Author Topic: What does this t-shirt say?  (Read 5874 times)

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Offline William

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What does this t-shirt say?
« on: August 24, 2011, 09:04:12 PM »
What does this t-shirt say? Is it in Russian or Old Church Slavonic?



Thanks in advance!
Apart from moral conduct, all that man thinks himself able to do in order to become acceptable to God is mere superstition and religious folly. - Immanuel Kant

Offline ialmisry

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #1 on: August 24, 2011, 09:06:17 PM »
What does this t-shirt say? Is it in Russian or Old Church Slavonic?



Thanks in advance!
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Offline Ionnis

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #2 on: August 24, 2011, 09:11:46 PM »
Disturbing.
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Offline IsmiLiora

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #3 on: August 24, 2011, 09:13:13 PM »
WHERE did you find that t-shirt?
She's touring the facility/and picking up slack.
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Offline William

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #4 on: August 24, 2011, 09:14:30 PM »
I was googling for Orthodox t-shirts.

I guess it's a no-no?
Apart from moral conduct, all that man thinks himself able to do in order to become acceptable to God is mere superstition and religious folly. - Immanuel Kant

Offline LBK

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #5 on: August 24, 2011, 09:19:58 PM »
I was googling for Orthodox t-shirts.

I guess it's a no-no?

Yes, as I see it.
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Offline William

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #6 on: August 24, 2011, 09:22:20 PM »
It's just as well, seeing as my mom refused to let me buy it.
Apart from moral conduct, all that man thinks himself able to do in order to become acceptable to God is mere superstition and religious folly. - Immanuel Kant

Offline LBK

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #7 on: August 24, 2011, 09:23:35 PM »
It's just as well, seeing as my mom refused to let me buy it.

Smart woman.
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Offline IsmiLiora

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #8 on: August 24, 2011, 09:25:10 PM »
Take my opinion with the grain of salt.

I think the shirt can be tongue in cheek funny (but my humor is weird like that). I just don't know who is behind it, whether some gang claiming that they're Orthodox created it or some dorky guy in his mother's basement. I actually would buy that shirt and wear it around the house -- not in public if I didn't know who was behind it or created it.
She's touring the facility/and picking up slack.
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Offline William

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #9 on: August 24, 2011, 09:27:26 PM »
It's just as well, seeing as my mom refused to let me buy it.

Smart woman.

 :)

IsmiLiora,

It's from the Russian rock band "Alisa." They're certainly not intentionally sacrilegious as many of their songs have pro-Orthodox lyrics. They could, of course, have unintentionally made something stupid/sacrilegious.
« Last Edit: August 24, 2011, 09:27:54 PM by William »
Apart from moral conduct, all that man thinks himself able to do in order to become acceptable to God is mere superstition and religious folly. - Immanuel Kant

Offline Kasatkin fan

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #10 on: August 24, 2011, 09:41:54 PM »
I don't particularly see anything sacriligious about it, Holy Tradition gives us the same message, it is a bit morbid however.

Offline IsmiLiora

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #11 on: August 24, 2011, 09:44:14 PM »
It's just as well, seeing as my mom refused to let me buy it.

Smart woman.

 :)

IsmiLiora,

It's from the Russian rock band "Alisa." They're certainly not intentionally sacrilegious as many of their songs have pro-Orthodox lyrics. They could, of course, have unintentionally made something stupid/sacrilegious.
Thank you! Will check out the music and consider getting the t-shirt. :)
She's touring the facility/and picking up slack.
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Offline Alveus Lacuna

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #12 on: August 24, 2011, 10:56:21 PM »
Nothing is as super-tough as Orthodoxy.

Offline tuesdayschild

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #13 on: August 24, 2011, 11:02:31 PM »
Nothing is as super-tough as Orthodoxy.


Offline orthonorm

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #14 on: August 24, 2011, 11:23:33 PM »
Nothing is as super-tough as Orthodoxy.



