OrthodoxChristianity.net
October 23, 2014, 05:41:18 PM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
News: Reminder: No political discussions in the public fora.  If you do not have access to the private Politics Forum, please send a PM to Fr. George.
 
   Home   Help Calendar Contact Treasury Tags Login Register  
Pages: 1 2 All   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Walk to Emmaus  (Read 7407 times) Average Rating: 0
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
IsmiLiora
Chronic Exaggerator
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: One step closer!
Jurisdiction: Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America (GOA)
Posts: 3,434


Back by unpopular demand.


« on: June 02, 2011, 12:18:36 AM »

Has anyone here been on the Walk to Emmaus? (The Upper Room -- Walk to Emmaus http://www.upperroom.org/emmaus/)

It's essentially a retreat disguised as the beginning of a longer journey. People from many Christian denominations attend the walk, although there were no Orthodox Christians on my walk! They were mostly RC, Baptist, evangelical, etc. During the weekend, prayer and worship are disrupted by silly traditions that attendants are basically forced to participate in. I was embarrassed at so many times during the Walk; I couldn't even imagine what kind of problems the team had with the men who weren't excited about dancing around with people in clown-ish costumes.

I attended one (well, I was cornered into going, although I should have put my foot down and said "No way") several years ago, and I was put off by many of the aspects of the Walk.

Among them is a sense of secrecy. The group actually had to make a statement* because so many spouses were "hiding" what happened on the walk and not telling their spouses about it. While many people have argued that it was that their spouse could be surprised, it has generated a resentment in the second person to attend the walk. For a few years my friend never told me what happened because she wanted me to be surprised. "Well, I'm not going, so you can tell me," I told her. "Oh, you ARE going," she responded.

My husband went on the walk before I did. At the time, we hadn't started officially dating yet, but we intended to after a period of prayer. Several people at my church were volunteering that weekend and they made it a point to tell me that he looked "horrible, like something had hit him and he was shocked." People on the walk are technically not allowed to use their cell phones (or consult their watches), so I couldn't contact him. I was distraught the entire weekend, and a big fight blew up because of it.

I don't want to keep blabbing, although if anyone has questions about the weekend (and its strangely cultish aspects), I can answer them. I just wanted to ask if any people on this board had attended a walk at one point. I'm opening this question to non-Orthodox, because I also wanted to ask if anyone was put off about it as well.


Just looking back, I feel that the Walk was one of the clues about my changing view of Christianity. All other aspects aside, there were many things that felt "wrong" about the weekend. I guess I'm hoping to hear about other's positive/negative experiences. I'm basically looking for an "Emmaus support group!"

*The statement instructs people to give details when asked, and not to act secretive. By experiencing the Walk through two different churches, I really know that this isn't being put into practice by many people who attended.
« Last Edit: June 02, 2011, 12:20:01 AM by IsmiLiora » Logged

She's touring the facility/and picking up slack.
--
"For in much wisdom is much grief, and he who increases knowledge increases sorrow." Ecclesiastes 1:18
--
I once believed in causes too, I had my pointless point of view --
Life went on no matter who was wrong or right
Gamliel
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: Greek Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Metropolis of San Francisco
Posts: 2,213



« Reply #1 on: June 02, 2011, 12:35:59 AM »

Is this similar to a mason lodge initiation? Undecided
Logged
IsmiLiora
Chronic Exaggerator
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: One step closer!
Jurisdiction: Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America (GOA)
Posts: 3,434


Back by unpopular demand.


« Reply #2 on: June 02, 2011, 12:41:01 AM »

Is this similar to a mason lodge initiation? Undecided
No. After the weekend, they call the rest of your life the "4th day," which is representative of our journey in Christianity.

There is no obligation to attend the meetings which occur after the Walk or to participate, although many members become involved. My roommate, who was on the road to a nervous breakdown throughout the entire weekend, actually became a speaker at the next Walk, so I guess she really got something out of it. I was never involved but continued to receive things in the mail and endured some "gentle" prodding from people at my church.

But some aspects of the weekend seemed sort of like an initiation into a bigger thing. At the end of the walk, when our rides were supposed to pick us up (YES! They discourage people from driving to the campsite themselves; your sponsor is supposed to drop you off and pick you up), we go into a big meeting hall and stand on stage. We have to announce ourselves and there is a short program.

Just feeling the shivers thinking about it again.

ETA: The thing is that they have a lot of rules, and they justify it by saying that they are showing agape love towards you. You have to let your sponsor take you out to dinner and drive because they love you. You get a whole mess of "presents" because of others' agape love. They wake you up in the morning personally because they love you. They will discourage you if you're trying to escape (and I've heard some tales) because they love you.
« Last Edit: June 02, 2011, 12:43:19 AM by IsmiLiora » Logged

She's touring the facility/and picking up slack.
--
"For in much wisdom is much grief, and he who increases knowledge increases sorrow." Ecclesiastes 1:18
--
I once believed in causes too, I had my pointless point of view --
Life went on no matter who was wrong or right
Gamliel
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: Greek Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Metropolis of San Francisco
Posts: 2,213



« Reply #3 on: June 02, 2011, 12:59:23 AM »

Hmmmmm.  I would be apprehensive about letting others have so much control.  I think if the Mrs. went along, and she had a sponsor who showed love by waking her up in the morning, she would show love back by giving the sponsor a black eye. Lips Sealed
Logged
JamesRottnek
Protokentarchos
*********
Offline Offline

Faith: Anglican
Jurisdiction: Episcopal Diocese of Arizona
Posts: 5,121


I am Bibleman; putting 'the' back in the Ukraine


« Reply #4 on: June 07, 2011, 07:14:49 PM »

What exactly do they have you do?  Neither Wikipedia nor their website were helpful
Logged

I know a secret about a former Supreme Court Justice.  Can you guess what it is?

The greatest tragedy in the world is when a cigarette ends.

American Spirits - the eco-friendly cigarette.

Preston Robert Kinney (September 8th, 1997-August 14, 2011
GabrieltheCelt
Hillbilly Extraordinaire
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Faith: Eastern Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: OCA
Posts: 6,988


Chasin' down a Hoodoo...


« Reply #5 on: June 07, 2011, 07:28:01 PM »

Has anyone here been on the Walk to Emmaus? (The Upper Room -- Walk to Emmaus http://www.upperroom.org/emmaus/)

It's essentially a retreat disguised as the beginning of a longer journey. People from many Christian denominations attend the walk, although there were no Orthodox Christians on my walk!
Golly, I wonder why?
 
  During the weekend, prayer and worship...
When compared to many Protestant traditions, prayer and worship are radically different in the Orthodox traditions.  Many Protestant traditions are evolving into weird, existential coffer hours.

...are disrupted by silly traditions that attendants are basically forced to participate in. I was embarrassed at so many times during the Walk; I couldn't even imagine what kind of problems the team had with the men who weren't excited about dancing around with people in clown-ish costumes.
Where I'm from we have a saying that goes, "You don't see cowsh!t till you step in it."  But sometimes, it's so glaringly obvious you can step right over it.  That's prolly why many Orthodox Christians are attracted to this kind of event. 









Logged

"The Scots-Irish; Brewed in Scotland, bottled in Ireland, uncorked in America."  ~Scots-Irish saying
IsmiLiora
Chronic Exaggerator
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: One step closer!
Jurisdiction: Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America (GOA)
Posts: 3,434


Back by unpopular demand.


« Reply #6 on: June 07, 2011, 07:31:15 PM »

It's like a whole weekend with prayer and worship. They also give -- I think it's 5 talks? They're about the different types of grace. There are also other activities, like singing "De Colores," nailing your sins to a cross, having communion at the end of the trip, etc.


They are super structured. And by super structured, I mean that they don't use clocks and they ask you to put away your watches. When they say that you have 5 minutes to go to the bathroom, they show you with your thumb and pointer finger, leaving a little space in between.

The prayer and worship part sounds dandy, but they don't let it work out of their own limits. I was praying with my group during prayer time that afternoon. One of the women started talking about a very personal problem, and she was having a nervous breakdown.  We were all sitting with her, listening to her talk, and praying with her. The leaders kept hovering around the doorway until they came in and told us we had to go to the dining hall. Obviously no one wanted to eat at that point, but they ushered us out of the room.

I was really angry about having to go to dinner at that time, and to cap it all off, they did another tradition that I hated -- they sang this song that they sing to late comers (who don't understand what the cryptic "5 minutes" sign means). This woman was sobbing and they were singing the late song. I harbored some definitely evil thoughts in my mind for HOURS after that.

They have a very strict time schedule, and you cannot mess with it in any way. Now seriously, how is that conducive to a weekend of growth in the faith?



Excessive vulgarity replaced with something more appropriate for the forum...  -PtA
« Last Edit: June 08, 2011, 11:40:38 PM by PeterTheAleut » Logged

She's touring the facility/and picking up slack.
--
"For in much wisdom is much grief, and he who increases knowledge increases sorrow." Ecclesiastes 1:18
--
I once believed in causes too, I had my pointless point of view --
Life went on no matter who was wrong or right
Benjamin the Red
Recovering Calvinist
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Catholic
Jurisdiction: Orthodox Church in America, Diocese of Dallas and the South ||| American Carpatho-Russian Orthodox Diocese
Posts: 1,601


Have mercy on me, O God, have mercy on me.


« Reply #7 on: June 07, 2011, 07:31:38 PM »

Sounds like one of those weird, semi-cultish charismatic/evangelical groups (like IHOP or something).

