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jewish voice
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« on: March 16, 2012, 03:50:14 AM »

I'm not sure if this is the right place to post this if not then pls feel free to  move.

I'm Jewish first and for most now I offer you this challenge if you so wish to partake in. Only using Tanakh ( OT to you) Show me where that Jesus is who the Orthodox Church says he is.

I'll do all reading that you offer to me and post back my thoughts.
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« Reply #1 on: March 16, 2012, 05:12:53 AM »

I'm not sure if this is the right place to post this if not then pls feel free to  move.

I'm Jewish first and for most now I offer you this challenge if you so wish to partake in. Only using Tanakh ( OT to you) Show me where that Jesus is who the Orthodox Church says he is.

I'll do all reading that you offer to me and post back my thoughts.
Isaiah 7:14 Therefore the Lord himself will give you a sign: The virgin will be with child and will give birth to a son, and will call him Immanuel.
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« Reply #2 on: March 16, 2012, 05:49:18 AM »

I'm not sure if this is the right place to post this if not then pls feel free to  move.

I'm Jewish first and for most now I offer you this challenge if you so wish to partake in. Only using Tanakh ( OT to you) Show me where that Jesus is who the Orthodox Church says he is.

I'll do all reading that you offer to me and post back my thoughts.

I will probably not participate in this, but I do think it would be beneficial for all parties if you mentioned any restriction you are placing on which version of the OT (such as Masoretic).
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« Reply #3 on: March 16, 2012, 08:22:18 AM »

Various references from Isaiah and Ezekiel, compiled in the Great Compline hymn God Is With Us:

God is with us, understand you nations, and submit.

For God is with us.

To the ends of the earth give ear.

For God is with us.

Submit, you mighty ones.

For God is with us.

If again you become strong, you will also submit again.

For God is with us.

And whatever you plan, the Lord will scatter it.

For God is with us.

And whatever word you speak, it will not remain among you.

For God is with us.

Fear of you we shall not fear, nor shall we be troubled.

For God is with us.

The Lord our God, let us sanctify him, and he will be our fear.

For God is with us.

And if I should trust in him, he will be sanctification for me.

For God is with us.

And I will trust in him, and I will be saved through him.

For God is with us.

Here am I and the children whom God has given me.

For God is with us.

The people who walked in darkness have seen a great light.

For God is with us.

We who dwell in the land and the shadow of death, a light will shine on us.

For God is with us.

For unto us a Child is born, unto us a Son is given.

For God is with us.

Whose government was upon his shoulder.

For God is with us.

And of his peace there is no bound.

For God is with us.

And his name shall be called, Angel of great counsel.

For God is with us.

Wonderful Counsellor.

For God is with us.

Mighty God, Ruler, Prince of peace.

For God is with us.

Father of the age to come.

For God is with us.

God is with us, understand you nations, and submit: For God is with us.


Also from Isaiah:

The ox knows its owner, and the donkey its master’s crib

Ezekiel 44:1-3:
Then He brought me back to the outer gate of the sanctuary which faces toward the east, but it was shut. 2 And the Lord said to me, “This gate shall be shut; it shall not be opened, and no man shall enter by it, because the Lord God of Israel has entered by it; therefore it shall be shut. 3 As for the prince, because he is the prince, he may sit in it to eat bread before the Lord; he shall enter by way of the vestibule of the gateway, and go out the same way.”
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« Reply #4 on: March 16, 2012, 08:57:03 AM »

*subscribing*
Many years ago, when I first began exploring into religion, a Protestant minister sat down with me and did pretty much what you are asking. He used a small paperback book that was published back then, that had something like 200 OT passages, and their Christian interpretations, 'proving' Jesus was the Jewish Messiah. It was very convincing to me, but of course I was both young and pre-disposed towards Christianity, so I was not as critical of a thinker as you are.

If such a book is still available, would you be interested in it? And, have you ever been through this process before?

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« Reply #5 on: March 16, 2012, 09:05:04 AM »

That is your chance, not ours.
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« Reply #6 on: March 16, 2012, 09:07:43 AM »

I can prove it to you solely using clips from Assassin's Creed. PM me for details.
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« Reply #7 on: March 16, 2012, 09:24:44 AM »

*subscribing*
Many years ago, when I first began exploring into religion, a Protestant minister sat down with me and did pretty much what you are asking. He used a small paperback book that was published back then, that had something like 200 OT passages, and their Christian interpretations, 'proving' Jesus was the Jewish Messiah. It was very convincing to me, but of course I was both young and pre-disposed towards Christianity, so I was not as critical of a thinker as you are.

If such a book is still available, would you be interested in it? And, have you ever been through this process before?


I would be interested if you can find the name of it I would give it a go over. I have had a few people try in the past but I would just shut them off real fast but this time I'm the one asking and looking Smiley
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« Reply #8 on: March 16, 2012, 09:34:36 AM »

I'm not sure if this is the right place to post this if not then pls feel free to  move.

I'm Jewish first and for most now I offer you this challenge if you so wish to partake in. Only using Tanakh ( OT to you) Show me where that Jesus is who the Orthodox Church says he is.

I'll do all reading that you offer to me and post back my thoughts.

I will probably not participate in this, but I do think it would be beneficial for all parties if you mentioned any restriction you are placing on which version of the OT (such as Masoretic). 
No real restrictions other than you either give me a link to something or I am able to read it from my Tanakh
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« Reply #9 on: March 16, 2012, 09:36:48 AM »

I'm not sure if this is the right place to post this if not then pls feel free to  move.

I'm Jewish first and for most now I offer you this challenge if you so wish to partake in. Only using Tanakh ( OT to you) Show me where that Jesus is who the Orthodox Church says he is.

I'll do all reading that you offer to me and post back my thoughts.

I will probably not participate in this, but I do think it would be beneficial for all parties if you mentioned any restriction you are placing on which version of the OT (such as Masoretic). 
No real restrictions other than you either give me a link to something or I am able to read it from my Tanakh
just so we are all on the same footing, would this website be acceptable
http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Bible/jpstoc.html
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« Reply #10 on: March 16, 2012, 09:42:06 AM »

I'm not sure if this is the right place to post this if not then pls feel free to  move.

I'm Jewish first and for most now I offer you this challenge if you so wish to partake in. Only using Tanakh ( OT to you) Show me where that Jesus is who the Orthodox Church says he is.

I'll do all reading that you offer to me and post back my thoughts.

I will probably not participate in this, but I do think it would be beneficial for all parties if you mentioned any restriction you are placing on which version of the OT (such as Masoretic). 
No real restrictions other than you either give me a link to something or I am able to read it from my Tanakh
just so we are all on the same footing, would this website be acceptable
http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Bible/jpstoc.html
Yep
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« Reply #11 on: March 16, 2012, 09:59:34 AM »

I will try to find that book.

