Topic: Muslims Want Catholic School to Provide Room Without Crosses

[sainthieu]

Yeah, right.

"Catholic University has been accused of violating the human rights of Muslim students by not allowing them to form a Muslim student group and by not providing them rooms without Christian symbols for their daily prayers, according to a complaint filed with the Washington, D.C. Office of Human Rights.

The 60-page complaint said Muslim students “must perform their prayers surrounded by symbols of Catholicism – e.g., a wooden crucifix, paintings of Jesus, pictures of priests and theologians which many Muslim students find inappropriate.”"

I have a solution for them: don't attend a Christian school.

[Ortho_cat]

i thought they respected Jesus and the fact that he died on the cross?

[akimori makoto]

i thought they respected Jesus and the fact that he died on the cross?

They say he never died on the cross.

[PeterTheAleut]

I have a solution for them: don't attend a Christian school.

QFT!

I have a phone number they can call: 1-800-WAAAAAA

[Shiny]

i thought they respected Jesus and the fact that he died on the cross?

They say he never died on the cross.

One of the craziest theories ever purported.

Don't they also say he moved the rock with his own hands?

[Ortho_cat]

i thought they respected Jesus and the fact that he died on the cross?

They say he never died on the cross.

oops ya forgot about that. Well they could just believe he is swooning there instead...

[Riddikulus]

Looks like the horse might have already bolted.

[Theophilos78]

One of the craziest theories ever purported.

Don't they also say he moved the rock with his own hands?

Ahmadiyya sect propagates that claim. Traditional and mainstream Islamic teaching is that Jesus was neither crucified nor killed.

[Theophilos78]

oops ya forgot about that. Well they could just believe he is swooning there instead...

Mainstream and traditionally most common Islamic theory is that of Jesus' replacement with Judas Iscariot. This view is also essential to the passion narrative in the medieval Gospel of Barnabas.

[Pikhristos Aftonf]

Completely outraged!!! Christians aren't allowed to even study at Alazhar university and that's a state-funded university, unlike the PRIVATE catholic schools and universities. when are westerners going to understand the double standards, hypocrisy and taqqiyah of Islam?
who screams about human rights when churches get burnt?

[Alpo]

Christians aren't allowed to even study at Alazhar university and that's a state-funded university, unlike the PRIVATE catholic schools and universities. when are westerners going to understand the double standards, hypocrisy and taqqiyah of Islam?

So if Muslims discriminate Christians, Christians should discriminate Muslims?

[Father Peter]

How is it discrimination to say 'this is a Christian school'?

[Alpo]

How is it discrimination to say 'this is a Christian school'?

I didn't mean that. It would be foolish to remove the crosses just because Muslims are demanding it. I understood that Pikhristos Aftonf was saying that since Christians aren't allowed in Muslim schools Christians shouldn't allow Muslims in Christian schools. That would be discrimination.

It could be though that I misunderstood what he/she was saying.

[IsmiLiora]

The crosses on the wall, wahhh, whatever. I've never been to Catholic (got accepted, but didn't want to live IN DC), but are there really religious symbols in every room?

Anyway, they chose to go there.

Not sure how I feel about them being prevented from starting a campus group, though. It's pretty common knowledge that a lot of students attending religious universities aren't all necessarily of the same religion. Plus, Catholic has allowed a Jewish student association to form, so preventing the Muslims from doing that is just weird. They should either prevent any other religious group from starting up a student group or leave that option on the table.

[JoeS]

Well, as the worm turns.  This is a perfect example of incrementalism.   The nose of the camel inside the tent?  If one is an adult and that adult applies to a Mormon school or a Catholic school that ADULT should understand that it may not comport with his or her personal religious slant.   I suspect that these Muslims have another adgenda ie to cause trouble and to somehow lessen the Catholicity of that school.   Call me paranoid but I see the trends of this religion and it aint pretty.   First it will be the crosses, then prayer time, then special bathrooms for washing their feet, and so on and so on.   

Folks this is what they do............They are at least honest in their intent on disrupting the norm for their sake.  We can show all the love and tolerance in the world for this religion and it will be just thrown aside and ignored.   Look at Egypt today and the problems the Copts are having.   In fact, look at any middle east country that has a Christian minority. 

[Eastern Mind]

I have a solution for them: don't attend a Christian school.

QFT!

