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Author Topic: The Beloved Apostle and Lady Gaga's "Judas"  (Read 6596 times) Average Rating: 0
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« Reply #45 on: May 21, 2011, 01:10:29 AM »

Quote from: deusveritasest
Whorish, yes. But I've seen nothing that appears to be legitimate blasphemy from Gaga. If anything what some people think is blasphemy is actually her expressing and confessing her own wickedness along with her desire to be holy, which is not blasphemous.

Interesting point.   Smiley Good one.
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« Reply #46 on: May 21, 2011, 03:05:35 AM »

If she is such a strong Orthodox Christian, I'm waiting for her to show it. Thus far I've seen a whorish entertainer who is trying to top Madonna in blasphemy.

Whorish, yes. But I've seen nothing that appears to be legitimate blasphemy from Gaga. If anything what some people think is blasphemy is actually her expressing and confessing her own wickedness along with her desire to be holy, which is not blasphemous.

Maybe so, but she doesn't need to deal with her confusion in front of everyone, vomiting it into the public arena. (And making more than a few pretty pennies off it to boot.)

But I think mostly she is leeching off controversy. Thats why she dresses like a weirdo and acts how she does. A product of our Youtube world. It's the same as all the other freaks who come down the pike. It's been done. It's old. But every time they push it a little further and sometime we have to say stop. I don't want to see Sexy St Mary Magdalene or Ripped Biker Jesus. Enough is enough.

When we have our Coptic brothers dying for wearing crosses and whatnot, and just confessing Christ at all, to portray our Lord and God this way is unacceptable, period. I don't care what issues Gaga has. She has issues, but she need not air them at our expense.

(I'd like to see her or one of the others try this with Mohammad, if they're so cutting edge. The only cutting edge there would be a machete, but we don't do that, thank God. But have some respect, please. Is threatening people with death the only way to get respect anymore? Is that who we are?)
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« Reply #47 on: May 21, 2011, 03:47:48 AM »

2. I think of bigotry as prejudice. It's not bigotry to speak out against people's actions. Nor should we tolerate defamation and blasphemy against Christ and His Saints, sexualizing and trivializing them, which I would say this is:



Contextualizing religious symbols is not necessarily trivializing of them. If anything, the most apparent reality is that she has a deep respect for Jesus.
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« Reply #48 on: May 21, 2011, 03:47:48 AM »

Satan-looking? If she wanted to be Satan-looking she would look like a beautiful angel, not a trashy attention-whore.

LOL
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« Reply #49 on: May 21, 2011, 03:47:48 AM »

and 9/11 was an inside-job...

It's possible.  Wink
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« Reply #50 on: May 21, 2011, 03:47:48 AM »

So you mean to tell me that all of these bands (including Lady Gaga) are just kidding when they mock Christ?

Once again: where did she mock Christ?
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« Reply #51 on: May 21, 2011, 03:47:48 AM »

She did the same thing with her song "Born That Way."  God does love everyone.  But we are called by Christ to seek the kingdom of heaven, not just be complacent with are current circumstances.

Huh. The song is called "Born This Way", and that's not at all the impression of the song that I get. If you're honing in on a certain issue (the GLBT community  Roll Eyes) then perhaps, but otherwise the song is not at all about complacency.
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« Reply #52 on: May 21, 2011, 03:47:48 AM »

Maybe so, but she doesn't need to deal with her confusion in front of everyone, vomiting it into the public arena.

It's not just about her. Her "fandom" is full of those who have these sorts of struggles and have been ostracized by uncharitable traditionalists. This is an evident theme of much of her music overall.

Thats why she dresses like a weirdo and acts how she does.

She dresses like a weirdo because she is a weirdo.

When we have our Coptic brothers dying for wearing crosses and whatnot, and just confessing Christ at all, to portray our Lord and God this way is unacceptable, period.

I fail to see the connection between the two.

And what is this issue you have with translating symbols to a modern culture? I'm suspicious that you would be offended by Christ Himself if he had been born in this generation.

(I'd like to see her or one of the others try this with Mohammad, if they're so cutting edge. The only cutting edge there would be a machete, but we don't do that, thank God. But have some respect, please. Is threatening people with death the only way to get respect anymore? Is that who we are?)

I haven't seen her express an interest in Muhammad as she has with Jesus, so why should she? Again, missing the point of her using Jesus.
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« Reply #53 on: May 21, 2011, 05:32:47 AM »

 
2. I think of bigotry as prejudice. It's not bigotry to speak out against people's actions. Nor should we tolerate defamation and blasphemy against Christ and His Saints, sexualizing and trivializing them, which I would say this is:



I thought this was supposed to also be an impersonation of Madonna and her old boyfriend - Jesus:



She wasn't confused... she did this on purpose. Sexualized imagery and full nudity mixed w/ Christian symbols and figures... is a mockery of Christianity and the teachings of the Church which adjure us to eschew sexual immorality and the lusts of the flesh.