Off top of my head, the 22nd Psalm (KJV numbering) was most convincing to me.
Also, 110 Psalm is often cited as a proof text.

I have to go to work now, will try to find book and post later.
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« Reply #12 on: March 16, 2012, 06:24:14 PM »

Hey JV. This is not a verse, but maybe you should just take a peek at "Surprised By Christ" by Fr. James Bernstein. It might give you some insight as to how he saw Christ as the Messiah.

PP
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« Reply #13 on: March 16, 2012, 07:47:53 PM »

I'm not sure if this is the right place to post this if not then pls feel free to  move.

I'm Jewish first and for most now I offer you this challenge if you so wish to partake in. Only using Tanakh ( OT to you) Show me where that Jesus is who the Orthodox Church says he is.

I'll do all reading that you offer to me and post back my thoughts.



Wow, how very nice of you to condescend and allow us the honer to prove to you where it says Jesus is Jesus in the OT?!

Thanks for this great opportunity we will get back to you asap.

OR you can read the book with an objective mind set and it will then be obvious.

(note: sarcastic tone intentional.)

Who the heck is this guy?
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« Reply #14 on: March 16, 2012, 10:10:55 PM »

Hey JV. This is not a verse, but maybe you should just take a peek at "Surprised By Christ" by Fr. James Bernstein. It might give you some insight as to how he saw Christ as the Messiah.

PP
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« Reply #15 on: March 16, 2012, 11:01:07 PM »

JV--If your intent is to explore Christianity and not to debate it, choosing the Free-for-all/Religious Topics may have been a mistake. If you send me a private message, I may be able to help you with your options. Second Chance, Section Moderator
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« Reply #16 on: March 17, 2012, 02:07:41 AM »

Actually, Second Chance, he had chosen the Other Topics area, but Michael moved it here.
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« Reply #17 on: March 17, 2012, 12:22:34 PM »

I am not too knowledgable on the subject, but awhile ago I came across a series of YouTube videos that seem well-researched.

(Note, these are all responses to other videos, the originals of which are linked on the YT pages.)

"Jesus IS the Messiah"
Part 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w4SGhd5AJZY
Part 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=io-FJTvJPfE
Part 3: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BiymxRZtEdA
Part 4: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j1tTBleyLJA
Part 5: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q1D5HjC0qiY

Responses to a Rabbi
Part 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_5DExDJEdTA
Part 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TCphSnAv6Js
Part 3: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gt_4IrU3K7Q

Aside from these, reading the Gospel of Matthew couldn't hurt. It is full of references to prophecy.
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« Reply #18 on: March 17, 2012, 03:31:04 PM »

At the risk of getting my behind kicked by an expert Jewish theologian when I barely know anything about the Old Testament, how about Psalm 51?
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« Reply #19 on: March 17, 2012, 04:04:17 PM »

At the risk of getting my behind kicked by an expert Jewish theologian when I barely know anything about the Old Testament, how about Psalm 51?

Protestant or Orthodox?
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« Reply #20 on: March 17, 2012, 05:31:19 PM »

At the risk of getting my behind kicked by an expert Jewish theologian when I barely know anything about the Old Testament, how about Psalm 51?

Protestant or Orthodox?

Damn, I mean Orthodox. In Orthodoxy it is Psalm 50 right?
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« Reply #21 on: March 17, 2012, 05:44:15 PM »

At the risk of getting my behind kicked by an expert Jewish theologian when I barely know anything about the Old Testament, how about Psalm 51?

Protestant or Orthodox?

Damn, I mean Orthodox. In Orthodoxy it is Psalm 50 right?

Yes, the traditional numbering is Psalm 50 (if you're referring to the penitential psalm). Sometimes, in order to avoid that confusion, people will just write Psalm 50(51).
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« Reply #22 on: March 17, 2012, 09:17:05 PM »

Hey JV,

 Maybe you can help us get to know you a little better by humoring me with this question; I believe you when you tell us you're Jewish.  What I find a little different is that you're using Islamic art as your avatar.  You see, Muslims aren't allowed to draw or paint pictures of animals or humans.  Something about only God can create life, so we shouldn't even try.  I don't know, I think Muhammad may have misunderstood art.  But anyway, I think your avatar, although in the shape of a tiger is actually an ayat (verse) from the Qur'an.  I understand this question is off topic so you can PM me if you want to.
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« Reply #23 on: March 17, 2012, 09:55:18 PM »

Hey JV,

 Maybe you can help us get to know you a little better by humoring me with this question; I believe you when you tell us you're Jewish.  What I find a little different is that you're using Islamic art as your avatar.  You see, Muslims aren't allowed to draw or paint pictures of animals or humans.  Something about only God can create life, so we shouldn't even try.  I don't know, I think Muhammad may have misunderstood art.  But anyway, I think your avatar, although in the shape of a tiger is actually an ayat (verse) from the Qur'an.  I understand this question is off topic so you can PM me if you want to.
My avatar and sig come from Ismailism philosophy. As most people know them  as Assassins( Hashasheen) during the crusades. I like crusade history but not the normal way as Christians would I guess. There were also Jews in this group of Assassins as well fighting with the Ismailism sect of Muslims and they helped bring Jerusalem back from  out of the hands of the Christians. 
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« Reply #24 on: March 18, 2012, 06:07:41 AM »

Hope none of these questions are offensive, but I have never talked to a Jew before so I am curious. Out of curiousity, does the Jewish faith Canonize certain individuals as Saints like we do in the Orthodox Church? And would a Christian be allowed to marry a Jew or attend a Jewish synagogue out of curiousity? Also, do you believe a Savior will come one day like David or Moses?

EDIT: Not Psalm 50(51), how about Psalm 22? This seems to clearly refer to Jesus.
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« Reply #25 on: March 18, 2012, 07:42:31 AM »

Hope none of these questions are offensive, but I have never talked to a Jew before so I am curious. Out of curiousity, does the Jewish faith Canonize certain individuals as Saints like we do in the Orthodox Church? And would a Christian be allowed to marry a Jew or attend a Jewish synagogue out of curiousity? Also, do you believe a Savior will come one day like David or Moses?

EDIT: Not Psalm 50(51), how about Psalm 22? This seems to clearly refer to Jesus.
The Jewish faith has many sects just like Christians do so some of these questions could be giving different answers. I'm not an Orthodox Jew but lean more towards Karaite Jew. Karaite's dont follow the Talmud or( the oral laws). There is no Karaite shul ( Church ) in my area so when I do go I go to a Reform Jewish shul. In Judaism we don't have Saints but we do have Sages kinda like just your Church Fathers with out the Saint part added
.
If you where to meet a nice Orthodox or Karaite Jewish gal the only way that you could marry her would be to convert to Judaism or she left the faith. Reform Jewish gal could marry you and not have to leave the faith. In the Reform movement is very open to all people and you see alot of mixed faith members at Shul and also how they see one as being a Jew also is different example is if a father is Jewish and the mother isn't the child is seen as a Jew in Reform but the other groups(Orthodox ) is only by the mother.

