Topic: Successor Hierarch for the ACROD?

[Basil 320]

Does anyone have any information or a basis for speculation as to who will succeed Metropolitan Nicholas, of blessed memory?  A friend who is in ACROD told me there is no obvious candidate of whom he is aware.

[Αριστοκλής]

No information from the several priests with whom I have spoken (and they ARE going to have to make the decision, after all). Speculation is, well, just that -speculation (something I'd rather avoid).

[podkarpatska]

No information from the several priests with whom I have spoken (and they ARE going to have to make the decision, after all). Speculation is, well, just that -speculation (something I'd rather avoid).

Indeed, speculation is just that. I will try to post information on that when it is released by the Chancery Office as I will likely hear of it before it hits the official diocesan website.

[arimethea]

Are there any internal candidates? It would seem to those of us on the outside of ACROD that they would need to go outside to find a candidate.

[ialmisry]

Christos anesti!

Are there any internal candidates? It would seem to those of us on the outside of ACROD that they would need to go outside to find a candidate.

I don't know why. Didn't the OCA just consecrate someone from ACROD as the new bishop of Chicago (Many Years!)

[Basil 320]

Yes, ialmisry, the OCA's new Bishop of Chicago was from ACROD, likewise the OCA's Bishop of New York had been released to the OCA from ACROD.

[admiralnick]

Most likely they'll go to the Ukrainians to get a Bishop like they did with Nicholas (He was in the Ukrainian Church when the See became vacant). The Internal Candidates in ACROD are few and far between and to my knowledge there are few that are under 60.

-Nick

[Basil 320]

Yes, but Metropolitan Nicholas had been in ACROD his entire life, prior to his elevation to the episcopacy and his election to the throne of the UOC of America, a short period of time before  ACROD Bishop John's untimely passing, which caught most everyone by surprise.

[kijabeboy03]

Would the Diocese be open to a non-Ruthenian/Carpatho-Russyn bishop? Does it have any say in the selection process?

[Fr. George]

Would the Diocese be open to a non-Ruthenian/Carpatho-Russyn bishop? Does it have any say in the selection process?

IIRC they have the most important voice in the selection process; they forward their choice to Constantinople for ratification by the Patriarchal Synod.

[kijabeboy03]

Wonderful! I wasn't sure given how things seem to work in the Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America.

[podkarpatska]

Wonderful! I wasn't sure given how things seem to work in the Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America.

It is a common misunderstanding and for some a deliberate misstatement, that the Carpatho-Russian and the two canonical Ukrainian Orthodox jurisdictions in North America are 'in the Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America.' None of us are either structurally or legally part of the Archdiocese. As a matter of general practice we do not commemorate the Archbishop of America. At the present time given our vacant position, he is our Locum Tenens and is being commemorated, however upon the enthronement of a new Bishop,that will no longer be the case.

The three jurisdictions in question, ACROD, the UOCUSA and UOCC, are under the omophor of the ecumenical throne and operate, for lack of a better word (and this is not being used in any canonical reference) autonomously. Bishops are chosen pursuant to the by-laws governing each of these jurisdictions and the choice is forwarded to the Holy Synod of the Ecumenical Patriarch for approval. To my knowledge, limited to ACROD, the Synod has never rejected any of the choices submitted since its founding in 1938.

[Basil 320]

But doesn't ACROD communicate to the Ecumenical Patriarch, technically, through the GO Archbishop of America; isn't its Holy Chrism received from the GO Archbishop of America?  Perhaps due to his personal relationship with Patriarch Bartholomew (and His Holiness' micromanaging style), Metropolitan Nicholas communicated with the Ecumenical Patriarch directly, but I think, although he enjoys "ruling bishop's" authority within ACROD, and the ACROD constitution establishes its relative autonomy (again, not using this term under it's Orthodox ecclesial definition), the ACROD hierarch is an auxiliary bishop to the GO Archbishop of America, just like all the GOAA bishops were between 1930 and 1978.  I'd guess that Bishop John and Metropolitan Orestes communicated with the Ecumenical Throne through Archbishop Iakovos.  Note the title of the sees of their hierarchs, i.e. +Nicholas' was Amissos, (not Johnstown), probably an inactivated see of the Ecumenical Throne.

[ialmisry]

Christos anesti!

