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Author Topic: I Formally Renounce Christianity  (Read 6526 times) Average Rating: 0
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« Reply #90 on: April 25, 2012, 04:14:56 AM »

Curious, are you some sort of Neo Ebionite? Certaintly not muslim (muslims never tend to call Christ Yeshua). But how is it that one Jewish pharisee could singlehandedly initate the great the apostasy? I've never understood this line of reasoning when it comes to Muslims or Neo Ebionites or whatever strange Messianic sect that says this. Questions need to be answered.

Was Saint Paul a deliberate deceiver? Or simply naive?

Why didn't the apostles ever confront him and why is there no record of this?

Given that historically the apostles accepted Saint Paul what caused him to become a bad egg or why did they accept such a man?

Alot to account for with this theory and by the end of it you'll be lucky if you have but a fraction of your faith.
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« Reply #91 on: April 25, 2012, 08:17:44 AM »

Funny a history channel documentary stated it was the oldest monotheistic faith.  Weird.

That's your problem, right there.
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« Reply #92 on: April 25, 2012, 10:53:11 AM »

Greetings. This is my post announcing that I formally renounce the AMartanity. If I am wrong on the Day of Judgement then may I have my infinite reward of reeses' peanut butter cups reduced to an infinite reward of dark chocolate reese's peanut butter cups. I now follow only the Christianity taught by the historical man Saul of Tarsus. I no longer believe that the eternal religioners are his followers. Amartin initiated the Great Apostasy.


This is supposed to be serious. There is nothing serious anymore in "Christianity." Everything is light-hearted nowadays. I cannot believe this! The Apostasy just keeps getting worse and worse.


Why would you base anything on an Internet forum? You want serious? Go to Mt. Athos and talk to an experienced spiritual father. Then you will find help you need. You need to stop trusting your own mind as the arbiter of truth.
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« Reply #93 on: April 25, 2012, 10:54:22 AM »

Greetings. This is my post announcing that I formally renounce the AMartanity. If I am wrong on the Day of Judgement then may I have my infinite reward of reeses' peanut butter cups reduced to an infinite reward of dark chocolate reese's peanut butter cups. I now follow only the Christianity taught by the historical man Saul of Tarsus. I no longer believe that the eternal religioners are his followers. Amartin initiated the Great Apostasy.


This is supposed to be serious. There is nothing serious anymore in "Christianity." Everything is light-hearted nowadays. I cannot believe this! The Apostasy just keeps getting worse and worse.



I am absolutely SHOCKED that this would be posted! There is no one serious anymore. May Yashua come soon to end the world.

I don't take seriously people who use the bizarre term "Yashua." If you can't say "Jesus," you have the problem.
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« Reply #94 on: April 25, 2012, 10:55:09 AM »

Unbelievable! I am never stepping another foot into an Eastern Orthodox church

It does not seem you ever visited. And, if you did, you did not leave your heresy at the door.
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« Reply #95 on: April 25, 2012, 10:56:00 AM »

Unbelievable!
Are you becoming a messianic jew?

No certainly not. They have corrupted the scriptures by animal sacrifices, genital mutilation, and genocide. The Jews are a perverse people. They have also denied the messengers.

And Mohammed was better?
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« Reply #96 on: April 25, 2012, 10:57:29 AM »

Unbelievable!
Are you becoming a messianic jew?

No certainly not. They have corrupted the scriptures by animal sacrifices, genital mutilation, and genocide. The Jews are a perverse people. They have also denied the messengers.
Then can you tell us where you've gotten your new religion? Who else is part of it? Do they have a website?

Every true religion has a Web site AND an Internet forum. The Web site tells you everything they believe and the forum is for catechesis and philosophical discussion. It has always been this way.
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« Reply #97 on: April 25, 2012, 10:58:36 AM »

Unbelievable!
Are you becoming a messianic jew?

No certainly not. They have corrupted the scriptures by animal sacrifices, genital mutilation, and genocide. The Jews are a perverse people. They have also denied the messengers.
Then can you tell us where you've gotten your new religion? Who else is part of it? Do they have a website?

Its the religion of Adam, Noah, Enoch, Abraham, Zoroaster, Moses, and Yashua (Isa)

Oldest religion in the world.

