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Author Topic: Met. Jonah to be put on leave  (Read 23698 times) Average Rating: 0
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« on: February 24, 2011, 11:57:36 PM »




Isa, what on earth is this?  Bishop Tikhon say that Metropoliatn Jonah has been placed on mandatory leave of absence.  Is it just a joke?
https://listserv.indiana.edu/cgi-bin/wa-iub.exe?A2=ind1102D&L=ORTHODOX&T=0&F=&S=&P=13719
« Last Edit: February 25, 2011, 01:59:31 AM by arimethea » Logged
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« Reply #1 on: February 25, 2011, 12:52:57 AM »

Isa, what on earth is this?  Bishop Tikhon say that Metropoliatn Jonah has been placed on mandatory leave of absence.  Is it just a joke?
https://listserv.indiana.edu/cgi-bin/wa-iub.exe?A2=ind1102D&L=ORTHODOX&T=0&F=&S=&P=13719
I've made inquiries. I'm asking third parties, as besides Met. Jonah, I know everyone else mentioned personally (I found out that I knew Bishop Tikhon better then I thought when his grace came up to me at the consecration of Bishop Melchisedek and started catching up on old time-we hadn't seen each other for two decades, when he had first converted) and don't want to compromise anyone.  Your post is the first I've heard of this.
« Last Edit: February 25, 2011, 01:59:46 AM by arimethea » Logged

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« Reply #2 on: February 25, 2011, 12:53:49 AM »


[img width=300pt]http://www.oca.org/Images/News/2008/2008-1112-jonah.jpg[/img]

Isa, what on earth is this?  Bishop Tikhon say that Metropoliatn Jonah has been placed on mandatory leave of absence.  Is it just a joke?
https://listserv.indiana.edu/cgi-bin/wa-iub.exe?A2=ind1102D&L=ORTHODOX&T=0&F=&S=&P=13719

According a blog that's reporting the info (which was most likely sent by Bishop TIKHON using his pre-ordination name), after they received the message they called a friend, who "verified" the info with a "very senior priest" in the OCA.  There is as yet no info on oca.org or ocanews.org.  I'm a bit skeptical, but it's a bit early for April Fool's Day, too.

Here another location: http://02varvara.wordpress.com/
Another location: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Irenikon/message/44049 (note the reply at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Irenikon/message/44060 )
« Last Edit: February 25, 2011, 02:00:00 AM by arimethea » Logged

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« Reply #3 on: February 25, 2011, 01:13:03 AM »


[img width=300pt]http://www.oca.org/Images/News/2008/2008-1112-jonah.jpg[/img]

Isa, what on earth is this?  Bishop Tikhon say that Metropoliatn Jonah has been placed on mandatory leave of absence.  Is it just a joke?
https://listserv.indiana.edu/cgi-bin/wa-iub.exe?A2=ind1102D&L=ORTHODOX&T=0&F=&S=&P=13719

According a blog that's reporting the info (which was most likely sent by Bishop TIKHON using his pre-ordination name), after they received the message they called a friend, who "verified" the info with a "very senior priest" in the OCA.  There is as yet no info on oca.org or ocanews.org.  I'm a bit skeptical, but it's a bit early for April Fool's Day, too.

Here another location: http://02varvara.wordpress.com/
Voices from Russia, NY. The National Enquirer of Orthodoxy.  I just was looking at something he posted right after Bishop Jonah was consecrated.  None of the predictions he made then have come to pass.


Quote
Lee Fitzgerald isn't Bishop Tikhon's pre-ordination name. Not even close.
Ah. I see they mean the retired Bishop Tikhon. My bad.

Still, I'll find out, Lord willing.
« Last Edit: February 25, 2011, 02:00:10 AM by arimethea » Logged

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« Reply #4 on: February 25, 2011, 01:26:50 AM »

I've received word that evidently there is smoke, but I haven't got enough that I want to yell fire just yet.

Lord have mercy!
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« Reply #5 on: February 25, 2011, 02:03:38 AM »

What?  I thought this was a joke when I saw it on Orthodox-Forum @Yahoo Groups.
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« Reply #6 on: February 25, 2011, 04:43:49 AM »

Perhaps these cryptic comments may refer to this:

"The Metropolitan had accused Fr. Garklavs of "disloyalty" in light of a recent report to the Synod from the Sexual Misconduct Policy Advisory Committee - a Committee formed by the Metropolitan of which Fr. Garklavs was a member - which was highly critical of the Metropolitan's actions, and inactions, in this field over the past 2 years.

No announcement of any decisions taken by the Synod has been made.  According to informed sources, a press release may be issued before the weekend."

http://www.ocanews.org/news/News2.24.11.html

I pray this is not the case.  Kyrie Eleison.

