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Author Topic: Hyperdox Herman  (Read 98605 times) Average Rating: 5
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Hiwot
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« Reply #585 on: May 10, 2012, 10:46:36 PM »

Huh. That's weird. I don't know why anyone would be concerned about Amharic...even if all Arabic speakers were terrorists by default, it sounds pretty different than Arabic.

Here in Albuquerque, we had the opposite situation with an Ethiopian girl who used to attend the church. She's since moved away (and I didn't even get Amharic lessons like she said she'd give me! Cry Heh. Oh well.), but she used to get into big arguments with some of the people from church because she supported Barrack Obama and they don't. One of the men said "He's a Muslim! His middle name is Hussein!" and she said "that's not fair! Your name is Raafat! That sounds 'Muslim', too!" That was really, really not the right thing to say. laugh The man gave her a very loud, angry Arabic lesson right there, for free. "You don't know anything! Shut up! It is Arabic for Rafael, and you call me a MUSLIM?! You are stupid!" Shocked She then, much less confidently than before, explained that no Ethiopians have Arabic names unless they are Muslims, so for Amhara and other Christian people, almost ANY Arabic name sounds Muslim...I don't know how true that is, but I thought it was funny. Because of my educational background, people at church often ask me to explain words to them (usually in English, but not always), so she asked me "So, Christians will have Arab names too? And it's okay?"

*facepalm*

While we were eating together in a COPTIC CHURCH, surrounded by people who have Arabic names, she asked that! Hahaha. God bless her. What a sweet lady...but yes, I had to explain that just like it's okay to have George and John and Marcus, names like Khalil, Raafat, and Tawfiq are okay, too. It seemed weird to be explaining this, as a non-Semitic person, to a native Amharic speaker, but it happened. Go figure. Smiley

LOL oh my! awkward! hahaha

but she is right, only Muslims have Arabic names, with very few exceptions like Adam, yet the pronunciation is markedly different for them both. the Muslim will be named Ibrahim, the Christian, Abraham, the Muslim will be named  mussa , the Christian musse, no christian is ever named Tawfiq, kadija, jamila , hawa, halima, habiba , jamal,Aminat, no Arabic name at all for the Christians. so if you hear arabic name its immediately understood that , the person is Muslim. the Christians have  names like, bekure,  bereket, samuel, yonatan,Michael, dawit, rebeqa, sara, kidist, kidus, yohannes, endriyas, hewan etc.. distinctly understood to be christian names..

I hope she has learnt some tact by now lol
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« Reply #586 on: May 11, 2012, 06:23:23 AM »

Arab names among Christians are due to Arab nationalism, which actually was invented by the EO Christian Michel Aflaq. The idea was to make people identify mostly with the nation, so that they would not give so much attention to religious differences and thereby stop discriminating against Christians. By identifying with the Arab nation, Christians could also present themselves as anticolonialist. Edward Said, for example, also was from an Arab Christian (Protestant) family.

In fact, the whole thing went quite well, until a) the Arabs did not manage to destroy Israel and b) Saudi money paid for re-islamisation. Nowadays, most Copts don't give Arab names anymore, preferring Christian names in Western forms.
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« Reply #587 on: May 11, 2012, 06:28:52 AM »

in Western forms.

 Huh
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« Reply #588 on: May 11, 2012, 06:32:00 AM »


George instead of Guirgis, Mary instead of Maryam, etc.
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« Reply #589 on: May 11, 2012, 11:00:38 AM »

Arab names among Christians are due to Arab nationalism, which actually was invented by the EO Christian Michel Aflaq.

EO have long been associated with Arab nationalism, even before it was given that name, like Lebanese EO writer Jurji Zeydan (1861-1914), who published the first secular (i.e., non-Islamic) history of the Middle East, which didn't exactly endear him to the public (they weren't ready for such ideas, I guess).

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In fact, the whole thing went quite well, until a) the Arabs did not manage to destroy Israel and b) Saudi money paid for re-islamisation. Nowadays, most Copts don't give Arab names anymore, preferring Christian names in Western forms.