No blood, no Trinity, no incarnate gods, etc.

Ah, now we see you speaking your ignorant heresy plainly.
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« Reply #98 on: April 25, 2012, 10:58:41 AM »

Unbelievable!
Are you becoming a messianic jew?

No certainly not. They have corrupted the scriptures by animal sacrifices, genital mutilation, and genocide. The Jews are a perverse people. They have also denied the messengers.
Then can you tell us where you've gotten your new religion? Who else is part of it? Do they have a website?

Every true religion has a Web site AND an Internet forum. The Web site tells you everything they believe and the forum is for catechesis and philosophical discussion. It has always been this way.

Unto the ages of ages.
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« Reply #99 on: April 25, 2012, 11:00:20 AM »

AMARTIN, I have a question....have you read the Jeffersonian Bible lately? This is really starting to sound like his beliefs.....

PP
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« Reply #100 on: April 25, 2012, 11:01:57 AM »

if this person is posting honestly, then all the joking is just pushing him further and further away. perhaps the notion that someone is apostasizing from the Church should be taken seriously.

I don't think he was ever in the Church. That said, as the OP listens to none by his own mind, nothing anyone says otherwise will accomplish anything. He and those like him need prayer.
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« Reply #101 on: April 25, 2012, 11:04:10 AM »

if this person is posting honestly, then all the joking is just pushing him further and further away. perhaps the notion that someone is apostasizing from the Church should be taken seriously.

I don't think he was ever in the Church. That said, as the OP listens to none by his own mind, nothing anyone says otherwise will accomplish anything. He and those like him need prayer.

But people like ME need threads like his for entertainment. Don't ruin this for me!!
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« Reply #102 on: April 25, 2012, 11:05:25 AM »

And where, pray tell, does "Isa" fit into all this, amartin? I mean, the only Isa I know posts here, and something tells me you're not talking about him...

Isa is Yashua. The first letter is transliterated as "Y" or "I". For example, Jews spell "Yisrael" and "Israel."

The better question is: who the heck is "Jesus" Huh There was NOBODY named Jesus. He is a fake character invented by the English.

The real man is Isa (pronounced: Yashua)

You need to take better care of your mental health.
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« Reply #103 on: April 25, 2012, 11:06:46 AM »

I wonder if amartin is also ishak a whole ago, who was just as disturbing in his posts?
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« Reply #104 on: April 25, 2012, 11:08:27 AM »

I really do want to know if amartin got these views from the Jeffersonian Bible. He also attack St. Paul and the miracles, and the trinity, and he also was no friend of the Hebrews.

Where I live, Jefferson is almost worshipped, so I've heard this stuff before.

PP
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« Reply #105 on: April 25, 2012, 11:09:40 AM »

....
I don't take seriously people who use the bizarre term "Yashua." If you can't say "Jesus," you have the problem.
Are you KJV-only?
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« Reply #106 on: April 25, 2012, 11:39:22 AM »

Greetings. This is my post announcing that I formally renounce the AMartanity. If I am wrong on the Day of Judgement then may I have my infinite reward of reeses' peanut butter cups reduced to an infinite reward of dark chocolate reese's peanut butter cups. I now follow only the Christianity taught by the historical man Saul of Tarsus. I no longer believe that the eternal religioners are his followers. Amartin initiated the Great Apostasy.


This is supposed to be serious. There is nothing serious anymore in "Christianity." Everything is light-hearted nowadays. I cannot believe this! The Apostasy just keeps getting worse and worse.


Your concerns are addressed from an Orthodox perspective by Fr. J on his blog. Please read this article in relation to Andrew Sullivan's so called 'Easter' article in Newsweek from earlier this month.

"It takes an institution -- or rather, the institutional manifestation of the True City, the Body of Christ -- to come up with words like "consubstantiality," "hypostasis," "union without confusion."

These are hard words. Christianity, like it or not, is complicated. And in this vale of sorrows, it cannot escape the contours and rhetoric of institutionality. God is certainly not limited by these contours, but we are.

So Andrew Sullivan has written nothing new. And some people will, every year, throw away their institutional membership cards out of frustration and despair. They will try to keep their "simple" Jesus.

