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Author Topic: Holy Orthodox Church, American Jurisdiction ( HOCAJ )  (Read 1496 times) Average Rating: 0
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quietmorning
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« on: February 24, 2012, 10:07:49 AM »

I found a Western Rite Orthodox Church in my area, and was hoping to call this morning to see if I might go to Ash Wednesday (I think this is the one thing I really miss from the RC) . . . but am very unsure if we are in communion with them or not. . .Who is the HOCAJ?  Are they in communion with the EO?  This is St. Basil's Cathedral in Nashville TN.  Here is a link to their site:  http://www.stbasilscathedral.org/home.cfm

Thanks!
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« Reply #1 on: February 24, 2012, 10:12:39 AM »

They are another tiny vagante group.  This is apparently their only parish.
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« Reply #2 on: February 24, 2012, 10:13:08 AM »

According to Al Green's Religious Groups That Use 'Orthodox' in Their Names But Are Not Canonical Eastern Orthodox Churches list, this group (HOCAJ) is not canonical.

Another red flag is the fact that they refer to Bp. Aftimos Ofiesh as a saint.
« Last Edit: February 24, 2012, 10:14:56 AM by Schultz » Logged

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« Reply #3 on: February 24, 2012, 10:13:43 AM »

They are another tiny vagante group.  This is apparently their only parish.

But it's the "American Jurisdiction"!
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« Reply #4 on: February 24, 2012, 10:16:47 AM »

I found this. Looks like a lot to read.
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« Reply #5 on: February 24, 2012, 10:32:25 AM »

Thank you, everyone! Smiley 
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« Reply #6 on: February 24, 2012, 10:55:46 AM »

This is a good tip-off as well:

Quote
Though we are brothers in Christ, we are not associated with the OCACNA, do not claim or represent ourselves to be the OCACNA, and are not part of the OCACNA in any form or function (The Holy Eastern Orthodox Catholic and Apostolic Church of North America)

That's vagante talk for sure.

When in doubt, check this page. These are the Orthodox churches in communion with each other, assuming you're not part of an Old Calendarist/Genuine Orthodox group.
« Last Edit: February 24, 2012, 10:56:05 AM by Agabus » Logged

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THE OPINIONS HERE MAY NOT REFLECT THE ACTUAL ORTHODOX CHURCH
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« Reply #7 on: February 24, 2012, 11:50:16 AM »

I'm often curious as to who, if anyone, shows up to the services of these groups aside from the "bishops" or "priests."
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« Reply #8 on: February 24, 2012, 12:08:33 PM »

I'm often curious as to who, if anyone, shows up to the services of these groups aside from the "bishops" or "priests."
I know of a half handful of these groups that also operate homeless shelters and soup kitchens, which buys them a lot of goodwill with their constituent communities, who in turn will attend an occasional service. Even then, most of the congregations are small.

My assumption is that those few “churches” are the exception and not the rule, but I find it hard to harbor ill-will against anyone — no matter how misguided their ideas about Orthodoxy — if they are feeding and clothing the poor. Broken clock being right twice a day and all that.
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« Reply #9 on: February 24, 2012, 12:10:56 PM »

I'm often curious as to who, if anyone, shows up to the services of these groups aside from the "bishops" or "priests."
I know of a half handful of these groups that also operate homeless shelters and soup kitchens, which buys them a lot of goodwill with their constituent communities, who in turn will attend an occasional service. Even then, most of the congregations are small.

My assumption is that those few “churches” are the exception and not the rule, but I find it hard to harbor ill-will against anyone — no matter how misguided their ideas about Orthodoxy — if they are feeding and clothing the poor. Broken clock being right twice a day and all that.


Good point.
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« Reply #10 on: February 24, 2012, 12:50:55 PM »

I found a Western Rite Orthodox Church in my area, and was hoping to call this morning to see if I might go to Ash Wednesday (I think this is the one thing I really miss from the RC) . . . but am very unsure if we are in communion with them or not. . .Who is the HOCAJ?  Are they in communion with the EO?  This is St. Basil's Cathedral in Nashville TN.  Here is a link to their site:  http://www.stbasilscathedral.org/home.cfm

Thanks!