I have a phone number they can call: 1-800-WAAAAAA

 

[BoredMeeting]

Christians aren't allowed to even study at Alazhar university and that's a state-funded university, unlike the PRIVATE catholic schools and universities. when are westerners going to understand the double standards, hypocrisy and taqqiyah of Islam?

So if Muslims discriminate Christians, Christians should discriminate Muslims?

I don't know that anyone has suggested that, but it would be nice if they were told to clean-up the discrimination and oppression in their part of the world before they bewail the injustice of having to gaze upon a crucifix while attending a Christian University in ours.

[Orual]

Christians aren't allowed to even study at Alazhar university and that's a state-funded university, unlike the PRIVATE catholic schools and universities. when are westerners going to understand the double standards, hypocrisy and taqqiyah of Islam?

So if Muslims discriminate Christians, Christians should discriminate Muslims?

I don't know that anyone has suggested that, but it would be nice if they were told to clean-up the discrimination and oppression in their part of the world before they bewail the injustice of having to gaze upon a crucifix while attending a Christian University in ours.

These Muslims don't have any more control over what you call "their part of the world" than you have over the EP or MP.

[bogdan]

which many Muslim students find inappropriate.”"

Are there "many" Muslim students at Catholic University?

I have a solution for them. http://www.lmgtfy.com/?q=mosques+near+%22Catholic+University%22+Washington+DC

[Pikhristos Aftonf]

Christians aren't allowed to even study at Alazhar university and that's a state-funded university, unlike the PRIVATE catholic schools and universities. when are westerners going to understand the double standards, hypocrisy and taqqiyah of Islam?

So if Muslims discriminate Christians, Christians should discriminate Muslims?

not at all, i am merely showing how two-faced Islam is! In Egypt, students must quote the Qur'an in Arabic exams (i got penalized for not doing that- what a rebel huh!)
Christians aren't allowed to study at a state-funded University! not a private catholic school, No a state University. i don't kid when i say that Christian girls are murdered because they refuse to wear the hijab at PUBLIC schools in Egypt!
its hypocritical to demand one thing and practice the other, and i can't think of a better case of hypocrisy than this.
I am not saying we shouldn't allow Muslims in Christian schools, i am just saying that if they choose to enroll in a Christian school, they have to follow the rules, even if that includes crosses in every square inch of every wall!

[AWR]

What if it was the other was around.  If a group of Christians were attending a school run by a Muslim organization, would it be wrong for them to want to have a prayer group in a room without Muslim symbols?

-   They are talking about the USA, not a foreign place.
-   They are not asking the Muslim symbols be but up instead, they just want a place without any symbols.

I do not think that the school should be forced to give these students what they want; I just think it is not an unreasonable request.
 (I assume that the students live on campus)

[Pikhristos Aftonf]

it is an unreasonable demand! they have choices of schools, there is no reason to go to a catholic school, and once you are there you must subscribe to the norm! also a school is for learning not prayer, that's what churches and mosques are for!

[IsmiLiora]

The sophomoric argument, "Because X group of Muslims/Muslim countries do this, we should do it too," is insane. If we are placing our democracy, values, ideals, economic system above every other country, WHY would we stoop down to that level?

Unless you all want to live in a theocracy or a really corrupt monarchy/"democracy" in the Middle East, then I apologize for my misunderstanding.

[Pikhristos Aftonf]

The West, that's us is always too lenient. it is how people are always allowed to trash Christianity with no response, whilst on the otherhand, a foul depiction of Muhammad and the entire Arab world boycotts Sweden. we can't deal with ignorance by appeasement, didn't work with Hitler and not going to work with Islam!
again, there is an established institution, they can't just join it to change it, they have the choice to go to a school that supports their freedom to worship.

[Pikhristos Aftonf]

The sophomoric argument, "Because X group of Muslims/Muslim countries do this, we should do it too," is insane. If we are placing our democracy, values, ideals, economic system above every other country, WHY would we stoop down to that level?

Unless you all want to live in a theocracy or a really corrupt monarchy/"democracy" in the Middle East, then I apologize for my misunderstanding.

sorry to burst your bubble, but its not a certain group of Muslims. Islam encourages Muslims in power to enslave and overpower people of other religions, it is not a religion, but a political cult! i am not saying all muslims are bad, just the ones that actually follow their religion to its fullness!

[vamrat]

And they probably want to replace the Crosses with their own pagan symbols.  Well, the only crescent they are getting from me is a full moon.

