Author Topic: Grace does not come to those who tuck in their shirts and wear neck ties  (Read 2919 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Aindriú

  • Faster! Funnier!
  • Protokentarchos
  • *********
  • Posts: 3,918
    • Blog
and yes, orthonorm approve of this message (sorta).

There's a surprise. I was wondering where you were.

I'm going to need this.

Offline FormerReformer

  • Convertodox of the convertodox
  • Site Supporter
  • Archon
  • *****
  • Posts: 2,547
    • Music and Orthodoxy
  • Faith: Convertodox
  • Jurisdiction: Netodoxy
Quick show of hands- how many of us here actually do wear ties to church on a regular basis?

How many of us attend a parish where the people our age normally wear ties as regular Sunday attire?

How many us attend parishes where those wearing ties are of that "you wear a tie to church" cross-denominational generation?

I'm just wondering where this epidemic of pants-tucking tie-wearing is, 'cause I sure as spit don't see it, and I currently attend a Greek Country Club parish.
« Last Edit: May 05, 2012, 10:57:29 PM by FormerReformer »
"Funny," said Lancelot, "how the people who can't pray say that prayers are not answered, however much the people who can pray say they are."  TH White

Oh, no: I've succumbed to Hyperdoxy!

Offline Paisius

  • Ditry Pope-loving ecumenist
  • OC.net guru
  • *******
  • Posts: 1,281
  • City of Light
Think about the ranks of angels and saints. None of them could ever conceive of tucking in their shirts or wearing neck ties. Nor will they help those who offend the righteous order of dress on earth. Those are things of the Satan's regime to make men look like docile servants of the apostate corporate state. We must dress like the saints to gain any rank in the celestial Kingdom.

think about the ranks of angels and saints none of them could ever conceive of using periods or other punctuation nor will they help those who offend the righteous order of scribing on earth those are things of the satans regime to make men look like docile servants of the apostate corporate state we must scribe like the saints to gain any rank in the celestial kingdom

Offline FormerReformer

  • Convertodox of the convertodox
  • Site Supporter
  • Archon
  • *****
  • Posts: 2,547
    • Music and Orthodoxy
  • Faith: Convertodox
  • Jurisdiction: Netodoxy
Think about the ranks of angels and saints. None of them could ever conceive of tucking in their shirts or wearing neck ties. Nor will they help those who offend the righteous order of dress on earth. Those are things of the Satan's regime to make men look like docile servants of the apostate corporate state. We must dress like the saints to gain any rank in the celestial Kingdom.

think about the ranks of angels and saints none of them could ever conceive of using periods or other punctuation nor will they help those who offend the righteous order of scribing on earth those are things of the satans regime to make men look like docile servants of the apostate corporate state we must scribe like the saints to gain any rank in the celestial kingdom

PUNCTUATION LIKE LOWER CASE LETTERS IS A WESTERN INNOVATION THAT DOES NOT APPEAR IN THE ORIGINAL GREEK TEXTS AND THUS SHOULD BE AVOIDED BY ALL PIOUS ORTHODOX CHRISTIANS
"Funny," said Lancelot, "how the people who can't pray say that prayers are not answered, however much the people who can pray say they are."  TH White

Oh, no: I've succumbed to Hyperdoxy!

Offline xariskai

  • юродивый/yurodivy
  • OC.net guru
  • *******
  • Posts: 1,557
  • יהוה עזי ומגני
  • Faith: Orthodox
When the Bible was written, NO ONE wore pants.

Thread over. Isa wins again.


Online Alveus Lacuna

  • Taxiarches
  • **********
  • Posts: 7,046
  • Faith: Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: OCA
I think a necktie can look very nice. Some of you hippies need to grow up and get a job. Stupid boomers...

Offline orthonorm

  • Hoplitarches
  • *************
  • Posts: 17,275
and yes, orthonorm approve of this message (sorta).

There's a surprise. I was wondering where you were.

Dude you should see me in my custom     . You off the rack jack.

