Author Topic: Archbishop blinks in Church crisis - Feud to END!  (Read 4033 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline TomS

  • Archon
  • ********
  • Posts: 3,186
  • "Look At Me! Look At Me Now! " - Bono
Archbishop blinks in Church crisis - Feud to END!
« on: May 20, 2004, 07:15:42 AM »
Archbishop blinks in Church crisis

Feud with Patriarchate to end

The unprecedented feud between the Ecumenical Patriarchate and the Church of Greece appears to be heading for a solution, following a decision by Archbishop Christodoulos to appease the demands of the Patriarchate. The archbishop is expected to call an emergency meeting of the Church of Greece’s highest decision-making body, the Hierarchy, by the end of next week, sources said.

 ;D

At this meeting, Christodoulos is expected to propose that the Greek Church’s leaders vote on a decision expressing respect for the Patriarchal Tome, which granted the Church of Greece its autocephalous status, and the Patriarchal Act of 1928 with which the Patriarchate granted the Greek Church temporary administrative powers over 36 bishoprics belonging to the Patriarchate. The crisis followed the death of two northern Greek bishops last summer and the resignation of a third. The Church of Greece chose to elect new bishops in a way that the Patriarchate said questioned its jurisdiction over the 36 bishoprics in the so-called “new territories” which became part of Greece after the Balkan Wars of 1913.

Ecumenical Patriarch Vartholomaios is said to agree with the impending decision and will call a meeting of the expanded Synod in Istanbul to end the suspension of communion imposed on Christodoulos on April 30. The Synod will also recognize the appointment of the three bishops elected by the Church of Greece.

This outcome is said to be the result of active engagement by the Greek government, which has been mediating between Athens and Istanbul over the past few weeks.

Sources said that by the end of June, Vartholomaios and Christodoulos will conduct a liturgy together at the Patriarchate in Istanbul, in the presence of Education and Religion Minister Marietta Giannakou, who led the mediation effort.

Government officials accompanying Prime Minister Costas Karamanlis on his visit to the United States expressed satisfaction with the outcome. They noted the solution had come from the Church itself and justified the government’s decision not to get involved in the substance of the crisis.

---

It's like I said, the EP was right ALL along!  ;) :-[

Offline Αριστοκλής

  • Merarches
  • ***********
  • Posts: 10,031
Re:Archbishop blinks in Church crisis - Feud to END!
« Reply #1 on: May 20, 2004, 08:08:58 AM »
TomΣ,
I don't know about "right" or not here...but I do know that if this fight  is ending, then I would hire Marietta Giannakou in an instant!

Demetri
"Religion is a neurobiological illness and Orthodoxy is its cure." - Fr. John S. Romanides

Offline Fr. David

  • The Poster Formerly Known as "Pedro"
  • Archon
  • ********
  • Posts: 2,833
Re:Archbishop blinks in Church crisis - Feud to END!
« Reply #2 on: May 20, 2004, 08:42:48 AM »
Glory to God....
Priest in the Orthodox Church in America - ordained on March 18, 2012

Oh Taste and See (my defunct blog)

From Protestant to Orthodox (my conversion story)

Offline Linus7

  • Archon
  • ********
  • Posts: 2,780
Re:Archbishop blinks in Church crisis - Feud to END!
« Reply #3 on: May 20, 2004, 10:33:34 AM »
Ahhhhhhhh . . .

Good news for a change!  ;D
The first condition of salvation is to keep the norm of the true faith and in no way to deviate from the established doctrine of the Fathers.
- Pope St. Hormisdas

Offline Ben

  • Unabashedly Pro-Life
  • OC.net guru
  • *******
  • Posts: 1,260
Re:Archbishop blinks in Church crisis - Feud to END!
« Reply #4 on: May 20, 2004, 11:28:05 AM »
Wonderful news!
"I prefer to be accused unjustly, for then I have nothing to reproach myself with, and joyfully offer this to the good Lord. Then I humble myself at the thought that I am indeed capable of doing the thing of which I have been accused. " - Saint

Offline countrymouse

  • cyberklutz
  • Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 115
  • OC.net
Re:Archbishop blinks in Church crisis - Feud to END!
« Reply #5 on: May 20, 2004, 08:20:19 PM »
God has granted it!

