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Author Topic: The Dividedness of The World  (Read 1359 times) Average Rating: 0
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TheCrossBarer
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« on: September 18, 2004, 02:02:35 AM »

I don't know why the world cannot get along. Other than ignorant rumors and outright lies, nobody gathers the concept or the truth behind the 3 major religions in the world.

Christianity was a follow-up to Judaism, as Christ himself was a Jew and taught not just about himself and the new covenant, but also of Moses and Elijah.

What most people dont want to listen to is that Muslims and Islams are almost the same faith as the Jews and Christians. The prophet Mohammad told how the angel Gabriel came to him and told him he would be a prophet of the Lord---like many who were before him.

Mohammad accepted Jews and Christians alike, saying that they like himself was revealed to the truth and awaited the same fate.

But Mohammad was not only a religious man but a politician of sorts and discussed to his followers that their homeland was corrupted by pagans and false gods, this leading to jihads or holy wars where Mohammad and his followers destroyed temples of idols.

The only thing that is amusing is that after Mohammad died he was made into an almost mythological figure and placed upon a higher pedestal than what he really was.

Mohammad has been portrayed as almost a demi-god, which that was not his calling---the Lord called him to be a prophet. And like Jesus' teachings, Mohammad's words from God were perversed and altered throughout time to suit everyone else' needs.

It is a shame that all three of these religions are doctrines of peace, but yet we all have inadvertantly or purposely warped those messages into doctrines of hate and war.

The Christians persecuted the Jews and had the Crusades to force people into Christainity---when Christ said that no man can force a man to believe in all truthfulness. The Jews were blamed for Christ' death, when in fact whether anyone likes it or not it was all of us who nailed him to the cross.

There's no peace between the Jews and Muslims because of different understandings and a history of war and arguments going back milleniums ago.

It is funny how nobody tries to see the good in people and misinterpret everything a person says or does. Christians say to the Muslims "Our God is bigger than Allah."

What a stupid and ironic statement when the word "Allah" in Muslim tounge means "God"!

Somewhere along the lines the Jews, the Christains and the Muslims are all right---and that line leads to God, but out of our own hatred and evil hearts we all have persecuted one another and dug the hole that we all are in now.

Christ spoke of unity, but there are nearly 38,000 denominations! It's not about doctrine and ceremonies, that's not what Christ was about---Christ was a simple man and far more simpler in his teachings and yet we've made them all so complicated!

We hate one another because everyone is different, but rarely do I ever see someone ever have true genuine concern over someone who they thought was in the wrong.

I was raised Baptist myself, but I have found no fault in the Lutherans, Methodists, Pentecostals etc. because we all are to be as one and as long as we have the Lord we all are alright in the end.

The main issues isnt over who's better than that church or what have you---it's about one thing. Saving others no matter what, and never giving up on saving another.

There are nearly 7 billion people on this earth and only 2 billion know Jesus Christ as their saviour---we've got some work to do.

The Lord is long suffering, and he will never be whole until we all are whole. The passion on the cross was where it begins and we have to help finish it.
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« Reply #1 on: September 18, 2004, 02:58:13 AM »

This is awfully "suspicious" for your first post that you chose to post such propaganda.

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don't know why the world cannot get along. Other than ignorant rumors and outright lies, nobody gathers the concept or the truth behind the 3 major religions in the world.

All other religions are false. They may have much "truths" to them, but the only true faith is that of Orthodoxy which has been preserved for 2000 years via Holy Scripture, Apostolic Tradition & dispensed by the Church government (The protectors of the faith who are the Bishops)

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What most people dont want to listen to is that Muslims and Islams are almost the same faith as the Jews and Christians. The prophet Mohammad told how the angel Gabriel came to him and told him he would be a prophet of the Lord---like many who were before him.

Obviously the angel Gabriel never came to Mohammad. He was just  like the other false prophets like Joseph Smith who barrowed heavily from judiasm & christianity and put his own twist to it. Thier is only One Lord, Jesus Christ himself.



