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Author Topic: I can barely abide Church these days  (Read 2801 times) Average Rating: 0
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akimori makoto
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No-one bound by fleshly pleasures is worthy ...


« on: October 08, 2011, 09:10:24 PM »

I'm at my wit's end. The obscene, disrespectful, generally irreverent and personally rude behaviour that goes on in my parish is slowly driving me to stop going to Church.

Please pray that I will get my head and heart in the right place and keep going to Church.
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« Reply #1 on: October 08, 2011, 09:23:27 PM »

Lord, have mercy! I pray that things get better. Remember the prize at the end of the race.
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« Reply #2 on: October 08, 2011, 09:25:23 PM »

Lord, have mercy on your servant.
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« Reply #3 on: October 08, 2011, 09:25:49 PM »

Lord, have mercy!
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« Reply #4 on: October 08, 2011, 09:43:29 PM »

Lord have mercy on you and your parish.

Wisdom of the Father, Jesus, give to your servant the wisdom to be able to discern how to approach this current situation, amen.
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« Reply #5 on: October 08, 2011, 10:36:10 PM »

Lord have mercy.
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« Reply #6 on: October 08, 2011, 10:39:41 PM »

Very sorry to read this.  Lord, have mercy.

Where's the priest in this mess?
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« Reply #7 on: October 08, 2011, 11:02:24 PM »

Lord, have mercy!
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« Reply #8 on: October 08, 2011, 11:23:25 PM »

Lord have mercy!
ah! i would also say whatever you do, do not engage this spirit directly with those that it motivates, it will only harm you, takes away you peace, so stay calm and pray for the spirit of humility and love, attend all the services,keep in mind that sometimes trials come to the individual or to the group as a whole, so this is a time to hold on. the whole parish needs prayers right now, this is not an easy matter. i have seen parishes unravelled when this spirit took over. Lord have mercy!
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« Reply #9 on: October 08, 2011, 11:51:55 PM »

Lord have mercy.

Maybe you should try a different parish.
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« Reply #10 on: October 09, 2011, 12:49:26 AM »

Lord have mercy!


If your parish didn't have saint-makers, how would you become a saint?
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« Reply #11 on: October 09, 2011, 01:24:22 AM »

Lord have mercy!
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« Reply #12 on: October 09, 2011, 01:48:28 AM »

Lord have mercy, is there perhaps another parish you could go to (If your curent one is causing you to fall into such despair)?
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« Reply #13 on: October 09, 2011, 02:12:24 AM »

Lord, have mercy.
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« Reply #14 on: October 09, 2011, 08:05:46 AM »

I'm at my wit's end. The obscene, disrespectful, generally irreverent and personally rude behaviour that goes on in my parish is slowly driving me to stop going to Church.

Please pray that I will get my head and heart in the right place and keep going to Church.

During Divine Services? During social time after Services? During other activities?

My own guidelines for Services:  Sit as close to the front as possible and close to the center. Focus on the Services (Priest/Chanters/Choir/etc.) without regard to what go on behind or beside you. Prior to and after communion focus on the preparation and thanksgiving prayers. Have a prayer taped in your Service book or otherwise available to pray during times that you may be easily distracted.
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« Reply #15 on: October 09, 2011, 08:26:51 AM »

I have the same problem but I've just let go and look to my own behavior..People in my parish talk and jabber during Church and while they go up to Communion shake hands and visit..I do not know their heart and I cannot and will not judge..I remember how I was raised and how my Baba and mother taught me how to behave so all of this is on me...I do ,however,refuse to talk in Church beyond a nod and "good morning"...Its kind of funny when people start to engage and I just say. " I'm sorry but I was taught to not talk in Church"....
I often wonder what people believe happens during Communion..but I know what I was taught so I behave accordingly.."put away all earthly cares" includes who is dating whom and how hard it is to find a parking place and all of this can be discussed during coffee hour if it needs to be discussed at all......
Having pews {YUCK} does make it more difficult to move...
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« Reply #16 on: October 09, 2011, 02:29:45 PM »

Lord have mercy!


If your parish didn't have saint-makers, how would you become a saint?

Exactly.

This may sound trite, but it's just distilled from what I've read about holy people. When we adopt a positive attitude toward others, especially if they aggravate us, we create a change for the better in them and in us. Rather than become angry and stay away, we ought all the more to struggle and keep going and ask for God's help to be able to see our disrespectful brethren as still better than ourselves, for the visible hardly ever corresponds, in the truth of things, to the invisible. Our Lord appeared as an ordinary man, and yet was God. We appear pious, and yet harbor all kinds of filth in our hearts. Others may appear impious and disrespectful, and yet they do not indulge in passions as we do. We can't know. We are called to be a light to the world and to bear the burdens of others.

