New York Town Clerk Quits Over Opposition to Gay Marriage

[Tallitot]

IIRC you live in England no? If not my bad.

No. I live in a country where we elect our head of state, rather then leave it to a genetic lottery.

Given your dislike of genetic lotteries, one has to wonder why you converted to a religion where one's status as a member of the Chosen People is, in the vast majority of cases, decided by genetic lottery.

One has to wonder how other Jews in his synagogue embrace his homosexuality too.

Let's see:
We went through our conversion ceremony together, the rabbi and the elders on our beit din were aware of our status as a couple.
We're listed on the membership roles as a family.
My sig-other sings in the choir.
I was recently elected to the synagogue board.
We have done Torah honors and other liturgical functions as a couple.
Friends have invited us a couple to take part in bar and bat mitzvahs.
We are invited to social events as a couple.
Draw your own conclusions as to whether or not we're accepted in our synagogue.

[Achronos]

IIRC you live in England no? If not my bad.

No. I live in a country where we elect our head of state, rather then leave it to a genetic lottery.

Given your dislike of genetic lotteries, one has to wonder why you converted to a religion where one's status as a member of the Chosen People is, in the vast majority of cases, decided by genetic lottery.

One has to wonder how other Jews in his synagogue embrace his homosexuality too.

Let's see:
We went through our conversion ceremony together, the rabbi and the elders on our beit din were aware of our status as a couple.
We're listed on the membership roles as a family.
My sig-other sings in the choir.
I was recently elected to the synagogue board.
We have done Torah honors and other liturgical functions as a couple.
Friends have invited us a couple to take part in bar and bat mitzvahs.
We are invited to social events as a couple.
Draw your own conclusions as to whether or not we're accepted in our synagogue.

And the most important guest is missing: God. Or is He absent from your synagogue.

[Tallitot]

So now you can judge where G-d is and isn't?

[Achronos]

So now you can judge where G-d is and isn't?

No but I can spot an oxymoron when I see it. Do you ask for bacon on your chicken sandwich at KFC too?

[ialmisry]

So now you can judge where G-d is and isn't?

No but I can spot an oxymoron when I see it. Do you ask for bacon on your chicken sandwich at KFC too?

With cheese?

[Aindriú]

So now you can judge where G-d is and isn't?

No but I can spot an oxymoron when I see it. Do you ask for bacon on your chicken sandwich at KFC too?

With cheese?

Toasted?

mmmmmm

[Achronos]

That double-down sure is delicious.

[stavros_388]

So now you can judge where G-d is and isn't?

Apparently he can judge much more than that.

[stavros_388]

A nice earthquake dumping SF and Hollywood into the sea, and global warming putting NYC under a mile of water could help.
Yes, I'm sure G-d'd getting ready to killhundreds of thousands of ppl to make you happy. 
My happiness, sadness or indifference has no bearing on the matter.

So why write such an abhorrent thing in the first place? Really, who exactly would it please to see millions of people perish so that so many bigots wouldn't have to lose sleep over sharing the continent with (gulp) homosexuals?

[biro]

A nice earthquake dumping SF and Hollywood into the sea, and global warming putting NYC under a mile of water could help.

Exodus 20:13: Thou shalt not kill.

I cannot fully say what I think about Isa's post above without violating site language rules and getting thrown out.

And people wonder why I lost faith.

[Achronos]

Nvm

[Tallitot]

The ironic thing is that the EO parish I belonged to pretty much accepted us as acouple on a DADT basis; we were invited to socialize with other families as a couple, everyone would always say "say hi to Joe for me" everyone thought it was great that I could put him on my insurance etc. So i guessw G-d wasn't there either.

[Tallitot]

Nvm

No Video Made?
Nun's Vegan Meal?
Non-Voting Memeber?

[LizaSymonenko]

NVM = Nevermind

[ialmisry]

A nice earthquake dumping SF and Hollywood into the sea, and global warming putting NYC under a mile of water could help.

Exodus 20:13: Thou shalt not kill.

I cannot fully say what I think about Isa's post above without violating site language rules and getting thrown out.

And people wonder why I lost faith.

Because your beliefs are unsteady and unstable, and crumble when your assertions are not accepted?

