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akimori makoto
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« on: October 08, 2011, 09:10:24 PM » |
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I'm at my wit's end. The obscene, disrespectful, generally irreverent and personally rude behaviour that goes on in my parish is slowly driving me to stop going to Church.
Please pray that I will get my head and heart in the right place and keep going to Church.
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The Episcopallian road is easy and wide, for many go through it to find destruction. lol sorry channeling Isa.
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zekarja
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Papa Abba St Cyril, of Alexandria, pray for us!
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« Reply #1 on: October 08, 2011, 09:23:27 PM » |
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Lord, have mercy! I pray that things get better. Remember the prize at the end of the race.
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Riddikulus
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« Reply #2 on: October 08, 2011, 09:25:23 PM » |
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Lord, have mercy on your servant.
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I believe in One God, maker of heaven and earth and of all things visible and invisible.
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Stephanos Nikolaos
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Hosanna in the highest!
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« Reply #3 on: October 08, 2011, 09:25:49 PM » |
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Lord, have mercy!
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“But I say to you who hear: Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, bless those who curse you, and pray for those who spitefully use you. To him who strikes you on the one cheek, offer the other also. And from him who takes away your cloak, do not withhold your tunic either.” +Luke 6:27-29
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Առէ'ք, Կերէ'ք այս է մարմին իմ:
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« Reply #4 on: October 08, 2011, 09:43:29 PM » |
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Lord have mercy on you and your parish.
Wisdom of the Father, Jesus, give to your servant the wisdom to be able to discern how to approach this current situation, amen.
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biro
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« Reply #5 on: October 08, 2011, 10:36:10 PM » |
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Lord have mercy.
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Cognomen
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« Reply #6 on: October 08, 2011, 10:39:41 PM » |
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Very sorry to read this. Lord, have mercy.
Where's the priest in this mess?
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"Paint a bunch of icons of our Lord and the saints and then kiss them. Also, pray to Mary after she dies in the future."
~ The Epistle of St. Paul to the Antiochians, 46 AD.
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Alveus Lacuna
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« Reply #7 on: October 08, 2011, 11:02:24 PM » |
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Lord, have mercy!
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Hiwot
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Job 19:25-27
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« Reply #8 on: October 08, 2011, 11:23:25 PM » |
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Lord have mercy!
ah! i would also say whatever you do, do not engage this spirit directly with those that it motivates, it will only harm you, takes away you peace, so stay calm and pray for the spirit of humility and love, attend all the services,keep in mind that sometimes trials come to the individual or to the group as a whole, so this is a time to hold on. the whole parish needs prayers right now, this is not an easy matter. i have seen parishes unravelled when this spirit took over. Lord have mercy!
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To God be the Glory in all things! Amen!
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Volnutt
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« Reply #9 on: October 08, 2011, 11:51:55 PM » |
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Lord have mercy.
Maybe you should try a different parish.
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I'm not posting on oc.net for the time being. Thank you to everyone for your support!
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ialmisry
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« Reply #10 on: October 09, 2011, 12:49:26 AM » |
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Lord have mercy!
If your parish didn't have saint-makers, how would you become a saint?
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Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
and both come out of your mouth
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JamesRottnek
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« Reply #11 on: October 09, 2011, 01:24:22 AM » |
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Lord have mercy!
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I know a secret about a former Supreme Court Justice. Can you guess what it is?
The greatest tragedy in the world is when a cigarette ends.
American Spirits - the eco-friendly cigarette.
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Robb
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« Reply #12 on: October 09, 2011, 01:48:28 AM » |
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Lord have mercy, is there perhaps another parish you could go to (If your curent one is causing you to fall into such despair)?
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Men may dislike truth, men may find truth offensive and inconvenient, men may persecute the truth, subvert it, try by law to suppress it. But to maintain that men have the final power over truth is blasphemy, and the last delusion. Truth lives forever, men do not.
-- Gustave Flaubert
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NicholasMyra
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« Reply #13 on: October 09, 2011, 02:12:24 AM » |
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Lord, have mercy.