It's true. Even though we have Raafats and Hodas among us, we have many more Georges and Marys (not Girgis's and Maryams).
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« Reply #590 on: May 11, 2012, 11:58:56 AM »

Whoa, this is really irrelevant. How about a ROCOR Roman : Goes to Vigil on Saturday, fails to say his evening prayers and the canons before communion.
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« Reply #591 on: May 12, 2012, 02:11:38 AM »


George instead of Guirgis, Mary instead of Maryam, etc.

Yes, I understood that part but why an Earth? They perceive Anglo-American culture to be more Christian than Arab culture?
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« Reply #592 on: May 12, 2012, 02:49:14 AM »

Those saints aren't "Anglo-American"...St. George was from Lydda (Palestine), for instance, and last time I checked, St. Mary was not from either England or America. You're confusing the language with the people, but Coptic antipathy towards Arabs is something different than just that. There is no real reason for Copts to avoid using Anglicized forms, as the English never cut their tongues out for speaking Coptic, never burned down their churches or destroyed their monasteries, never forced them to convert to Islam, never kidnapped their daughters or raped their wives, etc. It sucks, especially for the millions of Christian Arabs, but Islam has been souring the world on Arabs and Arabic for a long time now, or at least the part of the world that has paid attention to what Muhammad and Co. have done to the previously Christian (and Zoroastrian, and Buddhist...) lands that are now Islamic. Just last week I got into a weird discussion with a Coptic friend from church about why Arabic is not in and of itself good or bad (he is a native Arabic speaker, but openly claims to hate the language, because the Muslims brought it and robbed him of his birthright, i.e., Coptic. He is not the first Copt who I have known to speak like that). He wouldn't hear it until I reminded him that he reads the Bible in Arabic every day, and it is still the Bible.  Smiley

I once had a Syriac Orthodox friend from Canada whose family had migrated there from Iraq shortly after the rise of Saddam. They moved into an area with a lot of Arabs because that's the closest thing they had to a community at that time (the Baathist regime in Iraq had instituted compulsory Arabization of its non-Arab minorities, particularly harsh on the Assyrians and Syriacs since it meant they could no longer give their children names in their own language, nor teach their children their own language on any kind of official level; the same thing happened to Assyrians in Iran after the revolution in that country with regard to Farsi). Some years ago, my friend's brother had a son, and gave him an Arabic name, Tariq. Their mother was furious, as she had wanted him to keep his heritage in mind. She berated him quite openly for the decision, apparently screaming "That's not a Christian (~Syriac) name! And you can't even SAY it properly! Stupid!"

I was kind of shocked to hear that story from my friend, but I can't really say I blame her mother. There is no love lost between the non-Arab linguistic minorities of the Middle East and the Arabs.
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« Reply #593 on: May 12, 2012, 03:21:49 AM »

Just last week I got into a weird discussion with a Coptic friend from church about why Arabic is not in and of itself good or bad (he is a native Arabic speaker, but openly claims to hate the language, because the Muslims brought it and robbed him of his birthright, i.e., Coptic.

Arabs came and destroyed Coptic culture so Copts adopt English culture. Logical?
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« Reply #594 on: May 12, 2012, 03:38:46 AM »

Re-read what I wrote. One is not seen as a threat or a humiliation, the other is. What is "logical" is not my concern. It is not my place to critique my friends' feelings based on their alleged logical failings according to the internet.
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« Reply #595 on: May 12, 2012, 04:18:31 AM »

I that I am probably going to be flamed for this, but sometimes I really hope and fantasize over Europe taking over the entire Middle East so that at least then there will be more religious freedom and crackdown upon Islamic terrorists. It should have happened in the 1980s with all the political tension between the UN and Middle East but unfortunately it did not.
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« Reply #596 on: May 12, 2012, 06:15:08 AM »

And Arabs are, according to racialist theories and categories (which are BS, but I guess you have to have something to fill in on college admission forms and the census), white people.

Not Arabs. You're thinking of Persians.