Avoiding that like the plague.
Logged

"Hades is not a place, no, but a state of the soul. It begins here on earth. Just so, paradise begins in the soul of a man here in the earthly life. Here we already have contact with the divine..." -St. John, Wonderworker of Shanghai and San Francisco, Homily On the Sunday of Orthodoxy
rakovsky
Protokentarchos
*********
Online Online

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Orthodox Church in America
Posts: 4,558



WWW
« Reply #8 on: June 07, 2011, 07:37:03 PM »

Has anyone here been on the Walk to Emmaus? (The Upper Room -- Walk to Emmaus http://www.upperroom.org/emmaus/)

People from many Christian denominations attend the walk, although there were no Orthodox Christians on my walk! They were mostly RC, Baptist, evangelical, etc.

My husband went on the walk before I did. At the time, we hadn't started officially dating yet, but we intended to after a period of prayer. Several people at my church were volunteering that weekend and they made it a point to tell me that he looked "horrible, like something had hit him and he was shocked."

*The statement instructs people to give details when asked, and not to act secretive. By experiencing the Walk through two different churches, I really know that this isn't being put into practice by many people who attended.

What do you mean by two churches? That you went on two trips organized by two churches?
That one time your husband's church had some of its people volunteering at it and saw your husband?
Logged
IsmiLiora
Chronic Exaggerator
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: One step closer!
Jurisdiction: Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America (GOA)
Posts: 3,434


Back by unpopular demand.


« Reply #9 on: June 07, 2011, 07:48:39 PM »

Oh, sorry, I meant that I attended two churches that sent people to the walk. I had friends and acquaintances in both churches who had gone before me, and they refused to say anything about the walk, other than some minute details.


At the second church, which my husband and I attended for about 2 or 3 years -- we both went to the Emmaus walk through that church. I went to service on Sunday morning during his walk, and people in my church had seen him on Friday night, since they were volunteering. That's when they told me about how he looked.

I was sent to the next walk (Men and women go separately), and that was only because I didn't have enough guts to say no to all of the people who were telling me "Oh, it'll change your life! I promise!"
Logged

She's touring the facility/and picking up slack.
--
"For in much wisdom is much grief, and he who increases knowledge increases sorrow." Ecclesiastes 1:18
--
I once believed in causes too, I had my pointless point of view --
Life went on no matter who was wrong or right
rakovsky
Protokentarchos
*********
Online Online

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Orthodox Church in America
Posts: 4,558



WWW
« Reply #10 on: June 07, 2011, 07:52:22 PM »

There is no obligation to attend the meetings which occur after the Walk or to participate, although many members become involved. My roommate, who was on the road to a nervous breakdown throughout the entire weekend, actually became a speaker at the next Walk, so I guess she really got something out of it.
Hmmm... this change from nervous breakdown to devotee is like what can happen in cults or mindcontrol.

Come to think of it, how would you overcome mind control? Maybe pray, but then what if the other side is doing religious mind control?

But this is strange:
So what made your husband look horrid? what caused the breakbown?
What you have said doesn't seem to be enough to do it. I mean merely having people dance around you in clown outfits, getting driven around and lacking outside calls doesn't seem to do it enough. After all, this kind of stuff- at least that which you mentioned- is typical for kids in summer camps- costumes, lacking communication etc. Although nowadays I suppose more kids have cell phones than 10 years ago.
The point is, the fact people had breakdowns doesn't make sense- what caused this?

But some aspects of the weekend seemed sort of like an initiation into a bigger thing.
Hmmm it's possible, and interesting to think about. There is a movie, I think Training Day, when the hero gets overwhelmed and "loses" his test. The training is over. But then the boss tells him alone that actually he succeeded, and gives him a mission. So sometimes more can go on. P.S. some missions aren't fun. LOL.

Quote
At the end of the walk, when our rides were supposed to pick us up (YES! They discourage people from driving to the campsite themselves; your sponsor is supposed to drop you off and pick you up), we go into a big meeting hall and stand on stage.

You have to let your sponsor take you out to dinner and drive because they love you. ...They will discourage you if you're trying to escape (and I've heard some tales) because they love you.

OK, so sponsor must always drive you, you can have no transportation. You also mentioned no cellphones. So no outside calls.
And OK, they have an extremely patronizing view that they need to drive and wake you up, and the justification is that the patrons love you. But then, why no outside calls to/from other people who love you? Sounds like you are surrendering yourself to the patrons and temporarily abandoning those outside the entity, like parents, family, and church, since you can't communicate to or from them.

Dude, simply escaping could be fun. But it could be hard too.
« Last Edit: June 07, 2011, 07:55:36 PM by rakovsky » Logged
rakovsky
Protokentarchos
*********
Online Online

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Orthodox Church in America
Posts: 4,558



WWW
« Reply #11 on: June 07, 2011, 07:57:35 PM »

I didn't have enough guts to say no to all of the people who were telling me "Oh, it'll change your life! I promise!"
And did it change your life as much as those words suggest?

And if it's just some normal church retreat, like college kids staying over at the monastery or Church summer camp, why so much secrecy?
This secrecy seems strange.


And change your life? Well, summer camp and religious retreats were some of the best times of my life. I liked the Orthodox ones even more than the several RC ones I went on- which was good too I admit.

But still, "change your life?" Well, they made an impact. Maybe this is just harmless advertising by the volunteers?
« Last Edit: June 07, 2011, 08:00:54 PM by rakovsky » Logged
IsmiLiora
Chronic Exaggerator
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: One step closer!
Jurisdiction: Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America (GOA)
Posts: 3,434


Back by unpopular demand.


« Reply #12 on: June 07, 2011, 08:03:11 PM »

^ Yup! They made it sound like distrusting your sponsor was a bad thing. To top it all off, they kept teasing me about starving all weekend during our dinner out. I was scared to death and not amused at all.


My husband told me that he met up with a bunch of guys on his walk (talked into it by their loving wives and churches, apparently) and they made cult jokes the entire weekend. When they wake you up, they actually leave a cup of orange juice on your night table. They were all freaked out and I think they refused to drink it. I know, paranoid much? But the more I went into the weekend myself, things just didn't seem right.


On my first morning, they only woke up my roommate and told her to wake me up (they probably shook my leg once and gave up). She was in the shower for so long that she didn't get a chance to do that. They started ringing the bell, which meant that everyone was supposed to go to the main hall for breakfast RIGHT AWAY (they don't do lateness very well over there). I woke up with a bouquet of flowers on my bed.


I was in my pajamas and the women told me to get out of the room and go to the hall. "I don't have enough clothes on and I'm not ready," I told her. She kept urging me to just go to the hall, but I ignored the ladies and got dressed as quickly as I could. I was like, "Seriously? I'm a big girl. I know where the hall is. I can't show up 10 minutes late for breakfast?"

Anyway, some more stories of the crazy. Sorry, I am just venting.
Logged

She's touring the facility/and picking up slack.
--
"For in much wisdom is much grief, and he who increases knowledge increases sorrow." Ecclesiastes 1:18
--
I once believed in causes too, I had my pointless point of view --
Life went on no matter who was wrong or right
IsmiLiora
Chronic Exaggerator
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: One step closer!
Jurisdiction: Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America (GOA)
Posts: 3,434


Back by unpopular demand.


« Reply #13 on: June 07, 2011, 08:05:55 PM »


And did it change your life as much as those words suggest?
Well, aside from scaring the **** out of me, I didn't really bond with any of the women (I was, by far, the youngest on the walk. They called me the "baby bird). But honestly, I walked out of it feeling guilty that I didn't have the life changing experience. I felt like something was wrong with me. Only when I talked to my husband frankly, we found out how much we really didn't get out of it.

Like I said, it was one of the first moments when I started to consider leaving the non-denominational church and culture for good. So, I guess it DID have an impact!  Cheesy
Logged

She's touring the facility/and picking up slack.
--
"For in much wisdom is much grief, and he who increases knowledge increases sorrow." Ecclesiastes 1:18
--
I once believed in causes too, I had my pointless point of view --
Life went on no matter who was wrong or right
rakovsky
Protokentarchos
*********
Online Online

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Orthodox Church in America
Posts: 4,558



WWW
« Reply #14 on: June 07, 2011, 08:12:13 PM »

Sounds like one of those weird, semi-cultish charismatic/evangelical groups (like IHOP or something).

Avoiding that like the plague.

The pancake house?

You know, I went to an evangelical school for a few months. People weren't particularly unpleasant. In fact, at the time I generally shared their basic ideas. It was just that there seemed to be a kind of enforced thinking and negativity about other ideas. Like evolution is bad, evolutionists are bad. The negative attitude toward the RCs wasn't nice either, but not really that strong. The attitude about RCs is what I picture alot of protestants might've had about them, say, 100 years ago.

I doubt if it's only an evangelical problem: the strict religious education Stalin was subjected to seemed to work in a bad way. The strict style and watching over people in the religious school to make sure they weren't reading science books or other "bad" books, with isolation chamber punishments.

Anyway, I guess the point is that you could even have a "normal" religious view like Orthodoxy or mainstream Protestantism and create a religious environment that is too controlling, and perhaps mentally-suppressive because of doctrinariness.
« Last Edit: June 07, 2011, 08:16:26 PM by rakovsky » Logged
JamesRottnek
Protokentarchos
*********
Offline Offline

Faith: Anglican
Jurisdiction: Episcopal Diocese of Arizona
Posts: 5,121


I am Bibleman; putting 'the' back in the Ukraine


« Reply #15 on: June 07, 2011, 08:15:07 PM »

This thing sounds creepy
Logged

I know a secret about a former Supreme Court Justice.  Can you guess what it is?