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arnI
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« Reply #14 on: October 09, 2011, 08:05:46 AM » |
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I'm at my wit's end. The obscene, disrespectful, generally irreverent and personally rude behaviour that goes on in my parish is slowly driving me to stop going to Church.
Please pray that I will get my head and heart in the right place and keep going to Church.
During Divine Services? During social time after Services? During other activities? My own guidelines for Services: Sit as close to the front as possible and close to the center. Focus on the Services (Priest/Chanters/Choir/etc.) without regard to what go on behind or beside you. Prior to and after communion focus on the preparation and thanksgiving prayers. Have a prayer taped in your Service book or otherwise available to pray during times that you may be easily distracted. |
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Grant me to see my own errors and not to judge my brother
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SDMPNS
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Praise God for the beauty of Creation
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« Reply #15 on: October 09, 2011, 08:26:51 AM » |
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I have the same problem but I've just let go and look to my own behavior..People in my parish talk and jabber during Church and while they go up to Communion shake hands and visit..I do not know their heart and I cannot and will not judge..I remember how I was raised and how my Baba and mother taught me how to behave so all of this is on me...I do ,however,refuse to talk in Church beyond a nod and "good morning"...Its kind of funny when people start to engage and I just say. " I'm sorry but I was taught to not talk in Church"....
I often wonder what people believe happens during Communion..but I know what I was taught so I behave accordingly.."put away all earthly cares" includes who is dating whom and how hard it is to find a parking place and all of this can be discussed during coffee hour if it needs to be discussed at all......
Having pews {YUCK} does make it more difficult to move...
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Shanghaiski
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« Reply #16 on: October 09, 2011, 02:29:45 PM » |
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Lord have mercy!
If your parish didn't have saint-makers, how would you become a saint?
Exactly. This may sound trite, but it's just distilled from what I've read about holy people. When we adopt a positive attitude toward others, especially if they aggravate us, we create a change for the better in them and in us. Rather than become angry and stay away, we ought all the more to struggle and keep going and ask for God's help to be able to see our disrespectful brethren as still better than ourselves, for the visible hardly ever corresponds, in the truth of things, to the invisible. Our Lord appeared as an ordinary man, and yet was God. We appear pious, and yet harbor all kinds of filth in our hearts. Others may appear impious and disrespectful, and yet they do not indulge in passions as we do. We can't know. We are called to be a light to the world and to bear the burdens of others. May God help you, them, and all of us. |
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O Master Lord our God...who are wondrous in glory; who keeps his covenant and his mercy to them who love him with all their heart; who has given us redemption...through his only-begotten son, Jesus Christ...the life of everyone, the help of those who flee to him, the hope of those who cry to him.
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IsmiLiora
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« Reply #17 on: October 09, 2011, 04:02:03 PM » |
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Oh Akimori, I know how you feel.  the others do have good points about sticking it out. of course it is ultimately your decision but an ailing church needs people and belong to the body of the church in their unique way. If we all just left, what will be left? I feel I might be sympathetic to your circumstances so Pm me if you need to rant. Lord have mercy! |
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She's touring the facility/and picking up slack.
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"For in much wisdom is much grief, and he who increases knowledge increases sorrow." Ecclesiastes 1:18
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I once believed in causes too, I had my pointless point of view --
Life went on no matter who was wrong or right
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scamandrius
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« Reply #18 on: October 09, 2011, 05:21:15 PM » |
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I totally understand where you're coming from, Akimori. I have wrestled with these same issues. While it is easy to agree with Isa and stick it out for the sake of the kingdom, it is always so much harder to do it. And while it is easy to also leave to find another parish, I don't think any parish (outside of a monastic church) will give you that sense of "quiet" for you to appropriately pray for your soul and those of others. So, I am sorry that I have no solutions to give to you. But your prayers are also mine.
One thing that you should absolutely do which has been already suggested: Please, talk to your priest. And do so, ASAP.
Kyrie eleison.
