Author Topic: The stereotypical dreaded question  (Read 1347 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline casisthename

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 72
The stereotypical dreaded question
« on: April 05, 2012, 01:13:11 PM »
We have all heard the whole dating another Orthodox person is easier in the long run speel. And I honestly agree. But at the same time for us converts (which as of 2 weeks ago I can officially call my an Orthodox convert) we all know at times dating outside Orthodoxy is more realistic. What are some things those of you who have gone through this before, recommend bringing up to the other person before dating pertaining to Orthodoxy?

Offline Melodist

  • Archon
  • ********
  • Posts: 2,523
Re: The stereotypical dreaded question
« Reply #1 on: April 05, 2012, 01:38:38 PM »
We have all heard the whole dating another Orthodox person is easier in the long run speel. And I honestly agree. But at the same time for us converts (which as of 2 weeks ago I can officially call my an Orthodox convert) we all know at times dating outside Orthodoxy is more realistic. What are some things those of you who have gone through this before, recommend bringing up to the other person before dating pertaining to Orthodoxy?

That you WILL get married in an Orthodox church and your kids WILL BE baptized in your church - on the first date.  :o

Seriously, I don't know, I have only dated one girl since becoming Orthodox, and that didn't last long enough to go anywhere. I would probably start by defending it as being Christian by belief in the Trinity, incarnation, what's in the creed, and Peter's confession of Jesus as the Christ and the Son of the Living God. Then maybe mention that it is different than what she is used to and talk about the historical roots of the Church. I wouldn't mention anything about fasting until it became absolutely necessary, probably just find an excuse on fasting days to eat according to the rules when we go out and I cook, and eat no more than what is prepared for me when she cooks - no matter what she cooks. I probably wouldn't go into any more detail than that until she takes enough of an interest to attend church with me sometime and then deal with issues as the come up.

It's something I've put a little thought into how I would go about doing, especially since I'm 30 and the only available "women" in my parish are 18-19-20 year old college students.
And FWIW, these are our Fathers too, you know.

Made Perfect in Weakness - Latest Post: The Son of God

Offline Ortho_cat

  • Protokentarchos
  • *********
  • Posts: 5,392
Re: The stereotypical dreaded question
« Reply #2 on: April 05, 2012, 02:53:11 PM »
Show her that you are serious about your faith and that it's an important part of your life. Wait for her to ask to come to church with you (which she most likely will if you continue to date her for a period of time). I would avoid any/all debates. Answer all questions pertaining to the faith with patience, humility, kindness, and gratitude.

Online Alveus Lacuna

  • Taxiarches
  • **********
  • Posts: 7,049
  • Faith: Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: OCA
Re: The stereotypical dreaded question
« Reply #3 on: April 05, 2012, 02:55:44 PM »
It's something I've put a little thought into how I would go about doing, especially since I'm 30 and the only available "women" in my parish are 18-19-20 year old college students.

Sounds good to me!!!

Offline JamesR

  • Virginal Chicano Blood
  • Taxiarches
  • **********
  • Posts: 6,556
  • 1951-2015 Memory Eternal Uncle Roy--40 Days of Mourning.
  • Faith: Misotheistic Eastern Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: Orthodox Church *of* America
Re: The stereotypical dreaded question
« Reply #4 on: April 05, 2012, 03:00:59 PM »
Depends on your age. To be honest, I'm only sixteen and I do not have this problem. Chances are that I'm not going to end up marrying any of the girls I date in my teens, so, I do not think it matters if I bring up my religion or not. As to when I'm a bit older and marriage is a possibility, I'm not sure what I'll do. But hopefully I'll marry an Orthodox woman.
« Last Edit: April 05, 2012, 03:03:48 PM by JamesR »
...Or it's just possible he's a mouthy young man on an internet forum.
In the infinite wisdom of God, James can be all three.

Offline Ortho_cat

  • Protokentarchos
  • *********
  • Posts: 5,392
Re: The stereotypical dreaded question
« Reply #5 on: April 05, 2012, 03:10:42 PM »
It's something I've put a little thought into how I would go about doing, especially since I'm 30 and the only available "women" in my parish are 18-19-20 year old college students.

Sounds good to me!!!

lol ya, i don't see the problem here... ;)

Offline LizaSymonenko

  • Слава Ісусу Христу!!! Glory to Jesus Christ!!!
  • Global Moderator
  • Toumarches
  • ******
  • Posts: 13,911
    • St.Mary the Protectress Ukrainian Orthodox Cathedral
  • Faith: Eastern Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: Ukrainian Orthodox Church of the U.S.A.
Re: The stereotypical dreaded question
« Reply #6 on: April 05, 2012, 03:47:34 PM »

What?!?  Date someone who is non-Orthodox?  Why waste your time?  ;)

On the serious side...if you are serious about your Faith...then it truly is best to find a spouse who shares that Faith with you....better for the two of you and better for the kids.

