Author Topic: The Orthodox Way  (Read 1891 times)

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Offline patricius

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The Orthodox Way
« on: December 16, 2002, 03:27:54 PM »
I have just read "The Orthodox Way" by Bishop Kallistos Ware.  I was surprised by some of the things I found in it, and wondered if anyone here had any thoughts about it and its views.  Is it generally thought of as "orthodox" in its theology and approach?  Many thanks in advance.

God bless,

Patrick

Offline Nigula Qian Zishi

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Re:The Orthodox Way
« Reply #1 on: December 16, 2002, 04:57:27 PM »
Bishop Kallistos is a very ecumencal bishop and has some rather liberal thoughts on things such as the iconstasis, clerical orders and other issues.

Here is a good book review of this book from a traditional Orthodox POV:
http://orthodoxinfo.com/phronema/review_tow.htm
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Offline sinjinsmythe

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Re:The Orthodox Way
« Reply #2 on: December 16, 2002, 09:35:41 PM »
Nicholas, I agree that Bishop Ware has many liberal leanings.  I wonder how he can write a book and make the errors that he did like that.  I mean he should know since he is a Hierarch.  ???
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Offline patricius

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Re:The Orthodox Way
« Reply #3 on: December 16, 2002, 10:40:17 PM »
Nicholas,

Thanks for the link.  Several of the things I noticed are mentioned here.  For instance the not so bad Devil.  I wondered if this was, well, orthodox?

Also, the idea of Christ assuming fallen human nature.  I thought that was a bit odd.  I found it a little hard to believe that the Orthodox Church historically taught this.

I am curious though about the thoughts here about the specifics.  The site you linked I have found to be a bit extreme at times, and an article there stated that Mary was a sinner, which I found a little strange.  Is this article sound by your reasoning?  Would you agree with its criticisms?

Many thanks again.

God bless,

Patrick

Offline Mor Ephrem

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Re:The Orthodox Way
« Reply #4 on: December 16, 2002, 10:40:50 PM »
What errors did he actually make in the book?
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Offline Orthodoc

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Re:The Orthodox Way
« Reply #5 on: December 17, 2002, 10:00:29 AM »
[Nicholas, I agree that Bishop Ware has many liberal leanings.  I wonder how he can write a book and make the errors that he did like that.  I mean he should know since he is a Hierarch. ]

There are many of us who are Orthodox Catholics that agree with you.  For the sake of ecumenism Bishop Kallistos seems to be getting more and more liberal.  It seems each new addition of 'The Orthodox Church'  gets more liberal in its contents.

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Offline Mor Ephrem

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Re:The Orthodox Way
« Reply #6 on: December 17, 2002, 11:15:25 AM »
In what ways is he getting more and more liberal?  With regard to newer editions of The Orthodox Church, I know that there is the difference in his stance on birth control (which is considerably different from his first edition, which I'm now reading).  But what else has changed?
"Do not tempt the Mor thy Mod."

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Offline Nigula Qian Zishi

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Re:The Orthodox Way
« Reply #7 on: December 17, 2002, 12:29:13 PM »
Some of his ideas on female clergy, the iconstasis and ecumenism have changed for the worse as well. Again, another great review on it from a traditional mindset is here. The original version is much more orthodox. Thank goodness that St. John of Kronstadt Press has managed to get a few copies of the original version for sale.
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Offline sinjinsmythe

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Re:The Orthodox Way
« Reply #8 on: December 17, 2002, 12:56:24 PM »
Nicholas, thank you for the link.  It is very enlightening to read about Bishop Ware and what he has said.
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Offline Orthodoc

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Re:The Orthodox Way
« Reply #9 on: December 17, 2002, 06:32:01 PM »
[In what ways is he getting more and more liberal?  With regard to newer editions of The Orthodox Church, I know that there is the difference in his stance on birth control (which is considerably different from his first edition, which I'm now reading).  But what else has changed? ]

Regarding the 'Immaculate Conception' -Page 260:

"From the Orthodox point of view, however, the whole question belongs in the realm OF THEOLOGICAL OPINION; and if an individual Orthodox today felt impelled to believe in the Immaculate Conception, he or she could not be termed  heretic for so doing."

I know of very few Orthodox Bishops, priests, or laity that would agree with the above statement that reduces the Immaculate Conception to strictly Theologoumenia.

Those claims come from Papal Catholics of both Latin and Eastern Rites who try and pooh pooh the differences between Roman Catholics and Orthodox Catholics.

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« Last Edit: December 17, 2002, 06:35:08 PM by Orthodoc »
Oh Lord, Save thy people and bless thine inheritance.
Grant victory to the Orthodox Christians over their adversaries.
And by virtue of thy Cross preserve thy habitation.