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« Reply #7 on: February 25, 2011, 08:36:30 AM »

So if you tell the truth you can be fired?
Are we not Christians?
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« Reply #8 on: February 25, 2011, 09:35:43 AM »

I've received word that evidently there is smoke, but I haven't got enough that I want to yell fire just yet.

Your caution is good; there is no sense in making this out to be a big issue if it ends up being a joke or a hoax.
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« Reply #9 on: February 25, 2011, 10:02:23 AM »

I've received word that evidently there is smoke, but I haven't got enough that I want to yell fire just yet.

Your caution is good; there is no sense in making this out to be a big issue if it ends up being a joke or a hoax.

Amen to that.  I checked the OCA web site and there was no mention of this, so I wonder...

On the Indiana list, there is one character calling for the dissolving of the OCA.  How can some honestly make a statement like that without getting verification of this rumor?
« Last Edit: February 25, 2011, 10:13:40 AM by Monk Vasyl » Logged

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« Reply #10 on: February 25, 2011, 10:08:54 AM »

Perhaps these cryptic comments may refer to this:

"The Metropolitan had accused Fr. Garklavs of "disloyalty" in light of a recent report to the Synod from the Sexual Misconduct Policy Advisory Committee - a Committee formed by the Metropolitan of which Fr. Garklavs was a member - which was highly critical of the Metropolitan's actions, and inactions, in this field over the past 2 years.

No announcement of any decisions taken by the Synod has been made.  According to informed sources, a press release may be issued before the weekend."

http://www.ocanews.org/news/News2.24.11.html 

The part about the inaction and lack of following proper procedure of the OCA consistory as a whole dealing with problems of sexual abuse is true and has upset many.  Especially involving the upcoming court case of suspended Archbishop Seraphim in Winnipeg.
let's hope that in the future, delays and other mistakes will not be made.


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« Last Edit: February 25, 2011, 10:13:39 AM by Fr. George » Logged
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« Reply #11 on: February 25, 2011, 10:56:14 AM »

Lee Fitzgerald is the birth name of Bishop Tikhon (formerly) of San Francisco, rather than Bishop Tikhon (presently) of Philadelphia.  He (Fitzgerald) was ordained as Dn. Stephen, and then later renamed Tikhon.

Are you thinking of the latter Tikhon?

His Grace had some issues with posting on the internet, specifically the Indiana List, and so this 'new' identity (as opposed to his famous 'Love +BT' posts) may be his attempt to continue posting his personal opinions without entangling the OCA.  Clergy and hierarchy must be cautious when speaking their opinions if they could be confused with official pronouncements of the Church.



Isa, what on earth is this?  Bishop Tikhon say that Metropoliatn Jonah has been placed on mandatory leave of absence.  Is it just a joke?
https://listserv.indiana.edu/cgi-bin/wa-iub.exe?A2=ind1102D&L=ORTHODOX&T=0&F=&S=&P=13719
I've made inquiries. I'm asking third parties, as besides Met. Jonah, I know everyone else mentioned personally (I found out that I knew Bishop Tikhon better then I thought when his grace came up to me at the consecration of Bishop Melchisedek and started catching up on old time-we hadn't seen each other for two decades, when he had first converted) and don't want to compromise anyone.  Your post is the first I've heard of this.
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« Reply #12 on: February 25, 2011, 11:04:07 AM »

According to Church news sources in Greece, Metropolitan Jonah has just resigned:
http://romfea.gr/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=7372:-oca-&catid=13

VERY rough translation:

News Flash -  Chief Metropolitan Jonah OCA Has Resigned.
25th February 2011. 10:22am

Exclusive - According to exclusive information given to «Romfea.gr», the Primate of OCA Metropolitan Jonah of America resigned a few hours ago.

The same information indicates that the locum tenens is Archbishop Nathaniel of the Romanian Episcopate of the OCA.

Finally, noting that the new head of the OCA will be elected during the Inter-American Meeting of the OCA in the autumn.
« Last Edit: February 25, 2011, 11:16:55 AM by ozgeorge » Logged

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« Reply #13 on: February 25, 2011, 11:14:20 AM »

According to Church news sources in Greece, Metropolitan Jonah has just resigned:
http://romfea.gr/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=7372:-oca-&catid=13

It's been translated by Mystagogy:

http://www.johnsanidopoulos.com/2011/02/metropolitan-jonah-of-oca-resigns.html#comments
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« Reply #14 on: February 25, 2011, 11:21:13 AM »

A better translation than mine!
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« Reply #15 on: February 25, 2011, 11:37:49 AM »

+Jonah doesn't even have a reason to resign or be put on leave... What is such a big deal that he would have to?
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« Reply #16 on: February 25, 2011, 11:41:15 AM »

Someone just posted on Mystagogy that all he did was ask for a temporary sabbatical.  I think that sounds moderate enough that it's more likely to be the truth than the resignation story.
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« Reply #17 on: February 25, 2011, 11:43:57 AM »

+Jonah doesn't even have a reason to resign or be put on leave... What is such a big deal that he would have to?