If anything, the most apparent reality is that she has a deep respect for Jesus.

COUGH! What? If she had a "deep respect for Jesus" then why would she do this? She does it for the 'shock factor' which = $.


Once again: where did she mock Christ?

"In the video, Gaga plays a modern-day Mary Magdalene, riding in with motorcycle gang Jesus and his apostles. Sleekly sexualized, it places her, among other things, writing in a bath with both Jesus and Judas, who share intimate moments, as well.

Before the video was even released, the Catholic League struck out at Gaga — who grew up and is still a practicing Catholic — for what they deemed as inappropriate and offensive.

After the single was released during Holy Week, Catholic League spokesman Bill Donohue slammed Gaga for the song.

“This is a stunt... Lady Gaga tries to continue to shock Catholics and Christians in general: she dresses as a nun... she swallows the rosary. She has now morphed into a caricature of herself,

The video concludes with Gaga as Magdalene being stoned in a white dress.”





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« Reply #54 on: May 21, 2011, 06:45:12 AM »

Very Important Question: For those who are being highly critical, how many of you have actually carefully listened to, read, and analyzed the lyrics to "Judas"?
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« Reply #55 on: May 21, 2011, 09:57:59 AM »

She did the same thing with her song "Born That Way."  God does love everyone.  But we are called by Christ to seek the kingdom of heaven, not just be complacent with are current circumstances.

Huh. The song is called "Born This Way", and that's not at all the impression of the song that I get. If you're honing in on a certain issue (the GLBT community  Roll Eyes) then perhaps, but otherwise the song is not at all about complacency.

Interesting, thanks for the feedback.   No, it was just the general impression that I got from the song and video.   I know she wasn't writing a song about complacency, but in my opinion in the grand scheme of things.  It was really about complacency.  Thanks for the interesting contributions.
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« Reply #56 on: May 21, 2011, 10:01:37 AM »

She did the same thing with her song "Born That Way."  God does love everyone.  But we are called by Christ to seek the kingdom of heaven, not just be complacent with are current circumstances.

Huh. The song is called "Born This Way", and that's not at all the impression of the song that I get. If you're honing in on a certain issue (the GLBT community  Roll Eyes) then perhaps, but otherwise the song is not at all about complacency.

Interesting, thanks for the feedback.   No, it was just the general impression that I got from the song and video.   I know she wasn't writing a song about complacency, but in my opinion in the grand scheme of things.  It was really about complacency.  Thanks for the interesting contributions.

Oh, I forgot one thing,  the Judas song from a musical point of view wasn't very good.  A lot of the tones and melodies are very annoying.  I'm surprised she went in that direction, it was like fingernails scratching a chalkboard at times.
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« Reply #57 on: May 21, 2011, 07:32:53 PM »

She did the same thing with her song "Born That Way."  God does love everyone.  But we are called by Christ to seek the kingdom of heaven, not just be complacent with are current circumstances.

Huh. The song is called "Born This Way", and that's not at all the impression of the song that I get. If you're honing in on a certain issue (the GLBT community  Roll Eyes) then perhaps, but otherwise the song is not at all about complacency.

Interesting, thanks for the feedback.   No, it was just the general impression that I got from the song and video.   I know she wasn't writing a song about complacency, but in my opinion in the grand scheme of things.  It was really about complacency.  Thanks for the interesting contributions.

Oh, I forgot one thing,  the Judas song from a musical point of view wasn't very good.  A lot of the tones and melodies are very annoying.  I'm surprised she went in that direction, it was like fingernails scratching a chalkboard at times.

Uh, since when is music objective? Music is and always will be a subjective thing. I like Limp Bizkit, for instance, but many don't. What is good music to one person is bad to another. Same thing with art. I've seen paintings in museums that look like they were done by four year olds. But, to some people it is beautiful.
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« Reply #58 on: May 21, 2011, 07:38:21 PM »

If anything, the most apparent reality is that she has a deep respect for Jesus.

 Cheesy
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« Reply #59 on: May 21, 2011, 08:30:13 PM »

Very Important Question: For those who are being highly critical, how many of you have actually carefully listened to, read, and analyzed the lyrics to "Judas"?

I've looked at them.

She says she's in love with the betrayer of Jesus; she says she's in love with Judas (the Judean apostle).

She says that Judas is the demon that she clings to.

Maybe you could give us your rundown of the lyrics and tell us what you think they mean? You're hinting around... but I'm not really sure what it is you see that you think we don't.

I don't really have any issue w/ the song musically... at least it's somewhat original.

It's the mixing of sexually charged images with Christian symbols and themes, etc that I don't like...

I fail to see how all of this "shows a deep respect". Respect for Judas maybe...