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I seek the truth by which no man was ever harmed--Marcus Aurelius Those who do not read history are doomed to get their facts from Hollywood--Anonymous What earthly joy remains untouched by grief?--St. John Damascene http://myorthodoxjourney.blogspot.com/ |
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Clancy Boy
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« Reply #19 on: October 09, 2011, 06:12:48 PM » |
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Try a ROCOR church.
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samkim
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« Reply #20 on: October 09, 2011, 06:50:58 PM » |
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I'm at my wit's end. The obscene, disrespectful, generally irreverent and personally rude behaviour that goes on in my parish is slowly driving me to stop going to Church.
Please pray that I will get my head and heart in the right place and keep going to Church.
I used to have similar thoughts about my own parish, then I realized it's no more than I deserve. Who am I to complain? Ya know... |
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주 예수 그리스도 하느님의 아들이시여 저 이 죄인을 불쌍히 여기소서.
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akimori makoto
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« Reply #21 on: October 09, 2011, 10:28:34 PM » |
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Sensitive and nuanced advice from different perspectives -- thank you all so much for taking the time to pray for this unworthy sinner.
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The Episcopallian road is easy and wide, for many go through it to find destruction. lol sorry channeling Isa.
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akimori makoto
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« Reply #22 on: October 09, 2011, 10:29:11 PM » |
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Try a ROCOR church.
This is quickly becoming an attractive option. |
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The Episcopallian road is easy and wide, for many go through it to find destruction. lol sorry channeling Isa.
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Achronos
What's so good about Cincinnati? You like it? You think Cincinnati is cool? I've never heard anyone say, 'I'm going to Cincinnati on vacation.'
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« Reply #23 on: October 09, 2011, 10:51:02 PM » |
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Try a ROCOR church.
This is quickly becoming an attractive option. If you're single, do it. |
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“Without music, life would be a mistake.”
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"We see at once that the words absolute, divine, eternal, and so on do not express what is implied in them.
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FountainPen
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« Reply #24 on: October 30, 2011, 08:31:38 PM » |
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akimori makoto Please pray that I will get my head and heart in the right place and keep going to Church. Still praying and hoping that this is the case. |
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« Last Edit: October 30, 2011, 08:32:51 PM by FountainPen »
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None of us can have as many virtues as the fountain pen, or half its cussedness; but we can try. Mark Twain
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Volnutt
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« Reply #25 on: October 30, 2011, 08:55:00 PM » |
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Me too.
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I'm not posting on oc.net for the time being. Thank you to everyone for your support!
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akimori makoto
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« Reply #26 on: February 28, 2012, 03:54:34 PM » |
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*Bump*
Immediately following forgiveness vespers (I kid you not), my mum and I got verbally abused and physically intimidated by insane Greeks for our apparently bad parking.
What is with these people? How do they call themselves Christians when they are so full of malice and spite and hypocrisy? Is this a church or some sort of glorified marketplace of whores, robbers and liars?
I can't take this crap any more. I feel like I am going to snap one day and find the most WASP-y church possible and start attending there, just for a little sanity ...
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The Episcopallian road is easy and wide, for many go through it to find destruction. lol sorry channeling Isa.
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NicholasMyra
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« Reply #27 on: February 28, 2012, 03:56:48 PM » |
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*Bump*
Immediately following forgiveness vespers (I kid you not), my mum and I got verbally abused and physically intimidated by insane Greeks for our apparently bad parking.
What is with these people? How do they call themselves Christians when they are so full of malice and spite and hypocrisy? Is this a church or some sort of glorified marketplace of whores, robbers and liars?
I can't take this crap any more. I feel like I am going to snap one day and find the most WASP-y church possible and start attending there, just for a little sanity ...
Akimori, Please leave Australia. Come to America or Canada. There is nothing for you in that forsaken desert. Have you ever looked at a Kangaroo's arms? No animal should have to have such arms. Lord, have mercy |
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FountainPen
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« Reply #28 on: February 28, 2012, 04:23:22 PM » |
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*Bump*
Immediately following forgiveness vespers (I kid you not), my mum and I got verbally abused and physically intimidated by insane Greeks for our apparently bad parking.