If I able to grow a mane like that (which I can) does that make me tough in the Orthodox world? Oh in a month, I can grow a beard to make many a convert weep in envy as well.
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Offline Tallitot

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #15 on: August 25, 2011, 12:11:53 AM »
that tee looks to gangster/gangish.
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Offline IsmiLiora

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #16 on: August 25, 2011, 07:25:50 AM »
Nothing is as super-tough as Orthodoxy.


I think that Mr. Ismi would want to be this dude when he grows up. :D I am refusing to show him this picture lest he finds another reason to grow his hair long.
She's touring the facility/and picking up slack.
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Life went on no matter who was wrong or right

Offline Heorhij

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #17 on: August 25, 2011, 08:30:56 AM »
Take my opinion with the grain of salt.

I think the shirt can be tongue in cheek funny (but my humor is weird like that). I just don't know who is behind it, whether some gang claiming that they're Orthodox created it or some dorky guy in his mother's basement. I actually would buy that shirt and wear it around the house -- not in public if I didn't know who was behind it or created it.

No, it's not funny at all. This slogan, as well as its "sister"-slogan, "Russia for Russians," is officially put in the list of extremist slogans by the Ministry of Justice of the Russian Federation (http://lenta.ru/news/2011/05/16/slogan/).

I can't recall at the moment, who was the person who started making these t-shirts (maybe later in the day I will obtain the information from my Russian Facebook friends). All I know is that the force, the organization behind it is clearly Fascist, ultimately xenophobic Russian chauvinist group. The people who buy these t-shirts hate everything that is beyond their chimpanzee "brain" - the West, the USA (especially), NATO, Jews, Free Masons, homosexuals, Blacks, Catholics, non-ethnic Russian citizens of their country, Chechens, Georgians, Armenians, Asians - you name it. Their "Orthodoxy" lives, is sustained, fed, exclusively by hate, which spreads also on those Russian Orthodox whom they hate for, allegedly, being ready to compromise with all these "Sodomite-Liberal-proWestern-nonRussian forces of evil." The latter include anyone who happens to say anything they don't like, for example, Fr. Deacon Andrei Kuraev (who used to be a personal favorite of the previous Patriarch of Moscow, +ALEXIUS II (Ridiger), and who actually is a rabid xenophobe and Russian chauvinist, just not passionate enough for these extremists), or even the present Patriarch of Moscow, +KIRILL (Gundyaev).

These people are a disease, a plague, an ulcer, a cancer. I cannot even begin to describe how stupid, ugly, sick, and dangerous they are. They discredit Orthodoxy like nothing else. "Thanks" to them, a term has been popularized in Russia and in Ukraine: "diagnosis, Orthodoxy of the brain" ("православиe головного мозга"). 
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Offline vamrat

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #18 on: August 25, 2011, 09:50:16 AM »
It looks reminiscent of Chetnik symbolism.  The skull and crossbones are used by them and the slogan is similar to "For the King and Fatherland, Freedom or Death."
Das ist des Jägers Ehrenschild, daß er beschützt und hegt sein Wild, weidmännisch jagt, wie sich’s gehört, den Schöpfer im Geschöpfe ehrt.

Offline biro

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #19 on: August 25, 2011, 08:12:05 PM »
Makes me want to go out and make a shirt with a picture of some of the people in our parish, and they're smiling, and there'll be the words, "Hi, how are you? Please visit--" and then the parish information. Sort of a happy, cheery 'opposite' of the super-serious shirt.  :)
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Offline orthonorm

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #20 on: August 25, 2011, 08:19:29 PM »
Take my opinion with the grain of salt.

I think the shirt can be tongue in cheek funny (but my humor is weird like that). I just don't know who is behind it, whether some gang claiming that they're Orthodox created it or some dorky guy in his mother's basement. I actually would buy that shirt and wear it around the house -- not in public if I didn't know who was behind it or created it.

No, it's not funny at all. This slogan, as well as its "sister"-slogan, "Russia for Russians," is officially put in the list of extremist slogans by the Ministry of Justice of the Russian Federation (http://lenta.ru/news/2011/05/16/slogan/).

I can't recall at the moment, who was the person who started making these t-shirts (maybe later in the day I will obtain the information from my Russian Facebook friends). All I know is that the force, the organization behind it is clearly Fascist, ultimately xenophobic Russian chauvinist group. The people who buy these t-shirts hate everything that is beyond their chimpanzee "brain" - the West, the USA (especially), NATO, Jews, Free Masons, homosexuals, Blacks, Catholics, non-ethnic Russian citizens of their country, Chechens, Georgians, Armenians, Asians - you name it. Their "Orthodoxy" lives, is sustained, fed, exclusively by hate, which spreads also on those Russian Orthodox whom they hate for, allegedly, being ready to compromise with all these "Sodomite-Liberal-proWestern-nonRussian forces of evil." The latter include anyone who happens to say anything they don't like, for example, Fr. Deacon Andrei Kuraev (who used to be a personal favorite of the previous Patriarch of Moscow, +ALEXIUS II (Ridiger), and who actually is a rabid xenophobe and Russian chauvinist, just not passionate enough for these extremists), or even the present Patriarch of Moscow, +KIRILL (Gundyaev).

These people are a disease, a plague, an ulcer, a cancer. I cannot even begin to describe how stupid, ugly, sick, and dangerous they are. They discredit Orthodoxy like nothing else. "Thanks" to them, a term has been popularized in Russia and in Ukraine: "diagnosis, Orthodoxy of the brain" ("православиe головного мозга"). 

Just to be clear, you don't care for them? //:=)

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Offline mike

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #21 on: August 26, 2011, 09:30:14 AM »
« Last Edit: August 26, 2011, 09:31:07 AM by Michał Kalina »

Offline Heorhij

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #22 on: August 26, 2011, 10:59:55 AM »
post deleted - see Politics
« Last Edit: August 26, 2011, 11:00:53 AM by Heorhij »
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Offline Irish Hermit

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #23 on: August 26, 2011, 11:31:01 AM »
I'm not buying it.  This is biker gang Orthodoxy.  "Christians" who delight in such symbols as skulls with daggers clenched between their teeth are prey for the demons.  Their demonic insignia will only terrify other people and drive them away from Christ.

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #24 on: August 26, 2011, 11:37:02 AM »
Metropolitan Hilarion (Alfeyev) has addressed this element within the Russian Church.

Biker gang Orthodoxy

Metropolitan Hilarion: 'Atheism and Orthodoxy in Modern Russia'

------------------------------------------------------------

http://en.hilarion.orthodoxia.org/6_8

This is an excellent 'talk' by Metropolitan Hilarion (Alfeyev.)  Apart from the article's intrinsic worth the last paragraph impinges on the topic of this thread.

"The second danger is that of militant Orthodoxy, which would be a post-atheist counterpart of militant atheism. I mean an Orthodoxy that fights against Jews, against masons, against democracy, against Western culture, against enlightenment. This type of Orthodoxy is being preached even by some key members of the hierarchy, and it has many supporters within the Church. This kind of Orthodoxy, especially if it gains the support of the State, may force Russian atheism to withdraw temporarily to the catacombs. But Russian atheism, will not be vanquished until the transfiguration of the soul and the need to live according to the Gospel have become the only message of the Russian Orthodox Church."


Offline Heorhij

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #25 on: August 26, 2011, 11:43:30 AM »
Metropolitan Hilarion (Alfeyev) has addressed this element within the Russian Church.

Biker gang Orthodoxy

Metropolitan Hilarion: 'Atheism and Orthodoxy in Modern Russia'

------------------------------------------------------------

http://en.hilarion.orthodoxia.org/6_8

This is an excellent 'talk' by Metropolitan Hilarion (Alfeyev.)  Apart from the article's intrinsic worth the last paragraph impinges on the topic of this thread.

"The second danger is that of militant Orthodoxy, which would be a post-atheist counterpart of militant atheism. I mean an Orthodoxy that fights against Jews, against masons, against democracy, against Western culture, against enlightenment. This type of Orthodoxy is being preached even by some key members of the hierarchy, and it has many supporters within the Church. This kind of Orthodoxy, especially if it gains the support of the State, may force Russian atheism to withdraw temporarily to the catacombs. But Russian atheism, will not be vanquished until the transfiguration of the soul and the need to live according to the Gospel have become the only message of the Russian Orthodox Church."



He is right. I even know the names of hierarchs of the ROC who represent exactly this kind of "anti-whatever" quasi-Orthodoxy.

Orthodox (or "Orthodox") newspapers, bulletin boards, pamphlets in Russia and Ukraine are full of this idiocy. They fight vaccination of children, juvenile justice, "globalization," evolution, non-abusive parenting methods, the use of vernacular in Liturgy, trimming of beards and hair, etc. etc. etc. All that they make look like major, central issues in Orthodoxy.
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Offline Irish Hermit

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #26 on: August 26, 2011, 12:17:25 PM »
Here is their site

http://www.pycckie.org/info/index.shtml

Lots of photos in the galleries - some quite ominous and threatening. 

For English, Google  "Union of the Orthodox Banner-Bearers." It's Clockwork Orange meets Czarist Black Squadrons. "Russia for Russians!" "Orthodoxy or Death!" They take a dim view of non-Russian generally.

They are were established in 1992 with the blessing of Metropolitan Ioann (Snychev) whose writings are virulently anti-semitic.  However since his death it has been claimed the anti-semitic writings were from the pen of his secretary.  I don't know how credible that is.


Offline Irish Hermit

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #27 on: August 26, 2011, 12:28:18 PM »
Also popular..... Rasputin...



Offline Shiny

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #28 on: August 26, 2011, 12:52:00 PM »
^ Oh wow.
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Offline Heorhij

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #29 on: August 26, 2011, 01:03:09 PM »
L.D. Simonovich-Nikshich, the head of this "Union of Orthodox Banner-Bearers," is notorious for presiding over actions of book-burning. The "Banner-Bearers", under his direction, burned books by Charles Darwin and Eduard Radzinskiy (a Russian historian who investigated the murder of Tzar Nicholas and his family - apparently, not showing enough of the "Russian Spirit"). A blog titled "Govnomer" (literally, "Sh*t Measurer") quotes Simonovich saying, during this action, "yes, we are the Holy Inquisition. Just like we have fought heresies for centuries, we will keep doing it." (http://www.grani.ru/blogs/govnomer/entries/189290.html)
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Offline Heorhij

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #30 on: August 26, 2011, 01:22:03 PM »
L.D. Simonovich-Nikshich, the head of this "Union of Orthodox Banner-Bearers," is notorious for presiding over actions of book-burning. The "Banner-Bearers", under his direction, burned books by Charles Darwin and Eduard Radzinskiy (a Russian historian who investigated the murder of Tzar Nicholas and his family - apparently, not showing enough of the "Russian Spirit"). A blog titled "Govnomer" (literally, "Sh*t Measurer") quotes Simonovich saying, during this action, "yes, we are the Holy Inquisition. Just like we have fought heresies for centuries, we will keep doing it." (http://www.grani.ru/blogs/govnomer/entries/189290.html)

Oh, and how could I forget: earlier this month, Patriarch Kirill of Moscow awarded this nutbolt, Simonovich-Nikshich, with a medal of honor:

http://texas-88.livejournal.com/81870.html
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Offline orthonorm

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #31 on: August 26, 2011, 02:29:53 PM »
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Offline augustin717

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #32 on: August 26, 2011, 04:25:30 PM »
So, there is an actual association of "banner-bearers'. And I thought I was being funny, when, in a church full of "unworthy readers & subdeacons" I ironically called myself an "unworthy banner bearer". ::)

Offline William

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #33 on: August 26, 2011, 06:13:49 PM »
I feel stupid now.
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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #34 on: August 27, 2011, 09:48:14 AM »
I feel stupid now.

Don't. No reason at all. Unfortunately, the West is shielded from the objective truth about Russian "Orthodoxy."
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Offline ialmisry

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #35 on: August 27, 2011, 11:41:51 AM »
I feel stupid now.

Don't. No reason at all. Unfortunately, the West is shielded from the objective truth about Russian "Orthodoxy."
Shielded by what.

To the OP, why?  You didn't know, and you asked. Better that than thinking it's OK and falling pray.
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Offline Heorhij

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #36 on: August 27, 2011, 11:44:55 AM »
Don't. No reason at all. Unfortunately, the West is shielded from the objective truth about Russian "Orthodoxy."
Shielded by what.
[/quote]

By sweet and abysmally false myth about Holy Mother Russia being a beacon of true Orthodoxy for a millenium.
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Offline tuesdayschild

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #37 on: August 27, 2011, 11:55:36 AM »
The people who buy these t-shirts hate everything that is beyond their chimpanzee "brain"

These people are a disease, a plague, an ulcer, a cancer. I cannot even begin to describe how stupid, ugly, sick, and dangerous they are.

From your signature:
Quote
Love never fails.

You're an inspiration.
« Last Edit: August 27, 2011, 11:57:12 AM by tuesdayschild »

Offline Heorhij

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #38 on: August 27, 2011, 01:26:28 PM »
The people who buy these t-shirts hate everything that is beyond their chimpanzee "brain"

These people are a disease, a plague, an ulcer, a cancer. I cannot even begin to describe how stupid, ugly, sick, and dangerous they are.

From your signature:
Quote
Love never fails.

You're an inspiration.

I appreciate your sarcasm. However, there is no contradiction. I am learning to love all people, including those who are a disease, a plague, an ulcer, a cancer, stupid, ugly, sick, and dangerous. St. Paul, who certainly knew about love, is my inspiration in that (Romans 1:29-32). I know I have to love them, and I already do, in a way, because I pray for them (there exists, as you know, an Orthodox prayer for my enemies), and I sincerely wish them to repent and be saved and enter the Kingdom of God. But my love for them does not make them less of "a disease, a plague," etc. Unfortunately. I wish it would.  
« Last Edit: August 27, 2011, 01:27:14 PM by Heorhij »
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Offline tuesdayschild

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #39 on: August 27, 2011, 02:55:41 PM »
The people who buy these t-shirts hate everything that is beyond their chimpanzee "brain"

These people are a disease, a plague, an ulcer, a cancer. I cannot even begin to describe how stupid, ugly, sick, and dangerous they are.

From your signature:
Quote
Love never fails.

You're an inspiration.

I appreciate your sarcasm. However, there is no contradiction. I am learning to love all people, including those who are a disease, a plague, an ulcer, a cancer, stupid, ugly, sick, and dangerous. St. Paul, who certainly knew about love, is my inspiration in that (Romans 1:29-32). I know I have to love them, and I already do, in a way, because I pray for them (there exists, as you know, an Orthodox prayer for my enemies), and I sincerely wish them to repent and be saved and enter the Kingdom of God. But my love for them does not make them less of "a disease, a plague," etc. Unfortunately. I wish it would.  

Well, then, keep reading St. Paul.

Offline ialmisry

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #40 on: August 27, 2011, 05:41:04 PM »
Don't. No reason at all. Unfortunately, the West is shielded from the objective truth about Russian "Orthodoxy."
Shielded by what?

By sweet and abysmally false myth about Holy Mother Russia being a beacon of true Orthodoxy for a millenium.
Holy Mother Russia has quite a number of witness before the Judgement Seat in her defense:

« Last Edit: August 27, 2011, 05:50:31 PM by ialmisry »
Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth

Offline mike

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Re: What does this t-shirt say?
« Reply #41 on: August 27, 2011, 06:01:38 PM »
I really recommend moving to the Private Foras because one of you can lost control and unpleasant things will happen.