If she really had a deep respect she would have put some clothes on and toned down the slut act for the duration. How 'bout taking off that Cross while you get your sexy on?

If she wanted to be a real rebel these days, the song's lyrics would read:

Oh-oh-oh-ohoo
I'm in love with Jesus, Jesus

Oh-oh-oh-ohoo
I'm in love with Jesus, Jesus


And she would drop all the sexy stuff (like Judas pouring beer on her protruding arse, etc, etc)...

But - No.

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« Reply #60 on: May 22, 2011, 08:12:01 PM »

She did the same thing with her song "Born That Way."  God does love everyone.  But we are called by Christ to seek the kingdom of heaven, not just be complacent with are current circumstances.

Huh. The song is called "Born This Way", and that's not at all the impression of the song that I get. If you're honing in on a certain issue (the GLBT community  Roll Eyes) then perhaps, but otherwise the song is not at all about complacency.

Interesting, thanks for the feedback.   No, it was just the general impression that I got from the song and video.   I know she wasn't writing a song about complacency, but in my opinion in the grand scheme of things.  It was really about complacency.  Thanks for the interesting contributions.

Oh, I forgot one thing,  the Judas song from a musical point of view wasn't very good.  A lot of the tones and melodies are very annoying.  I'm surprised she went in that direction, it was like fingernails scratching a chalkboard at times.

Uh, since when is music objective? Music is and always will be a subjective thing. I like Limp Bizkit, for instance, but many don't. What is good music to one person is bad to another. Same thing with art. I've seen paintings in museums that look like they were done by four year olds. But, to some people it is beautiful.

Limp Bizkit?Huh   For real, yo?
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« Reply #61 on: May 22, 2011, 08:45:14 PM »

She did the same thing with her song "Born That Way."  God does love everyone.  But we are called by Christ to seek the kingdom of heaven, not just be complacent with are current circumstances.

Huh. The song is called "Born This Way", and that's not at all the impression of the song that I get. If you're honing in on a certain issue (the GLBT community  Roll Eyes) then perhaps, but otherwise the song is not at all about complacency.

Interesting, thanks for the feedback.   No, it was just the general impression that I got from the song and video.   I know she wasn't writing a song about complacency, but in my opinion in the grand scheme of things.  It was really about complacency.  Thanks for the interesting contributions.

Oh, I forgot one thing,  the Judas song from a musical point of view wasn't very good.  A lot of the tones and melodies are very annoying.  I'm surprised she went in that direction, it was like fingernails scratching a chalkboard at times.

Uh, since when is music objective? Music is and always will be a subjective thing. I like Limp Bizkit, for instance, but many don't. What is good music to one person is bad to another. Same thing with art. I've seen paintings in museums that look like they were done by four year olds. But, to some people it is beautiful.

Limp Bizkit?Huh   For real, yo?

I like their older stuff, from Three Dollar Bill to Chocolate Starfish. See, though? I think you are weird for not liking them and you think I'm weird for liking them. This is because music is subjective. We all are attracted to different things. It's what makes us independent of each other.
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« Reply #62 on: May 22, 2011, 09:20:42 PM »

No, Limp Bizkit and nu-metal in general is objectively bad.
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« Reply #63 on: May 22, 2011, 09:37:22 PM »

No, Limp Bizkit and nu-metal in general is objectively bad.

Oh, really? Go tell that to Brian Welch (who became a Christian and now produces nu-metal songs based on Christianity)...
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« Reply #64 on: May 22, 2011, 09:43:30 PM »

No, Limp Bizkit and nu-metal in general is objectively bad.

Oh, really? Go tell that to Brian Welch (who became a Christian and now produces nu-metal songs based on Christianity)...

You can put all the toppings you like on that sundae, but it's still poop-flavoured ice cream.
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« Reply #65 on: May 22, 2011, 09:59:30 PM »

No, Limp Bizkit and nu-metal in general is objectively bad.

Oh, really? Go tell that to Brian Welch (who became a Christian and now produces nu-metal songs based on Christianity)...

You can put all the toppings you like on that sundae, but it's still poop-flavoured ice cream.

Really? From what I've always known and read is that God absolutely loves to take something ungodly and make it His own. For instance: sinful humans. I guess all the "toppings" of grace God gave you and others were merely imputed, so you and all Christians are just as Luther said, piece of dung with snow covering them...
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« Reply #66 on: May 22, 2011, 11:49:25 PM »

No, Limp Bizkit and nu-metal in general is objectively bad.

Oh, really? Go tell that to Brian Welch (who became a Christian and now produces nu-metal songs based on Christianity)...

You can put all the toppings you like on that sundae, but it's still poop-flavoured ice cream.

Really? From what I've always known and read is that God absolutely loves to take something ungodly and make it His own. For instance: sinful humans. I guess all the "toppings" of grace God gave you and others were merely imputed, so you and all Christians are just as Luther said, piece of dung with snow covering them...

