OrthodoxChristianity.net
August 27, 2014, 05:10:33 AM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
News: Reminder: No political discussions in the public fora.  If you do not have access to the private Politics Forum, please send a PM to Fr. George.
 
   Home   Help Calendar Contact Treasury Tags Login Register  
Pages: « 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 »   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Scandinavian Orthodoxy  (Read 20975 times) Average Rating: 0
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
Jason.Wike
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Posts: 1,046


« Reply #90 on: May 30, 2012, 02:59:55 PM »

I hope this may be seen also outside of Finland. Here's a video of Divine Liturgy in Swedish at Uspenski cathedral in Helsinki. Apparently some new Swedish translation was used.

The video should be available for 28 days from now on and IIRC the liturgy will be seen at Swedish and Norwegian television sometimes during next autumn.

Nice. How did Swedish get to be so different from Norwegian and Danish though?
Logged
Orthodox11
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Posts: 2,999


« Reply #91 on: May 30, 2012, 03:01:49 PM »

Nice. How did Swedish get to be so different from Norwegian and Danish though?

It isn't. Or did you mean pronunciation? They all have Finnish accents. Finnish, of course, is a very different sounding language to Norwegian and Danish.
Logged
Alpo
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox. With some feta, please.
Posts: 6,624



« Reply #92 on: May 31, 2012, 06:15:02 AM »

They all have Finnish accents. Finnish, of course, is a very different sounding language to Norwegian and Danish.

While it could be that many people in the video are Finnish-speaking Finns who just fail to pronounce Swedish properly there probably are also some Swedish-speaking Finns. Their language is more of an actual dialect than mere accent.
« Last Edit: May 31, 2012, 06:24:07 AM by Alpo » Logged
Gorazd
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: The Ecumenical Patriarchate of Istanbul and Chambésy
Posts: 1,946



« Reply #93 on: May 31, 2012, 09:04:48 AM »

Any way to download this video?
Logged
Ansgar
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: More than an inquirer, less than a catechumen
Jurisdiction: Exarchate of orthodox churches of russian tradition in western Europe
Posts: 2,948


Keep your mind in hell and do not despair


« Reply #94 on: May 31, 2012, 09:36:51 AM »

They all have Finnish accents. Finnish, of course, is a very different sounding language to Norwegian and Danish.

While it could be that many people in the video are Finnish-speaking Finns who just fail to pronounce Swedish properly there probably are also some Swedish-speaking Finns. Their language is more of an actual dialect than mere accent.

Tell me about it. I can hardly read it. I have a book on orthodox theology written by clergymen in the north and I have a hard understanding the finland-swedish text.
Logged

Do not be cast down over the struggle - the Lord loves a brave warrior. The Lord loves the soul that is valiant.

-St Silouan the athonite
Alpo
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox. With some feta, please.
Posts: 6,624



« Reply #95 on: May 31, 2012, 09:48:22 AM »

They all have Finnish accents. Finnish, of course, is a very different sounding language to Norwegian and Danish.

While it could be that many people in the video are Finnish-speaking Finns who just fail to pronounce Swedish properly there probably are also some Swedish-speaking Finns. Their language is more of an actual dialect than mere accent.

Tell me about it. I can hardly read it. I have a book on orthodox theology written by clergymen in the north and I have a hard understanding the finland-swedish text.

LOL. What book is that?

Sorry Ansgar, but you reminded of this and I just have to place it here. Andre Wickström is a Finnish Swedish-speaking stand-up comedian who apparently had some serious trouble understanding Danish language. angel A sort of English version can be found here. I hope you don't find those offending since he makes fun of Finns too. Smiley

Any way to download this video?

There are loads of programs which can be used for downloading streaming videos from internet but I'm not exactly sure how legal that is. Finnish national public-broadcasting company itself doesn't offer any means for downloading videos from that site. Or anywhere else for that matter.
« Last Edit: May 31, 2012, 10:08:18 AM by Alpo » Logged
Alveus Lacuna
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: OCA
Posts: 6,856



« Reply #96 on: May 31, 2012, 09:54:07 AM »

On another thread, or perhaps in this one, somebody posted some Ukrainian Orthodox churches that look very similar to the stave churches. Can anybody clue me in on these and maybe their history?
Logged
Ansgar
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: More than an inquirer, less than a catechumen
Jurisdiction: Exarchate of orthodox churches of russian tradition in western Europe
Posts: 2,948


Keep your mind in hell and do not despair


« Reply #97 on: May 31, 2012, 10:08:59 AM »

Quote
LOL. What book is that?