But He, as Him, will not stay that way. Stumbling stones simply cannot.

It is better, on this Western Good Friday, to keep a simple silence, and to bear up under one's Cross."
http://janotec.typepad.com/terrace/2012/04/simple-sullivan.html
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« Reply #107 on: April 25, 2012, 11:47:31 AM »

Yeah, I don't completely understand the reformed Judaism surges.  The Aramaic is important however, if you want to understand the linguistics of the day of Christ. Often though people get it wrong because they get all bent out of shape and say "Jesus" is absolutely incorrect.

My only wonderment or question on using the name of Jesus would be that in our current modern English language, saying "Yeshua" would be
"more accurate" to the actual name as he walked here on Earth.   However, in consideration of the original Greek, tradition, and general culture, using the translation of "Jesus" is not a big deal as people make it.   We say both Yeshua and Jesus in our home.

Do you also say Emmanuel?



Not always.  Emmanuel meant "god with us".  Scriptures say "he will be called Emmanuel", not "he will be NAMED Emmanuel".   So yes, I say that Yeshua/Jesus was God with us, or Emmanuel.
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« Reply #108 on: April 25, 2012, 11:49:18 AM »

I really do want to know if amartin got these views from the Jeffersonian Bible. He also attack St. Paul and the miracles, and the trinity, and he also was no friend of the Hebrews.

Where I live, Jefferson is almost worshipped, so I've heard this stuff before.

PP

Please don't bring up the Jeffersonian Bible.  I almost worship TJ so when his religious views are brought up I usually just plug my ears with molded pieces of beeswax and smile blandly.   Grin
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« Reply #109 on: April 25, 2012, 11:52:36 AM »

I really do want to know if amartin got these views from the Jeffersonian Bible. He also attack St. Paul and the miracles, and the trinity, and he also was no friend of the Hebrews.

Where I live, Jefferson is almost worshipped, so I've heard this stuff before.

PP

Please don't bring up the Jeffersonian Bible.  I almost worship TJ so when his religious views are brought up I usually just plug my ears with molded pieces of beeswax and smile blandly.   Grin
Sorry Vam, TJ got really big in his britches. Not only about the bible, but what he said about the French revolution after the blood started flowing freely.

However, Poplar Forest is 5 minutes from my home, and his words about my home of Lynchburg were wonderful Smiley
PP
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« Reply #110 on: April 25, 2012, 12:09:00 PM »

Greetings. This is my post announcing that I formally renounce the AMartanity. If I am wrong on the Day of Judgement then may I have my infinite reward of reeses' peanut butter cups reduced to an infinite reward of dark chocolate reese's peanut butter cups. I now follow only the Christianity taught by the historical man Saul of Tarsus. I no longer believe that the eternal religioners are his followers. Amartin initiated the Great Apostasy.


This is supposed to be serious. There is nothing serious anymore in "Christianity." Everything is light-hearted nowadays. I cannot believe this! The Apostasy just keeps getting worse and worse.



I am absolutely SHOCKED that this would be posted! There is no one serious anymore. May Yashua come soon to end the world.

I don't take seriously people who use the bizarre term "Yashua." If you can't say "Jesus," you have the problem.

I'm absolutely not saying anything in support of the OP.

But you basically just said that the Lord's name, of Yeshua, as spoken in Aramaic, is a bizarre term.  It was transliterated in Greek, then to Old English as Jesus.   I have no problem with saying Jesus, but I believe saying Yeshua is more phonetically correct, and a more correct way of "praying in his name".  I absolutely do not believe that saying "Jesus" is wrong, but to call "Yeshua" a bizarre term, some may even call that blasphemy.

I think understanding Yeshua/Jesus and how we got there, using both, adds to the richness and respect towards all the cultures and languages.  It doesn't change who he was or our God, it was just our languages that were different.   We use both pronunciations in our home, and teach our children it both ways.  We teach them that he was called Yeshua as he walked on Earth, by his disciples, his parents, and those who knew of him.  We go on to teach them as the New Testament was recorded in Greek, how the sounds of his name did not exist in the Greek language, so as his message spread, the way we say his name was different.  When we read the scriptures, we say Jesus.  We often pray saying Jesus.  At supper, we pray using Yeshua.  