Offline TomS

  • Archon
  • ********
  • Posts: 3,186
  • "Look At Me! Look At Me Now! " - Bono
Re:Archbishop blinks in Church crisis - Feud to END!
« Reply #6 on: May 29, 2004, 03:00:57 PM »
Church bows to Patriarchate

One month after its decision to defy its Istanbul-based Mother Church and elect three new bishops to contested sees, the Church of Greece yesterday backtracked and agreed to observe existing agreements on its relations with the Ecumenical Patriarchate.

With the sole exception of hardliner Bishop Amvrosios of Kalavryta, the Church Hierarchy — the plenary session of all 80 bishops, chaired by Archbishop Christodoulos — voted “to continue in the future, as we have done so far, to respect and observe” agreements dating to 1850 and 1928 which regulate the Greek Church’s relations with the Patriarchate.

In response, the Patriarchate, which had severed contact with Christodoulos after the controversial election and refused to acknowledge the three new bishops, issued a statement expressing satisfaction, and voicing hope that “this decision will provide a sincere beginning of brotherly relations” between the two churches. The deal followed a mediatory effort by Education Minister Marietta Giannakou.

Simmering tension between the two churches erupted last summer into a turf war over control of 36 northern Greek sees that were wrested from the Turks following the Balkan Wars. Ignoring the patriarch’s claim to have the right of final approval on candidates for northern sees, in April the Church of Greece went ahead and filled three seats, two of which had been vacant since the summer.

“I welcome this positive development,” Giannakou said. “What is most important is the unity of Orthodoxy and the smooth cooperation between the two churches, for the good of all Greeks.”

However, sources said Christodoulos described the decision not as “a hasty retreat,” but rather as a gesture to maintain the peace.

Offline TomS

  • Archon
  • ********
  • Posts: 3,186
  • "Look At Me! Look At Me Now! " - Bono
Re:Archbishop blinks in Church crisis - Feud to END!
« Reply #7 on: June 05, 2004, 08:36:38 AM »
Church peace icily confirmed

In a frosty announcement yesterday, the Orthodox Ecumenical Patriarchate said it was lifting the sanctions it had placed on Archbishop Christodoulos and three Greek bishops after the Church of Greece agreed to accept the Istanbul-based church’s suzerainty over three dozen northern Greek sees.

The Patriarchate said it was restoring communion with Christodoulos — broken at the beginning of May after the archbishop flagrantly challenged Patriarch Vartholomaios’s authority over the 36 bishoprics — in response to the Greek Church’s decision on May 28 to pledge respect for patriarchal decisions of 1850 and 1928 governing the balance of power between the two churches.

The announcement added that the Patriarchate had decided to recognize “on sufferance” the newly appointed bishops of Thessaloniki, Eleftheroupolis and Kozani, whom Christodoulos picked without first securing Istanbul’s approval.

The bitter turf war, which broke out following the deaths last summer of two northern bishops, hinges on which church has ultimate control over sees in parts of Greece that were wrested from Turkey after 1912. When it came to a list of candidate replacements being sent to Istanbul, Athens insisted that the document was just for the patriarch’s information, while Vartholomaios claimed the right to approve the list.

Education Minister Marietta Giannakou, who brokered a preliminary peace deal between the belligerent churches last month, expressed satisfaction with yesterday’s news from Istanbul. “I hope a new era is starting in relations between the two churches,” she said. “What has been agreed... regarding the recognition of the three bishops must be followed to the letter.”

There was no immediate official reaction from the Church of Greece.

Offline Αριστοκλής

  • Merarches
  • ***********
  • Posts: 10,031
Re:Archbishop blinks in Church crisis - Feud to END!
« Reply #8 on: June 05, 2004, 12:13:44 PM »
Interesting slant buried in the article, TomΣ.
Isn't "suzerainty" a moslem or Turkish word? Hidden dig, perhaps?

Demetri
"Religion is a neurobiological illness and Orthodoxy is its cure." - Fr. John S. Romanides

Offline Anastasios

  • Webdespota
  • Administrator
  • Merarches
  • *******
  • Posts: 10,515
  • St. Chrysostomos the New
    • AnastasiosHudson.com
  • Faith: Orthodox Christian
  • Jurisdiction: Greek Old Calendarist
Re:Archbishop blinks in Church crisis - Feud to END!
« Reply #9 on: June 05, 2004, 02:08:15 PM »
This whole issue really bugged me. I am wary of Pat. Bartholemew's advancing web of control over the world of Orthodoxy yet in this case I thought he was right. Put me in a strange position

anastasios
Please Buy My Book!

