Author Topic: Catholic apologist website-Discredits Orthodox  (Read 1570 times)

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Offline vasily

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Catholic apologist website-Discredits Orthodox
« on: February 19, 2011, 12:50:03 PM »
Glory to Jesus Christ,
 I came upon this particular Catholic apologist website, davidmacd.com, and would like feedback on some statements taken from this site. I found this site to be particularly out to discredit the Orthodox Church and faith.

 The site states:
1. The Orthodox have deviated from Scriptures by the use of leavened bread in the Eucharist.
2. The Latin Church (Rome) Predates the Orthodox Church.
3. The Orthodox Church is "not" the truly fullness of the churches. It is only the Christ given ministry of Peter that can unify all the churches.

 There is much more.  I find the tactics used as pathetic and plain foolish. It is a shame Catholics go to extreme measures to justify their positions. It is plain propaganda.
 I do not find any of this nonsense on Orthodox sites or on youtube.

Offline minasoliman

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Re: Catholic apologist website-Discredits Orthodox
« Reply #1 on: February 19, 2011, 12:58:28 PM »
Glory to Jesus Christ,
 I came upon this particular Catholic apologist website, davidmacd.com, and would like feedback on some statements taken from this site. I found this site to be particularly out to discredit the Orthodox Church and faith.

 The site states:
1. The Orthodox have deviated from Scriptures by the use of leavened bread in the Eucharist.
2. The Latin Church (Rome) Predates the Orthodox Church.
3. The Orthodox Church is "not" the truly fullness of the churches. It is only the Christ given ministry of Peter that can unify all the churches.

 There is much more.  I find the tactics used as pathetic and plain foolish. It is a shame Catholics go to extreme measures to justify their positions. It is plain propaganda.
 I do not find any of this nonsense on Orthodox sites or on youtube.

I don't think all Catholics agree with his tactics or even his doctrines.  I personally wouldn't generalize what all Catholics are based on this person.
Vain existence can never exist, for "unless the LORD builds the house, the builders labor in vain." (Psalm 127)

If the faith is unchanged and rock solid, then the gates of Hades never prevailed in the end.

Offline Ortho_cat

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Re: Catholic apologist website-Discredits Orthodox
« Reply #2 on: February 19, 2011, 01:12:40 PM »
Glory to Jesus Christ,
 I came upon this particular Catholic apologist website, davidmacd.com, and would like feedback on some statements taken from this site. I found this site to be particularly out to discredit the Orthodox Church and faith.

 The site states:
1. The Orthodox have deviated from Scriptures by the use of leavened bread in the Eucharist.
2. The Latin Church (Rome) Predates the Orthodox Church.
3. The Orthodox Church is "not" the truly fullness of the churches. It is only the Christ given ministry of Peter that can unify all the churches.

 There is much more.  I find the tactics used as pathetic and plain foolish. It is a shame Catholics go to extreme measures to justify their positions. It is plain propaganda.
 I do not find any of this nonsense on Orthodox sites or on youtube.

Pretty standard, run-of-the-mill, catholic criticism of orthodox. Nothing new here. However, I do wish to take issue with the leavened bread point. Really? He's going to nit-pick that? How about not continuing the scriptural precedent of baptism by immersion, partaking of communion under both species, etc. If he wan't to talk about scriptural precedent, he's going to have alot more explaining than accusing to do.

Offline UniversalistGuy

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Re: Catholic apologist website-Discredits Orthodox
« Reply #3 on: February 19, 2011, 01:38:13 PM »
Glory to Jesus Christ,
 I came upon this particular Catholic apologist website, davidmacd.com, and would like feedback on some statements taken from this site. I found this site to be particularly out to discredit the Orthodox Church and faith.

 The site states:
1. The Orthodox have deviated from Scriptures by the use of leavened bread in the Eucharist.
2. The Latin Church (Rome) Predates the Orthodox Church.
3. The Orthodox Church is "not" the truly fullness of the churches. It is only the Christ given ministry of Peter that can unify all the churches.

 There is much more.  I find the tactics used as pathetic and plain foolish. It is a shame Catholics go to extreme measures to justify their positions. It is plain propaganda.
 I do not find any of this nonsense on Orthodox sites or on youtube.

I don’t understand your complaint.  If you were a committed Catholic wouldn’t you do your best to steer people away from what you perceive to be error?

Offline Alpo

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Re: Catholic apologist website-Discredits Orthodox
« Reply #4 on: February 19, 2011, 02:11:01 PM »
1. The Orthodox have deviated from Scriptures by the use of leavened bread in the Eucharist.

LOL! Doesn't Byzantine Catholic churches use leavened bread in the Eucharist? Maybe he should get to know his own church before trying to critisize others.
The user should probably be sleeping by now.

