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Timon
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« Reply #45 on: January 29, 2013, 10:01:25 PM »

I still struggle with fasting.  I guess im probably not alone either.  The longer fasting seasons arent really a problem.  I usually dont have trouble getting into a long term mindset like you need for Lent and Nativity fasts.  The harder ones for me are the weekly Wed and Fri fasts.  Its hard to keep these fasts when none of your friends or family are Orthodox.  Im not making an excuse... just pointing out that I am weak and still struggle in these areas. 
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« Reply #46 on: January 29, 2013, 10:02:14 PM »

Ohhh... and unfortunately, I dont have the best prayer life either.  Orthodoxy has helped, but I still struggle.
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« Reply #47 on: January 29, 2013, 10:34:04 PM »

A few tips from my favorite spiritual writer and elder Fr. Ilarion Argatu:
On Wed.you generally fast for for troubles like legal troubles, unjust accusations at home or work.
On Fri. fasting is for magic spells,enemies, curses and the forgiveness of sins. For the dead you give the name list to three monasteries, or in cases where the deceased had sinned beyond average, to seven to be payed for at daily liturgies for a year.
You should also know that on Wed. you light seven candles, whereas on Fri. nine are to be lit: three for forgiveness of sins, three for curses and spells and three for your enemies, known and unknown, seen and unseen.
If you are married you will not sleep in the same bed as your spouse when you fast like this, even if you do not come together that night-that before God is an abomination-for the man's body is weaker and still lusts for the woman and so you'll forfeit the benefit of fasting.
http://dindragoste.unica.ro/rugaciuni/rugaciune-9247367.php
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« Reply #48 on: January 30, 2013, 12:13:07 AM »

A few tips from my favorite spiritual writer and elder Fr. Ilarion Argatu:
On Wed.you generally fast for for troubles like legal troubles, unjust accusations at home or work.
On Fri. fasting is for magic spells,enemies, curses and the forgiveness of sins. For the dead you give the name list to three monasteries, or in cases where the deceased had sinned beyond average, to seven to be payed for at daily liturgies for a year.
You should also know that on Wed. you light seven candles, whereas on Fri. nine are to be lit: three for forgiveness of sins, three for curses and spells and three for your enemies, known and unknown, seen and unseen.
If you are married you will not sleep in the same bed as your spouse when you fast like this, even if you do not come together that night-that before God is an abomination-for the man's body is weaker and still lusts for the woman and so you'll forfeit the benefit of fasting.
http://dindragoste.unica.ro/rugaciuni/rugaciune-9247367.php

Hey, if you're a pious lady with little occupation but church-going, you've got to keep your devotional life in good order, right?

By the way, those candles are supposed to protect you from evil people's spells and curses, not to put spells on them. Even if pious ladies often misunderstand.

If you go to see a (spiritual) doctor and he doesn't at least prescribe a recipe, you'll be under the impression that the whole visit was pointless. People need to be told what to do. The more details, the better. Our Lord himself resorted to things like mud and spittle in some cases.

Holy water, incense, tons of prescribed prayer, long services in almost incomprehensible language, lighting candles and so on clearly have an anxiolytic, benefic effect for people who are in trouble. At the very least, it gives them something to do and some hope, so as not to get stuck/overwhelmed by their problems and feel helpless. Moreover, it's a way of engaging and stimulating one's faith, which alone can do wonders.     

I think everybody has their beliefs and rituals, some more rational, others verging on superstition. Suppressing them might not be such a good idea, once one gets into trouble and needs to cope with depression or other psychological illnesses. This is why traditional societies are better at dealing with these issues and can do without psychotropic drugs, expensive therapists and all the psychobabble. Babushkas and yiayias can cure just about anything - trust'em!     
« Last Edit: January 30, 2013, 12:26:34 AM by Romaios » Logged
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« Reply #49 on: January 30, 2013, 12:26:20 AM »

I did an experiment for a week that someone suggested I should do during the fasting seasons, but since it wasn't time to fast I went ahead and tried it anyway.

What seemed to work is strictly fast right off the bat, no slowly easing into a stricter fast as the Lenten or Nativity fast goes on. It's better to make it harder at first because it will get easier later on.

But it actually worked. My appetite has actually slowed down quite a bit, eventhough I'm not strictly fasting at the moment. I don't eat as much as I used to and don't eat a lot of garbage either.
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« Reply #50 on: January 30, 2013, 12:38:48 AM »

A few tips from my favorite spiritual writer and elder Fr. Ilarion Argatu:
On Wed.you generally fast for for troubles like legal troubles, unjust accusations at home or work.
On Fri. fasting is for magic spells,enemies, curses and the forgiveness of sins. For the dead you give the name list to three monasteries, or in cases where the deceased had sinned beyond average, to seven to be payed for at daily liturgies for a year.
You should also know that on Wed. you light seven candles, whereas on Fri. nine are to be lit: three for forgiveness of sins, three for curses and spells and three for your enemies, known and unknown, seen and unseen.
If you are married you will not sleep in the same bed as your spouse when you fast like this, even if you do not come together that night-that before God is an abomination-for the man's body is weaker and still lusts for the woman and so you'll forfeit the benefit of fasting.
http://dindragoste.unica.ro/rugaciuni/rugaciune-9247367.php

Hey, if you're a pious lady with little occupation but church-going, you've got to keep your devotional life in good order, right?