Past posts reflect stages of my life before my baptism and may not be accurate expositions of Orthodox teaching. Also, I served as an Orthodox priest from 2008-2013, before resigning.

Offline Νεκτάριος

  • Protokentarchos
  • *********
  • Posts: 5,437
Re:Archbishop blinks in Church crisis - Feud to END!
« Reply #10 on: June 05, 2004, 05:29:18 PM »
On paper I agree that the Patriarch was correct, but there are only so many times he can cry wolf before no one takes him seriously.

Offline TomS

  • Archon
  • ********
  • Posts: 3,186
  • "Look At Me! Look At Me Now! " - Bono
Re:Archbishop blinks in Church crisis - Feud to END!
« Reply #11 on: June 07, 2004, 10:10:54 AM »
Church bridge creaks and sways

For the first time in over five weeks, the name of Archbishop Christodoulos was officially mentioned in prayers at the Orthodox Ecumenical Patriarchate in Istanbul yesterday, marking the cessation of open hostilities between the two churches over control of three dozen northern Greek sees.

However, Church of Greece officials in Athens implied that the turf war was not yet over, responding to Friday’s stipulation by Patriarch Vartholomaios that three newly appointed northern bishops will have to apologize in writing for their election, which was carried out against the wishes of the Patriarchate.

A spokesman for Christodoulos said on Saturday that this demand had not been part of the peace deal brokered last month between the two churches by Education Minister Marietta Giannakou.

“The setting of terms and preconditions regarding the recognition of the three canonically and legitimately elected new bishops is a clear breach of the agreement,” Epifanios Iconomou said. However, he hailed the agreement as “a blessed development.”

At the end of April, Vartholomaios broke communion with Christodoulos over the latter’s decision to openly defy the Patriarchate and proceed with the election of new bishops for Thessaloniki, Kozani and Eleftheroupolis. The patriarch also refused to recognize the three officials.

The turf war concerns control of 36 northern sees in parts of Greece that were wrested from Turkey after 1912. It was officially declared over by Vartholomaios on Friday, one week after the Church of Greece agreed to adhere to patriarchal decisions of 1850 and 1928 governing the balance of power between the two churches.

However, Christodoulos has made it clear that he was unhappy with the deal, and far from penitent.

“Displaying great prudence and calm, we even reached the point of retreating from our acquired rights in order to preserve unity and good relations,” he told an Athens congregation on Saturday

Offline Orthodoc

  • Supporter & Defender Of Orthodoxy
  • Archon
  • ********
  • Posts: 2,526
  • Those who ignore history tend to repeat it.
Re:Archbishop blinks in Church crisis - Feud to END!
« Reply #12 on: June 07, 2004, 11:17:32 AM »

It seems that hardly one incident created by the EP in his quest for power, ends when he creates another -

----------

Ecumenical Patriarch Defends Himself
.c The Associated Press

ISTANBUL, Turkey (AP) - The spiritual leader of the world's Orthodox
Christians appeared before a criminal court Monday, defending himself
against charges he broke the law by dismissing a Bulgarian priest.

Ecumenical Patriarch Bartholomew I wore his long clerical garb into
the courtroom, where he and 12 other senior clerics are on trial on
rarely invoked charges of ``preventing others from observing faith
and conducting religious services.''

Bartholomew insisted the Holy Synod, or governing council, had the
authority to remove the priest, Konstantin Kostof. But members of a
Bulgarian foundation who launched the lawsuit argue that Bartholomew
has no power over the Bulgarian Orthodox Church because the church
split from the Patriarchate in 1840.

The Orthodox Church frequently sees struggles over authority, but
they rarely end up in a criminal court - and the trial poses a
challenge to Bartholomew's authority. The defendants face up to five
months in prison if found guilty.

The patriarch has spiritual authority over the world's 300 million
Orthodox Christians and directly controls several Greek Orthodox
churches around the world, including the Greek Orthodox Archdiocese
of America. Turkey only recognizes the patriarch as the religious
head of the tiny Greek community in Turkey.

Bartholomew said Kostof was removed in 2002 after he refused to refer
to the patriarch in prayers.

``Mr. Kostof refused to mention the name of the highest religious
leader in the liturgy as was required,'' Bartholomew told the court.
``We warned him. When he didn't comply he was dismissed.''