Lighten up.
If you have PMed me, the mods have taken my ability to PM away. Please see my email if you wish to contact me during my time of trial.

Online PeterTheAleut

  • The Right Blowhard Peter the Furtive of Yetts O'Muckhart
  • Section Moderator
  • Hypatos
  • *****
  • Posts: 34,466
  • Lord, have mercy on the Christians in Mosul!
  • Faith: Orthodox Christian
  • Jurisdiction: Orthodox Church in America
I personally agree that it is better to have the lower waist region covered rather than tucking in the shirt.
What do you think pants do?
Not all who wander are lost.

Offline Gebre Menfes Kidus

  • "SERVANT of The HOLY SPIRIT"
  • Merarches
  • ***********
  • Posts: 8,816
  • "Lord Have Mercy on Me a Sinner!"
    • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?ref=profile&id=1456515775
I personally agree that it is better to have the lower waist region covered rather than tucking in the shirt.
What do you think pants do?


A lot of pants don't cover much up these days. Even loose dress slacks can still reveal the form of the posterior. I think it would be nice if men and women could all wear robes to Church. But we don't want to look too different from the world, otherwise people might think we actually are different from the world.

That being said, I have much bigger issues to worry about regarding my salvation than what people wear.


Selam
""Love is a dangerous thing. It will crush you if you trust it. But without it you can never be whole. Love crucifies, but love saves. We will either be saved together with love, or damned alone without it."    Selam, +GMK+

Online PeterTheAleut

  • The Right Blowhard Peter the Furtive of Yetts O'Muckhart
  • Section Moderator
  • Hypatos
  • *****
  • Posts: 34,466
  • Lord, have mercy on the Christians in Mosul!
  • Faith: Orthodox Christian
  • Jurisdiction: Orthodox Church in America
I personally agree that it is better to have the lower waist region covered rather than tucking in the shirt.
What do you think pants do?


A lot of pants don't cover much up these days. Even loose dress slacks can still reveal the form of the posterior. I think it would be nice if men and women could all wear robes to Church. But we don't want to look too different from the world, otherwise people might think we actually are different from the world.

I not sure I agree with the above statement, since I'm not really sure what anyone could gain by looking at my butt, but I certainly agree with the below, so I'll just leave it at this. ;)

That being said, I have much bigger issues to worry about regarding my salvation than what people wear.
« Last Edit: May 06, 2012, 03:04:25 AM by PeterTheAleut »
Not all who wander are lost.

Offline dcommini

  • Tha mi sgulan na Trianaid
  • OC.net guru
  • *******
  • Posts: 1,212
  • Beannachd Dia dhuit
    • Life of an Orthodox Soldier
so according to the title of this thread I should have grace as I usually don't tuck in my shirt or wear a neck tie when I go to church
N/OblSB

Gun cuireadh do chupa thairis le slàinte agus sona - May your cup overflow with health and happiness
Check out my blog...

Offline JamesR

  • Virginal Chicano Blood
  • Taxiarches
  • **********
  • Posts: 6,555
  • No fate but what we make for ourselves.
  • Faith: Misotheistic Eastern Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: Orthodox Church *of* America
...otherwise people might think we actually are different from the world.

But we are. John 15:18-19

On a more personal note, I wish that I did not have to tuck my shirt in at Church for 'male reasons'. Most slacks are rather tight nowadays and can show your manly parts if you get 'excited' during Liturgy. In normal circumstances, your shirt can be used to hide it. But when it is tucked in at Liturgy, there is nothing to hide it.
...Or it's just possible he's a mouthy young man on an internet forum.
In the infinite wisdom of God, James can be all three.

