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Author Topic: Budhha statues  (Read 7259 times) Average Rating: 0
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« Reply #45 on: August 08, 2011, 11:46:23 AM »

Sorry for the confusion, IH. I was referring not your post but to the following post:
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personally, i like the idea of batting practice

Sorry for being confused.  I should assign myself some prostrations.  Smiley

Something occurs to me.... We recommend to people who have all those Christmas cards with icons on them, and all the church newsletters with icons in them, that they are disposed of by burning.   If we have access to a large enough oven this would be a way to dispose of statues.   I imagine that the Athonite monks would do this, in their largish ovens for cooking and bread making.
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« Reply #46 on: August 08, 2011, 12:54:01 PM »

Of course, we're assuming that a statue is an "idol".

Buddha himself probably would've destroyed it.
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« Reply #47 on: August 08, 2011, 09:20:45 PM »

The pragmatist in me says "it's a rock, throw it in the river."  The Orthodox in me says "it's a foreign idol, load it in a cannon and shoot it back to Poland."
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« Reply #48 on: August 08, 2011, 10:14:00 PM »

We recommend to people who have all those Christmas cards with icons on them, and all the church newsletters with icons in them, that they are disposed of by burning.   If we have access to a large enough oven this would be a way to dispose of statues.   I imagine that the Athonite monks would do this, in their largish ovens for cooking and bread making.

So bring the Buddhist statues to Mt. Athos for proper disposal? 

These are not Icons.  They are not images of Christ, the saints, or the angels.  At best, these are statues of a man who, as Shanghaiski rightfully points out, would be fine with their destruction.

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« Reply #49 on: August 08, 2011, 10:22:29 PM »

We recommend to people who have all those Christmas cards with icons on them, and all the church newsletters with icons in them, that they are disposed of by burning.   If we have access to a large enough oven this would be a way to dispose of statues.   I imagine that the Athonite monks would do this, in their largish ovens for cooking and bread making.

So bring the Buddhist statues to Mt. Athos for proper disposal? 

The Taliban did a thorough job of destroying those gigantic Buddha statues in Afghanistan.  I think they were 3rd century.

So give your statues to the local branch of the Taliban.

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These are not Icons.  They are not images of Christ, the saints, or the angels.  At best, these are statues of a man who, as Shanghaiski rightfully points out, would be fine with their destruction.

It still seems uncivilised.  I wonder how many of the Saints, humble as they are, would be OK with having their icons destroyed.
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« Reply #50 on: August 08, 2011, 10:45:48 PM »


Yes, but, Buddha isn't a saint.
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« Reply #51 on: August 08, 2011, 11:05:11 PM »

I would guess a few Orthodox Saints wouldn't mind having their icons properly burned, muzzle loaded and canonized if they were pointed towards a good cause.
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« Reply #52 on: August 08, 2011, 11:16:48 PM »

It still seems uncivilised. 

What does that say about the idol destroying saints chronicled in our tradition?  Surely they weren't "uncivilised" or exhibiting "grotesque" behavior.

He certainly doesn't have to destroy them, but this sensitivity towards this sort of object seems silly to me.  How should we properly dispose of National Geographic pictorials of Celtic horse gods?

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« Reply #53 on: August 08, 2011, 11:17:47 PM »

When I was 13 I was into all of that new-age stuff.  When I started going to Church, I tore/broke my tarot cards, "magic" candles, statues, etc. 

It is much better to bin them than let someone else get a hold of them.  You could be doing a favor for someone else's soul.
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« Reply #54 on: August 08, 2011, 11:21:18 PM »

whenever i see them [Buddha statues] in the houses/ apartments i work in as a handyman, i also look for whole foods bags; these seem to be symbiotic.
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« Reply #55 on: August 08, 2011, 11:21:57 PM »


Yes, but, Buddha isn't a saint.

How do you know that he wasn't, though? You admit to knowing next to nothing about the Buddha or Buddhism, and also that you would prefer to remain ignorant about such things. Perhaps people ignorant of Jesus and Christianity somewhere are saying: "I'd throw the statues of that scrawny bearded Jew in the trash, right along with the kitchen scraps"! That's the kind of speech that comes from ignorance.
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« Reply #56 on: August 08, 2011, 11:45:52 PM »


Yes, but, Buddha isn't a saint.