[scamandrius]

I have a solution for them: don't attend a Christian school.

Actually, I think it should read  "don't attend a Catholic school"(that actually believes what it preaches)!  There are plenty of Christian schools out there where you would never be able to detect a "Christian" identity.

[Ortho_cat]

And they probably want to replace the Crosses with their own pagan symbols.  Well, the only crescent they are getting from me is a full moon.

 

[recent convert]

Tell them to put up or shut up!

[Ansgar]

The West, that's us is always too lenient. it is how people are always allowed to trash Christianity with no response, whilst on the otherhand, a foul depiction of Muhammad and the entire Arab world boycotts Sweden. we can't deal with ignorance by appeasement, didn't work with Hitler and not going to work with Islam!
again, there is an established institution, they can't just join it to change it, they have the choice to go to a school that supports their freedom to worship.

If you are thinking about the Muhammed drawings, I am sad to say that it was Denmark. I still can't believe that we had to go through all that trouble because of a some drawings. Couldn't they just have burned our flag and then leave it at that?

[bogdan]

What if it was the other was around.  If a group of Christians were attending a school run by a Muslim organization, would it be wrong for them to want to have a prayer group in a room without Muslim symbols?

-   They are talking about the USA, not a foreign place.
-   They are not asking the Muslim symbols be but up instead, they just want a place without any symbols.

I do not think that the school should be forced to give these students what they want; I just think it is not an unreasonable request.
 (I assume that the students live on campus)

I would not have a problem praying in a room full of Muslim symbols. "Let God arise and let his enemies be scattered..." The only ones that should be upset by Christian prayer in a Muslim place are the demons.

[Pikhristos Aftonf]

If you are thinking about the Muhammad drawings, I am sad to say that it was Denmark. I still can't believe that we had to go through all that trouble because of a some drawings. Couldn't they just have burned our flag and then leave it at that?

yes my apologies it as Denmark, the point is: its not Muslims that are violent but Islam. Islam specifically states that Muslims should lie about their faith to make it sound more peaceful and appealing if they are a minority, but once they are a majority its their divinely appointed right to destroy and oppress other religions. its not isolated X groups of Muslims, Its ALL Muslims that practice their religion properly.

I would not have a problem praying in a room full of Muslim symbols. "Let God arise and let his enemies be scattered..." The only ones that should be upset by Christian prayer in a Muslim place are the demons.

there is no possible better way to express this!!! thank you so much! the Imams admit it! the crosses atop the churches were asked to be removed because it hurts us!, when they weren't removed the church was burnt! only demons should be worried about the cleansing of the cross!

[Riddikulus]

There is another way of looking at all this. I'm supposing that the Muslim students are paying for the privilege of attending this school? It might have been a courtesy in the first place to provide an uncrossed room for their private prayers. If you take folks' money, some catering to their needs might be expected in reciprocation. If they are they receiving eduction via charity, that might be different. Just a thought!

[akimori makoto]

There is another way of looking at all this. I'm supposing that the Muslim students are paying for the privilege of attending this school? It might have been a courtesy in the first place to provide an uncrossed room for their private prayers. If you take folks' money, some catering to their needs might be expected in reciprocation. If they are they receiving eduction via charity, that might be different. Just a thought!

This is quite sensible and charitable, but a charge of failing to generously cater to the needs of paying customers is a far cry from the accusation of "violation of human rights".

[Riddikulus]

There is another way of looking at all this. I'm supposing that the Muslim students are paying for the privilege of attending this school? It might have been a courtesy in the first place to provide an uncrossed room for their private prayers. If you take folks' money, some catering to their needs might be expected in reciprocation. If they are they receiving eduction via charity, that might be different. Just a thought!

This is quite sensible and charitable, but a charge of failing to generously cater to the needs of paying customers is a far cry from the accusation of "violation of human rights".

Of course. But things will always blow up out of all proportion. That's why we keep killing each other.

[dzheremi]

I have a solution for them: don't attend a Christian school.

QFT!

I have a phone number they can call: 1-800-WAAAAAA

Seriously. Somebody call the waaaahmbulance to take these kids to the waaaahspital.

All Christian schools should be Islam-free zones outside of comparative religion classes that make it clear that Islam is false. What a world we live in!

