Author Topic: Which church is more open to reuniting??  (Read 17190 times)

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Offline biro

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #495 on: April 17, 2012, 06:15:27 PM »
I wonder how many of us pray for unity in truth.

The Orthodox do, at every Divine Liturgy:

Having prayed for the unity of faith and for the communion of the Holy Spirit, let us commit ourselves, and one another, and our whole life to Christ our God.

Yeah, but I've seen people here insist that it really means insular unity within the Orthodox themselves, not those awful people outside.  :-\ So, I don't really know what it means when I pray that now.
He will come again with glory to judge the living and the dead. His kingdom will have no end.

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Offline Peter J

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #496 on: April 17, 2012, 06:30:12 PM »
Quote
"If we were to resume communion... there would be ONE Church".
The many Churches are the one Church; for the one Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church exists - whole and entire - only in and through the many local (eparchial / diocesan) Churches.

Good point. It isn't that there would be one Church but that there is one Church.
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Offline ialmisry

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #497 on: April 17, 2012, 06:46:27 PM »
I wonder how many of us pray for unity in truth.

The Orthodox do, at every Divine Liturgy:

Having prayed for the unity of faith and for the communion of the Holy Spirit, let us commit ourselves, and one another, and our whole life to Christ our God.

Yeah, but I've seen people here insist that it really means insular unity within the Orthodox themselves, not those awful people outside.  :-\ So, I don't really know what it means when I pray that now.
And we should join you in your confusion?

It means the door is open to those outside to come on inside.
Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth

Offline biro

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #498 on: April 17, 2012, 06:49:11 PM »
I wonder how many of us pray for unity in truth.

The Orthodox do, at every Divine Liturgy:

Having prayed for the unity of faith and for the communion of the Holy Spirit, let us commit ourselves, and one another, and our whole life to Christ our God.



Yeah, but I've seen people here insist that it really means insular unity within the Orthodox themselves, not those awful people outside.  :-\ So, I don't really know what it means when I pray that now.
And we should join you in your confusion?

It means the door is open to those outside to come on inside.

No kidding? You're a priest since when?
He will come again with glory to judge the living and the dead. His kingdom will have no end.

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And if I seem a little strange, well, that's because I am

Offline elijahmaria

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #499 on: April 17, 2012, 06:50:00 PM »
I wonder how many of us pray for unity in truth.

The Orthodox do, at every Divine Liturgy:

Having prayed for the unity of faith and for the communion of the Holy Spirit, let us commit ourselves, and one another, and our whole life to Christ our God.

Yeah, but I've seen people here insist that it really means insular unity within the Orthodox themselves, not those awful people outside.  :-\ So, I don't really know what it means when I pray that now.
And we should join you in your confusion?

It means the door is open to those outside to come on inside.

LOL...I told you that I've done that already and you told me to get out...LOL

As though I listen to you... ;)

Offline Peter J

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #500 on: April 17, 2012, 06:57:30 PM »
I wonder how many of us pray for unity in truth.

The Orthodox do, at every Divine Liturgy:

Having prayed for the unity of faith and for the communion of the Holy Spirit, let us commit ourselves, and one another, and our whole life to Christ our God.

Yeah, but I've seen people here insist that it really means insular unity within the Orthodox themselves, not those awful people outside.  :-\ So, I don't really know what it means when I pray that now.
And we should join you in your confusion?

It means the door is open to those outside to come on inside.

LOL...I told you that I've done that already and you told me to get out...LOL

Wow!
- Peter Jericho (a CAF poster)

Offline ialmisry

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #501 on: April 17, 2012, 07:34:36 PM »
I wonder how many of us pray for unity in truth.

The Orthodox do, at every Divine Liturgy:

Having prayed for the unity of faith and for the communion of the Holy Spirit, let us commit ourselves, and one another, and our whole life to Christ our God.

Yeah, but I've seen people here insist that it really means insular unity within the Orthodox themselves, not those awful people outside.  :-\ So, I don't really know what it means when I pray that now.
And we should join you in your confusion?

It means the door is open to those outside to come on inside.

LOL...I told you that I've done that already and you told me to get out...LOL

As though I listen to you... ;)
Guests are welcome, as are those who come to dwell.  Squatters and theives, not so much.
Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth

Offline elijahmaria

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #502 on: April 17, 2012, 07:41:53 PM »
Squatters and theives, not so much.