How do you know that he wasn't, though? You admit to knowing next to nothing about the Buddha or Buddhism, and also that you would prefer to remain ignorant about such things. Perhaps people ignorant of Jesus and Christianity somewhere are saying: "I'd throw the statues of that scrawny bearded Jew in the trash, right along with the kitchen scraps"! That's the kind of speech that comes from ignorance.

Sorry, but this is ridiculous.  The Church does not recognize him as a saint. 
According to your logic, we shouldn't destroy or discard any statues or images of any people, as we don't know if they really might be saints?

She's presenting an Orthodox viewpoint, not an ignorant one.  It's unfortunate that your universalist position can't discern a difference between the two. 

If it makes you feel better, I'll be sure to only use my right hand while leafing through the Qu'ran, just in case Muhammad's really a saint too.

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« Reply #57 on: August 08, 2011, 11:46:51 PM »

whenever i see them [Buddha statues] in the houses/ apartments i work in as a handyman, i also look for whole foods bags; these seem to be symbiotic.

 Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy
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« Reply #58 on: August 09, 2011, 12:05:41 AM »


Yes, but, Buddha isn't a saint.

How do you know that he wasn't, though? You admit to knowing next to nothing about the Buddha or Buddhism, and also that you would prefer to remain ignorant about such things. Perhaps people ignorant of Jesus and Christianity somewhere are saying: "I'd throw the statues of that scrawny bearded Jew in the trash, right along with the kitchen scraps"! That's the kind of speech that comes from ignorance.

Sorry, but this is ridiculous.  The Church does not recognize him as a saint. 

<Looking at my avatar> Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
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« Reply #59 on: August 09, 2011, 01:21:11 AM »

It still seems uncivilised. 

What does that say about the idol destroying saints chronicled in our tradition?  Surely they weren't "uncivilised" or exhibiting "grotesque" behavior.

Who does not thrill to the exploits of Saint Patrick and his men overturning idols and cutting down the sacred groves of oak, and the Irish missionaries on the continent did the same.  Often of course they paid a heavy price and were brutally assaulted and murdered.

But I don't see the bishops and missionaries doing that these days..... neither in Thailand nor India.  Are they afraid of being assaulted or taken to court?   
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« Reply #60 on: August 09, 2011, 01:26:02 AM »

Sorry, but this is ridiculous.  The Church does not recognize him as a saint. 

<Looking at my avatar> Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes

My mistake.  I guess Siddhartha Gautama is a recognized Orthodox Saint, and Buddhism is really just Eastern Eastern Orthodoxy.  Feel free to worship his statue as a deity.       Roll Eyes Right back atcha.

On a related note, if the OP genuinely felt as if Buddha directly brought him to Christ/Orthodoxy, my response might've been different.  He didn't mention anything like that. 

The idea that Orthodox Christians are supposed to revere statues of Buddha is rubbish. 
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« Reply #61 on: August 09, 2011, 01:32:59 AM »

Sorry, but this is ridiculous.  The Church does not recognize him as a saint. 

<Looking at my avatar> Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
On a related note, if the OP genuinely felt as if Buddha directly brought him to Christ/Orthodoxy....
Good question: I reckon the answer depends upon the meaning of "brought".
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« Reply #62 on: August 09, 2011, 01:35:06 AM »

Sorry, but this is ridiculous.  The Church does not recognize him as a saint. 

<Looking at my avatar> Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes

My mistake.  I guess Siddhartha Gautama is a recognized Orthodox Saint, and Buddhism is really just Eastern Eastern Orthodoxy.  Feel free to worship his statue as a deity.       Roll Eyes Right back atcha.

On a related note, if the OP genuinely felt as if Buddha directly brought him to Christ/Orthodoxy, my response might've been different.  He didn't mention anything like that. 

The idea that Orthodox Christians are supposed to revere statues of Buddha is rubbish. 