Ortodokse Røster i Nord. It's very good.  Smiley
http://www.ambon.se/ambon.se/bokhandel/ortodokse-roster-i-nord-i

Quote
Sorry Ansgar, but you reminded of this and I just have to place it here. Andre Wickström is a Finnish Swedish-speaking stand-up comedian who apparently had some serious trouble understanding Danish language.
Is that how we sound to you guys Cheesy

Logged

Do not be cast down over the struggle - the Lord loves a brave warrior. The Lord loves the soul that is valiant.

-St Silouan the athonite
Orthodox11
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Posts: 2,999


« Reply #98 on: May 31, 2012, 11:06:19 AM »

Is that how we sound to you guys Cheesy

Hahaha, I thought his Danish was spot on! Funny guy!
Logged
Ansgar
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: More than an inquirer, less than a catechumen
Jurisdiction: Exarchate of orthodox churches of russian tradition in western Europe
Posts: 2,948


Keep your mind in hell and do not despair


« Reply #99 on: May 31, 2012, 12:56:54 PM »

Is that how we sound to you guys Cheesy

Hahaha, I thought his Danish was spot on! Funny guy!

It actually sounded quite danish Smiley
Logged

Do not be cast down over the struggle - the Lord loves a brave warrior. The Lord loves the soul that is valiant.

-St Silouan the athonite
Jason.Wike
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Posts: 1,046


« Reply #100 on: May 31, 2012, 02:16:13 PM »

On another thread, or perhaps in this one, somebody posted some Ukrainian Orthodox churches that look very similar to the stave churches. Can anybody clue me in on these and maybe their history?

Like this? There's similar ones in Slovakia, Poland, and around the area. Even Protestants built some churches like that.
Logged
celticfan1888
Production Operator - Chemtrusion
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Catholicism
Jurisdiction: Orthodox Church of America
Posts: 3,026



« Reply #101 on: June 06, 2012, 04:53:33 AM »

Is that how we sound to you guys Cheesy

Ja! Ja! lol
Logged

Forgive my sins.
Orthodox11
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Posts: 2,999


« Reply #102 on: June 06, 2012, 07:47:32 AM »

On another thread, or perhaps in this one, somebody posted some Ukrainian Orthodox churches that look very similar to the stave churches. Can anybody clue me in on these and maybe their history?

The Rus were of Scandinavian descent, there's plenty of cultural overlap.
Logged
celticfan1888
Production Operator - Chemtrusion
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Catholicism
Jurisdiction: Orthodox Church of America
Posts: 3,026



« Reply #103 on: June 07, 2012, 05:12:07 AM »

On another thread, or perhaps in this one, somebody posted some Ukrainian Orthodox churches that look very similar to the stave churches. Can anybody clue me in on these and maybe their history?

History of the Rus' (who were Vikings that came from mostly modern-day Sweden). Explains why some of these things are similar.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rus%27_people
Logged

Forgive my sins.
Alpo
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox. With some feta, please.
Posts: 6,624



« Reply #104 on: June 10, 2012, 09:08:16 AM »

On another thread, or perhaps in this one, somebody posted some Ukrainian Orthodox churches that look very similar to the stave churches. Can anybody clue me in on these and maybe their history?

History of the Rus' (who were Vikings that came from mostly modern-day Sweden). Explains why some of these things are similar.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rus%27_people

There was a rather cool map over there. Beware, O Russia and Sweden! Some day we take our belonings back!

« Last Edit: June 10, 2012, 09:12:29 AM by Alpo » Logged
ialmisry
There's nothing John of Damascus can't answer
Hypatos
*****************
Offline Offline

Faith: جامعي Arab confesssing the Orthodox Faith of the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church
Jurisdiction: Antioch (for now), but my heart belongs to Alexandria
Posts: 37,444



« Reply #105 on: June 10, 2012, 09:23:08 AM »

On another thread, or perhaps in this one, somebody posted some Ukrainian Orthodox churches that look very similar to the stave churches. Can anybody clue me in on these and maybe their history?