[Pikhristos Aftonf]

WHY the double standards? are christians allowed to go to an Islamic school? are christians allowed to eat pork at an islamic school? are christians allowed to eat during ramadan at islamic schools?
if you can answer yes to all the above, then muslims can have their cross-free room!
i insist, islam is double-faced one for the west and one in their own arab countries! Chrisitians are kiled for not wearing hijab, they are jailed for not fasting during ramadan, Qur'an encourages this! some would say : this is not representative of islam, just a small portion of muslims- to you i say "the qur'an teaches muslims that christians are the " children and grandchildren of monkeys and pigs" and are to be "killed wherever you might see them", are these the principles we want at catholic schools?"

[dzheremi]

Pikhristos Aftonf: The Roman Catholic Church specifically preaches a form of "popular monotheism" as relates to Islam via their Catechism (CCC 841), so they are far kinder to Islam than the other way around.

[Pikhristos Aftonf]

yes, i am unfortunately aware, the largest christian body is allowing the devil as a religion, Lord have Mercy!
the west needs to do more! Islam is phasing Christianity out as the dominant religion in Europe, the Americas are the only safe-havens of Christianity at the moment...

[dzheremi]

I wouldn't count on the Roman Catholic Church to do anything positive about that, unfortunately. I know plenty of Maronites, Melkites, and other Eastern Catholics who know better, but they obviously don't call the shots, unfortunately.

The best bet is widespread Orthodox evangelism in the West, of course.

[Pikhristos Aftonf]

i completely agree, and i have my own theory behind the reasons:
the melkites, Maronites, etc as well as the orthodox such as the copts and syriacs all live in the middle east where they are exposed to the truth of Islam, so when they migrate to a western country they can voice their criticism of the devillish cult! European immigrants on the other hand presuppose that all humans have basic human decency and moral code, and assume that muslims don't have a sinister agenda, that's where the problems arise!

[Hiwot]

What if it was the other was around.  If a group of Christians were attending a school run by a Muslim organization, would it be wrong for them to want to have a prayer group in a room without Muslim symbols?

-   They are talking about the USA, not a foreign place.
-   They are not asking the Muslim symbols be but up instead, they just want a place without any symbols.

I do not think that the school should be forced to give these students what they want; I just think it is not an unreasonable request.
 (I assume that the students live on campus)

I would not have a problem praying in a room full of Muslim symbols. "Let God arise and let his enemies be scattered..." The only ones that should be upset by Christian prayer in a Muslim place are the demons.

indeed!!! reminds me of this old monk back in Ethio that was also the bell ringer that calls for the morning prayer, and  a few miles from St. Michael Church there is a mosque, and the muzzeyen says ahzzan nearly at the same time, so the monk always tries to be the first one to ring the bell and always says " Let God Arise and Let His enemies be scattered!" and also adds grinning while the azzan is heard a few minutes later,' well if you have to echo it, why not come over and do it the right way with us'  

[Hiwot]

I have a solution for them: don't attend a Christian school.

QFT!

I have a phone number they can call: 1-800-WAAAAAA

Seriously. Somebody call the waaaahmbulance to take these kids to the waaaahspital.

All Christian schools should be Islam-free zones outside of comparative religion classes that make it clear that Islam is false. What a world we live in!

AMEN!!!

[dzheremi]

Pikhristos Aftonf:

In addition to what you wrote, a lot of Europeans and Americans don't speak Arabic, so they don't know any better and sometimes assume that the bad things the Middle Eastern Christians tell them about Islam are sour grapes or just blind sectarianism or whatever.

Islam knows how to manipulate things to get good PR for itself, and lots of westerners (I feel like this is particularly true of Americans, but maybe others too) like to root for the "underdog", so when their Muslim "friends" talk about the nakba or Sabra and Shatila or whatever, the Westerners think "Oh, poor Muslims! They are so oppressed!" Their Muslim friends don't tell them about the robberies, forced taxes and other intimidation that the Christian communities around Tel al Zaatar were subjected to before that which led to so much tension and calls for the camp to be closed, and much less about the Damour massacre in 1976 that killed 684 civilians at the hands of the PLO and the LNM. Damour was a Christian town, so of course it never comes up...

So, yes...ignorance and manipulation of the sympathies of the well-meaning but naive westerners. Nobody listens to the Middle Eastern Christians, nobody in the West defends their own values or religion, and so Islam continues to grow unabated. Lord have mercy...

[Pikhristos Aftonf]

this world is not ours! there are no people luckier than the  Christians of the middle-east: crowns of martyrdom, crowns of persecution!