Name the Orthodox Christians who have said that. I cannot think of any.
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« Reply #63 on: August 09, 2011, 01:41:07 AM »

It still seems uncivilised. 
What does that say about the idol destroying saints chronicled in our tradition?  Surely they weren't "uncivilised" or exhibiting "grotesque" behavior.
Who does not thrill to the exploits of Saint Patrick and his men overturning idols and cutting down the sacred groves of oak, and the Irish missionaries on the continent did the same.  Often of course they paid a heavy price and were brutally assaulted and murdered martyred.

But I don't see the bishops and missionaries doing that these days..... neither in Thailand nor India.  Are they afraid of being assaulted or taken to court?

I certainly hope not, but my faith in bishops needs further cultivation.  I understand that publicly smashing other people's statues of faith would not be helpful or wise, but we're talking about the OP's own collection.

I'm also aware that this is a public forum, and that advising the OP to smash Buddhist idols/statues looks callous, intolerant, and generally distasteful to inquirers.  Fine, but I still don't think statues of Buddha are actually subject to the same disposal recommendations as Christian images. 
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« Reply #64 on: August 09, 2011, 01:44:53 AM »

It still seems uncivilised. 
What does that say about the idol destroying saints chronicled in our tradition?  Surely they weren't "uncivilised" or exhibiting "grotesque" behavior.
Who does not thrill to the exploits of Saint Patrick and his men overturning idols and cutting down the sacred groves of oak, and the Irish missionaries on the continent did the same.  Often of course they paid a heavy price and were brutally assaulted and murdered martyred.

But I don't see the bishops and missionaries doing that these days..... neither in Thailand nor India.  Are they afraid of being assaulted or taken to court?

I certainly hope not, but my faith in bishops needs further cultivation.  I understand that publicly smashing other people's statues of faith would not be helpful or wise, but we're talking about the OP's own collection.

I'm also aware that this is a public forum, and that advising the OP to smash Buddhist idols/statues looks callous, intolerant, and generally distasteful to inquirers.  Fine, but I still don't think statues of Buddha are actually subject to the same disposal recommendations as Christian images. 

I'm too sensitive..... I couldn't use a piece of newspaper with the Queen's image as toilet paper on a camping trip.
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« Reply #65 on: August 09, 2011, 01:49:19 AM »

Sorry, but this is ridiculous.  The Church does not recognize him as a saint. 

<Looking at my avatar> Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes

My mistake.  I guess Siddhartha Gautama is a recognized Orthodox Saint, and Buddhism is really just Eastern Eastern Orthodoxy.  Feel free to worship his statue as a deity.       Roll Eyes Right back atcha.

On a related note, if the OP genuinely felt as if Buddha directly brought him to Christ/Orthodoxy, my response might've been different.  He didn't mention anything like that. 

The idea that Orthodox Christians are supposed to revere statues of Buddha is rubbish. 

Name the Orthodox Christians who have said that. I cannot think of any.

Is this in response to my final sentence?  If so, by recommending that these statues be treated similarly to how we treat images of Christ, the saints, angels, etc. or donated to a Buddhist temple seems to be showing reverence. 

If it was to the first sentence: it was hyperbole.  I thought Jetavan's implication that Barlaam and Josaphat being commemorated proved Buddha's sainthood was over the top and deserved a similar response.
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« Reply #66 on: August 09, 2011, 01:51:43 AM »

I'm too sensitive..... I couldn't use a piece of newspaper with the Queen's image as toilet paper on a camping trip.

I'm with you on the latter.  Smiley
As to the former, well... I'm working on it.
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« Reply #67 on: August 09, 2011, 01:55:50 AM »

Good question: I reckon the answer depends upon the meaning of "brought".

Ah, yes. Semiotics, the ever-faithful trump card.
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« Reply #68 on: August 09, 2011, 02:02:29 AM »

There are two ways of looking at Buddhism, Hinduism, Shintoism, Islam, etc.

1.  The first one is to start from the verse of the Psalms "All the gods of the pagans are demons."

2.  The second is to understand that it is God Himself who has planted in man the need to worship Him.   In the places outside the countries of divine revelation (first Israel, and now the Christian countries) this God-given urge took many forms.  Some of the religions which were formed were mild and benevolent (Buddhism) and some were militant (Islam) and some (thank God, now extinct) required such ghastly things as human sacrifice.  And in the last example we can see the demons at work, perverting the human need to worship.