Shul is open to anyone who would wish to come and see. I would suggest a Reform one over an Orthodox one. Reason being is there are all ready Christians who do tend to go with there other half. I would also suggest that you phone ahead to let the Rabbi know that you would wish to visit as we have to deal with well haters alot people looking to do harm and they kinda like a heads up on a new comer who isn't known. Most Shuls when you leave service and it's night time will have Cops or rent a cops  Tongue in the parking lot when leaving Shul yes it is really this bad in some areas.  

We Jews already have a Savior G-d we don't view the Messiah as a savior we already have one in G-d. Messiah will 1) Build the Third Temple (Ezekiel 37:26-28).

2) Gather all Jews back to the Land of Israel (Isaiah 43:5-6).

3) Usher in an era of world peace, and end all hatred, oppression, suffering and disease. As it says: "Nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall man learn war anymore." (Isaiah 2:4)

4) Spread universal knowledge of the God of Israel, which will unite humanity as one. As it says: "God will be King over all the world -- on that day, God will be One and His Name will be One" (Zechariah 14:9).

If you would want to learn more on how Jews view the Messiah I would suggest the book  "The Real Messiah" by Rabbi Aryeh Kaplan

I hope I don't get in trouble for posting the last part but wanted to answer your questions as others have answered my question here
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« Reply #26 on: March 18, 2012, 08:07:50 AM »

You may find that this lack of Messiah is new to Judaism.
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« Reply #27 on: March 18, 2012, 08:08:32 AM »

Hey JV. This is not a verse, but maybe you should just take a peek at "Surprised By Christ" by Fr. James Bernstein. It might give you some insight as to how he saw Christ as the Messiah.

PP

It's an excellent book. But, if you're going to go that route, why not just contact Fr. Bernstein directly? His Surprised by Christ website has an email link to contact him:
 http://www.surprisedbychrist.com/

He's also the Rector of St. Paul's Antiochan Church in Lynnwood, WA, which has a website (but no direct email to Fr. Bernstein).

I don't know how easy it is to actually reach him, but I've never met a priest yet who wasn't willing to talk to an inquirer Smiley
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« Reply #28 on: March 18, 2012, 08:38:41 AM »

Hope none of these questions are offensive, but I have never talked to a Jew before so I am curious. Out of curiousity, does the Jewish faith Canonize certain individuals as Saints like we do in the Orthodox Church? And would a Christian be allowed to marry a Jew or attend a Jewish synagogue out of curiousity? Also, do you believe a Savior will come one day like David or Moses?

EDIT: Not Psalm 50(51), how about Psalm 22? This seems to clearly refer to Jesus.

Jews do not canonize people, though certain rabbis throughout history have acquired a status not unlike that of St. John Chrysostom or St. Basil; the rest of your questions differ based on the Jewish denomination.
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« Reply #29 on: March 18, 2012, 09:06:09 AM »

I was 'googling' trying to find that book I mentioned when I found this. Note at the bottom says "This list was adapted and edited from from a list I found on the internet somewhere. It looks like it may be an nth generation derivative of the book I read many years ago.

Obviously, the compiler of this list is very (polemically) Protestant, of the every-word-is-literal variety, which is NOT an Orthodox perspective.

I wanted to go through this list before posting, but I'm covering emergency work this weekend, and it appears I will not have time to do so. So, let me be clear: I'm not personally endorsing this particular list, although it appears to be very close to the one I remember. That being said, perhaps it may provide a useful starting point for investigation and/or discussion.

 http://www.preservedwords.com/prophecies.htm
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« Reply #30 on: March 18, 2012, 10:33:26 AM »

Here is a link that may or may not help you... http://christianthinktank.com/falsechrist.html
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« Reply #31 on: March 18, 2012, 01:27:45 PM »

Hey JV,

 Maybe you can help us get to know you a little better by humoring me with this question; I believe you when you tell us you're Jewish.  What I find a little different is that you're using Islamic art as your avatar.  You see, Muslims aren't allowed to draw or paint pictures of animals or humans.  Something about only God can create life, so we shouldn't even try.  I don't know, I think Muhammad may have misunderstood art.  But anyway, I think your avatar, although in the shape of a tiger is actually an ayat (verse) from the Qur'an.  I understand this question is off topic so you can PM me if you want to.
My avatar and sig come from Ismailism philosophy. As most people know them  as Assassins( Hashasheen) during the crusades. I like crusade history but not the normal way as Christians would I guess. There were also Jews in this group of Assassins as well fighting with the Ismailism sect of Muslims and they helped bring Jerusalem back from  out of the hands of the Christians.  

 I see.  Well, thanks for the explanation.  As I thought it would, your explanation has created further questions; the one I'll focus on seems to challenge your question to us here and that is this: Your avatar and signature seem to be rather polemic and a veiled threat to Christians (seeing how Ismaili's helped overthrow Christianity in Jerusalem).  That seems to be your one and only affection for them. How then can we possibly take you serious when asking for an explanation that Jesus is Lord?  If I am wrong, I apologize to you.  But certainly the thought must have crossed your mind that we might be a little distrusting?  Plus, you've been given some evidence already and it seems you've yet to address it.
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« Reply #32 on: March 18, 2012, 07:45:53 PM »

I was 'googling' trying to find that book I mentioned when I found this. Note at the bottom says "This list was adapted and edited from from a list I found on the internet somewhere. It looks like it may be an nth generation derivative of the book I read many years ago.

Obviously, the compiler of this list is very (polemically) Protestant, of the every-word-is-literal variety, which is NOT an Orthodox perspective.

I wanted to go through this list before posting, but I'm covering emergency work this weekend, and it appears I will not have time to do so. So, let me be clear: I'm not personally endorsing this particular list, although it appears to be very close to the one I remember. That being said, perhaps it may provide a useful starting point for investigation and/or discussion.

 http://www.preservedwords.com/prophecies.htm
Thank you very much Mark for this link and is much what I was looking for and I will start to read these and see what I think.
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« Reply #33 on: March 18, 2012, 07:50:25 PM »

Hey JV,

 Maybe you can help us get to know you a little better by humoring me with this question; I believe you when you tell us you're Jewish.  What I find a little different is that you're using Islamic art as your avatar.  You see, Muslims aren't allowed to draw or paint pictures of animals or humans.  Something about only God can create life, so we shouldn't even try.  I don't know, I think Muhammad may have misunderstood art.  But anyway, I think your avatar, although in the shape of a tiger is actually an ayat (verse) from the Qur'an.  I understand this question is off topic so you can PM me if you want to.
My avatar and sig come from Ismailism philosophy. As most people know them  as Assassins( Hashasheen) during the crusades. I like crusade history but not the normal way as Christians would I guess. There were also Jews in this group of Assassins as well fighting with the Ismailism sect of Muslims and they helped bring Jerusalem back from  out of the hands of the Christians.  