History of the Rus' (who were Vikings that came from mostly modern-day Sweden). Explains why some of these things are similar.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rus%27_people

There was a rather cool map over there. Beware, O Russia and Sweden! Some day we take our belonings back!


Rurik was a Swedized Finn, with Slavicized progeny.  The Finns kept it but lost their language.
Logged

Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth
Alpo
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox. With some feta, please.
Posts: 6,624



« Reply #106 on: June 10, 2012, 10:23:47 AM »

Rurik was a Swedized Finn, with Slavicized progeny.  The Finns kept it but lost their language.

You lost me. What we kept and what we lost?
« Last Edit: June 10, 2012, 10:24:16 AM by Alpo » Logged
Jason.Wike
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Posts: 1,046


« Reply #107 on: June 10, 2012, 02:15:46 PM »

Rurik was a Swedized Finn, with Slavicized progeny.  The Finns kept it but lost their language.

You lost me. What we kept and what we lost?

Finno-Ugrics in Russia kept their territory but they became Russians.
« Last Edit: June 10, 2012, 02:21:16 PM by Jason.Wike » Logged
Alpo
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox. With some feta, please.
Posts: 6,624



« Reply #108 on: June 10, 2012, 03:14:37 PM »

Rurik was a Swedized Finn, with Slavicized progeny.  The Finns kept it but lost their language.

You lost me. What we kept and what we lost?

Finno-Ugrics in Russia kept their territory but they became Russians.

Thanks, Jason.Wike.

Now that I think of it this explains why Ingegerd Olofsdotter of Sweden became St. Anna of Novgorod.
« Last Edit: June 10, 2012, 03:23:59 PM by Alpo » Logged
Alpo
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox. With some feta, please.
Posts: 6,624



« Reply #109 on: June 10, 2012, 05:47:12 PM »

I'd like to ask all of our Scandinavians in here whether you miss Western liturgy? AFAIK all Scandinavian state churches have fairly traditional Western liturgy as their standard sunday service so it's sort of part of our cultures.
Logged
Ansgar
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: More than an inquirer, less than a catechumen
Jurisdiction: Exarchate of orthodox churches of russian tradition in western Europe
Posts: 2,948


Keep your mind in hell and do not despair


« Reply #110 on: June 10, 2012, 06:04:05 PM »

I'd like to ask all of our Scandinavians in here whether you miss Western liturgy? AFAIK all Scandinavian state churches have fairly traditional Western liturgy as their standard sunday service so it's sort of part of our cultures.

Well, it's hard to say. When I attend a lutheran church, I sometimes do miss it and think about how great it would be if the churches could be filled again, but I still think that something is missing from the danish liturgy. The swedish and norwegian liturgies for example have kept much more of their catholic inheritance. I once attended a norwegian wedding and I was surprised to see that the priest were wearing a chasuble. I have only seen one danish priest wearing a chasuble in all my life. So while the danish liturgy is nice, I wouldn't give away the divine liturgy for anything.
Logged

Do not be cast down over the struggle - the Lord loves a brave warrior. The Lord loves the soul that is valiant.

-St Silouan the athonite
ialmisry
There's nothing John of Damascus can't answer
Hypatos
*****************
Offline Offline

Faith: جامعي Arab confesssing the Orthodox Faith of the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church
Jurisdiction: Antioch (for now), but my heart belongs to Alexandria
Posts: 37,444



« Reply #111 on: June 10, 2012, 06:18:48 PM »

I'd like to ask all of our Scandinavians in here whether you miss Western liturgy? AFAIK all Scandinavian state churches have fairly traditional Western liturgy as their standard sunday service so it's sort of part of our cultures.

Well, it's hard to say. When I attend a lutheran church, I sometimes do miss it and think about how great it would be if the churches could be filled again, but I still think that something is missing from the danish liturgy. The swedish and norwegian liturgies for example have kept much more of their catholic inheritance. I once attended a norwegian wedding and I was surprised to see that the priest were wearing a chasuble. I have only seen one danish priest wearing a chasuble in all my life. So while the danish liturgy is nice, I wouldn't give away the divine liturgy for anything.
I wonder how the liturgy of the Nordic Catholic Church compares.
Logged

Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth
Gorazd
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: The Ecumenical Patriarchate of Istanbul and Chambésy
Posts: 1,946



« Reply #112 on: June 10, 2012, 06:36:11 PM »

I'd like to ask all of our Scandinavians in here whether you miss Western liturgy? AFAIK all Scandinavian state churches have fairly traditional Western liturgy as their standard sunday service so it's sort of part of our cultures.