People get all bent out of shape over a simple "issue" that could just add richness and understanding to their faith.   They often act as though it changes the God they are praying to.   It doesn't.  Yeshua was the son of Maryam.  Jesus was the son of Maryam.  Jesus was the son of Mary.  Yeshua was the son of Mary.  It's the same people, the same God, just a language difference.  It's actually kind of neat, and I don't see it as bad to say either.
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« Reply #111 on: April 25, 2012, 12:28:27 PM »

It is not the name itself that is bizarre, Yeshu'isiam, it's the ideology behind it. Nobody will tell the Syriacs, for instance, not to pray in the name of Moran 'Isho Mshiho, but likewise there is no reason why it should be necessary that anyone outside of that tradition adopt Aramaic or Syriac posturing in their prayer just because of some strange need for "authenticity". It is Christ and the religion of Christianity itself that is authentic. This is after all as the Byzantines put it, the faith that established the universe. Given that fact, it shouldn't even be debatable that it is in fact authentic in Greek, and Latin, and Inuktitut, and Mongolian, and Tlingit, and German, and Walloon, and whatever other language just as much as it is in Aramaic, Syriac, Coptic, Ancient Greek, or any other more traditional language of worship. Lose sight of that and you risk making Christianity into a fetish in the worst possible meaning of that term.
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« Reply #112 on: April 25, 2012, 12:36:34 PM »

WOW - some thread...!

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« Reply #113 on: April 25, 2012, 12:48:02 PM »

Christ is Risen!

I was in ROCR but i realized i have to be more traditional than them even and go back earlier to Yashua himself. I cannot believe that mainstream Orthodoxy has turned into this...

"Mainstream" Orthodoxy has not turned into anything like what you think it is.  However, a thread on an Orthodox Christian discussion board that begins with a formal denouncement of Christ can only go three ways:

1. We can try to talk you out of it.  However, your entire posting history has indicated that you're not really open to this.  So...
2. We can try to tell you about how bad of a decision this is.  However, you've already indicated in this thread that you don't care.  So...
3. We can make light of your post and this thread.  We'll keep praying for you despite your pronouncement.

In the end it seems a bit hypocritical for you to be so incensed that Orthodoxy "has come to this" when you've openly declared that you don't care what we believe.  If your intention was to actually start a discussion (which is, of course, the purpose of a discussion board), then you've neglected to share the pertinent information that would give us your full perspective - i.e. what your new-found faith/religion is called, what it fully believes, etc.  So it's only natural for people to fill in the blanks that you've left with whatever their imagination can come up with.

Yes, I'm sure there are some who have participated in this thread who could have been more charitable in their responses, but you should either quit the "I'm shocked!" routine and actually engage the discussion, or just let the thread devolve into whatever it wants to.
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« Reply #114 on: April 25, 2012, 01:19:03 PM »

If a person is named Stephen, but he goes to visit France, they'll call him Etienne.

Yet, it is the same person.

Spellings change from year to year and place to place. They just do. It's not a crime.
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« Reply #115 on: April 25, 2012, 01:49:02 PM »

Nope, this guy has been weird from post #1

Greetings.

I was thinking about why/how God allows the suffering of innocent children. For example, thousands die every year from starvation.

To account for this, for a while I believed that God transcends desire, willing, and action.

But from a scientific perspective, could it be possible that God is at such a high vibrational frequency that God cannot automatically change things in the physical realm, which exists at an infinitely lower frequency? For example, spirits can walk through walls but they cannot easily change physical things. Could the same apply to God, but at infinitely higher levels?

Thanks for your input...

It's the vibrational frequency... yes... it's so clear now. Why didn't I ever think of that before?

Dan Rather just emailed - is the op's real name Kenneth by any chance? ( Embarrassed )
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« Reply #116 on: April 25, 2012, 02:06:58 PM »

I love FFA-RT!
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« Reply #117 on: April 25, 2012, 02:21:59 PM »

May the prayers of St. Varus intercede for Mr. Martin.
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« Reply #118 on: April 25, 2012, 03:02:39 PM »

If a person is named Stephen, but he goes to visit France, they'll call him Etienne.

Yet, it is the same person.