Then I must be neither for I am welcomed.

As I said: I don't ever need listen to you for anything at all.  Barely a blip on my radar, though it is good to know who your friends are not.

Offline biro

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #503 on: April 17, 2012, 07:42:43 PM »
Squatters and theives, not so much.

Then I must be neither for I am welcomed.

As I said: I don't ever need listen to you for anything at all.  Barely a blip on my radar, though it is good to know who your friends are not.

You know, you can report him for an ad hominem, if you want...  ::)
He will come again with glory to judge the living and the dead. His kingdom will have no end.

--

And if I seem a little strange, well, that's because I am

Offline elijahmaria

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #504 on: April 17, 2012, 07:53:27 PM »
Squatters and theives, not so much.

Then I must be neither for I am welcomed.

As I said: I don't ever need listen to you for anything at all.  Barely a blip on my radar, though it is good to know who your friends are not.

You know, you can report him for an ad hominem, if you want...  ::)

The decks do not stack that way here.  I'd open myself up for worse.  Besides there's more pity than annoyance.

 :)
« Last Edit: April 17, 2012, 07:54:02 PM by elijahmaria »

Offline Peter J

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #505 on: April 17, 2012, 08:07:40 PM »
It means the door is open to those outside to come on inside.

LOL...I told you that I've done that already and you told me to get out...LOL

As though I listen to you... ;)
Guests are welcome, as are those who come to dwell.  Squatters and theives, not so much.

This conversation has gotten quite bizarre. Does the door being open for those outside to come in refer to something other than swimming the Bosphorus? And if so what?
« Last Edit: April 17, 2012, 08:10:47 PM by Peter J »
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Offline LBK

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #506 on: April 17, 2012, 08:08:30 PM »
Squatters and theives, not so much.

Then I must be neither for I am welcomed.


Welcomed when you attend services, perhaps, but you, a non-Orthodox, receiving communion from an Orthodox chalice is still out of the question.
No longer posting here. Anyone is welcome to PM me or email me at the address in my profile.

Offline elijahmaria

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #507 on: April 17, 2012, 08:12:01 PM »
Squatters and theives, not so much.

Then I must be neither for I am welcomed.


Welcomed when you attend services, perhaps, but you, a non-Orthodox, receiving communion from an Orthodox chalice is still out of the question.

I know others like me who do, and with the blessing of both Orthodox and Catholic bishop.  In fact the "arrangements" were made at that level.

I am not in such a position, nor do I claim to be.  If I were I'd know enough to keep my mouth closed about it.  Since I am not I can speak and make reference to the elephant in the living room.

Mary
« Last Edit: April 17, 2012, 08:12:44 PM by elijahmaria »

Offline biro

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #508 on: April 17, 2012, 08:16:45 PM »
When I was still in the RCC, I saw, several times, Russian Orthodox kids come up and take Communion at the Friday morning Mass. That was the Mass for the school kids, and a lot of Orthodox go to the Roman Catholic school, because there isn't an Orthodox school in this area. Nobody seemed to get angry or have problems then.
He will come again with glory to judge the living and the dead. His kingdom will have no end.

--

And if I seem a little strange, well, that's because I am

Offline ialmisry

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #509 on: April 17, 2012, 08:26:59 PM »
Squatters and theives, not so much.

Then I must be neither for I am welcomed.
By whom, and for what?

As I said: I don't ever need listen to you for anything at all.  Barely a blip on my radar, though it is good to know who your friends are not.
Care to name your Orthodox friends giving you communion?
Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth

Offline elijahmaria

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #510 on: April 17, 2012, 08:30:52 PM »

Offline ialmisry

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #511 on: April 17, 2012, 08:37:57 PM »
Squatters and theives, not so much.

Then I must be neither for I am welcomed.

As I said: I don't ever need listen to you for anything at all.  Barely a blip on my radar, though it is good to know who your friends are not.