How do any of us know what is going on here?

 
Out of respect, we ought to refrain from comment until we know what is going on. Let's pray instead for the Metropolitan, the Synod and our brothers and sisters in the OCA. Lord, have mercy.
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« Reply #18 on: February 25, 2011, 11:46:03 AM »

One reason may be not moving fast enough on the Archbishop Seraphim case...look at Pokrov.org...he allegedly wrote a letter saying that an investigation was being done than about two months later the Holy Synod ordered an investigation..
I also know people were upset about the Fr.Raymond Valencia case...
Why he resigned I do not know but lets all pray for him and the Church
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« Reply #19 on: February 25, 2011, 11:47:49 AM »

If he did resign...maybe I shouldnt be jumping the gun
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« Reply #20 on: February 25, 2011, 11:48:26 AM »

+Jonah doesn't even have a reason to resign or be put on leave... What is such a big deal that he would have to?

"Uneasy lies the head that wears the crown"

Whatever the real story is on the matter between him and Fr. Garklavs, it can't be easy having your every move dissected and the parts thrown back in your face all the time.
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« Reply #21 on: February 25, 2011, 11:50:40 AM »

I would have to say that I wouldn't think (from what I've seen, even in the case of Archb. Seraphim & Fr. Garklavs) that those would be grounds for resignation. Maybe for him to go on temporary sabbatical, but not resignation/removal.

I know I shouldn't judge, but I can understand though, I believe Metropolitan Jonah probably has a much better conscious than other people we've had in the past...
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« Reply #22 on: February 25, 2011, 11:53:24 AM »

+Jonah doesn't even have a reason to resign or be put on leave... What is such a big deal that he would have to?

"Uneasy lies the head that wears the crown"

Whatever the real story is on the matter between him and Fr. Garklavs, it can't be easy having your every move dissected and the parts thrown back in your face all the time.

For those of you who are neither clergy nor members of clergy families, those words strike all to close to reality.  My dad was a consistory  member for over three decades under four Bishops in ACROD and such Byzantine intrigue truly is a curse upon Orthodoxy. I guess we invented the art form centuries ago in Constantinople and perfected it in Moscow, so it should come as no surprise. Lord, have mercy.
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« Reply #23 on: February 25, 2011, 12:06:59 PM »


Lord, have mercy on all involved, and on all of us.

What happens to the least of our brothers, happens to us.

Whatever is going on, for whatever reasons, people are hurting.  May the Lord heal all involved.
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« Reply #24 on: February 25, 2011, 12:11:43 PM »

+Jonah doesn't even have a reason to resign or be put on leave... What is such a big deal that he would have to?

"Uneasy lies the head that wears the crown"

Whatever the real story is on the matter between him and Fr. Garklavs, it can't be easy having your every move dissected and the parts thrown back in your face all the time.

For those of you who are neither clergy nor members of clergy families, those words strike all to close to reality.  My dad was a consistory  member for over three decades under four Bishops in ACROD and such Byzantine intrigue truly is a curse upon Orthodoxy. I guess we invented the art form centuries ago in Constantinople and perfected it in Moscow, so it should come as no surprise. Lord, have mercy.

Indeed.  If it's true that Fr. Garklavs came to him with well-intentioned criticism, the Met. might have taken it badly just because of the constant barrage of not-so-well-intentioned criticism.  I can picture him lashing out, realizing he was in the wrong, and deciding to take a break in order to get some perspective.
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« Reply #25 on: February 25, 2011, 12:18:42 PM »

I think our imaginations may be starting to get the best of us now...
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« Reply #26 on: February 25, 2011, 12:20:42 PM »

Found this on the web site of Holy Cross Orthodox Church, in Greensboro, NC:
"We have received word that His Beatitude, Metropolitan Jonah will not be able to come this weekend and has asked Bishop Mark, the administrator of the Diocese of the South, to come in his stead."
http://www.holycrossoca.org/

This neither confirms nor denies the rumor.
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« Reply #27 on: February 25, 2011, 12:22:53 PM »

I think our imaginations may be starting to get the best of us now...

I don't think anyone is assuming that the resignation story is true; it's just being "floated" until a reliable source can confirm it.  I'll agree with the earlier assessment: the sabbatical is more likely to be true.
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« Reply #28 on: February 25, 2011, 12:27:47 PM »

I think our imaginations may be starting to get the best of us now...

It's human nature to want to fill in the holes.  There was a study that found it's more distracting to listen to one side of a conversation than both sides (listening to someone on a phone versus two people conversing nearby), because in the first case your brain is anxious to figure out what the other, unheard person is saying, and doesn't want to concentrate on anything else.