Spellings change from year to year and place to place. They just do. It's not a crime.

Yes, this is the exact way I see it.  No crimes. Nothing wrong between the names Yeshua and Jesus.

We use both because we love the richness and traditions of both names.  In fact we find it very nice because it brings in the culture and linguistics from the worldwide church body.    Many priests here in America will say "Christ is Risen - Christos Voskrese - etc."  I've heard it in 5 languages... Means the same thing.   Using Yeshua or Jesus is both right, just as using Christ or Christos is right. 
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« Reply #119 on: April 25, 2012, 03:06:22 PM »

Greetings. This is my post announcing that I formally renounce the AMartanity. If I am wrong on the Day of Judgement then may I have my infinite reward of reeses' peanut butter cups reduced to an infinite reward of dark chocolate reese's peanut butter cups. I now follow only the Christianity taught by the historical man Saul of Tarsus. I no longer believe that the eternal religioners are his followers. Amartin initiated the Great Apostasy.


This is supposed to be serious. There is nothing serious anymore in "Christianity." Everything is light-hearted nowadays. I cannot believe this! The Apostasy just keeps getting worse and worse.



I am absolutely SHOCKED that this would be posted! There is no one serious anymore. May Yashua come soon to end the world.

I don't take seriously people who use the bizarre term "Yashua." If you can't say "Jesus," you have the problem.

I'm absolutely not saying anything in support of the OP.

But you basically just said that the Lord's name, of Yeshua, as spoken in Aramaic, is a bizarre term.  It was transliterated in Greek, then to Old English as Jesus.   I have no problem with saying Jesus, but I believe saying Yeshua is more phonetically correct, and a more correct way of "praying in his name".  I absolutely do not believe that saying "Jesus" is wrong, but to call "Yeshua" a bizarre term, some may even call that blasphemy.

I think understanding Yeshua/Jesus and how we got there, using both, adds to the richness and respect towards all the cultures and languages.  It doesn't change who he was or our God, it was just our languages that were different.   We use both pronunciations in our home, and teach our children it both ways.  We teach them that he was called Yeshua as he walked on Earth, by his disciples, his parents, and those who knew of him.  We go on to teach them as the New Testament was recorded in Greek, how the sounds of his name did not exist in the Greek language, so as his message spread, the way we say his name was different.  When we read the scriptures, we say Jesus.  We often pray saying Jesus.  At supper, we pray using Yeshua.  

People get all bent out of shape over a simple "issue" that could just add richness and understanding to their faith.   They often act as though it changes the God they are praying to.   It doesn't.  Yeshua was the son of Maryam.  Jesus was the son of Maryam.  Jesus was the son of Mary.  Yeshua was the son of Mary.  It's the same people, the same God, just a language difference.  It's actually kind of neat, and I don't see it as bad to say either.

OP said YASHUA, not YESHUA. Is it tomayto, tomahto? It didn't appear that way to me.
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Holy Trinity Church of Gergeti, Georgia


« Reply #120 on: April 25, 2012, 03:08:06 PM »

If a person is named Stephen, but he goes to visit France, they'll call him Etienne.

Yet, it is the same person.

Spellings change from year to year and place to place. They just do. It's not a crime.

Again, he was hooked on it, and misspelled it consistently.
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« Reply #121 on: April 25, 2012, 03:09:39 PM »

If a person is named Stephen, but he goes to visit France, they'll call him Etienne.

Yet, it is the same person.

Spellings change from year to year and place to place. They just do. It's not a crime.

Yes, this is the exact way I see it.  No crimes. Nothing wrong between the names Yeshua and Jesus.

We use both because we love the richness and traditions of both names.  In fact we find it very nice because it brings in the culture and linguistics from the worldwide church body.    Many priests here in America will say "Christ is Risen - Christos Voskrese - etc."  I've heard it in 5 languages... Means the same thing.   Using Yeshua or Jesus is both right, just as using Christ or Christos is right. 


Again, the OP was insanely separating Jesus from Yashua, whoever that is. Maybe I'm just dense.
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If you spend long enough on this forum, you'll come away with all sorts of weird, untrue ideas of Orthodox Christianity.
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I would suggest most persons in general avoid any question beginning with why.
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« Reply #122 on: April 25, 2012, 08:26:53 PM »

Man, turn your back for just a moment and look what happens.