The greatest tragedy in the world is when a cigarette ends.

American Spirits - the eco-friendly cigarette.

Preston Robert Kinney (September 8th, 1997-August 14, 2011
IsmiLiora
Chronic Exaggerator
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: One step closer!
Jurisdiction: Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America (GOA)
Posts: 3,434


Back by unpopular demand.


« Reply #16 on: June 07, 2011, 08:16:20 PM »

International House of Prayer.  Smiley I once actually wanted to get involved and someone shot me down and said that I didn't have a calling to do it. I don't even remember the details, except thinking "BURN!"

That was my big beef with the evangelicals. Not everyone followed the same path, but most of the people in the church read the SAME approved authors, watched the SAME approved TV shows...the conversations weren't very intellectually stimulating, to say the least. I just call the culture "shallow." Many people have the same core beliefs in Christianity that many of us do, and they are not so caught up in the gifts, or tracts, or anything like that. But the culture surrounding evangelicalism (in the US at least) overall is shallow, shallow, shallow. Orthodoxy was a breath of fresh air in a million ways.
Logged

She's touring the facility/and picking up slack.
--
"For in much wisdom is much grief, and he who increases knowledge increases sorrow." Ecclesiastes 1:18
--
I once believed in causes too, I had my pointless point of view --
Life went on no matter who was wrong or right
rakovsky
Protokentarchos
*********
Online Online

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Orthodox Church in America
Posts: 4,558



WWW
« Reply #17 on: June 07, 2011, 08:29:23 PM »

They started ringing the bell, which meant that everyone was supposed to go to the main hall for breakfast RIGHT AWAY (they don't do lateness very well over there). I woke up with a bouquet of flowers on my bed.


I was in my pajamas and the women told me to get out of the room and go to the hall. "I don't have enough clothes on and I'm not ready," I told her. She kept urging me to just go to the hall, but I ignored the ladies and got dressed as quickly as I could. I was like, "Seriously? I'm a big girl. I know where the hall is. I can't show up 10 minutes late for breakfast?"

Anyway, some more stories of the crazy. Sorry, I am just venting.

Well, I can see that as bad, depending on how they said it. If they were nice and said "Oh don't worry about wearing pajamas, you can just go in", then it seems OK.
But if they are really demanding about the immediacy, then it's somewhat an intrusion on your personal dress and composure. But then again, people in boot camp in the army get ordered to do things quickly. But then again, Boot Camp could be pretty mentally straining too.

So so far I am still not sure what could've caused an extreme breakdown (no, not yours, but the other lady you mentioned, and also what affected your husband). Did your husband mention anything else that could explain this?

Perhaps if someone does something "bad", the other patrons act in a hostile or punitive way?


On a sidenote, there is a TV documentary called "Jesus Camp" that shows a Pentecostal (I think) kid's camp
If you see it on Youtube, let me know your reaction:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=LACyLTsH4ac

« Last Edit: June 07, 2011, 08:36:43 PM by rakovsky » Logged
IsmiLiora
Chronic Exaggerator
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: One step closer!
Jurisdiction: Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America (GOA)
Posts: 3,434


Back by unpopular demand.


« Reply #18 on: June 07, 2011, 08:35:34 PM »

So so far I am still not sure what could've caused an extreme breakdown. Did your husband mention anything else that could explain this?
I hope I was clear -- I didn't have a breakdown! (I was really, really upset during my husband's weekend, but there were a lot of actors involved and I don't want to go too in depth about that story)

And yes, we saw Jesus Camp for the first time several months ago. I cried during the entire movie and was haunted by it for days after (this was after we started inquiring into Orthodoxy). With the exception of the cardboard George Bush, I recognized pretty much everything else in the movie.


If you're interested about this subject, I recommend reading Hanna Rosin's "God's Harvard: A Christian College On a Mission to Save America."  http://www.amazon.com/Gods-Harvard-Christian-College-Mission/dp/0151012628

It's about Patrick Henry College. Rosin talks a lot about the culture. She follows several students, some who are very open about their struggles with politics, their faith, and the culture. It was a pretty good book, in my opinion.

ETA: And I wouldn't mind boot camp if...well, it was actually boot camp. Smiley I didn't know many of the details going into the weekend, so I just felt like I was constantly being surprised without time to process or the choice to not heed their instructions immediately. Of course they wouldn't have hurt me, but you know what I mean.
« Last Edit: June 07, 2011, 08:37:20 PM by IsmiLiora » Logged

She's touring the facility/and picking up slack.
--
"For in much wisdom is much grief, and he who increases knowledge increases sorrow." Ecclesiastes 1:18
--
I once believed in causes too, I had my pointless point of view --
Life went on no matter who was wrong or right
Gamliel
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: Greek Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Metropolis of San Francisco
Posts: 2,213



« Reply #19 on: June 07, 2011, 08:50:41 PM »

So so far I am still not sure what could've caused an extreme breakdown. Did your husband mention anything else that could explain this?
I hope I was clear -- I didn't have a breakdown! (I was really, really upset during my husband's weekend, but there were a lot of actors involved and I don't want to go too in depth about that story)

And yes, we saw Jesus Camp for the first time several months ago. I cried during the entire movie and was haunted by it for days after (this was after we started inquiring into Orthodoxy). With the exception of the cardboard George Bush, I recognized pretty much everything else in the movie.


If you're interested about this subject, I recommend reading Hanna Rosin's "God's Harvard: A Christian College On a Mission to Save America."  http://www.amazon.com/Gods-Harvard-Christian-College-Mission/dp/0151012628

It's about Patrick Henry College. Rosin talks a lot about the culture. She follows several students, some who are very open about their struggles with politics, their faith, and the culture. It was a pretty good book, in my opinion.

ETA: And I wouldn't mind boot camp if...well, it was actually boot camp. Smiley I didn't know many of the details going into the weekend, so I just felt like I was constantly being surprised without time to process or the choice to not heed their instructions immediately. Of course they wouldn't have hurt me, but you know what I mean.
Try not to think about it anymore.  It is history.  You can now enjoy the quiet, refreshing, power of Liturgy.  Prayers.
Gamliel
Logged
rakovsky
Protokentarchos
*********
Online Online

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Orthodox Church in America
Posts: 4,558



WWW
« Reply #20 on: June 07, 2011, 08:59:16 PM »

So so far I am still not sure what could've caused an extreme breakdown. Did your husband mention anything else that could explain this?
I hope I was clear -- I didn't have a breakdown! (I was really, really upset during my husband's weekend, but there were a lot of actors involved and I don't want to go too in depth about that story)

And yes, we saw Jesus Camp for the first time several months ago. I cried during the entire movie and was haunted by it for days after (this was after we started inquiring into Orthodoxy). With the exception of the cardboard George Bush, I recognized pretty much everything else in the movie.

It's OK, Ismi. I meant the other lady you mentioned who had a breakdown, and what affected your husband.
I see that if the patrons would be really demanding and impatient while you dress, that this could be pretty unpleasant. Was that the kind of thing you are talking about?

Likewise, "nailing your sins to a cross" is pretty extreme. I know the early Christians confessed their sins to eachother, but if you mean that the people on the retreat make some public confessions and not everyone is really being forgiving, then this could be really hard.

For example, one time I told some evangelicals about how nice Orthodoxy is, and they asked me if I have a personal relationship with Jesus and really believe in it etc. Well, I have my doubts about religion, so I said I didn't want to get into it because I wanted to avoid a religious argument. I think they smirked alittle. And it makes me feel alittle hypocritical. But my point is that I can see how some evangelicals, who are certain about their religious correctness could make you feel bad because of one's faults.

It seems they have a sense that "once saved always saved" means you aren't going to have serious doubts or make serious mistakes, and this absolute standard can be pretty hard for those who do have doubts or make mistakes after they have the evangelical "born again" experience, which is basically a moment that one is strongly convinced about Christianity.
Logged
rakovsky
Protokentarchos
*********
Online Online

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Orthodox Church in America
Posts: 4,558



WWW
« Reply #21 on: June 07, 2011, 09:09:02 PM »

They are super structured. And by super structured, I mean that they don't use clocks and they ask you to put away your watches. When they say that you have 5 minutes to go to the bathroom, they show you with your thumb and pointer finger, leaving a little space in between.

Yeah really, are you that dumb... Oh wait, this is part of the arbitrariness. You don't now when the time is, so you cannot contradict them when they tell you the time is up.
In other words, this gives them more control over you.

With so much powerlessness I could see how it could be psychologically troubling if your patron(s) are mad at you or something.

So I guess my questions are what happened if people made mistakes, and also was there anything else that explains what made your husband look unhealthy? Perhaps he was just tired?

I was really pissed about having to go to dinner at that time, and to cap it all off, they did another tradition that I hated -- they sang this song that they sing to late comers (who don't understand what the cryptic "5 minutes" sign means). This woman was sobbing and they were singing the late song. I harbored some definitely evil thoughts in my mind for HOURS after that.

Yes, if it is a religious retreat, they should console her, instead of ignoring her in front of everyone. Maybe take her into another room and try to make her feel better.



Yes, they are basically treating you like they are strict, sometimes uncaring parents, and you are only 5 years old.