Man is created to worship God, and man will find for himself the ways to satisfy the need God has put so deep in his heart.  He can no more help worshipping than he can eating.  Without divine revelation he is not able to create true and pure religion and so he gets parts of it wrong.
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« Reply #69 on: August 09, 2011, 02:08:19 AM »

Good question: I reckon the answer depends upon the meaning of "brought".

Ah, yes. Semiotics, the ever-faithful trump card.
I-95 (a major interstate highway in the U.S.) can "bring" you to NYC. Maybe Buddhism served as the OP's "I-95", with Orthodoxy as the NYC, the final destination.
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« Reply #70 on: August 09, 2011, 03:09:23 AM »

There are two ways of looking at Buddhism, Hinduism, Shintoism, Islam, etc.

1.  The first one is to start from the verse of the Psalms "All the gods of the pagans are demons."

2.  The second is to understand that it is God Himself who has planted in man the need to worship Him.   In the places outside the countries of divine revelation (first Israel, and now the Christian countries) this God-given urge took many forms.  Some of the religions which were formed were mild and benevolent (Buddhism) and some were militant (Islam) and some (thank God, now extinct) required such ghastly things as human sacrifice.  And in the last example we can see the demons at work, perverting the human need to worship.

Man is created to worship God, and man will find for himself the ways to satisfy the need God has put so deep in his heart.  He can no more help worshipping than he can eating.  Without divine revelation he is not able to create true and pure religion and so he gets parts of it wrong.

Bless, Father,

An extraordinary post, my dear friend!

Many years,

Neil
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« Reply #71 on: August 09, 2011, 06:15:31 AM »

There are two ways of looking at Buddhism, Hinduism, Shintoism, Islam, etc.

1.  The first one is to start from the verse of the Psalms "All the gods of the pagans are demons."

2.  The second is to understand that it is God Himself who has planted in man the need to worship Him.   In the places outside the countries of divine revelation (first Israel, and now the Christian countries) this God-given urge took many forms.  Some of the religions which were formed were mild and benevolent (Buddhism) and some were militant (Islam) and some (thank God, now extinct) required such ghastly things as human sacrifice.  And in the last example we can see the demons at work, perverting the human need to worship.

Man is created to worship God, and man will find for himself the ways to satisfy the need God has put so deep in his heart.  He can no more help worshipping than he can eating.  Without divine revelation he is not able to create true and pure religion and so he gets parts of it wrong.


Bless, Father.

I agree with what you say above, and believe that both viewpoints are valid and part of the Orthodox view on other faiths specifically, and human nature in general. So, what action best reconciles these two views?

If we look at Buddhism as described in #1, then destroying the statues is the best option, as it means we will not be contributing to someone else's worship of "demons", nor will we be seen to support their faith.

If we look at Buddhism as described in #2, then destroying the statues is still an option, because they belong to Ansgar, and so the Buddhists' "need to worship" is not prevented by a few statues which they never owned being destroyed. In addition, whilst giving the statues to a local temple may look like we are giving credence to that faith, destroying the statues will not look like anything, because it can be done in private. Even we need never know what happened to them if Ansgar doesn't tell us, and we don't feel the need to ask him.

So, in conclusion, destroying the statues privately without fuss means that we act in the spirit of #1, without denying #2.
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« Reply #72 on: August 09, 2011, 08:45:28 AM »

I noticed no one has brought up iconoclasm.
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« Reply #73 on: August 09, 2011, 04:48:04 PM »


Yes, but, Buddha isn't a saint.

How do you know? He lived long before Christ. Had no access to the Hebrew Prophets or scriptures and yet taught people to get control of their passions and live for others... Not too bad considering.
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« Reply #74 on: August 09, 2011, 04:52:40 PM »

There are two ways of looking at Buddhism, Hinduism, Shintoism, Islam, etc.