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Mohammad accepted Jews and Christians alike, saying that they like himself was revealed to the truth and awaited the same fate.

That's some good spin. Would these be the same people Mahammad refers to as "the people of the book" in the Qu'ran who are only deserving of conversion or death???


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But Mohammad was not only a religious man but a politician of sorts and discussed to his followers that their homeland was corrupted by pagans and false gods, this leading to jihads or holy wars where Mohammad and his followers destroyed temples of idols.

Wait, I thought Mahammad was the Lord??? Now he's a politician?? Even more reasons not to trust him. They also destroyed more than just temples, they wiped out whole villages of people that disagreed with his new found faith. You left out that little tid bit.


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Mohammad has been portrayed as almost a demi-god, which that was not his calling---the Lord called him to be a prophet. And like Jesus' teachings, Mohammad's words from God were perversed and altered throughout time to suit everyone else' needs.

Yea, we can all see how much this has benefited the family of man. It sure has suited the Islamo fascist needs who are taking his teachings literally.



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It is funny how nobody tries to see the good in people and misinterpret everything a person says or does. Christians say to the Muslims "Our God is bigger than Allah."

He is much bigger......


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We hate one another because everyone is different, but rarely do I ever see someone ever have true genuine concern over someone who they thought was in the wrong.

Tell that to the muslims causing 17 of the 19 major world conflicts.
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« Reply #2 on: September 18, 2004, 01:46:47 PM »

What most people dont want to listen to is that Muslims and Islams are almost the same faith as the Jews and Christians. The prophet Mohammad told how the angel Gabriel came to him and told him he would be a prophet of the Lord---like many who were before him.

First off, there's a big difference between "almost", brother.  Secondly, Judaism and Christianity are not the same religion.  All three semitic faiths tie themselves in some way to Abraham, but anyone can say that they worship the True God, until their theology and praxis say otherwise.  Pharisaic/Rabbinic legalism is not the way, neither is Jihadism or the point and tally system in Islam.  Neither is the Lutheran doctrine of justification by faith alone.

Mohammad accepted Jews and Christians alike, saying that they like himself was revealed to the truth and awaited the same fate.

Muhammad killed the Jews who were in the way, and spared only the ones who caused him no problems.  The only Christians he knew were more than likely Nestorians, and if "The People of The Book" were supposed to be respected, I recommend you study the history of Islam more closely.  I think you might be surprised.  

Mohammad has been portrayed as almost a demi-god, which that was not his calling---the Lord called him to be a prophet. And like Jesus' teachings, Mohammad's words from God were perversed and altered throughout time to suit everyone else' needs.

Actually I differ in opinion on this as well.  Good Muslims do not revere Muhammed as a demi-god.  He's a very well-respected man, but that's it, he's still just a man.  Of course, the Ayatollah was just a man too, and just because you're not God doesn't mean people won't listen to you (especially if you claim to be THE prophet).  Muslims also believe that the Qur'an has not been altered whatsoever (which isn't hard to believe since it's not as old as the Bible and was fiercely preserved...that doesn't mean it's a superior book), and actually argue that one of Christianity's flaws is the alleged contamination of doctrine throughout history.  But I'll get to that soon enough.

The Christians persecuted the Jews and had the Crusades to force people into Christainity---when Christ said that no man can force a man to believe in all truthfulness. The Jews were blamed for Christ' death, when in fact whether anyone likes it or not it was all of us who nailed him to the cross.

