Author Topic: Vote In Favor of Murder! (An offensive Diatribe)  (Read 2198 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Asteriktos

  • Hypatos
  • *****************
  • Posts: 33,626
Vote In Favor of Murder! (An offensive Diatribe)
« on: October 07, 2002, 02:56:18 AM »
As the title of the thread suggests, this is going to be essentially a diatribe in its form. If someone disagrees, please speak up and say something (I promise to be as irenic as possible after this first post!  I'm using the tone I am going to use in this post mostly for rhetorical reasons, and not because the passions are leading me around by the nose). If you are easily offended or find the abortion debate to be a "touchy" topic for you, I suggest you avoid reading this post.


________________________________

I find the American "Christian" position on abortion hypocritical and sickening. The majority of Christians would identify themselves as "pro-life," but I must question how firmly they hold to the pro-life position. One thing that makes me question them is that a self-identified pro-lifer will vote for people who openly and fully support abortion for anyone who wants one. How exactly does a supposed pro-lifer vote for someone who supports something like partial-birth abortion anyway? If you say that the entity within a mother is alive, a baby, how in the world can you support someone who thinks it ok to murder the child?

Some might say "well, you can't just base things on one issue". What a bunch of tripe! What are you saying? That you will condone murder if it gets you tax breaks and better roads? (why does "Crime and Punishment" suddenly come to mind?) The single biggest issue should be "why have we murdered tens of millions of our own citizens, and why are we so apathetic in the face of their deaths?" Why do we fall into shock when a few thousand die in a terrorist attack, but hardly raise a word concerning the millions that have been killed by our own neighbors? And yet we vote for people who support this kind of attack?

Imagine a 9/11 every single day. It already happens, we hide it behind the now-too-familiar word "abortion." It's not even enough to say that you are "pro-life" anymore, because what does that mean? How many people say that and then turn around and define that term thusly: "I'm personally against it, I think it's wrong, though I won't force my opinion on someone else." That's also a bunch of tripe. We force our morality on people every day. Civil law by definition is an enforcement of morality (though of course their remains a sharp distinction between the concepts of crime and sin). Think it's wrong to exploit children in child pornography? Think it's wrong to put a puppy in a bag and beat it to death? Think people should be prosecuted for such things? (I certainly do). Then you're "forcing your morality" (or society or the culture as a whole is forcing it's morality) onto others, whether you like to think of it that way or not.

And what else is wrong with this whole picture in America? The more I read Chrysostom, the more I am struck by his bold stance against some of the "entertainment" going on during his time. In one of his homilies he basically says that if you admit that something is wrong, it's much worse for people to imitate it! Who does Chrysostom blame? Us! We Christians who support such things are blamed (to a large extent). We Christians who go to such plays (=watch such TV shows) which condone evil acts like abortion, we who support such imitations of evil (if only be laughing and watching).

We're more angry at the guy who kills an abortionist than we are at the actual abortionist! I don't support going out and murdering anyone, mind you, but there is something dreadfully wrong with being angry over one death, and that of someone whose life work was murder, while ignoring the hundreds of murders of the man as though they didn't happen. And where's the calling out about the horrible things being done in so many countries under the guise of "family planning"? Teenage girls who are minors can have an abortion performed in some places without the parents or father even being notified. CA seems to be going towards making certain abortion techniques mandatory training for some doctors. What is going on here?

I agree on very little with the man, but I do respect Bob Enyart in one reaspect: he is boldly and publically pro-life. He routinely goes in front of "abortion mills" (as he calls them) and tries to turn the women away from murdering their children and tries to help them get the help they need. He also does "Abortionist home visits". On holidays and some other times he will go to an abortionists home with others and protest the man's house. But what about you and I? What do we do? When was the last all-night vigil we held for those babies being aborted and who had been aborted? When was the last prayer we said for them for that matter. Would we change our view (and prayer habits, and speech habits, and...) if it was infanticide instead of abortion? We condemn Herod, we voted in Clinton (as a nation.. and don't say "I didn't vote for him".. what is more important is what you did to try and block him from being elected, and then re-elected).

Please pray.
« Last Edit: October 07, 2002, 03:03:23 AM by Slave of Christ »
Selah

Offline Nigula Qian Zishi

  • Administrator Emeritus, Retired Deacon, Inactive Poster, Active Orthodox Christian, Father, and Husband
  • OC.net guru
  • *******
  • Posts: 1,837
  • 我美丽的妻子和我。
    • Orthodox Ecclesiology and The World
  • Faith: Orthodox Christian
  • Jurisdiction: Greek Orthodox Metropolis of Denver
Re:Vote In Favor of Murder! (An offensive Diatribe)
« Reply #1 on: October 07, 2002, 08:02:30 AM »
Glory to Jesus Christ!

An old friend of mine who is neither strongly pro-life nor a theist in any way, once said this:

"If you truly believe that abortion is murder, then you've got to support the man that kills one abortion doctor or blows up one abortuary to save thousands of live. To do otherwise would be hypocritical. If someone was going to schools killing kids every day, would you idly stand by? No."

Its the same concept of killing Al Queda opperatives or a Sadam Husein, or a Hitler, or a Stalin.