I feel sorry for these people's real kids. There is some evan "child training" literature that talks about breaking their kids' will and stuff. It is messed up. The kids have just been raised in this thought and accept it. It's messed up.
Logged
rakovsky
Protokentarchos
*********
Online Online

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Orthodox Church in America
Posts: 4,558



WWW
« Reply #22 on: June 07, 2011, 09:16:23 PM »

I think it can be helpful and liberating to look back and see how you freed your mind. It is also a form of escape from the camp. And then thinking about what persuades you about Orthodoxy? This is also interesting.


Health and Happiness to you, Ismi.
Logged
dcommini
Tha mi sgulan na Trianaid
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Antiochian
Posts: 1,207


Beannachd Dia dhuit

dcommini
WWW
« Reply #23 on: June 07, 2011, 09:52:55 PM »

After reading this thread I want to go and see what they say about me having transportation and a cell phone since I am in the nat'l guard and need those things in case of an emergency, regardless of their rules. I'd also like to see them rush me into anything, I've been through boot camp, they are not drill sergeants, they can wait especially if I am praying...

But I'm sure that I will never get the chance to go and it probably wouldn't be very Christian of me to do those things
Logged

Gun cuireadh do chupa thairis le slàinte agus sona - May your cup overflow with health and happiness
Check out my blog...
rakovsky
Protokentarchos
*********
Online Online

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Orthodox Church in America
Posts: 4,558



WWW
« Reply #24 on: June 07, 2011, 10:08:58 PM »

After reading this thread I want to go and see what they say about me having transportation and a cell phone since I am in the nat'l guard and need those things in case of an emergency, regardless of their rules. I'd also like to see them rush me into anything, I've been through boot camp, they are not drill sergeants, they can wait especially if I am praying...

But I'm sure that I will never get the chance to go and it probably wouldn't be very Christian of me to do those things

Well, it could be like the DiCaprio movie Shutter Island where they don't let you in unless you give up stuff to them.
Also, yes in boot camp you got general training for dealing with psychological stress, LOL.
However, even with that, if you are in a cult they have ways to break you, LOL. Another thing is that part of it is that you are handing over your mind and trust to them. So if you refuse to do that, it's less likely they can manipulate you easily, and will need to find other, bad ways. They say everyone has a breaking point. But maybe that isn't true, or is a very extremely far off point for some people?

Probably you have read about scientology? Their compunds have spikes pointing inside the compound. Still, some have escaped, but have trouble explaining the psychological forces keeping them in.

I am sure they would find you a worthy opponent. LOL Wink
« Last Edit: June 07, 2011, 10:11:13 PM by rakovsky » Logged
dcommini
Tha mi sgulan na Trianaid
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Antiochian
Posts: 1,207


Beannachd Dia dhuit

dcommini
WWW
« Reply #25 on: June 07, 2011, 10:12:46 PM »

After reading this thread I want to go and see what they say about me having transportation and a cell phone since I am in the nat'l guard and need those things in case of an emergency, regardless of their rules. I'd also like to see them rush me into anything, I've been through boot camp, they are not drill sergeants, they can wait especially if I am praying...

But I'm sure that I will never get the chance to go and it probably wouldn't be very Christian of me to do those things

Well, it could be like the DiCaprio movie Shutter Island where they don't let you in unless you give up stuff to them.
Also, yes in boot camp you got general training for dealing with psychological stress, LOL.
However, even with that, if you are in a cult they have ways to break you, LOL. Another thing is that part of it is that you are handing over your mind and trust to them. So if you refuse to do that, it's less likely they can manipulate you easily, and will need to find other, bad ways. They say everyone has a breaking point. But maybe that isn't true, or is a very extremely far off point for some people?

Regards

Everybody deals with stress differently, and everybody has that breaking point. I just hope that they wouldn't come in to wake me up or mess with me in my sleep as I have slight (and as of yet undiagnosed) PTSD... anything other than my alarm waking me up is likely to get a fist/elbow/foot/knee to the face... I would really feel bad if that happened, especially if they were meaning well.
Logged

Gun cuireadh do chupa thairis le slàinte agus sona - May your cup overflow with health and happiness
Check out my blog...
rakovsky
Protokentarchos
*********
Online Online

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Orthodox Church in America
Posts: 4,558



WWW
« Reply #26 on: June 07, 2011, 10:15:47 PM »

After reading this thread I want to go and see what they say about me having transportation and a cell phone since I am in the nat'l guard and need those things in case of an emergency, regardless of their rules. I'd also like to see them rush me into anything, I've been through boot camp, they are not drill sergeants, they can wait especially if I am praying...

But I'm sure that I will never get the chance to go and it probably wouldn't be very Christian of me to do those things

Well, it could be like the DiCaprio movie Shutter Island where they don't let you in unless you give up stuff to them.
Also, yes in boot camp you got general training for dealing with psychological stress, LOL.
However, even with that, if you are in a cult they have ways to break you, LOL. Another thing is that part of it is that you are handing over your mind and trust to them. So if you refuse to do that, it's less likely they can manipulate you easily, and will need to find other, bad ways. They say everyone has a breaking point. But maybe that isn't true, or is a very extremely far off point for some people?

Regards

Everybody deals with stress differently, and everybody has that breaking point. I just hope that they wouldn't come in to wake me up or mess with me in my sleep as I have slight (and as of yet undiagnosed) PTSD... anything other than my alarm waking me up is likely to get a fist/elbow/foot/knee to the face... I would really feel bad if that happened, especially if they were meaning well.

Hehe. But again, this could be another "barrier" to your continued "therapy", which of course you know you really want. Wink

Anyway, the Emmaus Walk is probably rather harmless as far as cults go, unlike, say the Jim Jones guys.
« Last Edit: June 07, 2011, 10:17:53 PM by rakovsky » Logged
IsmiLiora
Chronic Exaggerator
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: One step closer!
Jurisdiction: Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America (GOA)
Posts: 3,434


Back by unpopular demand.


« Reply #27 on: June 07, 2011, 10:16:59 PM »

^ I believe that I remember hearing that the military men told the leaders in advance not to touch them at all. I'm not sure how they woke up, though. Probably that bell!

Rakovsky, my husband was very tired and just thrown off by what was going on that weekend. That's what he said to me, anyway. Smiley As for my roommate...I guess she found a lot of comfort in the worship and friendship. I don't want to judge, but I was really surprised that she was invited to talk, because she could barely hold herself together for a second when talking about her life. Something must have really changed!
Logged

She's touring the facility/and picking up slack.
--
"For in much wisdom is much grief, and he who increases knowledge increases sorrow." Ecclesiastes 1:18
--
I once believed in causes too, I had my pointless point of view --
Life went on no matter who was wrong or right
rakovsky
Protokentarchos
*********
Online Online

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Orthodox Church in America
Posts: 4,558



WWW
« Reply #28 on: June 07, 2011, 10:24:42 PM »

^ I believe that I remember hearing that the military men told the leaders in advance not to touch them at all. I'm not sure how they woke up, though. Probably that bell!

Rakovsky, my husband was very tired and just thrown off by what was going on that weekend. That's what he said to me, anyway. Smiley
Sure, I believe him.

It was only the first night (Friday) when he looked bad, so I am thinkig how much could've happened. Yeah, maybe if he wasn't all "into it" and they decided they had to "get to him" this could make sense. And, well, telling someone with you fingers you have only "this much" little piece of time to go to the bathroom and demand extreme punctuality, that could bother you...

I am thinking- well, what if I was one of the kids in Jesus camp? Then I would have to keep my thoughts to myself and go along with stuff I guess. What do you think is the best way to deal with such a situation?


Quote
As for my roommate...I guess she found a lot of comfort in the worship and friendship. I don't want to judge, but I was really surprised that she was invited to talk, because she could barely hold herself together for a second when talking about her life. Something must have really changed!
Well, if she had a breakdown and she found some of the people there were supportive, and picked her up from her breakdown, this could explain how she had some connection to it.


« Last Edit: June 07, 2011, 10:25:47 PM by rakovsky » Logged
IsmiLiora
Chronic Exaggerator
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: One step closer!
Jurisdiction: Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America (GOA)
Posts: 3,434


Back by unpopular demand.


« Reply #29 on: June 07, 2011, 10:36:07 PM »

Actually, the first night was Thursday! It's Thursday through Sunday. We couldn't talk after a certain time on the first night, which he hated. I actually liked it because it gave me some time to acclimate myself to what was going on.

But yes, I believe him too.


About Jesus Camp -- it's the worst when the children are involved. I entered the charismatic church at 18 years old, so I was old enough to make my own decisions. Even then, I felt pressured to go along with things. Just to be polite, I ended up participating in exercises that I thought were stupid, or even spiritually harmful. And I was 18 at the time! I had already walked out on Roman Catholicism -- why didn't I just leave the church? I don't know. I know that I did love how they spoke about God 24/7 without being ashamed (unlike in my RCC household and school, where faith was viewed very differently), but I couldn't put my finger on what was wrong early on.

