 04:05:28 PM »

Cake is good in moderation. A whole cake shouldn't be eaten in one sitting by anyone. Cheesy

The only thing close to literary porn I would want to read would be in a letter from my husband Wink
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« Reply #57 on: July 12, 2012, 04:17:55 PM »

Jane Austen could be considered "romance." I will allow my daughters to read that if they are interested. But modern teen/tween writing is just getting worse. I must say that as a parent it is very difficult to know what is suitable for my daughter's consumption. She consumes books at such a rapid pace I just can't read them all before she can. So I allow her to read far more adult classics than I do modern fiction.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702303657404576357622592697038.html

Quote
How dark is contemporary fiction for teens? Darker than when you were a child, my dear: So dark that kidnapping and pederasty and incest and brutal beatings are now just part of the run of things in novels directed, broadly speaking, at children from the ages of 12 to 18.
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« Reply #58 on: July 12, 2012, 04:26:37 PM »

http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2006/01/are-you-there-god-it-apos-s-me-monica/4511/

Quote
The Rainbow Party, an offering from Simon Pulse, a young-adult division of Simon & Schuster, takes place on a single day, in which a tough little sophomore named Gin issues invitations to a party at which she and five of her friends will perform oral sex on the lucky guests, a group of popular boys. The girls will each wear a different color of lipstick, so that when a boy has completed the circuit, his penis will bear the colors of the rainbow. The party is to take place after school, to last about an hour and a half—including time for chitchat—and to conclude before Gin's father returns home from work.

If our teens are being written this type of drivel, what is being written for mommy?
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« Reply #59 on: July 12, 2012, 10:02:45 PM »

http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2006/01/are-you-there-god-it-apos-s-me-monica/4511/

Quote
The Rainbow Party, an offering from Simon Pulse, a young-adult division of Simon & Schuster, takes place on a single day, in which a tough little sophomore named Gin issues invitations to a party at which she and five of her friends will perform oral sex on the lucky guests, a group of popular boys. The girls will each wear a different color of lipstick, so that when a boy has completed the circuit, his penis will bear the colors of the rainbow. The party is to take place after school, to last about an hour and a half—including time for chitchat—and to conclude before Gin's father returns home from work.

If our teens are being written this type of drivel, what is being written for mommy?
That was written in response to a scare that rainbow parties were actually happening and were a bad thing, since that definitely sounds like an actual thing high school students would do, and not something a 15 year old thought of while masturbating.
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« Reply #60 on: July 12, 2012, 11:23:28 PM »

Did you read the whole article? Because it isn't just about the one book.
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« Reply #61 on: July 12, 2012, 11:40:02 PM »

There's a vid on youtube of comedian Gilbert Godfried doing a dramatic  reading of some passages.  It's hilarious not just because of the way Gilbert reads it (he does it rather straight), but because the writing itself.

Darn, I could only find short clips of it. A deeper search brought up vids that have since been removed.  Undecided

Gilbert Gottfried reads 50 Shades of Grey

NOTE: THIS IS REPLETE WITH GRAPHIC LANGUAGE.

If I were I a better man I would have resisted clicking on this link. But the lure of Gilbert Gottfried was too much. I was laughing so hard that my wife came in the room and asked me what was so funny. I had to make up a lie.


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« Reply #62 on: July 12, 2012, 11:52:47 PM »

Did you read the whole article? Because it isn't just about the one book.

Three books in the series I believe.
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« Reply #63 on: July 12, 2012, 11:58:45 PM »

Fifty Shades of Gay

Was this intentional?
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« Reply #64 on: July 13, 2012, 12:33:09 AM »

Fifty Shades of Gay

Was this intentional?

Oh no no no.  Of course not...   Cheesy
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« Reply #65 on: July 13, 2012, 12:33:38 AM »

I just listened to the Gilbert Gottfried version.  That was glorious.
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« Reply #66 on: November 30, 2012, 11:26:41 PM »

A month ago, worried that the book -- the first in a trilogy and the basis of a highly-anticipated movie adaptation -- could harm Christian marriages, leaders at Southwestern Baptist Theological Seminary hosted a closed-door women’s meeting on what it all means and what churches should do about it.
....
In some parts of the evangelical world others are even trying to move beyond using the novel only as a cautionary tale. Instead they want to explore what the book’s prominence can bring to Christian conversations about healthy sexuality.
....
But Marissa Elliott, a Boston-area adjunct literature professor and an evangelical Christian, said she has trouble understanding what all the fuss is about.

“The only thing that upset me was the quality of writing,” said Elliott, who read the book about a month ago and considered it no better than your average beach novel.
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