Aindriu, where did you get popcorn eating smiley?

I was going to suggest that the OP was part of the "Hebrew Roots Movement" of Protestantism, they reject Paul, but I think there's few things been said that go beyond that.
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« Reply #123 on: April 25, 2012, 08:43:51 PM »

Google. Posted as a picture.
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« Reply #124 on: April 25, 2012, 08:52:45 PM »

I searched for an appropriately Aramaic smiley for our OP, and I swear to ORIGINAL MONOTHEISM that this came up relatively early:



I'm choosing to take that as a sign that amartin's god is upset with this stupid thread. Flee! Flee from the wrath of Yahoshouisa.
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« Reply #125 on: April 25, 2012, 08:56:41 PM »

Dan Rather just emailed - is the op's real name Kenneth by any chance? ( Embarrassed )

http://www.orthodoxchristianity.net/forum/index.php/topic,44313.msg738769.html#msg738769
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« Reply #126 on: April 25, 2012, 09:13:22 PM »


me bad/// that's what speed reading can do to ya!
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« Reply #127 on: April 25, 2012, 10:24:58 PM »

I have been pondering about the title of this thread: I formally renounce..."-- not "I informally renounce.." or "I renounce..." but " formally..."

How can one do that on the Internet? in a blog? I mean, why wasn't that nailed on the door of Saint Nicholas Cathedral or other suitable formal structure?
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« Reply #128 on: April 25, 2012, 10:30:35 PM »

If I am wrong on the Day of Judgement then may I be condemned for my insolence.

I believe God will be merciful upon those who have no idea what they're talking about.


Good thing for me!
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« Reply #129 on: April 25, 2012, 11:15:28 PM »

Google. Posted as a picture.

Thanks, it just fits this, so well.  Grin
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« Reply #130 on: April 25, 2012, 11:51:25 PM »

"Angels can fly because they take themselves lightly"...
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« Reply #131 on: April 26, 2012, 12:47:18 AM »

My only wonderment or question on using the name of Jesus would be that in our current modern English language, saying "Yeshua" would be
"more accurate" to the actual name as he walked here on Earth.   However, in consideration of the original Greek, tradition, and general culture, using the translation of "Jesus" is not a big deal as people make it.   We say both Yeshua and Jesus in our home.

If we start down that road, Confucius, Moses and Julius Caesar would all like a word with you as well. Not to mention places like Germany, Japan and Warsaw, or the month of January or the algebra classes they teach at your local high-school. That's just not how languages work. Once a word--including a proper name--has become fully naturalized it undergoes sound changes like any other word in the language and is very 'sticky'.

We say Jesus because every native-speaker of English knows who that refers too. We don't say Yeshua any more than we say Zhongguo or pronounce the 'k' and the 'gh' in 'knight'--because while English speakers with specialized knowledge might know what you were talking about, most wouldn't. And people generally prefer to communicate without having to place (or hear) a dictionary entry after every word if they can avoid it.
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« Reply #132 on: April 26, 2012, 01:04:43 AM »

If someone insists on calling Jesus only Yeshua, why not go all the way? Everyone knows what the names Yesheyahu, Yechezkel, and Yirmiyahu refer to!
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« Reply #133 on: April 26, 2012, 10:05:18 AM »

I have been pondering about the title of this thread: I formally renounce..."-- not "I informally renounce.." or "I renounce..." but " formally..."

How can one do that on the Internet? in a blog? I mean, why wasn't that nailed on the door of Saint Nicholas Cathedral or other suitable formal structure?

Even that is informal.  Personally, I think the only formal renunciation would be a signed letter that you personally staple to your primate's vestments during any of the processions at Liturgy.
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« Reply #134 on: April 26, 2012, 04:39:58 PM »

I have been pondering about the title of this thread: I formally renounce..."-- not "I informally renounce.." or "I renounce..." but " formally..."

How can one do that on the Internet? in a blog? I mean, why wasn't that nailed on the door of Saint Nicholas Cathedral or other suitable formal structure?
Because not only does he not understand the teachings of Christ, but he doesn't get vocabulary very well either.
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