You know, you can report him for an ad hominem, if you want...  ::)
Ad hominem?  Hardly.  EM is openly advocating behavior which the highest authority of an autocephalous Church (the Patriarch of Romanian and its Holy Synod) recently reiterated, as have the other autocephalous Churches in the past and now, as worthy of deposition of a cleric and unworthy of an Orthodox Christian.  If an Orthodox cleric is communing her knowingly, then he should openly submit to her supreme pontiff and cease spitting on the authority of the Orthodox bishops he commemorates in the diptychs.
Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth

Offline ialmisry

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #512 on: April 17, 2012, 08:39:23 PM »
Squatters and theives, not so much.

Then I must be neither for I am welcomed.
By whom, and for what?


Nosy
you come into my home and sit yourself at the dinner table, I need to know what you are doing there.
Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth

Offline ialmisry

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #513 on: April 17, 2012, 08:42:48 PM »
It means the door is open to those outside to come on inside.

LOL...I told you that I've done that already and you told me to get out...LOL

As though I listen to you... ;)
Guests are welcome, as are those who come to dwell.  Squatters and theives, not so much.

This conversation has gotten quite bizarre. Does the door being open for those outside to come in refer to something other than swimming the Bosphorus? And if so what?
They can sail up the Bosphorus as well.  Just not in a battleship, nor weigh anchor unless they are jumping in.
Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth

Offline ialmisry

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #514 on: April 17, 2012, 08:45:11 PM »
When I was still in the RCC, I saw, several times, Russian Orthodox kids come up and take Communion at the Friday morning Mass. That was the Mass for the school kids, and a lot of Orthodox go to the Roman Catholic school, because there isn't an Orthodox school in this area. Nobody seemed to get angry or have problems then.
Did Abp. Justinian or Met. Hilarion know?  Because I can assure you, they would not approve.
Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth

Offline elijahmaria

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #515 on: April 17, 2012, 08:45:44 PM »
Squatters and theives, not so much.

Then I must be neither for I am welcomed.
By whom, and for what?


Nosy
you come into my home and sit yourself at the dinner table, I need to know what you are doing there.

You are the one saying it.  There's a record of what I have said here, and I think that is sufficient.

Offline biro

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #516 on: April 17, 2012, 08:47:49 PM »
Squatters and theives, not so much.

Then I must be neither for I am welcomed.

As I said: I don't ever need listen to you for anything at all.  Barely a blip on my radar, though it is good to know who your friends are not.

You know, you can report him for an ad hominem, if you want...  ::)
Ad hominem?  Hardly.  EM is openly advocating behavior which the highest authority of an autocephalous Church (the Patriarch of Romanian and its Holy Synod) recently reiterated, as have the other autocephalous Churches in the past and now, as worthy of deposition of a cleric and unworthy of an Orthodox Christian.  If an Orthodox cleric is communing her knowingly, then he should openly submit to her supreme pontiff and cease spitting on the authority of the Orthodox bishops he commemorates in the diptychs.

I guess calling someone a thief is okay on this board now? How things have changed...
He will come again with glory to judge the living and the dead. His kingdom will have no end.

--

And if I seem a little strange, well, that's because I am

Offline ialmisry

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #517 on: April 17, 2012, 08:47:58 PM »
Squatters and theives, not so much.

Then I must be neither for I am welcomed.


Welcomed when you attend services, perhaps, but you, a non-Orthodox, receiving communion from an Orthodox chalice is still out of the question.

I know others like me who do, and with the blessing of both Orthodox and Catholic bishop.  In fact the "arrangements" were made at that level.
Then someone is due for a deposition, for, unlike the OO, no such agreement exists for followers of the Vatican to receive communion.

I am not in such a position, nor do I claim to be.  If I were I'd know enough to keep my mouth closed about it.  Since I am not I can speak and make reference to the elephant in the living room.
Unless you can point to and/or name the elephant, no, you can't.
Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth

Offline ialmisry

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #518 on: April 17, 2012, 08:49:23 PM »
Squatters and theives, not so much.

Then I must be neither for I am welcomed.

As I said: I don't ever need listen to you for anything at all.  Barely a blip on my radar, though it is good to know who your friends are not.

