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Author Topic: Blessings on this 81st Anniversary of the Coronation of HIM Haile Selassie I  (Read 16928 times) Average Rating: 0
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HabteSelassie
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« on: November 02, 2011, 04:03:19 PM »

Greetings in that Divine and Most Precious Name of Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ!

Today marks the 81st anniversary of the Coronation of His Imperial Majesty, Emperor Haile Selassie I, of Ethiopia, King of Kings, Lord of Lords, Conquering Lion of the Tribe of Judah, Elect of God, Light of This World, King of Zion, King of Israel, crowned November 2, 1930.

On this day, the Almighty God confirmed the sure loyalties of the promises of King David, affirming the perpetuity of the Davidic Monarchy among human beings.  The Israel of God, that is the Church, shall never be short a king or a prophet!

Haile Selassie I demonstrates the effective power of the Almighty God on earth, through men.

Three Cheers for the Emperor! Selassie I Jah! Selassie I Jah! Selassie I Jah! Rastafari!
stay blessed,
habte selassie
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« Reply #1 on: November 02, 2011, 04:39:07 PM »

Where is the perpetual earthly Davidic monarchy now?
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« Reply #2 on: November 02, 2011, 04:52:59 PM »

Greetings in that Divine and Most Precious Name of Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ!

Where is the perpetual earthly Davidic monarchy now?

shh.. its a secret not best for the internet, but if you search it up a bit you just might find it Wink

How could I forgot HIM best title, "Defender of the Orthodox Faith"
Defender of the Faith  
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"Venerable and Holy Fathers, in listening to the profound spiritual message conveyed by your closing addresses, and appreciating the happy outcome of your sustained efforts, Our heart has been touched by profound gladness. It should therefore be clear to the whole world from the result of your work that Your Holinesses have been guided and inspired by the Holy Spirit to accomplish your task in love and unity.

"The great common tasks accomplished by the Conference in unison bestow on the true faith and true order of the Oriental Orthodox Church the admiration of the whole world.

"As Solomon says, physical distance cannot be a barrier to love,. Likewise, the distances among your respective countries have been abolished by the proximity of your hearts. You have thus been able to speak a single tongue and think with a single mind. We thank Almighty God for enabling Us to witness the realization of Our dream in the successful outcome of this historic Conference.

"We are therefore happy to express to you Our readiness, fortified by the results of this Conference, to invite you and the Eastern Orthodox Churches, and also other churches at a later date. We ardently hope that we shall meet once again in the not too distant future.

"As We stated at the inauguration of this Conference, to meet together, to take council with one another, and to act in mutual cooperation, has proved a most fruitful method both in the secular and spiritual fields. Henceforth the way is open for you to follow this fruitful path, and to this end, Our help and assistance will always be forthcoming, since We support your efforts and ideas out of an unshakable conviction that it is Our spiritual duty to do so.

"We are gratified in particular to note that the work of this Conference has been concerned purely with religious spiritual matters free from extraneous political considerations. This is only fitting and proper, for the church, as a symbol of peace, must follow the path of peace in all parts of the world. In this connection We are glad to note that your evangelistic mission in the world has received due emphasis in your deliberations, together with the recognition of the Christian duty to pray for the rights of man and the peace of the world. For world peace can only be made abiding by the Grace of God, through the prayers of the Holy Fathers. the truth of this cardinal fact is evident to all mankind.

"We ardently hope that Almighty God shall bless the implementation of our important resolutions and decisions, just as He has made possible the successful convening and conclusion of this historic Conference.

"Holy Fathers, We have welcomed the title you have given Us, Defender of the Faith, with great honor, May almighty God grace your name. May God welcome your work. We have received this title given Us by you Holy Fathers, with religious reverence. May your prayers help Us in Our effort to fulfill the task entrusted to Us."
January 21st 1965


Besides of which, even if folks are of the persuasion that HIM is dead and buried, regardless it is custom to revere Christian monarchs in perpetuity in the same was as we still called US presidents "Mr. President" long after their terms are up, even after they've passed.  If duppy US politricksters deserve such honors, surely the King Of Kings and Defender of the Orthodox Faith deserves to be honored in our memory, and I know there are Russians here who know what I am talking about.

stay blessed,
habte selassie
« Last Edit: November 02, 2011, 04:53:23 PM by HabteSelassie » Logged

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« Reply #3 on: November 02, 2011, 04:57:14 PM »

Quote
King of Kings, Lord of Lords, Conquering Lion of the Tribe of Judah

Ummm...sorry for being a meanie but I thought that belonged to:




alone.


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« Reply #4 on: November 02, 2011, 05:04:11 PM »

i acknowledge one King of Kings, and He is not an earthly one.
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« Reply #5 on: November 02, 2011, 05:20:15 PM »

Greetings in that Divine and Most Precious Name of Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ!

Could y'all kindly go "poop" on someone elses' parade please?

In Ethiopian history, culture, law, and Church, the Emperors are the

King of Kings  because there are lesser kings in Ethiopian polity who reign under the Emperor's Divine sovereignty,

Lord of Lords because there are lesser lords in Ethiopian polity who reign under the Emperor's Divine sovereignty,

Conquering Lion of the Tribe of Judah because, as Davidic monarchs of King Solomon's family line, the Ethiopian Emperors have always carried this title as their lawful inheritance, in fact we in the Ethiopian Church actually don't think of this title as uniquely Christ's, in fact quite the opposite, it is because this is the earthly title for Davidic monarchs, giving Christ this same title is to affirm His Humanity as a descendant of King David.

Elect of God because the Emperors are the Anointed Kings chosen by God to reign in His power and authority on the earth as Christian sovereigns.

Light of this World is a temporary title also applied to the Emperors because they are Godly ordained, like Priests, to be the True Light pointing to Christ, just as the Moon reflects the Son and in God's Grace firmly guide the people towards the Will of God.


King of Zion because they are the lawful sovereigns over the Ark of the Covenant, Holy Zion.

King of Israel because they are the lawful sovereigns over the royal family and lineage of Israel, transplanted physically into Ethiopia, and further because the Emperors are the Defenders of the Church on earth in God's Grace, and the Church is of course as Apostle Paul explains the Israel of God.

Defender of the Faith because the Oriental Orthodox world awards this Title at various times to many Ethiopian Emperors, and it has been an HONOR and PRIVILEGE of the Ethiopian Emperors to be granted such responsibility by the Oriental Orthodox Fathers.

If y'all misunderstand the historicity of the very honorific and venerable titles and responsibilities of the Ethiopian Emperors that is fine and good, but please don't be so crass and insensitive.  Its like all our grandmothers told us, "If you aint got nothing nice to say, don't say nothing at all." Wink

stay blessed,
habte selassie
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« Reply #6 on: November 02, 2011, 05:41:13 PM »

Byzantine emperors also called themselves "King of Kings," no?
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« Reply #7 on: November 02, 2011, 05:56:49 PM »

Greetings in that Divine and Most Precious Name of Our Lord and Savior JEsus Christ!
Byzantine emperors also called themselves "King of Kings," no?

Exactly, Emperor Justinian, King of Kings of Rome, and Emperor Kaleb, King of Kings of Axum, met in their time to divide the realms of the world between them as mutual sovereigns.  The Ethiopians for a time respected the Byzantine monarchy as also being Solomonic, but as lesser sons or younger brothers, but as royal family all the same.  This is of course attested both in the epic meta-narrative the Kebra Negast and also many instances of historical interaction between the Ethiopian sovereigns and the Byzantines/Romans, from the 4th century up until 16th century with the fall of Constantinople.

 It is from that time on that Ethiopian Emperors have embraced the title Defender of the Faith and also considered themselves the remaining, lawful, Davidic King of Kings since their lesser brother the Byzantine/Romans had seemed to pass away from the scene.  Today, we see the monarchy in a period of transition, but the royal family remains active and in-tact, and this is really just a brief hiccup in the scheme of a two-thousand plus year dynasty which has had several hiccups in the past.  I for one, fully assert that God can and will fully restore the Davidic sovereigns in Ethiopia, and if He doesn't, I would superstitiously come to expect the Second Coming, as it would be too long a gap between King of Kings on the Throne.  Right now, we are almost two generations removed, but there are still those alive and well who served under HIM Haile Selassie, and so we can still think of it as only a pause, and restoration is indeed an option, and one which Ethiopia (and it would seem lately Egypt and Sudan) would greatly benefit from by God's Grace!

stay blessed,
habte selassie
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« Reply #8 on: November 02, 2011, 05:58:06 PM »

Byzantine emperors also called themselves "King of Kings," no?

Yes, let's not lose sight of the fact!
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« Reply #9 on: November 02, 2011, 06:29:33 PM »

Can anyone recommend a good biography? I have always wanted to read one but have had trouble finding things about him in the local library. Maybe I can order one. Thanks.
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« Reply #10 on: November 03, 2011, 01:43:21 AM »

L

A

R

P

...a smooth Ge'ezerator Ge'ezerating correctly.
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« Reply #11 on: November 03, 2011, 09:36:19 AM »

Byzantine emperors also called themselves "King of Kings," no?
I dont agree with anyone using that title other than the One who truly deserves it. The Lord Jesus Christ.