Offline Ansgar

  • Archon
  • ********
  • Posts: 3,053
  • Keep your mind in hell and do not despair
amartin, I must admit, I have failed to see the purpose of all this. You have made several threads over the last days in which you have made a statement about different theological or ethical subjects. That have been done many times before, but in all those other cases, I could always see a meaning with it. Many of them have let to very interesting discussions, but in this case I am confused. Maybe I just can't see it. So I am asking you(and please don't take this as an attack) what is your intention with all these posts? Are you trying to convince us of something, or do you just wish to discuss these subjects? (If the latter is the case, I think that maybe, we should all try a different approach).

I am merely curious.

Thank you for the non-hostility.

In actuality, I am trying to get a feel for how mainline Eastern Orthodox people feel about these issues. It is an education process for me as I learn about the psychology of spiritual apostasy. And others get the benefit of perhaps hearing righteousness for the first time.

I think this is where the problem lies. Righteousness in the Orthodox Church is seen as an entirely different thing than what you have described. Righteousness doesn't necessarily belong to the one who is able to pray the longest or the one who appear as the most pious. It belongs to he who seeks God with all his heart, he who humble himself before the Lord and who tries to follow the commandmensts of Christ. You asked us in another thread if we saw ourselves as righteous. If I look into myself and I see that I have sinned, that I have not done all I could to change myself,  should I then lie to myself by calling myself righteous, or should I acknowledge that I need to work harder.

Saint Maria of Paris said this:  

'At the Last Judgment I will not be asked whether I satisfactorily practised asceticism, nor how many bows I have made before the divine altar: I will be asked whether I fed the hungry, clothed the naked, visited the sick, and the prisoner in his jail. That is all I will be asked.'
Do not be cast down over the struggle - the Lord loves a brave warrior. The Lord loves the soul that is valiant.

-St Silouan the athonite

Offline Tallitot

  • Archon
  • ********
  • Posts: 2,713
Do angels wear shirts and ties?  ::)
Not on casual Fridays.
Proverbs 22:7

Offline Tallitot

  • Archon
  • ********
  • Posts: 2,713
I think a necktie can look very nice. Some of you hippies need to grow up and get a job. Stupid boomers...

Well said Alveus.
Proverbs 22:7

Offline Tallitot

  • Archon
  • ********
  • Posts: 2,713
"Grace does not come to those who tuck in their shirts and wear neck ties"
So Grace likes guys who dress down a little? Well that's her perogative.
Proverbs 22:7

Offline Aindriú

  • Faster! Funnier!
  • Protokentarchos
  • *********
  • Posts: 3,918
    • Blog
and yes, orthonorm approve of this message (sorta).

There's a surprise. I was wondering where you were.
Dude you should see me in my custom     . You off the rack jack.

Lighten up.

 ;D

I'm going to need this.

Offline Luckster

  • Double Dipper
  • Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 140
I never wear suits to Church. I'd rather go naked, let God see me as I am.
There's a Protestant group for that too.

Online PeterTheAleut

  • The Right Blowhard Peter the Furtive of Yetts O'Muckhart
  • Section Moderator
  • Hypatos
  • *****
  • Posts: 34,466
  • Lord, have mercy on the Christians in Mosul!
  • Faith: Orthodox Christian
  • Jurisdiction: Orthodox Church in America
"Grace does not come to those who tuck in their shirts and wear neck ties"
So Grace likes guys who dress down a little? Well that's her perogative.
:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
Not all who wander are lost.

Offline Ortho_cat

  • Protokentarchos
  • *********
  • Posts: 5,392
"Grace does not come to those who tuck in their shirts and wear neck ties"
So Grace likes guys who dress down a little? Well that's her perogative.

If this is the Grace the OP is referring to, then I can certainly understand. She's worth the suit and tie.


Online Alveus Lacuna

  • Taxiarches
  • **********
  • Posts: 7,046
  • Faith: Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: OCA
On a more personal note, I wish that I did not have to tuck my shirt in at Church for 'male reasons'. Most slacks are rather tight nowadays and can show your manly parts if you get 'excited' during Liturgy. In normal circumstances, your shirt can be used to hide it. But when it is tucked in at Liturgy, there is nothing to hide it.

 :D

Thanks for making my day!