You know, you can report him for an ad hominem, if you want...  ::)
Ad hominem?  Hardly.  EM is openly advocating behavior which the highest authority of an autocephalous Church (the Patriarch of Romanian and its Holy Synod) recently reiterated, as have the other autocephalous Churches in the past and now, as worthy of deposition of a cleric and unworthy of an Orthodox Christian.  If an Orthodox cleric is communing her knowingly, then he should openly submit to her supreme pontiff and cease spitting on the authority of the Orthodox bishops he commemorates in the diptychs.

I guess calling someone a thief is okay on this board now? How things have changed...
uncanonical/unlawful taking communion from an Orthodox chalice...that has NEVER been okay.
Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth

Offline ialmisry

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #519 on: April 17, 2012, 08:50:50 PM »
Squatters and theives, not so much.

Then I must be neither for I am welcomed.
By whom, and for what?


Nosy
you come into my home and sit yourself at the dinner table, I need to know what you are doing there.

You are the one saying it.  There's a record of what I have said here, and I think that is sufficient.
Indeed.  So just calling a spade a spade.
Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth

Offline biro

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #520 on: April 17, 2012, 08:51:04 PM »
Squatters and theives, not so much.

Then I must be neither for I am welcomed.

As I said: I don't ever need listen to you for anything at all.  Barely a blip on my radar, though it is good to know who your friends are not.

You know, you can report him for an ad hominem, if you want...  ::)
Ad hominem?  Hardly.  EM is openly advocating behavior which the highest authority of an autocephalous Church (the Patriarch of Romanian and its Holy Synod) recently reiterated, as have the other autocephalous Churches in the past and now, as worthy of deposition of a cleric and unworthy of an Orthodox Christian.  If an Orthodox cleric is communing her knowingly, then he should openly submit to her supreme pontiff and cease spitting on the authority of the Orthodox bishops he commemorates in the diptychs.

I guess calling someone a thief is okay on this board now? How things have changed...
uncanonical/unlawful taking communion from an Orthodox chalice...that has NEVER been okay.

Yeah, but you said thief. That has a very different meaning. Look in the dictionary.
He will come again with glory to judge the living and the dead. His kingdom will have no end.

--

And if I seem a little strange, well, that's because I am

Offline elijahmaria

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #521 on: April 17, 2012, 08:51:27 PM »

Unless you can point to and/or name the elephant, no, you can't.

Really?  I have.  Others have.  It is hardly a secret.  Simply because it annoys you does not make it any less a reality of our Churches in this schismatic status which we attribute to one another.

Offline biro

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #522 on: April 17, 2012, 08:52:23 PM »

Unless you can point to and/or name the elephant, no, you can't.

Really?  I have.  Others have.  It is hardly a secret.  Simply because it annoys you does not make it any less a reality of our Churches in this schismatic status which we attribute to one another.

The excommunications between the EO and RCC were repealed in 1965. What schism?

It's politics.
He will come again with glory to judge the living and the dead. His kingdom will have no end.

--

And if I seem a little strange, well, that's because I am

Offline elijahmaria

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #523 on: April 17, 2012, 08:54:24 PM »

Unless you can point to and/or name the elephant, no, you can't.

Really?  I have.  Others have.  It is hardly a secret.  Simply because it annoys you does not make it any less a reality of our Churches in this schismatic status which we attribute to one another.

The excommunications between the EO and RCC were repealed in 1965. What schism?

It's politics.

Seems to me that by definition it is sin, and those who actively promote it, on either side, are sinning.

Offline elijahmaria

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #524 on: April 17, 2012, 08:59:08 PM »
Squatters and theives, not so much.

Then I must be neither for I am welcomed.

As I said: I don't ever need listen to you for anything at all.  Barely a blip on my radar, though it is good to know who your friends are not.

You know, you can report him for an ad hominem, if you want...  ::)
Ad hominem?  Hardly.  EM is openly advocating behavior which the highest authority of an autocephalous Church (the Patriarch of Romanian and its Holy Synod) recently reiterated, as have the other autocephalous Churches in the past and now, as worthy of deposition of a cleric and unworthy of an Orthodox Christian.  If an Orthodox cleric is communing her knowingly, then he should openly submit to her supreme pontiff and cease spitting on the authority of the Orthodox bishops he commemorates in the diptychs.

I guess calling someone a thief is okay on this board now? How things have changed...
uncanonical/unlawful taking communion from an Orthodox chalice...that has NEVER been okay.