Please forgive me, I was not trying to attack the Ethiopians or anything. I was just a little taken aback by the titles given to this man.

Although I still find it the height of hubris to accept such titles, now that its been explained, I've learned something and I'll bow out.

PP
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« Reply #12 on: November 04, 2011, 03:18:45 PM »

Can anyone recommend a good biography? I have always wanted to read one but have had trouble finding things about him in the local library. Maybe I can order one. Thanks.

Same here.
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« Reply #13 on: November 04, 2011, 03:23:57 PM »

This video comes from one of the sticky threads above, but I think it's worth posting here. I love it!

http://www.diretube.com/haile-selassie/speaking-in-his-garden-david-will-still-beat-goliath-video_9cd589a73.html


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« Reply #14 on: November 06, 2011, 08:58:27 AM »

Here is an interesting stuff:

http://dubroom.org/rastafari/ncvlyundoi8ty/him_canada_1967.mp3

This is an extract from a radio program of 1967, named "Project 67: The Conquering Lion of Judah - A Profile Study Of His Imperial Majesty".

Around the middle of the audio, it speaks about H.I.M.'s coronation. And in it, it is said that a number of Coptic (Egyptian) deacons have sung, with palm branches in their hands, during his coronation's ceremony: "Hosanna, Blessed be the King of Israel, Blessed is He who cometh in the Name of the Lord."
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« Reply #15 on: November 06, 2011, 09:28:42 AM »

Is this veneration of Haile Selassie just a rastafari thing or is he respected also among regular Ethiopians?
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« Reply #16 on: November 06, 2011, 02:45:45 PM »

Is this veneration of Haile Selassie just a rastafari thing or is he respected also among regular Ethiopians?

The personality of H.I.M. Haile Selassie I is controversed among the Ethiopians. You can have different reactions, depending on the person with whom you are discussing. I feel in general their view on H.I.M. is "bittersweet" you see. "Haile Selassie the good and the bad" some say.. But you also have those who consider him to be very very great, and on the other hand those who despise him considering him to be an evil man. Really controversial.

There were so many propagandas against H.I.M. and his government and the royal family.. And personally I must say that some Ethiopians are very ignorant about H.I.M., and just believe and repeat the distortions, the lies or half-truths they hear around them.

Here is a documentary on His Majesty from a good perspective. Watch it. And in part 2, from 00:22 to 00:28, you can hear a Priest saying H.I.M. is angelic.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pRhlfNNH47U (Part 1)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sQ_kam0hYe0&feature=related (Part 2)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_osQ25naxO0&feature=related (Part 3)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mQ8G9DVj2vA&feature=related (Part 4)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rdpDCd73DqM&feature=related (Part 5)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sDCx4anpBN0&feature=related (Part 6)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ISrizOInwhM&feature=related (Part 7)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=82EjNs0o3L8&feature=related (Part 8 )

And please, Be aware that the audio program in the previous post is not a Rastafarian thing, but was made by non-Rastafarians, by Canadian journalists. But the link of this audio program is on the website of a Rastafarian, but a Rastafarian who does not adore/worship His Majesty.
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Mo'a Ambessa ze imnegede Yehuda !
The Lion of the tribe of Judah has conquered !
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« Reply #17 on: November 06, 2011, 03:53:49 PM »

Here is an interesting stuff:

http://dubroom.org/rastafari/ncvlyundoi8ty/him_canada_1967.mp3

This is an extract from a radio program of 1967, named "Project 67: The Conquering Lion of Judah - A Profile Study Of His Imperial Majesty".

Around the middle of the audio, it speaks about H.I.M.'s coronation. And in it, it is said that a number of Coptic (Egyptian) deacons have sung, with palm branches in their hands, during his coronation's ceremony: "Hosanna, Blessed be the King of Israel, Blessed is He who cometh in the Name of the Lord."


It's customary to sing this hymn when the Coptic Pope also comes in the Church.  I suppose the deacons extended the same to the Ethiopian emperor.
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« Reply #18 on: November 06, 2011, 06:41:07 PM »

Here is an interesting stuff:

http://dubroom.org/rastafari/ncvlyundoi8ty/him_canada_1967.mp3

This is an extract from a radio program of 1967, named "Project 67: The Conquering Lion of Judah - A Profile Study Of His Imperial Majesty".

Around the middle of the audio, it speaks about H.I.M.'s coronation. And in it, it is said that a number of Coptic (Egyptian) deacons have sung, with palm branches in their hands, during his coronation's ceremony: "Hosanna, Blessed be the King of Israel, Blessed is He who cometh in the Name of the Lord."


It's customary to sing this hymn when the Coptic Pope also comes in the Church.  I suppose the deacons extended the same to the Ethiopian emperor.

Thanks for the info. Then let me ask you these questions:

Do they sing "Blessed is He who cometh in the Name of the Lord" only? Or Do they sing "Hosanna, Blessed be the King of Israel, Blessed is He who cometh in the Name of the Lord" entirely? And Do they have palm branches too? Do you know?


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Mo'a Ambessa ze imnegede Yehuda !
The Lion of the tribe of Judah has conquered !
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« Reply #19 on: November 06, 2011, 09:31:33 PM »

Here is an interesting stuff:

http://dubroom.org/rastafari/ncvlyundoi8ty/him_canada_1967.mp3

This is an extract from a radio program of 1967, named "Project 67: The Conquering Lion of Judah - A Profile Study Of His Imperial Majesty".

Around the middle of the audio, it speaks about H.I.M.'s coronation. And in it, it is said that a number of Coptic (Egyptian) deacons have sung, with palm branches in their hands, during his coronation's ceremony: "Hosanna, Blessed be the King of Israel, Blessed is He who cometh in the Name of the Lord."


It's customary to sing this hymn when the Coptic Pope also comes in the Church.  I suppose the deacons extended the same to the Ethiopian emperor.

Thanks for the info. Then let me ask you these questions:

Do they sing "Blessed is He who cometh in the Name of the Lord" only? Or Do they sing "Hosanna, Blessed be the King of Israel, Blessed is He who cometh in the Name of the Lord" entirely? And Do they have palm branches too? Do you know?




We chant both  Smiley

And yes, palm branches as well.

Here's the hymn we chant:

http://www.orthodoxchristianity.net/forum/index.php/topic,9840.msg558025.html#msg558025
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« Reply #20 on: November 06, 2011, 09:43:34 PM »

Can anyone recommend a good biography? I have always wanted to read one but have had trouble finding things about him in the local library. Maybe I can order one. Thanks.

Haile Selassie I. My Life and Ethiopia's Progress: The Autobiography of Emperor Haile Sellassie I. Translated from Amharic by Edward Ullendorff. New York: Frontline Books

There are 2 vols. You can usually find Vol. 1 (which closes in 1937) on Amazon. Vol. 2 is harder to find, not sure why.

Haile Sellassie I (vol. 1): The Formative Years 1892-1936 by Harold Marcus, pub. 1st Red Sea Press, Inc., 1995

Marcus has written a lot on Ethiopia. I have yet to see anything indicating that he's published the second volume of this bio however.

Many years,

Neil
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« Reply #21 on: November 07, 2011, 03:33:13 AM »

Wonderful thread! Give thanks brothers HabteSelassie and Arnaud for the wonderful information about our beloved King. It saddens me whenever I hear people disparage H.I.M. in ignorance, or mock the Monarchy as an anachronism. My Priest told me that we must pray for the restoration of the Monarchy in Ethiopia, and I will continue to do so. Regardless of what others say about H.I.M., I would not know Christ apart from His Majesty's teachings and example. I would have remained ignorant about Orthodoxy, lost and floundering in a morass of Western Christian heresies. I give thanks for His Imperial Majesty Emperor Haile Selassie I!


Selam
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« Reply #22 on: November 07, 2011, 04:32:25 AM »

Can anyone recommend a good biography? I have always wanted to read one but have had trouble finding things about him in the local library. Maybe I can order one. Thanks.

Haile Selassie I. My Life and Ethiopia's Progress: The Autobiography of Emperor Haile Sellassie I. Translated from Amharic by Edward Ullendorff. New York: Frontline Books

There are 2 vols. You can usually find Vol. 1 (which closes in 1937) on Amazon. Vol. 2 is harder to find, not sure why.

Haile Sellassie I (vol. 1): The Formative Years 1892-1936 by Harold Marcus, pub. 1st Red Sea Press, Inc., 1995

Marcus has written a lot on Ethiopia. I have yet to see anything indicating that he's published the second volume of this bio however.