[ialmisry]

A nice earthquake dumping SF and Hollywood into the sea, and global warming putting NYC under a mile of water could help.
Yes, I'm sure G-d'd getting ready to killhundreds of thousands of ppl to make you happy. 
My happiness, sadness or indifference has no bearing on the matter.

So why write such an abhorrent thing in the first place? Really, who exactly would it please to see millions of people perish so that so many bigots wouldn't have to lose sleep over sharing the continent with (gulp) homosexuals?

LOL. The gay agenda is by far not the only thing SF, LA and NYC are hell bent on afflicting the rest of us with.

[LizaSymonenko]

A nice earthquake dumping SF and Hollywood into the sea, and global warming putting NYC under a mile of water could help.

Exodus 20:13: Thou shalt not kill.

I cannot fully say what I think about Isa's post above without violating site language rules and getting thrown out.

And people wonder why I lost faith.

Where you just saying that....or have you lost faith?

Why?

Hopefully not from reading posts on an Internet Forum. 

[biro]

I have. Look at Isa's posts about hoping everyone in New York, San Francisco and Hollywood dies. Look at his subsequent crack calling my beliefs (and by implication, me) unstable. Look at him posting pictures comparing gay people to Nazis and Communists.

I don't like that kind of thing.

Just in case you're wondering, I'm not gay. I just don't think people should have unequal legal rights. The Fourteenth Amendment to the U.S. Constitution says:

"All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws." 

(underlining is mine)

http://www.archives.gov/exhibits/charters/constitution_amendments_11-27.html

If you don't agree with me, that's fine. That much I can take. But I can't take the kind of things that have been going on here. If that makes me wrong, so be it.

I have been trying to figure out what to say in a letter to my priest. I just don't know.

[TheMathematician]

my friend blogged on this, and thought he raised a few good points
(WARNING: This specific post i am linking to is clean, however if you veer off the post there are things that may offend the reader and is unsavoury for consumption. I repeat however, this post is clean

In case you missed it, Ms. Fotusky is the Town Clerk of some shit town in southern New York that resigned rather than have to issue marriage licenses to homosexuals.  Conservative groups have made a big to-do about how much of a hero Fotusky is for choosing God over her job when she really hasn't done anything of the sort...

http://criminallyvu1gar.blogspot.com/2011/07/laura-l-fotusky-is-joke-and-liar.html

[Achronos]

I have. Look at Isa's posts about hoping everyone in New York, San Francisco and Hollywood dies.

Too bad for you there's truth in it.

Look at his subsequent crack calling my beliefs (and by implication, me) unstable.

You've been wobbling only to topple over, and it didn't need an earthquake involved.

Look at him posting pictures comparing gay people to Nazis and Communists.

Which comparision was that?

I don't like that kind of thing.

http://www.orthodoxchristianity.net/forum/index.php?action=logout;sesc=5ca0f093eea55fa73131f6dc10a10758

[ialmisry]

I have. Look at Isa's posts about hoping everyone in New York, San Francisco and Hollywood dies. Look at his subsequent crack calling my beliefs (and by implication, me) unstable. Look at him posting pictures comparing gay people to Nazis and Communists.

I don't like that kind of thing.

Just in case you're wondering, I'm not gay. I just don't think people should have unequal legal rights. The Fourteenth Amendment to the U.S. Constitution says:

"All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws."  

(underlining is mine)

http://www.archives.gov/exhibits/charters/constitution_amendments_11-27.html

If you don't agree with me, that's fine. That much I can take. But I can't take the kind of things that have been going on here. If that makes me wrong, so be it.

And so it is. But then we've gone over that a couple times already IIRC.

Let's talk of equal rights.  Everyone, heterosexual that is, has the right to have children, because they can.  Now, because of your interpretation of the 14th Ammendment, is the Federal Government responsible to provide gay couples with the children they can't have?

Btw, since you disagree with me on politics, let alone the Faith, are you going to renounce your citizenship too?

[LizaSymonenko]

I have. Look at Isa's posts about hoping everyone in New York, San Francisco and Hollywood dies. Look at his subsequent crack calling my beliefs (and by implication, me) unstable. Look at him posting pictures comparing gay people to Nazis and Communists.

I don't like that kind of thing.

Just in case you're wondering, I'm not gay. I just don't think people should have unequal legal rights. The Fourteenth Amendment to the U.S. Constitution says:

"All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws." 

