OrthodoxChristianity.net
October 20, 2014, 07:30:57 AM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
News: Reminder: No political discussions in the public fora.  If you do not have access to the private Politics Forum, please send a PM to Fr. George.
 
   Home   Help Calendar Contact Treasury Tags Login Register  
Pages: « 1 2  All   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: The Antirrhetikos is freaking me out  (Read 3795 times) Average Rating: 0
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
Salpy
Moderator
Toumarches
*****
Offline Offline

Faith: Oriental Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: Armenian Church
Posts: 12,722


Pray for the Christians of Iraq and Syria.


« Reply #45 on: June 09, 2011, 07:13:48 PM »

I finished the chapter on Listlessness (Acedia) and there is something I have a question about.  It was a verse that caught my eye because someone just started another thread asking about uncreated light.

I'm too lazy to type it from my Nook, so I will just copy and paste from the version that is on the website I linked earlier:

http://www.ldysinger.com/evagrius/07_Antirrhet/00a_start.htm

Quote
6.16. For the mind that does not believe that the [tempting-] thoughts of acedia remaining in him can disturb his state and at the time of prayer darken the holy light in his eyes.

   It was about this very light that we, I and the servant of God Ammonius, wished to know whence it comes: and so we asked the holy John of the Thebaid whether the nature of the intellect is [itself] luminous and thus of itself gives off this light, or whether some other [light] from without shines upon and illuminates it.

   He answered: “Human beings are not in a position to judge this; and the nous  also cannot be illuminated while praying without the grace of God, once it is freed from the numerous and fearful enemies trying hard to destroy it.”


+ Ps 37:11  My heart is troubled, my strength has failed me, and the light of my eyes is not with me


Would this be what is referred to as "uncreated light?"  What is he talking about?

Logged

mabsoota
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: Coptic
Posts: 2,567


Kyrie eleison


« Reply #46 on: June 10, 2011, 05:30:44 AM »

maybe if you typed it out yourself, you would have less listlessness and you would be enlightened with the uncreated light.
 Wink
(and pray for me too, a sinner)
Logged
Salpy
Moderator
Toumarches
*****
Offline Offline

Faith: Oriental Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: Armenian Church
Posts: 12,722


Pray for the Christians of Iraq and Syria.


« Reply #47 on: June 10, 2011, 11:17:18 AM »

maybe if you typed it out yourself, you would have less listlessness and you would be enlightened with the uncreated light.
 Wink
(and pray for me too, a sinner)

That's a good one!
 Cheesy

And yeah, I'm finding all kinds of sins in that book that I do all the time.  I guess we are fortunate that we have a merciful God.   Smiley
Logged

EkhristosAnesti
'I will say of the Lord, "He is my refuge and my fortress; My God, in Him I will trust."' - Psalm 91:2
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: Oriental Orthodox
Posts: 2,743


Pope St Kyrillos VI


« Reply #48 on: June 10, 2011, 11:02:46 PM »

Hi Salpy,

I'm not sure it's a good idea to be reading texts that were written by monks for monks, at least for the purpose of personal application in the pursuit of spiritual development.

I know that this text seems a mere neat and handy compilation and arrangement of Scriptural texts, but even when it comes to the Scriptures, there are many layers of meaning--not only of general narratives and incidents, but even at times of a single word--and some verses simply do not apply to laity in the same way that they would for monks. The example in the OP is an obvious case in point.

This is a matter that probably ought to be raised and discussed with your spiritual instructor in my opinion.

I hope I have not offended you in any way. I intend the above in a friendly tone of gentle caution.
« Last Edit: June 10, 2011, 11:16:55 PM by EkhristosAnesti » Logged

No longer an active member of this forum. Sincerest apologies to anyone who has taken offence to anything posted in youthful ignorance or negligence prior to my leaving this forum - October, 2012.

"Philosophy is the imitation by a man of what is better, according to what is possible" - St Severus
Salpy
Moderator
Toumarches
*****
Offline Offline

Faith: Oriental Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: Armenian Church
Posts: 12,722


Pray for the Christians of Iraq and Syria.


« Reply #49 on: June 10, 2011, 11:24:22 PM »

Hi Salpy,

I'm not sure it's a good idea to be reading texts that were written by monks for monks, at least for the purpose of personal application in the pursuit of spiritual development.

I know that this text seems a mere neat and handy compilation and arrangement of Scriptural texts, but even when it comes to the Scriptures, there are many layers of meaning--not only of general narratives and incidents, but even at times of a single word--and some verses simply do not apply to laity in the same way that they would for monks. The example in the OP is an obvious case in point.

This is a matter that probably ought to be raised and discussed with your spiritual instructor in my opinion.

I hope I have not offended you in any way. I intend the above in a friendly tone of gentle caution.

Not to worry.  I won't be applying too much of this to my personal spiritual development.   Smiley  It's a wonder that the Desert Fathers were able to live such intense lives.

I'm on the chapter on Vainglory now.  That actually has a lot in it which can apply to laity as well as monks.  Vainglory is something every Christian struggles with and it is something we really should not tolerate at all in ourselves.

Most of the other material, though, is way above where I am and where I ever probably will be.
« Last Edit: June 10, 2011, 11:59:21 PM by Salpy » Logged

Jetavan
Argumentum ad australopithecum
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Faith: Science to the Fourth Power
Jurisdiction: Ohayo Gozaimasu
Posts: 6,580


Barlaam and Josaphat


WWW
« Reply #50 on: September 23, 2012, 03:12:31 AM »

I just had an e-mail exchange with someone who has studied St. Evagrius extensively, and he says he is not commemorated by the Georgians.

I so wish I had access to a Georgian calendar.

"The Nestorian and Armenian Churches commemorate Evagrios as a saint (11 February)."

Source: "Commentary on the Philokalia: The Condemnation Of Evagrios Ponticos"
« Last Edit: September 23, 2012, 03:12:58 AM by Jetavan » Logged

If you will, you can become all flame.
Extra caritatem nulla salus.
In order to become whole, take the "I" out of "holiness".
सर्वभूतहित
Ἄνω σχῶμεν τὰς καρδίας
"Those who say religion has nothing to do with politics do not know what religion is." -- Mohandas Gandhi
Y dduw bo'r diolch.
Salpy
Moderator
Toumarches
*****
Offline Offline

Faith: Oriental Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: Armenian Church
Posts: 12,722


Pray for the Christians of Iraq and Syria.


« Reply #51 on: September 23, 2012, 06:10:37 PM »

The February date is probably for the Church of the East.  In the Armenian Church, he is celebrated in early December.
Logged

Tags: Evagrius Oriental Orthodox Fathers logismoi Georgian Church Desert Fathers Uncreated Light 
Pages: « 1 2  All   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.18 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
Page created in 0.065 seconds with 35 queries.