 I see.  Well, thanks for the explanation.  As I thought it would, your explanation has created further questions; the one I'll focus on seems to challenge your question to us here and that is this: Your avatar and signature seem to be rather polemic and a veiled threat to Christians (seeing how Ismaili's helped overthrow Christianity in Jerusalem).  That seems to be your one and only affection for them. How then can we possibly take you serious when asking for an explanation that Jesus is Lord?  If I am wrong, I apologize to you.  But certainly the thought must have crossed your mind that we might be a little distrusting?  Plus, you've been given some evidence already and it seems you've yet to address it.
Being that this is the internet I can see why you might question someone on if they were serious but I did ask the question. I haven't posted back on some of the readings yet cause I'm still trying to to think them over and  some where just posted today so I have yet to read them. I also wanted to add that If I were to convert over to Christian it would be Orthodox cause Rome was pretty bad to us Jews with there back door deals
ps lots of fixes on this due to my key's acting up and sticking
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« Reply #34 on: March 20, 2012, 09:37:59 AM »

I think I'm going to contact a priest to answer and guide me on my questions. So how should I address him in my email should it be father or priest or something else. Should I wait to after um your High Holy days to email one due to he might be to busy at this time. and can anyone here read Romanian the church's web site is all in Romanian and I would like to know what it says it gives times in english but I don't know what the rest of it says. here's the website to the church http://www.sf-andrei.com/home.shtml there isn't  much info though on the sight though
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« Reply #35 on: March 20, 2012, 10:29:06 AM »


Is that the nearest Orthodox church to you?

You would refer to the priest as "Father Name".

Don't wait.

Contact him now.  Perhaps he will have time to read his email and be able to help you.

It would be great if you could attend one of the Paschal services and see what we are all about!

I hope you come with an open heart and mind, and truly "see" what will be before your eyes.

:-)


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« Reply #36 on: March 20, 2012, 11:28:17 AM »


Is that the nearest Orthodox church to you?

You would refer to the priest as "Father Name".

Don't wait.

Contact him now.  Perhaps he will have time to read his email and be able to help you.

It would be great if you could attend one of the Paschal services and see what we are all about!

I hope you come with an open heart and mind, and truly "see" what will be before your eyes.

:-)



It's one of the nearest Orthodox church's I have 2 Greek,2 OCA a ROCOR and this one  I guess I live in a big Orthodox area and most people would like this as there all with in 10 t0 30 mins away  from where I live
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« Reply #37 on: March 20, 2012, 11:35:13 AM »


Excellent for you!

Perhaps you should pick the OCA, as it is guaranteed to be in English, and you will understand more.

I, too, am lucky to live in an area peppered with all kinds of flavors of Orthodoxy!
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« Reply #38 on: March 20, 2012, 11:46:46 AM »


Excellent for you!

Perhaps you should pick the OCA, as it is guaranteed to be in English, and you will understand more.

I, too, am lucky to live in an area peppered with all kinds of flavors of Orthodoxy!

I was thinking that but I seen on here some talk a bit down on OCA and the one Greek church here is in all english as well  here's a link to it http://saintmatts.wordpress.com/   
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« Reply #39 on: March 20, 2012, 12:16:57 PM »


Seems like a nice church.  They seem very organized and active.

Contact Fr. Demetrius (there is an email address for him under "contact us") or just show up for services.

I wish you all the best.
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« Reply #40 on: March 20, 2012, 05:11:18 PM »


Excellent for you!

Perhaps you should pick the OCA, as it is guaranteed to be in English, and you will understand more.

I, too, am lucky to live in an area peppered with all kinds of flavors of Orthodoxy!

I was thinking that but I seen on here some talk a bit down on OCA and the one Greek church here is in all english as well  here's a link to it http://saintmatts.wordpress.com/   
Hi, I moderate the St. Matthew's Orthodox Church website and I noticed a few visitors from this posting.  Our priest, Fr. Demetrius, is VERY approachable and knowledgeable.  And, what's more, he's excellent with Jewish/Christian dialogue.  So don't hesitate to contact him.  Feel free to call the phone number on the website.  By the way, you can call him "Demetrius" and he won't be offended.

Oh, and you are much welcome to visit.  We have many services during this Lenten season, as you see on the website. Smiley
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« Reply #41 on: March 20, 2012, 05:16:52 PM »


Welcome to the forum, djutzi!

The website is great.

I've been looking at it, and plan to go back to listen to some of the sermons!

Grin
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« Reply #42 on: March 20, 2012, 06:46:19 PM »


Excellent for you!

Perhaps you should pick the OCA, as it is guaranteed to be in English, and you will understand more.

I, too, am lucky to live in an area peppered with all kinds of flavors of Orthodoxy!

I was thinking that but I seen on here some talk a bit down on OCA and the one Greek church here is in all english as well  here's a link to it http://saintmatts.wordpress.com/   

JV, You're really blessed to have all these Eastern Orthodox Churches in your area.  Now that you've gotten a personal invitation, I implore you to go.  Go now.  At the very least, perhaps you could email Fr. Demetrius.  I did something similar eight years ago when I cold-called our priest.  I'd never met or spoke with him prior.  Best decision of my life.  Along with getting married.  Wink  So go!  What have you got to lose? 
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« Reply #43 on: March 20, 2012, 06:47:10 PM »

Saul, a devout Jew, was a huge persecutor of the Christians. He hated them and tried to destroy them. But God spoke to Saul and blinded him. Jesus appeared to Saul and asked " why do you persecute me"? When Saul recovered, he joined the apostles and became St Paul, one of our greatest martyr-saints. . No one who hated Christians the way he did would turn and become a Christian Martyr the way he did, if it was not for Jesus touching his life the way He did.  This is in the Bible. The Christians didn't convince him, Jesus did.   We should pray to St Paul to guide you on you journey.
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« Reply #44 on: March 20, 2012, 07:19:40 PM »

You might be interested in the book Jesus And The Jewish Roots Of The Eucharist by Brant Pitre. It is written by a Roman Catholic, but shouldn't contradict anything a Orthodox priest might tell you. I started reading it and found it very heavy in ancient Jewish theology and history. 
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« Reply #45 on: March 20, 2012, 08:48:55 PM »

You are possibly converting? That is amazing, good luck with your spiritual journey. Also, I would suggest going with the OCA parish. I know that many people talk badly about it, but the truth of the matter is that there is nothing wrong with it really. I know because I attend one. I would stay away from the Greek Church if I were you, because these ones can be really ethnic and more of a social thing than an actual religious experience.
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« Reply #46 on: March 20, 2012, 09:13:37 PM »

"I would stay away from the Greek Church if I were you, because these ones can be really ethnic and more of a social thing than an actual religious experience."

