Poll

Jewish Doctor?

Yes
13 (65%)
No
4 (20%)
Maybe
3 (15%)
Only during High Holy Days
0 (0%)

Total Members Voted: 20

Voting closed: August 15, 2016, 02:31:43 AM

Author Topic: This may sound racist, but...  (Read 591 times)

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Offline hecma925

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This may sound racist, but...
« on: July 06, 2016, 02:31:43 AM »
Explain your vote, if you'd be so kind.
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Offline Olivia

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Re: This may sound racist, but...
« Reply #1 on: July 06, 2016, 04:19:26 AM »
I don't see any difference between going to a Jewish doctor and any other doctor. My family and I base our doctor devious on their compentency and location, not their religion.


(Forgive me if I misunderstood your question; I took it to mean "Would you ever go to a Jewish doctor?")
This is something cute and innocent.

Offline Arachne

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Re: This may sound racist, but...
« Reply #2 on: July 06, 2016, 04:45:13 AM »
Option 5: How would I even know?
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Offline hecma925

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Re: This may sound racist, but...
« Reply #3 on: July 06, 2016, 05:08:58 AM »
Option 5: How would I even know?

If you gotta ask...
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Offline Arachne

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Re: This may sound racist, but...
« Reply #4 on: July 06, 2016, 05:20:31 AM »
Option 5: How would I even know?

If you gotta ask...

...it don't matter anyways. :D
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Offline FinnJames

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Re: This may sound racist, but...
« Reply #5 on: July 06, 2016, 06:21:16 AM »
I voted 'maybe' because whether or not it's offensive ('racist') depends on who says it and who they say it to. It could quite easily be bragging or just a simple statement of fact.

But this thread makes me nervous; I guess I'm going to have to stop telling people I go to a woman dentist.  ;)

Offline scamandrius

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Re: This may sound racist, but...
« Reply #6 on: July 06, 2016, 08:25:19 AM »
I don't understand the question.  Are there Jewish doctors? Yes.  Do I have a Jewish doctor?  I don't know. Do my sons have Jewish pediatricians?  I doubt it but again I don't know.  A doctor I see on occasion when mine is out of the office is Arab Orthodox.  Do I get a bonus for that?

Offline Bryan Paul

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Re: This may sound racist, but...
« Reply #7 on: July 06, 2016, 08:41:56 AM »
Explain your vote, if you'd be so kind.
Explain the question, if you'd be so kind.

Am I a Jewish doctor? No.
Do I know a Jewish doctor? Not personally.
Do I have a Jewish doctor? No.
Have I ever been to a Jewish doctor? Yes.
Would I go to a Jewish doctor? Yes.
Should there be Jewish doctors? Yes.

What are you asking?
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Offline Iconodule

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Re: This may sound racist, but...
« Reply #8 on: July 06, 2016, 09:44:01 AM »
I think hecma was making a jest in reference to Mina's recent warning and also the canonical injunction against retaining Jewish doctors.

Offline Svartzorn

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Re: This may sound racist, but...
« Reply #9 on: July 06, 2016, 09:50:59 AM »
I voted "no" not out of hatred towards jews, but because it's going to make some people alarmated because it's so "racist and offensive".
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Offline William T

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Re: This may sound racist, but...
« Reply #10 on: July 06, 2016, 09:58:11 AM »
my guess is the OP woke up with these symptoms this morning:

dry mouth
sensitivity to light
upset stomach
headache


If this is what ails you (what ales you, get it?), I would not suggest the doctor.  However if you have a nice deli by you, some lox can work wonders.