Offline augustin717

  • Taxiarches
  • **********
  • Posts: 5,690
On a more personal note, I wish that I did not have to tuck my shirt in at Church for 'male reasons'. Most slacks are rather tight nowadays and can show your manly parts if you get 'excited' during Liturgy. In normal circumstances, your shirt can be used to hide it. But when it is tucked in at Liturgy, there is nothing to hide it.

 :D

Thanks for making my day!
Brother James, you are in dire need of purification, let alone theosis!

Offline Aindriú

  • Faster! Funnier!
  • Protokentarchos
  • *********
  • Posts: 3,918
    • Blog
On a more personal note, I wish that I did not have to tuck my shirt in at Church for 'male reasons'. Most slacks are rather tight nowadays and can show your manly parts if you get 'excited' during Liturgy. In normal circumstances, your shirt can be used to hide it. But when it is tucked in at Liturgy, there is nothing to hide it.

Someone needs to help you with proper technique. Especially since you're staring at all the pretty girl during liturgy.

I'm going to need this.

Offline Ortho_cat

  • Protokentarchos
  • *********
  • Posts: 5,392
...otherwise people might think we actually are different from the world.

But we are. John 15:18-19

On a more personal note, I wish that I did not have to tuck my shirt in at Church for 'male reasons'. Most slacks are rather tight nowadays and can show your manly parts if you get 'excited' during Liturgy. In normal circumstances, your shirt can be used to hide it. But when it is tucked in at Liturgy, there is nothing to hide it.

ah, the joys of adolescence.

Offline Tallitot

  • Archon
  • ********
  • Posts: 2,713
On a more personal note, I wish that I did not have to tuck my shirt in at Church for 'male reasons'. Most slacks are rather tight nowadays and can show your manly parts if you get 'excited' during Liturgy. In normal circumstances, your shirt can be used to hide it. But when it is tucked in at Liturgy, there is nothing to hide it.

Someone needs to help you with proper technique. Especially since you're staring at all the pretty girl during liturgy.
Or watching a hot guy doing prostrations. ;)
Proverbs 22:7

Offline podkarpatska

  • Merarches
  • ***********
  • Posts: 9,308
  • Pokrov
    • ACROD (home)
amartin, I must admit, I have failed to see the purpose of all this. You have made several threads over the last days in which you have made a statement about different theological or ethical subjects. That have been done many times before, but in all those other cases, I could always see a meaning with it. Many of them have let to very interesting discussions, but in this case I am confused. Maybe I just can't see it. So I am asking you(and please don't take this as an attack) what is your intention with all these posts? Are you trying to convince us of something, or do you just wish to discuss these subjects? (If the latter is the case, I think that maybe, we should all try a different approach).

I am merely curious.

Thank you for the non-hostility.

In actuality, I am trying to get a feel for how mainline Eastern Orthodox people feel about these issues. It is an education process for me as I learn about the psychology of spiritual apostasy. And others get the benefit of perhaps hearing righteousness for the first time.

I think this is where the problem lies. Righteousness in the Orthodox Church is seen as an entirely different thing than what you have described. Righteousness doesn't necessarily belong to the one who is able to pray the longest or the one who appear as the most pious. It belongs to he who seeks God with all his heart, he who humble himself before the Lord and who tries to follow the commandmensts of Christ. You asked us in another thread if we saw ourselves as righteous. If I look into myself and I see that I have sinned, that I have not done all I could to change myself,  should I then lie to myself by calling myself righteous, or should I acknowledge that I need to work harder.

Saint Maria of Paris said this:  

'At the Last Judgment I will not be asked whether I satisfactorily practised asceticism, nor how many bows I have made before the divine altar: I will be asked whether I fed the hungry, clothed the naked, visited the sick, and the prisoner in his jail. That is all I will be asked.'

Amen x3.