WOW!

talk abt steriotyping an entire ethnic groop Undecided
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« Reply #47 on: March 20, 2012, 09:29:48 PM »


A member of that Greek parish actually joined this forum having noticed the pings to that website, and personally extended a warm welcome and invite to his church.

I would go with this church. If a parishioner took the trouble to track down the IP address and actually reach out, that parish is definitely not being "ethnic", but is being Christ-like.

I would give them a try.  Their services are also in English.
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« Reply #48 on: March 21, 2012, 08:01:33 AM »

There's a site called:

 
http://www.theholyeucharist.com/

This site is Dr. Brant Pitre's site and there is a free 72 minute video to watch explaining the ancient Jewish roots of Christian views on the Eucharist. Again, this is a Roman Catholic scholar, but I am posting it because Dr. Pitre has sound credentials with his speciality in ancient Judaism.  This talk focuses alot on acient Jewish beliefs of the Messiah and draws on the prophets of the Old Testament.

Again, others have suggested attending an Orthodox Divine Liturgy, you definately need to do that!  Smiley   
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« Reply #49 on: March 21, 2012, 09:31:27 AM »

There's a site called:

 
http://www.theholyeucharist.com/

This site is Dr. Brant Pitre's site and there is a free 72 minute video to watch explaining the ancient Jewish roots of Christian views on the Eucharist. Again, this is a Roman Catholic scholar, but I am posting it because Dr. Pitre has sound credentials with his speciality in ancient Judaism.  This talk focuses alot on acient Jewish beliefs of the Messiah and draws on the prophets of the Old Testament.

Again, others have suggested attending an Orthodox Divine Liturgy, you definately need to do that!  Smiley   
We went over that in Catechesis on Sunday. I had no idea it went back that far. Super interesting.

PP
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« Reply #50 on: March 22, 2012, 11:48:48 AM »

"I would stay away from the Greek Church if I were you, because these ones can be really ethnic and more of a social thing than an actual religious experience."

WOW!

talk abt steriotyping an entire ethnic groop Undecided

I know the Greeks get a bad rap for this, and I'm not dissing other folks' experience, but my experience has been exactly opposite. The first Divine Liturgy I attended was at a GOA mission parish, most of the service was in English and we were welcomed warmly, invited to coffee hour and Sunday school, midweek Bible study. Several people stayed for a long time afterward to answer our questions.
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« Reply #51 on: March 22, 2012, 01:44:41 PM »

see these :

http://biblebasicsonline.com/english/Study07OriginofJesus/0701OTPropheciesOfJesus.html

http://www.lamblion.com/articles/articles_bible6.php

http://www.bibleprobe.com/365messianicprophecies.htm

http://brittgillette.com/WordPress/?page_id=21


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« Reply #52 on: March 22, 2012, 02:12:31 PM »

"I would stay away from the Greek Church if I were you, because these ones can be really ethnic and more of a social thing than an actual religious experience."

WOW!

talk abt steriotyping an entire ethnic groop Undecided

I know the Greeks get a bad rap for this, and I'm not dissing other folks' experience, but my experience has been exactly opposite. The first Divine Liturgy I attended was at a GOA mission parish, most of the service was in English and we were welcomed warmly, invited to coffee hour and Sunday school, midweek Bible study. Several people stayed for a long time afterward to answer our questions.

That is the exact description of my parish.
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« Reply #53 on: March 22, 2012, 02:28:59 PM »

In all honesty i find then too friendly.
I'm kind a Private person, but you cant be like that if you visit or join a new Greek parish.
They tend to ask all sorts of questions pull you around to show you things, invite you to there homes for coffee.
too much for me (i like being in the background unnoticed)but this is great for a convert or someone inquiring abt Orthodoxy.
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« Reply #54 on: March 22, 2012, 03:38:25 PM »

In all honesty i find then too friendly.
I'm kind a Private person, but you cant be like that if you visit or join a new Greek parish.
They tend to ask all sorts of questions pull you around to show you things, invite you to there homes for coffee.
too much for me (i like being in the background unnoticed)but this is great for a convert or someone inquiring abt Orthodoxy.

But seriously folks, how in the name of all that's holy are people who have just met you going to know what your personal preferences for social interaction are?
People don't welcome visitors or talk to them - visitors complain.
People are friendly to visitors - visitors complain

Pick one, people! Wink
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« Reply #55 on: March 22, 2012, 03:50:18 PM »

Whats your problem?
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« Reply #56 on: March 22, 2012, 03:50:39 PM »

In all honesty i find then too friendly.
I'm kind a Private person, but you cant be like that if you visit or join a new Greek parish.
They tend to ask all sorts of questions pull you around to show you things, invite you to there homes for coffee.
too much for me (i like being in the background unnoticed)but this is great for a convert or someone inquiring abt Orthodoxy.

But seriously folks, how in the name of all that's holy are people who have just met you going to know what your personal preferences for social interaction are?
People don't welcome visitors or talk to them - visitors complain.
People are friendly to visitors - visitors complain

Pick one, people! Wink
Sounds like my wife actually. Her solution, be friendly and brief.

PP
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« Reply #57 on: March 22, 2012, 10:10:57 PM »

I just wanted to give a quick up date I have emailed the Father at St Matthew's and were working on setting up a time up to meet.
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« Reply #58 on: March 22, 2012, 10:13:23 PM »

In all honesty i find then too friendly.
I'm kind a Private person, but you cant be like that if you visit or join a new Greek parish.
They tend to ask all sorts of questions pull you around to show you things, invite you to there homes for coffee.
too much for me (i like being in the background unnoticed)but this is great for a convert or someone inquiring abt Orthodoxy.

But seriously folks, how in the name of all that's holy are people who have just met you going to know what your personal preferences for social interaction are?
People don't welcome visitors or talk to them - visitors complain.
People are friendly to visitors - visitors complain

Pick one, people! Wink

This makes me not want to visit your parish a whole lot.
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« Reply #59 on: March 22, 2012, 11:07:10 PM »

I just wanted to give a quick up date I have emailed the Father at St Matthew's and were working on setting up a time up to meet.

That is good news. You may also want to look here as well.
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« Reply #60 on: March 22, 2012, 11:13:45 PM »

"I would stay away from the Greek Church if I were you, because these ones can be really ethnic and more of a social thing than an actual religious experience."

WOW!

talk abt steriotyping an entire ethnic groop Undecided

It's true.
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« Reply #61 on: March 22, 2012, 11:15:26 PM »

I wish I had a good Greek experience like the ones mentioned. At my parish I noticed that the Greeks are just always happy and seem to not really take spirituality seriously while the Russians are always a bit 'goomier' if you will, focusing in humility and self improvement. There is a Greek Church very close to my family's new apartment we're moving to and I wasn't going to give it a try because I wanted to go to the Russian one which is a bit farther, but I guess I'll give the Greek one a shot. I just cannot get over the lack of piety I have observed among Greek worship, no offense. They are just always happy, celebrating, seeming too confident in their salvation. It worries me. I'm spiritually sick and need help, I do not think that celebration will help me. I need treatment, humbleness and emphasis on improvement and humility, which is why I am more leaned toward the Russian Churches.
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« Reply #62 on: March 22, 2012, 11:16:34 PM »

I would stay away from the Greek Church if I were you, because these ones can be really ethnic and more of a social thing than an actual religious experience.