I'm not a Scandinavian, but I went to see a Lutheran mass in a small Swedish town about 3 months ago, and it was really beautiful. And, in fact, extremely similar to what I have seen in the ECUSA.
Logged
Orthodox11
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Posts: 2,999


« Reply #113 on: June 10, 2012, 06:40:10 PM »

Well, it's hard to say. When I attend a lutheran church, I sometimes do miss it and think about how great it would be if the churches could be filled again, but I still think that something is missing from the danish liturgy. The swedish and norwegian liturgies for example have kept much more of their catholic inheritance. I once attended a norwegian wedding and I was surprised to see that the priest were wearing a chasuble. I have only seen one danish priest wearing a chasuble in all my life. So while the danish liturgy is nice, I wouldn't give away the divine liturgy for anything.

I attended a Church of Norway service last Sunday. It opens with the "Kyrie eleison, Gud Fader, forbarme Deg", etc. sung in very traditional plainchant. As a child, the plainchant stuff was the only part of the service I ever liked. I found it very moving, despite the organ, and I suddenly got very nostalgic. The next hour was a collection of hymns (all of which sound like children's songs), solo performances, and various readings (all of which contained failed attempts at humour). I went from almost being moved to tears in the first couple of minutes, to spending the next 58minutes dying to leave. I couldn't get over just how empty, lifeless and superficial it all was.
Logged
Ansgar
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: More than an inquirer, less than a catechumen
Jurisdiction: Exarchate of orthodox churches of russian tradition in western Europe
Posts: 2,948


Keep your mind in hell and do not despair


« Reply #114 on: June 10, 2012, 06:48:46 PM »

I'd like to ask all of our Scandinavians in here whether you miss Western liturgy? AFAIK all Scandinavian state churches have fairly traditional Western liturgy as their standard sunday service so it's sort of part of our cultures.

Well, it's hard to say. When I attend a lutheran church, I sometimes do miss it and think about how great it would be if the churches could be filled again, but I still think that something is missing from the danish liturgy. The swedish and norwegian liturgies for example have kept much more of their catholic inheritance. I once attended a norwegian wedding and I was surprised to see that the priest were wearing a chasuble. I have only seen one danish priest wearing a chasuble in all my life. So while the danish liturgy is nice, I wouldn't give away the divine liturgy for anything.
I wonder how the liturgy of the Nordic Catholic Church compares.

I just watched some parts of their liturgy. It really looks like a lutheran mass, just with some catholic elements and I could recognize some of the things. They don't sound weird or anything though. Just another high lutheran traditionalist group.
Logged

Do not be cast down over the struggle - the Lord loves a brave warrior. The Lord loves the soul that is valiant.

-St Silouan the athonite
Ansgar
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: More than an inquirer, less than a catechumen
Jurisdiction: Exarchate of orthodox churches of russian tradition in western Europe
Posts: 2,948


Keep your mind in hell and do not despair


« Reply #115 on: June 10, 2012, 06:54:42 PM »

Quote
I attended a Church of Norway service last Sunday. It opens with the "Kyrie eleison, Gud Fader, forbarme Deg", etc. sung in very traditional plainchant. As a child, the plainchant stuff was the only part of the service I ever liked. I found it very moving, despite the organ, and I suddenly got very nostalgic
I know. The danish church doesn't use chant anymore and then, last year, when I watched the memorial service for the Utøya victims (may their memory be eternal), the deacon(or church servant, I'm not really sure) started chanting the creed and I was completely mindblowed. It was beautiful.
Logged

Do not be cast down over the struggle - the Lord loves a brave warrior. The Lord loves the soul that is valiant.

-St Silouan the athonite
Alpo
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox. With some feta, please.
Posts: 6,624



« Reply #116 on: June 10, 2012, 11:05:51 PM »

I just watched some parts of their liturgy. It really looks like a lutheran mass, just with some catholic elements and I could recognize some of the things. They don't sound weird or anything though. Just another high lutheran traditionalist group.