But doesn't ACROD communicate to the Ecumenical Patriarch, technically, through the GO Archbishop of America; isn't its Holy Chrism received from the GO Archbishop of America?  Perhaps due to his personal relationship with Patriarch Bartholomew (and His Holiness' micromanaging style), Metropolitan Nicholas communicated with the Ecumenical Patriarch directly, but I think, although he enjoys "ruling bishop's" authority within ACROD, and the ACROD constitution establishes its relative autonomy (again, not using this term under it's Orthodox ecclesial definition), the ACROD hierarch is an auxiliary bishop to the GO Archbishop of America, just like all the GOAA bishops were between 1930 and 1978.  I'd guess that Bishop John and Metropolitan Orestes communicated with the Ecumenical Throne through Archbishop Iakovos.  Note the title of the sees of their hierarchs, i.e. +Nicholas' was Amissos, (not Johnstown), probably an inactivated see of the Ecumenical Throne.

Ah, therein less the rub.  IIRC, Abp. Demetrios is also the exarch for the US (North America?)

[admiralnick]

Wonderful! I wasn't sure given how things seem to work in the Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America.

It is a common misunderstanding and for some a deliberate misstatement, that the Carpatho-Russian and the two canonical Ukrainian Orthodox jurisdictions in North America are 'in the Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America.' None of us are either structurally or legally part of the Archdiocese. As a matter of general practice we do not commemorate the Archbishop of America. At the present time given our vacant position, he is our Locum Tenens and is being commemorated, however upon the enthronement of a new Bishop,that will no longer be the case.

The three jurisdictions in question, ACROD, the UOCUSA and UOCC, are under the omophor of the ecumenical throne and operate, for lack of a better word (and this is not being used in any canonical reference) autonomously. Bishops are chosen pursuant to the by-laws governing each of these jurisdictions and the choice is forwarded to the Holy Synod of the Ecumenical Patriarch for approval. To my knowledge, limited to ACROD, the Synod has never rejected any of the choices submitted since its founding in 1938.

So that's why Metropolitan Nicholas went on so many trips to represent the Ecumenical Patriarch. Got it.....

-Nick

[podkarpatska]

Within the world of Byzantium, there is reality, and there is perceived reality. This is not limited to the vicinity of the Phanar and the Ecumenical Throne but is pervasive across Orthodoxy.

The reality from within ACROD, at least from its founding in 1938 through the recent death of +Metropolitan Nicholas, is that we are a 'self-ruling' entity with no interference from the Phanar in our daily affairs. The only time I can remember the EP and his Exarch stepping in was when the late Bishop John presumed to make chrism during Holy Week. That only happened once and would not happen again.

I suspect that the perceived reality from the point of view of some within the OCA is that ACROD is not really self-ruling. (Certainly that is the argument that the UOC-KP factions advance against the UOC-USA.) On the other hand, the perceived reality from the point of view of the Phanar is to tread carefully lest the 'natives' get restless and attempt to move, probably towards the OCA or be unduly influenced by Moscow. (Certainly the recent enthronements of Bishops Michael and Matthias by the OCA would add 'fuel' to that perception, yet within our reality (that of ACROD) these acts are not viewed that way.)

Yes, Metropolitan Nicholas had a special bond of friendship with His All Holiness and he did act as his emissary on a number of occasions over the years. He had a particular role to play in relations with the Orthodox Church of the Czech and Slovak lands and with the Greek Catholics in Slovakia, Transcarpathia and the United States. So be it and so what - Bishops have various roles to fulfill in their mission to the Church.

I was at the Divine Liturgy in Perth Amboy, New Jersey at the late Metropolitan's home parish where His Eminence, Archbishop Demetrios celebrated the Liturgy in his capacity as locum tenens to commemorate the 40th day. It should be noted that the pastor, Fr. Michael Rosco noted that this marked the first and only time that any of the Greek Archbishops of New York had ever celebrated liturgy in one of our Churches during its entire seventy three years of existence. (Of course, the various  Archbishops have participated in liturgical events such as enthronements, consecrations and funerals over the years, but not as celebrant.)

[kijabeboy03]

I remember seeing Archbishop Demetrios (or possibly Archbishop Spyridon?) referred to as 'Exarch of the Atlantic and Pacific Oceans.' I'm glad this hasn't been turned into an actual jurisdiction over the ACROD, the UOCC, or the UOCUSA (beyond being a locum tenens and/or installing new primates).