This celebrating two Easters, two Christmases, fasting, not fasting, ..... it just opens up more possibilities for discord within the family unit.

I know....believe me I KNOW....it's hard to find an Orthodox spouse.  Did I mention...I know?

However, watching those around me marry outside the Church....and watching all the issues they encounter....it's just not worth it.

Again, I know that marrying an Orthodox person does NOT guarantee familial bliss....however, it is one less reason over which to argue.  We have our Traditions and traditions...and both seem odd to the non-believer.  To me, my faith is priority one....and if my spouse, no matter how much I loved him, even hinted at ridiculing or belittling Orthodoxy, it would just kill me.  I would be torn between the two.

I'm just saying....IF you can, try to find someone within Orthodoxy to settle down with.

Conquer evil men by your gentle kindness, and make zealous men wonder at your goodness. Put the lover of legality to shame by your compassion. With the afflicted be afflicted in mind. Love all men, but keep distant from all men.
—St. Isaac of Syria

Offline Ortho_cat

  • Protokentarchos
  • *********
  • Posts: 5,392
Re: The stereotypical dreaded question
« Reply #7 on: April 05, 2012, 04:21:48 PM »
I think if i seriously dated someone outside of the church, i would set a line in the sand that if we get serious (married) she will eventually have to come over with me :)
« Last Edit: April 05, 2012, 04:22:00 PM by Ortho_cat »

Offline TheMathematician

  • OC.net guru
  • *******
  • Posts: 1,865
  • Formerly known as Montalo
  • Faith: Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: ACROD
Re: The stereotypical dreaded question
« Reply #8 on: April 05, 2012, 09:47:03 PM »
then again, depending on the church you get married in, your spouse would need to be Orthodox to be married to the,(as is the case with my ROCOR parish)

Offline NicholasMyra

  • Avowed denominationalist
  • Taxiarches
  • **********
  • Posts: 6,381
  • Nepsis or Sepsis™
  • Faith: Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: Antiochian+Greek
Re: The stereotypical dreaded question
« Reply #9 on: April 06, 2012, 01:19:49 AM »
That you WILL get married in an Orthodox church and your kids WILL BE baptized in your church - on the first date.  :o
:o
Quote from: Orthonorm
if Christ does and says x. And someone else does and says not x and you are ever in doubt, follow Christ.

Πάντα μὲν καθαρὰ τοῖς καθαροῖς
Τοῖς δὲ μεμιασμένοις καὶ ἀπίστοις οὐδὲν καθαρόν

Offline acts420

  • Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 310
    • Acts420
Re: The stereotypical dreaded question
« Reply #10 on: April 06, 2012, 01:30:42 AM »
We have all heard the whole dating another Orthodox person is easier in the long run speel. And I honestly agree. But at the same time for us converts (which as of 2 weeks ago I can officially call my an Orthodox convert) we all know at times dating outside Orthodoxy is more realistic. What are some things those of you who have gone through this before, recommend bringing up to the other person before dating pertaining to Orthodoxy?

The reality in most of the places I've lived is that most girls, by far, don't even know what orthodox Christianity is.  When I've dated, I've tried to find out how "close" they are.  Most have heard of God, of Christ, and of some of His teachings.  So I'll ask about things like belief in God, in Christ's resurrection, and the role love for others should play in our lives.  If there are too few shared beliefs and practices, then I don't even see the point of dating.  I could marry a non-orthodox girl in the right situation, I think.  It would be far from ideal though, and there would have to be a certain minimum of shared faith and practice regarding God and righteous living.  For instance, I'm just not going to marry and risk having kids with an atheist who will be fighting my attempts to teach the faith in God to our children.  I'm not going to marry a girl who thinks giving to the poor is a waste.  If a girl doesn't even have the bare minimum, and if she isn't showing interest in progressing toward the Way, then I see no reason to grow close to her and set us both up for a potential heartbreak in the future.
« Last Edit: April 06, 2012, 01:33:09 AM by acts420 »
In Christ,
Jason
www.acts420.com

Offline Justin Kissel

  • •|•|•
  • Protospatharios
  • ****************
  • Posts: 31,789
Re: The stereotypical dreaded question
« Reply #11 on: April 06, 2012, 01:32:42 AM »
Yuns guys are doing it wrong. World views are malleable, looks are not. Find someone you're attracted to, and then negotiate which religion/philosophy you can mutually agree to.  :police:

Offline NicholasMyra

  • Avowed denominationalist
  • Taxiarches
  • **********
  • Posts: 6,381
  • Nepsis or Sepsis™
  • Faith: Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: Antiochian+Greek
Re: The stereotypical dreaded question
« Reply #12 on: April 06, 2012, 02:09:50 AM »
Yuns guys are doing it wrong. World views are malleable, looks are not. Find someone you're attracted to, and then negotiate which religion/philosophy you can mutually agree to.  :police:
I prefer the method of swinging a 99 knot prayer rope back and forth in front of a girl's face like a hypnotist's watch, while whispering: "you are getting a phronema... you are getting a phronema... when I metanya three times, you will accept the dogmatic declaration of Nicea II!". If she backs away awkwardly, she's a goner. If she scowls and asks why I haven't moved on to 150 knots, I know she's a potential keeper.
« Last Edit: April 06, 2012, 02:14:27 AM by NicholasMyra »
Quote from: Orthonorm
if Christ does and says x. And someone else does and says not x and you are ever in doubt, follow Christ.

Πάντα μὲν καθαρὰ τοῖς καθαροῖς
Τοῖς δὲ μεμιασμένοις καὶ ἀπίστοις οὐδὲν καθαρόν

Offline mabsoota

  • Archon
  • ********
  • Posts: 2,859
  • Kyrie eleison
  • Faith: Christian
  • Jurisdiction: Orthodox (Coptic)
Re: The stereotypical dreaded question
« Reply #13 on: April 06, 2012, 04:52:08 AM »
looks are not malleable!
then something bad happened with mine.
somehow i don't look the same as i did 20 years ago.
thank God my husband digs grey hair...
 ;)

Offline KShaft

  • Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 250
Re: The stereotypical dreaded question
« Reply #14 on: April 07, 2012, 01:42:13 AM »
We have all heard the whole dating another Orthodox person is easier in the long run speel. And I honestly agree. But at the same time for us converts (which as of 2 weeks ago I can officially call my an Orthodox convert) we all know at times dating outside Orthodoxy is more realistic. What are some things those of you who have gone through this before, recommend bringing up to the other person before dating pertaining to Orthodoxy?



It's something I've put a little thought into how I would go about doing, especially since I'm 30 and the only available "women" in my parish are 18-19-20 year old college students.

And this is a problem?!?

Just kidding. 25 year old is good 30 is good too. 19-20 year old women nowadays act like 14 year olds typically. Wasnt always the case... If she is a good Orthodox girl, dont count her out. She may age like fine wine. If shes older than you then shell just turn to vinegar...

Offline KShaft

  • Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 250
Re: The stereotypical dreaded question
« Reply #15 on: April 07, 2012, 01:44:18 AM »
It's something I've put a little thought into how I would go about doing, especially since I'm 30 and the only available "women" in my parish are 18-19-20 year old college students.

Sounds good to me!!!

Yes, this answer here....

Offline Shiny

  • Site Supporter
  • Toumarches
  • *****
  • Posts: 13,267
  • Paint It Red
Re: The stereotypical dreaded question
« Reply #16 on: April 07, 2012, 02:03:36 AM »
I think I will take a "mentor's" advice and say if she ain't crazy, she should have no problem becoming Orthodoxy. I agree.
“There is your brother, naked, crying, and you stand there confused over the choice of an attractive floor covering.”

– St. Ambrose of Milan

Offline GabrieltheCelt

  • Taxiarches
  • **********
  • Posts: 7,014
  • Faith: Eastern Orthodox OCA
Re: The stereotypical dreaded question
« Reply #17 on: April 07, 2012, 02:21:50 AM »
Show her that you are serious about your faith and that it's an important part of your life. Wait for her to ask to come to church with you (which she most likely will if you continue to date her for a period of time). I would avoid any/all debates. Answer all questions pertaining to the faith with patience, humility, kindness, and gratitude.

 This is absolutely wonderful advice and almost exactly how I approached things with my wife when we began dating.  The only deviation was that I invited her to church after a few dates rather than wait for her to ask me for permission.  Again, great advice.  :)
"The Scots-Irish; Brewed in Scotland, bottled in Ireland, uncorked in America."  ~Scots-Irish saying

Offline GabrieltheCelt

  • Taxiarches
  • **********
  • Posts: 7,014
  • Faith: Eastern Orthodox OCA
Re: The stereotypical dreaded question
« Reply #18 on: April 07, 2012, 02:39:57 AM »
I think I will take a "mentor's" advice and say if she ain't crazy, she should have no problem becoming Orthodoxy. I agree.