The poor children. I wanted to kidnap all of them. They are so obviously fed lines by their parents and pastors. Listen to the interviews -- they sound almost word-for-word like the sermons I've heard.  Those children didn't come up with those lines by themselves. Sad
Logged

She's touring the facility/and picking up slack.
--
"For in much wisdom is much grief, and he who increases knowledge increases sorrow." Ecclesiastes 1:18
--
I once believed in causes too, I had my pointless point of view --
Life went on no matter who was wrong or right
dcommini
Tha mi sgulan na Trianaid
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Antiochian
Posts: 1,207


Beannachd Dia dhuit

dcommini
WWW
« Reply #30 on: June 07, 2011, 10:42:41 PM »

After reading this thread I want to go and see what they say about me having transportation and a cell phone since I am in the nat'l guard and need those things in case of an emergency, regardless of their rules. I'd also like to see them rush me into anything, I've been through boot camp, they are not drill sergeants, they can wait especially if I am praying...

But I'm sure that I will never get the chance to go and it probably wouldn't be very Christian of me to do those things

Well, it could be like the DiCaprio movie Shutter Island where they don't let you in unless you give up stuff to them.
Also, yes in boot camp you got general training for dealing with psychological stress, LOL.
However, even with that, if you are in a cult they have ways to break you, LOL. Another thing is that part of it is that you are handing over your mind and trust to them. So if you refuse to do that, it's less likely they can manipulate you easily, and will need to find other, bad ways. They say everyone has a breaking point. But maybe that isn't true, or is a very extremely far off point for some people?

Regards

Everybody deals with stress differently, and everybody has that breaking point. I just hope that they wouldn't come in to wake me up or mess with me in my sleep as I have slight (and as of yet undiagnosed) PTSD... anything other than my alarm waking me up is likely to get a fist/elbow/foot/knee to the face... I would really feel bad if that happened, especially if they were meaning well.

Hehe. But again, this could be another "barrier" to your continued "therapy", which of course you know you really want. Wink

Anyway, the Emmaus Walk is probably rather harmless as far as cults go, unlike, say the Jim Jones guys.

I do need therapy, but I doubt they could handle that on the civilian side.

^ I believe that I remember hearing that the military men told the leaders in advance not to touch them at all. I'm not sure how they woke up, though. Probably that bell!


It is nice to know that they will at least respect that request at least.
Logged

Gun cuireadh do chupa thairis le slàinte agus sona - May your cup overflow with health and happiness
Check out my blog...
IsmiLiora
Chronic Exaggerator
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: One step closer!
Jurisdiction: Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America (GOA)
Posts: 3,434


Back by unpopular demand.


« Reply #31 on: June 07, 2011, 10:45:55 PM »

Honestly, it depends on the situation. I know of some mothers who were able to argue and persuade the leaders to let them have their cell phones on their person. (You can leave it in the room, but they urge you to turn it off. I never saw anyone with a cell phone all weekend, so I'm not sure what they would have done if I kept mine in my pocket.) But I also know some people who faced resistance about the driving, phone, and watch issues.

The fact that it happens, though...I mean, it is really unnerving not to know what time it is. It isn't peaceful at all, in my opinion -- especially if I was told not to wear my watch!
« Last Edit: June 07, 2011, 10:46:21 PM by IsmiLiora » Logged

She's touring the facility/and picking up slack.
--
"For in much wisdom is much grief, and he who increases knowledge increases sorrow." Ecclesiastes 1:18
--
I once believed in causes too, I had my pointless point of view --
Life went on no matter who was wrong or right
dcommini
Tha mi sgulan na Trianaid
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Antiochian
Posts: 1,207


Beannachd Dia dhuit

dcommini
WWW
« Reply #32 on: June 07, 2011, 10:50:24 PM »

Honestly, it depends on the situation. I know of some mothers who were able to argue and persuade the leaders to let them have their cell phones on their person. (You can leave it in the room, but they urge you to turn it off. I never saw anyone with a cell phone all weekend, so I'm not sure what they would have done if I kept mine in my pocket.) But I also know some people who faced resistance about the driving, phone, and watch issues.

The fact that it happens, though...I mean, it is really unnerving not to know what time it is. It isn't peaceful at all, in my opinion -- especially if I was told not to wear my watch!

Even in boot camp they let you have a watch (they even tell you to go buy one if you don't have one). It seems to me that the whole time thing is to throw off your perception and force you to rely on what they tell you - possibly a form of mind control - if they tell you that 3 minutes is 5 and you believe them what else might you believe?

Of course that is only speculation on my part as I really do not have enough information to go off of which is another reason I would like to go; to find out for myself (and not get brainwashed).
Logged

Gun cuireadh do chupa thairis le slàinte agus sona - May your cup overflow with health and happiness
Check out my blog...
rakovsky
Protokentarchos
*********
Online Online

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Orthodox Church in America
Posts: 4,558



WWW
« Reply #33 on: June 08, 2011, 10:50:22 AM »

Even in boot camp they let you have a watch (they even tell you to go buy one if you don't have one). It seems to me that the whole time thing is to throw off your perception and force you to rely on what they tell you - possibly a form of mind control - if they tell you that 3 minutes is 5 and you believe them what else might you believe?

Of course that is only speculation on my part as I really do not have enough information to go off of which is another reason I would like to go; to find out for myself (and not get brainwashed).
I don't think it's worth it. Just get a really bossy girlfriend, give her your watch and cellphone and then go to a particularly active Evan church for a week. It seems to be about being the child in an Evan parent-child relationship.
Logged
dcommini
Tha mi sgulan na Trianaid
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Antiochian
Posts: 1,207


Beannachd Dia dhuit

dcommini
WWW
« Reply #34 on: June 08, 2011, 05:19:23 PM »

Even in boot camp they let you have a watch (they even tell you to go buy one if you don't have one). It seems to me that the whole time thing is to throw off your perception and force you to rely on what they tell you - possibly a form of mind control - if they tell you that 3 minutes is 5 and you believe them what else might you believe?

Of course that is only speculation on my part as I really do not have enough information to go off of which is another reason I would like to go; to find out for myself (and not get brainwashed).
I don't think it's worth it. Just get a really bossy girlfriend, give her your watch and cellphone and then go to a particularly active Evan church for a week. It seems to be about being the child in an Evan parent-child relationship.

I already had one of those and made her my wife, now I'm never certain when or where I am  Tongue and if she should ever happen upon this thread she would kill me...
Logged

Gun cuireadh do chupa thairis le slàinte agus sona - May your cup overflow with health and happiness
Check out my blog...
IsmiLiora
Chronic Exaggerator
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: One step closer!
Jurisdiction: Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America (GOA)
Posts: 3,434


Back by unpopular demand.


« Reply #35 on: June 08, 2011, 05:35:33 PM »

Hey, bossy wives are nothing like the people at Emmaus....



We sure aren't bringing glasses of juice and putting them on your night table every morning! No way! We need the beauty sleep. I'd like my juice with ice, please.
 Wink
Logged

She's touring the facility/and picking up slack.
--
"For in much wisdom is much grief, and he who increases knowledge increases sorrow." Ecclesiastes 1:18
--
I once believed in causes too, I had my pointless point of view --
Life went on no matter who was wrong or right
Melodist
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: The Faith That Established The Universe
Jurisdiction: AOANA
Posts: 2,523



« Reply #36 on: June 08, 2011, 06:09:20 PM »

Even in boot camp they let you have a watch (they even tell you to go buy one if you don't have one).

They told us not to wear watches in boot camp. Our drill instructors just told us what to do when they wanted us to do it.
Logged

And FWIW, these are our Fathers too, you know.

Made Perfect in Weakness - Latest Post: The Son of God
dcommini
Tha mi sgulan na Trianaid
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Antiochian
Posts: 1,207


Beannachd Dia dhuit

dcommini
WWW
« Reply #37 on: June 08, 2011, 06:18:39 PM »

Even in boot camp they let you have a watch (they even tell you to go buy one if you don't have one).

They told us not to wear watches in boot camp. Our drill instructors just told us what to do when they wanted us to do it.

Ours told us to have watches to set alarms for stuff like fireguard and CQ. And for 5 minute bathroom brakes.
Logged

Gun cuireadh do chupa thairis le slàinte agus sona - May your cup overflow with health and happiness
Check out my blog...
PeterTheAleut
The Right Blowhard Peter the Furtive of Yetts O'Muckhart
Section Moderator
Protospatharios
*****
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: OCA
Posts: 32,662


Lord, have mercy on the Christians in Mosul!


« Reply #38 on: June 08, 2011, 11:49:36 PM »

Even in boot camp they let you have a watch (they even tell you to go buy one if you don't have one).

They told us not to wear watches in boot camp. Our drill instructors just told us what to do when they wanted us to do it.
You went through Marine Corps boot camp?
Logged
jnorm888
Jnorm
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: Eastern Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Antiochian
Posts: 2,516


Icon and Cross (international space station)


WWW
« Reply #39 on: June 09, 2011, 02:22:51 AM »

Has anyone here been on the Walk to Emmaus? (The Upper Room -- Walk to Emmaus http://www.upperroom.org/emmaus/)

It's essentially a retreat disguised as the beginning of a longer journey. People from many Christian denominations attend the walk, although there were no Orthodox Christians on my walk! They were mostly RC, Baptist, evangelical, etc. During the weekend, prayer and worship are disrupted by silly traditions that attendants are basically forced to participate in. I was embarrassed at so many times during the Walk; I couldn't even imagine what kind of problems the team had with the men who weren't excited about dancing around with people in clown-ish costumes.

I attended one (well, I was cornered into going, although I should have put my foot down and said "No way") several years ago, and I was put off by many of the aspects of the Walk.