I'd say if you want ashes go to Roman Catholic church.  They let lay people impose ashes upon thine countenance so really it's a symbolic thing.  Why not?
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« Reply #11 on: February 24, 2012, 02:42:16 PM »

I'm often curious as to who, if anyone, shows up to the services of these groups aside from the "bishops" or "priests."

Bishops' wives.
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« Reply #12 on: February 24, 2012, 02:46:11 PM »

I thought we had a HOCAJ member here at one time...or was that another set of abbreviations?

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« Reply #13 on: February 24, 2012, 02:46:33 PM »

This is a good tip-off as well:

Quote
Though we are brothers in Christ, we are not associated with the OCACNA, do not claim or represent ourselves to be the OCACNA, and are not part of the OCACNA in any form or function (The Holy Eastern Orthodox Catholic and Apostolic Church of North America)

That's vagante talk for sure.

When in doubt, check this page. These are the Orthodox churches in communion with each other, assuming you're not part of an Old Calendarist/Genuine Orthodox group.

I wasn't sure what that meant . . .so better to ask than to assume. . .  Grin
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« Reply #14 on: February 24, 2012, 02:48:16 PM »

I found a Western Rite Orthodox Church in my area, and was hoping to call this morning to see if I might go to Ash Wednesday (I think this is the one thing I really miss from the RC) . . . but am very unsure if we are in communion with them or not. . .Who is the HOCAJ?  Are they in communion with the EO?  This is St. Basil's Cathedral in Nashville TN.  Here is a link to their site:  http://www.stbasilscathedral.org/home.cfm

Thanks!

I'd say if you want ashes go to Roman Catholic church.  They let lay people impose ashes upon thine countenance so really it's a symbolic thing.  Why not?

Hm. . .I've never had anyone put ashes on me other than a priest, this must be a new thing.  Or a newer thing. . .since it's been a while since I've been to an RC service.
« Last Edit: February 24, 2012, 02:51:44 PM by quietmorning » Logged
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« Reply #15 on: February 24, 2012, 02:53:46 PM »

I found a Western Rite Orthodox Church in my area, and was hoping to call this morning to see if I might go to Ash Wednesday (I think this is the one thing I really miss from the RC) . . . but am very unsure if we are in communion with them or not. . .Who is the HOCAJ?  Are they in communion with the EO?  This is St. Basil's Cathedral in Nashville TN.  Here is a link to their site:  http://www.stbasilscathedral.org/home.cfm

Thanks!

I'd say if you want ashes go to Roman Catholic church.  They let lay people impose ashes upon thine countenance so really it's a symbolic thing.  Why not?

Hm. . .I've never had anyone put ashes on me other than a priest, this must be a new thing.  Or a newer thing. . .since it's been a while since I've been to an RC service.


Really? Ash Wed. church services are packed to the gills here.  They usually have the priest and a handful of laity smearing ashes on foreheads.
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« Reply #16 on: February 24, 2012, 03:49:41 PM »

I found a Western Rite Orthodox Church in my area, and was hoping to call this morning to see if I might go to Ash Wednesday (I think this is the one thing I really miss from the RC) . . . but am very unsure if we are in communion with them or not. . .Who is the HOCAJ?  Are they in communion with the EO?  This is St. Basil's Cathedral in Nashville TN.  Here is a link to their site:  http://www.stbasilscathedral.org/home.cfm

Thanks!

I'd say if you want ashes go to Roman Catholic church.  They let lay people impose ashes upon thine countenance so really it's a symbolic thing.  Why not?

Hm. . .I've never had anyone put ashes on me other than a priest, this must be a new thing.  Or a newer thing. . .since it's been a while since I've been to an RC service.


Really? Ash Wed. church services are packed to the gills here.  They usually have the priest and a handful of laity smearing ashes on foreheads.

I was one of those 'lay' people - a Eucharistic Minister. . .we never placed ashes, only the priest.  The last RC Church I went to was in Southern California - the church as standing room only at every service - with well over 3500 people as members.  There were several priests. 

That was . . . prior to 2000. . .so it's been a while. . . things may have changed, and may be different from diocese to diocese. . .so I don't doubt you, I just have never experienced it.

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