OrthodoxChristianity.net
June 19, 2013, 07:04:23 AM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
News: If you don't like the Lent theme or it's hard for you to read posts with it, feel free to revert back to the old theme in your profile on the left menu "Look and Layout Preferences."
 
   Home   Help Calendar Contact Treasury Tags Login Register  
OrthodoxChristianity.net > Moderated Forums > Faith Issues (Moderator: Michał Kalina) > Topic: Begetting of the Son vs the Procession of the Holy Spirit
Pages: 1   Go Down
« previous next »
  Print  
Author Topic: Begetting of the Son vs the Procession of the Holy Spirit  (Read 528 times) Average Rating: 0
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
William
Procrastinator and slacker. Also formerly known as Apples
Archon
********
Online Online

Faith: Christian
Posts: 3,316
« on: April 18, 2011, 08:03:13 PM »
What is the difference between the Son being begotten of the Father and the Spirit's procession from Him?
Logged
Irish Hermit
Kibernetski Kaludjer
Warned
Stratopedarches
**************
Offline Offline

Posts: 10,991


Holy Father Patrick, pray for us
« Reply #1 on: April 18, 2011, 08:15:44 PM »
Quote from: Apples on April 18, 2011, 08:03:13 PM
What is the difference between the Son being begotten of the Father and the Spirit's procession from Him?

Saint John of Damascus wrote about this question over a thousand years ago...

'The mode of generation and the mode of procession are incomprehensible. We have learned that there is a difference between generation and procession, but the nature of the difference we in no wise understand.'
Logged
jckstraw72
Elder
*****
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: OCA
Posts: 1,174
« Reply #2 on: April 18, 2011, 10:22:07 PM »
was it St. Gregory the Theologian who said let us contemplate this and we can go mad together?
Logged
ialmisry
There's nothing John of Damascus can't answer
Megas Domestikos
**********************
Offline Offline

Faith: جامعي Arab confesssing the Orthodox Faith of the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church
Jurisdiction: Antioch (for now), but my heart belongs to Alexandria
Posts: 30,241
« Reply #3 on: April 18, 2011, 10:22:58 PM »
Quote from: Apples on April 18, 2011, 08:03:13 PM
What is the difference between the Son being begotten of the Father and the Spirit's procession from Him?
Father beat me to it.

if we knew that, we would know God as He knows Himself, and be persons of the Holy Trinity.
Logged
Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth
deusveritasest
Toumarches
*
Offline Offline

Faith: None
Jurisdiction: None
Posts: 7,528



WWW
« Reply #4 on: April 18, 2011, 10:27:17 PM »
Quote from: Apples on April 18, 2011, 08:03:13 PM
What is the difference between the Son being begotten of the Father and the Spirit's procession from Him?

How can we know what the difference between them is if we don't even know what exactly each of them are in the first place?

The way I figure it, God likened the causation of the Son and the Spirit to the begetting and spiration of this world, not in an absolute manner, but as a symbol that reveals something of the reality. Given that "Begetting" and "Proceeding" are thus mere inklings of who the Son and the Spirit are, there really isn't room to say that we can know the exact difference between the two. All we can say is that there is something about the causation of the Son that is more like human begetting and something about the causation of the Spirit that is more like Spiration.

Nonetheless, it suffices to say that this amounts to there not being any real answer to your question.
« Last Edit: April 18, 2011, 10:27:28 PM by deusveritasest » Logged
I stopped posting here in August 2011 because of stark disagreement with the policies of the administration and moderating team of the forums. If you desire, feel free to PM me, message me on Facebook (link in profile), or email me: cddombrowski@gmail.com
Irish Hermit
Kibernetski Kaludjer
Warned
Stratopedarches
**************
Offline Offline

Posts: 10,991


Holy Father Patrick, pray for us
« Reply #5 on: April 18, 2011, 10:33:06 PM »
Quote from: jckstraw72 on April 18, 2011, 10:22:07 PM
was it St. Gregory the Theologian who said let us contemplate this and we can go mad together?

Yes indeed. Saint Gregory the Theologian who died about 388 AD is an erudite representative of the Church Fathers on the subject of the origins of the three Persons of the Trinity. 
 
You hear that there is generation? Do not waste your time in seeking after the how. You hear that the Spirit proceeds from the Father? Do not busy yourself about the how" [Orat XX, 2]  "You ask what is the procession of the Holy Spirit? Do tell me first what is the unbegottenness of the Father, then I will explain to you the physiology of the Son's generation and the Spirit's procession and both of us shall be stricken with madness for prying into the mystery of God" [Orat XXXI, 8]
 
The Fifth Theological Oration.On the Holy
Spirit by St Gregory Nazianzen

In my opinion the Western world has been long stricken with the madness against which Saint Gregory cautions.
Logged
Tags: Trinity 
Pages: 1   Go Up
  Print  
OrthodoxChristianity.net > Moderated Forums > Faith Issues (Moderator: Michał Kalina) > Topic: Begetting of the Son vs the Procession of the Holy Spirit
 « previous next »
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.18 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
Page created in 0.043 seconds with 32 queries.