Apparently economy is not all that it's cracked up to be then...eh?

Offline Peter J

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #525 on: April 17, 2012, 09:09:59 PM »
What schism?

Do you mean from the Catholic p.o.v.?

"schism is the refusal of submission to the Roman Pontiff or of communion with the members of the Church subject to him."
- CCC #2089
- Peter Jericho (a CAF poster)

Offline ialmisry

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #526 on: April 17, 2012, 09:25:49 PM »

Unless you can point to and/or name the elephant, no, you can't.

Really?  I have.
At first I'm tempted to be my own conservative self, and account that I haven't seen you do so to the fact that I don't go through all your posts.  But since I've seen others call you on your silence, I don't think I've missed a thing.

Others have.
Sure.  I've mentioned Met. Coreanu.

It is hardly a secret.
Neither is the discipline and warning imposed on Met. Coreanu by his Patriarch and Holy Synod.

Except to those covering their eyes and plugging their ears.

Simply because it annoys you does not make it any less a reality of our Churches in this schismatic status which we attribute to one another.
It's more than my personal annoyance. Your ecclesiastical community is not only in schism, it is in heresy.

Odd how you are so dismissive of the 92-8% of the Vatican's flock who flout Humanae Vitae, but try to delude others into thinking that some flaky-nameless-fringe giving communion to heterodox get to define the parameters of the Church.

WARNING:Do not let wolves pull the wool over your eyes.
Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth

Offline xariskai

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #527 on: April 17, 2012, 09:29:21 PM »
Squatters and theives, not so much.

Then I must be neither for I am welcomed.

As I said: I don't ever need listen to you for anything at all.  Barely a blip on my radar, though it is good to know who your friends are not.

You know, you can report him for an ad hominem, if you want...  ::)
Ad hominem?  Hardly.  EM is openly advocating behavior which the highest authority of an autocephalous Church (the Patriarch of Romanian and its Holy Synod) recently reiterated, as have the other autocephalous Churches in the past and now, as worthy of deposition of a cleric and unworthy of an Orthodox Christian.  If an Orthodox cleric is communing her knowingly, then he should openly submit to her supreme pontiff and cease spitting on the authority of the Orthodox bishops he commemorates in the diptychs.

I guess calling someone a thief is okay on this board now? How things have changed...
uncanonical/unlawful taking communion from an Orthodox chalice...that has NEVER been okay.

Apparently economy is not all that it's cracked up to be then...eh?
Protestants not infrequently sneak communion in Roman Catholic churches, and Catholic priests have been known to knowingly serve communion to Protestants in open violation of Roman Catholic teaching; how do you feel about this?
« Last Edit: April 17, 2012, 09:36:36 PM by xariskai »

Offline ialmisry

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #528 on: April 17, 2012, 09:29:53 PM »
Squatters and theives, not so much.

Then I must be neither for I am welcomed.

As I said: I don't ever need listen to you for anything at all.  Barely a blip on my radar, though it is good to know who your friends are not.

You know, you can report him for an ad hominem, if you want...  ::)
Ad hominem?  Hardly.  EM is openly advocating behavior which the highest authority of an autocephalous Church (the Patriarch of Romanian and its Holy Synod) recently reiterated, as have the other autocephalous Churches in the past and now, as worthy of deposition of a cleric and unworthy of an Orthodox Christian.  If an Orthodox cleric is communing her knowingly, then he should openly submit to her supreme pontiff and cease spitting on the authority of the Orthodox bishops he commemorates in the diptychs.

I guess calling someone a thief is okay on this board now? How things have changed...
uncanonical/unlawful taking communion from an Orthodox chalice...that has NEVER been okay.

Apparently economy is not all that it's cracked up to be then...eh?
Something you can and would get deposed over is not economy, so you are off point.  Sort of like renigade priests marrying homosexual couples: it doesn't canonize gay marriage.  Ditto Old Catholic bishops ordaining women.
Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth

Offline ialmisry

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #529 on: April 17, 2012, 09:31:01 PM »
Squatters and theives, not so much.

Then I must be neither for I am welcomed.

As I said: I don't ever need listen to you for anything at all.  Barely a blip on my radar, though it is good to know who your friends are not.