May God help you, them, and all of us.
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« Reply #17 on: October 09, 2011, 04:02:03 PM »

Oh Akimori, I know how you feel. Sad the others do have good points about sticking it out. of course it is ultimately your decision but an ailing church needs people and belong to the body of the church in their unique way. If we all just left, what will be left?

I feel I might be sympathetic to your circumstances so Pm me if you need to rant.

Lord have mercy!
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« Reply #18 on: October 09, 2011, 05:21:15 PM »

I totally understand where you're coming from, Akimori. I have wrestled with these same issues.  While it is easy to agree with Isa and stick it out for the sake of the kingdom, it is always so much harder to do it.  And while it is easy to also leave to find another parish, I don't think any parish (outside of a monastic church) will give you that sense of "quiet" for you to appropriately pray for your soul and those of others.  So, I am sorry that I have no solutions to give to you.  But your prayers are also mine.

One thing that you should absolutely do which has been already suggested:  Please, talk to your priest.  And do so, ASAP.

Kyrie eleison.
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« Reply #19 on: October 09, 2011, 06:12:48 PM »

Try a ROCOR church.
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« Reply #20 on: October 09, 2011, 06:50:58 PM »

I'm at my wit's end. The obscene, disrespectful, generally irreverent and personally rude behaviour that goes on in my parish is slowly driving me to stop going to Church.

Please pray that I will get my head and heart in the right place and keep going to Church.

I used to have similar thoughts about my own parish, then I realized it's no more than I deserve. Who am I to complain? Ya know...
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No-one bound by fleshly pleasures is worthy ...


« Reply #21 on: October 09, 2011, 10:28:34 PM »

Sensitive and nuanced advice from different perspectives -- thank you all so much for taking the time to pray for this unworthy sinner.
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No-one bound by fleshly pleasures is worthy ...


« Reply #22 on: October 09, 2011, 10:29:11 PM »

Try a ROCOR church.

This is quickly becoming an attractive option.
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The Episcopallian road is easy and wide, for many go through it to find destruction. lol sorry channeling Isa.
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« Reply #23 on: October 09, 2011, 10:51:02 PM »

Try a ROCOR church.

This is quickly becoming an attractive option.
If you're single, do it.
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« Reply #24 on: October 30, 2011, 08:31:38 PM »

akimori makoto
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Please pray that I will get my head and heart in the right place and keep going to Church.

Still praying and hoping that this is the case.
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« Reply #25 on: October 30, 2011, 08:55:00 PM »

Me too.
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No-one bound by fleshly pleasures is worthy ...


« Reply #26 on: February 28, 2012, 03:54:34 PM »

*Bump*

Immediately following forgiveness vespers (I kid you not), my mum and I got verbally abused and physically intimidated by insane Greeks for our apparently bad parking.

What is with these people? How do they call themselves Christians when they are so full of malice and spite and hypocrisy? Is this a church or some sort of glorified marketplace of whores, robbers and liars?

I can't take this crap any more. I feel like I am going to snap one day and find the most WASP-y church possible and start attending there, just for a little sanity ...
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« Reply #27 on: February 28, 2012, 03:56:48 PM »

*Bump*

Immediately following forgiveness vespers (I kid you not), my mum and I got verbally abused and physically intimidated by insane Greeks for our apparently bad parking.

What is with these people? How do they call themselves Christians when they are so full of malice and spite and hypocrisy? Is this a church or some sort of glorified marketplace of whores, robbers and liars?

I can't take this crap any more. I feel like I am going to snap one day and find the most WASP-y church possible and start attending there, just for a little sanity ...
Akimori,

Please leave Australia. Come to America or Canada. There is nothing for you in that forsaken desert.

Have you ever looked at a Kangaroo's arms? No animal should have to have such arms.

Lord, have mercy
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« Reply #28 on: February 28, 2012, 04:23:22 PM »

*Bump*

Immediately following forgiveness vespers (I kid you not), my mum and I got verbally abused and physically intimidated by insane Greeks for our apparently bad parking.

What is with these people? How do they call themselves Christians when they are so full of malice and spite and hypocrisy? Is this a church or some sort of glorified marketplace of whores, robbers and liars?

I can't take this crap any more. I feel like I am going to snap one day and find the most WASP-y church possible and start attending there, just for a little sanity ...
Akimori,

Please leave Australia. Come to America or Canada. There is nothing for you in that forsaken desert.

Have you ever looked at a Kangaroo's arms? No animal should have to have such arms.

Lord, have mercy

Nicholas might have a point. I'd consider Britain as well; we have nice butterflies and no guns.