By the way, those candles are supposed to protect you from evil people's spells and curses, not to put spells on them. Even if pious ladies often misunderstand.

If you go to see a (spiritual) doctor and he doesn't at least prescribe a recipe, you'll be under the impression that the whole visit was pointless. People need to be told what to do. The more details, the better. Our Lord himself resorted to things like mud and spittle in some cases.

Holy water, incense, tons of prescribed prayer, long services in almost incomprehensible language, lighting candles and so on clearly have an anxiolytic, benefic effect for people who are in trouble. At the very least, it gives them something to do and some hope, so as not to get stuck/overwhelmed by their problems and feel helpless. Moreover, it's a way of engaging and stimulating one's faith, which alone can do wonders.    

I think everybody has their beliefs and rituals, some more rational, others verging on superstition. Suppressing them might not be such a good idea, once one gets into trouble and needs to cope with depression or other psychological illnesses. This is why traditional societies are better at dealing with these issues and can do without psychotropic drugs, expensive therapists and all the psychobabble. Babushkas and yiayias can cure just about anything - trust'em!    
I never ever hinted at suppressing these things. If anything, this stuff is in a way more human/humane than much more serious theology. Even if i can't say I believe fr. Argatu's many detailed tips and cues on pretty much everything, I enjoy reading them and, where i to see someone practice them, I wouldn't say a word against it.
I still have to find out why, say, Conciliar Press do see it fit to publish Mrs Matthew-Green's musings on just about everything but never, to my knowledge, this type of spiritual literature. And that's not for its rarity in the orthodox world.
« Last Edit: January 30, 2013, 12:40:50 AM by augustin717 » Logged
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« Reply #51 on: January 30, 2013, 12:44:39 AM »

When I feel like it, I'll probably translate Fr. ilarion's tips on how to recognize a witch/wizard:
http://www.parinteleilarionargatu.ro/subpagini/95/Raspunsuri-duhovnicesti--Vraji-vrajitorie/
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« Reply #52 on: January 30, 2013, 12:57:45 AM »

When I feel like it, I'll probably translate Fr. ilarion's tips on how to recognize a witch/wizard:
http://www.parinteleilarionargatu.ro/subpagini/95/Raspunsuri-duhovnicesti--Vraji-vrajitorie/
Google translate offers this insight:

"If you sprinkle it with holy water, witch hand mattress shoulder"
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« Reply #53 on: January 30, 2013, 01:02:39 AM »

When I feel like it, I'll probably translate Fr. ilarion's tips on how to recognize a witch/wizard:
http://www.parinteleilarionargatu.ro/subpagini/95/Raspunsuri-duhovnicesti--Vraji-vrajitorie/
Google translate offers this insight:

"If you sprinkle it with holy water, witch hand mattress shoulder"

Fr. Argatu says that, ”if you sprinkle her with holy water, the witch's arm twitches from the shoulder.”

Twitches/jumps = „saltă”; mattress = „saltea”. 
« Last Edit: January 30, 2013, 01:26:25 AM by Romaios » Logged
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« Reply #54 on: January 30, 2013, 05:42:37 PM »

i have skim-read it (no time to translate for you, sorry) and there are some useful tips, but it's easy with this approach to start to see demons under every stone and to focus on the failings of others instead of ourselves.
rather than focusing on where we may see evil works, it is better for each of us to work hard on our spiritual lives with prayer and fasting, and with Bible study and attending church and asking questions. this way we are closer to God, and if He wants us to know about the spiritual problems (demon possesion, sin etc.) of those around us, then He will reveal it clearly to us.

it's always better to focus on my own sins, than those of my brothers.
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« Reply #55 on: January 30, 2013, 06:12:46 PM »

If you are married you will not sleep in the same bed as your spouse when you fast like this, even if you do not come together that night-that before God is an abomination-for the man's body is weaker and still lusts for the woman and so you'll forfeit the benefit of fasting.

 Huh So what if you only have one bed? Where is the poor husband* supposed to sleep, on the floor?

(*because you know, it would be the husband, NOT the wife!  Grin )
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« Reply #56 on: January 30, 2013, 06:15:35 PM »

If you are married you will not sleep in the same bed as your spouse when you fast like this, even if you do not come together that night-that before God is an abomination-for the man's body is weaker and still lusts for the woman and so you'll forfeit the benefit of fasting.

 Huh So what if you only have one bed? Where is the poor husband* supposed to sleep, on the floor?

(*because you know, it would be the husband, NOT the wife!  Grin )

I've been sleeping on the floor for about a month*, and it hasn't been that bad  angel


*Ok, technically I have a comforter and sleeping bag underneath me, but it's still pretty hard.
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« Reply #57 on: January 30, 2013, 06:29:37 PM »

If you are married you will not sleep in the same bed as your spouse when you fast like this, even if you do not come together that night-that before God is an abomination-for the man's body is weaker and still lusts for the woman and so you'll forfeit the benefit of fasting.

 Huh So what if you only have one bed? Where is the poor husband* supposed to sleep, on the floor?

(*because you know, it would be the husband, NOT the wife!  Grin )

I've been sleeping on the floor for about a month*, and it hasn't been that bad  angel


*Ok, technically I have a comforter and sleeping bag underneath me, but it's still pretty hard.
I slept on the floor a whole winter pretty much. Not for the pious reasons the good father mentions, though. Actually life wasn't free of abominations at that time IIRC.
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« Reply #58 on: January 30, 2013, 07:02:28 PM »

If you are married you will not sleep in the same bed as your spouse when you fast like this, even if you do not come together that night-that before God is an abomination-for the man's body is weaker and still lusts for the woman and so you'll forfeit the benefit of fasting.
http://dindragoste.unica.ro/rugaciuni/rugaciune-9247367.php

As a married man with a full time job and 2 little kids, I can guarantee that there isn't lust there every night.  Most nights you just want to sleep.  You always hear jokes about couples losing intimacy after they get married.  Well, its true.  Not that we'd want to, but especially if you have a young family, that takes a lot out from both of you after going through a full day of work and then attending to the kids at night until they go to sleep.  By the time your kids go to sleep that is also the only thing on your mind, go to sleep.  Heck, personal hygiene has taken a back seat for me as well.  Not only in the evening, I can't count the number of times I get to work and forgot to comb my hair or put moisturizer on my face (I have serious dry skin issues on my face).
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« Reply #59 on: January 30, 2013, 07:05:11 PM »

Just out of curiosity, was Fr. Ilarion Argatu married?
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« Reply #60 on: January 30, 2013, 07:16:21 PM »

If you are married you will not sleep in the same bed as your spouse when you fast like this, even if you do not come together that night-that before God is an abomination-for the man's body is weaker and still lusts for the woman and so you'll forfeit the benefit of fasting.
http://dindragoste.unica.ro/rugaciuni/rugaciune-9247367.php

As a married man with a full time job and 2 little kids, I can guarantee that there isn't lust there every night.  Most nights you just want to sleep.  You always hear jokes about couples losing intimacy after they get married.  Well, its true.  Not that we'd want to, but especially if you have a young family, that takes a lot out from both of you after going through a full day of work and then attending to the kids at night until they go to sleep.  By the time your kids go to sleep that is also the only thing on your mind, go to sleep.  Heck, personal hygiene has taken a back seat for me as well.  Not only in the evening, I can't count the number of times I get to work and forgot to comb my hair or put moisturizer on my face (I have serious dry skin issues on my face).
I agree with you. I haven't been married but have enough experience to know that lust isn't always there. Fr. Ilarion though was a monk, although only after his wife died. Probably pretty early .
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« Reply #61 on: January 30, 2013, 07:30:53 PM »

"I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin."
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« Reply #62 on: January 30, 2013, 07:52:11 PM »

If you are married you will not sleep in the same bed as your spouse when you fast like this, even if you do not come together that night-that before God is an abomination-for the man's body is weaker and still lusts for the woman and so you'll forfeit the benefit of fasting.
http://dindragoste.unica.ro/rugaciuni/rugaciune-9247367.php

As a married man with a full time job and 2 little kids, I can guarantee that there isn't lust there every night.  Most nights you just want to sleep.  You always hear jokes about couples losing intimacy after they get married.  Well, its true.  Not that we'd want to, but especially if you have a young family, that takes a lot out from both of you after going through a full day of work and then attending to the kids at night until they go to sleep.  By the time your kids go to sleep that is also the only thing on your mind, go to sleep.  Heck, personal hygiene has taken a back seat for me as well.  Not only in the evening, I can't count the number of times I get to work and forgot to comb my hair or put moisturizer on my face (I have serious dry skin issues on my face).
I agree with you. I haven't been married but have enough experience to know that lust isn't always there. Fr. Ilarion though was a monk, although only after his wife died. Probably pretty early .

At least for newlyweds, I agree with him.  But for couples who've been married for years and with kids, I doubt that lust is always there.  At least in my case I can say that it is not.
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« Reply #63 on: January 31, 2013, 06:18:54 AM »

When I feel like it, I'll probably translate Fr. ilarion's tips on how to recognize a witch/wizard:
http://www.parinteleilarionargatu.ro/subpagini/95/Raspunsuri-duhovnicesti--Vraji-vrajitorie/
Google translate offers this insight:

"If you sprinkle it with holy water, witch hand mattress shoulder"


Fr. Argatu says that, ”if you sprinkle her with holy water, the witch's arm twitches from the shoulder.”

Twitches/jumps = „saltă”; mattress = „saltea”. 


By Google translate standards that's actually not that bad - I've actually seen it translate charge (as in a financial charge) as gratuit, which (meaning free of charge) is pretty much the exact opposite. Having said that people still seem to trust it for some reason. I've genuinely seen a bug raised by a software tester that said 'the Chinese translations don't make sense'. He was putting them through Google translate and comparing with the English version!

James
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