The Christians persecuted the Jews, and the Jews persecuted the Christians, too (SEE Saul who became Paul, the Pharisees, etc).  The Crusades were about more than just forcing people into Christianity.  A lot of people like to blame the start of it on the Pope, but in all fairness, it was the Egyptian Caliphate that burned down the Church of The Resurrection in Jerusalem that lit the fuse.  You're right, we can't blame the Jews for Christ's death on The Cross.  It would be like blaming all Romans for killing Caesar because the senators who conspired and murdered him were Romans.  Chirst was killed by his peers (in accordance with The Scriptures), and His peers were Jewish (and so was He, and His Holy Mother, and most of the Holy Apostles, too).  Sometimes those Holy Covenants can really have repercussions  Wink

It is funny how nobody tries to see the good in people and misinterpret everything a person says or does. Christians say to the Muslims "Our God is bigger than Allah." What a stupid and ironic statement when the word "Allah" in Muslim tounge means "God"!

I'll double check, but I'm pretty sure that if I ask some of my Arab Christian professors, they'll say that their God is not the same as a Muslim's.

Somewhere along the lines the Jews, the Christains and the Muslims are all right

I hope that you're not Orthodox my friend, because this statement is unquestionably heretical, being something akin to either ecuminism or unitarianism.

Christ spoke of unity, but there are nearly 38,000 denominations!

38,000 Protestant denominations Wink

It's not about doctrine and ceremonies, that's not what Christ was about---Christ was a simple man and far more simpler in his teachings and yet we've made them all so complicated!

Christ was indeed a man.  And he is also (now and forever) The Living God.  And God is entitled to the best that his Royal Priesthood and His Church has to offer in terms of worship.

I was raised Baptist myself, but I have found no fault in the Lutherans, Methodists, Pentecostals etc. because we all are to be as one and as long as we have the Lord we all are alright in the end.

It would be hard to find fault in other Protestant denominations if you're Baptist in your upringing, since the doctrine is fairly similar throughout.  It'd also be pretty easy to see welcoming theological trends in Islam, since Protestantism and Islam are very similar in many respects (individual interpretation of the books, instant salvation...although in Islam works are important, hellfire and damnation in a very visual sense, a wrathful angry God, etc.), the absence of liturgical emphasis...

The Lord is long suffering, and he will never be whole until we all are whole.

The Orthodox Church is One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic, friend.  Come and see.  Smiley






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« Reply #3 on: September 18, 2004, 01:48:21 PM »

Oh, and Nacho, I already know that your'e pretty Neo-Conservative, with all of the Michael Savage quotes and the verbatim Fox media spin.  I have a question though, since we're talking about religion, etc.  What's your positon on Israel and Palestine?
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« Reply #4 on: September 18, 2004, 03:03:35 PM »

I dont know about you but I cant find any evidence of Islam's origin going back to Abraham.  I dont see the connection.  I know that Islam claims that Ishmael, first born of Abraham, is the link in the chain but I havent read anything linking Ishmael with Muhammed.  IMHO, Muhammed started this religion based on a combination of Jewish, Christian and bedouin beliefs.  

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« Reply #5 on: September 18, 2004, 03:07:19 PM »

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Oh, and Nacho, I already know that your'e pretty Neo-Conservative, with all of the Michael Savage quotes and the verbatim Fox media spin.  I have a question though, since we're talking about religion, etc.  What's your positon on Israel and Palestine?

I do support Israell protecting itself from the jihadist thugs within reasonable means. It's amazing to me how much the arab world hates the jews & want to see the demise of Israel.  If I had to choose sides, it would be israel in the current situation.  I wouldn't say I'm a huge supporter of Israel because I'm aware they treat christians like crap also which is very unfortunate. My opinion could change because I'm only basing my opinion from the media & what I have read.  I haven't heard too much of the palestinian side of things, so I try to remain somwhat open minded about what's going on over there. I doubt it will get better, but I could be wrong.