That comment really made me think. Is it immoral to take an guilty, unrepentant life to save thousands of innocents?
在基督
尼古拉
前执事
的博客

Offline Robert

  • "Amazing"
  • Archon
  • ********
  • Posts: 2,442
Re:Vote In Favor of Murder! (An offensive Diatribe)
« Reply #2 on: October 07, 2002, 10:05:38 AM »
Hi Slave of Christ,

I fully concur with the post you make.


Bobby

Online Mor Ephrem

  • Supreme Commander of the Joint Armed Warrior Services (JAWS) of the Oriental Orthodox Church
  • Section Moderator
  • Protospatharios
  • *****
  • Posts: 28,154
  • Fr Seraphim Rose and the Twin Towers
    • OrthodoxChristianity.net
  • Faith: Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: But my heart belongs to Czech Lands
Re:Vote In Favor of Murder! (An offensive Diatribe)
« Reply #3 on: October 07, 2002, 01:41:17 PM »
As do I.  Great post!

Offline MaryCecilia

  • Struggler
  • Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 109
    • Many twists and turns mary's blog
Re:Vote In Favor of Murder! (An offensive Diatribe)
« Reply #4 on: October 07, 2002, 06:33:18 PM »
I also agree with all you had to say Slave of Christ! Great post and IMO a well written post!   :)  



in ICXC,
MaryCecilia
Mary Cecilia passed into eternal life on Jan 2, 2010.  May her memory be eternal!

Offline hecma925

  • Non-clairvoyant, but you can call me Elder
  • Toumarches
  • ************
  • Posts: 11,718
  • Unbreakable! He's alive, dammit! It's a MIRACLE!
    • Blog
  • Faith: Truthful Chalcedonian Truther
  • Jurisdiction: Orthodox Church of the South
Re: Vote In Favor of Murder! (An offensive Diatribe)
« Reply #5 on: September 18, 2015, 06:59:42 AM »
Great post, Slave of Christ!
Happy shall he be, that shall take and dash thy little ones against the rock. Alleluia.

Once Christ has filled the Cross, it can never be empty again.

"But God doesn't need your cookies!  Arrive on time!"

Offline seekeroftruth777

  • OC.net guru
  • *******
  • Posts: 1,375
  • Faith: Eastern Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: GOARCH
Re: Vote In Favor of Murder! (An offensive Diatribe)
« Reply #6 on: September 18, 2015, 08:53:52 AM »
whoa I can't believe that wasn't moved to politics like everything else is now on here that touchy or controversial. looking way back at the OP and responses do they all still have the same views?

Offline minasoliman

  • Mr., Sir, Dude, Guy, Male, tr. Minas in Greek, Menes in white people Egyptologists :-P
  • Moderator
  • Hoplitarches
  • *****
  • Posts: 17,257
  • Pray for me Sts. Mina & Kyrillos for my interviews
  • Faith: Oriental Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: Coptic
Re: Vote In Favor of Murder! (An offensive Diatribe)
« Reply #7 on: September 22, 2015, 05:21:28 PM »
whoa I can't believe that wasn't moved to politics like everything else is now on here that touchy or controversial. looking way back at the OP and responses do they all still have the same views?

Well, this was 2002.  Things change since then.  Let's not get carried away and leave this thread to be part of the historical fabric of this site.  If people want to re-discuss something in this thread, then do so with a "religious" aspect of it, and leave off the politics.  It sounds difficult, I know, but this can help encourage someone to slowly type and think twice before clicking on that "post" button.
Vain existence can never exist, for "unless the LORD builds the house, the builders labor in vain." (Psalm 127)

If the faith is unchanged and rock solid, then the gates of Hades never prevailed in the end.

Offline PeterTheAleut

  • The Right Blowhard Peter the Furtive of Yetts O'Muckhart
  • Hypatos
  • *****************
  • Posts: 37,391
  • Lord, have mercy on the Christians in Mosul!
  • Faith: Orthodox Christian
  • Jurisdiction: Orthodox Church in America
Re: Vote In Favor of Murder! (An offensive Diatribe)
« Reply #8 on: September 22, 2015, 05:46:19 PM »
whoa I can't believe that wasn't moved to politics like everything else is now on here that touchy or controversial. looking way back at the OP and responses do they all still have the same views?

Well, this was 2002.
I don't think we even had a Politics board in 2002. That came many years later.
Not all who wander are lost.

Online TheTrisagion

  • Delusional Overlord
  • Hoplitarches
  • *************
  • Posts: 16,860
  • And the cat is back again.
  • Faith: Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: Antiochian
Re: Vote In Favor of Murder! (An offensive Diatribe)
« Reply #9 on: September 22, 2015, 05:51:52 PM »
I didn't look to see when this was written and rather suprised that the tone was not at all the Justin Kissel that I have gotten to know.
The term planet earth is an innovation which has arisen in recent centuries with the error of heliocentrism.

If one wants to confess a pure doctrine of Orthodoxy, they should be careful not to refer to the earth as a planet, unlike the current Pope as well as Patriarch Kirill and Patriarch Bartholomew, who regularly speak in error when they refer to our planet earth.

Offline seekeroftruth777

  • OC.net guru
  • *******
  • Posts: 1,375
  • Faith: Eastern Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: GOARCH
Re: Vote In Favor of Murder! (An offensive Diatribe)
« Reply #10 on: September 22, 2015, 06:41:11 PM »
I didn't look to see when this was written and rather suprised that the tone was not at all the Justin Kissel that I have gotten to know.

yeah that most shocking that this was from justin we all know and love he seem so relaxed and chill these days