Author Topic: GOA - Protestants & EP Sign Agreement Re: Baptism  (Read 3180 times)

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Offline Orthodoc

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GOA - Protestants & EP Sign Agreement Re: Baptism
« on: October 11, 2004, 10:10:24 AM »
Protestants and Orthodox Laud Agreement in Germany on Baptism (ENI Release)

Ecumenical News International
Daily News Service
06 October 2004

By Frauke Brauns

Bielefeld, Germany, 6 October (ENI)--The Evangelical Church in Germany (EKD), the country's main Protestant grouping, and the Istanbul-based Ecumenical Patriarchate of Constantinople have signed an agreement to recognise baptisms.

Under the agreement announced after a September meeting in Istanbul, Christians who convert from one denomination to another will not be baptised again.

"Although [full] church fellowship does not yet exist between our churches, we each regard the other's members as being baptised and in the case of a change of confession we reject undertaking a new baptism," the two churches said in a joint statement.

The statement was signed by Metropolitan Augoustinos of Germany who is responsible for Orthodox Christians in central Europe, for the Ecumenical Patriarchate, and Bishop Rolf Koppe, head of foreign relations for the EKD.

Baptism, a religious ceremony performed with water, is acknowledged throughout the Christian world to be a commandment of Jesus and the fundamental rite of initiation into the Church.

"During our negotiations Metropolitan Augoustinos pointed out that the Ecumenical Patriarchate in Germany has not baptised converts for many years," said Dr Dagmar Heller, the EKD officer responsible for ecumenism and Orthodoxy. "But signing this paper helps to combat misunderstanding and prejudices."

The EKD and the Ecumenical Patriarchate have held talks since 1969 partly to help promote the integration of Greek Orthodox Christians into German society. Many Greeks came to Germany in the 1960s and 1970s to seek work in the industrial regions of Frankfurt, Munich, Stuttgart, Cologne and Dusseldorf.

The Ecumenical Patriarchate in Germany has more than 400 000 members, making it the country's third biggest Christian denomination after the EKD and the Roman Catholic Church.

A major World Council of Churches-sponsored conference earlier this year highlighted the importance of the mutual recognition of baptism, considered by some to offer currently the most promising way to promote church unity.

In 2003, the then WCC general secretary, Konrad Raiser, said there would be "a 'Copernican Revolution' in ecumenical dialogue if churches were genuinely to recognise each other's baptism". [348 words]

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Orthodoc


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Offline JohnCassian

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Re:GOA - Protestants & EP Sign Agreement Re: Baptism
« Reply #1 on: October 11, 2004, 10:14:53 AM »

"During our negotiations Metropolitan Augoustinos pointed out that the Ecumenical Patriarchate in Germany has not baptised converts for many years," said Dr Dagmar Heller, the EKD officer responsible for ecumenism and Orthodoxy.


Ha!  This takes 'Meaningless Joint Statement' to a whole new level of silliness.

Coming next week: EP and Pope Sign Agreement Re: Books in the New Testament!

"Do leave off speaking of me as an ill-educated and uncouth and unfriendly man, not even worthy to live." - St. Gregory the Theologian in a Letter to St. Basil the Great

Offline Αριστοκλής

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Re:GOA - Protestants & EP Sign Agreement Re: Baptism
« Reply #2 on: October 11, 2004, 10:29:51 AM »
Ha!  This takes 'Meaningless Joint Statement' to a whole new level of silliness.

Coming next week: EP and Pope Sign Agreement Re: Books in the New Testament!


Lol! How true, JohnCassian.
Apparently the 'Phanar' wishes to still swim against the tide. Fortunately we have 14 other Orthodox Churches to put the suspicion to 'agreements' such as this. Silly.