A bit heavy handed coming from someone who has never even set foot in a Greek parish, don't ya think?
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« Reply #63 on: March 22, 2012, 11:19:05 PM »

I would stay away from the Greek Church if I were you, because these ones can be really ethnic and more of a social thing than an actual religious experience.

A bit heavy handed coming from someone who has never even set foot in a Greek parish, don't ya think?

Everything I say should be taken with a grain of salt, but I am just stating what I have observed from the Greek members of my congregation and the videos I have seen of Greek worship services.
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« Reply #64 on: March 22, 2012, 11:26:55 PM »

As I was telling another member via PM, I had a bad experience with the Greeks. I totally understand how I was treated and have nothing against them. I love their bishops and priests though.
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« Reply #65 on: March 22, 2012, 11:33:58 PM »

Greek old ladies are pretty nice. They treat you like a grandson, literally. They'll offer to give you rides, invite you to their house, give you food. Yet, at the same time, they'll expect you to get them coffee, be the first ones to tell you to tuck your shirt in and scold you for bad manners. It makes me feel like they are accepting me as a part of their family.
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« Reply #66 on: March 23, 2012, 09:08:51 AM »

I just wanted to give a quick up date I have emailed the Father at St Matthew's and were working on setting up a time up to meet.

Awesome! Dialoguing with a Priest is the BEST way to learn about Orthodoxy. And, you are very lucky to be in an area with so many different Orthodox churches. If, for whatever reason, you do not relate well with one Priest or parish, you can check out the others. I hope the meeting goes well for you!
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« Reply #67 on: March 23, 2012, 09:26:47 AM »

I just wanted to give a quick up date I have emailed the Father at St Matthew's and were working on setting up a time up to meet.

Awesome! Dialoguing with a Priest is the BEST way to learn about Orthodoxy.

Yes. I just want to reiterate that message boards are the worst to learn about it.
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« Reply #68 on: March 23, 2012, 09:40:31 AM »

In all honesty i find then too friendly.
I'm kind a Private person, but you cant be like that if you visit or join a new Greek parish.
They tend to ask all sorts of questions pull you around to show you things, invite you to there homes for coffee.
too much for me (i like being in the background unnoticed)but this is great for a convert or someone inquiring abt Orthodoxy.

But seriously folks, how in the name of all that's holy are people who have just met you going to know what your personal preferences for social interaction are?
People don't welcome visitors or talk to them - visitors complain.
People are friendly to visitors - visitors complain

Pick one, people! Wink

This makes me not want to visit your parish a whole lot.

That would be your loss. Of course, I'm pretty biased.
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« Reply #69 on: March 23, 2012, 09:43:31 AM »

I just wanted to give a quick up date I have emailed the Father at St Matthew's and were working on setting up a time up to meet.

Awesome! Dialoguing with a Priest is the BEST way to learn about Orthodoxy.

Yes. I just want to reiterate that message boards are the worst to learn about it.


 Cheesy  Unless the priest in question is a jerk and has no clue what he's talking about...   ahh, but I forgot, on this forum we pretend like all priests are gracious and knowledgable, and so we can blindly say "ask your priest!" any time an issue comes up  police
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« Reply #70 on: March 23, 2012, 11:16:28 AM »

James, have you considered the Pharisees?  They certainly seemed to be quite pious, but Christ says that if you are only as righteous as one, you're damned.  I just recently finished reading the book Light in the Darkness, which is a compilation of writings by Sergei Fudel.  Fudel lived over half of his life in Soviet prisons, because of his faith.  However, throughout the book, he is scathing in regard to the false piety of many, many Russians he knew - both before and after the Communists took over Russia.  He repeatedly has passages condemning an outward piety that is without an inward piety.  He writes that he would rather throw out the icons and prostrations and other such things, if people would just be inwardly pious.  He writes about how so many Russians practice the things you "have to do" simply because they feel that they have to and if they do, they will go to Heaven.  He even writes about priests who had no faith, at all, in God, who were atheists, yet prided themselves on being able to perform the services of the Church perfectly, according entirely to the rubrics.

Outward signs mean NOTHING without a true, inward piety.  If you are not truly repentant, you are damned whether or not you appear to be spiritual, whether or not you appear to be faithful, whether or not you follow the rules and regulations of the Typicon, to the tee.  So, if you don't have true faith, true unadulterated Orthodox faith, free of superstition, what does it matter if you follow the rubrics?  You may as well not even come to Church, you may as well eat five pounds of beef every day of Lent, you may as well spit on your priests and bishops, because you have no life in you.

Do not worry so much about outward appearances, worry far more about the state of your soul.
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« Reply #71 on: March 23, 2012, 12:26:12 PM »

James, have you considered the Pharisees?  They certainly seemed to be quite pious, but Christ says that if you are only as righteous as one, you're damned.  I just recently finished reading the book Light in the Darkness, which is a compilation of writings by Sergei Fudel.  Fudel lived over half of his life in Soviet prisons, because of his faith.  However, throughout the book, he is scathing in regard to the false piety of many, many Russians he knew - both before and after the Communists took over Russia.  He repeatedly has passages condemning an outward piety that is without an inward piety.  He writes that he would rather throw out the icons and prostrations and other such things, if people would just be inwardly pious.  He writes about how so many Russians practice the things you "have to do" simply because they feel that they have to and if they do, they will go to Heaven.  He even writes about priests who had no faith, at all, in God, who were atheists, yet prided themselves on being able to perform the services of the Church perfectly, according entirely to the rubrics.

Outward signs mean NOTHING without a true, inward piety.  If you are not truly repentant, you are damned whether or not you appear to be spiritual, whether or not you appear to be faithful, whether or not you follow the rules and regulations of the Typicon, to the tee.  So, if you don't have true faith, true unadulterated Orthodox faith, free of superstition, what does it matter if you follow the rubrics?  You may as well not even come to Church, you may as well eat five pounds of beef every day of Lent, you may as well spit on your priests and bishops, because you have no life in you.

Do not worry so much about outward appearances, worry far more about the state of your soul.