``According to our rules, the Synod that grants spiritual authority
can also take it back in the same manner,'' he said, according to a
court transcript obtained by The Associated Press.

Three of the other 12 clerics from the patriarchate also appeared
before the court Monday, wearing business suits.

The charges against the men were brought by Bozhidar Chiprov, head of
a Bulgarian Orthodox Church foundation.

The Ecumenical Patriarchate in Istanbul dates from the Orthodox Greek
Byzantine Empire, which collapsed when the Muslim Ottoman Turks
conquered the city in 1453. Istanbul, then called Constantinople, was
the capital of the Byzantine Empire.

Although few Greek Orthodox Christians remain in overwhelmingly
Muslim Turkey, the patriarchate is still based in Istanbul.

=========

Orthodoc
Oh Lord, Save thy people and bless thine inheritance.
Grant victory to the Orthodox Christians over their adversaries.
And by virtue of thy Cross preserve thy habitation.

Offline TomS

  • Archon
  • ********
  • Posts: 3,186
  • "Look At Me! Look At Me Now! " - Bono
Re:Archbishop blinks in Church crisis - Feud to END!
« Reply #13 on: June 07, 2004, 11:23:05 AM »
"Although few Greek Orthodox Christians remain in overwhelmingly Muslim Turkey, the patriarchate is still based in Istanbul. "

And the only reason he remains there is that his "power" resides in the past.

If he were to leave, he could no longer appeal to the image of the "glory of Constantinople" to justify his hold on Orthodoxy.
« Last Edit: June 07, 2004, 11:23:58 AM by Tom+ú »

Offline Anastasios

  • Webdespota
  • Administrator
  • Merarches
  • *******
  • Posts: 10,515
  • St. Chrysostomos the New
    • AnastasiosHudson.com
  • Faith: Orthodox Christian
  • Jurisdiction: Greek Old Calendarist
Re:Archbishop blinks in Church crisis - Feud to END!
« Reply #14 on: June 07, 2004, 11:37:04 AM »
Orthodoc,

How is dismissing that Bulgarian priest a power play? The priest was in the territory of Bartholemew and did not commemorate him! This is phyletism!  If I were a priest of the OCA who moved to Romania, I would have to commemorate His Holiness Patriarch Teoctist.

anastasios
Please Buy My Book!

Past posts reflect stages of my life before my baptism and may not be accurate expositions of Orthodox teaching. Also, I served as an Orthodox priest from 2008-2013, before resigning.

Offline Orthodoc

  • Supporter & Defender Of Orthodoxy
  • Archon
  • ********
  • Posts: 2,526
  • Those who ignore history tend to repeat it.
Re:Archbishop blinks in Church crisis - Feud to END!
« Reply #15 on: June 07, 2004, 12:42:35 PM »
[How is dismissing that Bulgarian priest a power play? The priest was in the territory of Bartholemew and did not commemorate him! This is phyletism!  If I were a priest of the OCA who moved to Romania, I would have to commemorate His Holiness Patriarch Teoctist.]

You are right!  I concede!

Orthodoc
Oh Lord, Save thy people and bless thine inheritance.
Grant victory to the Orthodox Christians over their adversaries.
And by virtue of thy Cross preserve thy habitation.

Offline Anastasios

  • Webdespota
  • Administrator
  • Merarches
  • *******
  • Posts: 10,515
  • St. Chrysostomos the New
    • AnastasiosHudson.com
  • Faith: Orthodox Christian
  • Jurisdiction: Greek Old Calendarist
Re:Archbishop blinks in Church crisis - Feud to END!
« Reply #16 on: June 07, 2004, 01:12:28 PM »
Orthodoc,

While I disagreed with you on this one point, I would agree with you on Patriarch Bartholemew's general trend towards power consolidation.

anastasios
Please Buy My Book!

Past posts reflect stages of my life before my baptism and may not be accurate expositions of Orthodox teaching. Also, I served as an Orthodox priest from 2008-2013, before resigning.

Offline TomS

  • Archon
  • ********
  • Posts: 3,186
  • "Look At Me! Look At Me Now! " - Bono
EP drops demand for apology; asks COG bishops for forgiveness
« Reply #17 on: June 08, 2004, 08:41:28 AM »
[curiuoser and curiouser]

Church feud staggers on to a conclusion

In surprise, patriarch seeks ‘forgiveness’

The 11-month battle between Ecumenical Patriarch Vartholomaios and Archbishop Christodoulos, head of the Church of Greece, took a strange twist yesterday when the patriarch dropped his demand for three Greek bishops to apologize for what he calls their irregular election and declared instead that he sought “forgiveness from them and every one else.”