What is with these people? How do they call themselves Christians when they are so full of malice and spite and hypocrisy? Is this a church or some sort of glorified marketplace of whores, robbers and liars?
I can't take this crap any more. I feel like I am going to snap one day and find the most WASP-y church possible and start attending there, just for a little sanity ...
Akimori, Please leave Australia. Come to America or Canada. There is nothing for you in that forsaken desert. Have you ever looked at a Kangaroo's arms? No animal should have to have such arms. Lord, have mercy Nicholas might have a point. I'd consider Britain as well; we have nice butterflies and no guns. #laughs Seriously though, i am still praying for your situation. |
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« Last Edit: February 28, 2012, 04:23:59 PM by FountainPen »
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None of us can have as many virtues as the fountain pen, or half its cussedness; but we can try. Mark Twain
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vamrat
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« Reply #29 on: February 28, 2012, 05:44:13 PM » |
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*Bump*
Immediately following forgiveness vespers (I kid you not), my mum and I got verbally abused and physically intimidated by insane Greeks for our apparently bad parking.
What is with these people? How do they call themselves Christians when they are so full of malice and spite and hypocrisy? Is this a church or some sort of glorified marketplace of whores, robbers and liars?
I can't take this crap any more. I feel like I am going to snap one day and find the most WASP-y church possible and start attending there, just for a little sanity ...
Akimori, Please leave Australia. Come to America or Canada. There is nothing for you in that forsaken desert. Have you ever looked at a Kangaroo's arms? No animal should have to have such arms. Lord, have mercy Nicholas might have a point. I'd consider Britain as well; we have nice butterflies and no guns. #laughs Seriously though, i am still praying for your situation. You're more than welcome to come to Omaha. We have plenty of nice Orthodox Churches in town and we haven't hung or run Greeks out of town since the early 1900's! Also, we too have butterflies, and lots of guns! All the same, I will pray for you that God gives you comfort in this issue, my friend. |
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It is an education process for me as I learn about the psychology of spiritual apostasy. And others get the benefit of perhaps hearing righteousness for the first time.
Blessed are the Peacemakers, for they shall be called the sons of God.
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mabsoota
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Kyrie eleison
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« Reply #30 on: February 28, 2012, 06:12:30 PM » |
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fountain pen, didn't know u were in britain too, did u actually see any butterflies yet? it is much warmer than last week, so maybe there are some already. i wish u a lovely spring with many butterflies.
aikimori makoto, i also think u should visit another orthodox church. not to leave yr church, but just to find some spiritual food while u work on becoming a saint so u can love yr church more (and when u are a saint, pls tell us sinners how to love others more as well!)
if the other churches are terrible too, maybe u have a problem and u will get an idea what u have to work on. if the other churches are much more helpful, then u will have the spiritual nourishment u need to learn how to deal with yr church. sometimes people in the church do need to make changes, but u need to be humble about it, and i pray God will show u how to do that.
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Maximum Bob
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« Reply #31 on: February 29, 2012, 12:23:00 AM » |
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Lord, have mercy.
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Prov. 3: 5-6 Trust in the Lord with all your heart, lean not on your own understanding; in all your ways acknowledge Him, and He shall direct your paths.
Psalm 37:23 The Lord guides a man safely in the way he should go.
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Ionnis
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« Reply #32 on: February 29, 2012, 12:28:54 AM » |
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Lord have mercy! |
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“Till we can become divine, we must be content to be human, lest in our hurry for change we sink to something lower.” -Anthony Trollope
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Maria
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O most Holy Theotokos, save us.
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« Reply #33 on: February 29, 2012, 12:58:27 AM » |
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Lord have mercy.
Perhaps look into the ROCOR or an Old Calendar Church?
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Glory to Jesus Christ!
Glory to Him forever!
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IXOYE
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« Reply #34 on: February 29, 2012, 01:07:28 AM » |
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Lord, have mercy!
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katherine 2001
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« Reply #35 on: February 29, 2012, 07:55:04 AM » |
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I hate to tell you this, but there are sinners in the ROCOR and Old Calendar churches as well. I bet any priests of those churches would tell you that you could very well run into these problems at any parish, unfortunately.