May be there should be separate topic for nu-metal?Huh
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« Reply #67 on: May 22, 2011, 11:50:45 PM »

No, Limp Bizkit and nu-metal in general is objectively bad.

Oh, really? Go tell that to Brian Welch (who became a Christian and now produces nu-metal songs based on Christianity)...


Excuse the angry face.  I don't know how that happened.  sorry.
You can put all the toppings you like on that sundae, but it's still poop-flavoured ice cream.

Really? From what I've always known and read is that God absolutely loves to take something ungodly and make it His own. For instance: sinful humans. I guess all the "toppings" of grace God gave you and others were merely imputed, so you and all Christians are just as Luther said, piece of dung with snow covering them...

May be there should be separate topic for nu-metal?Huh
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« Reply #68 on: May 23, 2011, 12:36:44 PM »

No, Limp Bizkit and nu-metal in general is objectively bad.

Oh, really? Go tell that to Brian Welch (who became a Christian and now produces nu-metal songs based on Christianity)...

You can put all the toppings you like on that sundae, but it's still poop-flavoured ice cream.

Really? From what I've always known and read is that God absolutely loves to take something ungodly and make it His own. For instance: sinful humans. I guess all the "toppings" of grace God gave you and others were merely imputed, so you and all Christians are just as Luther said, piece of dung with snow covering them...

Did you really just compare nu-metal to a human being made in the image of God?
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« Reply #69 on: May 23, 2011, 01:04:48 PM »

This thread is an awesome generational culture clash.

Can we have a thread about Old Testament dietary laws and the Book of Revelation as contextualized by the Wu Tang Clan's RZA?
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« Reply #70 on: May 23, 2011, 02:39:06 PM »

When we have our Coptic brothers dying for wearing crosses and whatnot, and just confessing Christ at all, to portray our Lord and God this way is unacceptable, period.

I fail to see the connection between the two.

And what is this issue you have with translating symbols to a modern culture?

People die for the cross, the crown of thorns, and what they represent. She throws them onscreen overtop some sexualized imagery. It is illegitimate and a mockery of them. It glorifies the passions those objects were used to free us from.

Throwing a cross into a music video does not constitute translating symbols to a modern culture. If they want to learn about the cross, then come to a church.

I haven't seen her express an interest in Muhammad as she has with Jesus, so why should she? Again, missing the point of her using Jesus.

I don't care what the point is, frankly. The point of the Gospel is as clear as it can get. It does not need her commentary, nor do we need Lady Gaga acting as a missionary.
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« Reply #71 on: May 23, 2011, 02:41:28 PM »

Very Important Question: For those who are being highly critical, how many of you have actually carefully listened to, read, and analyzed the lyrics to "Judas"?

I've looked at them.

She says she's in love with the betrayer of Jesus; she says she's in love with Judas (the Judean apostle).

She says that Judas is the demon that she clings to.

Maybe you could give us your rundown of the lyrics and tell us what you think they mean? You're hinting around... but I'm not really sure what it is you see that you think we don't.

I don't really have any issue w/ the song musically... at least it's somewhat original.

It's the mixing of sexually charged images with Christian symbols and themes, etc that I don't like...

I fail to see how all of this "shows a deep respect". Respect for Judas maybe...

If she really had a deep respect she would have put some clothes on and toned down the slut act for the duration. How 'bout taking off that Cross while you get your sexy on?

If she wanted to be a real rebel these days, the song's lyrics would read:

Oh-oh-oh-ohoo
I'm in love with Jesus, Jesus

Oh-oh-oh-ohoo
I'm in love with Jesus, Jesus


And she would drop all the sexy stuff (like Judas pouring beer on her protruding arse, etc, etc)...

But - No.

†IC XC†
†NI KA†




Yeah, pretty much sums it up for me.
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« Reply #72 on: May 23, 2011, 02:51:08 PM »

This thread is an awesome generational culture clash.

Limp Bizkit and Korn came out when I was in middle school. I may not always have had the best taste back then, but even I could sense that nu-metal was just beyond the pale.
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Is to doubt a fit reply." - William Blake

Quote from: Byron
Just ignore iconotools delusions. He is the biggest multiculturalist globalist there is due to his unfortunate background.
NicholasMyra
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Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Antiochian/Greek
Posts: 5,768


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« Reply #73 on: May 23, 2011, 03:55:05 PM »

This thread is an awesome generational culture clash.

Limp Bizkit and Korn came out when I was in middle school. I may not always have had the best taste back then, but even I could sense that nu-metal was just beyond the pale.
System of a Down?
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Quote from: Orthonorm
if Christ does and says x. And someone else does and says not x and you are ever in doubt, follow Christ.

"You are philosophical innovators. As for me, I follow the Fathers." -Every heresiarch ever
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