Christodoulos and Education and Religion Minister Marietta Giannakou, who had mediated between the two churches, declared their satisfaction with Vartholomaios’s statement, seeing it as the end of the dispute. The patriarch’s declaration followed intense pressure by the Greek government for him to drop the demand that the bishops apologize, something which officials said had not been in a deal brokered by the government.

The unprecedented crisis erupted last July when the bishop of Thessaloniki died. The sees of Eleftheroupolis and Kozani then fell vacant. All three are among the 36 “new territories” that the Patriarchate had provisionally allowed the Church of Greece to administer since 1928. When the Church of Greece went ahead with the election of new bishops, the patriarch said that the Greek Church was usurping the Patriarchate’s authority. At the end of April, the Istanbul-based Patriarchate broke communion with Christodoulos.

Giannakou’s mediation led to Vartholomaios’s agreeing with the election of the three bishops while the Church of Greece agreed to adhere to patriarchal decision of 1850 which established the Greek Church as autocephalous and the 1928 act regarding the “new territories.”

But Church of Greece officials were adamant that the deal did not include Vartholomaios’s demand that the three bishops apologize in writing. The government stepped in again, forcing Vartholomaios’s statement, which he made to the Athens News Agency correspondent in Istanbul. “In the face of the three metropolitan bishops’ refusal to display their true desire for forgiveness from the Mother Church, and in light of the resulting danger of a resurgence of the crisis in relations between the two churches, which no one wants, we personally, as patriarch, request forgiveness from them and all others, because we saddened them in exerting our responsibilities and we wish them success in their pastorate as if they were never elected,” the statement said.

Christodoulos, with whom the Patriarchate restored communion on Friday, declared his joy. “His All Holiness and my humble self overcame the ordeal in relations between the two churches with love, forgiveness and courage,” Christodoulos said. “The Ecumenical Patriarchate and the Church of Greece are starting a new chapter in the future of Orthodoxy and Hellenism.”

Giannakou said: “I feel especially happy that both his All Holiness and his Beatitude, with their wise stand, put an end to a crisis whose continuation could only cause damage to the Church and the Nation. The two pillars of Orthodoxy set a good example.”

http://www.ekathimerini.com/4dcgi/_w_articles_politics_100004_08/06/2004_43676

Offline prodromos

  • OC.net guru
  • *******
  • Posts: 1,463
  • Sydney, Australia
Re:Archbishop blinks in Church crisis - Feud to END!
« Reply #18 on: June 08, 2004, 04:12:35 PM »
Quote
Three of the other 12 clerics from the patriarchate also appeared
before the court Monday, wearing business suits.

Of course what the news article fails to tell us is that in Turkey it is illegal for priests to wear clerical garb in public (and they still think they should be allowed to join the EU ::) )

Offline Father Peter

  • Section Moderator
  • Archon
  • *****
  • Posts: 3,090
    • Coptic Orthodox Church - Patriarchal Diocese
  • Faith: Coptic Orthodox
  • Jurisdiction: Patriarchal Diocese
Re:Archbishop blinks in Church crisis - Feud to END!
« Reply #19 on: June 08, 2004, 04:22:56 PM »
I must say that when I was in Turkey, in Constantinople, I found it quite intimidating, oppressive even.

I visted one Church and sat in a car with my bishop and an Armenian one. I asked where we were going and he said 'to such and such a Church', to pray at the tombs of earlier Patriarchs. I asked when the Church had been built and he said 'mumble, mumble 60'. I thought he had said the 16th century. In fact he had said 1960 something. I expressed my surprise and he said that the previous Church had been demolished to make way for a supermarket carpark but that the supermarket had never materialised. They just seemed to have a chapel and crypt left over on the site.

On a positive side I believe that the Syriac speaking communities in the East of Turkey, though nearly extinct through persecution and conflict, are now to be finally allowed to teach their children the Syriac language, something that had been illegal. My bishop visited the area last year and it was sad to see how an ancient community had been brought so low, with much emigration to the West.

Peter
My ministry and blog - http://www.stgeorgeministry.com

The poster formerly known as peterfarrington