« Last Edit: July 06, 2016, 09:59:42 AM by William T »
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Offline genesisone

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Re: This may sound racist, but...
« Reply #11 on: July 06, 2016, 10:02:17 AM »
I responded "yes" on the assumption that the question is asking if I would be treated by a Jewish doctor. I am aware that there is a canon somewhere that if taken literally and out of context would forbid me to do so. It is my understanding that canons were put in place because of a particular problem that needed to be dealt with. The problem centuries ago was that religion and medicine were closely tied. If a Jewish doctor were to treat me as any other doctor would - and I have no doubt that the vast majority of them would - then no problem. My current doctor (and my previous one, his father-in-law) is Indian in ethnicity, so I would guess practises Hinduism, though we have never discussed it. He is aware that I am an Orthodox Christian and is respectful of that - and was very impressed with my cholesterol levels at the end of Lent  ;). I do have a problem with the ilks of Dr Oz of TV fame who mixes medicine with New Age philosophies.

Offline FatherGiryus

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Re: This may sound racist, but...
« Reply #12 on: July 06, 2016, 11:10:34 AM »
There are canons barring Christians from Jewish doctors, but it has to do with two things:

a) Jewish doctors were often the 'go-to' guys for abortions (they would, interestingly enough, perform abortions on non-Jews but not on Jewish women)

b) Jewish doctors often were involved in ritual magic as part of their art

If you look around for archeological evidence, you find a lot of Jewish magical papyri and amulets in the Byzantine world.  I have several books on the topic I collected while working on my MDiv thesis on the Evil Eye.  Anyway, it was creepy stuff, and so a canon was adopted to urge Christians to avoid magicians Jewish doctors.

These days, I'd say it would be hard to find any licensed doctors engaging in witchcraft, though the abortion thing is still a problem.  And, yet, with specialization, it is less so.
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Offline Opus118

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Re: This may sound racist, but...
« Reply #13 on: July 06, 2016, 11:19:14 AM »
Council of Trullo
 
CANON XI. LET no one in the priestly order nor any layman eat the unleavened bread of the Jews, nor have any familiar intercourse with them, nor summon them in illness, nor receive medicines from them, nor bathe with them; but if anyone shall take in hand to do so, if he is a cleric, let him be deposed, but if a layman let him be cut off.

http://legacy.fordham.edu/halsall/basis/trullo.asp
It sounds like you can be excommunicated for this offense.


Offline William T

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Re: This may sound racist, but...
« Reply #14 on: July 06, 2016, 11:38:42 AM »
Council of Trullo
 
CANON XI. LET no one in the priestly order nor any layman eat the unleavened bread of the Jews, nor have any familiar intercourse with them, nor summon them in illness, nor receive medicines from them, nor bathe with them; but if anyone shall take in hand to do so, if he is a cleric, let him be deposed, but if a layman let him be cut off.

http://legacy.fordham.edu/halsall/basis/trullo.asp
It sounds like you can be excommunicated for this offense.

This is a law though.  In order to interpret it you have to have some expertise in canon law, which I don't have.  A lot of laws that are written anywhere are archaic and practically useless.  When was the last time this law was normative?  What is the history of it's use?   Moreover in our day to day practice how many of our priests or bishops ever bring this up? 

There are hundreds of esoteric things like this written down everywhere.  I think in Ohio I'm not allowed to tie a tiger to a lamppost on Thursday's.  I'm.sure that la wasn't illogical, and for a very few there may be a need to understand the context of that law, nevertheless...
« Last Edit: July 06, 2016, 11:43:12 AM by William T »
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Offline Mor Ephrem

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Re: This may sound racist, but...
« Reply #15 on: July 06, 2016, 11:42:43 AM »
...my MDiv thesis on the Evil Eye.

Looks like I'm going to need to track that down for my summer reading...
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Offline tuesdayschild

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Re: This may sound racist, but...
« Reply #16 on: July 06, 2016, 11:44:28 AM »
...my MDiv thesis on the Evil Eye.

I would like to read it.

Offline DeniseDenise

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Re: This may sound racist, but...
« Reply #17 on: July 06, 2016, 11:46:15 AM »
me 3
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Offline seekeroftruth777

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Re: This may sound racist, but...
« Reply #18 on: July 06, 2016, 11:53:39 AM »
This is in relation to the Canon law  prohibiting Jewish doctors, right?

