Author Topic: Orthodoxy in Country of Georgia  (Read 1024 times)

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Offline cstaff

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Orthodoxy in Country of Georgia
« on: August 09, 2011, 04:44:36 PM »
My brother, who is an evangelical pastor, recently went to the country of Georgia to help spread the true "gospel" to the Orthodox of that country.  In his blog, he posted several terrible accusations about the state of Orthodox belief in that country.  As an example, my brother wrote that the Orthodox Church teaches that Jesus “is very angry because He died for our sins, and provided a way for us to be free from our sins, and he is angry that we haven’t dealt with our sins, gotten rid of our sinfulness.”  He went on to explain that any parishioner cannot pray directly to Jesus because of this disappointment and anger.  “Your only hope is to pray to others who have influence with Jesus – his mother, other venerated saints” who have Jesus’ ear.  In this way you may be able to get Jesus to answer or provide some kind of help."

Obviously, this is not Orthodox teaching and it upsets me that he would publish this as such.  Does anyone have any idea from whom he might have heard this in Georgia?  He claims that some of the young people in that country told him this is what they were taught.
« Last Edit: August 09, 2011, 04:44:59 PM by cstaff »

Offline Ansgar

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Re: Orthodoxy in Country of Georgia
« Reply #1 on: August 09, 2011, 05:14:03 PM »
Could you provide a link to this blog? I would very much like to read it.
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Offline cstaff

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Offline Orthodox11

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Re: Orthodoxy in Country of Georgia
« Reply #3 on: August 09, 2011, 05:50:24 PM »
It's the normal rubbish many Evangelical missionaries spout whenever they go to "save" the Orthodox. Most people, Orthodox, Catholic, Protestant, Muslim, are woefully ignorant of what their own religion teaches. That applies to pretty much any place you go to.

Offline bogdan

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Re: Orthodoxy in Country of Georgia
« Reply #4 on: August 09, 2011, 05:58:57 PM »
If the report is accurate, it sounds like some bizarre folk belief. That certainly is not Orthodox dogma.

My suspicion, though, is that this is a misunderstanding on your brother's part. I don't know if it's willful or not, but this is certainly odd.
« Last Edit: August 09, 2011, 05:59:17 PM by bogdan »

Offline Ansgar

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Re: Orthodoxy in Country of Georgia
« Reply #5 on: August 09, 2011, 06:08:33 PM »
It seems like that your brother mainly have got his information from georgian evangelicals. The fact that the date of the byzantine icon controversy is set to the 11th century shows that they have lack historical knowledge.
I hope that the georgian church will be able to guard and educate its flock.
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Offline Alpo

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Re: Orthodoxy in Country of Georgia
« Reply #6 on: August 09, 2011, 06:35:50 PM »
Maybe your brother converts to Orthodoxy when the Georgians tell him the Church really teaches. ;)

Offline Shlomlokh

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Re: Orthodoxy in Country of Georgia
« Reply #7 on: August 09, 2011, 06:47:34 PM »
Maybe your brother converts to Orthodoxy when the Georgians tell him the Church really teaches. ;)
Let's make that our prayer! :)

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Offline cstaff

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Re: Orthodoxy in Country of Georgia
« Reply #8 on: August 09, 2011, 07:30:50 PM »
Yes.  Please pray for my brother.  Thanks.

Offline pasadi97

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Re: Orthodoxy in Country of Georgia
« Reply #9 on: August 09, 2011, 09:17:20 PM »
The state of orthodoxy is not so good because many things however we shoul remember 70+ years of communism when in Russia from 5000+ Churches only hundreds remained, there was no religious education and such.
Taking people from Orthodoxy and moving them to evagelism is like taking them from Church of God and moving them outside and this is a sin for people moving outside orthodoxy and because evangelism does not have confession to erase this sin, people that went to Evangelism may end in Hell.
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Offline Irish Melkite

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Re: Orthodoxy in Country of Georgia
« Reply #10 on: August 10, 2011, 01:42:50 AM »
Interestingly, as regards the Baptist Church in Gori, which is highlighted in the blog entry

Quote
First Baptist Church in Gori, near Georgia's border with Ossetia, last year baptized nine new believers, the church's first baptism service in a decade.

http://74.6.238.254/search/srpcache?ei=UTF-8&p=Gori+Baptist+Church&fr=slv1-ver&u=http://cc.bingj.com/cache.aspx?q=Gori+Baptist+Church&d=4515831951723724&mkt=en-US&setlang=en-US&w=a82a884b,f265337e&icp=1&.intl=us&sig=_U4v7MsgfAuMAVapBhB0JA--

That line is in an article dated June of this year, so the 9 baptisms (the church's first in a decade) occurred in 2010. It isn't indicated whether the 9 were previously Orthodox faithful or not, but - regardless - it certainly suggests that the inroads into Orthodoxy suggested by the blog are a tad less than significant in numbers. 

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Neil
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Offline Salpy

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Re: Orthodoxy in Country of Georgia
« Reply #11 on: August 10, 2011, 01:54:20 AM »
I read through part of the blog and found the same old lies that I often hear Protestants tell about my own Church.  I can give no credibility to a group that feels the need to lie about others to justify its own existence. 