I'm also not really a neo-conservative. My beleifs fall in line more with the old school conservatives like Regean & Pat Buchanan. I disagree with many policies of the current administration. I beleive Bush came in office being a true conservative, but as Buchanan has said in his new book that the neo - conservatives around him hijacked the presidency by giving him lots of bad policy advice. It's unfortuante we don't have too many options in this country because that "other" party is completely off the scale & nuts. The only reason why I'm still a big supporter of the current administration is due to the fact that  the next 4 supreme court justices could be chosen & if that "other" guy wins we could have four monsters  who will terroize this country for years to come. The supreme court wil be ruled with an iron fist by Ruth Bader Ginsburg who I despise because she wants to tear everything down that I love about this country. Anyways, I'm sorry I couldn't get much more specific, there is a ban on political discussion here.
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« Reply #6 on: September 18, 2004, 10:53:41 PM »

Come on, guys & gals. TheCrossBarer (twistedfreak14@hotmail.com) is just trolling some moral equivalency milarkey to get a bite. In our lifetime someone invented a church on a wager (L. Ron Hubbard) and people bought into his joke; "the prophet" M wasn't much better.
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« Reply #7 on: September 19, 2004, 01:40:36 AM »

I know what you mean about the politics, Nacho (not the ban, which is probably good for a religious board, but the partisan nonsense that goes on in Washington).  I'm thoroughly disappointed in the candidates in the major parties, but I can't find anyone else to stick with.  I looked up the Constitution Party, thinking it'd be pretty good, but some of the stuff, like you said was a little to far off for my taste.  Anyway, I won't get politics going any further, lest I tempt the monitor.  Thanks for the insight, though.  Cheers.

PS  Anyone who's following this thread, if you happen to read The Complete Idiot's Guide to Understanding Islam, be prepared.  It's basically a sales pitch.  You don't get much of an idea of the negative side until the end of the book, when the author tries to justify the Iran hostage crisis and a few other absolutely wacky things.  It is a good book for understanding a few key things, though, like how
Muslims see Christians, etc.
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« Reply #8 on: September 19, 2004, 03:45:36 PM »

Crossbarer:
What in the world are you talking about? FIrst, you call Muhammad, a prophet and then you want everyone to be saved.[that is to acheive salvation]  
Please note that this an Orthodox [not orthodox] Christians forum. These guys don't have flexible beliefs like protestants or others. Although they'd be even better if they accepted the Pope and Catholicism.
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« Reply #9 on: September 19, 2004, 06:34:30 PM »

The original poster claims he cannot understand why the world's population does not get along, and then brings in Judaism, Christianity and Islam as some sort of Abrahamic succession. Accepting s/he then relates to scripture and has some experience of people the answer should be glaringly obvious. Man is not perfect. In Genesis we see how one brother fell on another and killed him. The world's population has grown in numbers, technology, appetites but lost much in terms of the restraint faith may bring. Men and women are not perfect!

A serious study of these three 'faiths' and their various sub-groups would reinforce all I written. Communism is a modern 'closed' belief system. One of their number harangued me one day until I asked a question. How many communist parties were there in his country? Then I started to enumerate them and the time over which they had appeared, 70 years at that time.

Orthodox Christianity as another poster has written is very different from Judaism and Islam. We do not see our faith as a Faith, but Truth. A precious pearl to be treasured, lived with faith and struggle; and passed on whole.  In this we differ from Romans, because as another has written you can be a Catholic (Orthodox) but not a Papist but you cannot be a Papist and Catholic. Sadly and increasingly they have followed the teaching of a series of Popes and become as salt which has lost its flavour.
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« Reply #10 on: September 19, 2004, 08:44:00 PM »

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he will never be whole until we all are whole

Excuse me, but what a load of horses**t.  God the Father, Son and Holy Spirit is Whole and Complete - Omniscient, Omnipresent, Immutable and has no need of us.  We are only creatures, whether whole or in part. The Holy Trinity is dependent upon us for nothing, absolutely nothing.
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« Reply #11 on: September 23, 2004, 10:41:12 PM »

CatholicEagle,

There is a ban on proselytism so your little jibe about the Pope is not really kosher--but I'll let it slide since you said it in the same sentence as sticking up for us Smiley

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