Offline RaphaCam

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Re: This may sound racist, but...
« Reply #19 on: July 06, 2016, 11:59:51 AM »
The priest who gives me rides halfway home is a Jewish doctor.
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Offline Porter ODoran

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Re: This may sound racist, but...
« Reply #20 on: July 06, 2016, 12:31:45 PM »
Council of Trullo
 
CANON XI. LET no one in the priestly order nor any layman eat the unleavened bread of the Jews, nor have any familiar intercourse with them, nor summon them in illness, nor receive medicines from them, nor bathe with them; but if anyone shall take in hand to do so, if he is a cleric, let him be deposed, but if a layman let him be cut off.

http://legacy.fordham.edu/halsall/basis/trullo.asp
It sounds like you can be excommunicated for this offense.

Is the Church in existential danger from mingling with Jews today? I think the Jewish religion as it is today is of merely novel interest to us. Nobody is going to try to Judaize Orthodoxy today. Therefore, it would seem to me the canon has served its purpose and is fulfilled.
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Offline DeniseDenise

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Re: This may sound racist, but...
« Reply #21 on: July 06, 2016, 12:42:53 PM »


Therefore, it would seem to me the canon has served its purpose and is fulfilled.


Not going to disagree with your conclusion or anything...but you spend an awful lot of time doing the bolded part...rather than finding out what the Church as a whole 'finds'
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Offline Porter ODoran

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Re: This may sound racist, but...
« Reply #22 on: July 06, 2016, 01:08:32 PM »


Therefore, it would seem to me the canon has served its purpose and is fulfilled.


Not going to disagree with your conclusion or anything...but you spend an awful lot of time doing the bolded part...rather than finding out what the Church as a whole 'finds'

I try to put something like that in any statement of substance I make here. This kind of thing isn't an indication that someone does no research; try to be less literal.
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Offline hecma925

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Re: This may sound racist, but...
« Reply #23 on: July 07, 2016, 06:46:41 PM »
I think hecma was making a jest in reference to Mina's recent warning and also the canonical injunction against retaining Jewish doctors.

Yes, and to see what people's minds would gravitate to when seeing the question without much context.  For those familiar with the canons, they will go to that; for others it comes to if they would/do see a Jewish doctor.  I have in the past, but currently I do not.   I used to live in Florida, so there were plenty of Jewish doctors to go to.
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Offline hecma925

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Re: This may sound racist, but...
« Reply #24 on: July 07, 2016, 06:47:43 PM »
A doctor I see on occasion when mine is out of the office is Arab Orthodox.  Do I get a bonus for that?

+5 points.  It would have been +10 if he was an Arab Orthodox Jew.
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Offline hecma925

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Re: This may sound racist, but...
« Reply #25 on: July 07, 2016, 06:48:26 PM »
If this is what ails you (what ales you, get it?), I would not suggest the doctor.  However if you have a nice deli by you, some lox can work wonders.


Mmmmmmmm, or some pastrami on dark rye with lots of mustard.
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Offline J Michael

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Re: This may sound racist, but...
« Reply #26 on: July 08, 2016, 07:36:53 PM »
I think hecma was making a jest in reference to Mina's recent warning and also the canonical injunction against retaining Jewish doctors.

Yes, and to see what people's minds would gravitate to when seeing the question without much context.  For those familiar with the canons, they will go to that; for others it comes to if they would/do see a Jewish doctor.  I have in the past, but currently I do not.   I used to live in Florida, so there were plenty of Jewish doctors to go to.

Ah....a mind gravitating to little context...Sounds very Zen-like.  Or dangerously political. ;D ;D
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Re: This may sound racist, but...
« Reply #27 on: July 08, 2016, 08:31:17 PM »
Its so hard to tell these days. Back in the good ol' days, you could just take a quick peak down the doc's drawers and find out where he stands. Nowadays, you got all these other folk nicking the bits so you don't know if they are Jewish or not.  :(
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