Among them is a sense of secrecy. The group actually had to make a statement* because so many spouses were "hiding" what happened on the walk and not telling their spouses about it. While many people have argued that it was that their spouse could be surprised, it has generated a resentment in the second person to attend the walk. For a few years my friend never told me what happened because she wanted me to be surprised. "Well, I'm not going, so you can tell me," I told her. "Oh, you ARE going," she responded.

My husband went on the walk before I did. At the time, we hadn't started officially dating yet, but we intended to after a period of prayer. Several people at my church were volunteering that weekend and they made it a point to tell me that he looked "horrible, like something had hit him and he was shocked." People on the walk are technically not allowed to use their cell phones (or consult their watches), so I couldn't contact him. I was distraught the entire weekend, and a big fight blew up because of it.

I don't want to keep blabbing, although if anyone has questions about the weekend (and its strangely cultish aspects), I can answer them. I just wanted to ask if any people on this board had attended a walk at one point. I'm opening this question to non-Orthodox, because I also wanted to ask if anyone was put off about it as well.


Just looking back, I feel that the Walk was one of the clues about my changing view of Christianity. All other aspects aside, there were many things that felt "wrong" about the weekend. I guess I'm hoping to hear about other's positive/negative experiences. I'm basically looking for an "Emmaus support group!"

*The statement instructs people to give details when asked, and not to act secretive. By experiencing the Walk through two different churches, I really know that this isn't being put into practice by many people who attended.

I went a few weeks ago and I loved it. It is secretive for a very good reason. What I loved about the retreat is that it was for men only! And we dealt with men issues! I understand wholeheartedly why they want to keep personal things personal. Look, you shouldn't be upset about this. Being secretive is not always bad.

I had a wonderful time and if I knew what it was before going then it would of totally ruined the experience for me. Some people may of had a bad experience, but I had a wonderful one.


I see it as harmless!

« Last Edit: June 09, 2011, 02:24:17 AM by jnorm888 » Logged

"loving one's enemies does not mean loving wickedness, ungodliness, adultery, or theft. Rather, it means loving the theif, the ungodly, and the adulterer." Clement of Alexandria 195 A.D.

http://ancientchristiandefender.blogspot.com/
jnorm888
Jnorm
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: Eastern Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Antiochian
Posts: 2,516


Icon and Cross (international space station)


WWW
« Reply #40 on: June 09, 2011, 02:27:13 AM »

Is this similar to a mason lodge initiation? Undecided

It's a Roman Catholic ministry that also allow non-Roman catholics to participate.
« Last Edit: June 09, 2011, 02:28:10 AM by jnorm888 » Logged

"loving one's enemies does not mean loving wickedness, ungodliness, adultery, or theft. Rather, it means loving the theif, the ungodly, and the adulterer." Clement of Alexandria 195 A.D.

http://ancientchristiandefender.blogspot.com/
jnorm888
Jnorm
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: Eastern Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Antiochian
Posts: 2,516


Icon and Cross (international space station)


WWW
« Reply #41 on: June 09, 2011, 02:33:05 AM »

Honestly, it depends on the situation. I know of some mothers who were able to argue and persuade the leaders to let them have their cell phones on their person. (You can leave it in the room, but they urge you to turn it off. I never saw anyone with a cell phone all weekend, so I'm not sure what they would have done if I kept mine in my pocket.) But I also know some people who faced resistance about the driving, phone, and watch issues.

The fact that it happens, though...I mean, it is really unnerving not to know what time it is. It isn't peaceful at all, in my opinion -- especially if I was told not to wear my watch!

Have you ever gone camping in the woods at all? You sound way too depending on the grid. Look, being away from your phone for a few days isn't going to kill you. They do that for your first retreat, but they allowed us to have our phones. They just told us to not tell anyone the personal information of others at the retreat. And we didn't.
« Last Edit: June 09, 2011, 02:37:32 AM by jnorm888 » Logged

"loving one's enemies does not mean loving wickedness, ungodliness, adultery, or theft. Rather, it means loving the theif, the ungodly, and the adulterer." Clement of Alexandria 195 A.D.

http://ancientchristiandefender.blogspot.com/
jnorm888
Jnorm
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: Eastern Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Antiochian
Posts: 2,516


Icon and Cross (international space station)


WWW
« Reply #42 on: June 09, 2011, 02:45:47 AM »

After reading this thread I want to go and see what they say about me having transportation and a cell phone since I am in the nat'l guard and need those things in case of an emergency, regardless of their rules. I'd also like to see them rush me into anything, I've been through boot camp, they are not drill sergeants, they can wait especially if I am praying...

But I'm sure that I will never get the chance to go and it probably wouldn't be very Christian of me to do those things

Well, it could be like the DiCaprio movie Shutter Island where they don't let you in unless you give up stuff to them.
Also, yes in boot camp you got general training for dealing with psychological stress, LOL.
However, even with that, if you are in a cult they have ways to break you, LOL. Another thing is that part of it is that you are handing over your mind and trust to them. So if you refuse to do that, it's less likely they can manipulate you easily, and will need to find other, bad ways. They say everyone has a breaking point. But maybe that isn't true, or is a very extremely far off point for some people?

Regards

Everybody deals with stress differently, and everybody has that breaking point. I just hope that they wouldn't come in to wake me up or mess with me in my sleep as I have slight (and as of yet undiagnosed) PTSD... anything other than my alarm waking me up is likely to get a fist/elbow/foot/knee to the face... I would really feel bad if that happened, especially if they were meaning well.

This is how they woke us up:
http://youtu.be/oYMSU-aNdSk (The wake up call at 7 in the morning)

Our Emmuas retreat was awesome! You would love it, especially the one over here in Pittsburgh.
Logged

"loving one's enemies does not mean loving wickedness, ungodliness, adultery, or theft. Rather, it means loving the theif, the ungodly, and the adulterer." Clement of Alexandria 195 A.D.

http://ancientchristiandefender.blogspot.com/
IsmiLiora
Chronic Exaggerator
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: One step closer!
Jurisdiction: Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America (GOA)
Posts: 3,434


Back by unpopular demand.


« Reply #43 on: June 09, 2011, 09:37:50 AM »

Have you ever gone camping in the woods at all? You sound way too depending on the grid. Look, being away from your phone for a few days isn't going to kill you. They do that for your first retreat, but they allowed us to have our phones. They just told us to not tell anyone the personal information of others at the retreat. And we didn't.
I'm glad you had a good experience! As I was saying, my roommate apparently did as well, since she did a complete 180 during the weekend.

And like I said, I didn't like that I was SURPRISED by the rules and I HAD to follow what they were saying. I've been out of cell phone contact for several days or even weeks at a time, when I was doing missions in Ukraine and when I was in the Philippines. While I miss being able to use it, I can let go if I need to!

If I have cell reception and my watch has a working battery, I don't need to have other people tell me to put it away and have to depend on them to tell me how much time I have to go to the bathroom and run to my room with their hands (unless I'm in boot camp, that is).
« Last Edit: June 09, 2011, 09:38:41 AM by IsmiLiora » Logged

She's touring the facility/and picking up slack.
--
"For in much wisdom is much grief, and he who increases knowledge increases sorrow." Ecclesiastes 1:18
--
I once believed in causes too, I had my pointless point of view --
Life went on no matter who was wrong or right
rakovsky
Protokentarchos
*********
Online Online

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Orthodox Church in America
Posts: 4,558



WWW
« Reply #44 on: June 09, 2011, 10:29:07 AM »

I don't know about you, but if dudes were putting flowers on my bed I might think it was weird too. Smiley

Also, I can see people on a religious retreat having a very good time. But I am confused why someone telling you with your fingers you have only a little time to go to the bathroom and demanding you act "right away" is enjoyable.

Maybe it is some kind of religious boot camp.
Logged
IsmiLiora
Chronic Exaggerator
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: One step closer!
Jurisdiction: Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America (GOA)
Posts: 3,434


Back by unpopular demand.


« Reply #45 on: June 09, 2011, 10:36:29 AM »


Our Emmuas retreat was awesome! You would love it, especially the one over here in Pittsburgh.
Oh, and by the way, you ARE Orthodox! So tell me, how many of them were on the walk with you guys? I'm dying to know. We had a few Catholics, but everyone was mostly Protestant or non-denominational.

The worship is also quite Protestant in style -- I couldn't imagine a hardcore Orthodox person getting into it all that much. I don't know. I just feel like there were so many aspects of the retreat that someone with Orthodox beliefs might recoil at. There is a Catholic version, though, and perhaps that one would "fit" better? I'd love to hear your opinions.
Logged

She's touring the facility/and picking up slack.
--
"For in much wisdom is much grief, and he who increases knowledge increases sorrow." Ecclesiastes 1:18
--
I once believed in causes too, I had my pointless point of view --
Life went on no matter who was wrong or right
jah777
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Posts: 1,934


« Reply #46 on: June 09, 2011, 11:58:37 AM »

I went a few weeks ago and I loved it. It is secretive for a very good reason. What I loved about the retreat is that it was for men only! And we dealt with men issues! I understand wholeheartedly why they want to keep personal things personal. Look, you shouldn't be upset about this. Being secretive is not always bad.

And what can be gained from such an experience that cannot be gained from going to Confession in an Orthodox church or Orthodox monastery? 