I don't know about Norwegian and Danish Lutherans but to me this definetely seems more Roman and Catholic than Lutheran.
« Last Edit: June 10, 2012, 11:06:11 PM by Alpo » Logged
orthonorm
Warned
Hoplitarches
*************
Offline Offline

Faith: Sola Gratia
Jurisdiction: Outside
Posts: 16,459



« Reply #117 on: June 11, 2012, 12:16:29 AM »

Ansgar and Alpo,

Reading your posts today have brought more than a few smiles.

I laugh a lot but smile rarely.

You two are (there is no decent English word that doesn't come off as patronizing or at least I can't think of one, but it's really, really, good whatever it is).

Thanks.
Logged

Ignorance is not a lack, but a passion.
orthonorm
Warned
Hoplitarches
*************
Offline Offline

Faith: Sola Gratia
Jurisdiction: Outside
Posts: 16,459



« Reply #118 on: June 11, 2012, 12:21:03 AM »

I'd like to ask all of our Scandinavians in here whether you miss Western liturgy? AFAIK all Scandinavian state churches have fairly traditional Western liturgy as their standard sunday service so it's sort of part of our cultures.

Well, it's hard to say. When I attend a lutheran church, I sometimes do miss it and think about how great it would be if the churches could be filled again, but I still think that something is missing from the danish liturgy. The swedish and norwegian liturgies for example have kept much more of their catholic inheritance. I once attended a norwegian wedding and I was surprised to see that the priest were wearing a chasuble. I have only seen one danish priest wearing a chasuble in all my life. So while the danish liturgy is nice, I wouldn't give away the divine liturgy for anything.

Maybe I missed it, but do you have a link to a Lutheran liturgy from your parts?
Logged

Ignorance is not a lack, but a passion.
Ansgar
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: More than an inquirer, less than a catechumen
Jurisdiction: Exarchate of orthodox churches of russian tradition in western Europe
Posts: 2,948


Keep your mind in hell and do not despair


« Reply #119 on: June 11, 2012, 05:17:58 AM »

I just watched some parts of their liturgy. It really looks like a lutheran mass, just with some catholic elements and I could recognize some of the things. They don't sound weird or anything though. Just another high lutheran traditionalist group.

I don't know about Norwegian and Danish Lutherans but to me this definetely seems more Roman and Catholic than Lutheran.
That was quite catholic. I watched this video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B9Vvx3hc-bA&feature=player_embedded

Many of the prayers can also be found in the danish church, just in a less liturgical fashion.
« Last Edit: June 11, 2012, 05:20:10 AM by Ansgar » Logged

Do not be cast down over the struggle - the Lord loves a brave warrior. The Lord loves the soul that is valiant.

-St Silouan the athonite
Ansgar
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: More than an inquirer, less than a catechumen
Jurisdiction: Exarchate of orthodox churches of russian tradition in western Europe
Posts: 2,948


Keep your mind in hell and do not despair


« Reply #120 on: June 11, 2012, 05:28:59 AM »

I'd like to ask all of our Scandinavians in here whether you miss Western liturgy? AFAIK all Scandinavian state churches have fairly traditional Western liturgy as their standard sunday service so it's sort of part of our cultures.

Well, it's hard to say. When I attend a lutheran church, I sometimes do miss it and think about how great it would be if the churches could be filled again, but I still think that something is missing from the danish liturgy. The swedish and norwegian liturgies for example have kept much more of their catholic inheritance. I once attended a norwegian wedding and I was surprised to see that the priest were wearing a chasuble. I have only seen one danish priest wearing a chasuble in all my life. So while the danish liturgy is nice, I wouldn't give away the divine liturgy for anything.

Maybe I missed it, but do you have a link to a Lutheran liturgy from your parts?

Man, are you lucky. I just found a complete danish christmas mass and here, the priest are actually wearing a chasuble. The liturgy is still as in every other church though.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6-MK5dGgYrA&feature=relmfu (part 1)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8cDIyDo0q3o&feature=related (part 2)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8cDIyDo0q3o&feature=relmfu (part 3)

(You will see the priest singing some of the parts of the mass which is very rare but do happen in some parishes)
« Last Edit: June 11, 2012, 05:39:31 AM by Ansgar » Logged

Do not be cast down over the struggle - the Lord loves a brave warrior. The Lord loves the soul that is valiant.