You know, you can report him for an ad hominem, if you want...  ::)
Ad hominem?  Hardly.  EM is openly advocating behavior which the highest authority of an autocephalous Church (the Patriarch of Romanian and its Holy Synod) recently reiterated, as have the other autocephalous Churches in the past and now, as worthy of deposition of a cleric and unworthy of an Orthodox Christian.  If an Orthodox cleric is communing her knowingly, then he should openly submit to her supreme pontiff and cease spitting on the authority of the Orthodox bishops he commemorates in the diptychs.

I guess calling someone a thief is okay on this board now? How things have changed...
uncanonical/unlawful taking communion from an Orthodox chalice...that has NEVER been okay.

Apparently economy is not all that it's cracked up to be then...eh?
Protestants not infrequently sneak communion in Roman Catholic churches as well; how do you feel about this?
I did all the time when I was Lutheran.  And it wasn't sneaking: everyone knew I was evangelical Lutheran.
Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth

Offline ialmisry

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #530 on: April 17, 2012, 09:32:35 PM »

Unless you can point to and/or name the elephant, no, you can't.

Really?  I have.  Others have.  It is hardly a secret.  Simply because it annoys you does not make it any less a reality of our Churches in this schismatic status which we attribute to one another.

The excommunications between the EO and RCC were repealed in 1965. What schism?

It's politics.

Seems to me that by definition it is sin, and those who actively promote it, on either side, are sinning.
Refusing communion to heretics is a virtue.
Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth

Offline elijahmaria

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #531 on: April 17, 2012, 09:32:49 PM »
WARNING:Do not let wolves pull the wool over your eyes.

True.  You should stop tugging so hard on it, al Misry.  It's no fringe that has used economy to minister to the flock.

Offline elijahmaria

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #532 on: April 17, 2012, 09:34:21 PM »

I did all the time when I was Lutheran.  And it wasn't sneaking: everyone knew I was evangelical Lutheran.

We hope that it was of benefit to you.

Offline elijahmaria

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #533 on: April 17, 2012, 09:36:55 PM »

Unless you can point to and/or name the elephant, no, you can't.

Really?  I have.  Others have.  It is hardly a secret.  Simply because it annoys you does not make it any less a reality of our Churches in this schismatic status which we attribute to one another.

The excommunications between the EO and RCC were repealed in 1965. What schism?

It's politics.

Seems to me that by definition it is sin, and those who actively promote it, on either side, are sinning.
Refusing communion to heretics is a virtue.

Only some Orthodox bishops would say that the Catholic Church is a Church of Heretics.  So all you do here is pull more wool over the fact that Orthodoxy is internally conflicted over the schism.

Which has been my point for taking on this particular subject.  Thanks for helping out here.

M.

Offline xariskai

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #534 on: April 17, 2012, 09:42:46 PM »

Unless you can point to and/or name the elephant, no, you can't.

Really?  I have.  Others have.  It is hardly a secret.  Simply because it annoys you does not make it any less a reality of our Churches in this schismatic status which we attribute to one another.

The excommunications between the EO and RCC were repealed in 1965. What schism?

It's politics.

Seems to me that by definition it is sin, and those who actively promote it, on either side, are sinning.
Refusing communion to heretics is a virtue.

Only some Orthodox bishops would say that the Catholic Church is a Church of Heretics.  So all you do here is pull more wool over the fact that Orthodoxy is internally conflicted over the schism.

Which has been my point for taking on this particular subject.  Thanks for helping out here.

M.
Roman Catholic popes have also held variegated views; Pope Honorius comes to mind. Does that fact make your church internally conflicted over monothelitism?
« Last Edit: April 17, 2012, 09:43:58 PM by xariskai »

Offline elijahmaria

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #535 on: April 17, 2012, 09:47:23 PM »

Unless you can point to and/or name the elephant, no, you can't.

Really?  I have.  Others have.  It is hardly a secret.  Simply because it annoys you does not make it any less a reality of our Churches in this schismatic status which we attribute to one another.

The excommunications between the EO and RCC were repealed in 1965. What schism?

It's politics.

Seems to me that by definition it is sin, and those who actively promote it, on either side, are sinning.
Refusing communion to heretics is a virtue.