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orthonorm
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« Reply #36 on: February 29, 2012, 12:05:10 PM » |
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Lord have mercy.
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We cannot legislate morality by passing laws controlling firearms. The only evil we can combat lies within our hearts. We need stronger laws to protect the moral foundation of society against the evil of gay marriage. |
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Nigula Qian Zishi
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« Reply #37 on: February 29, 2012, 01:40:45 PM » |
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Have you shared these thoughts with your priest in confession?
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LizaSymonenko
Христос Воскрес!!! Christ is Risen!!!
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« Reply #38 on: February 29, 2012, 02:24:04 PM » |
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Akimori, I'm sorry to hear how you were treated! Remember, these are just people, and they aren't perfect. Perhaps the husband and wife quarreled and simply took their frustration out on you.
You should pity the poor souls who can't control their temper, their actions or words.
You're need to simply "let it go". I know it's hard, but, people will be rude to you, no matter where you are. Don't take it to heart.
...like water off a ducks back.
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Conquer evil men by your gentle kindness, and make zealous men wonder at your goodness. Put the lover of legality to shame by your compassion. With the afflicted be afflicted in mind. Love all men, but keep distant from all men.
—St. Isaac of Syria
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Papist
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« Reply #39 on: February 29, 2012, 03:56:44 PM » |
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Lord, have mercy.
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"The only-begotten Son of God, wanting us to be partakers of his divinity, assumed our human nature so that, having become man, he might make men gods." - St. Thomas Aquinas
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akimori makoto
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« Reply #40 on: February 29, 2012, 05:13:39 PM » |
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Thank you all so much, for the prayers, the encouragement, the advice and for just allowing me a place to vent.
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The Episcopallian road is easy and wide, for many go through it to find destruction. lol sorry channeling Isa.
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akimori makoto
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« Reply #41 on: February 29, 2012, 05:15:11 PM » |
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Have you shared these thoughts with your priest in confession?
I haven't, because I feel a strong temptation to allow the confession to become a private bitching session. Father is aware of how I feel, though perhaps not the specifics of what goes on when he's not looking. |
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The Episcopallian road is easy and wide, for many go through it to find destruction. lol sorry channeling Isa.
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Volnutt
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« Reply #42 on: February 29, 2012, 05:55:33 PM » |
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I think you should go for anyway. Tell him to tell you to shut up if you get too rant-ish, since you're worried about it.  At the very least, he should probably know some of the specifics. |
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I'm not posting on oc.net for the time being. Thank you to everyone for your support!
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augustin717
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« Reply #43 on: February 29, 2012, 05:57:15 PM » |
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In cases like that I would have just cussed back, and barely remembered the incident after. It works better.
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Punch
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« Reply #44 on: February 29, 2012, 06:12:24 PM » |
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In cases like that I would have just cussed back, and barely remembered the incident after. It works better.
I am pretty much with you on this one. Better to have to confess a few terse words said to these people than have my whole faith in danger because I held it in. |
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Volnutt
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« Reply #45 on: February 29, 2012, 06:16:12 PM » |
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In cases like that I would have just cussed back, and barely remembered the incident after. It works better.
I am pretty much with you on this one. Better to have to confess a few terse words said to these people than have my whole faith in danger because I held it in. I dunno, that sounds like quite a slippery slope. Then again, my faith is always in danger, so I'm likely not the world's best authority. |
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I'm not posting on oc.net for the time being. Thank you to everyone for your support!
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Punch
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« Reply #46 on: February 29, 2012, 11:48:35 PM » |
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In cases like that I would have just cussed back, and barely remembered the incident after. It works better.