Many years,

Neil

Thank you!   Smiley
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« Reply #23 on: November 07, 2011, 05:57:21 AM »

My Priest told me that we must pray for the restoration of the Monarchy in Ethiopia

Must?! Did he specify any reason for that?
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« Reply #24 on: November 07, 2011, 06:29:39 AM »

My Priest told me that we must pray for the restoration of the Monarchy in Ethiopia

Must?! Did he specify any reason for that?


HabteSelassie explained the reasons above.


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« Reply #25 on: November 07, 2011, 04:05:28 PM »

Greetings in that Divine and Most Precious Name of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ!

Here is an interesting stuff:

http://dubroom.org/rastafari/ncvlyundoi8ty/him_canada_1967.mp3

This is an extract from a radio program of 1967, named "Project 67: The Conquering Lion of Judah - A Profile Study Of His Imperial Majesty".

Around the middle of the audio, it speaks about H.I.M.'s coronation. And in it, it is said that a number of Coptic (Egyptian) deacons have sung, with palm branches in their hands, during his coronation's ceremony: "Hosanna, Blessed be the King of Israel, Blessed is He who cometh in the Name of the Lord."


You would have to triple check that fact, because while there were indeed Egyptian clergy attending the coronation because the Ethiopian Church was not yet  autocephalous, the historic sources tend to confuse the specifically Coptic clergy from the specifically Ethiopian clergy.  So when you read and hear primary source material and later historical sources, there is some inherent confusion.  There very well may have been Coptic deacons along with the attending Coptic priests, but the Liturgy at that coronation was Ethiopian, aside from the Egyptian Metropolitan Archbishop of Ethiopia who did the crowning, the celebrating clergy were all Ethiopian.  I would not want to misrepresent the Egyptians in this matter, and also highlight that in the historic sources (non-Ethiopian that is to say) Coptic and Ethiopian in regards to the Church in Ethiopia are inaccurately used interchangeably.

My Priest told me that we must pray for the restoration of the Monarchy in Ethiopia

Must?! Did he specify any reason for that?

There specific prayers in the Divine Liturgy for the King and Queen which are customarily assumed for the contemporary secular Heads of State.  Many priests have monarchist sentiments and see this transfer as being in poor taste, and so folks of this persuasion pray for the restoration of the monarchy.  We must pray for it is code-word for we should not try to necessarily fight a revolution for it.  Further, we in the Church pray for our leaders, good and bad, for the Grace of God to intervene in our lives.  If they are good, we pray giving thanks, if they are bad, we pray that God help us and them.  When the Church had to pray for Col. Mengistu and the Derg, a regime who routinely assassinated clergy as real politick, we all the more fervently prayed for our unfortunate leader, that the Grace of God might save us from the chaos.  These are the wounds that the brother was mentioning around the plurality of Ethiopian opinions regarding HIM.  From my personal experience with Ethiopians here in the US, including some of HIM personal clergy who are my priests still today, the elders and older generation who lived under or near HIM still are fond of HIM memory and legacy, and rightfully venerated HIM in the tradition of the Church according to the titles I documents above.  The "baby-boomer" generation grew up in the Derg and Revolution eras, and so they really don't know HIM much more as either a fairy tale or the boogie man.  The youngsters, people 15-30, now these folks simply LOVE and ADORE HIM, and HIM t-shirts are becoming more popular amongst Ethiopians than Rastas!  Why else would China mass produce millions of these Lion of Judah logo things, the Bob Marley fans market can't possibly be as large as the market of millions of Ethiopians are increasingly becoming more interesting in the Imperial history and legacy.

Is this veneration of Haile Selassie just a rastafari thing or is he respected also among regular Ethiopians?

The personality of H.I.M. Haile Selassie I is controversed among the Ethiopians. You can have different reactions, depending on the person with whom you are discussing. I feel in general their view on H.I.M. is "bittersweet" you see. "Haile Selassie the good and the bad" some say.. But you also have those who consider him to be very very great, and on the other hand those who despise him considering him to be an evil man. Really controversial.

There were so many propagandas against H.I.M. and his government and the royal family.. And personally I must say that some Ethiopians are very ignorant about H.I.M., and just believe and repeat the distortions, the lies or half-truths they hear around them.

Here is a documentary on His Majesty from a good perspective. Watch it. And in part 2, from 00:22 to 00:28, you can hear a Priest saying H.I.M. is angelic.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pRhlfNNH47U (Part 1)

And please, Be aware that the audio program in the previous post is not a Rastafarian thing, but was made by non-Rastafarians, by Canadian journalists. But the link of this audio program is on the website of a Rastafarian, but a Rastafarian who does not adore/worship His Majesty.

I love the way you phrased that, "the personality of HIM" because we in Rastafari use the same exact language to describe the Emperor.  I prefer to side with those like that priest in Man of Millenium (an absolute GEM of a biography of HIM) who think of HIM as angelic, after all it is written

Quote
“The LORD will save the dwellings of Judah first, so that the honor of the house of David and of Jerusalem’s inhabitants may not be greater than that of Judah.  .. so that the feeblest among them will be like David, and the house of David will be like God, like the angel of the LORD going before them.   
Zechariah 12:3

stay blessed,
habte selassie
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« Reply #26 on: November 08, 2011, 07:45:53 AM »

Is this veneration of Haile Selassie just a rastafari thing or is he respected also among regular Ethiopians?

The personality of H.I.M. Haile Selassie I is controversed among the Ethiopians. You can have different reactions, depending on the person with whom you are discussing. I feel in general their view on H.I.M. is "bittersweet" you see. "Haile Selassie the good and the bad" some say.. But you also have those who consider him to be very very great, and on the other hand those who despise him considering him to be an evil man. Really controversial.

There were so many propagandas against H.I.M. and his government and the royal family.. And personally I must say that some Ethiopians are very ignorant about H.I.M., and just believe and repeat the distortions, the lies or half-truths they hear around them.


this is a fair and balanced assessment IMO. the Emperor remains controversial not only due to ignorance and hateful propaganda which has obviously been rampant by the derge regime and other parties,  but also among the well educated historians as well as the general Ethiopian public which for the most part is highly political and knows its history pretty well. there are extremes on each end of course, but most would be fair to say, he was both good and bad. as he was only a man who had great responsibility of leading a country which is not made out of a one ethnicity , nor one religion. not everyone was enjoying his leadership, however we evaluate our emperors by the standards of their time and the precedent of our other glorious kings, kings we have canonised, as being just leaders as well as devout God bearing Christian Saints. some have abdicated their rule to persue the religious life. some have lived on a strict ascetic life while ruling as kings, the taxation only enough to maintain the govt, they were true servants of the Lord and the people, some of them not even eating the royal banquet that would be prepared for their court, rather they live on whatever income they have acquired by selling baskets as the monks do. each gives their crown to the Church upon their passing or their abdication. Kings like Emperor Minelek II were so much loved that their name was never called as just janhoy Menelik, but rather it was always Emmye Menelik/ dearest mother Menelik/ you see the place of a mother in Ethiopian Psyche is great, and that was how much they loved him, infact he was so loved that his death was hidden from the public for five years and for five years people used every opportunity to morn him on public defying the official denial of his death. they were also fiercely patriotic, there is a tradition in Ethiopia that the worriers go singing and laughing as they do battle the main team is to call the names of those that have died heroes, the ancestors, and how delightful it would be to meet them today and to stand among them with honor. its mainly called ' qererto, fukera, shillela' because of its outrageous jovial mood many have been called demons by their enemies.

the Emperor is measured by all that came before him and by the standards of his time and his situation. he has done many great things, and has made his fair share of political errors. however if we are talking about his faith, then he was a faithful man a devout orthodox christian, and served the Church the best he could. it pains me to see how much his name has been used to spread a false message, and idolatry which for some brought a political gain. however as St. Paul have said, saying I am Paul's or Apollo's is not the message of the Gospel. let us rejoice in the message of freedom that the Gospel of Christ Our Lord brings us.There is much fruit that has come out of him sending Bishop to the Caribbeans and making sure that the message of the Gospel is not distorted by  political interest groups or other innocents. for Our Lord Jesus Christ is who we worship who we preach and whose return we anticipate and pray for. I thank God for those who have heard the message of Orthodoxy and became part of the fold of Christ's flock as a result of that. and I pray for the rest who are mistakenly lead astray by those who have distorted the message of the Gospel that they may come to see the Light of Christ Our Victorious King.
I realise there are monarchists who would wish for the return of the monarchy in Ethiopia, that is not likely to happen in the Ethiopia of today, however they can pray for that as the rest pray for the leadership that will be just for all. I read that some clergy are telling people that they must pray for the restoration of the monarchy, that is absolutely a matter of personal opinion. not a canonical obligation of the faithful.

habte I do not want to bust your bubble but, the 'baby boomers' as you called them although i doubt they can be called that, are not as ignorant of their history as you protray them, there is nothing fairy tale or a bogey man attitude about the emperor, if they have a boggy man attitude they will tell you the reason why they despise him, the reason might not be to our satisfaction but still there is a reason. Ethiopians are highly political people, they spend ours talking about their history and political impact of this leader or that, the generation you missed is the generation that overthrew the king, they are the fathers and mothers of the above baby boomers, and they have talked about him a lot more than they have talked about Emperor Caleb, or any other emperor. the new generation you mentioned of loving and adoring the emperor, because they are wearing the T-shirts of the lion of Judah, and the emperor or bob merely, i assure you the same generation is the one that has been fighting for a democratic government, this generation is not a monarchist generation, millions of Tupac's T-shirts have been sold in Ethiopia, as well as the T shirts of Emperor Theodoros, Yohannes, and Menelik. do not read too much into the event.

as to our Coptic brothers being at the Coronation , ofc they were there, as they have been before in the time of Menelik , theodoros, yohannes etc... solidarity in faith , and the hymn really means nothing other than it being a traditional hymn reserved for kings and bishops. there is no hidden Messianic message, and the hyperbole of praise by the Ethiopian singers of their monarchy its business as usual, they do it for all the kings. the more praise one comes up with a creative double entendre the better demonstrative effect it has on the learnt poet. the poets being Christians they use christian imagery in their poems.