1.  The first one is to start from the verse of the Psalms "All the gods of the pagans are demons."

2.  The second is to understand that it is God Himself who has planted in man the need to worship Him.   In the places outside the countries of divine revelation (first Israel, and now the Christian countries) this God-given urge took many forms.  Some of the religions which were formed were mild and benevolent (Buddhism) and some were militant (Islam) and some (thank God, now extinct) required such ghastly things as human sacrifice.  And in the last example we can see the demons at work, perverting the human need to worship.

Man is created to worship God, and man will find for himself the ways to satisfy the need God has put so deep in his heart.  He can no more help worshipping than he can eating.  Without divine revelation he is not able to create true and pure religion and so he gets parts of it wrong.


Bravo ! POM nomination

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« Reply #75 on: August 09, 2011, 04:58:53 PM »

whenever i see them [Buddha statues] in the houses/ apartments i work in as a handyman, i also look for whole foods bags; these seem to be symbiotic.

LOL laugh
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« Reply #76 on: August 09, 2011, 05:07:01 PM »


Yes, but, Buddha isn't a saint.

How do you know? He lived long before Christ. Had no access to the Hebrew Prophets or scriptures and yet taught people to get control of their passions and live for others... Not too bad considering.

As far as I know the Orthodox Church hasn't recognized him as such, nor have I seen any icons of him with a halo.

Whether the man himself is a saint or not is a irrelevant here.  The discussion centers around Buddhist idols of a pagan god.

I have been taught to follow Christ. 

Buddhists have for the most part heard of Christ (especially those here in the U.S.) however, they choose to pray to a round bellied Buddha.  Why would I even chance reinforcing their misguided beliefs by saving some silly clay or jade or whatever statue in my own house?

Is this for real?

I won't mention what I did with the copy of the Quran that was pushed on me at the State Fair.

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« Reply #77 on: August 09, 2011, 06:51:37 PM »

He lived long before Christ. Had no access to the Hebrew Prophets or scriptures and yet taught people to get control of their passions and live for others... Not too bad considering.

You forgot to mention that he also taught that there is no God, that we get reincarnated, that we can escape the cycle through nothingness.  The living for others is debatable.  More like detachment.

Look, he was probably a good fellow, and I don't believe anyone's claiming that he's burning in eternal hellfire  That said, he is not recognized as a saint, and his statues are certainly not things we're supposed to venerate/hold in a place of reverence.  Just because people have a certain affinity for him doesn't mean that we can just pretend he's a saint and move on.  Perhaps he is secretly a saint, but so are plenty of other people as well.  Great.  This is not an Icon folks, sorry.

Has anyone asked their priest about this sort of thing?  Mine, for one, would look at me as if I asked to play jazz trumpet during Divine Liturgy and tell me to toss it.
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« Reply #78 on: August 09, 2011, 07:04:12 PM »

Mine, for one, would look at me as if I asked to play jazz trumpet during Divine Liturgy
Sorry, just had to say LOL.

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« Reply #79 on: August 09, 2011, 07:14:41 PM »

I do not really care about Buddha or  how his teachings square with the Orthodox faith, but I wouldn't keep those statues in my house for the only reason that they are the most stereotypically bourgeois "spiritual" items. On that account alone they are worthy of  being tossed out. Get a Sacred Heart Jesus instead or a plastic Madonna.
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« Reply #80 on: August 09, 2011, 07:24:16 PM »

bourgeois

lol
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« Reply #81 on: August 09, 2011, 07:25:55 PM »


Yes, but, Buddha isn't a saint.

How do you know? He lived long before Christ. Had no access to the Hebrew Prophets or scriptures and yet taught people to get control of their passions and live for others... Not too bad considering.

As far as I know the Orthodox Church hasn't recognized him as such, nor have I seen any icons of him with a halo.

Whether the man himself is a saint or not is a irrelevant here.  The discussion centers around Buddhist idols of a pagan god.

I have been taught to follow Christ.  

Buddhists have for the most part heard of Christ (especially those here in the U.S.) however, they choose to pray to a round bellied Buddha.  Why would I even chance reinforcing their misguided beliefs by saving some silly clay or jade or whatever statue in my own house?

Is this for real?

I won't mention what I did with the copy of the Quran that was pushed on me at the State Fair.