I am pretty much with you on this one. Better to have to confess a few terse words said to these people than have my whole faith in danger because I held it in. I dunno, that sounds like quite a slippery slope. Then again, my faith is always in danger, so I'm likely not the world's best authority. Probably is a slippery slope. However, I find that when I tell someone to have aerial intercourse with a rolling pastry, I tend to feel bad about it rather quickly. When I "turn the other cheek", I tend to stew about it for a long time. |
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orthonorm
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« Reply #47 on: February 29, 2012, 11:52:02 PM » |
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I find that when I tell someone to have aerial intercourse with a rolling pastry
I am starting to see the dangers the Tollhouses truly pose. |
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We cannot legislate morality by passing laws controlling firearms. The only evil we can combat lies within our hearts. We need stronger laws to protect the moral foundation of society against the evil of gay marriage. |
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Maria
Orthodox Christian
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O most Holy Theotokos, save us.
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« Reply #48 on: March 01, 2012, 12:12:32 AM » |
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I hate to tell you this, but there are sinners in the ROCOR and Old Calendar churches as well. I bet any priests of those churches would tell you that you could very well run into these problems at any parish, unfortunately.
Yes, we are all sinners. However, when I encountered a similar situation in an OCA church, we left that parish as did many other folks. Finally, the Bishop noticed the revenues were drastically down and took action against several nasty parishioners. I am very delighted to be in an Old Calendar parish now where people truly do love one another. Sometimes changing parishes is in your best interest To the OP: I will pray for you. Lord have mercy. Lord have mercy. Lord have mercy. |
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« Last Edit: March 01, 2012, 12:14:33 AM by Maria »
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Glory to Jesus Christ!
Glory to Him forever!
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mabsoota
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Kyrie eleison
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« Reply #49 on: March 01, 2012, 03:46:26 PM » |
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if u curse someone, u need to repent in front of them and in front of God. if u 'hold it in', u only need to repent in front of God. 'holding it in' is only dangerous if u don't 'let it out' before God in repentance and in response to His love that can cast our all fear, calm every storm and renew every repentant sinner.
it is ok to then calmly go up to the person that annoyed u and explain that their behaviour caused u discomfort and u would prefer it if they did not speak to u like that in the future.
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Punch
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« Reply #50 on: March 01, 2012, 04:30:03 PM » |
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if u curse someone, u need to repent in front of them and in front of God. if u 'hold it in', u only need to repent in front of God. 'holding it in' is only dangerous if u don't 'let it out' before God in repentance and in response to His love that can cast our all fear, calm every storm and renew every repentant sinner.
it is ok to then calmly go up to the person that annoyed u and explain that their behaviour caused u discomfort and u would prefer it if they did not speak to u like that in the future.
How can I trust the advice of someone who cannot spell "you"? |
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biro
Ursus maritimus
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Και κλήρονομον δείξον με, ζωής της αιωνίου
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« Reply #51 on: March 01, 2012, 04:36:57 PM » |
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On the parking issue: is it possible you could switch to public transportation? Then you don't have to meet these folks in the parking lot anymore. Just a thought.
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« Last Edit: March 01, 2012, 04:37:12 PM by biro »
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phthalyl.podomatic.com
the-cornet.blogspot.com
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mabsoota
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Kyrie eleison
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« Reply #52 on: March 01, 2012, 05:02:14 PM » |
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punch, you don't have to trust me, especially as i don't use capital letters either so might be a bot...
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orthodoxchristianonline
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« Reply #53 on: March 06, 2012, 07:23:38 PM » |
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Lord have mercy.
A prayer can do wonders.
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biro
Ursus maritimus
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Faith: Raised Roman Catholic; now attend GOA
Jurisdiction: Metropolis of Atlanta
Posts: 9,589
Και κλήρονομον δείξον με, ζωής της αιωνίου
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« Reply #54 on: March 06, 2012, 11:09:28 PM » |
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punch, you don't have to trust me, especially as i don't use capital letters either so might be a bot...
I don't think you're a bot.  |
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phthalyl.podomatic.com
the-cornet.blogspot.com
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mabsoota
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Jurisdiction: Coptic
Posts: 1,711
Kyrie eleison
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« Reply #55 on: March 07, 2012, 05:39:38 AM » |
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thank u! thanks for all yr interesting posts as well. note: no link in signature advertising, so not bot. |
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