Only some Orthodox bishops would say that the Catholic Church is a Church of Heretics.  So all you do here is pull more wool over the fact that Orthodoxy is internally conflicted over the schism.

Which has been my point for taking on this particular subject.  Thanks for helping out here.

M.
Roman Catholic popes have also held variegated views; Pope Honorius comes to mind. Does that fact make your church internally conflicted over monothelitism?

If we are speaking of one...most likely not...If we speak of many over many hundreds of years...yes.

It is not all one-sided however...There are Catholics who hate what I say as well.

Somehow, by God, that too can be over-come so that we all may be one.

Offline xariskai

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #536 on: April 17, 2012, 09:52:59 PM »

Unless you can point to and/or name the elephant, no, you can't.

Really?  I have.  Others have.  It is hardly a secret.  Simply because it annoys you does not make it any less a reality of our Churches in this schismatic status which we attribute to one another.

The excommunications between the EO and RCC were repealed in 1965. What schism?

It's politics.

Seems to me that by definition it is sin, and those who actively promote it, on either side, are sinning.
Refusing communion to heretics is a virtue.

Only some Orthodox bishops would say that the Catholic Church is a Church of Heretics.  So all you do here is pull more wool over the fact that Orthodoxy is internally conflicted over the schism.

Which has been my point for taking on this particular subject.  Thanks for helping out here.

M.
Roman Catholic popes have also held variegated views; Pope Honorius comes to mind. Does that fact make your church internally conflicted over monothelitism?

If we are speaking of one...most likely not...If we speak of many over many hundreds of years...yes.

It is not all one-sided however...There are Catholics who hate what I say as well.

Somehow, by God, that too can be over-come so that we all may be one.
To be fair you were speaking of bishops; you do realize there are dissenting bishops in your own tradition, no? Does a pro-abortion dissenting bishop in your church mean your church is internally conflicted over abortion?

« Last Edit: April 17, 2012, 09:57:56 PM by xariskai »

Offline elijahmaria

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #537 on: April 17, 2012, 09:58:02 PM »

To be fair you were speaking of bishops; you do realize there are dissenting bishops in your own tradition as well, no? Does a pro-abortion dissenting bishop in your church mean your church is internally conflicted over abortion?


You are quite correct.  The Roman rite is in de facto schism and has been for some time over a number of moral issues, liturgical issues, and theological issues.  So it is possible to be schismatic on some issues and to still remain in communion.

That is something else to consider within this topic of so-called intercommunion.

M.

Offline xariskai

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #538 on: April 17, 2012, 10:00:32 PM »
Squatters and theives, not so much.

Then I must be neither for I am welcomed.

As I said: I don't ever need listen to you for anything at all.  Barely a blip on my radar, though it is good to know who your friends are not.

You know, you can report him for an ad hominem, if you want...  ::)
Ad hominem?  Hardly.  EM is openly advocating behavior which the highest authority of an autocephalous Church (the Patriarch of Romanian and its Holy Synod) recently reiterated, as have the other autocephalous Churches in the past and now, as worthy of deposition of a cleric and unworthy of an Orthodox Christian.  If an Orthodox cleric is communing her knowingly, then he should openly submit to her supreme pontiff and cease spitting on the authority of the Orthodox bishops he commemorates in the diptychs.

I guess calling someone a thief is okay on this board now? How things have changed...
uncanonical/unlawful taking communion from an Orthodox chalice...that has NEVER been okay.

Apparently economy is not all that it's cracked up to be then...eh?
Protestants not infrequently sneak communion in Roman Catholic churches, and Catholic priests have been known to knowingly serve communion to Protestants in open violation of Roman Catholic teaching; how do you feel about this?

Offline elijahmaria

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Re: Which church is more open to reuniting??
« Reply #539 on: April 17, 2012, 10:03:34 PM »
Protestants not infrequently sneak communion in Roman Catholic churches, and Catholic priests have been known to knowingly serve communion to Protestants in open violation of Roman Catholic teaching; how do you feel about this?


I don't see how this relates to what I was talking about.  I was not talking about "sneaking" communion.  I was speaking of circumstances where there are actually arrangements made in economy, or where nothing is said in tacit acceptance.

But to answer your personal question: One always hopes that even an unworthy communion is of benefit to soul and body and not to the condemnation of anyone!!