Author Topic: beards pre schism  (Read 1120 times)

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Offline arrow prayer

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beards pre schism
« on: February 28, 2014, 09:27:04 PM »
did all bishops or popes or priests or whatever they're suppose to be called have beards pre schism?
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Online Asteriktos

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Re: beards pre schism
« Reply #1 on: February 28, 2014, 09:40:35 PM »
I think, speaking in general, that in the east beards were popular, while in the west they were popular at some times and not popular at others. Were they a symbol of strength, masculinity, and not caring about worldly appearance, or were they a sign of being uncivilized and uncultured (and perhaps even illiterate)? So far as I can tell it depended on who you asked and when.

Offline arrow prayer

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Re: beards pre schism
« Reply #2 on: February 28, 2014, 10:08:17 PM »
but originally they all had bears...right?
sorry for my ignorance.
« Last Edit: February 28, 2014, 10:08:52 PM by isus »
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Offline DeniseDenise

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Re: beards pre schism
« Reply #3 on: February 28, 2014, 10:14:36 PM »
but originally they all had bears...right?
sorry for my ignorance.

Only Russian monks have bears!


Sorry. That was a joke.

All opinions expressed by myself are quite tragically my own, and not those of any other poster or wall hangings.

Offline Maria

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Re: beards pre schism
« Reply #4 on: February 28, 2014, 10:15:28 PM »
but originally they all had bears...right?
sorry for my ignorance.

The Russians had their bears, especially St. Seraphim of Sarov.
The memory of God should be treasured in our hearts like the precious pearl mentioned in the Holy Gospel. Our life's goal should be to nurture and contemplate God always within, and never let it depart, for this steadfastness will drive demons away from us. - Paraphrased from St. Philotheus of Sinai
Writings from the Philokalia: On Prayer of the Heart,
Translated from the Russian by E. Kadloubovksy and G.E.H. Palmer, Faber and Faber, London, Boston, 1992 printing.

Offline Maria

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Re: beards pre schism
« Reply #5 on: February 28, 2014, 10:17:05 PM »
but originally they all had bears...right?
sorry for my ignorance.

Only Russian monks have bears!


Sorry. That was a joke.



 :laugh:

We must be on the same wavelength. Simultaneous postings!
The memory of God should be treasured in our hearts like the precious pearl mentioned in the Holy Gospel. Our life's goal should be to nurture and contemplate God always within, and never let it depart, for this steadfastness will drive demons away from us. - Paraphrased from St. Philotheus of Sinai
Writings from the Philokalia: On Prayer of the Heart,
Translated from the Russian by E. Kadloubovksy and G.E.H. Palmer, Faber and Faber, London, Boston, 1992 printing.

Offline Maximum Bob

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Re: beards pre schism
« Reply #6 on: February 28, 2014, 11:38:36 PM »
My daughters say my beard makes me look like a fuzzy bear.  ;D
Psalm 37:23 The Lord guides a man safely in the way he should go.

Prov. 3: 5-6 Trust in the Lord with all your heart, lean not on your own understanding; in all your ways acknowledge Him, and He will direct your paths.

Offline arrow prayer

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Re: beards pre schism
« Reply #7 on: February 28, 2014, 11:41:10 PM »
guys stop fooling around....was it the norm to have beards pre schism
is it something catholics got rid of/changed afterwards or did they never do it
how/when did catholics stop
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Offline Maximum Bob

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Re: beards pre schism
« Reply #8 on: February 28, 2014, 11:50:33 PM »
Hey I was trying to nudge it back in the right direction by reintroducing the word beard for the first time since the second post.

Seriously though I have understood beards to be more likely in antiquity but never universal, due I believe to a Roman preference for being clean shaven. But, I could be wrong.
Psalm 37:23 The Lord guides a man safely in the way he should go.

Prov. 3: 5-6 Trust in the Lord with all your heart, lean not on your own understanding; in all your ways acknowledge Him, and He will direct your paths.

Online Asteriktos

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Re: beards pre schism
« Reply #9 on: March 01, 2014, 12:07:40 AM »
guys stop fooling around....was it the norm to have beards pre schism
is it something catholics got rid of/changed afterwards or did they never do it
how/when did catholics stop

As Maximum Bob said, it was never universal. As I have mentioned on the forum before, when the western missionaries and eastern missionaries were vying for Bulgaria in the 9th century one of the things they brought up as a difference, believe it or not, was beards. St. Photius apparently thought enough of it to mention it as a difference in a letter to the Pope as well, though he counted it as a minor one. Beards (or lack of them) also seemed to bother Pat. Michael Cerularius, another figure central in the breaking apart of the Church, though I would expect that the issue of beards was fairly low on the list of problems.

Offline Maria

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Re: beards pre schism
« Reply #10 on: March 01, 2014, 01:14:34 AM »
My daughters say my beard makes me look like a fuzzy bear.  ;D

Fuzzy wuzzy was a bear
Fuzzy wuzzy had no hair.
Fuzzy wuzzy wasn't fuzzy, was he?

Bears aside.

If one looks at Orthodox Christian Icons, only Eunichs and youths did not have beards.

I do not know when the West thought that shaving their beards made them look more civilized and young, but in reading the life of St. Nektarios of Aegina, his biographers mentioned many discussions that St. Nektarios had with highly educated and proud Byzantine Priests who felt that they had to discard the Byzantine beard and the riassa in order to dialogue with Roman Catholics. St. Nektarios prayed for their salvation, and encouraged his seminarians to wear the riassa and keep their facial hair as a witness of the Priesthood. He died in 1920.

« Last Edit: March 01, 2014, 01:18:38 AM by Maria »
The memory of God should be treasured in our hearts like the precious pearl mentioned in the Holy Gospel. Our life's goal should be to nurture and contemplate God always within, and never let it depart, for this steadfastness will drive demons away from us. - Paraphrased from St. Philotheus of Sinai
Writings from the Philokalia: On Prayer of the Heart,
Translated from the Russian by E. Kadloubovksy and G.E.H. Palmer, Faber and Faber, London, Boston, 1992 printing.

Offline Laurentius

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Re: beards pre schism
« Reply #11 on: March 01, 2014, 06:14:06 AM »
It could also be noted that missionary priests are still suppose to wear beards in the RC tradition. I think this was mostly a cultural thing in two different parts of the empire.
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Offline Gunnarr

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Re: beards pre schism
« Reply #12 on: March 01, 2014, 06:20:29 AM »
in the west, beards were not as common, in the east, beards were common

no changes needed both are legitimate
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Offline vasily

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Re: beards pre schism
« Reply #13 on: March 01, 2014, 09:50:58 AM »
From why I have been able to find, is that the tradition of beards came from the Old Testament Prophets.

Offline kyril

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Re: beards pre schism
« Reply #14 on: March 01, 2014, 10:12:57 AM »
 I thought that 'beards pre-schism' referred to their appearance (just?) before
the barber's shears descended upon them; poor things. The shears, that is.
kyril