I do not know if we will ever get the full conversation in this case, but my hope is that people will not go running and screaming "ZOMG HE RESIGNED!!!1!" when there are other plausible turns of events.
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« Reply #29 on: February 25, 2011, 12:29:10 PM »

some guy's blog...again, nothing official:

http://elgreca262.blogspot.com/2011/02/metropolitan-jonah-resigns-syosset.html

http://elgreca262.blogspot.com/2011/02/met-jonah-oca-resigns-possible-causes.html
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« Reply #30 on: February 25, 2011, 12:51:57 PM »

Yikes...did we crash the server?  Shocked
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« Reply #31 on: February 25, 2011, 12:53:01 PM »

it's true. It's on OCAnews.
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« Reply #32 on: February 25, 2011, 12:53:14 PM »


Lord, have mercy on all involved, and on all of us.

What happens to the least of our brothers, happens to us.

Whatever is going on, for whatever reasons, people are hurting.  May the Lord heal all involved.


Yes...


Lord have mercy!
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« Reply #33 on: February 25, 2011, 12:55:05 PM »

it's true. It's on OCAnews.

link?
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« Reply #34 on: February 25, 2011, 12:57:09 PM »



http://www.ocanews.org/
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« Reply #35 on: February 25, 2011, 12:57:41 PM »

I second that!
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« Reply #36 on: February 25, 2011, 12:59:11 PM »


still nothing official from the real OCA (this link is Orthodox Christians for Accountability)

Again, they cite Romofea.org (but mention several other undisclosed sources)
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« Reply #37 on: February 25, 2011, 01:03:24 PM »

Stokoe must know what he's talking about. wasn't he part of the metropolitan council or some such?
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« Reply #38 on: February 25, 2011, 01:03:40 PM »


still nothing official from the real OCA (this link is Orthodox Christians for Accountability)
And the information on ocanews.org is patently false.
Romfea.gr stated that Metropolitan Jonah resigned, not "has been removed as the Primate" as ocanews states.
Chinese whispers or wishful thinking on the part of ocanews?
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« Reply #39 on: February 25, 2011, 01:04:44 PM »

here is the site to keep an eye on. Until we see it here...

http://www.oca.org/news.html
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« Reply #40 on: February 25, 2011, 01:19:42 PM »

It is there...

http://ocanews.org/news/JonahLeaveofAbsence2.25.11.html
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« Reply #41 on: February 25, 2011, 01:23:54 PM »

I've received word that evidently there is smoke, but I haven't got enough that I want to yell fire just yet.

Your caution is good; there is no sense in making this out to be a big issue if it ends up being a joke or a hoax.

Amen to that.  I checked the OCA web site and there was no mention of this, so I wonder...

On the Indiana list, there is one character calling for the dissolving of the OCA.  How can some honestly make a statement like that without getting verification of this rumor?
To be fair, those vultures are perpetually circling and have been perhaps even before the OCA received the Tomos of Autocephaly.

As for myself, either way it isn't going to change my poistion on the OCA a jot. Why should it?  Within 41 years of its own autocephaly, Constantinople managed right off the bat to drive its primate (now a glorified saint, and even then recognized as a living saint) from his see, exile another (another glorifeid saint, even then recognized as a lving saint) to his death splitting not only itself but the other Churches, and attempt to seize the territory of its superior. In 47 years it managed to elected a primate who started a heresy that led to the first permanent schism and heretical church in history.
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« Reply #42 on: February 25, 2011, 01:27:44 PM »

And the information on ocanews.org is patently false.
Romfea.gr stated that Metropolitan Jonah resigned, not "has been removed as the Primate" as ocanews states.
Chinese whispers or wishful thinking on the part of ocanews?

Did you read past the first two paragraphs? Stokoe has a detailed account of what has been going on behind the scenes for months and why the OCA Synod has asked/required the Metropolitan to take a leave of absence.
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« Reply #43 on: February 25, 2011, 01:28:48 PM »

Its true...the Holy Synod put him om premanent leave.. Arbp.National is the locum tenons.....the ew Metropolitan will be elected at the next AAC
its on ocanews.org........Mark Stokoe is a member of the Metropolitan Council
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« Reply #44 on: February 25, 2011, 01:35:28 PM »

As for myself, either way it isn't going to change my poistion on the OCA a jot. Why should it?  Within 41 years of its own autocephaly, Constantinople managed right off the bat to drive its primate (now a glorified saint, and even then recognized as a living saint) from his see, exile another (another glorifeid saint, even then recognized as a lving saint) to his death splitting not only itself but the other Churches, and attempt to seize the territory of its superior. In 47 years it managed to elected a primate who started a heresy that led to the first permanent schism and heretical church in history.

Could you please explain what you are referring to here?  What glorified saints?  What heretical church?
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