Nope, I'm thinking of Arabs. Check out census forms sometime. Not only are Arabs counted as white, they are actually counted as white by their own request, though of course this is a political calculation, not an affirmation of reality. All racial matters are a political calculation on some level.

Not according to "racialist theories". Oh, wait you're talking about modern America and its BS PC race groups. I thought you meant actual race theories.
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« Reply #597 on: May 12, 2012, 08:30:23 AM »

Arabs came and destroyed Coptic culture so Copts adopt English culture. Logical?

Original Semitic/Coptic/Greek forms would seem like a much more logical choice, I hope it's a passing trend.
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« Reply #598 on: May 12, 2012, 08:32:10 AM »

I that I am probably going to be flamed for this, but sometimes I really hope and fantasize over Europe taking over the entire Middle East so that at least then there will be more religious freedom and crackdown upon Islamic terrorists. It should have happened in the 1980s with all the political tension between the UN and Middle East but unfortunately it did not.

Uh...James...it's been done (long before the 1980s), and it didn't work out like that at all. See: British in Iraq and Palestine, Italians in Libya, French in Lebanon, Syria, North Africa, etc. That's kind of why the Middle East is as it is, geo-politically speaking.
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« Reply #599 on: May 12, 2012, 08:43:26 AM »


George instead of Guirgis, Mary instead of Maryam, etc.

Yes, I understood that part but why an Earth? They perceive Anglo-American culture to be more Christian than Arab culture?

Not more Christian, just less Arab.  To many, Arab = Islam.
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« Reply #600 on: May 12, 2012, 08:54:48 AM »

Arabs came and destroyed Coptic culture so Copts adopt English culture. Logical?

Original Semitic/Coptic/Greek forms would seem like a much more logical choice, I hope it's a passing trend.

So, the particularly English/Indo-European forms of these names are bad and illogical, but the Semitic/Arabic and Greek/Indo-European forms are good and logical and authentic? Despite the part where Coptic is neither Greek/Indo-European nor Semitic/Arab? I just want to understand how this works...

Well, I guess I'd better tell Fr. Marcus today after liturgy today that he is using the wrong form of his name. He will be surprised to hear it, but it is best that he learn the real way now than continue in his error (the error of being named Marcus, of course), lest the authenticity police come and arrest him for crimes against his own heritage. police
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« Reply #601 on: May 12, 2012, 09:10:14 AM »

So, the particularly English/Indo-European forms of these names are bad and illogical, but the Semitic/Arabic and Greek/Indo-European forms are good and logical and authentic? Despite the part where Coptic is neither Greek/Indo-European nor Semitic/Arab? I just want to understand how this works...

I mean it makes more sense to either have the names in their Coptic form, or in the original Greek or Semitic forms (most Christian names coming from one of those two). I think that's fairly straight forward.
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« Reply #602 on: May 12, 2012, 09:23:55 AM »

Arabs came and destroyed Coptic culture so Copts adopt English culture. Logical?

Original Semitic/Coptic/Greek forms would seem like a much more logical choice, I hope it's a passing trend.

So, the particularly English/Indo-European forms of these names are bad and illogical, but the Semitic/Arabic and Greek/Indo-European forms are good and logical and authentic?

Adopting names from the other side of the Globe is the thing that bewilders me. I understand the aversion towards all things Arab but why to adopt names from compeltely different enviroment? It's like Americans having aversion to all things English and giving their children Chinese names instead of native ones.
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« Reply #603 on: May 12, 2012, 09:37:56 AM »

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I mean it makes more sense to either have the names in their Coptic form, or in the original Greek or Semitic forms (most Christian names coming from one of those two). I think that's fairly straight forward.

Yeah, I got that, but why? The Coptic bit makes sense since they are Copts (and you still find people named after specifically Egyptian saints like Mina, Abanoub, etc.), but the Greek or Arabic? Or do you mean by Semitic that they should all be adopting the Syriac forms of names, even though Copts are likewise not Syriacs?