May the Lord  have mercy and give eternal rest to the soul of the Faithful Departed Servants of God Emperors of Ethiopia.
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« Reply #27 on: November 08, 2011, 08:50:51 PM »

The link below shows a very rare video of a fairly complete liturgy celebrated by Pope Kyrillos VI.  As you know Pope Kyrillos and HIM had a tremendous bond of affection.  Everyone was always naked before Pope Kyrillos, he saw straight through the souls of all who stood before him. So for me, Pope Kyrillos' great love for HIM says much.

Go to the beginning of the video starting around 1:56 and you can see Pope Kyrillos and HIM standing next to each other with arms locked together.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9O06mE21xiM&feature=share

In Christ,
Fr. Kyrillos
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« Reply #28 on: November 09, 2011, 07:33:30 AM »

Selassie I Jah!

I have no problem with the royal titles bestowed upon HIM. They are by no means unique to the Ethiopian monarchy.

However, the phrase "Selassie I Jah" is blasphemy. Haile Selassie was a mere man, not Jah. I know Selassie means Trinity, the Trinity is, of course, Jah. But "Selassie I" is the title given to Tafari Makonen. Those who shout "Selassie I Jah" or "Jah Rastafari" are not Orthodox but the worshippers of men.
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« Reply #29 on: November 09, 2011, 08:04:01 AM »

Selassie I Jah!

I have no problem with the royal titles bestowed upon HIM. They are by no means unique to the Ethiopian monarchy.

However, the phrase "Selassie I Jah" is blasphemy. Haile Selassie was a mere man, not Jah. I know Selassie means Trinity, the Trinity is, of course, Jah. But "Selassie I" is the title given to Tafari Makonen. Those who shout "Selassie I Jah" or "Jah Rastafari" are not Orthodox but the worshippers of men.


Not necessarily brother. It is true that many Rastas worship Haile Selassie as God, but not all do so. I still chant "JAH! Rastafari!:" But I am not a Haile Selassie worshiper. When I exclaim "JAH! Rastafari!," I am hailing and acknowledging that JAH/God is ruler of Creation. So I just want you to please be careful about accusing those who use this phrase of idolatry.


Selam
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« Reply #30 on: November 09, 2011, 08:27:02 AM »

Not necessarily brother. It is true that many Rastas worship Haile Selassie as God, but not all do so. I still chant "JAH! Rastafari!:" But I am not a Haile Selassie worshiper. When I exclaim "JAH! Rastafari!," I am hailing and acknowledging that JAH/God is ruler of Creation. So I just want you to please be careful about accusing those who use this phrase of idolatry.

How does using the princely title Ras and the first name Tafari in conjunction with the name of God praise Him as ruler of creation? I know you are not a worshiper of HIM, so I'm interested in how you justify such an exclamation.
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« Reply #31 on: November 09, 2011, 08:56:27 AM »

 
Not necessarily brother. It is true that many Rastas worship Haile Selassie as God, but not all do so. I still chant "JAH! Rastafari!:" But I am not a Haile Selassie worshiper. When I exclaim "JAH! Rastafari!," I am hailing and acknowledging that JAH/God is ruler of Creation. So I just want you to please be careful about accusing those who use this phrase of idolatry.

How does using the princely title Ras and the first name Tafari in conjunction with the name of God praise Him as ruler of creation? I know you are not a worshiper of HIM, so I'm interested in how you justify such an exclamation.


Because as you already know, "JAH" means God. And "Rastafari" means ruler or head of creation. Brother Habte Selassie may elaborate on this more if he wishes.


Selam
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« Reply #32 on: November 09, 2011, 11:47:15 AM »

Not necessarily brother. It is true that many Rastas worship Haile Selassie as God, but not all do so. I still chant "JAH! Rastafari!:" But I am not a Haile Selassie worshiper. When I exclaim "JAH! Rastafari!," I am hailing and acknowledging that JAH/God is ruler of Creation. So I just want you to please be careful about accusing those who use this phrase of idolatry.

How does using the princely title Ras and the first name Tafari in conjunction with the name of God praise Him as ruler of creation? I know you are not a worshiper of HIM, so I'm interested in how you justify such an exclamation.


Because as you already know, "JAH" means God. And "Rastafari" means ruler or head of creation. Brother Habte Selassie may elaborate on this more if he wishes.


Selam

Selam to all,

OK in the hope of correcting the kind of blasphemy  which is sickening and yet that masquerades itself as something right and that needs to be openly rejected and condemned I will give the meaning of those words that  Gebre seems to mistakenly believe  that Rastafari= to head of creation. Gebre by your definition if ras is head which is true but is only a princely title, then teferi must be creation which in reality it is not, not even remotely close by any etymology of the term. infact here is the meaning of Teferi. the root word is ' ferehat'/ Fear and  the other words derived from it are ' feri'/ coward/  , Asferi/ terrifying/( a word used for events , animals, objects , ideas) whereas when one wants to use it to a person's relation to others we use the word Teferi/ one who is feared by others,terrifying/ it is also related to being respected when it is used as a persons name, and this has mostly to do with being a warrior. now the other false interpretation or more like a rationalisation of former affection, is to say the term JAH only refers to jan-hoye, which is the Ethiopian colloquial way of saying "O King" for the king, how on earth did this traditional term used only for MEN who have become kings, suddenly become distorted by some to mean The LORD JEHOVA? which is what JAH means. Lord have mercy!!! I tremble for those who would dare to say such a thing! I find this most distressing and repulsive.
Emperor Haile Selassie , is a mere man, an Orthodox Christian yes, some might say a holy man that can also be true, however anything that has to do with chanting of JAH I bla bla , Is nothing but Blasphemy!!! Ethiopians love their kings for the most part, but none of them even when there were the most holy ones , were ever worshiped! 'E-sema'ene  wa E-reyine wa E-negerune Abewine keme bo Amlak Ze enbeleke!/ we have not heard, we have not seen, and our fathers have not told us that there is any other God other than YOU!/ this is the daily midnight prayer of the Ethiopian Orthodox Tewahedo Church.

Now we have cleared that up, I hope in all honesty all those who call themselves members of the Orthodox Church need to abandon any form of former idolatry either hidden in their baggage, or mistakenly still Carry with themselves as a jewellery of sorts. ( Genesis 31:19-35,When Laban had gone to shear his sheep, Rachel stole her father’s household gods.....  But why did you steal my gods?”

31Jacob answered Laban, “I was afraid, because I thought you would take your daughters away from me by force. 32But if you find anyone who has your gods, he shall not live. In the presence of our relatives, see for yourself whether there is anything of yours here with me; and if so, take it.” Now Jacob did not know that Rachel had stolen the gods.

33So Laban went into Jacob’s tent and into Leah’s tent and into the tent of the two maidservants, but he found nothing. After he came out of Leah’s tent, he entered Rachel’s tent. 34Now Rachel had taken the household gods and put them inside her camel’s saddle and was sitting on them. Laban searched through everything in the tent but found nothing.

35Rachel said to her father, “Don’t be angry, my lord, that I cannot stand up in your presence; I’m having my period.” So he searched but could not find the household gods.


Genesis 35:1-7 1Then God said to Jacob, “Go up to Bethel and settle there, and build an altar there to God, who appeared to you when you were fleeing from your brother Esau.”

2So Jacob said to his household and to all who were with him, “Get rid of the foreign gods you have with you, and purify yourselves and change your clothes. 3Then come, let us go up to Bethel, where I will build an altar to God, who answered me in the day of my distress and who has been with me wherever I have gone.” 4So they gave Jacob all the foreign gods they had and the rings in their ears, and Jacob buried them under the oak at Shechem. 5Then they set out, and the terror of God fell upon the towns all around them so that no one pursued them.

6Jacob and all the people with him came to Luz (that is, Bethel) in the land of Canaan. 7There he built an altar, and he called the place El Bethel,a because it was there that God revealed himself to him when he was fleeing from his brother. )


 As we all can see , it has been done that people have brought in their idols hiding it from those that are certain of their faith enough to  say if it is found among one of us , that person shall die!, but even hidden as it is, it can not survive entering Bethel( the dwelling place of the LORD GOD) so it before entering one has to abandon all forms of Idolatry, even that comes as a decorative piece of jewelery that would draw the Heart of man into his /her former idol, or encourage those who still worship the idol to continue to do so.

 however before God there is no point in rationalising such blasphemy! One must  stand up and give Laban his idols! One must stop giving this reason or that to hid the idol that is still with Oneself. its horrific its sickening and The Ethiopian Orthodox Tewahedo Church utterly rejects , and anathematise it! woe unto those who would give what belongs to The Almighty God to a mere creature ,a pile of dust such as a man! For Who is like Our God? NO ONE!!! All honor and glory a man got is because of the Honor and Glory that was given to him by the Holy Trinity!

This is a scandalous thing one that is a stumbling block for all others that seek the Truth found in Orthodoxy! the Church has a proper way to venerate a saint , in this case the Church has not canonised the Emperor hailesialsie the first. so public veneration as a saint is an un canonical practice. private veneration of a faithful departed should be done in the proper christian manner and in private. anythingelse is foreign to the Apostolic Tradition of the Church. however Idolatry is indirect opposition to everything we believe in and hold dear.

I hope we are not going to argue about this, because if a mistaken translation is the cause of this albeit unintentional blasphemous utterans of our orthodox brethren then once they know what they are saying it will be easy for those who Love Christ first to correct their ways. however if we are going to merely go on denial like Rachel did only to hold on to our idols then we can not claim to be members of the Orthodox Church.

Our Faith is the Faith of the Holy Martyrs who gave their life  giving witness to the Truth, so giving witness to the Faith they died for sitting from the safety of our homes and over the internet LOL is the least we all can do. 


In Christ,
Hiwot
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« Reply #33 on: November 09, 2011, 12:03:13 PM »

Wow dear sister! Cool down with the judgment please. Seriously. You cannot know what is in our hearts when we chant JAH! Rastafari! The word JAH is used in the King James version of the Bible- see Psalm 68:4. It is a Hebrew for of YAHWEH/Jehovah. Ok? So I will always chant the name of Almighty JAH, and to do so is the antithesis of idolatry.

Thank you for explaining the etymology of the words "Ras" and "Tafari." Brother Habte Selassie has explained this before, which is why I was asking him to explain it once again. Now, I know that my God - Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, One JAH, amen! - is Lord and Ruler of all Creation. I also know that He is terrible in awe and wonder, so holy that no man can gaze upon Him in the flesh. So, when I chant "JAH! Rastafari!," I am praising God and giving Him all the glory.

Yes, it is sad but true that many Rastas equate our beloved Emperor and King with God Himself, and to do so is pure idolatry. But do not condemn all Rastafarians or all those who chant "JAH! Rastafari!" as idolaters. No need to quote Scriptures to me about the danger and sin of idolatry.

I am a baptized Ethiopian Orthodox Christian who will defend the Orthodox Tewahedo Faith to my dying breath. I have spent much labor and effort proclaiming the Orthodox Faith and the Truth of Eyesus Kristos to fellow Rastafarians who still cling to their idolatry. I have ministered to Rastas in prison, where I did not hesitate to communicate the beautiful Truths of Orthodoxy to them.

So, with respect, please try not to be so judgmental. You should certainly know by now my love for and devotion to our Tewahedo Faith. OK?


Selam
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« Reply #34 on: November 09, 2011, 12:18:25 PM »

Wow dear sister! Cool down with the judgment please. Seriously. You cannot know what is in our hearts when we chant JAH! Rastafari! The word JAH is used in the King James version of the Bible- see Psalm 68:4. It is a Hebrew for of YAHWEH/Jehovah. Ok? So I will always chant the name of Almighty JAH, and to do so is the antithesis of idolatry.

Thank you for explaining the etymology of the words "Ras" and "Tafari." Brother Habte Selassie has explained this before, which is why I was asking him to explain it once again. Now, I know that my God - Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, One JAH, amen! - is Lord and Ruler of all Creation. I also know that He is terrible in awe and wonder, so holy that no man can gaze upon Him in the flesh. So, when I chant "JAH! Rastafari!," I am praising God and giving Him all the glory.

Yes, it is sad but true that many Rastas equate our beloved Emperor and King with God Himself, and to do so is pure idolatry. But do not condemn all Rastafarians or all those who chant "JAH! Rastafari!" as idolaters. No need to quote Scriptures to me about the danger and sin of idolatry.

I am a baptized Ethiopian Orthodox Christian who will defend the Orthodox Tewahedo Faith to my dying breath. I have spent much labor and effort proclaiming the Orthodox Faith and the Truth of Eyesus Kristos to fellow Rastafarians who still cling to their idolatry. I have ministered to Rastas in prison, where I did not hesitate to communicate the beautiful Truths of Orthodoxy to them.

So, with respect, please try not to be so judgmental. You should certainly know by now my love for and devotion to our Tewahedo Faith. OK?


Selam

Gebre I am not being judgemental but only stating my faith, Tell me again why would you say JAH Rastafari, plainly rather than say let so and so explain it , tell me why you would say that , and I know JAH means The Lord Jehova, now is Rastafari the Lord Jehova? so why is he being refered to as such? is that not utterly blasphemy?

I have said it before and I will say it again , all those that equate the Lord God with a mere man are not Orthodox whether or not baptised as one! read my post again I am not judging anyone who is orthodox in faith, I am condeming those who seek to corrupt the faith and scandalise the Orthodox Church.
Is RasTafari the LORD AND RULER OF CREATION??? IS he JAH? if not tell me why you say he is when you chant?

I know you say you do not worship rastafari, and I will like to take you on your word if you would tell me Why you Say JAH RASTAFARI?

I am a sinner of all manner of things, but I will bost with this , that my faith is Orthodox! read into this what you like my brother, but I Still want to know Why you say JAH RASTAFARI when you know Rastafari means nothing of ruler of creation! so enlighten me , if it is not an idol warshiping then it is a mistake but it can not be anything else. if it is let me know right now and I will stand corrected. nothing will please me other than to find the Orthodox Faith in all my bretheren!

In Christ,
Hiwot
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« Reply #35 on: November 09, 2011, 12:46:33 PM »

Wow dear sister! Cool down with the judgment please. Seriously. You cannot know what is in our hearts when we chant JAH! Rastafari! The word JAH is used in the King James version of the Bible- see Psalm 68:4. It is a Hebrew for of YAHWEH/Jehovah. Ok? So I will always chant the name of Almighty JAH, and to do so is the antithesis of idolatry.

Thank you for explaining the etymology of the words "Ras" and "Tafari." Brother Habte Selassie has explained this before, which is why I was asking him to explain it once again. Now, I know that my God - Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, One JAH, amen! - is Lord and Ruler of all Creation. I also know that He is terrible in awe and wonder, so holy that no man can gaze upon Him in the flesh. So, when I chant "JAH! Rastafari!," I am praising God and giving Him all the glory.

Yes, it is sad but true that many Rastas equate our beloved Emperor and King with God Himself, and to do so is pure idolatry. But do not condemn all Rastafarians or all those who chant "JAH! Rastafari!" as idolaters. No need to quote Scriptures to me about the danger and sin of idolatry.

I am a baptized Ethiopian Orthodox Christian who will defend the Orthodox Tewahedo Faith to my dying breath. I have spent much labor and effort proclaiming the Orthodox Faith and the Truth of Eyesus Kristos to fellow Rastafarians who still cling to their idolatry. I have ministered to Rastas in prison, where I did not hesitate to communicate the beautiful Truths of Orthodoxy to them.

So, with respect, please try not to be so judgmental. You should certainly know by now my love for and devotion to our Tewahedo Faith. OK?


Selam

Gebre I am not being judgemental but only stating my faith, Tell me again why would you say JAH Rastafari, plainly rather than say let so and so explain it , tell me why you would say that , and I know JAH means The Lord Jehova, now is Rastafari the Lord Jehova? so why is he being refered to as such? is that not utterly blasphemy?

I have said it before and I will say it again , all those that equate the Lord God with a mere man are not Orthodox whether or not baptised as one! read my post again I am not judging anyone who is orthodox in faith, I am condeming those who seek to corrupt the faith and scandalise the Orthodox Church.
Is RasTafari the LORD AND RULER OF CREATION??? IS he JAH? if not tell me why you say he is when you chant?

I know you say you do not worship rastafari, and I will like to take you on your word if you would tell me Why you Say JAH RASTAFARI?

I am a sinner of all manner of things, but I will bost with this , that my faith is Orthodox! read into this what you like my brother, but I Still want to know Why you say JAH RASTAFARI when you know Rastafari means nothing of ruler of creation! so enlighten me , if it is not an idol warshiping then it is a mistake but it can not be anything else. if it is let me know right now and I will stand corrected. nothing will please me other than to find the Orthodox Faith in all my bretheren!

In Christ,
Hiwot


Dear sister, I have explained it clearly already. I have been explicity clear that I DO NOT worship Haile Selassie as God. I have explained what I mean when I chant "JAH! Rastafari!" Perhaps you should go back and read my explanations again. But do not question the authenticity of my Faith or cast aspersion on my motives. Only JAH knows my heart! You are not my Priest, and if my Priest were to instruct me not to use such an exclamation, then I would no longer do so.

My sister, I have read opinions of yours that I disagreed with, but I have never questioned your Faith. It saddens me that after all our communications and all the posts you have seen from me on this forum that you would accuse me of idolatry and essentially call me a liar. I would never speak to you that way, nor would I presume to question your faith.

Please try to express your concerns and ask your questions without such a judgmental and prejudicial spirit. You are an intellingent person, and it saddens me to see you willfully ignore the clear explanations with which I have already provided you.

Selam
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« Reply #36 on: November 09, 2011, 12:59:11 PM »

Wow dear sister! Cool down with the judgment please. Seriously. You cannot know what is in our hearts when we chant JAH! Rastafari! The word JAH is used in the King James version of the Bible- see Psalm 68:4. It is a Hebrew for of YAHWEH/Jehovah. Ok? So I will always chant the name of Almighty JAH, and to do so is the antithesis of idolatry.

Thank you for explaining the etymology of the words "Ras" and "Tafari." Brother Habte Selassie has explained this before, which is why I was asking him to explain it once again. Now, I know that my God - Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, One JAH, amen! - is Lord and Ruler of all Creation. I also know that He is terrible in awe and wonder, so holy that no man can gaze upon Him in the flesh. So, when I chant "JAH! Rastafari!," I am praising God and giving Him all the glory.

Yes, it is sad but true that many Rastas equate our beloved Emperor and King with God Himself, and to do so is pure idolatry. But do not condemn all Rastafarians or all those who chant "JAH! Rastafari!" as idolaters. No need to quote Scriptures to me about the danger and sin of idolatry.

I am a baptized Ethiopian Orthodox Christian who will defend the Orthodox Tewahedo Faith to my dying breath. I have spent much labor and effort proclaiming the Orthodox Faith and the Truth of Eyesus Kristos to fellow Rastafarians who still cling to their idolatry. I have ministered to Rastas in prison, where I did not hesitate to communicate the beautiful Truths of Orthodoxy to them.

So, with respect, please try not to be so judgmental. You should certainly know by now my love for and devotion to our Tewahedo Faith. OK?


Selam

Gebre I am not being judgemental but only stating my faith, Tell me again why would you say JAH Rastafari, plainly rather than say let so and so explain it , tell me why you would say that , and I know JAH means The Lord Jehova, now is Rastafari the Lord Jehova? so why is he being refered to as such? is that not utterly blasphemy?

I have said it before and I will say it again , all those that equate the Lord God with a mere man are not Orthodox whether or not baptised as one! read my post again I am not judging anyone who is orthodox in faith, I am condeming those who seek to corrupt the faith and scandalise the Orthodox Church.
Is RasTafari the LORD AND RULER OF CREATION??? IS he JAH? if not tell me why you say he is when you chant?

I know you say you do not worship rastafari, and I will like to take you on your word if you would tell me Why you Say JAH RASTAFARI?

I am a sinner of all manner of things, but I will bost with this , that my faith is Orthodox! read into this what you like my brother, but I Still want to know Why you say JAH RASTAFARI when you know Rastafari means nothing of ruler of creation! so enlighten me , if it is not an idol warshiping then it is a mistake but it can not be anything else. if it is let me know right now and I will stand corrected. nothing will please me other than to find the Orthodox Faith in all my bretheren!

In Christ,
Hiwot


Dear sister, I have explained it clearly already. I have been explicity clear that I DO NOT worship Haile Selassie as God. I have explained what I mean when I chant "JAH! Rastafari!" Perhaps you should go back and read my explanations again. But do not question the authenticity of my Faith or cast aspersion on my motives. Only JAH knows my heart! You are not my Priest, and if my Priest were to instruct me not to use such an exclamation, then I would no longer do so.

My sister, I have read opinions of yours that I disagreed with, but I have never questioned your Faith. It saddens me that after all our communications and all the posts you have seen from me on this forum that you would accuse me of idolatry and essentially call me a liar. I would never speak to you that way, nor would I presume to question your faith.

Please try to express your concerns and ask your questions without such a judgmental and prejudicial spirit. You are an intellingent person, and it saddens me to see you willfully ignore the clear explanations with which I have already provided you.

Selam


Ah, Gebre I am questioning again why would you continue to use the same phrase as used by the rastafarians who worship hialesilasse and who use the term JAH RASTAFARI as the declaration of their faith that he is the Christ The ALLMighty Rastafari, and yet you say it really does not mean anything other than the JAH part you seem to willfully ignore that you have included in that term the rastafari name which for all who read it says THE LORD JEHOVA RASTAFARI! Now tell me again do you not see the blasphemy in the term? is this the Orthodox Faith?
you are the one who is continuing to argue with me about the usage and meaning of the term as not being blasphemous and insist that you will continue to use it. well No orthodox priest I know will approve of such a thing! yes I am not your priest but if you were to tell your priest that you are saying THE LORD JEHOVA RASTAFARI when you chant I am 100% sure he will be horrified by it as I am now and will immediately tell you to renounce such heretical exclamation! because it does not matter what you say the word means because we can only talk in reality and the reality is the meaning of the term is not THE LORD JEHOVA LORD OF CREATION as you twisted it to mean, this is the plain truth, now if you deny the meaning of the term then we have nothing to discuss, however after I have told you the meaning of the term know that you no longer the excuse of ignorance of the term before the LORD who does indeed knows what is in our heart, and if what is in our heart is truly after Worshiping Him alone in Truth and Spirit, then the truth is what we will seek at all time and when we find it by His Grace we will cast away all manner of falsehood!

In Christ,
Hiwot.
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To God be the Glory in all things! Amen!

Only pray for me, that God would give me both inward and outward strength, that I may not only speak, but truly will; and that I may not merely be called a Christian, but really be found to be one. St.Ignatius of Antioch.Epistle to the Romans.
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« Reply #37 on: November 09, 2011, 01:06:25 PM »

Wow dear sister! Cool down with the judgment please. Seriously. You cannot know what is in our hearts when we chant JAH! Rastafari! The word JAH is used in the King James version of the Bible- see Psalm 68:4. It is a Hebrew for of YAHWEH/Jehovah. Ok? So I will always chant the name of Almighty JAH, and to do so is the antithesis of idolatry.

Thank you for explaining the etymology of the words "Ras" and "Tafari." Brother Habte Selassie has explained this before, which is why I was asking him to explain it once again. Now, I know that my God - Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, One JAH, amen! - is Lord and Ruler of all Creation. I also know that He is terrible in awe and wonder, so holy that no man can gaze upon Him in the flesh. So, when I chant "JAH! Rastafari!," I am praising God and giving Him all the glory.

Yes, it is sad but true that many Rastas equate our beloved Emperor and King with God Himself, and to do so is pure idolatry. But do not condemn all Rastafarians or all those who chant "JAH! Rastafari!" as idolaters. No need to quote Scriptures to me about the danger and sin of idolatry.

I am a baptized Ethiopian Orthodox Christian who will defend the Orthodox Tewahedo Faith to my dying breath. I have spent much labor and effort proclaiming the Orthodox Faith and the Truth of Eyesus Kristos to fellow Rastafarians who still cling to their idolatry. I have ministered to Rastas in prison, where I did not hesitate to communicate the beautiful Truths of Orthodoxy to them.

So, with respect, please try not to be so judgmental. You should certainly know by now my love for and devotion to our Tewahedo Faith. OK?


Selam

Gebre I am not being judgemental but only stating my faith, Tell me again why would you say JAH Rastafari, plainly rather than say let so and so explain it , tell me why you would say that , and I know JAH means The Lord Jehova, now is Rastafari the Lord Jehova? so why is he being refered to as such? is that not utterly blasphemy?

I have said it before and I will say it again , all those that equate the Lord God with a mere man are not Orthodox whether or not baptised as one! read my post again I am not judging anyone who is orthodox in faith, I am condeming those who seek to corrupt the faith and scandalise the Orthodox Church.
Is RasTafari the LORD AND RULER OF CREATION??? IS he JAH? if not tell me why you say he is when you chant?

I know you say you do not worship rastafari, and I will like to take you on your word if you would tell me Why you Say JAH RASTAFARI?