It is not enough to expose sins, or talk about sins.  Exposed sins must be repented of, confessed before an Orthodox priest, be remedied through the prayer of absolution, through penances, etc.  One needs patristic counsel on how to overcome the sins, how to war against the passions, and this is a matter that non-Orthodox groups know nothing about.  In a controlled environment, people can be handled (manipulated) in such a way as to produce “breakdowns”, or a certain sorrow about one sins, but only in the Church can one find a complete diagnosis for the soul’s sickness, and a complete method for healing/theosis through appropriate ascesis and frequent reception of the Holy Mysteries.  “Prayer” and “worship” on the “Emmaus Walk”, on the other hand, may open a person up to a great many things that can damage the soul and hinder the process of healing/theosis, rather than assisting with this process. 

One website on the Emmaus Walk says:

Quote
The hope of the Emmaus community is that we may come to… a better understanding of the Church of Jesus Christ, which has no denominational boundaries.

http://www.gbgm-umc.org/aswte/content_history.htm

It is good to get to know non-Orthodox Christians, and to better understand what non-Orthodox Christians around us believe.  However, to create some “experience” of a vague and “spiritual” unity that supposedly transcends (and therefore trivializes) dogmatic differences, to bring people together in a controlled environment and use methods to “break down defenses” in order to increase this feeling of “unity”, is absolutely antithetical to Christianity.  Such “experiences” and methodologies are not of Christ, but rather they will characterize the future religion of the Antichrist.  The myth of the spiritual unity of all religions and of all mankind begins with the myth of the spiritual unity of all Christian heresies (“denominations”). 
Logged
jnorm888
Jnorm
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: Eastern Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Antiochian
Posts: 2,516


Icon and Cross (international space station)


WWW
« Reply #47 on: June 09, 2011, 06:17:53 PM »


Our Emmuas retreat was awesome! You would love it, especially the one over here in Pittsburgh.
Oh, and by the way, you ARE Orthodox! So tell me, how many of them were on the walk with you guys? I'm dying to know. We had a few Catholics, but everyone was mostly Protestant or non-denominational.

The worship is also quite Protestant in style -- I couldn't imagine a hardcore Orthodox person getting into it all that much. I don't know. I just feel like there were so many aspects of the retreat that someone with Orthodox beliefs might recoil at. There is a Catholic version, though, and perhaps that one would "fit" better? I'd love to hear your opinions.

I was invited to the Roman Catholic one by an Orthodox friend at my parish. They were for the most part charismatic Roman Catholics, and yes, the style is mostly charismatic protestant. The whole charismatic thing is something I'm use to and so it never bothered me. I think I grew out of it now that I'm Orthodox, but I wasn't bothered by it.
http://youtu.be/Pl3eqptVGnM (St. Paul retreat center)

The Emmuas in Pittsburgh is mostly Roman Catholic.
« Last Edit: June 09, 2011, 06:20:15 PM by jnorm888 » Logged

"loving one's enemies does not mean loving wickedness, ungodliness, adultery, or theft. Rather, it means loving the theif, the ungodly, and the adulterer." Clement of Alexandria 195 A.D.

http://ancientchristiandefender.blogspot.com/
rakovsky
Protokentarchos
*********
Online Online

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Orthodox Church in America
Posts: 4,558



WWW
« Reply #48 on: June 09, 2011, 06:33:52 PM »


Our Emmuas retreat was awesome! You would love it, especially the one over here in Pittsburgh.
Oh, and by the way, you ARE Orthodox! So tell me, how many of them were on the walk with you guys? I'm dying to know. We had a few Catholics, but everyone was mostly Protestant or non-denominational.

The worship is also quite Protestant in style -- I couldn't imagine a hardcore Orthodox person getting into it all that much. I don't know. I just feel like there were so many aspects of the retreat that someone with Orthodox beliefs might recoil at. There is a Catholic version, though, and perhaps that one would "fit" better? I'd love to hear your opinions.

I was invited to the Roman Catholic one by an Orthodox friend at my parish. They were for the most part charismatic Roman Catholics, and yes, the style is mostly charismatic protestant. The whole charismatic thing is something I'm use to and so it never bothered me. I think I grew out of it now that I'm Orthodox, but I wasn't bothered by it.
http://youtu.be/Pl3eqptVGnM (St. Paul retreat center)

The Emmuas in Pittsburgh is mostly Roman Catholic.

So it's like a spillover of the Evan Charismatic movement into R. Catholicism. This explains why a primarily Evan oriented program would have some followers from the RCs. Pittsburgh is a strongly RC place. So this is another explanation for why the Emmaus walk group might be there even if normally it is Evan.

 I heard that in the Middle Ages some Orthodox ate the paint chips from holy icons. Bad decision I think. So one cannot point fingers.

And I haven't been on the Emmaus Walk group, it just sounds like some kind of religious boot camp.
I think retreats are good and am glad if Orthodox and others do them. But I think the boot camp stuff is unnecessary. And if there are feelings of consternation at having people yell at you when you dress or something that may take away from the positive religious experience.
« Last Edit: June 09, 2011, 06:36:03 PM by rakovsky » Logged
jnorm888
Jnorm
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: Eastern Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Antiochian
Posts: 2,516


Icon and Cross (international space station)


WWW
« Reply #49 on: June 09, 2011, 06:53:06 PM »

I went a few weeks ago and I loved it. It is secretive for a very good reason. What I loved about the retreat is that it was for men only! And we dealt with men issues! I understand wholeheartedly why they want to keep personal things personal. Look, you shouldn't be upset about this. Being secretive is not always bad.

And what can be gained from such an experience that cannot be gained from going to Confession in an Orthodox church or Orthodox monastery? 

It is not enough to expose sins, or talk about sins.  Exposed sins must be repented of, confessed before an Orthodox priest, be remedied through the prayer of absolution, through penances, etc.  One needs patristic counsel on how to overcome the sins, how to war against the passions, and this is a matter that non-Orthodox groups know nothing about.  In a controlled environment, people can be handled (manipulated) in such a way as to produce “breakdowns”, or a certain sorrow about one sins, but only in the Church can one find a complete diagnosis for the soul’s sickness, and a complete method for healing/theosis through appropriate ascesis and frequent reception of the Holy Mysteries.  “Prayer” and “worship” on the “Emmaus Walk”, on the other hand, may open a person up to a great many things that can damage the soul and hinder the process of healing/theosis, rather than assisting with this process. 

One website on the Emmaus Walk says:

Quote
The hope of the Emmaus community is that we may come to… a better understanding of the Church of Jesus Christ, which has no denominational boundaries.

http://www.gbgm-umc.org/aswte/content_history.htm

It is good to get to know non-Orthodox Christians, and to better understand what non-Orthodox Christians around us believe.  However, to create some “experience” of a vague and “spiritual” unity that supposedly transcends (and therefore trivializes) dogmatic differences, to bring people together in a controlled environment and use methods to “break down defenses” in order to increase this feeling of “unity”, is absolutely antithetical to Christianity.  Such “experiences” and methodologies are not of Christ, but rather they will characterize the future religion of the Antichrist.  The myth of the spiritual unity of all religions and of all mankind begins with the myth of the spiritual unity of all Christian heresies (“denominations”).

You don't even know why we went. We went for a reason. Most of the Emmuas Roman Catholics at the retreat were also part of the Pittsburgh Catholics men's fellowship ministry. Which is pretty powerful in this city.

There are people in Pittsburgh that would like to create a city wide Pan-Orthodox men's fellowship as well. The only problem is no one has an experience on how that works or would work, especially within an Orthodox context. In order to have a radio program, first you have to have experience with radio programs, in order to have a tv program, well, first you have to have experience with television programs. In order to have a campus ministry, well, first you have to have experience in campus ministry. The same is true with this. In order to have a Men's fellowship thingy, well, first you have to have experience in men fellowships. What are they like? What do they do? What are they for? Is there really a need for one? What would it look like if we had one?

Like I said, you don't know why we went. There are worse things for you to worry about than this. I for one don't like to see Orthodox Christians as Masons and Eastern Stars, But they exist, especially over here. And I met Roman Catholics who also don't like to see Roman Catholics as Masons and Eastern Stars, but they exist in Pittsburgh, and so you are worried about something that is mostly harmless. The Roman Catholic version had priests at the retreat and they had confession. They also had Roman Catholic monks there. The place where we were at was a monastery. And so most of what you said was already covered within their system.

A Pan-Orthodox men's fellowship would look different, especially in the area of music. We would probably chant, but most of the elements we saw at the Roman Catholic retreat would be the same.

I actually liked it.
Logged

"loving one's enemies does not mean loving wickedness, ungodliness, adultery, or theft. Rather, it means loving the theif, the ungodly, and the adulterer." Clement of Alexandria 195 A.D.

http://ancientchristiandefender.blogspot.com/
rakovsky
Protokentarchos
*********
Online Online

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Orthodox Church in America
Posts: 4,558



WWW
« Reply #50 on: June 09, 2011, 09:34:38 PM »

Jnorm,

Well then I am curious how much Ismi's experience reflected yours. Perhaps hers was simply different because she was with an unusual group?
I could see a summer camp run by two different groups turning out very differently.

Maybe I am criticizing too much, but I actually like some women to be in a group. I am not say it's bad if they aren't, just that their personalities can be fun too.

Anyway, i am glad you had a good time.

Peace, Jnorm.
Logged
mabsoota
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: Coptic
Posts: 2,570


Kyrie eleison


« Reply #51 on: June 10, 2011, 06:34:31 AM »

wow, sounds really dodgy to me.
i worry yr room mate actually went a bit mad and that's why she liked it afterwards.
like people being kidnapped falling in love with their kidnappers because they get a bit screwed up.
u always have to be careful about who you give control to, that's why proverbs 4:23 says 'guard your heart, it is the wellspring of life'.

jnorm888, looks like u were with less screwed up people. if u take a dodgy concept and some nice people try to apply it, it won't be quite as disastrous.

dcommini, i like yr posts, i think you should think twice before having therapy, you come across as fine to me.
most psychotherapy and counseling in developing countries is based on the theories crazy guys like freud and jung and is quite anti-Christian in it's foundation.
i had some (protestant) Christian counseling as a teenager, and it definitely made me worse. the things that helped me deal with various psychological issues the best were confession and prayer with my confession father and also talking about things with friends and other Christians who were able to help me look outside myself.
if you have big problems, then see a qualified family doctor or psychiatrist, like if you need medication. otherwise a normal prayer life and Bible study and praying with Christian friends should help you progress in life.

it seems to me most counselors offer people quick fixes that feed people's desire for emotional highs, but do no good (or even harm) in the long term. on the other hand, the normal Christian life offers a gradual and constant surrender of your will to God and helps you to pass through all kinds of life's trials and still grow spiritually.
Logged
IsmiLiora
Chronic Exaggerator
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: One step closer!
Jurisdiction: Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America (GOA)
Posts: 3,434


Back by unpopular demand.


« Reply #52 on: June 10, 2011, 01:13:43 PM »

wow, sounds really dodgy to me.
i worry yr room mate actually went a bit mad and that's why she liked it afterwards.
like people being kidnapped falling in love with their kidnappers because they get a bit screwed up.
u always have to be careful about who you give control to, that's why proverbs 4:23 says 'guard your heart, it is the wellspring of life'.

Hm, that's an interesting point. I don't really know if there was anything psychologically going on with her, but I love the use of the verse you quoted. I went into the weekend NOT knowing anything about the ministers and leaders who were there. Not to say that I should write them off completely, but I basically had to trust that this collection of people were making the right choices for me and my situation.

I would feel comfortable going to a retreat that was just through my church or through a "sister church" or something like that. But that's just me.

Like I said, the "bombardment of love" was a little off-putting. Here's another detail of my walk that I felt conflicted about for a very long time:

On the second day, they gave us this bag filled with "gifts." There were gifts everywhere: on our beds, night tables, and on our tables. These presents were supposed to make us feel special and loved. They have a LOT of volunteers, and a lot of them either typed out a verse on a piece of paper and attached a piece of candy to it. Some of them were flimsy plastic toys, stuff that's intended for 5 or 6 year olds.

The thing is, it wasn't really personal at all, since they just gave the same gifts to everyone. So, while I definitely appreciated the gesture at the time, it felt kind of weird as I reflected on it later. It's like "Here, we love you, here's a bag full of THINGS." Of course the Bible verse bookmarks and such were a nice touch, but it was just too much to take in and really appreciate. I became confused.

And plus, while I also appreciate the sentiment, I also don't like waste (environmentalist rant coming up). WHY would they give silly googly eye puppets to older women? Some of those flimsy plastic things, I could see absolutely no use for. It was like "Hmm, what kind of gift can I give that won't be the same as the others?" And I had hundreds of pieces of paper to recycle from that weekend and sadly, a lot of things to throw out.

While we were going through the bags, one of the women actually stopped by my table and said to me, "Don't you feel loved?" (In a kindly way!) I was thinking, was this really supposed to make me feel loved? Like I said, a very nice gesture, but something felt off to me.

I hope this doesn't come off the wrong way. I don't NEED personalized gifts or expensive things. I didn't want those things. But I felt like I was supposed to feel loved from receiving the gifts. And yet, they felt completely impersonal.

There were some very good touches to the weekend, such as your sponsor asking your family and such to write letters to you, which they presented you with on the last day. Heh, my parents weren't even bothered to write full letters, so that was kind of depressing. But it was nice to read letters from my friends. That, the Candlelight (which was mainly because my husband was there), the night where we couldn't talk, and private prayer time were my favorite parts of the Walk.
Logged

She's touring the facility/and picking up slack.
--
"For in much wisdom is much grief, and he who increases knowledge increases sorrow." Ecclesiastes 1:18
--
I once believed in causes too, I had my pointless point of view --
Life went on no matter who was wrong or right
mabsoota
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: Coptic
Posts: 2,570


Kyrie eleison


« Reply #53 on: June 10, 2011, 10:55:44 PM »

well, everything you describe sounds dodgy!
if someone makes you feel bad for not feeling how you are 'supposed to', this is the opposite of loving you!
God's love is about Him loving us as we are, with our sins and insecurities and failures and responding to us in a personal way. that means a way that is different for each person!
sounds like someone got a self-help book written by a 10 year old on 'how the world should be' and then just did all the recommendations of the book without checking if they would actually help someone.

my worst every counselling session (i was 16 or 17) consisted of these family friends asking me repeatedly over about half an hour (seriously) 'who am i?' and then telling me none of my answers were good enough and concluding i had a serious identity problem  Roll Eyes

they did not have any practical suggestions for how i could fix my problem, the focus was on diagnosis only! sounds like the people at your retreat were studying the same book on 'how to treat other humans'.

i eventually sorted my 'identity problem' by leaving the shallow self-help, self-centred culture of that church and learning more about God. once i had understood God's identity a lot better, mine was not such a big deal any more. learning about and experiencing the depth of the relationship with God that is possible through Holy Communion and focusing on God and less on people made me much calmer and more confident. this kind of work on your character takes time, but it lasts. loads of people who knew me for a long time say i am calmer and happier.
the good news, ismiliora is that you are in the right church, and it will get better and better   Cheesy
Logged
vasily
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Orthodox church in america
Posts: 189



« Reply #54 on: June 11, 2011, 11:07:39 AM »

Per their website  they  are connected to the United Methodist Church. Their mission is to strengthen and renew Christian people as disciples of Jesus Christ. The walk is ecumenical.
This is quite radically different from Orthodoxy. Reading the Scriptures, the Church Fathers, the lives of the Saints, etc. would be more productive. Attending the Orthodox services, specifically the Liturgy, is the way to strengthen one's Christian Faith, and to become closer to God.
Logged
jnorm888
Jnorm
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: Eastern Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Antiochian
Posts: 2,516


Icon and Cross (international space station)


WWW
« Reply #55 on: August 07, 2011, 08:13:27 PM »

We did it!


The first Orthodox version was just done!  Grin
Logged

"loving one's enemies does not mean loving wickedness, ungodliness, adultery, or theft. Rather, it means loving the theif, the ungodly, and the adulterer." Clement of Alexandria 195 A.D.

http://ancientchristiandefender.blogspot.com/
IsmiLiora
Chronic Exaggerator
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: One step closer!
Jurisdiction: Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America (GOA)
Posts: 3,434


Back by unpopular demand.


« Reply #56 on: August 07, 2011, 08:15:47 PM »

We did it!


The first Orthodox version was just done!  Grin
Wait, what? I want to hear more, please.
Logged

She's touring the facility/and picking up slack.
--
"For in much wisdom is much grief, and he who increases knowledge increases sorrow." Ecclesiastes 1:18
--
I once believed in causes too, I had my pointless point of view --
Life went on no matter who was wrong or right
jnorm888
Jnorm
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: Eastern Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Antiochian
Posts: 2,516


Icon and Cross (international space station)


WWW
« Reply #57 on: August 07, 2011, 08:31:16 PM »

We did it!


The first Orthodox version was just done!  Grin
Wait, what? I want to hear more, please.

Ours was based on the feast of the Transfiguration.

I posted half of the registration form on my blog.
http://ancientchristiandefender.blogspot.com/2011/07/mens-retreat-weekend-at-antiochian.html (Men’s Retreat Weekend at the Antiochian Village)


We had one non-Orthodox Christian attend and he wasn't use to the length of our liturgy. He also wasn't use to standing up the whole time. I kinda felt sorry for him. The chapel we were at didn't have any pews. Other than that he enjoyed it!


We had two or 3 services on Friday, 2 or 3 on Saturday, and one on Sunday.

Instead of singing modern secular charismatic protestant songs (and some modern charismatic Roman Catholic songs) that the other Emmauses are known for, we decided to stick with Orthodox hymns and chants. Like The Cherubic Hymn, The Transfiguration of our Lord Troparion (A) and others. It took months of us praying, fasting, arguing, and talking about how we were going to make it fit an Orthodox ethos. We gave our plans to various priests and other people and they gave their input back and so it was a going back and forth of how to do it right.

But it was done, and I am mostly happy with the results. We might have to tweak something here and there, but most of it seemed to be right where it needs to be.

« Last Edit: August 07, 2011, 08:37:28 PM by jnorm888 » Logged

"loving one's enemies does not mean loving wickedness, ungodliness, adultery, or theft. Rather, it means loving the theif, the ungodly, and the adulterer." Clement of Alexandria 195 A.D.

http://ancientchristiandefender.blogspot.com/
mabsoota
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: Coptic
Posts: 2,570


Kyrie eleison


« Reply #58 on: August 07, 2011, 10:54:48 PM »

maybe u should give it another name?
sounds like u made some chicken curry without chilli but with cumin, without chicken but with beans, without onions but with tomato, and what you got was egyptian beans, not chicken curry at all!

PS. sorry for use of word 'chicken' during the fast...
Logged
Tags:
Pages: 1 2 All   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.18 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
Page created in 0.21 seconds with 85 queries.