By that logic, it seems strange that anyone in the English-speaking world would not be named good, pure English/Germanic names like Alfred or Edward. Or perhaps French names are acceptable for English-speakers as well, by analogy to the pervasive influence of Greek on Coptic. Hmm. Should I call myself Yirmiyahu to be true to the Semitic roots of my name, or Jérémie? Oh, I just can't decide! Mainly because they both strike me as equally unnecessary.

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Adopting names from the other side of the Globe is the thing that bewilders me. I understand the aversion towards all things Arab but why to adopt names from compeltely different enviroment? It's like Americans having aversion to all things English and giving their children Chinese names instead of native ones.

I agree, Alpo. All Americans should be required to give their children native American names like Tisquantum and Ssiquoya. Smiley
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« Reply #604 on: May 12, 2012, 02:42:25 PM »

From a Coptic point of view, the USA is the most powerful Christian country, so they love to imitate everything American. Itz's just the same as Egyptian Muslims do with Saudi Arabia.

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« Reply #605 on: May 12, 2012, 03:37:36 PM »

Arabs came and destroyed Coptic culture so Copts adopt English culture. Logical?

Original Semitic/Coptic/Greek forms would seem like a much more logical choice, I hope it's a passing trend.

So, the particularly English/Indo-European forms of these names are bad and illogical, but the Semitic/Arabic and Greek/Indo-European forms are good and logical and authentic?

Adopting names from the other side of the Globe is the thing that bewilders me. I understand the aversion towards all things Arab but why to adopt names from compeltely different enviroment? It's like Americans having aversion to all things English and giving their children Chinese names instead of native ones.

Heck , you wouldn't believe the names that come up these days in the USA for birth registration. Traditional Christian names are probably in the minority - not because of a massive demographic shift, but because of trends.
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« Reply #606 on: May 12, 2012, 06:22:01 PM »

Funnily enough, this subject came up on the way home from liturgy this afternoon. Me and two Coptic friends were talking about local Middle Eastern restaurants and I brought up a local restaurant that is run by Christians. My friend said "Yes, that one is run by a Jordanian man named 'Umar. The Jordanians aren't conservative like we (Copts) are about their names. We could never be named 'Umar...NEVER!" The reason, of course, is that this is a "Muslim" name. Growing up in a mixed Latino/Anglo community, I had always associated that name (or at least the variant Omar) with Latinos, who are generally not Muslims, but my Coptic friends insist that no Christian would be named that.

Except, apparently, Jordanians. laugh

(The Jordanian Catholics who attend our liturgy semi-regularly are a brother and sister pair named Lisa and Fady...)
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« Reply #607 on: May 13, 2012, 11:24:25 AM »

One of my Swedish relatives has named his daughter Mona. (Quite a common name in Sweden, for example there is Mona Sahlin, a politician.)

My Egyptian Catholic friend was surprised. He said: Isn't Mona a Muslim name? I told him Mona Lisa was Catholic, but he still found it odd.
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« Reply #608 on: May 13, 2012, 11:43:12 AM »

I told him Mona Lisa was Catholic, but he still found it odd.

Doesn't 'mona' mean 'lady'?
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« Reply #609 on: May 13, 2012, 01:14:51 PM »

Yeah, I don't think Mona is a Muslim name even in all the Arabic-speaking countries. In Lebanon there was a singer in the mid-1980s named Mona Geagea, the Geagea family being one of the famous modern Maronite Catholic political families in that country, originating in Bsharri (famous Maronite village). For instance, current leader of the mostly-Maronite right wing political party and former Christian militia the Lebanese Forces, Samir Geagea, is from this family.
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« Reply #610 on: May 13, 2012, 02:41:09 PM »

I told him Mona Lisa was Catholic, but he still found it odd.

Doesn't 'mona' mean 'lady'?
I think it's the feminine possessive in Italian i.e. "My"
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« Reply #611 on: May 13, 2012, 03:00:26 PM »

I thought you meant actual race theories.
I can't think of anyone credible who produced or furthered a race theory in 50 years.