  Not true. Even if a priest or layperson has absolutely no faith at all and does things as required. The simple fact that they are there and acting as Christians can actually benefit someone else greatly. When one enters church in a spiritual state of mind. There focus shouldn't be on the other people. It should be on themselves and as long as the people and environment around them look and behave normally. It has absolutely no baring on one's own salvation. It's the system as a whole that saves.
   Hospitals operate the same manor. Your run through a bunch of tests including MRI, cat-scan, x-rays and the system give you the prognosis. It could be any of the steps that actually saves. It's the system as a whole that covers all the bases through a cooperative method.
   Stretched out through a life time you will encounter every step that is needed for salvation. It is always up to the person to take advantage of it. The system itself is fool proof.
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« Reply #72 on: March 23, 2012, 03:54:32 PM »


I understand what you are saying, but it is not our place to judge our fellow Orthodox Christians. Getting back on topic, I know that outward signs of piety will not save me alone and that many people use them for false reasons, but that is irrelevant to me. Even if my Orthodox brethren are taking advantage of these outward signs, I know that I myself personally would be using them for the right reasons despite whatever reasons they are using them for. You say that outward piety does not matter as much as the salvation of our soul. I agree, but you misunderstand that to me, outward piety DOES play a part in the salvation of my soul. I need outward signs, rituals and practices to remind me of who I am before God and keep me focused.
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« Reply #73 on: March 23, 2012, 08:14:45 PM »


I understand what you are saying, but it is not our place to judge our fellow Orthodox Christians. Getting back on topic, I know that outward signs of piety will not save me alone and that many people use them for false reasons, but that is irrelevant to me. Even if my Orthodox brethren are taking advantage of these outward signs, I know that I myself personally would be using them for the right reasons despite whatever reasons they are using them for. You say that outward piety does not matter as much as the salvation of our soul. I agree, but you misunderstand that to me, outward piety DOES play a part in the salvation of my soul. I need outward signs, rituals and practices to remind me of who I am before God and keep me focused.

You, quite clearly, do not understand what I was saying, nor do you understand the second clause of your first sentence.  It is not our place to judge ANYONE (Orthodox or otherwise), yet you have NO problem judging everyone who doesn't utilize all the externals that you feel are important or vital.  However, you have no knowledge of the state of their soul unless you are a Spirit-bearing Elder, in which case I bow to your holiness.  For all you know, they are seen as exceptionally holy by God Himself, and perhaps they don't need such externals as ou do.

I was also not saying externals are unimportant.  Rather, I was saying that they are totally useless if one does not have any internals.  What does six hundred prostrations in an hour matter if one feels they will merit him salvation?  They are useless then.  What does owning 5,000 icons matter if one thinks the saints are gift-dispensing vending machines and our prayers are dollar bills?  If one has no internals, then they may as well have no externals and - in fact - they may be just like the Pharisees, condemned by God because they have only externals, yet think themselves righteous. 

You seem to think Russians who utilize externals are somehow holier than Greeks; I pointed out a Russian martyr, a man who suffered his whole life for his faith, who wrote countless times about the lack of faith amongst Russians who were quite well-versed in externals.  You need to take a closer look at what is truly important, and at yourself instead of focusing on the Greeks who you feel are unholy for failing to utilize as many external - and very public - signs as the Russians, and instead of focusing on the Russians who you feel are holy merely because they utilize many external - and very public - signs.
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« Reply #74 on: March 24, 2012, 06:52:18 AM »

The Jewish faith has many sects just like Christians do so some of these questions could be giving different answers. I'm not an Orthodox Jew but lean more towards Karaite Jew. Karaite's dont follow the Talmud or( the oral laws). There is no Karaite shul ( Church ) in my area so when I do go I go to a Reform Jewish shul. In Judaism we don't have Saints but we do have Sages kinda like just your Church Fathers with out the Saint part added


Polish Karaites do not identify themselves as Jews.
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« Reply #75 on: March 24, 2012, 07:14:44 AM »

The Jewish faith has many sects just like Christians do so some of these questions could be giving different answers. I'm not an Orthodox Jew but lean more towards Karaite Jew. Karaite's dont follow the Talmud or( the oral laws). There is no Karaite shul ( Church ) in my area so when I do go I go to a Reform Jewish shul. In Judaism we don't have Saints but we do have Sages kinda like just your Church Fathers with out the Saint part added


Polish Karaites do not identify themselves as Jews.
they still going by Taters over there.
Here's a simple over view on Karaites if anyone cares to know http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karaite_Judaism

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« Reply #76 on: March 24, 2012, 07:34:14 AM »

Here's a simple over view on Karaites if anyone cares to know http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karaite_Judaism

I think they care more for themselves than for English wiki.
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« Reply #77 on: March 24, 2012, 11:12:40 AM »

The Jewish faith has many sects just like Christians do so some of these questions could be giving different answers. I'm not an Orthodox Jew but lean more towards Karaite Jew. Karaite's dont follow the Talmud or( the oral laws). There is no Karaite shul ( Church ) in my area so when I do go I go to a Reform Jewish shul. In Judaism we don't have Saints but we do have Sages kinda like just your Church Fathers with out the Saint part added


Polish Karaites do not identify themselves as Jews.

Really? That's interesting.  Huh
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« Reply #78 on: March 24, 2012, 11:15:31 AM »

The Jewish faith has many sects just like Christians do so some of these questions could be giving different answers. I'm not an Orthodox Jew but lean more towards Karaite Jew. Karaite's dont follow the Talmud or( the oral laws). There is no Karaite shul ( Church ) in my area so when I do go I go to a Reform Jewish shul. In Judaism we don't have Saints but we do have Sages kinda like just your Church Fathers with out the Saint part added


Polish Karaites do not identify themselves as Jews.

Polish Karaites and Jewish Karaites (who, today, are primarily descendants of Egyptian Jews) are two separate religious groups.
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« Reply #79 on: March 24, 2012, 12:15:29 PM »

hi, jewish voice.
i speak romanian, but as so little of that website is in english, it looks like they might not have much translation inside the church either! so u can either visit one that advertises in english (i think that's a good idea for a church located in an english speaking country!) or send me a personal messsage with any bits u want translating.
may God bless yr searching; He rewards those who seek Him.
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« Reply #80 on: March 24, 2012, 01:53:15 PM »

I am romanian.What is it that it is desired in "romanian" ?
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« Reply #81 on: March 24, 2012, 02:06:34 PM »

so JewishVoice, are you convinced yet? Wink
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« Reply #82 on: March 24, 2012, 02:55:19 PM »

so JewishVoice, are you convinced yet? Wink
I didn't get to meet with the Father at the one church yet. What I have read that has been posted on here not as of yet.
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« Reply #83 on: March 24, 2012, 05:07:45 PM »

so JewishVoice, are you convinced yet? Wink
I didn't get to meet with the Father at the one church yet. What I have read that has been posted on here not as of yet.

oh, well let us know how that meeting goes!
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« Reply #84 on: March 25, 2012, 04:28:39 PM »

buna azul,
 Smiley
it was a romanian orthodox church website. but i think he is going to get his info from an english speaking source.
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« Reply #85 on: March 25, 2012, 10:20:42 PM »

Well there is a Rabbi that revealed the name of the messiah.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k0DTT3u2JZ8
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« Reply #86 on: March 26, 2012, 12:50:12 AM »

You are possibly converting? That is amazing, good luck with your spiritual journey. Also, I would suggest going with the OCA parish. I know that many people talk badly about it, but the truth of the matter is that there is nothing wrong with it really. I know because I attend one. I would stay away from the Greek Church if I were you, because these ones can be really ethnic and more of a social thing than an actual religious experience.