I am a sinner of all manner of things, but I will bost with this , that my faith is Orthodox! read into this what you like my brother, but I Still want to know Why you say JAH RASTAFARI when you know Rastafari means nothing of ruler of creation! so enlighten me , if it is not an idol warshiping then it is a mistake but it can not be anything else. if it is let me know right now and I will stand corrected. nothing will please me other than to find the Orthodox Faith in all my bretheren!

In Christ,
Hiwot


Dear sister, I have explained it clearly already. I have been explicity clear that I DO NOT worship Haile Selassie as God. I have explained what I mean when I chant "JAH! Rastafari!" Perhaps you should go back and read my explanations again. But do not question the authenticity of my Faith or cast aspersion on my motives. Only JAH knows my heart! You are not my Priest, and if my Priest were to instruct me not to use such an exclamation, then I would no longer do so.

My sister, I have read opinions of yours that I disagreed with, but I have never questioned your Faith. It saddens me that after all our communications and all the posts you have seen from me on this forum that you would accuse me of idolatry and essentially call me a liar. I would never speak to you that way, nor would I presume to question your faith.

Please try to express your concerns and ask your questions without such a judgmental and prejudicial spirit. You are an intellingent person, and it saddens me to see you willfully ignore the clear explanations with which I have already provided you.

Selam


Ah, Gebre I am questioning again why would you continue to use the same phrase as used by the rastafarians who worship hialesilasse and who use the term JAH RASTAFARI as the declaration of their faith that he is the Christ The ALLMighty Rastafari, and yet you say it really does not mean anything other than the JAH part you seem to willfully ignore that you have included in that term the rastafari name which for all who read it says THE LORD JEHOVA RASTAFARI! Now tell me again do you not see the blasphemy in the term? is this the Orthodox Faith?
you are the one who is continuing to argue with me about the usage and meaning of the term as not being blasphemous and insist that you will continue to use it. well No orthodox priest I know will approve of such a thing! yes I am not your priest but if you were to tell your priest that you are saying THE LORD JEHOVA RASTAFARI when you chant I am 100% sure he will be horrified by it as I am now and will immediately tell you to renounce such heretical exclamation! because it does not matter what you say the word means because we can only talk in reality and the reality is the meaning of the term is not THE LORD JEHOVA LORD OF CREATION as you twisted it to mean, this is the plain truth, now if you deny the meaning of the term then we have nothing to discuss, however after I have told you the meaning of the term know that you no longer the excuse of ignorance of the term before the LORD who does indeed knows what is in our heart, and if what is in our heart is truly after Worshiping Him alone in Truth and Spirit, then the truth is what we will seek at all time and when we find it by His Grace we will cast away all manner of falsehood!

In Christ,
Hiwot.

Pray for me, a sinner.


Selam
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"There are two great tragedies: one is to live a life ruled by the passions, and the other is to live a passionless life."
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« Reply #38 on: November 09, 2011, 01:16:42 PM »

I'm just some silly ferenji, but it has always seemed to me something curious that Ras Tafari, who the Rastafarians take to be some kind of incarnation of God, was an Orthodox Christian. I figure if it's good enough for "god", it is good enough for me and ought to be good enough for everyone! Hence in Ethiopia proper this Rastafarian ideology/theology is seen as foreign, and is therefore confined to tiny isolated places like Shashamene.

But don't take my word for it, read what Ethiopians themselves have to say about the Rastafrians in their midst. It does not seem terribly positive, outside of the Rastas being nice and teaching the Ethiopians English. This part in particular struck me as incredibly bizarre and to be rightfully rejected:

Quote
The Rastafarians say they plan "to educate" the Ethiopian people about their last Emperor.


Forgive me, but I have very little patience for this idea that people from Jamaica should be educating Ethiopians about their own rulers, history, and the proper appreciation or understanding of circumstances under which the Ethiopians themselves lived during the reign of said rulers in those years of their history. For a so-called "black liberation" movement (and that's what Rastafarianism is in the popular mind: a POLITICAL movement based on an assumed racial outlook), the Rastas in this case seem an awful lot like the colonizers they're supposedly fighting against. Like the 73 year old man in the article who claims that the West should help repatriate black people who want to return "to their native land" -- how many Jamaicans were taken from Ethiopia? How many black people in the West in general? I don't know the answers to these questions, but to expect Ethiopia, which has her own problems rooted in her own history and her own local circumstances (none of which the Rastafarians seem to completely appreciate, as they are fetishists, so they primarily see Ethiopia in cosmic, quasi-religious terms), to absorb immigrants from the West with their romantic notions and marijuana addictions simply because those westerners view Ethiopia as their "native land" even if they have no material or historical connection to it outside of their romanticizing of it seems insane.

I have known several Ethiopians and Rastafarians in my life. I have not known any Ethiopian Rastafarians (by which I mean Rastafrians of indigenous stock, not the immigrants who live in Ethiopia; Amhara Rastafarians, Oromo Rastafarians, Tigre Rastafarians, Sidaamo Rastafarians, etc). In fact, the two populations seem to mix about as well as oil and water. If I had to guess as to why this is, I would say that there is enough REAL religion and REAL history in Ethiopia that they probably don't have any need for any westerners' fake recasting of their country and its history and its religions. And I don't blame them. Orthodoxy, after all, is true, and Rastafarianism certainly is not. That's something I'm fairly certain Gebre would agree with, regardless of his affinities for the Rastafarian cult that I will openly admit I cannot even begin to understand.
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« Reply #39 on: November 09, 2011, 01:26:19 PM »

Wow dear sister! Cool down with the judgment please. Seriously. You cannot know what is in our hearts when we chant JAH! Rastafari! The word JAH is used in the King James version of the Bible- see Psalm 68:4. It is a Hebrew for of YAHWEH/Jehovah. Ok? So I will always chant the name of Almighty JAH, and to do so is the antithesis of idolatry.

Thank you for explaining the etymology of the words "Ras" and "Tafari." Brother Habte Selassie has explained this before, which is why I was asking him to explain it once again. Now, I know that my God - Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, One JAH, amen! - is Lord and Ruler of all Creation. I also know that He is terrible in awe and wonder, so holy that no man can gaze upon Him in the flesh. So, when I chant "JAH! Rastafari!," I am praising God and giving Him all the glory.

Yes, it is sad but true that many Rastas equate our beloved Emperor and King with God Himself, and to do so is pure idolatry. But do not condemn all Rastafarians or all those who chant "JAH! Rastafari!" as idolaters. No need to quote Scriptures to me about the danger and sin of idolatry.

I am a baptized Ethiopian Orthodox Christian who will defend the Orthodox Tewahedo Faith to my dying breath. I have spent much labor and effort proclaiming the Orthodox Faith and the Truth of Eyesus Kristos to fellow Rastafarians who still cling to their idolatry. I have ministered to Rastas in prison, where I did not hesitate to communicate the beautiful Truths of Orthodoxy to them.

So, with respect, please try not to be so judgmental. You should certainly know by now my love for and devotion to our Tewahedo Faith. OK?


Selam

Gebre I am not being judgemental but only stating my faith, Tell me again why would you say JAH Rastafari, plainly rather than say let so and so explain it , tell me why you would say that , and I know JAH means The Lord Jehova, now is Rastafari the Lord Jehova? so why is he being refered to as such? is that not utterly blasphemy?

I have said it before and I will say it again , all those that equate the Lord God with a mere man are not Orthodox whether or not baptised as one! read my post again I am not judging anyone who is orthodox in faith, I am condeming those who seek to corrupt the faith and scandalise the Orthodox Church.
Is RasTafari the LORD AND RULER OF CREATION??? IS he JAH? if not tell me why you say he is when you chant?

I know you say you do not worship rastafari, and I will like to take you on your word if you would tell me Why you Say JAH RASTAFARI?

I am a sinner of all manner of things, but I will bost with this , that my faith is Orthodox! read into this what you like my brother, but I Still want to know Why you say JAH RASTAFARI when you know Rastafari means nothing of ruler of creation! so enlighten me , if it is not an idol warshiping then it is a mistake but it can not be anything else. if it is let me know right now and I will stand corrected. nothing will please me other than to find the Orthodox Faith in all my bretheren!

In Christ,
Hiwot


Dear sister, I have explained it clearly already. I have been explicity clear that I DO NOT worship Haile Selassie as God. I have explained what I mean when I chant "JAH! Rastafari!" Perhaps you should go back and read my explanations again. But do not question the authenticity of my Faith or cast aspersion on my motives. Only JAH knows my heart! You are not my Priest, and if my Priest were to instruct me not to use such an exclamation, then I would no longer do so.

My sister, I have read opinions of yours that I disagreed with, but I have never questioned your Faith. It saddens me that after all our communications and all the posts you have seen from me on this forum that you would accuse me of idolatry and essentially call me a liar. I would never speak to you that way, nor would I presume to question your faith.