(underlining is mine)

http://www.archives.gov/exhibits/charters/constitution_amendments_11-27.html

If you don't agree with me, that's fine. That much I can take. But I can't take the kind of things that have been going on here. If that makes me wrong, so be it.

I have been trying to figure out what to say in a letter to my priest. I just don't know.

Biro.

First of all.  The posters of this forum, as esteemed, knowledgeable and righteous at they may be....are not the Church.  Just because you disagree with a poster or two doesn't mean you have to leave the Church.

Isa's comments about the SF and earthquakes, and whatever natural disaster.....was meant to say that an act of God might wake people up....and have them rethink their lives.  However, I fear that wouldn't be the case.  Too many folks are blind to such things.  They would simply write it off as the normal cycle of the ecological natural world we live in.  God would have nothing to do with any thing.

As for the 14th Amendment....that is a government thing, not a Church doctrine.

However, the Church does teach to love each other, even to love and pray for your enemies.  However, the Church also teaches against homosexual activity.  We are not taught to hurt anyone, but, we are also not taught to sit idly by and let things happen.

You mistook Isa's photos of Nazis to represent his views of gays.  I think what he was trying to show was not the gays, themselves, but, the complacent people who didn't stand up to stop what they saw was a bad thing happening.  In other words, folks who realize that an action is wrong, and will only lead to worse situations in the future, however, for whatever reason (fear, shame, want to be cool and politically correct, accepted, etc) do nothing to stop the disaster they see coming on the horizon.

As was noted above, gay marriage undermines the "family" unit.  This will cause nothing but trouble.  The family is the core of each one of us (next to God and Church).  Families teach us, guide us, etc.  If that one family that was mentioned was prohibited to be foster parents because they were anti-gay....this already bodes ill.

Already in California they are changing the school books to teach "gay history".  What?  What is gay history?  Why do they need to know a "history" that is based on sexual orientation.  If we are teaching and promoting equality....this seems that "gays" are making themselves out to be special, and not equal to others.

I think you are hurt and upset.   However, if you take a big step backwards, and think about all the repercussions of this new "equality" you will have to admit, it's messing with family, society, etc.

I hope and pray you rethink your stance and don't take things so personally.  Remember, the Church does teach against homosexual activity, but, does not teach to harm anyone of any orientation.   As much as we like to think we know best....we must acquiesce to God and His knowledge.

I pray for peace in this world, but, I fear it's going to be a bumpy ride....

[TristanCross]

What does a civil marriage certificate have to do with the sacrament of marriage as observed by the Church? Nothing. I can't see anyone or anything stopping gay civil marriages from growing more and more acceptable in our society. A civil marriage has nothing to do with religion, so let them have it, I say. Then all of this nonsense can simmer down to silence (hopefully). Gays can enjoy their civil legal marriages, and Christians can enjoy their sacramental marriages. 

Should we also just accept that abortion is okay in the eyes of Americans and that we can't do anything to change? Of course not. We are called to bring the truth to these people.

[celticfan1888]

So now you can judge where G-d is and isn't?

God? lol. 

[Tallitot]

So now you can judge where G-d is and isn't?

God? lol. 

Yeah you think it's ridiculous for someone to try to show some respect for the Creator, but let someone fail to genuflect to one of your worldy heros, such as the Windsors and boy do your knickers get twisted. One wonders who you truly worship.

[TristanCross]

So now you can judge where G-d is and isn't?

God? lol. 

Jewish people believe it is disrespectful to write "God". Thus, they add a dash in place of the "o".

[Aindriú]

So now you can judge where G-d is and isn't?

God? lol. 

Yeah you think it's ridiculous for someone to try to show some respect for the Creator, but let someone fail to genuflect to one of your worldy heros, such as the Windsors and boy do your knickers get twisted. One wonders who you truly worship.

That's W-nds-rs.

I kid. I'm sorry. I had to. 

I understand it's a sign of respect. It's just not a symbol that Christians typically use.

[Asteriktos]

Lighten up, Tallitot.

"It's our sense of humor that has sustained us as a people for 3,000 years" - Tim Whatley, convert to Judaism

[Carl Kraeff (Second Chance)]

This is getting too personal. I will lock it for a few days to let everybody calm down. Sorry for the inconvenience. Second Chance

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