[podkarpatska]

I remember seeing Archbishop Demetrios (or possibly Archbishop Spyridon?) referred to as 'Exarch of the Atlantic and Pacific Oceans.' I'm glad this hasn't been turned into an actual jurisdiction over the ACROD, the UOCC, or the UOCUSA (beyond being a locum tenens and/or installing new primates).

I should note that he was very precise in his language regarding the Diocese and the vacancy during his homily so as not to fuel any conspiracy minded folks.

[AMM]

I think many jurisdictions are going to be in scramble mode when looking for candidates given how few (at least as far as I can tell) monastics or unmarried and/or widowed priests there are around as potential candidates.  I think it's unfortunate that one of the main criteria may be whether the candidate is unmarried, as opposed to being a potential successful leader, but it is what it is.

[ICXCNIKA]

I have a question that perhaps you can answer since you seem to be a long time and active member of the Carpatho Rusyn Diocese. There has been talk among the Ruthenians (at least among the ones in Europe) to join the UGCC and form one jurisdiction. Has there ever been any discussions or desire to join the UOC-USA? Or are there significant differences whereby the Rusyns would lose their identity?

Wonderful! I wasn't sure given how things seem to work in the Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America.

It is a common misunderstanding and for some a deliberate misstatement, that the Carpatho-Russian and the two canonical Ukrainian Orthodox jurisdictions in North America are 'in the Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America.' None of us are either structurally or legally part of the Archdiocese. As a matter of general practice we do not commemorate the Archbishop of America. At the present time given our vacant position, he is our Locum Tenens and is being commemorated, however upon the enthronement of a new Bishop,that will no longer be the case.

The three jurisdictions in question, ACROD, the UOCUSA and UOCC, are under the omophor of the ecumenical throne and operate, for lack of a better word (and this is not being used in any canonical reference) autonomously. Bishops are chosen pursuant to the by-laws governing each of these jurisdictions and the choice is forwarded to the Holy Synod of the Ecumenical Patriarch for approval. To my knowledge, limited to ACROD, the Synod has never rejected any of the choices submitted since its founding in 1938.

[Fr. George]

I remember seeing Archbishop Demetrios (or possibly Archbishop Spyridon?) referred to as 'Exarch of the Atlantic and Pacific Oceans.' I'm glad this hasn't been turned into an actual jurisdiction over the ACROD, the UOCC, or the UOCUSA (beyond being a locum tenens and/or installing new primates).

It was never intended to be an extension of actual jurisdiction, merely a title indicating that The Archbishop of America is a representative of the Ecumenical Patriarchate (EP + Synod) in the Western Hemisphere (incl. oceans/islands).  If the Patriarchate, for example, wanted a representative at an event (say, the funeral for His Eminence NICHOLAS of blessed memory), then the Archbishop of America would be "it."

[podkarpatska]

I have a question that perhaps you can answer since you seem to be a long time and active member of the Carpatho Rusyn Diocese. There has been talk among the Ruthenians (at least among the ones in Europe) to join the UGCC and form one jurisdiction. Has there ever been any discussions or desire to join the UOC-USA? Or are there significant differences whereby the Rusyns would lose their identity?

Wonderful! I wasn't sure given how things seem to work in the Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America.

It is a common misunderstanding and for some a deliberate misstatement, that the Carpatho-Russian and the two canonical Ukrainian Orthodox jurisdictions in North America are 'in the Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America.' None of us are either structurally or legally part of the Archdiocese. As a matter of general practice we do not commemorate the Archbishop of America. At the present time given our vacant position, he is our Locum Tenens and is being commemorated, however upon the enthronement of a new Bishop,that will no longer be the case.

The three jurisdictions in question, ACROD, the UOCUSA and UOCC, are under the omophor of the ecumenical throne and operate, for lack of a better word (and this is not being used in any canonical reference) autonomously. Bishops are chosen pursuant to the by-laws governing each of these jurisdictions and the choice is forwarded to the Holy Synod of the Ecumenical Patriarch for approval. To my knowledge, limited to ACROD, the Synod has never rejected any of the choices submitted since its founding in 1938.

There are differences in chant and Rusyns have historically lacked a sense of cultural kinship with Ukraine. To the outside observer the differences may appear subtle, but nothing regarding Church and culture is always what it seems!