Please try to express your concerns and ask your questions without such a judgmental and prejudicial spirit. You are an intellingent person, and it saddens me to see you willfully ignore the clear explanations with which I have already provided you.

Selam


Ah, Gebre I am questioning again why would you continue to use the same phrase as used by the rastafarians who worship hialesilasse and who use the term JAH RASTAFARI as the declaration of their faith that he is the Christ The ALLMighty Rastafari, and yet you say it really does not mean anything other than the JAH part you seem to willfully ignore that you have included in that term the rastafari name which for all who read it says THE LORD JEHOVA RASTAFARI! Now tell me again do you not see the blasphemy in the term? is this the Orthodox Faith?
you are the one who is continuing to argue with me about the usage and meaning of the term as not being blasphemous and insist that you will continue to use it. well No orthodox priest I know will approve of such a thing! yes I am not your priest but if you were to tell your priest that you are saying THE LORD JEHOVA RASTAFARI when you chant I am 100% sure he will be horrified by it as I am now and will immediately tell you to renounce such heretical exclamation! because it does not matter what you say the word means because we can only talk in reality and the reality is the meaning of the term is not THE LORD JEHOVA LORD OF CREATION as you twisted it to mean, this is the plain truth, now if you deny the meaning of the term then we have nothing to discuss, however after I have told you the meaning of the term know that you no longer the excuse of ignorance of the term before the LORD who does indeed knows what is in our heart, and if what is in our heart is truly after Worshiping Him alone in Truth and Spirit, then the truth is what we will seek at all time and when we find it by His Grace we will cast away all manner of falsehood!

In Christ,
Hiwot.

Pray for me, a sinner.


Selam


I too am a sinner, my brother.However Let us stick to the Creed of Our Faith, Either in our hymns or in our prayers to our God. For Hailesilase has no place in either one while we  Adore Our Creator, and /or Sing of His Infinite Glory. For there is only ONE Name that is Above ALL names and that is the Name of Our God Lord and Savior JESUS Christ. we refute those who say in their creed of their faith JAH Rastafari, we say instead the Nicene Creed, the Creed of The Apostles and say there is only One JAH, and the Jesus is the Christ no other man's name rastafari, hailesilase, tafari mekonin whateverelse this is not our Faith and this is not our Hymnogpraphy! it has no place at all in the Orthodox Faith and in the Orthodox Church.

Those who confess JAH RASTAFARI we must pray for their conversion to the Orthodox Faith , but we can not accommodate such heresy to appease man. if they love the king as a political figure let them do so, but he is not the Messiah they say he is when they say JAH RASTAFARI.

May the prayers of the Saints be with us all.

In Christ,
Hiwot.
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To God be the Glory in all things! Amen!

Only pray for me, that God would give me both inward and outward strength, that I may not only speak, but truly will; and that I may not merely be called a Christian, but really be found to be one. St.Ignatius of Antioch.Epistle to the Romans.
Gebre Menfes Kidus
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« Reply #40 on: November 09, 2011, 01:26:32 PM »

I'm just some silly ferenji, but it has always seemed to me something curious that Ras Tafari, who the Rastafarians take to be some kind of incarnation of God, was an Orthodox Christian. I figure if it's good enough for "god", it is good enough for me and ought to be good enough for everyone! Hence in Ethiopia proper this Rastafarian ideology/theology is seen as foreign, and is therefore confined to tiny isolated places like Shashamene.

But don't take my word for it, read what Ethiopians themselves have to say about the Rastafrians in their midst. It does not seem terribly positive, outside of the Rastas being nice and teaching the Ethiopians English. This part in particular struck me as incredibly bizarre and to be rightfully rejected:

Quote
The Rastafarians say they plan "to educate" the Ethiopian people about their last Emperor.


Forgive me, but I have very little patience for this idea that people from Jamaica should be educating Ethiopians about their own rulers, history, and the proper appreciation or understanding of circumstances under which the Ethiopians themselves lived during the reign of said rulers in those years of their history. For a so-called "black liberation" movement (and that's what Rastafarianism is in the popular mind: a POLITICAL movement based on an assumed racial outlook), the Rastas in this case seem an awful lot like the colonizers they're supposedly fighting against. Like the 73 year old man in the article who claims that the West should help repatriate black people who want to return "to their native land" -- how many Jamaicans were taken from Ethiopia? How many black people in the West in general? I don't know the answers to these questions, but to expect Ethiopia, which has her own problems rooted in her own history and her own local circumstances (none of which the Rastafarians seem to completely appreciate, as they are fetishists, so they primarily see Ethiopia in cosmic, quasi-religious terms), to absorb immigrants from the West with their romantic notions and marijuana addictions simply because those westerners view Ethiopia as their "native land" even if they have no material or historical connection to it outside of their romanticizing of it seems insane.

I have known several Ethiopians and Rastafarians in my life. I have not known any Ethiopian Rastafarians (by which I mean Rastafrians of indigenous stock, not the immigrants who live in Ethiopia; Amhara Rastafarians, Oromo Rastafarians, Tigre Rastafarians, Sidaamo Rastafarians, etc). In fact, the two populations seem to mix about as well as oil and water. If I had to guess as to why this is, I would say that there is enough REAL religion and REAL history in Ethiopia that they probably don't have any need for any westerners' fake recasting of their country and its history and its religions. And I don't blame them. Orthodoxy, after all, is true, and Rastafarianism certainly is not. That's something I'm fairly certain Gebre would agree with, regardless of his affinities for the Rastafarian cult that I will openly admit I cannot even begin to understand.

I devote much of my life to promoting the Orthodox Tewahedo Faith to Rastafarians. I have debated, argued, discussed, and reasoned with Haile Selassie worshipers ad infinitum in an attempt to lead them to Jesus Christ and His True Orthodox Church. I have been persecuted and threatened by some Rastas for daring to proclaim Jesus Christ as the Way, the Truth, and the Life. But apparrently my Faith is now being questioned by an Orthodox sister. It makes me very sad.


Selam
« Last Edit: November 09, 2011, 01:28:38 PM by Gebre Menfes Kidus » Logged

"There are two great tragedies: one is to live a life ruled by the passions, and the other is to live a passionless life."
Selam, +GMK+
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« Reply #41 on: November 09, 2011, 01:39:59 PM »

I don't know too much about this topic and I am REALLY curious to hear your response to Hiwot's dissection of the terminology, Gebre. Nothing about personal issues or faith, just the use of the words "Jah" and "Rastafari." A purely linguistic argument, if you will.
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« Reply #42 on: November 09, 2011, 01:44:50 PM »

I don't know too much about this topic and I am REALLY curious to hear your response to Hiwot's dissection of the terminology, Gebre. Nothing about personal issues or faith, just the use of the words "Jah" and "Rastafari." A purely linguistic argument, if you will.

Yeah, I understand your interest. But I've explained it clearly already on this thread. If you don't mind, please go back and read what I've already posted. Thanks!


Selam
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"There are two great tragedies: one is to live a life ruled by the passions, and the other is to live a passionless life."
Selam, +GMK+
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« Reply #43 on: November 09, 2011, 01:49:05 PM »

I don't know too much about this topic and I am REALLY curious to hear your response to Hiwot's dissection of the terminology, Gebre. Nothing about personal issues or faith, just the use of the words "Jah" and "Rastafari." A purely linguistic argument, if you will.

Yeah, I understand your interest. But I've explained it clearly already on this thread. If you don't mind, please go back and read what I've already posted. Thanks!


Selam

all you said was that JAH RASTAFARI means JAH LORD OF CREATION which is in accord with the Rastafarian declaration of faith. but which is in direct opposition to the Orthodox Faith. Rastafari is not LORD OF CREATION is what I have been saying to you and what you inssit will continue to use regardless.

In Christ,
Hiwot.
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« Reply #44 on: November 09, 2011, 01:56:02 PM »

I don't know too much about this topic and I am REALLY curious to hear your response to Hiwot's dissection of the terminology, Gebre. Nothing about personal issues or faith, just the use of the words "Jah" and "Rastafari." A purely linguistic argument, if you will.

Yeah, I understand your interest. But I've explained it clearly already on this thread. If you don't mind, please go back and read what I've already posted. Thanks!


Selam

all you said was that JAH RASTAFARI means JAH LORD OF CREATION which is in accord with the Rastafarian declaration of faith. but which is in direct opposition to the Orthodox Faith. Rastafari is not LORD OF CREATION is what I have been saying to you and what you inssit will continue to use regardless.

In Christ,
Hiwot.

Dear sister, once again you are in error. That is not all that I said. Please take the time to go back a re-read my comments. If you think that I am an idolater and a liar, then I once again ask that you pray for me a sinner. No need to continue to your argumentative behavior. OK? Thank you my sister.


Selam
« Last Edit: November 09, 2011, 01:56:33 PM by Gebre Menfes Kidus » Logged

"There are two great tragedies: one is to live a life ruled by the passions, and the other is to live a passionless life."
Selam, +GMK+
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