 Actually, people (regardless of their sex) choose to convert (or not to convert) for many reasons.  Insinuating that a person who doesn't choose Orthodoxy over all other Christian paths may not have complete control of their mental faculties is an irresponsible statement.   
"The Scots-Irish; Brewed in Scotland, bottled in Ireland, uncorked in America."  ~Scots-Irish saying

Offline GabrieltheCelt

  • Taxiarches
  • **********
  • Posts: 7,014
  • Faith: Eastern Orthodox OCA
Re: The stereotypical dreaded question
« Reply #19 on: April 07, 2012, 02:42:47 AM »
looks are not malleable!
then something bad happened with mine.
somehow i don't look the same as i did 20 years ago.
thank God my husband digs grey hair...
 ;)

 I totally dig my wife's graying hair!  But then again, she's a knockout and looks good in anything. 
"The Scots-Irish; Brewed in Scotland, bottled in Ireland, uncorked in America."  ~Scots-Irish saying

Offline casisthename

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 72
Re: The stereotypical dreaded question
« Reply #20 on: April 07, 2012, 02:25:06 PM »
...I'd just like to point out I'm a woman and ergo it would be wait for him to ask

Offline Justin Kissel

  • •|•|•
  • Protospatharios
  • ****************
  • Posts: 31,789
Re: The stereotypical dreaded question
« Reply #21 on: April 07, 2012, 02:27:30 PM »
...I'd just like to point out I'm a woman and ergo it would be wait for him to ask

You a doormat muslim girl or something?

Offline KBN1

  • High Elder
  • ******
  • Posts: 888
Re: The stereotypical dreaded question
« Reply #22 on: April 07, 2012, 05:26:29 PM »
We have all heard the whole dating another Orthodox person is easier in the long run speel. And I honestly agree. But at the same time for us converts (which as of 2 weeks ago I can officially call my an Orthodox convert) we all know at times dating outside Orthodoxy is more realistic. What are some things those of you who have gone through this before, recommend bringing up to the other person before dating pertaining to Orthodoxy?

That you WILL get married in an Orthodox church and your kids WILL BE baptized in your church - on the first date.  :o

Seriously, I don't know, I have only dated one girl since becoming Orthodox, and that didn't last long enough to go anywhere. I would probably start by defending it as being Christian by belief in the Trinity, incarnation, what's in the creed, and Peter's confession of Jesus as the Christ and the Son of the Living God. Then maybe mention that it is different than what she is used to and talk about the historical roots of the Church. I wouldn't mention anything about fasting until it became absolutely necessary, probably just find an excuse on fasting days to eat according to the rules when we go out and I cook, and eat no more than what is prepared for me when she cooks - no matter what she cooks. I probably wouldn't go into any more detail than that until she takes enough of an interest to attend church with me sometime and then deal with issues as the come up.

It's something I've put a little thought into how I would go about doing, especially since I'm 30 and the only available "women" in my parish are 18-19-20 year old college students.

Ha.  When I converted I gave up hope of marriage.

Edit:  I should add one of these -- ;)
« Last Edit: April 07, 2012, 05:31:06 PM by KBN1 »

Offline Melodist

  • Archon
  • ********
  • Posts: 2,523
Re: The stereotypical dreaded question
« Reply #23 on: April 07, 2012, 06:19:29 PM »
Ha.  When I converted I gave up hope of marriage.

The real reason people join monasteries.
And FWIW, these are our Fathers too, you know.

Made Perfect in Weakness - Latest Post: The Son of God

Offline Ortho_cat

  • Protokentarchos
  • *********
  • Posts: 5,392
Re: The stereotypical dreaded question
« Reply #24 on: April 07, 2012, 11:03:02 PM »
Ha.  When I converted I gave up hope of marriage.

The real reason people join monasteries.

give me 5 years and i'll be one of em.

Offline Tikhon.of.Colorado

  • Site Supporter
  • Archon
  • *****
  • Posts: 2,375
Re: The stereotypical dreaded question
« Reply #25 on: April 16, 2012, 09:14:59 PM »
I am speaking from no personal experience.  I won't be getting married, so I don't really date...

We should know someone as a friend before dating them.  If they know you, they should know that your serious enough about your faith to be on a forum about the topic!   ;)

My old priest suggested taking our possible future spouses to Church with us.  He took his dates to services, including his chrismation and forgiveness vespers, which I really wouldn't recommend, as it would just weird them out.  He ended up meeting his wife at seminary.  He was newly enrolled, and she was visiting a relative.  You could always try that, I suppose...

Just take your time when dating and all.  Make your intentions clear from the beginning, and there will be no surprises.  But be open to your partner's imput.  If what Church to baptize your children in is that much of an issue with you both, than it's just not meant to be.

Talk to a priest about this!!!

I've found this: http://www.facebook.com/pages/Orthodox-Christian-Singles/266833854444

This book was written by an Orthodox Christian, and is from the viewpoint of an single Orthodox Christian on dating:
http://www.amazon.com/Heaven-Help-Single-Christian-Navigating/dp/1928653405