Variation is variation. Ethnicity is ethnicity. Race in the physical heritage sense is pseudoscience.
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« Reply #612 on: May 13, 2012, 07:44:18 PM »

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I think it's the feminine possessive in Italian i.e. "My"

Mia is the feminine possessive in Italian. As in the exclamation Madonna, mia! (My Lady!) which refers to the Mother of God, the same as the Greek Panaghia mou!
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« Reply #613 on: May 13, 2012, 08:04:14 PM »

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I think it's the feminine possessive in Italian i.e. "My"

Mia is the feminine possessive in Italian. As in the exclamation Madonna, mia! (My Lady!) which refers to the Mother of God, the same as the Greek Panaghia mou!
Gotcha, I was thinking French Mon/ma and extrapolating.
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« Reply #614 on: May 17, 2012, 01:40:45 AM »

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« Reply #615 on: May 17, 2012, 03:15:34 AM »

Says that other forms of Christianity and religions are logically fallacious

Believes that Logic itself is a godless Latinization
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« Reply #616 on: May 17, 2012, 05:05:54 AM »

and again...
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« Reply #617 on: May 17, 2012, 07:01:08 AM »

and again...

I like the Monk!!!!!
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« Reply #618 on: May 17, 2012, 08:55:31 AM »

I told him Mona Lisa was Catholic, but he still found it odd.

Doesn't 'mona' mean 'lady'?

Municipal Offices of New York ... oh wait, that's Mony.
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« Reply #619 on: May 17, 2012, 08:57:40 AM »

What's the movie diablo 3?
Even better: Watches war movies/prays for the sould of the fictional characters killed.
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« Reply #620 on: May 17, 2012, 10:55:52 AM »

What's the movie diablo 3?
Even better: Watches war movies/prays for the sould of the fictional characters killed.
Diablo 3 is a video game.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diablo_3
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« Reply #621 on: May 17, 2012, 10:57:17 AM »

Diablo 3 is a new American English term for lonely girlfriends and wives  laugh

PP
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« Reply #622 on: May 18, 2012, 12:32:21 PM »

and again
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« Reply #623 on: May 18, 2012, 03:16:14 PM »

and again
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« Reply #624 on: May 19, 2012, 04:57:13 PM »

Not had a lot of time to follow stuff around here.

Clicked on Nick's tumblr Herman link:

http://hyperdoxherman.tumblr.com/

And saw this:



Literal LOL!

This is one of the best.

And the commentary below:

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You know what the “O” stands for, don’t you?
Zwingli.

Who came up with this?

Brilliant.
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« Reply #625 on: May 21, 2012, 11:16:52 AM »



this is me.
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Christian. Guitarist. Zymurgist. Librarian.
Taxiarches
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Scion of the McKeesport Becks.


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« Reply #626 on: May 21, 2012, 11:19:02 AM »



this is me.

I don't thinkt this has anything to do with being hyperdox but with being OCD or somesuch.
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"Hearing a nun's confession is like being stoned to death with popcorn." --Abp. Fulton Sheen
Timon
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« Reply #627 on: May 21, 2012, 11:21:14 AM »



this is me.

I don't thinkt this has anything to do with being hyperdox but with being OCD or somesuch.

yea lets go with that.  i mean, my corner looks nice and all, but theres going to be some work to do when I have to take it all down.  if I had it to do over again, i wouldve just set a few icons on a small table up against the wall. haha.
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Even if we have thousands of acts of great virtue to our credit, our confidence in being heard must be based on God's mercy and His love for men. Even if we stand at the very summit of virtue, it is by mercy that we shall be saved.

— Chrysostom

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ilyazhito
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« Reply #628 on: May 21, 2012, 12:46:45 PM »

A complete waste of energy and time for a simple tax. Builds a church, spends 3 months remodeling the cupola because it doesn't line up. This totally delays the consecration.
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Rufus
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Nafpliotis with sunglasses and a cigar.


« Reply #629 on: May 21, 2012, 01:32:10 PM »



this is me.

You're not alone.
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Tags: MEME Hyperdox cheval amusant memes 
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