As far as I know the Orthodox Church hasn't recognized him as such, nor have I seen any icons of him with a halo.


So you thought my statement indicated that I believed the Orthodox Church has canonized Shakyamuni Buddha? Really??...

I bet youre just trying to be snarky.  Wink

Whether the man himself is a saint or not is a irrelevant here.  The discussion centers around Buddhist idols of a pagan god.




I think that is an inaccurate assessment. The Buddha is not considered "A God" or "God" by Buddhists FYI.

So what we are really talking about is being respectful of a venerable person, Saintly by all accounts, who predated Christ and whose teachings are laudable by any and all standards. Plus, we are certainly not discussing worship of statues of him but rather how to dispose of them. I vote for being respectful and avoiding triumphalism and arrogance...  You do whatever you want.


I have been taught to follow Christ.  

Buddhists have for the most part heard of Christ (especially those here in the U.S.) however, they choose to pray to a round bellied Buddha.  Why would I even chance reinforcing their misguided beliefs by saving some silly clay or jade or whatever statue in my own house?


I think you may not have read this thread carefully enough. No one is suggesting that. We are discussing how to best dispose of such statues, either toss them or destroy them like trash or return them.

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« Reply #82 on: August 09, 2011, 07:36:49 PM »

He lived long before Christ. Had no access to the Hebrew Prophets or scriptures and yet taught people to get control of their passions and live for others... Not too bad considering.

You forgot to mention that he also taught that there is no God, that we get reincarnated, that we can escape the cycle through nothingness.  The living for others is debatable.  More like detachment.

Look, he was probably a good fellow, and I don't believe anyone's claiming that he's burning in eternal hellfire  That said, he is not recognized as a saint, and his statues are certainly not things we're supposed to venerate/hold in a place of reverence.  Just because people have a certain affinity for him doesn't mean that we can just pretend he's a saint and move on.  Perhaps he is secretly a saint, but so are plenty of other people as well.  Great.  This is not an Icon folks, sorry.

Has anyone asked their priest about this sort of thing?  Mine, for one, would look at me as if I asked to play jazz trumpet during Divine Liturgy and tell me to toss it.

You forgot to mention that he also taught that there is no God, that we get reincarnated, that we can escape the cycle through nothingness.  The living for others is debatable.  More like detachment.


Ummm...It's actually a bit more complicated than that.

When the Buddha was asked "Is there a God" he remained silent.

He was then asked "Is there not a God" he remained Silent.

And not to get too deep into this, but the Lotus Sutra does indeed reveal that there is a Supreme Being. The "Eternal Shakyamuni Buddha" ( not the temporal manifestation that we are discussing). Google Lotus Sutra chapter 15 through 22, especially chapter 16....like I said. it's complicated.

So Buddhists in some sects did indeed have some notion of the existence of a (The) Supreme Being. Not a Creator God as we know him..but none the less.  
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« Reply #83 on: August 09, 2011, 07:40:55 PM »


Snarky?  Me? Wink

...and I HAVE read the thread carefully.

I understand that it revolves around whether one should keep these idols or destroy them.

"So what we are really talking about is being respectful of a venerable person, Saintly by all accounts, who predated Christ and whose teachings are laudable by any and all standards. Plus, we are certainly not discussing worship of statues of him but rather how to dispose of them. I vote for being respectful and avoiding triumphalism and arrogance...  You do whatever you want. "

I don't have to "do" anything, because there's no way a statue of Buddha would be in my house in the first place.

However, if it were, I would throw it in the trash and not think about it twice.  I would not be offending local Buddhists, because they would know nothing about it.  It wouldn't be a display of triumph as you seem to think, it would simply be housecleaning.

If I think it improper to pray before a statue of Buddha, how would I in good conscience donate it or gift it (local temple or Salvation Army) knowing that someone else would be praying before it?  Seriously.  

If I had fireworks in my house, and was afraid they would cause me harm because they were old and unstable.....would I, out of respect for the fireworks makers and others, donate these same fireworks to the city, perhaps to be used in the local fireworks display....knowing full well that someone might get hurt if they use them?  No.