#laughs

Seriously though, i am still praying for your situation.
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« Reply #29 on: February 28, 2012, 05:44:13 PM »

*Bump*

Immediately following forgiveness vespers (I kid you not), my mum and I got verbally abused and physically intimidated by insane Greeks for our apparently bad parking.

What is with these people? How do they call themselves Christians when they are so full of malice and spite and hypocrisy? Is this a church or some sort of glorified marketplace of whores, robbers and liars?

I can't take this crap any more. I feel like I am going to snap one day and find the most WASP-y church possible and start attending there, just for a little sanity ...
Akimori,

Please leave Australia. Come to America or Canada. There is nothing for you in that forsaken desert.

Have you ever looked at a Kangaroo's arms? No animal should have to have such arms.

Lord, have mercy

Nicholas might have a point. I'd consider Britain as well; we have nice butterflies and no guns.

#laughs

Seriously though, i am still praying for your situation.

You're more than welcome to come to Omaha.  We have plenty of nice Orthodox Churches in town and we haven't hung or run Greeks out of town since the early 1900's!

Also, we too have butterflies, and lots of guns!

All the same, I will pray for you that God gives you comfort in this issue, my friend.
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« Reply #30 on: February 28, 2012, 06:12:30 PM »

fountain pen, didn't know u were in britain too, did u actually see any butterflies yet? it is much warmer than last week, so maybe there are some already. i wish u a lovely spring with many butterflies.

aikimori makoto, i also think u should visit another orthodox church. not to leave yr church, but just to find some spiritual food while u work on becoming a saint so u can love yr church more (and when u are a saint, pls tell us sinners how to love others more as well!)
if the other churches are terrible too, maybe u have a problem and u will get an idea what u have to work on. if the other churches are much more helpful, then u will have the spiritual nourishment u need to learn how to deal with yr church. sometimes people in the church do need to make changes, but u need to be humble about it, and i pray God will show u how to do that.
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« Reply #31 on: February 29, 2012, 12:23:00 AM »

Lord, have mercy.
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« Reply #32 on: February 29, 2012, 12:28:54 AM »

Sad Lord have mercy!
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« Reply #33 on: February 29, 2012, 12:58:27 AM »

Lord have mercy.

Perhaps look into the ROCOR or an Old Calendar Church?
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« Reply #34 on: February 29, 2012, 01:07:28 AM »

Lord, have mercy!
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« Reply #35 on: February 29, 2012, 07:55:04 AM »

I hate to tell you this, but there are sinners in the ROCOR and Old Calendar churches as well.  I bet any priests of those churches would tell you that you could very well run into these problems at any parish, unfortunately. 
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« Reply #36 on: February 29, 2012, 12:05:10 PM »

Lord have mercy.
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« Reply #37 on: February 29, 2012, 01:40:45 PM »

Have you shared these thoughts with your priest in confession?
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« Reply #38 on: February 29, 2012, 02:24:04 PM »


Akimori, I'm sorry to hear how you were treated!  Remember, these are just people, and they aren't perfect.  Perhaps the husband and wife quarreled and simply took their frustration out on you.

You should pity the poor souls who can't control their temper, their actions or words.

You're need to simply "let it go".  I know it's hard, but, people will be rude to you, no matter where you are.  Don't take it to heart.

...like water off a ducks back.

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« Reply #39 on: February 29, 2012, 03:56:44 PM »

Lord, have mercy.
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« Reply #40 on: February 29, 2012, 05:13:39 PM »

Thank you all so much, for the prayers, the encouragement, the advice and for just allowing me a place to vent.
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« Reply #41 on: February 29, 2012, 05:15:11 PM »

Have you shared these thoughts with your priest in confession?

I haven't, because I feel a strong temptation to allow the confession to become a private bitching session.

Father is aware of how I feel, though perhaps not the specifics of what goes on when he's not looking.
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« Reply #42 on: February 29, 2012, 05:55:33 PM »

I think you should go for anyway. Tell him to tell you to shut up if you get too rant-ish, since you're worried about it.  Wink

At the very least, he should probably know some of the specifics.
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« Reply #43 on: February 29, 2012, 05:57:15 PM »

In cases like that I would have just cussed back, and barely remembered the incident after. It works better.
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Faith: Christian
Jurisdiction: Body of Christ
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« Reply #44 on: February 29, 2012, 06:12:24 PM »

In cases like that I would have just cussed back, and barely remembered the incident after. It works better.

I am pretty much with you on this one.  Better to have to confess a few terse words said to these people than have my whole faith in danger because I held it in.
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Orthodox only because of God and His Russians.
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