Are Atheists really Satanists / Luciferians?

[yeshuaisiam]

You've missed the conversation my friend, try again.

We aren't talking just about Laveyan Satanism. Mystic's and Magicians outside the boundaries of Christendom have been accused of Devil-Worship and "Satanism" since at least the 1800's.

Ok, now I understand. So, we are not talking only about laveyan satanism, but theistic satanism, gnosticism, palladism and so forth. I'm sure though, that both of us will agree we should stick to the official definitions, in other case we'll get all tangled up. So we can't speak in loose term "satanism", because it's like merging Jehova's Witnesses with Roman Catholics and saying they're "Christians". The former believe in God, the latter believe in defiance, but that's where similarities often end.

I'm talking about all of it.  Anton Lavey said "the purest form of Satanism is true Atheism".   Gnostics believe in becoming exalted into Gods... Either way its about putting your will before God's.

[Pan Michał]

I'm talking about all of it.  Anton Lavey said "the purest form of Satanism is true Atheism".   Gnostics believe in becoming exalted into Gods... Either way its about putting your will before God's.

I know what's on your mind, but what do Christians believe in?

[Babalon]

You've missed the conversation my friend, try again.

We aren't talking just about Laveyan Satanism. Mystic's and Magicians outside the boundaries of Christendom have been accused of Devil-Worship and "Satanism" since at least the 1800's.

Ok, now I understand. So, we are not talking only about laveyan satanism, but theistic satanism, gnosticism, palladism and so forth. I'm sure though, that both of us will agree we should stick to the official definitions, in other case we'll get all tangled up. So we can't speak in loose term "satanism", because it's like merging Jehova's Witnesses with Roman Catholics and saying they're "Christians". The former believe in God, the latter believe in defiance, but that's where similarities often end.

I'm talking about all of it.  Anton Lavey said "the purest form of Satanism is true Atheism".   Gnostics believe in becoming exalted into Gods... Either way its about putting your will before God's.

Unless of course you contend that your will is analogous to God's. That "will" not being every petty desire that comes across your mind, but the perfected mechanism buried deep within Man- which acts in accordance with the "universal" schema and does ONLY what is needed and nothing else. That's something totally different though.

Anton LaVey, or as his father called him, Howard Levey- was quite the showman. He was like an L. Ron Hubbard, but far less malicious in my opinion. His doctrine was silly and he HAD to have known that. He was once quoted as saying:

"My religion is just Ayn Rand's philosophy with ceremony and ritual added."

Plus, he took some of the Enochian Magic work that John Dee "developed" (and much later, Crowley and The Hermetic Order of The Golden Dawn) and simply replaced the names of God with Satan. I've met a couple of Satanist's, they're not all that interesting (or bright, for that matter) in my experience. While i have nothing against these individuals myself, their philosophy has an unhealthy habit raising the Ego to the God level. The identification of the Self with the body and it's passions alone are hardly a good way to live. If you're looking for any sort of improvement anyway.... Oh well.

[Babalon]

Either way. Whether or not Satanism=Atheism, based on the definitions alone, Atheism does not = Satanism.

This seems simple enough, right?

[Achronos]

Babalon what is your jurisdiction?

[Babalon]

Babalon what is your jurisdiction?

I'm not a Christian.

[Kerdy]

Babalon what is your jurisdiction?

I'm not a Christian.

Now I understand your confusion.

[Babalon]

Babalon what is your jurisdiction?

I'm not a Christian.

Now I understand your confusion.

And what exactly am i confused about?

[Kerdy]

Babalon what is your jurisdiction?

I'm not a Christian.

Now I understand your confusion.

And what exactly am i confused about?

A great many things, but the point is, without the most basic understanding of what is going on, it is easy to become confused.

[Babalon]

Babalon what is your jurisdiction?

I'm not a Christian.

Now I understand your confusion.

And what exactly am i confused about?

A great many things, but the point is, without the most basic understanding of what is going on, it is easy to become confused.

Your arrogance is impressive.

I'm quite comfortable with being wrong on certain issues, i like to learn- but If you're going to make a statement like that and refuse to explain it, it's better that you just keep silent from now on.

[Achronos]

I know that, but what is this:

A.'.A.'.

[Babalon]

I know that, but what is this:

A.'.A.'.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A.%27.A.%27.
http://outercol.org/

[Asteriktos]

I know that, but what is this:

A.'.A.'.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A.%27.A.%27.
http://outercol.org/

Far out 

[Babalon]

 

[Kerdy]

Babalon what is your jurisdiction?

I'm not a Christian.

Now I understand your confusion.

And what exactly am i confused about?

A great many things, but the point is, without the most basic understanding of what is going on, it is easy to become confused.

Your arrogance is impressive.

I'm quite comfortable with being wrong on certain issues, i like to learn- but If you're going to make a statement like that and refuse to explain it, it's better that you just keep silent from now on.

Perhaps, but easily surpassed by your own.  I did explain.  Read the entire thread again if you must.  You seem unclear on several key issues, none of which you grasp the fullness of, thus the confusion.  You aren't alone and its in no way a personal jab.  I simply have a better understanding of where you are coming from.  Be defensive if you wish.  It's of no consequence to me.

[Kerdy]

I know that, but what is this:

A.'.A.'.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A.%27.A.%27.
http://outercol.org/

And this clarifies your elusive inquiry about magic.  Yes, I am beginning to understand a great deal now.

[Babalon]

Babalon what is your jurisdiction?

I'm not a Christian.

Now I understand your confusion.

And what exactly am i confused about?

A great many things, but the point is, without the most basic understanding of what is going on, it is easy to become confused.

Your arrogance is impressive.

I'm quite comfortable with being wrong on certain issues, i like to learn- but If you're going to make a statement like that and refuse to explain it, it's better that you just keep silent from now on.

Perhaps, but easily surpassed by your own.  I did explain.  Read the entire thread again if you must.  You seem unclear on several key issues, none of which you grasp the fullness of, thus the confusion.  You aren't alone and its in no way a personal jab.  I simply have a better understanding of where you are coming from.  Be defensive if you wish.  It's of no consequence to me.

Which one's? My particular interpretation of the word "heretic"?

I would never be so bold as to assume that i have a "better understanding of where you are coming from", than say, you.

Explain. I'm not attacking you, im just (at last!) confused.

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