If it's not safe for me, it's not safe for others.  ...and exactly OUT OF RESPECT for others, and for their souls, I would destroy that statue of Buddha, rather than send it in to the world to hurt others.

...but, that's just me.  You go right ahead and do what you like.  (Now, I am being snarky.)  Smiley
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« Reply #84 on: August 09, 2011, 07:50:01 PM »

A couple things, from my infintesimally small understanding of Buddhism... so far as I understand, saying that "we get reincarnated" isn't exactly right, if by "we" you mean a specific soul or whatever continuing into another life; also, not all buddhists pray to a statue of buddha... and many "buddhist" beliefs also weren't given directly from St. Buddha... thus the fragmenting and significant differences between groups...
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« Reply #85 on: August 09, 2011, 07:52:50 PM »


The Soka Gakkai International, the largest Buddhist Group operating in the West is mostly made up of working class people. They also have a large number of African Americans.. Tina Turner is a member..... So go look her in the eye and tell her what an easy "Bourgeois" life she has had.. Dare ya Smiley

I recall years ago that they used to go downtown and preach to Prostitutes and get them to go to introductory meetings. Many used Buddhism as a way out of that life and reformed.

I ran a Buddhist Prison Ministry ( not the Soka Gakkai but a similar group). My group had a large contingent of former Prisoners who began practicing Buddhism while incarcerated. Most had tattoos on their necks and each finger (LOVE..HATE) and on their faces. We had one Woman who was fully tattooed from head to toe. Even the Japanese priests were a bit scared of her.... A nicer person you will never meet. She had had a hard life.

So.......... count your blessings.. .
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« Reply #86 on: August 09, 2011, 07:56:14 PM »

I understand that it revolves around whether one should keep these idols or destroy them.

Then maybe I am the one who missed the suggestion to keep them. I beleive what we have been discussing is how to best dispose of them.

Oh and you may want to read some things by very well respected Orthodox who are  former Buddhists. Fr. Seraphim Rose and Fr. Abbot Damincene of Platina Monastery for example. They say not to worry too much about people going through a Buddhist phase. They say Buddhism while certainly incomplete, is a SOBER religion to quote Fr. Seraphim and that it can serve to preserve people's soul's until they are ready to receive Christ.

 
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« Reply #87 on: August 09, 2011, 08:03:41 PM »


The Soka Gakkai International, the largest Buddhist Group operating in the West is mostly made up of working class people. They also have a large number of African Americans.. Tina Turner is a member..... So go look her in the eye and tell her what an easy "Bourgeois" life she has had.. Dare ya Smiley

I recall years ago that they used to go downtown and preach to Prostitutes and get them to go to introductory meetings. Many used Buddhism as a way out of that life and reformed.

I ran a Buddhist Prison Ministry ( not the Soka Gakkai but a similar group). My group had a large contingent of former Prisoners who began practicing Buddhism while incarcerated. Most had tattoos on their necks and each finger (LOVE..HATE) and on their faces. We had one Woman who was fully tattooed from head to toe. Even the Japanese priests were a bit scared of her.... A nicer person you will never meet. She had had a hard life.

So.......... count your blessings.. .

What are you on about?
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« Reply #88 on: August 09, 2011, 08:06:18 PM »

I understand that it revolves around whether one should keep these idols or destroy them.

Then maybe I am the one who missed the suggestion to keep them. I beleive what we have been discussing is how to best dispose of them.

Oh and you may want to read some things by very well respected Orthodox who are  former Buddhists. Fr. Seraphim Rose and Fr. Abbot Damincene of Platina Monastery for example. They say not to worry too much about people going through a Buddhist phase. They say Buddhism while certainly incomplete, is a SOBER religion to quote Fr. Seraphim and that it can serve to preserve people's soul's until they are ready to receive Christ.

 

Seriously?  What about those who are Buddhist and happy to remain so....and never "receive" Christ?

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« Reply #89 on: August 09, 2011, 08:32:39 PM »

(for the record, my comment about batting practice was supposed to be so ridiculous and sarcastic, that it should have 0% creditability or sounding good. that was not the case i see, and emotions shall be empolyed to ensure understanding)
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