As you move from what is now eastern Slovakia into Transcarpathian Ukraine the Rusyns gradually give way to the western Ukrainians who are predominantly Greek Catholic. The Greek Catholics around the Slovak border and the cities of Uzhorod and Muchachevo are within the historic boundaries of the Greek Catholic Eparchy of Munkacs/Muchachevo which is a designated as a 'sui juris' church by Rome. They are not part of the Ukrainian Greek Catholic Synod based in L'vov with pretensions upon Kiev. It is my understanding that this is a source of irritation to some Ukrainian nationalists who do not recognize the Rusyns as a separate group. Rusyns in Slovakia would have no desire to join the UGCC as they have their own 'sui juris' church with their own episcopacy.

The Orthodox Rusyns of Slovakia have their own parallel dioceses to those of the Greek Catholics and to my memory all of the Bishops of the Orthodox Church of the Czech and Slovak lands are at least partially Rusyn in ethnic background. The Orthodox were influenced by the presence of the White Russians who relocated to Ladimirova in Slovakia following the Revolution and remained there until Czechoslovakia came under Soviet domination. The late Metropolitan Laurus of ROCOR was born in Ladimirova and was of Rusyn heritage.

In Transcarpathia, the Orthodox Rusyns do not have their own Bishop as they were made part of the Russian Church following the USSR's annexation of Transcarpathia following World War II. They have a large presence in the Uzhorod area and the leading Orthodox Rusyn priest, Father Dymytry Sydor, is a 'thorn' in the side of the local Ukrainian authorities - most of whom are sympathetic to the UGCC or the UOC-KP. The Rusyns are aligned there with the UOC-MP. To those of you who have been to Uzhorod, you may have seen the massive Orthodox Church in the City constructed during the 1990's and yet unfinished in the upper church. This is the Cathedral Church of the Exhaltation of the Holy Cross built through  Fr. Dymytry's vision and will power. I believe it is intended to be the second or third largest Orthodox Church of the MP when completed.

As to the United States, ACROD and UOC-USA and Canada are on very friendly terms both on the hierarchical, clerical and lay side of things. Bishop Daniel of Toronto shares both Ukrainian and Rusyn heritage as did the late Archbishop Vsevelod. However, I do not see the possibility of there being any desire on either part to formalize things outside of the overall potential for change in our American Church per se.

A more detailed summary may be found here:  http://www.simkovich.org/religion.htm

[kijabeboy03]

There are two hierarchs of the UOC-MP in Transcarpathia - are neither of them of Rusyn heritage?

[kijabeboy03]

I think the UOC-KP has a bishop in Transcarpathia as well, but I'm assuming he's ethnically Ukrainian...

[podkarpatska]

There are two hierarchs of the UOC-MP in Transcarpathia - are neither of them of Rusyn heritage?

I don't think so, but I will check this Sunday with one of our parishioners who is a good friend of Fr. Dymyti.

[kijabeboy03]

Coolness! :-)

[ICXCNIKA]

podkarpatska,

Thank you for your very informative response. I will look at the website as well.

[kijabeboy03]

I just found the biographies on the Moscow Patriarchate's website - Archbishop Mark of Khust (who used to serve in the patriarchal exarchate in Canada) was born in Transcarpathia and Archbishop Theodore of Mukachevo was born in Galicia.

[Irish Melkite]

I have a question that perhaps you can answer since you seem to be a long time and active member of the Carpatho Rusyn Diocese. There has been talk among the Ruthenians (at least among the ones in Europe) to join the UGCC and form one jurisdiction.

Although tangential to the main topic, I'd agree with my friend and brother, podkarpatska, that there is no interest among the Ruthenians of the Eparchy of Muchachevo to become one with the UGCC. If there is interest in such, it runs the other way, i.e., there are undoubtedly those within the UGCC who would like to absorb the Ruthenian jurisdiction into the larger sister Church.

Muchachevo sits as an observer at the UGCC Synod (and is annotated as such in minutes, etc) and while there are assuredly matters of common interest and concern that are jointly addressed, that is the extent of it.

Many years,

Neil

[Orest]

Archbishop Mark of Khust was in Canada and came to one of our UOCC banquets for a celebration in Winnipeg.  Can't remember the occasion but he spoke in fluent Ukrainian and got along with the Orthodox in Canada.
Who is Bishop Daniel of Toronto?

[podkarpatska]

Archbishop Mark of Khust was in Canada and came to one of our UOCC banquets for a celebration in Winnipeg.  Can't remember the occasion but he spoke in fluent Ukrainian and got along with the Orthodox in Canada.
Who is Bishop Daniel of Toronto?