Offline Carl Kraeff (Second Chance)

  • Taxiarches
  • **********
  • Posts: 7,393
  • Faith: Orthodox Christian
  • Jurisdiction: Diocese of the South (OCA)
amartin, I must admit, I have failed to see the purpose of all this. You have made several threads over the last days in which you have made a statement about different theological or ethical subjects. That have been done many times before, but in all those other cases, I could always see a meaning with it. Many of them have let to very interesting discussions, but in this case I am confused. Maybe I just can't see it. So I am asking you(and please don't take this as an attack) what is your intention with all these posts? Are you trying to convince us of something, or do you just wish to discuss these subjects? (If the latter is the case, I think that maybe, we should all try a different approach).

I am merely curious.

Thank you for the non-hostility.

In actuality, I am trying to get a feel for how mainline Eastern Orthodox people feel about these issues. It is an education process for me as I learn about the psychology of spiritual apostasy. And others get the benefit of perhaps hearing righteousness for the first time.

Thank you for being forthright. It seems to me that your postings are not designed to stimulate a conversation but to satisfy pre-formed conclusions about "the psychology of spiritual apostasy." Of course. we all get to benefit from "hearing righteousness for the first time." Have I gotten this right so far?

ADDED: What do you think of the following paragraphs from the Forum Rules?

Forum Purpose & Place of the Non-Orthodox

To be clear, this site exists as an Orthodox Forum where people who identify themselves as Orthodox are given a place to discuss things pertinent to the Orthodox Faith.  In practicality, this means that there is a broad approach to allowing people from the Eastern Orthodox "Majority", the Eastern Orthodox "Traditionalists", and the Oriental Orthodox "Non-Chalcedonians" to post on topics relating to Orthodoxy.  It should be emphasized that it is the policy of this site that no one is required to affirm that any of the other groups are canonical or Orthodox, but rather the purpose of the broad approach is to allow broad discussion on topics that in academic discourse are labeled "Orthodox studies."

People who do not fit this broad, academic definition of Orthodox, such as Roman Catholics, Protestants, non-Christians, and others, are permitted to post here and to offer positive contributions to the site and corrections when their faith traditions are misrepresented.  They are not, however, permitted to attempt to bring people to other faiths.
« Last Edit: May 07, 2012, 11:02:25 AM by Second Chance »

Offline orthonorm

  • Hoplitarches
  • *************
  • Posts: 17,275
On a more personal note, I wish that I did not have to tuck my shirt in at Church for 'male reasons'. Most slacks are rather tight nowadays and can show your manly parts if you get 'excited' during Liturgy. In normal circumstances, your shirt can be used to hide it. But when it is tucked in at Liturgy, there is nothing to hide it.

 :D

Thanks for making my day!

No kidding, this got lulz from many.
If you have PMed me, the mods have taken my ability to PM away. Please see my email if you wish to contact me during my time of trial.

Offline That person

  • OC.net guru
  • *******
  • Posts: 1,160
  • Long live Commie Superman
So bowties are cool?
"Some have such command of their bowels, that they can break wind continuously at pleasure, so as to produce the effect of singing."- St. Augustine of Hippo

Movie reviews you can trust.

Offline First Man

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 19
I have seen a picture of St. Nikolai the Serb when he was in the United States and he was wearing a suit.

Offline First Man

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 19


On a more personal note, I wish that I did not have to tuck my shirt in at Church for 'male reasons'. Most slacks are rather tight nowadays and can show your manly parts if you get 'excited' during Liturgy. In normal circumstances, your shirt can be used to hide it. But when it is tucked in at Liturgy, there is nothing to hide it.

Someone needs to help you with proper technique. Especially since you're staring at all the pretty girl during liturgy.

The old flip and tuck?

Offline Carl Kraeff (Second Chance)

  • Taxiarches
  • **********
  • Posts: 7,393
  • Faith: Orthodox Christian
  • Jurisdiction: Diocese of the South (OCA)
Folks, I am locking this thread until further notice as there are couple of issues that I plan to discuss with the moderator team. Second Chance