-St Silouan the athonite
Alpo
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox. With some feta, please.
Posts: 6,624



« Reply #121 on: June 11, 2012, 07:20:53 AM »

That was quite catholic. I watched this video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B9Vvx3hc-bA&feature=player_embedded

Well that was indeed more Lutheran. Except for the icons and Slavic crosses which are painful reminder that this could have been an Orthodox church if something hadn't went wrong.
Logged
Ansgar
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: More than an inquirer, less than a catechumen
Jurisdiction: Exarchate of orthodox churches of russian tradition in western Europe
Posts: 2,948


Keep your mind in hell and do not despair


« Reply #122 on: June 11, 2012, 07:35:23 AM »

That was quite catholic. I watched this video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B9Vvx3hc-bA&feature=player_embedded

Well that was indeed more Lutheran. Except for the icons and Slavic crosses which are painful reminder that this could have been an Orthodox church if something hadn't went wrong.

Yeah, it's sad. Appearently, they know about the orthodox church. They mention it shortly in the introduction.
Logged

Do not be cast down over the struggle - the Lord loves a brave warrior. The Lord loves the soul that is valiant.

-St Silouan the athonite
celticfan1888
Production Operator - Chemtrusion
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Catholicism
Jurisdiction: Orthodox Church of America
Posts: 3,026



« Reply #123 on: June 11, 2012, 12:29:27 PM »

I'd like to ask all of our Scandinavians in here whether you miss Western liturgy? AFAIK all Scandinavian state churches have fairly traditional Western liturgy as their standard sunday service so it's sort of part of our cultures.

Some days I legitimately do. And when I go back and visit I wish it could be part of Orthodoxy.
Logged

Forgive my sins.
Ansgar
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: More than an inquirer, less than a catechumen
Jurisdiction: Exarchate of orthodox churches of russian tradition in western Europe
Posts: 2,948


Keep your mind in hell and do not despair


« Reply #124 on: June 16, 2012, 03:35:42 PM »

Our archimandrite led a pilgrimage to Serbia. They even met Patriarch Irenej.  Smiley
http://www.ortodoks.com/
Logged

Do not be cast down over the struggle - the Lord loves a brave warrior. The Lord loves the soul that is valiant.

-St Silouan the athonite
William
Protokentarchos
*********
Offline Offline

Faith: None
Posts: 4,306


« Reply #125 on: June 16, 2012, 03:44:44 PM »

Are Lutheran masses kind of Roman rite or a unique Germanic rite?

Also, I'd think the Slavic rite would work culturally in Scandinavia seeing as how the Rus' were Scandinavians and Russian Orthodoxy is a state church in Finland.
« Last Edit: June 16, 2012, 03:44:55 PM by William » Logged

Apart from moral conduct, all that man thinks himself able to do in order to become acceptable to God is mere superstition and religious folly. - Immanuel Kant

Leave there thy gift before the altar, and go thy way; first be reconciled to thy brother, and then come and offer thy gift. - Matt. 5:24
Ansgar
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: More than an inquirer, less than a catechumen
Jurisdiction: Exarchate of orthodox churches of russian tradition in western Europe
Posts: 2,948


Keep your mind in hell and do not despair


« Reply #126 on: June 16, 2012, 03:54:18 PM »

Are Lutheran masses kind of Roman rite or a unique Germanic rite?

Also, I'd think the Slavic rite would work culturally in Scandinavia seeing as how the Rus' were Scandinavians and Russian Orthodoxy is a state church in Finland.

It depends. The norwegian liturgy is still relatively high liturgical, while the danish liturgy(with a few excpetions) is very lutheranized.

Logged

Do not be cast down over the struggle - the Lord loves a brave warrior. The Lord loves the soul that is valiant.

-St Silouan the athonite
Orthodox11
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Posts: 2,999


« Reply #127 on: June 16, 2012, 04:31:18 PM »

Also, I'd think the Slavic rite would work culturally in Scandinavia seeing as how the Rus' were Scandinavians

The Rus were Scandinavians, but the Rite used is Byzantine, the modern Slavic form of which developed in an environment which was quite distinct from that of the Scandinavian countries. The grandure of Imperial Russia, which shapes so much of modern Russian practice, is pretty much antithetical to every aspect of Scandinavian culture. "It's just too much" has been the general verdict of Norwegians I know who have attended Orthodox liturgies. So I don't think the cultural connection is as meaningful as it might appear at first sight.