Me bad, Bishop Daniel is in Chicago!  I meant  Bishop Andriy (Peshko) who is the acting Bishop of the Eastern Eparchy of the UOCC. Please accept my apologies, my fingers were faster than my brain!

[Basil 320]

Is anyone aware of any developments as to who might be nominated as Metropolitan Nicholas' successor?

[kijabeboy03]

Is Bishop Andriy not officially Bishop of Toronto to give the eparchy time to adjust to him or does the Ecumenical Patriarchate have an issue with his move from Western Europe to Canada?

[John of the North]

Is Bishop Andriy not officially Bishop of Toronto to give the eparchy time to adjust to him or does the Ecumenical Patriarchate have an issue with his move from Western Europe to Canada?

Bishop Andriy has yet to be enthroned as Bishop for the Eastern Eparchy, but he has been chosen as the Eparchy's next hierarch.

[kijabeboy03]

Apparently he has, but why hasn't the Holy Synod of the Church of Constantinople at least recognized his election as auxiliary Bishop of Saskatoon by the Ukrainian Orthodox Church of Canada?

[John of the North]

Apparently he has, but why hasn't the Holy Synod of the Church of Constantinople at least recognized his election as auxiliary Bishop of Saskatoon by the Ukrainian Orthodox Church of Canada?

I'm confused. How do you know they didn't recognise his election to Saskatoon??

[kijabeboy03]

There's been no news of it since then - God knows in this day and age it would have been posted somewhere :-). As it is, everything available (that I can find anyway) says his election as Bishop of Saskatoon is still pending the Holy Synod's approval although he's already moved :-).

[Fr. George]

the ACROD hierarch is an auxiliary bishop to the GO Archbishop of America, just like all the GOAA bishops were between 1930 and 1978.

I'm sorry I missed this earlier.  No, the ACROD hierarch is not an auxiliary bishop to the Archbishop; he is (was) a ruling bishop who happened to have as a see a city in Asia.  The Archbishop has/had no direct ecclesiastical authority over him, and only acted in relation to him as a brother hierarch or, when the occasion called for it, as the local exarch of the Patriarchate.

[JamesRottnek]

That is, then, the same setup as the Metropolises, right?

[Basil 320]

For many years, but not in recent years, the GOAA Yearbook used to print the following language, in fine print, on the page that listed the SCOBA member ecclesiastical jurisdictions.

"Our relationship to the Ukrainian Orthodox Diocese and to the Carpatho-Russian Orthodox Diocese (see above) differs slightly to that which we have with other jurisdictions.  In both cases, since each were established by the Ecumenical Patriarchate, our Archdiocese, as Exarchate of the Ecumenical Patriarchate is entrusted with the direct spiritual supervision of their diocese.  This means that when they relate to the Ecumenical Patriarchate, for reception of Holy Chrism or the election of a new bishop, this must be submitted to the Archbishop, who in turn after reviewing the matter transmits it to the Holy Synod of the Ecumenical Patriarchate for action.  In all other matters these two dioceses function totally independent of this Archdiocese.

In addition, the Albanian Orthodox Diocese and the Byelorussian Orthodox Diocese are also under the jurisdiction of the Ecumenical Patriarchate.  Each of these diocese is headed by a vicar priest who is directly responsible to the Archbishop."

[kijabeboy03]

The Belarusian Orthodox parishes are completely with the Belarusian Autocephalous Orthodox Church now, aren't they?

[mike]

The Belarusian Orthodox parishes are completely with the Belarusian Autocephalous Orthodox Church now, aren't they?

There are a few within ACROD.

[podkarpatska]

That is, then, the same setup as the Metropolises, right?

Excepting that the Ruling Bishop of ACROD is not the Bishop of Johnstown, PA just as Metropolitan Constantine of the UOCUSA is not the Bishop of Bound Brook, NJ. Also, these two jurisdictions have their own internal by-laws and regulations and are not subject to the Archdiocesan regulations which have been the subject of some discussion here recently.

[username!]

Rusyns are Ukrainians.  That's my new bumpersticker, or at least Rusyn is a term/idea invented by second generation children of immigrant Ukrainian parents from Galicia.

[Schultz]

Rusyns are Ukrainians.  That's my new bumpersticker, or at least Rusyn is a term/idea invented by second generation children of immigrant Ukrainian parents from Galicia.

And here we go again...

The Lemko-Rusyn Republic, founded at the end of WWI.

Kind of ruins your argmument that Rusyn is an immigrant idea, doesn't it?