Offline Jakub

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Re: Catholic apologist website-Discredits Orthodox
« Reply #5 on: February 19, 2011, 02:17:36 PM »
What apologist may I ask ?
An old timer is a man who's had a lot of interesting experiences -- some of them true.

Grant me the senility to forget the people I never liked anyway, the good fortune to run into the ones I do, and the eyesight to tell the difference.

Offline Benjamin the Red

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Re: Catholic apologist website-Discredits Orthodox
« Reply #6 on: February 19, 2011, 02:43:23 PM »
Glory to Jesus Christ,
 I came upon this particular Catholic apologist website, davidmacd.com, and would like feedback on some statements taken from this site. I found this site to be particularly out to discredit the Orthodox Church and faith.

 The site states:
1. The Orthodox have deviated from Scriptures by the use of leavened bread in the Eucharist.
2. The Latin Church (Rome) Predates the Orthodox Church.
3. The Orthodox Church is "not" the truly fullness of the churches. It is only the Christ given ministry of Peter that can unify all the churches.

 There is much more.  I find the tactics used as pathetic and plain foolish. It is a shame Catholics go to extreme measures to justify their positions. It is plain propaganda.
 I do not find any of this nonsense on Orthodox sites or on youtube.

I don’t understand your complaint.  If you were a committed Catholic wouldn’t you do your best to steer people away from what you perceive to be error?

Of course, and I would hope that we do. However, the points made here are just bad. As pointed out here already, he attacks the use of leavened bread in the Eucharist, when his own church does it. The idea that the Roman church pre-dates the Orthodox are also quite silly, and shows lack of knowledge concerning the spread of Christianity shown in the book of Acts. The last point is a contention of most Roman Catholics. The Pope is needed for everything because he sits in the seat of Peter and is the supreme bishop of the Church. If people would like to explore the depth of this argument between our two churches, it has been hashed out ad nauseum on these fora.
"Hades is not a place, no, but a state of the soul. It begins here on earth. Just so, paradise begins in the soul of a man here in the earthly life. Here we already have contact with the divine..." -St. John, Wonderworker of Shanghai and San Francisco, Homily On the Sunday of Orthodoxy

Offline militantsparrow

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Re: Catholic apologist website-Discredits Orthodox
« Reply #7 on: February 19, 2011, 03:09:03 PM »
What apologist may I ask ?

I think he gets most of his apologetical material from Mark Bonocore.
"Yeah, the sparrow hath found an house..." -Psalm 84:3

Offline GabrieltheCelt

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Re: Catholic apologist website-Discredits Orthodox
« Reply #8 on: February 19, 2011, 03:27:40 PM »
Vasily, it seems as if David MacD is suffering from illusions of grandeur and is in need of entire semester of history lessons, but not all Latin Catholic's behave this way.  
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Offline minasoliman

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Re: Catholic apologist website-Discredits Orthodox
« Reply #9 on: February 19, 2011, 05:15:10 PM »
Vasily, it seems as if David MacD is suffering from illusions of grandeur and is in need of entire semester of history lessons, but not all Latin Catholic's behave this way.  

You mean delusions of grandeur?   :police:
Vain existence can never exist, for "unless the LORD builds the house, the builders labor in vain." (Psalm 127)

If the faith is unchanged and rock solid, then the gates of Hades never prevailed in the end.

Offline Irish Hermit

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Re: Catholic apologist website-Discredits Orthodox
« Reply #10 on: February 19, 2011, 05:39:58 PM »
What apologist may I ask ?

I think he gets most of his apologetical material from Mark Bonocore.

Yes, this man uplifts a lot of his material from Mark Bonocore.

As an example of the dreadful way that Catholic apologists treat one another, have a look at what the Catholic Mark Poulson says about Mark Bonocore.

Here is just a couple of samples:

"Bonocore is an archetypical fundamentalist, in the bad sense of the word.
That is, Bonocore's reasoning is viciously circular, his thought is shallow,
his attitude is arrogant, and he is as incapable of being on the receiving
end of a dialogue as a brick is of being a dartboard."

"He is a grown man with a four year-old's understanding of the faith,
and he holds on to that faith with the grip and pugnaciousness of a rabid bulldog."

See how they love one another, these Catholic apologists!!!!!

For more (some of it is humorous if you're in the mood) go to:
http://www.tektonics.org/af/bonocore01.html#matt2

Offline katherine 2001

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Re: Catholic apologist website-Discredits Orthodox
« Reply #11 on: February 19, 2011, 05:53:29 PM »
Several churches were started before the church in Rome, since the first church was established in Jerusalem.  That one came later in the game.  All  the earlier churches are still Orthodox (either Eastern or Coptic).  Maybe the gentleman needs to study Church History more. 