I have always thought the Old Rite (in a less austere form perhaps) would be very appropriate in a Scandinavian context.
Logged
Ansgar
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: More than an inquirer, less than a catechumen
Jurisdiction: Exarchate of orthodox churches of russian tradition in western Europe
Posts: 2,948


Keep your mind in hell and do not despair


« Reply #128 on: June 16, 2012, 04:44:45 PM »

Quote
I have always thought the Old Rite (in a less austere form perhaps) would be very appropriate in a Scandinavian context.
 

Really? I have always thought that even with the old rite, most scandinavians would find the liturgy way to emotional.
Logged

Do not be cast down over the struggle - the Lord loves a brave warrior. The Lord loves the soul that is valiant.

-St Silouan the athonite
Orthodox11
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Posts: 2,999


« Reply #129 on: June 16, 2012, 05:29:23 PM »

Really? I have always thought that even with the old rite, most scandinavians would find the liturgy way to emotional.

It will always be foreign to those who grew up in such a radically different tradition but I think the older, simpler, less ostentatious Russian forms preserved in the Old Rite would be more appropriate in a Scandinavian context. I'm talking here only about the rite, of course, not about the "Old Believers" themselves.
Logged
Gorazd
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: The Ecumenical Patriarchate of Istanbul and Chambésy
Posts: 1,946



« Reply #130 on: June 16, 2012, 05:46:57 PM »

The "lower" Lutheran services in Germany are due to the enlightenment and Reformed influences (remember, the Hohenzollern family was Calvinist, not Lutheran).

Luther himself said mass in German, but in quite a high style. About the same as Lutheran masses in Sweden or Finland today.

As for liturgy being "too much", we can respond that we do not do ur own thing, but we do join the worship of the angels in heaven.
Logged
Jason.Wike
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Posts: 1,046


« Reply #131 on: June 16, 2012, 11:09:02 PM »

Also, I'd think the Slavic rite would work culturally in Scandinavia seeing as how the Rus' were Scandinavians

The Rus were Scandinavians, but the Rite used is Byzantine, the modern Slavic form of which developed in an environment which was quite distinct from that of the Scandinavian countries. The grandure of Imperial Russia, which shapes so much of modern Russian practice, is pretty much antithetical to every aspect of Scandinavian culture. "It's just too much" has been the general verdict of Norwegians I know who have attended Orthodox liturgies. So I don't think the cultural connection is as meaningful as it might appear at first sight.

I have always thought the Old Rite (in a less austere form perhaps) would be very appropriate in a Scandinavian context.

I'm curious how the Old Rite is different and what would make it more appropriate? I've seen videos of their services that always seem to be set in the woods, so not sure how that is different from when they actually have a church.
Logged
Orthodox11
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Posts: 2,999


« Reply #132 on: June 17, 2012, 12:30:28 PM »

I'm curious how the Old Rite is different and what would make it more appropriate? I've seen videos of their services that always seem to be set in the woods, so not sure how that is different from when they actually have a church.

It's not so much the rites themselves (I don't really like calling them "rites" since they're all just variants of the same Byzantine Rite), and more the manner in which they're performed today. The Old Rite just seems to be more understated, lesh flashy. I don't have first hand experience of it though, so my impression of it might be wrong.
Logged
Alpo
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox. With some feta, please.
Posts: 6,624



« Reply #133 on: June 17, 2012, 01:13:38 PM »

The grandure of Imperial Russia, which shapes so much of modern Russian practice, is pretty much antithetical to every aspect of Scandinavian culture. "It's just too much" has been the general verdict of Norwegians I know who have attended Orthodox liturgies. So I don't think the cultural connection is as meaningful as it might appear at first sight.

I don't know about (former?) state church of Norway but the developments of liturgical services in the state church of Finland has been more
to high church direction than the other way around.
Logged
Ansgar
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: More than an inquirer, less than a catechumen
Jurisdiction: Exarchate of orthodox churches of russian tradition in western Europe
Posts: 2,948


Keep your mind in hell and do not despair


« Reply #134 on: July 05, 2012, 12:14:08 PM »

Theotoke parthene in Norwegian  Smiley

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=12OXczv8GGA&feature=plcp
Logged

Do not be cast down over the struggle - the Lord loves a brave warrior. The Lord loves the soul that is valiant.

-St Silouan the athonite
Tags:
Pages: « 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 »   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.18 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
Page created in 0.132 seconds with 73 queries.