The Russians are holier because they have the nabedrennik and the red double-orarion.
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« Reply #87 on: March 27, 2012, 03:16:13 PM »

Just a quick up date I meet with the Father today from Saint Matthew's and had a very good meeting and I enjoyed our time talking and I plan on going to Saint Matthew's this sunday doing a little of that come and see
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« Reply #88 on: March 27, 2012, 03:17:22 PM »

Just a quick up date I meet with the Father today from Saint Matthew's and had a very good meeting and I enjoyed our time talking and I plan on going to Saint Matthew's this sunday doing a little of that come and see
Thats awesome! Have a great time Smiley

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« Reply #89 on: March 27, 2012, 03:41:40 PM »

Just a quick up date I meet with the Father today from Saint Matthew's and had a very good meeting and I enjoyed our time talking and I plan on going to Saint Matthew's this sunday doing a little of that come and see

awesome, let us know how it goes.
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« Reply #90 on: April 01, 2012, 01:52:40 PM »

I went to my First Orthodox service today. Everyone there was very nice and made me feel very welcomed there Grin. I must really say with what little bit of Church I been to before I had no clue to what was going on to much. I haven't stood that long since my old Marine Corps days  Tongue I think I will have to get new dress shoes besides my hard wing tip flat ones. I think I might have found my Church home if G-d so leads me into Orthodoxy.
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« Reply #91 on: April 01, 2012, 02:09:06 PM »

I went to my First Orthodox service today. Everyone there was very nice and made me feel very welcomed there Grin. I must really say with what little bit of Church I been to before I had no clue to what was going on to much. I haven't stood that long since my old Marine Corps days  Tongue I think I will have to get new dress shoes besides my hard wing tip flat ones. I think I might have found my Church home if G-d so leads me into Orthodoxy.

Good to hear! Glad you had a positive impression.  Grin
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« Reply #92 on: April 01, 2012, 02:12:14 PM »

I went to my First Orthodox service today. Everyone there was very nice and made me feel very welcomed there Grin. I must really say with what little bit of Church I been to before I had no clue to what was going on to much. I haven't stood that long since my old Marine Corps days  Tongue I think I will have to get new dress shoes besides my hard wing tip flat ones. I think I might have found my Church home if G-d so leads me into Orthodoxy.

May God continue to bless you on your journey! angel
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« Reply #93 on: April 01, 2012, 02:22:57 PM »

 I know it's only the beginning, but Glory to God! I hope you find the answers you seek and join us some day!
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« Reply #94 on: April 01, 2012, 02:38:05 PM »

I went to my First Orthodox service today. Everyone there was very nice and made me feel very welcomed there Grin. I must really say with what little bit of Church I been to before I had no clue to what was going on to much. I haven't stood that long since my old Marine Corps days  Tongue I think I will have to get new dress shoes besides my hard wing tip flat ones. I think I might have found my Church home if G-d so leads me into Orthodoxy.

Glory to God. Leave up your hyphen to Him.
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« Reply #95 on: April 01, 2012, 03:54:09 PM »

praise the Lord!
also buy new, more casual wide-fitting shoes...
 Wink
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« Reply #96 on: April 02, 2012, 10:52:55 AM »

haven't stood that long since my old Marine Corps days  Tongue I think I will have to get new dress shoes besides my hard wing tip flat ones.


Here's a tip: Dr. Scholl's inserts and arch supports!
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« Reply #97 on: April 02, 2012, 11:04:20 AM »

Quote
I went to my First Orthodox service today. Everyone there was very nice and made me feel very welcomed there . I must really say with what little bit of Church I been to before I had no clue to what was going on to much. I haven't stood that long since my old Marine Corps days   I think I will have to get new dress shoes besides my hard wing tip flat ones
Dr. Scholl's helps mate Smiley

Quote
I think I might have found my Church home if G-d so leads me into Orthodoxy
Praise God. I hope you find what you're looking for.

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« Reply #98 on: April 06, 2012, 11:23:21 AM »

Hey JV,

 Maybe you can help us get to know you a little better by humoring me with this question; I believe you when you tell us you're Jewish.  What I find a little different is that you're using Islamic art as your avatar.  You see, Muslims aren't allowed to draw or paint pictures of animals or humans.  Something about only God can create life, so we shouldn't even try.  I don't know, I think Muhammad may have misunderstood art.  But anyway, I think your avatar, although in the shape of a tiger is actually an ayat (verse) from the Qur'an.  I understand this question is off topic so you can PM me if you want to.
My avatar and sig come from Ismailism philosophy. As most people know them  as Assassins( Hashasheen) during the crusades. I like crusade history but not the normal way as Christians would I guess. There were also Jews in this group of Assassins as well fighting with the Ismailism sect of Muslims and they helped bring Jerusalem back from  out of the hands of the Christians.  

 I see.  Well, thanks for the explanation.  As I thought it would, your explanation has created further questions; the one I'll focus on seems to challenge your question to us here and that is this: Your avatar and signature seem to be rather polemic and a veiled threat to Christians (seeing how Ismaili's helped overthrow Christianity in Jerusalem).  That seems to be your one and only affection for them. How then can we possibly take you serious when asking for an explanation that Jesus is Lord?  If I am wrong, I apologize to you.  But certainly the thought must have crossed your mind that we might be a little distrusting?  Plus, you've been given some evidence already and it seems you've yet to address it.
Being that this is the internet I can see why you might question someone on if they were serious but I did ask the question. I haven't posted back on some of the readings yet cause I'm still trying to to think them over and  some where just posted today so I have yet to read them. I also wanted to add that If I were to convert over to Christian it would be Orthodox cause Rome was pretty bad to us Jews with there back door deals
ps lots of fixes on this due to my key's acting up and sticking
Really? Just what "back door deals" might that be?

If anything, the Latin Church has more than once put her butt on the line in defense of the so-called "chosen".

Besides, it's not like Jews haven't ever made their own "back door deals" against Rome themselves not too mention the Eastern church as well. You even acknowledged in an earlier post about Jews commiserating with the Saracens against the Crusaders in their eventual expulsion out of Jerusalem. Jews have a history of siding with Islam against the Church and the West including Moorish Spain and the fall of Constantinople. So let's not be hypocritical here, Jews have made their share of covert deals with the enemy behind close doors as well.
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Sancte Michael Archangele, defende nos in proelio, contra nequitiam et insidias diaboli esto praesidium.
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