Demetri
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Offline Strelets

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Re:GOA - Protestants & EP Sign Agreement Re: Baptism
« Reply #3 on: October 11, 2004, 11:06:10 AM »
This sounds like news from the Onion Dome.  Did they agree to allow converts to keep their old God, too?
"The creed is very simple, and here is what it is: to believe that there is nothing more beautiful, more courageous, and more perfect than Christ; and there not only isn't, but I tell myself with a jealous love, there cannot be." ~ Fyodor Dostoevsky

Online Justin Kissel

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Re:GOA - Protestants & EP Sign Agreement Re: Baptism
« Reply #4 on: October 11, 2004, 11:42:47 AM »
Quote
Baptism, a religious ceremony performed with water

:smiley7: That's sort of like, "The eucharist, a religious ceremony where you eat and drink stuff".

Offline JoeS

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Re:GOA - Protestants & EP Sign Agreement Re: Baptism
« Reply #5 on: October 11, 2004, 11:53:23 AM »
//..., a religious ceremony performed with water
 

 That's sort of like, "The eucharist, a religious ceremony where you eat and drink stuff".//

Like washing my car.

JoeS  ;D

Offline Tallitot

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Re:GOA - Protestants & EP Sign Agreement Re: Baptism
« Reply #6 on: October 11, 2004, 12:27:10 PM »
Just think, as little as a decade ago the reporter wouldn't have had to explain what Baptism is, they could've assumed that most readers knew what the word meant.
Proverbs 22:7

Offline Keble

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Re:GOA - Protestants & EP Sign Agreement Re: Baptism
« Reply #7 on: October 11, 2004, 01:53:51 PM »
This sounds like news from the Onion Dome.  Did they agree to allow converts to keep their old God, too?

Of course they did-- they didn't require them to become pagans, after all.

Offline Αριστοκλής

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Re:GOA - Protestants & EP Sign Agreement Re: Baptism
« Reply #8 on: October 14, 2004, 07:38:47 PM »
BEFORE I insert my feet in my mouth over this with my priest this weekend, what is the EKD? Lutheran?
(If so, the EP's several decades late)

Demetri
"Religion is a neurobiological illness and Orthodoxy is its cure." - Fr. John S. Romanides

Offline Elisha

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Re:GOA - Protestants & EP Sign Agreement Re: Baptism
« Reply #9 on: October 14, 2004, 10:11:53 PM »
BEFORE I insert my feet in my mouth over this with my priest this weekend, what is the EKD? Lutheran?
(If so, the EP's several decades late)

Demetri

I think it stands for Evangelische Kirche Deutsch (just a guess), so the Evangelical German Church.  But in common speak there, usually someone will ask you Evangelisch oder Catholisch?  Sounding like evangelical or Catholic, but they MEAN (around 90% of the time) Lutheran or Catholic.  Of all "christians" in German (using the term loosely), I would guess the split would be something like 40% Catholic, 40% Lutheran, 20% Everything else (WAG).

Offline TomS

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Re:GOA - Protestants & EP Sign Agreement Re: Baptism
« Reply #10 on: October 14, 2004, 10:15:23 PM »
Of all "christians" in German (using the term loosely), ...

I hope that at your next confession, you will be asking forgiveness for judging your fellow Christians.

Offline Αριστοκλής

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Re:GOA - Protestants & EP Sign Agreement Re: Baptism
« Reply #11 on: October 14, 2004, 10:25:22 PM »
I hope that at your next confession, you will be asking forgiveness for judging your fellow Christians.

Who is judging whom?
 :-";"xx
"Religion is a neurobiological illness and Orthodoxy is its cure." - Fr. John S. Romanides

Offline TomS

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Re:GOA - Protestants & EP Sign Agreement Re: Baptism
« Reply #13 on: October 14, 2004, 11:57:04 PM »
Friends,

TomS is a friend of many of us and we are trying to patiently answer his questions. However, many of the threads are becoming bogged down because of TomS's concerns.  I would therefore request that TomS start a thread in free for all called "TomS's concerns" and that he only post stuff that he disagrees with* in THAT thread for the time being.

I ask that we get back on track and not respond any more to the TomS posts in these threads.

Anastasios
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* And of course in so doing it must be reasonable and not offensive to the Orthodox believers here.
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