Offline JimCBrooklyn

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Re: Orthodoxy in Country of Georgia
« Reply #12 on: August 10, 2011, 02:54:59 AM »
I read through part of the blog and found the same old lies that I often hear Protestants tell about my own Church.  I can give no credibility to a group that feels the need to lie about others to justify its own existence. 
You should have listened to the chat I had with a Ukrainian Mormon missionary the other day   :D
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Offline Ansgar

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Re: Orthodoxy in Country of Georgia
« Reply #13 on: August 10, 2011, 04:24:49 AM »
I read through part of the blog and found the same old lies that I often hear Protestants tell about my own Church.  I can give no credibility to a group that feels the need to lie about others to justify its own existence. 
You should have listened to the chat I had with a Ukrainian Mormon missionary the other day   :D

Now that sounds interesting :D
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Offline Shanghaiski

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Re: Orthodoxy in Country of Georgia
« Reply #14 on: August 10, 2011, 09:27:39 AM »
My brother, who is an evangelical pastor, recently went to the country of Georgia to help spread the true "gospel" to the Orthodox of that country.  In his blog, he posted several terrible accusations about the state of Orthodox belief in that country.  As an example, my brother wrote that the Orthodox Church teaches that Jesus “is very angry because He died for our sins, and provided a way for us to be free from our sins, and he is angry that we haven’t dealt with our sins, gotten rid of our sinfulness.”  He went on to explain that any parishioner cannot pray directly to Jesus because of this disappointment and anger.  “Your only hope is to pray to others who have influence with Jesus – his mother, other venerated saints” who have Jesus’ ear.  In this way you may be able to get Jesus to answer or provide some kind of help."

Obviously, this is not Orthodox teaching and it upsets me that he would publish this as such.  Does anyone have any idea from whom he might have heard this in Georgia?  He claims that some of the young people in that country told him this is what they were taught.

Babadoxy mixed with Protestant bias=massive ignorance.

Many Orthodox are very ignorant of what they actually believe. This is not unusual when it comes to any religious group. It is, however, unfortunate, and I believe local Churches everywhere are doing something to fix this.
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Offline Orest

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Re: Orthodoxy in Country of Georgia
« Reply #15 on: August 10, 2011, 10:45:13 AM »
Tell me has your brother actually learned the Georgian language?  How does he really know what the average Georgian Orthodox person believes?
When i visited Russia or even Eastern Europe i heard about American protestant missionary teams who don't even know the language but come to "save" the Orthodox.

Offline cstaff

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Re: Orthodoxy in Country of Georgia
« Reply #16 on: August 10, 2011, 10:51:38 AM »
Tell me has your brother actually learned the Georgian language?  How does he really know what the average Georgian Orthodox person believes?
When i visited Russia or even Eastern Europe i heard about American protestant missionary teams who don't even know the language but come to "save" the Orthodox.

No.  He had an interpreter.

Offline Iconodule

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Re: Orthodoxy in Country of Georgia
« Reply #17 on: August 10, 2011, 11:21:09 AM »
Tell me has your brother actually learned the Georgian language?  How does he really know what the average Georgian Orthodox person believes?
When i visited Russia or even Eastern Europe i heard about American protestant missionary teams who don't even know the language but come to "save" the Orthodox.

No.  He had an interpreter.

Then there are about a million things that could go wrong.

Offline Alveus Lacuna

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Re: Orthodoxy in Country of Georgia
« Reply #18 on: August 10, 2011, 12:07:23 PM »
It's pretty telling that he ate at a McDonald's while he was there, and that that is what he was inspired to take a picture of.

Oh, and don't forget how it was impossible for Georgians to stop the veneration of icons because the monks were making so much money off of them and running such a racket...  ::)

Total garbage, even if there is truth to the folk sentiment they are still very ignorant themselves.
« Last Edit: August 10, 2011, 12:07:48 PM by Alveus Lacuna »

Offline JimCBrooklyn

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Re: Orthodoxy in Country of Georgia
« Reply #19 on: August 10, 2011, 12:35:47 PM »
It's pretty telling that he ate at a McDonald's while he was there, and that that is what he was inspired to take a picture of.

Oh, and don't forget how it was impossible for Georgians to stop the veneration of icons because the monks were making so much money off of them and running such a racket...  ::)

Total garbage, even if there is truth to the folk sentiment they are still very ignorant themselves.

 :D
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Offline Alveus Lacuna

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Re: Orthodoxy in Country of Georgia
« Reply #20 on: August 10, 2011, 01:55:44 PM »
The glories of Georgia are attached.

Offline Justin Kissel

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Re: Orthodoxy in Country of Georgia
« Reply #21 on: August 10, 2011, 01:57:17 PM »
The glories of Georgia are attached.

Mine eyes have seen the glory of the coming of the Lord!

Offline Alveus Lacuna

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Re: Orthodoxy in Country of Georgia
« Reply #22 on: August 10, 2011, 01:58:54 PM »
Mine eyes have seen the glory of the coming of the Lord!

More like the coming of America, and they need an American Jesus to match the new dining options. Remember, he's not a stern judge, he's your boyfriend!