Offline Jakub

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Re: Catholic apologist website-Discredits Orthodox
« Reply #12 on: February 19, 2011, 06:05:51 PM »
I have no delusions of grandeur, however I have had some visions of Grand Marnier...
An old timer is a man who's had a lot of interesting experiences -- some of them true.

Grant me the senility to forget the people I never liked anyway, the good fortune to run into the ones I do, and the eyesight to tell the difference.

Offline ialmisry

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Re: Catholic apologist website-Discredits Orthodox
« Reply #13 on: February 19, 2011, 06:47:55 PM »
Glory to Jesus Christ,
 I came upon this particular Catholic apologist website, davidmacd.com, and would like feedback on some statements taken from this site. I found this site to be particularly out to discredit the Orthodox Church and faith.

 The site states:
1. The Orthodox have deviated from Scriptures by the use of leavened bread in the Eucharist.
2. The Latin Church (Rome) Predates the Orthodox Church.
3. The Orthodox Church is "not" the truly fullness of the churches. It is only the Christ given ministry of Peter that can unify all the churches.

 There is much more.  I find the tactics used as pathetic and plain foolish. It is a shame Catholics go to extreme measures to justify their positions. It is plain propaganda.
 I do not find any of this nonsense on Orthodox sites or on youtube.

Pretty standard, run-of-the-mill, catholic criticism of orthodox. Nothing new here. However, I do wish to take issue with the leavened bread point. Really? He's going to nit-pick that? How about not continuing the scriptural precedent of baptism by immersion, partaking of communion under both species, etc. If he wan't to talk about scriptural precedent, he's going to have alot more explaining than accusing to do.
LOL. And married clergy.  And then he's even wrong on the leaven part:
http://www.orthodoxchristianity.net/forum/index.php/topic,25677.135.html
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A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth

Offline PeaceSerenity

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Re: Catholic apologist website-Discredits Orthodox
« Reply #14 on: February 19, 2011, 07:27:14 PM »
The site states:
1. The Orthodox have deviated from Scriptures by the use of leavened bread in the Eucharist.

I mean, it's not like Christ said "Take eat, this is my body which has been conveniently condensed into the form of a wafer."  :)
Some people should be more careful when throwing punches  ;D

Offline Irish Hermit

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Re: Catholic apologist website-Discredits Orthodox
« Reply #15 on: February 19, 2011, 10:45:30 PM »

He is wrong about leavened bread.

Please see message 21 at

http://www.orthodoxchristianity.net/forum/index.php/topic,13141.msg272267.html#msg272267

CATHOLIC SCHOLARS SAY THAT THE CHURCH OF ROME USED LEAVENED BREAD
for the first 800 and more years.

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Today (19 February) is the commemoration of St. Mildred of Thanet, Abbess of Minster
See http://groups.yahoo.com/group/celt-saints

Offline vasily

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Re: Catholic apologist website-Discredits Orthodox
« Reply #16 on: February 20, 2011, 11:37:25 AM »
To "universalistguy", it is not a complaint, it is more in the sense of creating an awareness. I do not find these tactics being used on Orthodox sites. discrediting the Catholic Church. There are legitimate ways to discuss the Orthodox faith to others, instead of being deceitful and purposely take things out of context. I am currently and have in the past, dealt with these Catholic apologists, and it is disheartening that they are out to create their own interpretations of Scriptures and the early Church Fathers. One in particular was James Likoudis. I got the impression that he has been brainwashed by Papist propaganda. I personally can not see this dialogue between the Catholic Church and Orthodox, when you have these particular individuals lurking in the wings, hoping that everyone will be under the universal authority of the Pope.

Offline Ortho_cat

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Re: Catholic apologist website-Discredits Orthodox
« Reply #17 on: February 20, 2011, 12:44:40 PM »

He is wrong about leavened bread.

Please see message 21 at

http://www.orthodoxchristianity.net/forum/index.php/topic,13141.msg272267.html#msg272267

CATHOLIC SCHOLARS SAY THAT THE CHURCH OF ROME USED LEAVENED BREAD
for the first 800 and more years.

__________________________________________
Today (19 February) is the commemoration of St. Mildred of Thanet, Abbess of Minster
See http://groups.yahoo.com/group/celt-saints



Offline NorthernPines

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Re: Catholic apologist website-Discredits Orthodox
« Reply #18 on: February 21, 2011, 11:53:04 AM »
And people wonder why I'm critical of apologists? LOL!

Offline ialmisry

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Re: Catholic apologist website-Discredits Orthodox
« Reply #19 on: February 21, 2011, 12:37:00 PM »
We have dealt with some of the garbage on this site before:
http://www.orthodoxchristianity.net/forum/index.php/topic,20118.msg299347.html#msg299347
Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth